Will parole board set OJ Simpson free?
This is a rush transcript from "The Five," July 17, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone, I'm Kimberly Guilfoyle along Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, Dana Perino and Greg Gutfeld. It's 9 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."
It is a hearing that everyone will be watching. OJ Simpson is up for parole this week. So, will one of America's most infamous prisoners be set free? It's a crime saga that began more than 23 years ago, 1994, Los Angeles police in hot pursuit of a fugitive from justice. NFL legend Orenthal James Simpson wanted for the murders of his ex-wife Nicole Brown and her friend Ron Goldman. It led to the trial of the century.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOHNNIE COCHRAN, OJ DEFENSE ATTORNEY: O.J. Simpson in a knit cap from two blocks away is still O.J. Simpson. It's no disguise. It's no disguise. It makes no sense. It doesn't fit. If it doesn't fit, you must acquit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: And in 1995, an acquittal. Despite powerful DNA evidence that linked Simpson directly to the crime.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We, the jury in the above entitled action find the defendant Orenthal James Simpson not guilty of the crime of murder in violation of penal code section 187 (a).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: But two years later in a civil trial he was found liable for the deaths and ordered to pay more than $33 million to the families of the victims. Fast forward to 2007, O.J. arrested again. This time on armed robbery, kidnapping, and other charges involving two sports memorabilia agents at a Las Vegas hotel. He was convicted in that trial.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Count one, conspiracy to commit a crime. Guilty. Count two, conspiracy to commit kidnapping, guilty. Count three, conspiracy to commit robbery, guilty.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: Simpson is now 70 years of age and up for parole after serving more than eight years of a 33 year sentence. If granted release on Thursday, he would walk out of prison on October 1st. The hearing will be televised much like the trial. All right, Greg, get your thoughts.
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: The reason why you had to do a two-minute recap is because most of the people don't remember this because they are so young. I was like listening to this, I'm kind of like, I know every part of this. And it's like, of course it's going to be televised because we can't get enough of scandal. We cannot -- we have forgotten how to shame. So we all must go and just suck all this in because we can't get enough of it. I don't understand parole. It should work in reverse.
You start at the sentence and good behavior prevents you from lengthening the sentence, not from shortening. I don't understand why somehow a 33 year sentence goes to eight years. I don't know. The one thing I learned from this sentence is that facts don't matter when you're a celebrity and you have got a lot of money and you have you a lot of lawyers. Nobody else could have gotten off that way.
We excuse the brutality of famous people if you look at what's going on with R. Kelly right now. There are no music sites that are talking about that. And they knew about that forever. And with O.J., there was a lot of star power there. And that star power overpowered a lot of people.
JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: What did R. Kelly do?
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Well, it's the whole, it's another day. You know that --
WATTERS: I thought it was something new. I thought it was something new.
GUTFELD: Go ahead. It's the same thing.
GUILFOYLE: No, it's the old thing.
WATTERS: Got it.
GUILFOYLE: Not good.
GUTFELD: I shouldn't have brought it up.
GUILFOYLE: Yes. Thank you. Dana?
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, watching the video reminded me on the night that he was acquitted, I was working as a waitress in Denver, Colorado, and I had the bar area. And no one left. And I think we stayed there -- everybody stayed until like 2:00 in the morning. I probably made the most tips I ever had in my life. Because as Greg was saying, people were absolutely glued to the television. They couldn't get enough of it.
GUTFELD: And there was no social networks, no internet. Yet the thing was, something we obsessed over constantly.
PERINO: Well, and as much as I think that he killed his wife and Ron Goldman, this particular crime is for the botched robbery in Nevada. And I guess I would say that the reason that you do parole based on good behavior is so that you actually do behave in prison so that can you try to get out earlier. Kimberly, I don't know if that's exactly correct.
PERINO: But I think that --
WATTERS: And you're going to support that when you get locked up.
GUTFELD: I know. I know. I changed my mind --
PERINO: I don't think it's preferential treatment for parole. But I do think that in our justice system we have to look at this particular crime and if the prosecutor and the judge think that he has met the standards that were set and that he should get paroled and he is probably going to get paroled.
GUILFOYLE: All right. Jesse, do you recall this? I mean, how old were you?
WATTERS: I was in high school when I was watching this. Sorry, Greg. No. I think the juice is going to get cut loose again because of the letter of the law. The first time he skated because you could pay for the dream team. They chose the bad venue downtown L.A. and the prosecution booted it. They made him try on the glove. They had Mark Fuhrman the racist up on the stands. They got the race card played on them and they didn't even realize it was happening.
GUILFOYLE: That was her allegation against him.
WATTERS: That was the allegation against Mark Fuhrman. I thought it was on tape. Maybe I'm wrong. And then the prosecutors threw the kitchen sink at him for the armed robbery. He wasn't even holding the gun. But he was involved in the armed robbery. And I think it was, you know, really, really rough sentence. Because they had in mind this guy skated on a double homicide. Now, he has been behaving in prison and no one is going to testify against him at the parole board hearing.
So, I think if they're fair and they just look at this case, they will parole him. But if they say karma is going to play a role here, they're going to make him sit down. I think most Americans want to see O.J. stay in prison. I think there is a certain segment of the population that might break down among racial lines that want O.J. loose. And I understand that I'm going to shoot a waters world about this and we will see if that's the case or not.
But then there is also a sixth segment of the population that says, I know he did it, but I still want to see O.J. out. I want to see O.J. in the tabloids. I want to see O.J. on TV because O.J. is a spectacle. And unfortunately, if he does get paroled, I think it's going to reopen a lot of racial wounds in this country, unfortunately. And I think O.J. being paroled is probably the only thing that could knock Trump out of a news cycle for a little while. But Trump will probably tweet about it and then the media is going to go bonkers.
GUILFOYLE: Well, he is on parole for trying to get his sports memorabilia back.
WATTERS: He claims.
GUILFOYLE: Yes. But you can't use force to do that. But nevertheless, you can't be kept in because you think that he murdered his wife and Ron Goldman. So, this is an entirely different fact pattern.
GUILFOYLE: And that's what they have to consider, not whether or not their personal beliefs as to whether or not he is guilty of the prior crime.
JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: So, this is like a trip down memory lane, Kimberly.
WILLIAMS: Because I mean, on Thursday this is going to be on all of your television screens. Every cable channel. I think the networks may get involved is going to cover this. And they will cover it with like the intensity you would think it was another Trump event. Because that's the only thing in my lifetime that you say is comparable to this kind of electrifying personality. Now, here is the criteria that the parole board will be looking at. They will consider his age and as Kimberly told you he is 70 years old. So he is getting up there. Secondly.
GUILFOYLE: Medical convictions.
WILLIAMS: Medical convictions for a violent crime. Well, in this case, yes it was, he didn't hold a gun but it was a violent crime being committed at the time.
WILLIAMS: And then the third thing, his prior criminal history. Now, if you listen to us talk about, this you would say oh well, of course, you know, what happened to Nicole. But the fact is O.J. Simpson doesn't have a prior criminal history.
WILLIAMS: And then the final fact that they will consider and I find this amusing, his plans after his release. Well, I mean, I guess.
WATTERS: He is going to look for the real killers on the golf course.
WILLIAMS: You know, you beat me to my --
WATTERS: I'm sorry, Juan. I didn't mean to pull that --
WILLIAMS: That is cool.
PERINO: I'm curious about Kimberly's recollections. Because you are in California at the time you're practicing law. And what do you remember?
GUILFOYLE: And then I went right in right after the O.J., you know, case to the Los Angeles district attorney as a new prosecutor. I was in the class with the Simpson interns. So they had been working on that case. And I was the only person hired that wasn't an intern.
PERINO: Oh, really?
GUILFOYLE: Yes. And only one that wasn't from the L.A. D.A.'s office when we came to San Francisco. So, that was interesting. But, and then going downtown to try cases at the time and you would see, because of the backlash against the police and everything, you would see like not guilties up on the board. Like any case where it had an officer as a main witness, there's a narcotics case, et cetera, very difficult at the time. Than just, you know, the composition of the juries downtown, depending on, you know, the different areas. That was one of the things that the D.A.'s office was criticized about is that they didn't try the case where it happened in that particular.
PERINO: Why was that?
GUILFOYLE: Well, they made a decision to take it downtown to the criminal courts building. High security, et cetera. And they actually thought that the jurors down there would be, I think, more likely to convict him. And they grossly miscalculated that.
GUILFOYLE: Because the civil case was done in the actual area by Brentwood and Santa Monica court. And that's where they were able to get the civil, you know, verdict issued against him. So it was quite interesting. But I think they got an 82 percent chance usually in that Nevada system that people with his similar background in terms of lack of priors, good conduct, nobody is opposing his parole, his age, his medical condition, et cetera. Pretty much 82 percent that I think he gets released.
GUTFELD: What could he do? If you think about a lot of the characters in this drama are still alive whether you want to talk about Marcia Clark, Judge Ito, Collins, Fuhrman, Rosa Lopez the maid. Kato Kaelin. You know, it's a pay per view reunion panel that could probably blow Mayweather McGregor out of the water.
WATTERS: I think FOX should make some calls on that.
GUTFELD: But I mean, if you had everybody out there, you add, all of them up there and it could be like an amazing thing to finally like get to the truth and just get really ugly.
WATTERS: Maybe on the Greg Gutfeld show.
GUTFELD: Yes. We don't have enough chairs.
WILLIAMS: But will he have to pay the 33.5 million?
GUTFELD: Oh, yes.
WILLIAMS: Because he's never paid the money.
GUTFELD: Every money he makes has to be ducked. Right?
WILLIAMS: Well, no, but I think some of the NFL pension is protected.
GUTFELD: Right. Yes.
WILLIAMS: So, the question is, if they do that invest them, like he can't write another book that says, what if I did it?
PERINO: But do you know, Kimberly?
GUILFOYLE: Yes. I mean, that's a judgment that still in effect against him.
GUILFOYLE: So, yes, if he makes some money, he joins like the Kardashian reality show --
PERINO: Oh, no!
GUILFOYLE: Who knows? Who knows? And he makes any money from that, profits, of course they will try to seize and it make sure that they get money put towards their judgment. Right? That's fair, isn't it?
WILLIAMS: That would be good.
GUILFOYLE: All right. Well, President Trump is fired up again at the liberal media for targeting his son while covering for Hillary Clinton. Next.
GUTFELD: So, as the media fans the flames of collusion, I ask, what about them? Meaning: What about Hillary's dirty tricks? Podesta scams, the media's role in ignoring all of it. Remember blaming Benghazi on a video? Donna Brazile's debate help. The tarmac visit? The secret server? The IRS? Or how about the left's decades of collusion with the USSR? You couldn't swing a dead tabby without hitting a fellow traveler in Hollywood or academia. Funny how the left embraced far worse evil back then and now they hate Russia whose military and land mass is nowhere near the size and strength of its old self.
Now I get it. The "what about them" argument doesn't excuse Donald Jr.'s actions. But that's not the point. It's simply to show you that the chase is driven by politics and not morality. It reveals the depths the left goes to win.
Example: Let's say for the past year, Jesse has been stuffing me in my locker outside "The Five." Finally, I punch him in the goofies. That's the "what about" argument. The response is valid after the abuse. That's why America yawns over Russia. And for them a better explanation exists: A nonpolitician -- Donald Trump Jr. -- took a meeting unaware the rules and forgot about it.
Look, Russian meddling is a worry that we raise every single day on "The Five." But today's duplicity by hysterics who embraced the Reds decades ago negates the outrage. You want collusion to matter? Ask this: How do we stop it from happening again? That's constructive, which is why the Dems and their media enablers hate it.
Jesse, shouldn't the past matter? The context? Shouldn't we to provide context the people that are chasing Trump of them far worse?
GUTFELD: Is that as they say a distraction, a diversification?
WATTERS: Yes. You're doing it. And the reason I stuffed you in the locker is you fit so nicely in that tiny little locker. And I don't mind it.
GUTFELD: And I don't mind it.
WATTERS: So cute.
GUTFELD: I don't mind it. I sleep in there.
WATTERS: I think the Democrats are trying to criminalize winning. And the only thing Trump is guilty of is beating Hillary. And they want to make beating Hillary a crime. Now, the reason you use the what about them scenario is because it's the only thing that really challenges the left's integrity. Because when you say they are hypothetical, they have double standards, they're bias. They say, oh, we're not. And you can point to these hard examples.
Because their integrity is all they have in order to sell their propaganda. But that's what it is, it is a mirage? And they use it to masquerade the propaganda. So, without it, they are broke. And I love playing the what about them game. I'm actually quite good at it. You stole some of the monologue. But I would like to add a few. They did use the IRS as a weapon to persecute Republicans in order to win re-election.
They lied about the video in order to win re-election. They said, you can keep your healthcare in order to win re-election. That's not even mentioning the fact that they let guns walk into Mexico that killed a border patrol guard or let, you know, these people hack our military and then commute the guilty people. So, here's the things that Don Jr. didn't do. Don Jr. didn't destroy evidence. He didn't plead the Fifth. He didn't get anybody shot. He didn't break a law so far. He didn't embolden terrorists. So, I would like to hear what the media has to say about those charges before they can start convicting him.
GUTFELD: Hmm. I think that's a fair defense. Juan, if you focus on future collusion, that keeps from you talking about the past. Is that why the Democrats and the media can't move on, they can't say about what we should do next because then that forces them to let go of the story? Do you follow me, Juan?
WILLIAMS: I was trying to.
GUTFELD: It's a brilliant comment I made. In fact, I will just skip you now. Now, go ahead.
WILLIAMS: You mean that because of the things you mentioned in the past where you had fellow travelers who are mostly liberal Democrats who --
GUTFELD: Not that they have to focus on what happened in the campaign rather than how we could stop them in the future. Do you say, okay, we agree, if Republicans -- we agree, meddling is bad and meddling happened, let's work to prevent that in the future. They will go no, not so fast. We need to focus on the past on the campaign.
WILLIAMS: Well, that's not just true.
GUTFELD: But it's happening.
WILLIAMS: No. Because in fact the head of the Democratic, I think the Congressional committee just wrote a letter to the Republican cohort saying, let's get together, let's create an alliance and stop this from happening in the future. And guess what, the Republicans said no.
WILLIAMS: Yes. Because I think --
GUTFELD: I do not have that information with me. I shall look it up later.
WILLIAMS: Okay. But I think the fear is that somehow you justify or validate the idea of this Russian probe. But, I mean, my feeling is, by the way, that guess what, Trump, Jr. did obstruct because he didn't reveal his email contacts. Kushner.
WATTERS: Did he obstruct justice or did he struck?
WILLIAMS: He was not forthcoming with the information much as --
WATTERS: Maybe he should have deleted all his emails.
GUILFOYLE: Or bleach them.
WILLIAMS: How about Kushner?
GUTFELD: Yes. That's a good point though. Can I just move to Kimberly?
GUILFOYLE: Yes. Thank you.
GUTFELD: He clearly didn't think he was doing anything wrong. He didn't even bother to hide anything. That's the sign of it.
WILLIAMS: Didn't know the "New York Times" had it?
GUTFELD: Well, if he thought he had done something wrong, aka Hillary --
GUTFELD: He would have destroyed them before that.
GUILFOYLE: The point is, if he thought there were something nefarious. And whether he had done something that was criminally live before, et cetera. There were some kind of evidence of specific collusion. Yes, then he would have destroyed evidence which is what we saw a Hillary Clinton do and get away with them, just peachy keen. You know, just go ahead and delete, you know, 30,000 emails. Bleach bit, destroy devices, do anything you can but there is a total double standard. And that is just all fine.
WILLIAMS: You got to running away?
GUILFOYLE: No, we're not running away. I'm running right into it. It feels good.
So, here's the thing. So, Don Jr. is like, here is my information. So what if the "New York Times" had it or not. He had available because he didn't delete it or try and destroy it or try and get rid of and tamper with evidence, et cetera. So, he is being transparent. He has answered questions. Okay. He has produced the emails. And he said, you know, regrettably yes he could have handled things a little bit differently.
But nevertheless, 20 minutes complete waste of time. And I think the evidence is showing now that this was a total set up because you look at the woman that he met with and her connections and ties to the Democratic Party. So, I mean, what else is there to say there? It's obvious what happened.
GUTFELD: Well, there is from Dana. Wrap it up. Use your common sense and your wisdom.
PERINO: Put a bow on it.
PERINO: I don't actually buy the conspiracy theory that the Democrats set it up for her to go that might come out and then I would -- I just don't think there is enough evidence there to say that. I do think that --
GUILFOYLE: That's posible (SPEAKING SPANISH).
PERINO: Yes. That's posible (SPEAKING SPANISH). I do think that the Russians maybe were trying to say like, knock, knock --
PERINO: Is anybody there and they got somebody to say, yes, I'm there and I think the reasons last week when I said I never would do it, I thought about this over the weekend and why would I think that? It's because every day in my life I have woken up thinking that I'm in trouble with somebody.
PERINO: And I wake up and I think even before I got out of bed, like, why is my dad mad at me? I haven't done anything yet. And I have a nose for trouble. And I'm a little bit paranoid. And I also think that if the Russian government wants to provide information, ding, ding, ding, okay, don't do that. I was trying to think --
WATTERS: I thought I had a nose for trouble.
GUILFOYLE: Oh, you have a whole body for trouble.
PERINO: Can I sniff out trouble and stay out of it.
WATTERS: Okay. Let me know what you find.
PERINO: Well, a big problem for Hillary Clinton for a long time always believed she was above the law. And that's what made the right so mad.
PERINO: And so, when you talk about, well, what about this? It does sort of weakens the argument from the right. But as you've said, the right has now taken on the tactics of the left. And if that is worth it to win, maybe that's where the movement goes. Although I just would like to think we are better than that.
WATTERS: I just think they're saying, lower the temperature on the media side so you are going to make this into Watergate. What about Watergate one, two, three, 4.0 the last eight years.
PERINO: I think Benghazi was a really good example. We were made fun of for talking about that. And nobody stood up for the video maker for his First Amendment rights to make a video.
GUTFELD: Everybody laughed.
GUTFELD: Everybody laughed about the --
PERINO: Let's start talking about it again.
GUTFELD: Yes, Dana.
PERINO: I want to do it. We get that b roll of the burning cars.
GUTFELD: Yes. That was great. All right. The fastest seven coming up next.
WATTERS: Welcome back. Time for the fastest seven minutes on television. Three stories, seven minutes. Let's go. First up. Al Gore hasn't given up his global warming films even though dire predictions in his first one didn't come to pass. He is now out promoting an inconvenient sequel with some more fuzzy facts.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
AL GORE, FORMER UNITED STATES VICE PRESIDENT: We have never had a president who has deliberately made decisions, the effect of which is to tear down America's standing in the world, starting with his withdrawal from the Paris agreement, the climate crisis is by far the most serious challenge we face. I went to Miami on a sunny day, no rain, and I saw fish from the ocean swimming in the streets in Miami Beach just because it was a high tide.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: All right. So, Gutfeld, why didn't Gore take a picture of this fish swimming in the streets and post it on the internet, did he invent it?
GUILFOYLE: Yes. He's created it.
GUTFELD: The great thing about this sequel is that it proves him wrong because the earth was supposed to be gone before the sequel came out.
WATTERS: That's right.
GUTFELD: The biggest problem in climate change activism right now is Al Gore. And even the vocal leaders admit that exaggeration is harming their cause and bolstering skepticism. The more that you exaggerate a cause, the more skeptics you create. So, Gore is becoming the albatross around the climate change activism neck. And the link between climate change and extreme weather is considered weak and very strongly in question if you look at all the data.
WATTERS: Dana Perino?
PERINO: Well, President Trump is one thing that, maybe one of the only things that could reinvigorate Al Gore's career. If we have seen more of Al Gore in the last six months than we have in eight years. And that's because Gore did not poke President Obama at all when it came to climate change. He didn't say do more. Like Paris accords were basically is totally voluntary so it really meant nothing. And so Gore now has reclaim from Obama the title of Global Climate Change Champion of the World. And all he has to do is put out a press release and he will get on TV.
WILLIAMS: Well, in fact I think Al Gore thought that the Paris climate deal wasn't sufficient and they weren't doing enough. So he was critical of that. I don't know if he made it personal with Obama in the way that I think people make it personal with Trump because Trump has been very clear he is not about that. Now, last week when he was over for Bastille Day in Paris, apparently Emmanuel Macron the President was making an effort to try to get President Trump to change his mind. But I don't see any evidence of it so far.
WATTERS: Also not seeing any evidence of global warming. KG?
WILLIAMS: No, no, no. Hold on. Let me just say before KG.
GUTFELD: Oh, wait. Let's get out of that.
WILLIAMS: You know what? Don't forget, this is what you guys are saying. No evidence? What happened to that huge glacier, the size of Delaware that broke off lately?
GUTFELD: It's on my backyard, I'll show it to you.
WILLIAMS: Oh, I see. Okay.
GUILFOYLE: Yes. He is making margaritas out of it. So, listen, bad news for Al Gore, OK, because he's been doing this fearmongering and like climate, like witchcraft nonsense for how long now? We weren't even supposed to be here to talk about this because Mar-a-Lago was supposed to be wiped out like everything.
But none of his predictions have come true. Very sad for him. But, again, like Dana said, he is getting some relevance now where is he talking and going crazy about the climate stuff because of President Trump. So it's like actually the best thing to happen.
WATTERS: That's right. All right. On Friday we told you Kid Rock was considering a run for senate. He's apparently not the only celebrity with political ambitions. Here is Caitlyn Jenner.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
CAITLYN JENNER, TV PERSONALITY: I have considered it. I like the political side of it. Over the next six months or so, I got to find out where I can do a better job. Can I do a better job from the outside, kind of working the perimeter of the political scene, being open to, you know, talk to anybody? Or are you better off from the inside? And we are in the process of determining that and, yes, but I would look for a senatorial run.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
WATTERS: I think Caitlyn should announce on the "Greg Gutfeld Show."
GUTFELD: I would love that. But the way, I already got her slogan, "Caitlyn, now there is real change."
GUTFELD: The thing is, it's an opportunity for am ember of LBGT to reframe identity politics as not a rejection, I mean, not as an exaggeration of difference but as a celebration of greater community. This has always been the problem in leftist politics and activism, is that we keep celebrating - - we keep hammering the divisiveness and how different you are.
And this is somebody who as a leader could say hey, I'm a conservative, a member of the LBGT. I could, like, bring people together. So it would actually be refreshing.
WATTERS: That would blow people's mind. Does Caitlyn have a shot in California?
PERINO: Sure she does. Well, it depends. I mean the LBGT community has not necessarily embraced her with open arms, but imagine if she didn't talk about that at all. She said I'm going to give one interview about that and that's it. And the rest of the time I'm talking about taxes and the economy and protecting this country. She'd actually probably win.
WATTERS: OK, Juan?
WILLIAMS: No. I don't think she has any chance in California despite the fact that it's kind of liberal la la land. The reality is transgender and gay rights would be the basis of her campaign (ph), that's why she's upset.
PERINO: That's not what she is saying.
WILLIAMS: No, I think she is saying. And you know what, remember that young woman who sang the national anthem at the inaugural then she said her sister was someone who is --
WILLIAMS: -- and then she came and said I'm so disappointed with President Trump. I think Caitlyn Jenner has that feeling. By the way, the Rock says he wants to do politics, right? Kid rock wants to do it. But you know what? Caitlin Jenner would be the best athlete of all.
WATTERS: Interesting point.
GUTFELD: Two rocks and a kid.
GUILFOYLE: OK, so yes, I think Caitlyn should run, you know. Obviously, she's very interested in politics and it would be smart of the Republican Party in California to back her and then, you know, see what happens with the Democrats and the Liberals and the LBGTQ community and see if they actually come out and do the right thing and support her.
WATTERS: All right, and finally with big night for "Game of Thrones" fans, season seven premiered last night to its biggest audience ever, more than 16 million.
WATTERS: KG, did you watch?
GUILFOYLE: I was busy. I was busy doing a far better show.
WATTERS: OK, right. And Juan, did you watch?
WILLIAMS: Yes. So I was at dinner and all of a sudden I realized my family is gone, because everybody said, oh my gosh, they thought it was at 10:00 but it was at 9:00. That's why everybody went running out of the restaurant.
WATTERS: You a fan or not or does it scare you?
PERINO: I think it would scare me. The only thing I've seen about it is the Ben Shapiro spoof thing that he did on it. It was pretty funny.
WATTERS: OK. You probably hate "Game of Thrones."
GUTFELD: No, I loved it.
PERINO: He loved it.
GUTFELD: My favorite part was when Carrie ran into Mr. Big outside of her apartment to make it clear she doesn't want him in her life and then she has dinner with Samantha, Charlotte and Miranda before she runs off to Paris.
WATTERS: That was "Sex in the City," Gutfeld.
GUTFELD: No, that was "Game of Thrones."
WATTERS: Oh, god. All right, some breaking news ahead on the GOP's effort to repeal Obamacare. Back in a moment.
PERINO: Some breaking news tonight. Another big setback for the Republican effort to repeal and replace Obamacare. Chief national correspondent Ed Henry has more on that breaking news tonight. Ed?
ED HENRY, FOX NEWS CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Dana, I just got off the phone with one of the president's top advisor who told me this is a blow to the president tonight but they are still hopeful they can pick up the pieces either by getting the Senate to work on health care again after the August recess or perhaps the president will have to go out to the American people and put pressure on Senate Republicans to come up with a new version after six or seven years of vowing that they would repeal and replace Obamacare.
Tonight, for now at least, it is dead. This news coming because two more Republican senators in the last few moments have come out and said they cannot support the current version of the bill. That would be Mike Lee of Utah as well as Jerry Moran of Kansas. Now, you put them on top of the fact that you've had Susan Collins and Rand Paul already saying they will not vote for this current version of the bill.
You have Senator John McCain who just had surgery who is out in Arizona and we all know is not going to be able to come back and vote on any version of this at least for a week or so. That means the Republicans are nowhere close to having at least 50 votes to then have Vice President Mike Pence cast the 51st vote for a motion to proceed to at least get to a floor debate on this.
All this comes just a few hours after the president made very positive optimistic remarks here at the White House insisting they were very close to a deal. That he still thought they were going to surprise people. So what's interesting is this advisor I just spoke to, to the president is telling me that the key move is what does the president do next?
Does he go out on twitter tonight or tomorrow and start lashing out at Senate Republican leaders who I'm told in private he is very frustrated with, that they haven't been able to get this done. Or does he find a way to move forward with them constructively to try and pick up the pieces, Dana.
PERINO: All right, thank you, Ed. So, Jesse, President Trump and I were on the same page. Optimism, believing it was going to happen and you said no, you don't think it's not going to happen and it turns out you might be right.
WATTERS: I hate to tap myself on the back, Dana, but I'm going to do it. You know, I didn't have a lot of faith in the Senate Republicans because they didn't show any optimism. I mean, you've had, what, seven months to just come up with something.
PERINO: Seven years.
WATTERS: Seven years. What did they do? I mean the Senate dining room, the food is not that great. The gym by the looks of them, no one is really working out. They are not allowed to like take lunches and dinners anymore because of this lobbying rules.
What do they do? They have one job, repeal and replace Obamacare and they can't do it. If you're working in the private sector and you've had all this time to get something done, and then you come into a board meeting and did you go, I got nothing. I mean, those people are out on the street.
PERINO: They might say you have nothing. Kimberly, sometimes for the president or for any president dealt a bad hand and you just have to decide how to play it. So what do you think will happen tomorrow?
GUILFOYLE: I think it's really frustrating. I know the president is frustrated with the situation. A lot has been promised to him and not much delivered. I think this is, you know, a failure on the part of the leadership to be quite honest because they needed to get this to stick and coalesce and get it done. And I'm mostly I'm sad for the American people, you know.
And there were promises made and they have not been delivered on. And they had, you know, all kinds of complaints, all along about Obamacare. Night and day complaining and criticizing. And yet they can't come together to put something excellent forward to the American people. So that's the problem.
PERINO: So a lot of people will be living with uncertainty, Greg.
GUTFELD: You know, I'm thinking about this and what everybody is saying. Whenever we do a segment on health care, I get home and I'm sure it happens to you, you get all these e-mails from like doctors and nurses and I get maybe like 20 e-mails from people telling me the solution. And it's really, really smart, very practical, and they are always very specific good stuff.
And I keep sitting here and I'm going like there's no landing page. There is no landing place for these ideas. And I started thinking about stuff like Waze which people or drivers use. They find the quickest route based on accumulation of user data. If you go on Wikipedia and you plug in any word -- when you plug in any word, anything shows up. If you put Jesse Watters, Wikipedia. If you put --
WATTERS: No, don't do that.
GUILFOYLE: Don't do it.
GUTFELD: The point is --
GUILFOYLE: The controversy section.
GUTFELD: Technology isn't just a device. It's the scope of it. It's the fact that everybody is contributing to it and that happens with Wikipedia and with Waze and I get all these e-mails and I'm going there's got to be landing strip for ideas because we're trusting this huge problem to the government which is a dearth -- it's a dearth of ideas. Anyway, I'm not the only one who's thought of that.
PERINO: So Juan, is this salvageable for the Republicans?
WILLIAMS: No, and it hasn't been for a very long time. Remember, as you pointed out, Dana, seven years -- seven years. So, yes, you can go into the Wikipedia. You can go on the internet. You can call up the experts, but the experts will say oh, we're Republicans. You know what, we're a heritage. We're Mitt Romney in Massachusetts and we want to keep the marketplace alive.
We want the insurance companies involved and this is how we can do it. And they've put together this plan and then Obama emulates the plan and the Republicans playing politics saying, we hate it, we hate it, we hate it. Well guess what? Now, according to the polls more than 50 percent of Americans think Obamacare needs to stay in place. They like it.
PERINO: I think that's because they don't understand what the alternative could be.
WILLIAMS: Oh yes. Well, I think after seven years they understand it pretty well.
PERINO: Maybe this is actually the (INAUDIBLE) to remain optimistic. This is maybe a chance to regroup and even if they have to do it in September that would be OK. President Trump is making all kinds of changes to America's immigration policy and the results are miraculous according to the head of the Border Patrol Union. That's next.
WILLIAMS: Since President Trump has taken office, there has been a large drop in the number of people trying to cross illegally into the U.S. due to his strict immigration policies. The head of the National Border Patrol Union calls it, "nothing short of miraculous." He is heaping praise on the president.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRANDON JUDD, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL BORDER PATROL UNION: There's a vibe. There's an energy in the border patrol that's never been there before. In 20 years that I have been in the patrol, we haven't seen this type of energy. And we're excited because we signed up to do a job, and this president is allowing us to do that job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: So Kimberly, here you have the head of the union praising President Trump saying he's brought a new attitude to the border patrol. My question is, those guys are unleashed but they don't have any concern about breaking up families.
GUILFOYLE: Oh my gosh. For a second I thought you were just going to be legitimate.
WILLIAMS: I am.
GUILFOYLE: I thought you were going to be like this is great. Things are working.
WATTERS: Border Patrol is at the border. They're not deporting people.
GUILFOYLE: No, and I mean, exactly. But now he is saying that they are mean-spirited.
WILLIAMS: No, I think it's all part of the same thing. In fact --
GUILFOYLE: But you can't -- you got to be fair.
WILLIAMS: I am fair.
GUILFOYLE: What about giving -- OK. But the point of the matter is, they're saying that this is good. They're actually able to do their job and enforce the law. Since when is that a bad thing? So now you even have the union saying that they've seen improvement and that President Trump has done a good job, but yet again, you are loathe to in fact acknowledge a positive accomplishment. Why is that?
WILLIAMS: No, because, in fact, it is lower but it was lower even when Obama was in there. They hit all-time lows in terms of people crossing the southern border --
GUTFELD: That's because --
GUILFOYLE: And now people don't come over because they're afraid the wall, which is Trump.
WILLIAMS: Jesse, in fact, President Trump's administration has just enacted (ph) they're going to unleash additional visas for workers. What do you think of that?
WATTERS: I hadn't heard that. It's interesting. Is it high tech workers?
WILLIAMS: No, no, no.
PERINO: Like ones that work at Mar-a-Lago.
WATTERS: So they work under water?
PERINO: I'm for it. I'm for more legal immigration.
WATTERS: I know under Obama the Border Patrol is making sandwiches for illegals and now Border Patrol under Trump is delivering knuckle sandwiches to traffickers. I think having less smuggling, less cartel activity, less illegal alien border crossings and less human traffickers, I think that is a god thing. I think people on the border, Americans -- Americans on the border want that Juan. That's what I think this is all it's about --
WILLIAMS: I don't think that but you think that.
WATTERS: -- protecting the American people.
GUILFOYLE: How long did it take to you come up with the knuckle sandwich thing?
WATTERS: Longer than it would have taken Greg.
WILLIAMS: And also John Kelly, the head of Homeland Security, Dana, now says he doesn't think they can defend the deferred program for people who arrived as children.
PERINO: You mean that it will go away?
PERINO: Well, I think that that will be debate that they should have with Congress so that whatever action they decide can be more stable and there will be certainty and it has to go to courts. Let's just get that Supreme Court decision because now they have a full nine. I understand the boost in morale. He said, they take a job to fulfill a mission and in the last eight years, that mission had been very muddied.
So now they feel like that the president has their back. ICE and the Border Patrol are political punching bags. So, some things are doing too much, some things are doing too little. It goes back and forth and I think that they just do a really good job. I'm sure it is refreshing for them to feel like the president is supportive.
WILLIAMS: So Greg, will you give one tenth of your salary to build a wall?
GUTFELD: Yes. I didn't know anybody asked.
GUTFELD: You know what, everybody in their lives have had a job that was soul destroying and it's always soul destroying because the boss didn't tell what you to do. It's usually when you were young you had a boss which show up and you just kind of sit at your desk. I had a job like that. So, when you get a new boss, who just says to you do your job.
It is invigorating and it gives you purpose and it goes back to what I've said before about Trump, is that he may not need a wall. He is the wall. Simply invoking these changes is enough to make a difference. And it is happening. And Central America, the traffickers can no longer get customers and the wall is not even there.
GUILFOYLE: Well, Border Patrol used to sue President Obama and his administration. And now the rule of law has returned to the United State that's why everybody is --
WILLIAMS: I think it's a good point. "One More Thing" up next.
GUILFOYLE: It's time now for "One More Thing." Delight us, Greg.
GUTFELD: My childhood hero growing up passed away. Martin Landau was 89. Anybody who was my age grew up watching "Mission Impossible." Martin Landau was an amazing character because he was always in disguise. Like "Mission Impossible" is great for an adolescent boy who had gadgets, disguises. You had Barbara Bain, Peter Lupus, you had Greg Morris and you had Peter Graves and Martin Landau.
It was such disguises when you were a kid. Trickery was enchanting. It was like you always wanted to be able to do that. And that's what was so great about this show. By the way, he left "Mission Impossible." He was replaced by Leonard Nimoy, but he had originally turned down the job as Spak in "Star Trek."
WILLIAM: I didn't know that.
GUTFELD: He was a great actor and awesome, and Ed Wood as well.
GUILFOYLE: All right, that was pretty fantastic. Juan?
WILLIAMS: Well, did you see this on Friday? President Bush and President Clinton, who are friends by the way, spoke together at the Bush Library in Dallas and without mentioning President Trump by name, they said the most important quality for a president is humility. I agree. Humility is great but today, folks, I am far from humble. I am bursting with pride because the event where the president spoke was a 2017 graduation for 60 members of the Presidential Leadership Scholars Program and one of the graduates, no other than my son Tony.
Here's the class photo of all the graduates. You can see Mrs. Laura Bush there, Presidents Clinton and Bush. Tony is right there in the center. Here's a closer look. You can see him on the right-hand side and there he is on stage with the two presidents.
PERINO: He sent you a lot of pictures.
WILLIAMS: He did. So, Tony, Antonio, so proud of you from dad.
GUILFOYLE: Oh, he's amazing. I love him. Handsome man as well. OK, Dana.
PERINO: OK, so Jesse is going to love this one. There's a Golden Retriever named Storm and he's a hero tonight for his rescue of a baby deer. It actually happened. He was with his owner, Mark Freely (ph) when the rescue happened. Storm jumped into Long Island Sound, rescued the fawn, brought it back and then nudged it trying to make sure that, you know, it was alive.
The deer actually ran back into the water again. It was rescued by the Strong Island Rescue. They got the deer out and now the fawn is recovering from ticks and an eye injury at a local animal shelter. Amazing dog.
GUILFOYLE: I love that one more thing.
WATTERS: Another dog video.
GUILFOYLE: All right. So, yesterday I had the pleasure of being on my friend's show, The Next Revolution, Steve Hilton. He had a little surprise for me, a little Wet Coast Kimberly's food court. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE HILTON, THE NEXT REVOLUTION SHOW HOST: So what is the verdict, Kimberly?
GUILFOYLE: Oh my god, I give it a 10 and so does the Russian judge.
GUILFOYLE: Very juicy, Steve. So, I suggest you wear a little bib of sorts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: It was so delicious. It's called impossible burger and it tastes like meat, it reads (ph) like meat, it looks like meat but it's actually made of like beats and other things. So Dana and I were talking about it. We think we have to do a little taste test here to see if the crew can decide and figure it out. Lots of fun. OK, Jesse.
WATTERS: Well, my sister, younger, Eliza (INAUDIBLE) Watters was just appointed to be a member of the Marshall Selection Committee. She was a Marshall scholar years ago and Marshall scholarships are named after George Marshall, former Secretary of State and only 40 Americans each year are allowed to be a Marshall scholar. They go over to Oxford. They study. They get all these fancy degrees then I get to go visit over there at Oxford.
PERINO: It's amazing. Good job.
WATTERS: Yes, we're very proud of her.
PERINO: You got to like that.
GUILFOYLE: All right, set your DVRs, never miss an episode of "The Five." "Hannity" next.
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