Why Newt Gingrich says caravan is 'an attack on America'

This is a rush transcript from "The Story," October 22, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

MARTHA MACCALLUM, HOST: So, good evening everybody. I'm Martha MacCallum. And as we just said, it's 14 days now until the midterm elections. Tonight, two live pictures tell the story.

First, you've got the growing caravan of thousands of people headed towards the U.S. border. Who are they? Who is supporting them? And will the president put the military on our border to turn them back?

Then, over to Houston at this moment, thousands of people lined up all day long to be part of the Trump-Cruz rally, which is now moments away as these former foes who traded the nastiest of barbs, now join forces in an attempt to hold the GOP Senate seat in Texas.


PRESIDEN T DONALD TRUMP: Lying Ted, lying Ted.  What's your name? My name is lying Ted Cruz.

SEN. TED CRUZ, R-TEXAS: I am not in the habit of supporting people who attack my wife.

TRUMP: To me he's not lying Ted anymore, he's beautiful Ted. He is Texas -- I call him Texas Ted.

MACCALLUM: So here now is the live look. We will take you there since that kept under way. The president is expected to call for the coming border showdown. He's expected to call it rather a national emergency.

He will likely go after Beto O'Rourke, we expect Cruz's opponent. And also Democrats who the president blames for the situation at the border. Saying that the failure to vote and pass immigration reform is long overdue.

About the caravan, the president saying this.

TRUMP: Guatemala, Honduras, El Salvador, they paid a lot of money. Every year, we give them foreign aid, and they did nothing for us, nothing.


MACCALLUM: So, in just a moment, we will be speaking with Univision anchor Jorge Ramos for his perspective on the ground in Mexico. And we will talk with Newt Gingrich who sees the caravan as, "an attack on America." We begin with Fox News correspondent William La Jeunesse, who is live alongside the caravan. Good evening, William.

WILLIAM LA JEUNESSE, FOX NEWS NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Good evening, Martha. You can see that people now are just jamming into here, but I want to take you right over here. Anything with wheels on it people are trying to get on. OK?

There got another two hours left in their trek to the next town they're trying to go to. And people are exhausted. They're hot, it's been a really long day. A lot of people only have flip-flops, they've been nursing blisters on their feet.

I'm going to tell you guys, anything that stops, right? A lot of local Mexicans are helping these people out with food, with water, obviously clothing and transportation. So, if truck stops, this is exactly what you see.

So, you know, people talk about, Oh, it's an organized caravan and that -- I haven't seen that. I have people who don't even have enough money to put socks on their feet. They're dealing with blisters and so forth.

But as you said, the caravan itself is growing, OK? Which started out as maybe two or 3,000 crossing the Honduran border. Now, we're up to over 7,000. That's according to the people who are part of this caravan, as well as the Mexican government.

Now in terms of what's happening with Mexico, the government itself is not been able to stop. They were simply overwhelmed by the number. And they're letting them go through.

In fact, they told the presidents of Guatemala and Honduras that they were going to offer them safe passage. So, you've got this caravan going on for literally miles in both directions. They stopped traffic on a major highway.

Now, in terms of what's happening next, right? So, there's a town north of us about 80 miles. They're doing about 20-25 miles a day it's called, Arriaga. They may be able, some may catch a train there or maybe a bus.  The risks, the dilemma for them is that they fear is they get on those buses, Mexican agents will come on and deport them. Basically divided into port.

So, they kind of strengthen numbers, so they stay together. On the other hand, the heat was so intense today. Crying babies, baby strollers.  People just trying to find any kind of shade they can. It's really humid, it's really hot. People were dropping, literally, all over the place.  They couldn't make it.

And many of these people are not going to be able to make it. Definitely not another 1,400 miles, and potentially 60 to 90 days. It's not just going to happen.

So, I think for the message, and you know what I'm hearing Martha, and all I'll wrap it up for you. But you know, these people, frankly, everyone I've talked to, they've just want a better life. You know, it isn't -- it isn't about the sovereignty of U.S. borders and Mexican borders. They could care less. What they're trying to say, is they have no job, they have no hope, they have no wages, people working in the Highlands, growing coffee, there's no money in that anymore.

So, if America doesn't want illegal immigration, it's got to get its own house and order because the people are coming. And in fact, we have been reports that back down at the river, about 50 miles behind me, more people are on the banks of that river to cross into Mexico. OK? Back to you.

MACCALLUM: Very interesting. William, thank you very much. So, for more perspective on the ground in Mexico, I'm joined by Jorge Ramos, Univision news anchor and the author of Real America on Facebook Watch. Jorge, thank you very much for being here today.

You know, I want to -- of report today from the Washington Post --

JORGE RAMOS, NEWS ANCHOR, UNIVISION: Great to be here and --

MACCALLUM: So they -- glad to have you with us. That many of the people that they talked to -- that the Washington Post talk to. They told the reporters that they had already been deported several times from the United States. And that they were going to try to make it back in again, many of them, to try to meet up with family members.

They said that they would try to run in between the border guards, at places that they know, are poorest along the United States border. And one of them was quoted as saying that's how it is, they catch you and you try to get back. What kind of system is that?

RAMOS: Well, maybe they're only talking to people who speak English. Yes, of course, I've talked to some of them who have been deported, but the majority -- (INAUDIBLE)

None of them have been in the United States before. So, some of them, yes, have been deported but the majority not, Martha. And something really important is that the vast majority of these people are not criminals, they're not terrorists, and they're not even immigrants, they're refugees.

And as a nation in the United States, we have to choose what kind of nation we are and treat them with respect. We cannot prejudge them. We cannot say all of them are criminals, all of them are rapists. That is not true.

So, what we have to do is to listen to them. Hear their cases, and if they do sort of political asylum, then, grant it to them.

MACCALLUM: You know, I mean -- there, according to one estimate by the Gallup World Poll 57 million people in Latin America and the Caribbean would like to come to the United States.

But you simply -- I mean, do you -- do you recommend that they should all be allowed in? I mean, at what point is there -- you know, a lot -- I mean, how is this going to work? Leave the border open? Everyone, just out of the goodness of everyone's hearts, welcome in 57 million people eventually?


MACCALLUM: So, what would you recommend?

RAMOS: No. I am not for open borders. I understand what you're saying, Martha. But I am not for open borders. I think that the immigration system that we have right now is simply not working, is not working for everyone.

Trump's immigration policy is a complete failure, it hasn't worked.  Enforcement only, it doesn't work. And what we need is a legal immigration system that really works. Now, despite the optics, I know that if you are in the United States, and you are watching this --


RAMOS: You might think, oh, we're going to be invaded. That is not true.  There is no invasion here. We're talking about 7,000 right now, maybe a few thousand more trying to cross the border between Mexico and Guatemala.


MACCALLUM: Yes, but Jorge --

RAMOS: Some of them are going to make it to Texas. Some of them are going to make it to California.


MACCALLUM: I understood. But this is -- you can't just walk --

RAMOS: But at the end, this is -- this is the truth. There's only 11 million people in the United States who are undocumented.


RAMOS: And that has remained stable for the last decade. Martha.

MACCALLUM: Yes. Well, but the problem is that it's -- you know, it's a law-breaking environment. You're not allowed to just cross the border.  You're not allowed to go up and find to the openings at the border where there's no Border Patrol agents and sneak your way through, and you know, put your foot on the property, and then become the responsibility of the U.S. government. It simply doesn't work.

And what's being asked is for Latin America and Mexico to take their share of the burden and to manage this problem. And perhaps, to find a way to improve their own economy so that everybody doesn't want to flood out.

RAMOS: I agree with you. And I think, Mexico has done his part.  President Pena Nieto, unfortunately, for many immigrants, Mexicans and Central Americans. The Mexican police has become -- and the Trump's immigration police. That's the truth, and many people see this, we don't agree with that. What President Trump is (INAUDIBLE)


MACCALLUM: What do you mean by that? We watch the fence -- no, hold on -- hold on. We watch the fence between Guatemala and Mexico, he overrun. And it doesn't appear that there was any attempt by the Mexican police to really handle this situation.

RAMOS: No. No, no, what I'm telling is that Mexican police -- Mexican police try to prevent --


MACCALLUM: Well, it doesn't seem like they're up for the top now.

RAMOS: -- some immigrants to pass by. And you know, immigration is through it. And instead of going through a bridge, they use the river, and here they are. So, it didn't work and President Pena Nieto try to become Trump's police and just simply didn't work.

What President Trump is trying to do right now --


MACCALLUM: Why doesn't he be Mexican police? Why not Mexico's police?  This is your problem -- I'm sorry.

RAMOS: Threatened foreign aid, to cut foreign aid to Honduras and Southern Guatemala. Is the worst he can do because -- let me just finish this and I let you talk.

MACCALLUM: OK. We have a delay, I'm sorry.

RAMOS: Simply because -- simply because if you put more pressure on Central America, more people like this are going to try to come to the United States.

MACCALLUM: Yes. Well, you know, obviously there's a -- there's a big problem with the economy and with the Mexican ability. It's not Trump's police, and I mean, Mexico has its own Police Department. They have a responsibility to deal -- they -- you guys in Mexico they deport tens of thousands of people every year back across that border.

But let me ask you this, in terms of the people that are coming now, the caravan which just keeps growing and growing, why now -- why now? Why did this all come to pass and this group growing in numbers by the day? Why now?

RAMOS: Well, I think it has to do -- it started with social media as if it would happen in any other part of the world. And it's so interesting because I didn't see any conspiracy here or any collusion or Democrats or Republicans participating in this. Absolutely not.

What happened is that once people in Central America, especially, in Honduras, once they learn that one caravan was going north, they decided to join for two reasons. For safety. They are not risking being raped or being vandalized on their way from Central America to the United States.  And then, it has to do with money, Martha, simply money.

If you live in Honduras or Guatemala, and you want to go to the United States, you got to pay up for a coyote or a smuggler, maybe $6,000, maybe up to $7,000. But if you are part of this caravan, you won't pay anything.  So, I think it has to do with safety, and it has to do with money. And that's what we have right now about 7,000 people in Mexico already. And a few thousand more waiting at the Guatemala border.

MACCALLUM: Yes, very interesting. Jorge, thank you. Thank you very much in Mexico with us tonight. Joining me now, Newt Gingrich, former House speaker, and a Fox News contributor. You wrote this piece that calling this an attack on America. Newt, your thoughts on what we just heard from William La Jeunesse, the reporter and Jorge Ramos on the ground as well.

NEWT GINGRICH, FORMER SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES: Well, I look, I think it's pretty clear. If you use Jorge Ramos' numbers, there are, at least, nine or 10,000 potential people if you count the ones on the Guatemala border or the one who come north.

The easy question asked is this, let say we open the border, we welcome all of them. That picture goes out across the whole planet. How big do you think the next convoy is, and the -- and then a caravan after that? And the caravan after that?

And you get to the question, you either going to control the border, or you're not going to control the border. And as an American, I'm -- we have -- we have the most generous legal immigration system in the world. We have over a million people a year legally becoming American or be getting American right to be in America. Most of them go on to become American citizens.

So, it's just a -- it's just a dishonest lie to suggest that we don't have a serious immigration program that's legal. Now, the problem we have is we have a lot of folks who want to break the law. And if you ever had open borders as you pointed out, the Gallup World Poll -- I think the number for all of Latin America and the Caribbean was 179 million people would like to come to the U.S. It's just unsustainable.

So, the question becomes what are you going to do about it? And the president who has inherited a disastrous immigration system between court orders, bad congressional laws, federal regulation, it's a total disaster.

He's trying to get this right. I think it's important to stop this caravan in part to send a signal to the rest of Latin America, "No, you're not going to be allowed to come in. And in part, because in the process of stopping it, we're going to learn a lot about the laws that need to be changed.

And frankly, Congress may be in the lame-duck session. Ought to be challenged, it's not comprehensive reform, but let's take the 10 dumbest things. Let's just fix one step at a time and begin to make it possible to manage our border.

MACCALLUM: Yes. I just want to play this clip from "The View" today. An animated conversation about this, and get your thoughts. Let's put it up.


WHOOPI GOLDBERG, CO-HOST, "THE VIEW," ABC: Is this straight up fear- mongering? I mean, when did -- when did he start putting the Middle Easterners in? I thought he was just --


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are they walking? Are they walking here?

GOLDBERG: Well, I don't know.

BARBARA WALTERS, CO-HOST, "THE VIEW," ABC: You know what, he makes up everything. He'll tell you as Usama bin Laden is marching.


MACCALLUM: Are they referring to the fact that the president suggested that there might be some criminals. And he said that people from unknown Middle Easterners are mixing in. Your reaction to that, Newt.

GINGRICH: Well, first of all, the Secretary of Homeland Security said yesterday that we have to recognize there are probably people from the cartels among the seven to 10,000 that there are probably other people who are involved in human trafficking.

Remember, a lot of those pictures you saw of a man and a young girl. He wasn't her father. He was the guy bringing her into cellar into human trafficking. So, let's be clear, the most of these people are just folks who'd love to get to the Promised Land, they'd love to have Christmas, they'd love to have Christmas. They'd love to have a chance to live like we live. But there is a substantial set of people who are lawbreakers, who are dangerous, who were MS-13 members. And if you were a terrorist and wanted to get in the U.S. and you saw 10,000 people trying to get in the U.S., how unlikely is that you might decide to join them?

MACCALLUM: Pretty good way to get in. Yes, there's a huge upsurge. They used to have a lot of single young men crossing the border and now more than ever they are arriving with a child in tow and the Department of Homeland Security should say has a really hard time identifying that child and whether or not they're supposed to be with that adult which is a potentially very scary situation for these young people. Newt Gingrich, thank you. Always good to see you, sir. Good to have you here.

GINGRICH: Thank you.

MACCALLUM: You bet. So tonight former rivals now allies as President Trump travels to the Lone Star State in hopes of helping Ted Cruz keep his Senate seat. We're going to go there live. But first, is the media trying to tell a particular narrative about the death of Jamal Khashoggi? Judith Miller and Howie Kurtz here to set the record straight.


MACCALLUM: So any moment we expect President Trump to take the stage at this big rally in Texas tonight for his once rival and now friend Sen. Ted Cruz. We're going to take you there live as it gets underway because we do expect that news will be made with regard to a number of stories, the caravan and also the growing mystery surrounding Jamal Khashoggi and what happened to him in the consulate in Turkey. A lot of questions as we continue to go through this story. And some corners, the Saudi columnist has been described as a champion of freedom, others questioned some of his ties.

Sebastian Gorka, a former adviser to President Trump wrote a piece on this over the weekend and he said this. People die every day. It's our lot.  Some deaths attract more attention than others, some for good reason, sometimes for nefarious and dishonest ones. So what about Jamal Khashoggi?  Yes, it is now clear that Saudi -- that the Saudi Arabian man was murdered, but what are the facts of his death and do they matter to you or to America? First things first. It is important to understand that Khashoggi was neither an American nor was he strictly speaking a journalist.

Joining me now is Judith Miller, Fox News contributor and former New York Times reporter and Howard Kurtz, host of "MediaBuzz." Good to have both of you with us today. He's making a point here, Judith, and I know that you find it very distasteful what he said.


MACCALLUM: However, in terms of looking at this as the news story and the amount of attention that it gets is there you know, is there parity in terms of other things that happen in the world? Is this the kind of thing that happens in the Middle East in -- at a greater pace than it happens in other places? Why has this garnered so much media attention and what do you think of what he wrote?

MILLER: Well, I think that this story is obviously an important story. It is --- his murder is a gruesome, barbaric affair carried out perhaps yet to be determined, but most people who follow the Middle East think that it was ordered by a prince, by the man who's going to be the next leader of Saudi Arabia. Therefore, a rupture in relations between the United States and Saudi Arabia is a story that goes far beyond the murder of one man. And surely Mr. Gorka who supposedly is a counterterrorism expert should understand that.

MACCALLUM: You know, it's interesting Bret Baier over the weekend interviewed the foreign minister. He said basically that you know, they still think it was a plot that was gone awry. They're still trying to figure it out, still trying to investigate. The President was interviewed about this on the plane on the way to Houston. He echoed that phrase that it was a plot that gone awry. The President didn't seem to know about the bone saw according to these reports and he said that the Prince and the King were not involved.

Howie, let me turn to you now in terms of the coverage of this story because some of it has been geared towards pointing a finger at President Trump and using this in some regard against him, against his policies your thoughts on that.

HOWARD KURTZ, FOX NEWS CHANNEL HOST: Well, Martha, I'm the first to admit the journalists care more about the fate of one of their own, a Washington Post contributor, than some of the random dissidents who were sometimes disappeared by the Saudi regime, that they have make Khashoggi assemble, and at the same time you know, it is getting an awful lot of coverage. But for having said that, this is a genuine international crisis for several reasons.

There were blatant and repeated Saudi lying about the situation, the gruesome nature of the crime itself, and the fact that it could disrupt U.S.-Saudi relations. And these efforts by a few people on the right Sebastian Gorka included to minimize the magnitude of this murder by either smearing Khashoggi or questioning his support of the Muslim Brotherhood are nothing less than an attempt at political deflection. Nobody deserves this fate, not a 60-year-old writer living in Virginia.

MACCALLUM: Yes, I want to show the video of you know, when we talk about the gruesome nature of this of someone who appears to be one of the 15 according to these reports who carried out this murder leaving in Khashoggi 's clothing. Watch this.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: At first glance, this man could almost pass for Jamal Khashoggi, and that's the idea. Take a look, same clothes, same glasses and beard, similar age and physique, everything except the shoes. But a senior Turkish official tells CNN that the man on the left is a body double, one of 15 Saudi operatives sent to kill Khashoggi and then cover it up.


MILLER: You know, the other reason that this story has such power is the way in which we're learning the details of this gruesome murder. A double, a body double sent in along with an autopsy forensics expert who may have been overseeing the dismemberment of this writer. This is gruesome stuff and we're getting it day by day by day. When you're in a hole Saudi Arabia stop digging, that's what they're doing by continuing to lie and cover up what actually happened inside the consulate in Istanbul.

MACCALLUM: I mean, the problem is you know, you think about what happened in with Russian spies being killed in London, you think back to you know, some of the other stories with ricin, you know, these are the kinds -- this is the behavior that you expect from certain governments around the world.  Saudi Arabia is trying to prove that it's not like that anymore, that it's reforming, that women are driving, that women are going to the movie theater.

We get endless video of all of these things happening and yet, Howie, this is a big black mark against that idea. And that seems to me to be the most important point here that you know journalists on all sides of this equation need to recognize that there failing the test for membership.

KURTZ: Right. There's been a tremendous effort by the Saudi regime through some in the media in the U.S. to paint the Crown Prince MBS as a reformer and yet it's not clear whether he knew about or authorized or acquiesced in this horrible murder. And sure, the way in which it's unfolded, when a Russian spy or somebody else is killed, often it's a two or three days story and the person is brought to justice. Remember, the Saudis spent more than a week saying, oh he walked out of there. He walked out of that consulate and now have to admit that that's a lie. That has given the story legs and also the Trump administration's response to these lies. The President now using the words lies and deception to describe the case. That has provided the narrative fuel as well.

MACCALLUM: Just one last quick thought, Judith, when you know, you look at Benghazi, you look at some of the stories that many reporters have not been as interested perhaps in as they should have. Is that a fair criticism that they you know, might be milking this story to some extent because it works for a narrative against President Trump?

MILLER: I think some journalists are biased, some journalists would believe that this story will play to President Trump's detriment but I don't think that's what's driving this story. I don't think anyone who's followed the story thinks that's its power. What's at stake here is the future leadership of Saudi Arabia and America's relationship with it and the kind of country not only they are but the kind of country and people we want to be.

MACCALLUM: Yes, Jared Kushner out there today, saying that he is pushing for transparency and encouraging the Prince to be completely transparent and that this is a very serious issue. We'll see where it goes next.  Thank you both. Good to see tonight.

MILLER: Thank you.

MACCALLUM: So we are now moments away from President Trump taking the stage in Texas with Senator Ted Cruz. We're going to take you there as soon as that gets underway, looking for some news that will be made there on that stage tonight. Also, lawmakers harassed and heckled in public over politics. The latest target --




MACCALLUM: Jessica -- Charlie Hurt and Jessica Tarlov coming up next on that.


MACCALLUM: We are back. Any minute now President Trump is set to take the stage in Texas for a rally in support of Senator Ted Cruz. We will go there as soon as he comes out.

But first, we begin with the story that Senator Cruz knows all too well. One, less than one month ago he went to a dinner with his wife in D.C., and this is what they had for an appetizer. Hecklers chase them out, chased out by protesters. They did eventually come back in but we understand that now it's happening again, this time in Kentucky where the target of public harassment was one of the top Republicans in Washington Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell.

Trace Gallagher has the story from our west coast newsroom. Hi, Trace.

TRACE GALLAGHER, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: It appears Mitch McConnell is kind of getting used to this behavior because during the entire time that he was being yelled at by a small group of protesters while he dined with his wife, McConnell stayed calm and kept sipping his drink.

His wife on the other hand, Transportation Secretary Elaine Chao decided to stand her ground. Watch some of this.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why don't you get out of here. Why don't you--


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Leave her alone.


GALLAGHER: You see the senator kind of sipping his drink, Elaine Chao kind of yelling back at them. You can see the other diners by the way also stepped up to let the protesters know they were out of line.

The woman who took this video obtained by TMZ says she didn't start taping until after a protester slammed his fist on McConnell's table and threw food out the door. This, by the way, is a fourth time in four months McConnell has been publicly harassed.

And he certainly not alone as you mentioned, Texas Senator Ted Cruz and his wife were harassed last month in a D.C. restaurant during the height of the Brett Kavanaugh confirmation process.

And back in June, Homeland Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen was harassed and shouted down at a D.C. Mexican restaurant. Most of these incidents target Republicans, but Democrat certainly are not immune. During a campaign stop last week for Florida, Democratic House candidate Donna Shalala, House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi was bombarded with a flurry of expletives. Watch.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You don't belong here (muted) Get (muted) out of here!


GALLAGHER: And the beeps go on. The protesters reportedly included the proud boys, a right-wing group accused of being in several violent scuffles. And we should note GOP Congressman Steve Scalise who was shot and nearly killed last year by a liberal activist condemned that behavior saying, if you want to stop Pelosi's policies, don't threaten her, vote. That's how we settle our differences. Martha?

MACCALLUM: Yes. I mean, that is why this is so scary because it can escalate so easily.


MACCALLUM: Trace, thank you very much. Here now with more, Charles Hurt, opinion editor at the Washington Times, Jessica Tarlov, a senior director of research at Bustle.com and both are Fox News contributor's.

Havana Rumba, you know, you do a (Inaudible) a Margarita with his wife and they are throwing food out the wind -- out the front door there. I mean, you know, true to character, true to form, right, Mitch McConnell is like, I'm just going to sit here and sipped my drink.

CHARLES HURT, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Yes, But the strangest part of that is throwing the food out the door. I don't--


MACCALLUM: You were -- was it there food that's thrown out there.

HURT: It's completely unclear. But you know, I mean, I think it's great for -- you know, democracy is a noisy affair, and I have no problem with that. But honestly if you're going out to a dinner, going out to a restaurant, and you could spend like the evening with your family and enjoying a good meal, and instead your idea of a good time is to get up and start screaming at somebody about politics.

There's something wrong in your life, something is terribly out of whack. I mean, it's like you wouldn't show up at church wearing a bathing suit and a cocktail.

MACCALLUM: This is true.

HURT: It would be very awkward for everybody, you know. And people would think that, and people would reveal -- would realize something is probably out of whack. And you ought to get help. I think these two which needed help.

MACCALLUM: Perhaps they do. I want to play I like Elaine Chao because she really stands up for her man. And you saw what she did there. And this is from June. Remember this one. Watch this woman.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why are you separating families?



CHAO: Back off. You leave him alone. Leave my husband alone!


MACCALLUM: In that tape she gets it right in that in their face, leave them alone! Meanwhile, he's in the car saying, come on, Elaine, we're running late. Let's get out of here.


JESSICA TARLOV, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: I also did really like that clip. I think there are two issues at play here.


TARLOV: So, one, first of all, if you are a public servant and the public is paying your salary, and you are out there, whether people have the right to come up to you and talk to you in a respectful manner about policy. (Inaudible) as Senator Sherrod Brown, for instance, just came out over the weekend and said, we believe that when we are in public because we are public servants that we should talk to people, if they have something to say.

And you know, you need to be respectful obviously, you should address that. The throwing of food and the real disruption approach or the ejection from restaurants, that doesn't really work for me.


MACCALLUM: Like saying to Nancy Pelosi--

TARLOV: Terrible.

MACCALLUM: -- you are a blanking commie.


MACCALLUM: And by the way, that room that she open the door to where she went in, that wasn't where she was going, it was like a closet.


TARLOV: She had to get out of the way.

MACCALLUM: And they had a way until soon they left.

TARLOV: It's horrible and I do appreciate Trace doing my Democrat vetting for me and pointing that out before anchors, I got to get to Nancy Pelosi thing in here. So, it's not just--


MACCALLUM: Yes, it's horrible on both sides.

TARLOV: It is horrible on both sides.

MACCALLUM: It's a lack of civility. Hillary Clinton has been calling for more that though actually.

TARLOV: I wouldn't say that she wants what's happening to Mitch McConnell or to Nancy Pelosi, I don't think that's the point she was making and certainly not the point that Eric Holder was making about how what kind of politics we need to put forward in the final days before the midterms. I don't think that anyone wants that to happen and I appreciate lawmakers on both sides saying this is simply unacceptable.


MACCALLUM: I haven't heard honestly, though, when you think about it, you know, you have her from Republicans that they, you know, that this is uncivil.

HURT: Yes.

MACCALLUM: Because this, clearly is sort of the unfortunate for both person for what can happen and what it can lead to.

HURT: Yes. And all of it reveals something that I think is very troubling, and that is that politics has become like 90 percent of people's lives it seems like.


HURT: They have become absorbed with it--


HURT: -- obsessed -- on both sides obsessed with it. And it's really not supposed to be like that. We are supposed to have our families and our jobs, everything we do. Politics is not supposed to dominate our lives. That's not -- that's not what this experiment is all about.

TARLOV: No, but that trend has been going on for decades and it's been building. That's why we have become more tribal. Obviously, people are not associating with those on the other side because we feel that our values are so disjointed from those that we politically aligned with. The 24-hour news cycle that you have it coming at you all the time, what socially affects social media has on you.

MACCALLUM: We will take a break so we can get back to the 24/7 news cycle.


TARLOV: Yes, we'll be right.

MACCALLUM: And politics that people can argue about. Stand by, you guys for a moment.

So we're away now for President Trump's rally in Texas. Because we are not going to talk about your top 10 favorite movies, Charlie, or which is on Sunday. We are going to go back to the rally. The president will be there to endorse his new friend Senator Ted Cruz. They have a very good relationship now, when we come back.


TRUMP: To me he's not lying Ted anymore, he's beautiful Ted.


TRUMP: He is Texas, I call him Texas Ted.



MACCALLUM: So, a Fox News alert as we wait for this rally getting underway, that is Brad Parscale, he is the 2020 campaign manager for President Trump's campaign, he was sort of the guy behind all the data and al the metrics in the last campaign and he is leading the way this time around.

So, they are all there to support Senator Ted Cruz tonight who is in sort of an unexpectedly tighter race than he thought he would be in, although he's up by about seven points right now in the Real Clear Politics average.

But as you remember, President Trump when he was candidate Trump, and candidate Cruz, kind of went at it. Watch this.


CRUZ: I don't get angry, but if you mess with my wife, you mess with my kids, that will do it every time. Donald, you are a sniveling coward and leave Heidi the hell alone.

TRUMP: In the case of lying Ted Cruz, lying Ted lies, he lies. You know, Ted he brings the bible, holds them high and puts it down, lies.


MACCALLUM: Remember those? Those are some of the greatest hits. OK. But here is the Texas Senate race, 52-45 right now. Ted Cruz, we understand is making his way onto the stage. Are we going there now? Let's watch a little bit of this this.

HURT: One thing in politics when former primary rivals have to then get together--


MACCALLUM: You're a sniveling coward!

HURT: It's a great -- it's a great American political (Inaudible).

TARLOV: I mean, your father was involved in JFK's--


MACCALLUM: Yes, there was that.

TARLOV: And you're the zodiac killer.

MACCALLUM: But politics to nothing is not pragmatic, right? And at this moment President trump needs Cruz to win.

HURT: Let's hear those.

CRUZ: God bless President Donald Trump.

TARLOV: It must really gunk.


MACCALLUM: All right. So here comes the president. Just a new piece out there the president saying that he would send all of the troops necessary to the U.S.-Mexico border to block the growing caravan of Central American migrants calling their attack an assault on our country. Here is the president in Texas.


MACCALLUM: So, this is all the, you know, applause at the moment before the president starts to speak. I remember at the RNC, one of the most stunning moments was when Ted Cruz was on the stage not endorsing President Trump at the Republican national convention.

In the middle of Ted Cruz's speech, the president and his entire family walked in, in the back and the spotlight was on them as they came down and sat in their seats. So, all of the attention was pulled away from the stage and on to the Trump family. So pretty amazing. Full circle as we see often in politics.


HURT: So, I think they (Inaudible).


MACCALLUM: It looks like it.

TARLOV: At least for the next two weeks.

HURT: Yes. And I think Texas is going to like Trump.


MACCALLUM: OK. Looking it all up in Ted Cruz tonight. The president has really been on a non-stop rally tour across America over the course of the last couple of weeks. In 14 days to go. He's also, you know, simultaneously launching his next presidential election campaign it appears. And the president will take over and then after this Tucker Carlson on the other side.

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