Should Trump get credit for winning the war against ISIS?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," December 27, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

CHRIS STIREWALT, GUEST CO-HOST: Hello, everybody. I'm Chris Stirewalt along with Kennedy, Marie Harf, Katie Pavlich and Tom Shillue. What a bunch. It's 5 o'clock in New York City, and this is "The Five."

Now, President Trump vowed we were going to finally win the war against ISIS under his watch.


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: We will find you, we will destroy you and we will win.

TRUMP: I would bomb the (BLEEP) out of them.


TRUMP: This is an evil, sadistic, monstrous enemy, and we must keep these killers out of our country.


TRUMP: We're going to knock out ISIS so violently and so fast. ISIS is being dealt one brutal defeat after another. You'll see it.



STIREWALT: And as his first year in office closes out, there is extremely positive evidence we may be getting closer than ever. ISIS has lost 98 percent of its territory in Iraq and Syria according to Ryan Dillon, he's the chief spokesman for operation inherent resolve. Now look, there are still major hurdles to conquer against the terror network in Syria, but this is encouraging news going into the New Year. So, my question for you, obviously, you know, Marie, that you were going to get this first.

MARIE HARF, GUEST CO-HOST: I could sense it.


STIREWALT: You could feel the mojo. So, look, to ask the Trump White House, what they would say is, and they do say, that the Obama administration wasn't tough enough, didn't take enough steps. We hear a lot of complaints about the rules of engagement and the approach. How much of that was a strategic choice and how much of that was an error in judgment?

HARF: Well, and some of that is just politics, right?


HARF: So, the strategy that has led to a virtual defeat of ISIS in the caliphate, in Syria and Iraq is largely a strategy that was laid out during the Obama administration by military commanders. Now, President Trump has loosen the rules of engagement. He has allowed the military to use more bombs, for example, and so I think that has helped. But, for me, the bigger question is what is the strategy going forward? There're tens of thousands of ISIS fighters who once they lose this territory in Syria and Iraq are going to go back to Europe, they're going to go online, they're going to radicalize people like we've seen try to commit terrorist attack here in the U.S. So, in terms of the fight against ISIS this is a good step, but the fight is going to continue in a different and almost more dangerous way.

STIREWALT: And Katie, I do want to talk more about the online threat, the threat here domestically, all of that razzmatazz. But there's also the question about what happens in Syria next.


STIREWALT: And one of the reasons, by the way, to give the previous administration some credit where it's due, part of the go-slow was who's going to govern Syria...


STIREWALT: ... and who's going to govern these fallen places?

PAVLICH: But I wouldn't argue that the ISIS strategy is completely about Syria. It's actually been more about getting back that territory in Iraq. And so, the administration has done that as you mentioned the rule of engagement, which were severely downplay during the Obama administration. It was not reported that 80 percent of the casualties in places like Afghanistan and Iraq happened under Obama's watch as a result of this rules of engagement, second guessing the commanders on the ground. And you can give credit to President Obama for the strategy in the last year of his term but that was the military commanders, but you have to give credit to President Trump for actually listening to them and getting the job done. And the thing that's interesting to going forward as we look at the global war on terror, this is a victory now, but this is not something that has been completely solved. And we're attacking terrorists in places like Somalia. We've just learned that the number of bombing since Donald Trump took office have doubled in Somalia in partnership with the government there...


PAVLICH: So this is going to be something we continue to fight because of the nature of the threats that we face, but it's a huge victory. Not only just for getting rid of ISIS, but also for the military to feel like they can finally do their job again.

STIREWALT: Kennedy, are we going to have troops in Iraq and Syria forever?

KENNEDY, GUEST CO-HOST: I feels like we are, unfortunately, and Afghanistan as well. That's why whenever we have good news like the caliphate as 98 percent contain, you always have to wonder what's the mission creek, what's the next step? What is the ultimate goal of the United States? And, of course, there are those who makes the case that there are U.S. interests that have to be secured in those places, and I think that argument gets flimsier and flimsier. And the president said as much when he was campaigning. Obviously, the realities of governing are quite different, but the success of containing ISIS is something that has to be satisfying for him. But Katie is absolutely right. You know, we can't hang mission accomplished banners because this can go on so many different directions. Syria has already devolved into civil war. And we've seen places like Yemen and Libya in an absolute shambles. And, you know, I hope that the president continues to indulge his non- interventionist streak. And he has people around him who understand the cost of human life and the amount of money that we have spent overseas. The president had said that himself in regards to infrastructure spending saying, hey, why are we spending $7 trillion in overseas wars when we should essentially be spending that here in this country making our bridges and roads in better condition?

STIREWALT: Nation building here at home, I believe, is the preferred phrase of the last two presidents. Tom?

TOM SHILLUE, GUEST CO-HOST: I like the generals.

STIREWALT: You're pro-generals.



STIREWALT: I stand with the men and women in uniform. One of the big advantages of this is that it denies ISIS and the people who now call themselves ISIS a recruiting tool, because when the myth of the caliphate was alive, right, they could say we are building our own nation in the desert. We're going to make this pure thing, and the caliphate will be restored, and da, da, da, da. The physical defeat of it does denies them a recruiting point, but to everybody's point this is really materialize online. This is really everywhere.

KENNEDY: It's a digital caliphate.

SHILLUE: Yes. Although, winning is -- that's why winning is important. I mean, Trump is all about winning and it's true in regards to ISIS. The more wins you rack up the better, you know. It's down now. We want to keep snuffing it out and count up those victories. But I think this is a scenario where we do have bipartisanship. I mean, everybody hates ISIS, so we're kind all together on that. I think people, you know, here, I give President Obama credit when he had success in that area. I also think it was great when he went back on his word and he kept Guantanamo Bay, like, I was glad he broke that promise. I think when he gets down with, a lot of times -- you know, he ran against his own -- I'm going to close Guantanamo, I'm going to change our foreign policy. But when he got in there, the foreign policy against ISIS wasn't that dramatically changed under President Obama. I think when these presidents get in there they do take the advice of the generals. And so, I think it's one area where there's a lot of bipartisanship...


KENNEDY: With President Obama because there were -- from Bob Gates to people in the Pentagon. You know, every time they left the administration they talked about how difficult it was because they would layout plans for defeating ISIS, and President Obama had his own ideas on how he wants to do it.

HARF: Well, Bob Gate wasn't there when ISIS really became a threat. I think Bob Gate has other issues with the administration...


HARF: The problem President Obama was trying to come up against is to the United States military every problem looks like a nail and every bomb looks like a hammer. And so, there has to be other tools in the American toolbox.


HARF: But there has to be other tools to go after threats. And I think he ran...


HARF: No, no, no, listen. He ran on ending the war in Iraq. He ran on getting out of Afghanistan...

PAVLICH: Which created ISIS, by the way.


HARF: We're still in the longest war in America's history in Afghanistan. And we have no end in sight to when these men and women are coming home.

KENNEDY: President Obama had 8 years to end that war.

HARF: And he didn't. And I'm not saying that was OK. My point is, we have to look at American power, not just in bombs, but in diplomacy as our economic power, as trade deals...

PAVLICH: That did not work very well when it came to ISIS. The bombing of ISIS...


STIREWALT: Is it a reasonable question to ask, what becomes of Bashar Assad, what becomes of Syria?


STIREWALT: It's great to have ISIS, it's great to have the people, as Tom points out, everyone in the world universally hates. These guys are the New York Yankees of being hated.


PAVLICH: Very important question to ask you about ISIS actually joining the ranks of the Iraqi government in places where it's not stable. So there's always another problem that we're going to have to deal with.


PAVLICH: Is taking on terrorists and bombing more and taking off the rules of engagement. But in terms of how we move forward, you talked about these guys going to Europe, the ones that are left who haven't been killed. That comes down to domestic policy. That is one foreign policy, whether it's in Europe or the United States, turns into domestic policy on how we deal with our borders, how we deal with vetting of refugees...


PAVLICH: ... and online radicalization in these areas that has not assimilated. That is the problem.

KENNEDY: That is one area where I absolutely agree with Marie, and that is -- I think we have to be more mindful than ever of -- you know, what I refer to as the digital caliphate, people who have scattered at the 45,000 fighters who were fighting with ISIS. Those people -- I mean, they're down to 1,000. That means you've got 44,000...


KENNEDY: And they have gone to places in Western Europe. And they are here in the United States. And they're radicalizing in ways we have seen here in New York City with two terror attacks this year.

HARF: Or you don't even have to travel there anymore. It used to be you could track someone travel and it was a red flag. You don't even have to, you can go online.

STIREWALT: Tom, do we end up with regime changes or are we going to end up orchestrating regime change in Syria, do you think?

SHILLUE: There's another example of -- the president gets flexible when they get into office...

STIREWALT: Real flexible.

SHILLUE: President Trump, he changed his view on Syria. Remember, he came in and says we're not going to -- you know...

STIREWALT: What do I care?

SHILLUE: Yeah. And then, how long did it take him to start bombing Syria. So, he change -- Presidents change when they get in here. That's why you've got to trust the generals...

STIREWALT: Do we end up confronting Russia, and do we end up taking out Assad or do he stay?

SHILLUE: Well, maybe if we can get this investigation come to a close.



STIREWALT: Maybe Trump offers Mueller a deal. Let me off the hook, I'll take out Assad. You think we end up taking out Assad?

KENNEDY: If you listen to the left, we're not fighting against Russia. We're fighting with Russia. So we're a puppet of the Soviet regime and we do whatever Putin wants.


PAVLICH: Proxy we're going on. And this is all about the Iranians. So it's not just about Bashar al-Assad, it's about the Iranian being now the focus of this administration.

STIREWALT: So, you think he stays?

PAVLICH: I don't know. I'm not going to predict that. But I do know that the administration is very focus on Iran and making sure that they don't creep in...

STIREWALT: Somebody once said that Bashar al-Assad days were numbered?


STIREWALT: Last word.

HARF: The problem has always been if Assad is not there, what fills that void. That's always been the problem.


STIREWALT: Ahead, when Harry meet Barry. A very interesting interview conducted by the prince with the ex-president. That's next.


KENNEDY: Well, here's something you don't see every day, a prince interviewing a president. The BBC releasing an interview conducted by Prince Harry with former President Barack Obama. Some interesting exchanges. We have the highlights beginning with what sounded like a veil slight at Mr. Obama's successor over his use of social media.


FORMER PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: All of us in leadership have to find ways in which we can recreate a common space on the internet. One of the dangers of the internet is that people can have entirely different realities. They can be just cocooned in information that reinforces their biases. It's also, by the way, harder to be as obnoxious and cruel in person as people can be anonymously on the internet.


KENNEDY: But the president hinted anonymous on the internet. Mr. Obama never mentioned President Trump by name, but one could imagine he had him in mind. Here's another clip of 44 handing over the presidency to 45.


PRINCE HARRY OF WALES: You sat through the inauguration with your game face on, not giving much emotion away as we all saw. What's going through your mind?

OBAMA: The first thing that went through my mind was -- sitting across from Michelle, how thankful I was that she has been my partner through that whole process, and that we haven't fundamentally change I think was a satisfying feeling that was mix with all the work that was still undone. Concerns about how the country moves forward. But, you know, overall, there was a serenity there more than I would expected.


KENNEDY: There's nothing more serene than the feeling of your entire legacy coming undone, right before your eyes.


KENNEDY: Do you believe that he really felt serene knowing that the president he just been inaugurated was about to undo many of his regulations...

PAVLICH: He probably didn't feel well, but he may have gotten those emotions out on election night when I'm sure he was not very happy with Hillary Clinton for blowing it, right? But I'm just wondering if he brought the prince an iPod full of his speeches as he did for the queen. Wondering how I'm saddened when asked about whether -- the Churchill bus being back in the White House...


PAVLICH: Dangerous about the social media that they want to remind President Obama of. The first thing, inviting a woman who bathes herself in milk and fruit loops in her bathtub to do an interview of you in the White House, that's one. Second is selfie sticks. The president used a lot of those. And the third was -- remember when Osama Bin Laden news broke, it happened on twitter first not through the White House. So, that's also dangerous.

KENNEDY: President Obama very adept to social media. And, in fact, when he was running against Senator McCain in 2008, it was his use of the Facebook which really put him over the top, particularly, with younger, digitally-minded voters. So, isn't it a little hypocritical for him to be attacking the president?

HARF: Well, first of all, he didn't attack the president. If you've just listen to what he said, nothing he said was controversial. The internet can be a swamp full of horrible things said about all of us. It happens all the time. And it does make people just listen to what they already believe. That's also not good. Nothing he said is controversial. I truly think that he is concerned about discourse and dialogue. And there are parts of the internet like twitter that do not help it. I'm fully onboard with him on it.

KENNEDY: It's not supposed to help it. The internet is not supposed to be completely sanitary and serene.


PAVLICH: But it's not for its discourse that people don't want to be on it because they're harassed or threaten. That's just not good for our discourse.

KENNEDY: Well, maybe that has something to do with the kind of discourse that you engage in, Tom. I find the digital realm to be quite satisfying to engage in.

SHILLUE: Absolutely. This is the same song he's been singing for years and years. President Barack Obama wanted to always go back to the days when we have three networks telling his story. It always bothered him. That's why Fox News would stick in his craw so much because Fox News...


KENNEDY: Name checked Fox News constantly.



SHILLUE: It's a wonderful world now where people -- people, actually, have their own opinions that they can publish them.


SHILLUE: It's better than the old days.


KENNEDY: The government should really crackdown on wrong ideas. That's exactly what you're saying.

HARF: No, what I'm saying is we don't have facts anymore...


HARF: ... to debate over. Am I totally outnumbered here, Stirewalt?

STIREWALT: Look, I think that the promise of social media has largely not been met...

HARF: How do you get your news?

STIREWALT: Social media. Look...


Maria: Is it all fake?

STIREWALT: I'm saying the promise has not been met. That doesn't mean that it won't be met in time. The single greatest challenge, arguably, facing our culture and by extension our republic today is how do we deal with this medium? What regulations are appropriate? Do we approach it from an anti-trust perspective with the big companies that controls it like Facebook, like Google? Do we approach it from -- I think we probably end up with anti-trust measures as what I think to ensure some competition.

KENNEDY: There's plenty of competition. That's the wonderful thing about the internet. I think that's what's so frustrating for the president is that there such a great proliferation and half of it disagrees with him.


KENNEDY: And that's what's frustrating him because he feels he's right. He feels that his beliefs and opinions are objectively true. That is not correct. And therefore, anything that runs counter to his deeply felt beliefs must be inherently wrong...

STIREWALT: The amount of anonymity and the amount of the nasty climate that all that anonymity breaths. So anonymity has value, right?

KENNEDY: The president does not operate anonymously online, though.

STIREWALT: The current president.


STIREWALT: I don't -- maybe I'm naive, I did not read Obama talking about Trump specifically there or that is a veil swipe at Trump. I thought that was just a generalize lament. I did not read him...

SHILLUE: Did you read it in to the questions the prince was asking every time? 2017 has been a very, very...


HARF: The conspiracy theories that are totally false have the ability to jump out of the internet and into real life. And by that I mean the pizza gate. Where someone walk with an automatic weapon into a pizza parlor a mile from my house and could have killed people because of something stupid and false that he read on the internet.


KENNEDY: But I think that has more to do with the mental stability of someone like that than, you know, the internet had some questionable things in there, therefore it should be illegal.


PAVLICH: Before the internet there was unpleasant discourse as well. The internet certainly magnifies that, however it's a choice. Look, there are things in the internet that are said every single day that are horrible. Twitter is a cesspool of disgusting things that are said on a regular basis. That is true. But it's also like the first amendment. There are things that are said not on the internet and there are prices to pay for those freedoms. And the question does becomes how do we regulate these things? Who are the people in government who decides what's OK to be said, what's not OK to be said?

(CROSSTALK) HARF: Our political leaders though, should we look to them to set a better example than President Trump has?

PAVLICH: Or maybe Barack Obama who is a very divisive figure...

HARF: We're not talking about Barack Obama.


HARF: President Trump bullies people on twitter, online, repeatedly -- he has brought down the level of our discourse...

KENNEDY: How did you think a Fox News reporter felt when he was being bullied by the Obama administration?


HARF: Again, we can criticize Barack Obama and criticize Donald Trump. We're allowed to do both at the same time.

KENNEDY: I agree.

PAVLICH: Some of us actually do.


KENNEDY: Well, President Trump in his continued rift with the FBI. Well, it was just turned up a notch. We'll have that next. Right here.


HARF: President Trump, as you know, isn't very happy with the FBI these days. He's at Mar-a-Lago tweeting again and again that the bureau is tainted, still fired up about the investigation into his campaign possible ties to Russia. Watergate reporter Carl Bernstein takes great issue with that saying it's not the FBI that's tainted.


UNINDENTIFIED MALE: There's only one institution that really has been tainted through these months and that is the Trump presidency. It's tainted by the president's lies, by his disrespect for American institutions operating under the law with traditional American democracy and instruments thereof. If the president is as confident as he says this investigation is going to end very soon and with him being exonerated, he ought to welcome all of this instead of attacking constantly. He's doing a great disservice to our democracy.


HARF: Well, I agree with some of the things, not everything, that Carl Bernstein just said. But Chris, I'm coming to you first on this. It does seem like President Trump almost enjoys pushing institutions to the limits. I think a lot of his supporters like that he was going to come in and shake up Washington, drain the swamp. Do you think this is taking it a step too far in really going after the FBI as they're investigating him?

STIREWALT: Well, you can look at it in a couple of ways. Now, number one, Carl Bernstein, glory day.

HARF: Right.


STIREWALT: I was on Fox News Sunday with Bob Woodward on Sunday. He's measured, he's smart, he has good perspective on this. Bernstein has -- his former stablemate has embraced like a full plutonium...


HARF: So true.

STIREWALT: The wires are alive. So I think I might discount some of his POV.

HARF: That being said.

STIREWALT: All that having been said. Look, the president has a strategy, and his supporters and defender have a strategy which is that whatever the FBI and Robert Mueller come up with, they want his core group of supporters to say it doesn't matter. It's not credible. The FBI is shot through with Democrats. It is crooked. And I don't believe what they say, and I'm sticking with my man. So this is all pre-bottle so that whatever comes out at the end that Republicans -- or Trump's Republicans will stick with him whatever the findings are because you are impeaching the witness in advance.

PAVLICH: Which will look really silly if Robert Mueller actually ends up exonerating the president. And so, there are some ways to walk around this. But that being said, there is a serious issue at the top levels of the FBI. We have it in black-and-white with the text messages. Not only people talking about it politically, but an official government office being used to talk about some kind of insurance policy. And I think it's legitimate that people have questions about what exactly that meant.

Now Christopher Wray, the new FBI director, has an obligation to go through, remind his agents, especially the top brass working around him, that politics cannot impede any of your investigations, and none of your decisions can be made based on how you feel about particular candidates and what they are saying. And he has an obligation to do it in a transparent way so that the American people as a whole -- not Trump's ardent base supporters, but the American people as a whole -- can regain some kind of confidence in the FBI.

Because I've talked to a number of people on the left as well, who say these messages that have come to light are actually alarming to them in terms of how this was handled and maybe some of the biases that happened during the Obama administration, not to hold Democrats accountable in the same way that Republicans are being held accountable. And that's a fair thing to be asking.

HARF: I think -- and we talked about this earlier on "Outnumbered." I also think I've heard from FBI colleagues that I used to work with when I was in government, who said, "Look, these text messages are terrible. They look bad. He was taken off of the investigation. There's a lot of us who are working here who are non-partisan who worked under Democrats and Republicans who feel like the president and his supporters are somehow attacking all of our credibility."


HARF: Are you joking?

SHILLUE: I am joking. I don't care about "the great men and women of the" -- they keep going back to that. It's the leadership and the people who are running the investigation stink. We see their -- their attacks. We see that they're biased.

KENNEDY: I think it's really important to make that differentiation.

HARF: But you're not making a differentiation. You think we should?

KENNEDY: I think there is a differentiation. I think Katie pointed that out on "Outnumbered" earlier today. There is a difference between people who work in law enforcement who have sworn to protect and defend the United States Constitution who believe in the rule of law and who work their tails off day in and day out. And then I...

SHILLUE: He's not going after -- President Trump isn't saying all the men and women...


KENNEDY: No, but then I think there are some people...

HARF: ... cases.

KENNEDY: ... some people at the top who, unfortunately, have so much influence over the frustrated and hard-working people on the lower levels...

STIREWALT: Are you talking here about -- are you talking about...

SHILLUE: Go do your work. I don't know what the problem is. We're seeing at the top it's rotten.

STIREWALT: Who's at the top? Who's rotten?

HARF: Who's rotten?

SHILLUE: Strzok.

HARF: He's not at...

STIREWALT: He's not at the top.

SHILLUE: He was. He's the guy with...


SHILLUE: How many examples do we have?

HARF: You don't have any evidence that these personal political views have influenced ongoing investigations. That's what's being looked into right now.

PAVLICH: We do have evidence that it may have a significant impact on...


SHILLUE: And I don't know why he has to sit there with tape over his mouth. I think it's -- President Trump should say, "I don't like it. I don't like these guys." I think if he sees bias, he should say it. I don't know why he has to just sit there like a bull in the bull ring.

HARF: Like a respectable leader.

KENNEDY: Here's why it's different, because...

SHILLUE: I don't believe in this stuff.

KENNEDY: It's one thing if you're an outside analyst just sort of looking at everything, commenting on it. And a lot of people, that's what they do all day long. They read the news, they watch the news, and they form an opinion and they talk about it with their friends.

It's very different when you're part of story and you're the one who's actually affecting the outcome of the measurement. You are -- you are the one who's being measured at the same time.

STIREWALT: We have seen both parties, over the past 50 years, take issue with the FBI, whether it was trying to get Martin Luther King to commit suicide or any number of things that have happened. I'm not saying that the agency is beyond reproach or to be unquestioned.

HARF: Right.

STIREWALT: But I do think this. I think that the American people can take comfort from the fact that, on a basic level, our federal law enforcement agencies and our Justice Department are staffed by conscientious people who respect the rule of law, conscientious people who love the country more than their own political party. And I think that anything that we can say -- of everything that we can say, we can say that America is, by and large, overwhelming well-served by these agencies and by these...

KENNEDY: Do we know how those texts came to light? I'm still very curious about that.

PAVLICH: The inspector general, I believe.

STIREWALT: I.G. I.G. found them, because they fired -- they fired him, or they demoted him...


STIREWALT: ... and then it was like, "Oh, look at that!"

HARF: "Give your phone," like?

PAVLICH: I do want to say One More Thing about what the FBI agents on the ground are actually doing. They are completely removed from politics. And they're working on things like child sex trafficking.

HARF: Yes.

PAVLICH: And illicit drug use, child pornography and terrorism. They're completely removed. So it is very important to distinguish, you know, who we're exactly talking about here when it comes to...

SHILLUE: They should be just as upset.

PAVLICH: ... some accountability.

HARF: They are upset.


HARF: They are.

KENNEDY: The Hillary investigation, as well.

STIREWALT: I'm untainted. I am untainted.

KENNEDY: All right.

HARF: OK. Coming up, Vanity Fair is getting some pushback for its new video mocking Hillary Clinton. The controversy up next. Stay close.


PAVLICH: Hillary Clinton just won't go away. Staffers at Vanity Fair have suggestions to keep her busy and out of politics.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's time to start working on your sequel to your book, "What Happened?": "What the Hell Happened?"

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Get someone on your tech staff to disable auto-fill on your iPhone, so that typing an "F" doesn't become "form exploratory committee for 2020."

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Take up a new hobby in the New Year. Volunteer work. Knitting. Improv comedy, literally anything that will keep you from running again.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: To finally put away your James Comey voodoo doll. Now we all know you think that James Comey cost you the election, and he might have, but so did a handful of other things. It's a year later and time to move on.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So cheers to you, Hillary Clinton.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Cheers to you, Hillary.


PAVLICH: Literally anything, please. Those New Year's tips for Hillary didn't go over well with some of her supporters. And there's been backlash on social media over the video, some calling it sexist, predictably, to suggest that Hillary Clinton take up a hobby like knitting. The staffer who made that comment says they did snarky New Year's resolutions for a bunch of politicians, including President Trump. And a spokeswoman for Vanity Fair was contrite, saying, "It was an attempt at humor, and we regret that it missed the mark."

Tom Shillue, our resident knitter. Is this sexist?

SHILLUE: It's not sexist. They did -- you know, she had a number of suggestions. She said knitting, which is -- I guess is associated with women. I'm not a sexist, so I don't know. They also suggested she take up comedy, an art form associated with men. So I think that...

PAVLICH: That's sexist. I do not like that comment at all.

HARF: You're not helping. You're not helping.

STIREWALT: Stop digging, Tom.

SHILLUE: I said yesterday on this show, Kennedy, they are saying, "Lock her up" now. The Democrats are chanting it about Hillary Clinton. They all want her to go away. Did you see those people? Could you see more typical Democrat and Hillary supporters than those people?

HARF: Hey, hey now.

KENNEDY: No, they're not. These are millennials. This is a changing of the media guard. And these are people saying, "Please, whatever you do, don't run again, because you are tanking the party."

SHILLUE: That's the thing, that they...

KENNEDY: And so I have actually -- and this is something that I've been saying for some time. That Hillary Clinton is so desperate and embarrassing and lacks such self-awareness that she needs to go away and reexamine her life in private.

But now I'm saying, after such a glorious year of making fun of her, she is such a great time. I hope she doesn't go anywhere. I hope she starts running for president in 2018, because she provides so much material. Hillary, please, wherever you are, stay in the limelight. You are a blast! It is an endless supply of jokes and barbs. So stick with it.

PAVLICH: Chris, I think the saddest part of the story is that Vanity Fair somewhat apologized for the video.

STIREWALT: So much. So much is sad about this. So much is sad.

PAVLICH: Isn't that terrible?

STIREWALT: You know, we were talking before about the cocoons that people in the Internet era are able to keep for themselves. It's a thermostatically-controlled 72 degrees.

PAVLICH: Yes, I like that.

STIREWALT: Everything -- everything affirms your world view.

KENNEDY: That's what President Obama was saying with Prince Harry.

STIREWALT: Everything reinforces what you think, and you only hear that you're right.

The fact that this mild lampooning of, by the way, we should point out, the most disastrous -- most disastrous national politician. Two presidential elections, lost to the two most unlikely. She lost twice. Once to a guy - - once to a guy whose middle name was "Hussein."

KENNEDY: Was Hussein, right.

STIREWALT: And the other tie to the host of the "Celebrity Apprentice." She lost -- she's the worst Democratic nominee since at least -- at least Dukakis.

SHILLUE: She beat Rick Lazio. Don't you forget that.

STIREWALT: That's true. She beat Rick Lazio.

So she -- so here is this person. Obviously, a target for ridicule, rightly a target for ridicule. In this case, it's gentle mocking. It's light -- it's gentle mockery. And the fact that that is too much, that this is just too hot a dose. We just can't possibly take this mocking, and it has -- we have to dissect it on the basis of "is knitting sexism? Oh, my God." And on and on.

PAVLICH: Like a college course study.

STIREWALT: This -- people are too -- people are too stupid.

KENNEDY: I can't stand those base reactions, though. If you do something wrong or someone calls you on something, that person is not automatically racist or sexist.

PAVLICH: Right. Marie.

STIREWALT: I think that's sexist.

PAVLICH: Your input on this explosive, shocking...?

HARF: ... I want to never, ever have to talk about Hillary Clinton on television again.

PAVLICH: A couple days off, so...

HARF: Because it's frustrating. But also -- as a Democrat. But also because she's not the future of the party. And it's Republicans who love making fun of her. And Republicans who make fun of her and who love talking about her.

PAVLICH: And Democrats. Democrats are making fun.

HARF: Go into 2018 thinking we're going to relitigate 2016, they're going to be in for a big surprise come November. Because there are a lot of new Democrats who are not Hillary Clinton Democrats. They're Reagan money. They're fired up. And so while this is funny, we're about to turn the page into a big election that is not going to be about the Clintons.

KENNEDY: Hopefully there will be some new names and new faces that we can talk about. I want to talk about ideas and not political failures.



PAVLICH: Shot fired. OK, so speaking of a not-so-fresh face, fasten your seat belts. Mariah Carey is returning to Times Square for a New Year's Eve redo after last year's disaster. How's that going to go? Next.


SHILLUE: It wasn't Mariah Carey's finest hour.



MARIAH CAREY, SINGER: All right. We didn't have a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) for this song, so we'll just say, it was another one. I'm going to say let the audience sing, OK?


SHILLUE: Last year New Year's Eve's performance was a catastrophic mess. But everyone deserves a second chance, right? Mariah is going to get one this Sunday when she returns to Times Square for a redemption performance on "Dick Clark's Rocking Eve."

Wow, Kennedy, Mariah Carey, I don't know -- am I the only one who thinks that wasn't that bad of a performance? She had technical issues.

KENNEDY: Well, here's what I will say. Jesse Watters and I will be hosting "An All-American New Year" right here on the FOX News Channel starting at 10 p.m. Eastern on Sunday night.


KENNEDY: We will be in Times Square.

Last year as Mariah Carey walked by me, I said, "Hello, Mariah," and looked her in the eye, and she looked as though the ghost of MTV Past had grabbed her around the neck and wouldn't let go. She was so terrified and discombobulated.


KENNEDY: Now I think that might have been the cause.

STIREWALT: You did it!

SHILLUE: You freaked her out.

KENNEDY: So what I need to do is Jesse and I need to find her beforehand and give her a nice...

STIREWALT: Positive vibe, yes.

KENNEDY: ... friendly, positive emotional massage so she's able to go out.

PAVLICH: You should give her a jacket.

KENNEDY: ... and complete the work that she started. And you know, it's going to be, like, minus 25. So I don't think she'll be in the sequined bodysuit.

PAVLICH: She needs more than that.

STIREWALT: Do you know what she's wearing this year?

Yes. That's what the Internet said.

KENNEDY: We do have an inspired outfit.

STIREWALT: Spangled nude body stocking.

SHILLUE: I think Kennedy should leave the emotional massaging to -- to Jesse. What do you think?

STIREWALT: I feel like there's no good answer. There's no good answer on that. There's no good answer.

HARF: You love Mariah, though.

KENNEDY: We're her good luck charm.

PAVLICH: I love Mariah when she actually sings. I mean, those poor people stood out in Times Square in the cold to hear the audience sing.

KENNEDY: It will be even colder this year.

SHILLUE: Did you ever try -- do you go outside and you do these things? There are technical issues. It's hard.


HARF: Some day, if we just forget what we're saying on the show, and I'm just going to wander around and say we didn't practice it.

PAVLICH: I'm glad she's getting a second chance. This is America. We believe in redemption. She's getting a second chance to do a good job. But she should dress appropriately, because it would be harder to sing when it's so cold.

KENNEDY: It would be great if she dresses like the kid in the "Christmas Story."

SHILLUE: She should.

HARF: Here's a question. Why doesn't she just lip-sync?

KENNEDY: Well you could hear the crack behind her with the dog whistle.

SHILLUE: She can not -- she can no longer sing those super high notes, Marie. But the thing is.

KENNEDY: Did you hear her voice? Like, "All right. It's a technical problem. I don't know if anyone can hear this."

SHILLUE: She had a cold.

KENNEDY: "I want it to sing itself."

SHILLUE: And she was raspy. But it's difficult. It's hard to sing outside. My sympathy tends to go with the performers.

PAVLICH: Are you going to sing?

SHILLUE: I wouldn't mind. But the thing is...

PAVLICH: He's available.

SHILLUE: They have -- like, we have ear pieces. People talk to us during the show. Don't...

HARF: Is that who's been talking in my earphone.

KENNEDY: She said that hers were on the fritz; they were not working. But then she and her publicist at the time accused Dick Clark Productions...


KENNEDY: ... of sabotaging her ear monitors. I'm like, "Why would we do that?"

HARF: Right.


KENNEDY: We would much rather you have a great performance. We don't want people talking about how you were an unprofessional slob on the stage.

STIREWALT: Who was that? Was it Beyonce who messed up the national anthem?

KENNEDY: That was Roseanne Barr.

HARF: Beyonce can do no wrong.

SHILLUE: Beyonce did it great. Then it was revealed that she was lip- syncing. And again, all the power to them. It's hard to sing outside. Did you ever try to sing the national anthem?

KENNEDY: That was a very frigid day.


KENNEDY: Absolutely freezing cold. Whitney Houston did the same thing in 1991, because she wanted to make sure, in case the audio went out, that she had one prerecorded. And it was absolutely beautiful. She recorded it in the stadium.

SHILLUE: And you've got Maverick and Iceman flying over your head. It's hard.

KENNEDY: They bump the tower. You're spilling coffee on yourself.

HARF: There's a lot happening right now.

SHILLUE: Tune and watch Kennedy and Jesse Watters.

STIREWALT: That's your real takeaway.

SHILLUE: "One More Thing" is up next.


STIREWALT: It's time now -- duh-da-da-dah! -- for "One More Thing"! Marie, Katie, Tom, Chris, that's me. Kennedy.

HARF: I'll go first.

STIREWALT: You want to go first?

HARF: Sure. So this is the plane to nowhere. Chrissy Teigen and her husband, John Legend -- John Legend, who is also a Buckeye, like I am -- were stuck on a plane heading from L.A. to Tokyo when it was turned back because an unauthorized person was on board. Apparently, this happens more often than you think. In the last 24 hours, 10 planes have had to turn around and go back to their origin.

But let's play -- she tweeted out something making fun of the situation. I think we have the video.


CHRISSY TEIGEN, MODEL: Thank you so much for taking me on this awesome vacation, babe.

JOHN LEGEND, SINGER: Welcome to Los Angeles.


HARF: A little sarcasm there for a plane that literally turned around in midair and came back. Not the way any of us want to start our vacation.

STIREWALT: Life is so hard.

HARF: I know. It's just...

PAVLICH: OK. So this is a very sweet story. Sean Hopkins, a high school student in California, received a great surprise from his classmates after his Nintendo 3-D game system he got from his late grandmother...


PAVLICH: ... was stolen. Watch this.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We took it upon ourselves to donate all this money towards a new game for you.



PAVLICH: Isn't that just the sweetest thing? All of his classmates got their allowances together and pitched in to buy him a new one. And he said thank you by telling them, "You're an angel from God." Very grateful to their kindness, which is the opposite of bullying. So it was a very nice, feel-good story.

STIREWALT: What -- what manner of rotten human being steals...

PAVLICH: I know.

STIREWALT: ... a video game system for a child at Christmas. Maybe it's just a literacy advocate.


SHILLUE: The parents. "No, don't give it to him!"

PAVLICH: "Oh, man! Another one?"

KENNEDY: No more Nintendo for you.

STIREWALT: "We want him to go to college."


SHILLUE: Yes. Well, you know, as the author of "Mean Dads for a Better America," I believe that parents should embarrass their children whenever possible. Deja (ph) Davis, she was just trying to sing a pop sing and watch what her mother does.




DAVIS: Wait. Mama, come on. Come on. I sounded good! Oh my God!


PAVLICH: The best. Love it.

SHILLUE: Fantastic. Don't you love it, Kennedy?

KENNEDY: That's the kind of parenting that...

HARF: Have you ever done something like that to your kid?

KENNEDY: Every day.

STIREWALT: This is...

KENNEDY: I dance in the grocery store, and my children, they bury their heads, like, "Mom!"

I tell them, "I was once cool, I'll have you know, in the '90s."

PAVLICH: You still are cool.

STIREWALT: All right. Please let me bring it down. Let me get the coolness out of the room, because I want to tell you about the 8-year-old boy. He was rescued after falling through the ice in Utah on Christmas day. Now I love this story for a couple of reasons. One, the boy is chasing a dog who he was worried about going out onto the ice.


STIREWALT: He fell through the water. Several rescuers arrived on the scene. And you're going to meet Sergeant Aaron Thompson of the Washington County, Utah, Sheriff's Office. And he went into the water after this kid. Let's listen.


SGT. AARON THOMPSON, WASHINGTON COUNTY, UTAH, SHERIFF'S OFFICE: I was getting desperate. I had searched the entire broken out area. And he was back underneath the ice beyond the broken-out area. And I was actually calling out to him.


STIREWALT: Now, this guy ends up with, obviously, hypothermia, deep cuts and stitches all over his body. But he got the kid out. The kid was still, when I was reading about it today, the kid was still artificially unconscious. They were keeping him in a coma-like state, because they were watching his brain activity. But the prognosis was good. And very important, the dog was fine.


STIREWALT: The dog was fine. So kudos...

PAVLICH: Happy story.

STIREWALT: Kudos to Sergeant Thompson.

And Kennedy, what do you got?

KENNEDY: Well, I have something for older people. This time of year, of course...


KENNEDY: ... you see so many people celebrating. They're with their families. And it's incredibly isolating. And they found -- there was a study of 3,300 people in Israel. And for those who got out of the house every day, who went out and did something outside their home, they were much more likely to hit major milestones. If they were 70, they were most likely to see 75 or 80, if they, in fact, went outside of their house.

So if you find that you have been shut in and isolated, but you want to live a long and productive life, there is a direct correlation between you getting out of your house and living longer. So go ahead. Find a way. Call a friend or family member. Make sure they drive you somewhere. Better yet, walk, if you can. Get out, live longer.

HARF: And if you know someone...


HARF: ... and you're our age, and you know someone who needs help, do it.

SHILLUE: Download the FOX News app and you take it with you everywhere. You don't have to...

PAVLICH: And leave your television.

STIREWALT: We'll give you -- we'll give you 30 seconds' grace.

Now, that is it for us, but "Special Report" is up next. Mike Emanuel is filling in for Bret Baier. Over to you, Mr. Mike.

MIKE EMANUEL, FOX NEWS: Good to see the gentleman from West Virginia on TV and all of you at "The Five."

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