Trump: NFL owners did the right thing

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This is a rush transcript from "The Five," May 24, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hi, I'm Greg Gutfeld with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Marie Harf, Jesse Watters, and she swim laps in a shot glass, Dana Perino -- "The Five."

It's day two in kneel-gate and, as usual, both sides line up on opposite ends of the field. First, there's Donald Trump doing Donald Trump:


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: You have to stand proudly for the national anthem or you shouldn't be playing, you shouldn't be there, maybe you shouldn't be in the county.

You have to stand proudly for the national anthem. And, the NFL owners did the right thing if that's what they're done.

BRIAN KILMEADE, FOX NEWS: If that is the story, did you feel like you pushed this story forward and you pushed this to a conclusion?

TRUMP: I think the people pushed it forward. This was not me. I brought it out. I think the people push it forward.


GUTFELD: Yes, another excellent, hard-hitting interview from Mr. Kilmeade. Give that guy a raise or at least something to stand on.


GUTFELD: The fact is you expect that from Trump. He finds an issue and he takes the hard-line stance. Whining about it would be pointless. He's your uncle -- Uncle Sam. But that didn't stop the pearl clutchers from clutching their pearls.


JOY BEHAR, THE VIEW: The racism is disgraceful.

If you're a football player, or whatever they are, any sports guy who have the position to do it, do it.

PRINCETON PROFESSOR EDDIE GLAUDE JR.: It's ridiculous, it's absurd. He sounds a lot like Erdogan right there, doesn't he? He doesn't sound like the leader of the free world.

MIKE LUPICA, NY DAILY NEWS: And remember how this all started. Speaking to a crowd that looked like an SCC white football crowd in 1955, calling them SOBs and saying they should be fired. In what world other than his is that OK?


GUTFELD: America.

See, they miss the point: The First Amendment is a right held by every citizen against the government. But, a private entity like the NFL, they own it, they make the rules. As long as there's no discrimination the NFL can mandate that teams play in high heels and referees wear tutus. It's their ball they can take it and go home. And the players can protest, but they will be penalized if it's done during a game --penalized not jailed. Only the government can jail you. You see the difference? Players are employees at work disobeying a rule.

So, where are you in all of this? Where you've always been, scratching your head. You prefer unity over conflict. You don't mind dissent. It's the dissension where there not need be. Mind you, you still love a good debate. It's why you watch "The Five." But a political act within a sporting event is like turning on this very show and finding me and Dana playing badminton for an hour. It's not what you came here for. It's not why you watch. And let be honest, seeing me in tight white shorts is not appropriate for 5 p.m.


GUTFELD: Or ever, that is so true, Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: It's really lots of shade of Kilmeade about the box and this and that. Glass houses.


GUTFELD: I'm not scared of Kilmeade. I'm asleep when he's up. All right, Jesse, welcome back. You had strep throat. We missed you.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Yes, Trump was right. I was sick of winning.


GUTFELD: What happened?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Tired of winning.

WATTERS: Tired of winning.

GUTFELD: It was a purely natural vacation.

WATTERS: Thank you for bringing that up.

GUTFELD: OK. I read Reason Magazine, I usually respect -- I like what they say, but they say that NFL was bowing to Trump. My theory is, they wanted to nip this practice in the bud because you can start -- you can kneel for everything. You can kneel about abortion or gun rights. If this keeps going, it never stops.

WATTERS: Yeah, I don't read Reason. I read the Weekly Standard, because that's what you gave me a subscription for. No one is trampling anyone's constitutional rights. We're all employees like we are here at Fox News. There's rules.


WATTERS: . so you can't run wild. Mostly, rules so you can't run wild. There's H.R. rules, P.R. rules. It's just the fact that like Harf couldn't get here when she did her one more thing and take a knee every time. After a while, people would change the channel and then the ratings would dip, and the company CEO would say can you stop doing that. And if you said no, you're fired. That's how it works. You wear their jersey, you're in their stadium, you're playing for their team, they can tell what to do or what not to do. I think it's a great idea. And, Trump, he's not saying anything -- he's not going to deport line backers and free safeties. He's saying love it or leave it, you know. He likes this country so much. It's hyperbola. He can't see how anybody wouldn't like this country at all.

But the kneeling thing really hurt because it was misconstrued. They did it at the wrong time. Speak your mind on ESPN, on Fox News, on twitter. On Sunday, play football. It hurt Jemele Hill, she lost her show. It hurt the commissioner. He got hit hard because of his erratic response. It hurt the ratings, networks didn't like it. It hurt the players. Now, some of the players that kneeled are free agents and they're having a hard time getting re-signed. So, it even hurt the Democrats because they sided against 75 percent of the country. So, I think this is a good thing and I'm glad they've resolved it.

GUTFELD: All right, Dana, you know, another argument for not defending the NFL ban is like -- this is like shutting down speakers on campus. And you're kind of like a snow flake if you don't want them to kneel.

PERINO: I saw some of that today. And, I don't feel like the government should be telling any private organization what they can or should not do. I mean, unless it's like, you know, harming people or illegal. So, I'm for private companies being able to do what they want to do. Colleges are meant to be places for free expression.


PERINO: Most of them get taxpayer dollars. And, I guess, you can maybe say, well, the NFL shouldn't get any money, taxpayer dollars towards stadium funds. I'm for that too. But, the NFL is to play football. That's not a place where you expect to have a free exchange of ideas like you would on college campus. That doesn't make any sense to me.

GUTFELD: Yeah. It's a free exchange of helmets to the head. Marie, you can't say this is discriminating if it applies to everyone, correct?

MARIE HARF, CO-HOST: Well, I think what the NFL didn't do correctly here, in my opinion, is it doesn't seem like they communicated adequately with the player association before they released this. And so, now, there's this fight in the public between the player's association who said they weren't consulted and their looking at it, individual players and the NFL. I know they want this get out of the way before the next season, I get that.


HARF: But it sort of reseeded from the headlines. And so, if they had really coordinated this and come out with a more comprehensive plan, here's our plan, we're going to fine players if they kneel. But we're also going to undertake this five community activism steps that players have asked for. It seems like that would have been a better way to move forward. And the president's comments, once again, sort of throw more, you know, gasoline on the fire of what is a very controversial issue. So, I think the NFL could have probably handled this a little better. Now, you have people like the owner of the Jets who comes out and said he will pay the fine if his players get them. He won't pass it along because he wants his players to be able to express themselves.

GUTFELD: That's a interesting point, K.G., because then he's putting the onus, if that's a real word.

PERINO: It is.


GUTFELD: It puts the onus on the other owners. It's the owner's onus. It took the onus of the owners. So now, the other owners are going to go -- well, the Jets are doing it, should we do it? So, I don't know. Will the struggle continue?

GUILFOYLE: Yes, applying pressure, probably a simpler term to use, since you're struggling deeply with that.


GUILFOYLE: All right. So now, he's saying, OK, he going to go ahead and do that, what about the rest of you? You know, show up, pay up, et cetera. But, listen, I'm with President Trump on this because they're paid millions of dollars for the privilege of playing in one of the world's greatest sports, one that I love to watch as well. But, really, there is a time for social justice and activism. I love it. Express yourself, that's what people fought for in this country, so that all of us can sit here and have crazy, insane opinions at the table.

WATTERS: Why are you looking at me?


GUILFOYLE: It was a side glance. One eye at you, one eye at Greg.


GUTFELD: It's amazing how she can do that.

GUILFOYLE: It's really unbelievable. I practice it a lot. And that's what we're here for, right? Is to be able to express opinion. But they're paid a job. We're paid to do a job here. And we work for this company. They work for different teams in the NFL. If they have a problem with that, you know, don't play then. And that's what he's trying to say. I like the use of hyperbole though. That was excellent, Jesse.

WATTERS: Thank you. Better than onus?

GUILFOYLE: If you don't like the country, then, you know.

WATTERS: You go play for the CFL in Canada.



GUTFELD: And kneel before the Canadian flag. Yeah. How will that work. Do you think Canadians are going to go for that? I don't think so.

GUILFOYLE: Go play for the French, Jesse. No uniforms.


GUTFELD: Dana, the underlying truth to all of this is that everybody -- I have an inkling that everybody wants this behind them, even Colin Kaepernick. Everybody is like, OK, this wasn't supposed to go this long.

PERINO: Right. I think that that's true. And then, when you have people all say we all want the same thing. We're all for America, et cetera, yeah, absolutely people want this -- and I think that's what the NFL was trying to do. I think that they've handled it pretty well. I think they're going to have to do it at some point. Might as well do it now, get it over with. They had the owners meeting, move on. And I think the other thing is -- now that they've laid out this policy, if it continues to happen, which I can't see how it would, I mean, if they're going to nail them there's going to be a problem unless you're the Jets, but they've laid out the policy. So now, if you do it and you get fired you're actually firing yourself. And you're making a choice.

GUTFELD: Yeah. Again, it's another one of these issue, Jesse, that is like -- were you hear when we're talking about Laurel and Yanny?


GUTFELD: It's Laurel and Yanny.

PERINO: And he's a Yanny.

GUTFELD: Were you a Yanny?

WATTERS: Yes, but it's not 50/50. It's like 80/20 in this country. And I don't have a problem with people wanting to talk about race and police brutality, that's a noble cause, which is don't do it during the time where people are supposed to be unified under one flag. And, it's fine to be all about activism. But, it's all about symbols with these people. They wear the hat. They walk out of class over guns. You know, they do the black power thing. That's fine. But then when you say, what do you want to do about it? What's the solution? They go, oh, well, we have to do something. And they don't ever really offer any solutions. So, I think that's what people have a problem with. What do the players want? What specifically are they addressing? What are the solutions to police brutality and racism? No one knew what those were. So, that's why people were upset because it just looked unpatriotic.

PERINO: Well, also, the NFL really can't afford I don't to have a situation where to go another season.


PERINO: It's not just because the ratings, but there're all sort of different pressures, a lot of different -- people watching different things. But, also, this recent decision by the Supreme Court about sports betting, that's a much bigger issue that the NFL needs to deal with right now, so I think it's right to get this over with.

GUTFELD: Also the brain injuries.

HARF: Yes, that's a bigger issue, I think, long term for the NFL. And there are some players like Malcolm Jenkins, if you're a Philedelphia Eagle, who went to Ohio State.


HARF: Who had, actually, put out plans and ideas for how to work with community activists and law enforcements. He's been doing these meetings on his own with some other players. He is taking pro-active steps. More players should do that like he has been doing.

GUTFELD: Yes. Last word, Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: He should focus on, actually, playing football, so they can keep their jobs. Look what happened to Kaepernick, to saying he was horrendous with the 49ers, almost ruin my football dynasty.


GUILFOYLE: Thank God he got rid of him. He can be all he wants now.

GUTFELD: Yeah. I still feel bad about the 49ers.

GUILFOYLE: Right. They were the best team ever. Everybody looked up to the 49ers. We had the best quarterbacks. We have Steve Young, we have Joe Montana, we have Ronnie Lott.


GUTFELD: Yeah. All right, we've got to shut up now. I'm talking about myself. President Trump cancels the North Korea summit. His message to the north, next.


GUILFOYLE: In a major turn of events, President Trump is calling off next month highly anticipated summit with North Korea Kim Jong-un, blaming increasingly hostile rhetoric from the rogue regime. The president explains why he pulled the plug.


TRUMP: I believe that this is a tremendous setback for North Korea, and indeed, a setback for the world. Hopefully, positive things will be taking place with respect to the future of North Korea. But if they don't, we are more ready than we have ever been before. It's possible that the existing summit could take place or summit at some later date. Nobody should be anxious. We have to get it right.


GUILFOYLE: As expected, Democrats are spiking the football over the summit cancellation.


REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF.: I think it's a good thing for Kim Jong-un. We got this letter from the president saying, OK, never mind. He must be having a giggle fit.

SEN. ROBERT MENENDEZ, D-N.J.: The art of diplomacy is a lot harder than the art of the deal.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: The president that was rehearsing his end zone dance and we weren't even at the 50-yard line yet on the summit.


GUILFOYLE: All right. A lot of football metaphors.

HARF: We're kneeling.

GUILFOYLE: However -- and so, President Trump, Jesse, taking a strong stance on this. But, you know, he's right. You can't go into something unless you have it worked out, and it's operating from a position of strength. And he's saying to them, listen, we're better prepared than ever before. Meaning, don't mess with us, a little-bit of flexing there, and saying, hey, we're not going to cater to him.

WATTERS: Trump did what Kerry should have done, and that's the willing to walk away from the table. Now, like you've said, we're negotiating from a position of strength. I believe little rocket man lost face, was put in his place. Trump is big into respect. He bad-mouth our vice president. And then they're playing coy with the prep work for Singapore, so Trump just took a step back and said let's just work this out. Maybe it will happen. Maybe it won't. It's still just gamesmanship. We still may have this summit down the line. Nobody knows that for sure. But they have done a lot of concessions.

You know they've destroyed the missile site. They've stopped ballistic missile testing. They've released hostages. And they cross the DNZ to shake hands with Moon to signal an end to the Korean War. With that said the media is totally out of line when it comes to their criticism here. They're trying to score political points against a Republican president, but they end up trying to make little rocket man look like the winner here. How can when you announce the summit in the beginning, the media say, oh, that's a win for Kim. And then, when you bail out of the summit they say, oh, that's a win for Kim. Which one is it? And they've done this the entire time. Fire and furry helped Kim. We didn't have strong enough sanctions. China was not going to play ball with us. We're alienating our allies. Remember what they said about the sister of Kim?


WATTERS: She was the big diplomat. But, Ivanka, no, no, no, she was just messing things up. So, the whole time they've been on the side of Kim. I don't take anything they say seriously anymore.

GUILFOYLE: I must change my name immediately. All right. So, little rocket man is like the run-away bride. He doesn't want to go through out the summit. He's like creating problems. He's being obstructionist. But, Dana, this is also to be expected because it's kind of part and parcel with how he has behaved in the past.

PERINO: It's how they act. In fact, I was talking to somebody who said it's actually more comforting now to have Kim Jong-un acting normal, because this is how he acts. It is interesting to put -- the onus?


PERINO: On President Trump when it was little rocket man that changed his rhetoric. That's actually what happened. But also, remember the montage Greg had of President Trump every time he talks about North Korea saying, but we'll see what happens. Like, that's actually what he meant that we'll see what happens. And he's not afraid to walk away from it. He left the door open. I am really curious about China's role here, and maybe one day -- I don't need to know right now, but I would love to know one day when everything is solved.

WATTERS: You think it has something to do with the trade negotiations?

PERINO: Certainly.


WATTERS: Interesting.

PERINO: And, also, I think South Korea is way too eager for this, and they need to figure out how to tap the breaks a little-bit and accept President Trump when he says we'll see what happens. That's what he means. And, I understand they might be frustrated that they didn't hear from him before this news came out. But, it's not your typical diplomacy.

GUILFOYLE: Negotiations, for sure. All right, Greg, what can you add to this conversation?

GUTFELD: A lot. First thing I'll add suggest an angle to Rachel Maddow. This was all done as a play to drive up the price of the commemorative coin that were made for the summit. Now that they're not going to be use they're going to be more expensive. So, Trump is trying to turn a profit of a cancelled meeting. Look, it's like the media has never bought a car or a new car.

PERINO: Lemon?

GUTFELD: Because even though I do feel a bit disappointed, I'm not surprised because I understand that in negotiations, the only way negotiations work, it's a race to leave the table first. You've got to be the first one to leave. And I have to say, we didn't mention Trump's letter -- the letter he wrote.

WATTERS: Classic.

GUTFELD: Oh, it was amazing. You know what it was? It was perfect, tough love. Trump's language was the exact same tone as the parents who kicked out the 30-year-old. We want to do what's best for you. It really could have been good. But he really should get a job. And think about how you're going to pay for your apartment. That's what he's saying. This could really work out. It's a shame that it's not happening this. But the fact is Trump -- this is what he does. He would negotiate over a bread roll at the dinner table. And this is what happens. China, we're no longer the welcome mat for China. They're ticked off because we disinvited them from attending one of our naval drills. And so, they're mad about that. The last time they were there they spied on us and they stole technology. So, I think, you know, I think this is all -- I'm cautiously optimistic. That's tad disappointed, but I was prepared.

WATTERS: Because you're invested in coin.



PERINO: . go to a summit and try to force something, and then we're like to have to swallow something that wasn't good.

GUTFELD: Exactly. And William Devane bought a lot of those coins.

GUILFOYLE: No. He's showing a good edge in terms of diplomacy and how he's handling this. And it is far more complex and it does involve China. But the fact President Trump had Pompeo go over there to make sure the back channels are open, communications between North Korea, South Korea, China, and little rocket man wants to be reassured that if he does engages in this denuclearization that we'll honor our bargain and the regime will stay in power. Stay tuned for all of that, right, Marie?

HARF: Yes. And I think it will be interesting to see if the administration goes back to the drawing board, goes back to basics, goes back to the substance, and start thinking through what they actually want to get from this, because I agree that a summit is important, but they need to do a little more of the prep work. Clearly, everyone wasn't on the same page. They have to go back to the South Koreans and make sure they are OK. They were I think surprised by the announcement today. Yesterday, they were saying it's a 99 percent chance of happening. So, I think that the president was right in keeping the door open to diplomacy today. In his letter was a little hint of threat of nuclear war.

GUTFELD: Well, that was a response to their threat.

HARF: But, I think they also have to realize that words matter. You know, they were upset at the vice president. And the White House today has actually even admitted that the vice president's comments were not helpful. So, everyone needs to take a breath, go back to the diplomatic drawing board. Pompeo, I think, will be very helpful in that regard.

GUILFOYLE: And he has been so far (INAUDIBLE).

HARF: Yes.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Well, it's troubled waters for the Democratic blue wave in California, indeed, details ahead.


PERINO: OK. Pull myself together here because Jesse is cracking me up. All right. There's more evidence, Jesse, that a blue wave is crashing for Democrats. A new report says polling in California shows President Trump's rising popularity is bad news for Democrats in key house races there. Trump's approval rating is surging in Orange County where four tight races could determine if the Republicans hold the house. And this maybe an example of why. Why does a business owner confront Nancy Pelosi over her recent crumbs remarks.


UNINDENTIFIED MALE: When the tax and job bills was passed, I gave my employees a thousand dollars bonus, plus 5 percent pay increase that they appreciated very much. Add to that the reduced withholding from their paycheck, and it turn to a noticeable increase in income. This certainly was not crumbs to them.


PERINO: Oh, the crumb comment came back to haunt them. Kimberly, another thing that's happening in your home state of California, is they have they call a jungle primary.


PERINO: So, there's a lot of enthusiasm on the Democratic side. A whole bunch of people wanted to run. So, they've watered down the votes on the Democratic side. And whoever the top two vote getters are on primary day, on June 5th, those two people go to the run off, and it could be that in a couple of these races that the Democrats are totally shut out and don't even have a candidate.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. Well, what's going to be interesting is that I know the Democrats are very worried if the race comes down to certain individuals I may have been associated with in the past, Kevin -- and John Cox, that the two will run against each other. And this is something I find to be very interesting is that -- and I've been predicting this, and I have advised on this to say, watch out. Getting too crazy and too far left because Orange County there has really been surging, and the poll numbers that are coming in there are quite considerable and formidable. So, that's something that the Republicans can count on. John Cox has been endorsed by the president, making positive comments, et cetera, about him. So, this is going to be one of the more interesting, you know, races to watch, because you have Gavin Newsom, we have Villaraigosa, you've got John Cox now trying to surge. So, I think it's going to be more fascinating then we're accustomed to in California.

PERINO: And, Marie, Pelosi's comments about crumbs might have played really well in certain places, pretty progressive places. But, if you're fighting for the majority in places like Orange County, and it comes down to that, it's not helpful. And the sanctuary city policy such like in Orange County, it is not a blue county yet. It's still reddish-orange.

HARF: Right. Literally, Orange County. Well, and Orange County isn't representative of the larger issues in California. I think that her comments probably play well in other parts of the state.

But I think what's interesting is the Democratic Party has really been focused on running candidates that match their districts. And so, while Nancy Pelosi is popular in some districts and raises a lot of money, she's not in others.

So we see people, not just Connor Lamb, but there are a lot of Conner Lambs out there running in this cycle. They're raising a lot of money. And they are not parroting what Nancy Pelosi says. So I think that it will be very interesting. I am by no means spiking the football a couple of months before the midterms. I think that some Democrats are overly optimistic. It's going to be very interesting. And in some of these states, like New Jersey, New York, Illinois, even California where the tax bill hasn't been as helpful because of the state and local taxes.

PERINO: And in, you know, the first year, when there was the gubernatorial races, like in Virginia and New Jersey. But Virginia in particularly. That first year of President Trump, there was a huge amount of Democratic enthusiasm, and the Republican loses in Virginia.

I don't know if that necessarily would happen today, just because the second year things feel a little bit more -- there's a lot of results. People feel a little bit more comfortable. And so maybe this midterm is not going to be what the Democrats thought.

WATTERS: It's looking like that. Good news for America. Bad news for Democrats. If you just look at the statistics that have come out, wages have gone up 3 percent under the Trump administration. It's the biggest surge in wages in 18 years.

Consumer confidence near a 20-year high. People have 2,000 extra dollars in their pockets for a family. Families are flush. They can feel it. And the stock market is doing well, and people's 401(k)s are better.

When you combine that with the fact that we've been safer as a country, you're more prosperous that's hard to run against. So the Democrats, all they have, like Greg said, identity politics. Because they don't have an identity. I mean, what is the Democratic identity? They slogan they stole from Trump in the midterms. It's "drain the swamp." I mean, come on. You guys can do better than that.

PERINO: It's been 18 months since the election, and the Democrats seem to have not, like, settled in on one -- sort of a message, because they're changing things. They're calling things crumbs.


PERINO: It's like they're not quite sure what they want to be.

GUTFELD: First of all, Trump's approval better be soaring in Orange County. It is orange.


GUTFELD: Nancy never live down the "crumbs" moment. That is her Britney Spears shaved head moment. It will be stuck with her forever.

But you know, OK, about this? I get a little depressing here. It's not about Trump. A lot of it is about California, which is a slow rolling disaster due to incompetent governance and destructive policies. It's -- it is resembling the day room from "One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest."

Because -- I had -- I had Dr. Drew on my podcast. He is predicting serious infectious disease explosions in California --

WATTERS: Oh, my God.

GUTFELD: -- because of the homeless -- because of the homeless situation and human waste that is created --


GUTFELD: -- combined with rodents which outnumber humans ten to one.

HARF: What?

GUTFELD: This is happening. If you have seen the homeless encampments in California, that is the consequence of destructive progressive policies. And you combine that with the diseases that are spread by fleas in rodents. The rodents are in this -- I'm telling you.

GUILFOYLE: Are you going to record a commercial? Because it's frightening. And I think people would go out to vote.

GUTFELD: This is actually true. I mean, the last time this happened it rhymed with the plague.

GUILFOYLE: This is a great ad.

GUTFELD: No, I'm telling you. If you have human homeless encampments, the waste is measured in tons. You have rodents that are outnumbering people. And you combine that together. The fleas spread this. California is in for a really scary time. I'm scaring myself.


GUTFELD: Am I really on TV right now?

GUILFOYLE: You're in your head, though, for sure.

PERINO: We will save everyone and move on. Two highly-anticipated meetings on the Russian investigation today, all surrounding the president's Spygate claims. The details next.


WATTERS: Two big briefings in Washington as House and Senate lawmakers from parties meet with intelligence officials on the Russia investigation. This comes amid reports of an FBI informant talking to Trump campaign insiders and the president making accusations of a spy.

In his exclusive interview on "FOX and Friends," Trump continues to take aim at former FBI director James Comey.


TRUMP: I think a thing that I've done for the country, the firing of James Comey, is going to go down as a very good thing. FBI is great. But some of the people at the top were rotten apples. James Comey was one of them.


WATTERS: Rotten James Comey. Meanwhile, James Clapper claims the Russians not only affected the outcome of the election; they decided it.


JAMES CLAPPER, FORMER DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: It's my -- what I would call my informed opinion that, given the massive effort the Russians made and the number of citizens that they touched and, given the fact that it turned on less than 80,000 votes in three states, to me it just exceeds logic and credulity that they didn't affect the election. And it's my belief they actually turned it.


WATTERS: All right. So the Obama administration likes to brag that they never had a scandal. I think we just found one, Marie.

HARF: You believe, Jesse?

WATTERS: And one of the pieces of evidence linking that is we have new Page-Strzok texts. And at one point Strzok says, "The White House is running this," meaning the counterintelligence investigation into the Trump campaign.

HARF: How do you know what they meant?

WATTERS: What say you?

HARF: Did it say that?

GUILFOYLE: Jesse has rested his case.

WATTERS: If you look at the context, it's very clear. Kimberly, what about you?

HARF: Wait, wait, wait.

WATTERS: Go ahead.

HARF: OK. So, I think that the Mueller investigation is serious and is getting more serious. And the president is deciding whether or not to sit down and talk with Bob Mueller.

Against that backdrop, I think the president and his supporters are trying to sort of create an alternative narrative about what they feel is a scandal without putting forward any evidence to back it up.

WATTERS: There's no evidence?

HARF: There was no spy --

WATTERS: Of abuse of power here?

HARF: There was no spy looking, spying on the Trump campaign. That is not true.

WATTERS: How do you -- why not?

HARF: Because there's no evidence to support that, Jesse.

WATTERS: If you have an FBI informant, possibly two to three, talking to three to four Trump campaign officials before the counterintelligence investigation was opened, you don't think that's a spy in the campaign?

HARF: I do not.

WATTERS: Why not?

HARF: That's not what the intel question community would call it either.

WATTERS: What would they call it?

HARF: So supporters of the president call it that to distract from the Russia investigation and discredit Bob Mueller. I think why --

WATTERS: Comey said it was, like, human intelligence asset or something like that.

HARF: I think -- I think why today's meeting were important.

WATTERS: That's like calling an intern -- you know, a coffee transportation specialist.

HARF: I think why today's meetings were important, and it was important that they included Democrats, was because there's a lot of insinuations that are put out there by the supporters of the president that I think are designed to credit the investigation. So what we really need is the actual transparency and information. And if you're right --

WATTERS: Listen.

HARF: -- I will tell you, you're right. OK? I will.

WATTERS: Let's hear it. Because I am right.

HARF: No, you're not.

WATTERS: Because there hasn't been no transparency. Every time they ask questions, which they have oversight of -- I'm talking about the congresspeople -- of the DOJ and the FBI, they're stonewalled. Right, Kimberly?

GUILFOYLE: Stonewalled. They won't release documents. They redact. They submit false dossiers that are paid for by Hillary Clinton. When you look at all, like, the bad actor behavior, it's coming from the other side.

And now you see, in fact, the collusion appears to be -- and the I.G. report will confirm this -- if they were acting in concert to try to undermine a presidential candidate and specifically engage in spying, OK, in a campaign. They had no authority to do so. If you were that concerned that there was an influence of Russians, then you should have knocked on the door and said, "Beware." And instead they decided to try to take things into their own hands.

And if I was James Comey, I would be zipping it. Because by the time the I.G. report comes out, he wouldn't be able to give his book away. Same for clap on, clap off. So the two Jims are in big trouble. And I also think, like, McCabe, he's in trouble, too. So we'll see how this goes. But you know, this -- They're trying to get out ahead of it and preempt it --


GUILFOYLE: -- because they know how bad it is, because they know what, in fact, they've done.

WATTERS: Kind of stunning that James Clapper said what he said, Dana. I mean, he's been known as a liar and a leaker, and now he's pulling a number out of thin air, saying that votes were affected to the point where Trump wouldn't have won. Where do you think he came up with that?

PERINO: Well, yes, I think that is extremely curious. So hopefully, we'll find out more. And he prefaces it by saying, "It's my informed opinion." And he would have been in a position to know something, I guess, except for the big problem for -- with all of this is that, if you believe all of that, then you have to believe that our government is totally incompetent.

WATTERS: Possibility.

PERINO: Because if they were trying to throw the race against Hillary -- I mean, against Trump, they really didn't do a good job.

But also, I think the big problem for Democrats is that we just did a block about how the Democrats have spent 18 months, and they haven't figured out what they're going to be fore and what they're going to say.

And to having somebody like Clapper reinforce, in their mind, that Hillary Clinton lost because of the Russians, makes it so much harder for them to actually figure out a message. With a little bit of effort, the campaign in Brooklyn, if they had left Brooklyn and get to Wisconsin and Michigan, they probably could have won.

WATTERS: Right. Not helpful from Clapper.

Greg Gutfeld.

GUTFELD: So we have a collusion competition. We've got two collusion stories going on. The initial collusion story, Russia and Trump, really is the media's morphine. It's the drip, drip, drip that keeps them in dreamland to cover up the pain they still feel from Trump's victory.

Now let's move onto what we're -- what Trump is calling Spygate. So I'm going to try and decipher, Marie, your response to that, which I believe reflects all of media.

So we all know, everybody -- we all know that there really was no spying whatsoever. There was no spying whatsoever. But if there was, it was good spying. It was like a spy vaccine that protects against the worst spying. But again, there was no spying. But please don't reveal the name of the non-spy, because he's definitely not a spy. And you don't want to blow his cover for not being a spy. So A, no spying, but it's good spying. And please don't reveal the name of the spy, because he's not a spy.

GUILFOYLE: Charitable spying.

WATTERS: That's right. Get your story straight, Democrats.

Up next, who's on "The Five" who's addicted to their cellphones. Find out next.


HARF: Well, the Memorial Day holiday weekend is just around the corner. And just like you, "The Five" can't wait. But we will be able -- will we be able to shut down, relax, and put away our cellphones, as all of us look at our cellphones here? A new study says, not a chance. Americans check their phones 80 times per day on average while on vacation. Jesse.



PERINO: Very good.

GUTFELD: That was hackneyed.

GUILFOYLE: That was almost compelling acting there.

WATTERS: I sold it. Yes.

HARF: Are you, are you -- you are on Instagram. You do a lot of Instagramming.


GUILFOYLE: Insta-nonsense. Yes.

HARF: Yes.

GUTFELD: I figure that's David Schwimmer.

HARF: Do you also do it on vacation?

WATTERS: I'm going to try to stop this vacation. It's hard. Because you're in the news business. You don't want to come back on Monday and be like, what happened? Is the summit back on?

PERINO: Right.

WATTERS: So -- but this time, I really want to really throw away the phone, and I'm going to really make a concerted effort to ditch the phone.

GUILFOYLE: Where are you going?

WATTERS: I'm not going to tell people for security reasons.



HARF: OK. He wasn't kidding.

WATTERS: That's my answer.

HARF: So we'll check with you on Tuesday, and we'll see how you did.

Dana, are you a vacation phone checker?

PERINO: I do find it hard to take a break from it, because it's so -- it's so hard to catch up.

And also, it's a wonderful time to be in news. There's so much news. And if you -- you know, there's lots of great stuff being written, keeping in touch with people. Pictures of Jasper are amazing.

HARF: Amazing.

PERINO: But yes, of course, I would like not have to look at it as much as I do.

HARF: There's times when I go places that have really bad reception. And I actually find it very soothing, because then I can't check my phone. No?

GUILFOYLE: Anxiety producing.

HARF: So you're, like, a phone all the time person?

GUILFOYLE: You know why? Because I like the news. I mean, that's my vacation. I want to read about it. I want to look what's going on. I'm interested in it. I want to check the pictures. What's Dana doing having a better life then me?

I want to -- I want to see it, OK. I'm like, oh, there's the beach. OK. OK, there's Jasper, frolicking in the waves. And then it makes you happy.

PERINO: Jasper has a better life then all of us.

GUILFOYLE: Then I feel like I'm on vacation.

HARF: Greg.

GUTFELD: In the problem lies the solution, Marie. You need to treat your phones like anything in life. Delayed gratification. If you don't look at something for two hours, then come back and you see what you find, it's a digital Christmas. All of a sudden, your phone becomes a little --

PERINO: Otherwise it's just Monday.

GUTFELD: It's just Monday. But instead, three or four times, you have a little digital Christmas. We are opening gifts or GIFs. Hmm. See what I did there? The problem -- the world --

WATTERS: You can say "digital Christmas" now.

GUTFELD: Digital Christmas.


GUTFELD: The world is a hard place if you don't have something to look forward to. And we always, like, if you keep checking your phone, there's nothing there, it actually makes you feel kind of bad.

PERINO: And like, "No one cares."

GUTFELD: No one cares. If you just put it off, the phone can create moments of the day where you actually feel good and lock forward to it. Instead of being distracted, you become delighted. And you avoid the status inequality that drives everybody crazy.

PERINO: You know what I would pay for? Here's a business for somebody.


PERINO: If I were to take a break from my phone for four days, can you produce for me a three-page memo of what happened so that I wouldn't feel like I missed out? And then I could just catch up that -- that's brilliant.

WATTERS: Don't you have an assistant?


HARF: Someone at FOX, definitely.

GUTFELD: I would lie throughout the whole thing. I'm very sorry to hear about your family.

GUILFOYLE: Gosh, you're --

HARF: You're a downer tonight, man.

GUTFELD: No, I'm an upper. I'm filled with reality.

GUILFOYLE: This is his status quo. Homeostasis.

HARF: On that note "One More Thing" is up next. Stay tuned.


GUTFELD: Time for "One More Thing" -- Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: OK. So this is a follow-up on a story I did back in April. And today President Trump granted a rare and historic posthumous pardon for the first African-American heavyweight boxing champion, Jack Johnson. And the pardon clears Johnson of racially-motivated charges resulting from his relationships with a white woman in 1912, if you can believe it.

Senator John McCain had called for the pardon. His great-grand-niece. And also Sylvester Stallone specifically went to President Trump to try to lobby on his behalf. And there was an Oval Office event today, along with former champion Lennox Lewis, current champion Deontay Wilder, and Johnson's family. So take a look at this.


GUILFOYLE: So it's a story of triumph and tragedy, but it's not over yet. President Donald Trump hopefully will pardon this fine American and put him back in the ranks where he belongs, one of boxing's greatest.


GUILFOYLE: I'm a huge fan of boxing. I always used to watch with my father. And so he taught me about this boxer, as well. So I think this is really, you know, long overdue. And so I'm happy that this happened. And God bless his family and his relatives.

GUTFELD: Excellent.

PERINO: All right. You like baseball?

GUTFELD: Yes. But that's not as good as Kimberly's.

PERINO: No. Nothing will top Kimberly's today.

Any fan knows that the best part of the baseball game is when those big mascots decide to run. In last night's game in Dallas, they had -- the mascots were Nolan Ryan, Sam Houston, and George W. Bush. There was a heckler there trying to get the Bush one to move forward. Watch this.




PERINO: It reminds me of when President Bush decided to run a marathon, and his mom was there to cheer him on. And she said the same thing, "Get moving," so that he wouldn't lose.

The good news is the Bush character won.

GUTFELD: Excellent.

All right. Time for this.


GRAPHIC: Greg's Commuter News.


GUTFELD: "Greg's Commuter News." You know when you're hitching a ride, whether it's hitchhiking or sharing a -- I don't know, a seat. Make sure you're actually inside the vehicle. Not like this little fellow.




Take a look at this kid. Riding the top of the car. Apparently, the family was unaware that the cat was on the car and had been clinging to the roof of the van.

PERINO: Oh, no!

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God!

WATTERS: Is that the Romney car?

GUTFELD: Terrible. It hitched a ride for two miles. Two miles. But good news, the cat did not survive. Kidding! The cat is fine. Everything's fine. They reunited. He's not injured.

PERINO: So sad!

GUTFELD: The cat's name is Rebel. And the cat --

GUILFOYLE: Without a cause.

GUTFELD: -- was not even fazed, they said. But please do not put cats on the roof of cars. That's not a good thing.

PERINO: Oh, my gosh! It's terrible.

GUILFOYLE: That's really -- you know.

GUTFELD: I've got a -- where are we now, Jesse?

WATTERS: Yes. Brace yourself, Greg. New study out, an extra glass of wine could take 30 minutes off your life. The old study said that men could drink 14 glasses of wine a week, and that was good. That, apparently, study was way off. Fake news, apparently. Seven glasses of wine for men. That's the way to go. When you have more than that, you die young. So --

GUILFOYLE: You mean a night?

WATTERS: A week.

PERINO: A week.

GUILFOYLE: I was like, you could not do that.

Yes, but there's a new study out that says champagne and aspirin is excellent for you. It prevents dementia.

WATTERS: Who committed that study?

GUILFOYLE: You should start. Immediately.

PERINO: She did.

Baier (ph).

GUTFELD: All right, Marie.

GUILFOYLE: It's a real story. Look it up.

HARF: So the Stanley Cup is set. The series starts Monday, May 28. And the Las Vegas Golden Knights, an expansion team, have reached the Stanley Cup in their first season. They're going up against the Washington Capitals, who are only playing in their second Stanley Cup final ever.

The Golden Knights are the best first-year expansion team in pro sports history, and their inaugural game was played right after the tragic shooting in Las Vegas. It was really a moment for the town to come together and honor the victims. So it's going to be a really great series between these two teams. And we're going to get an historic outcome, because --

PERINO: The Capitals are going to win.

HARF: -- neither team has ever won the Stanley Cup. So this year will be a first.

WATTERS: No one cares about hockey.

HARF: Did you really just crap all over my "One More Thing."

WATTERS: No one cares about it.

GUTFELD: Oh, you're going to get letters.

GUILFOYLE: You're going to meet a few hockey players.

GUTFELD: Yes, it's not going to be pretty. Your walk home ain't going to be pretty. I'll tell you that, champ.

PERINO: They're going to be waiting outside for you.

GUILFOYLE: They're not worried about losing their seat.

GUTFELD: Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." Don't be callous. Bret's in Dallas.


BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS: Nice. Thank you, Greg. You lost me on the hockey talk. Go Caps.

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