Trump doubles down on MS-13: I'll always call them animals

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," May 23, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Kimberly Guilfoyle along with Richard Fowler, Pete Hegseth, Dana Perino and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City, and this is "The Five."

President Trump delivering on another one of his campaign promises, calling for tougher immigration laws. The president hosted a roundtable with police, congressmen and local leaders on Long Island, New York, an area hit hard by the murderous MS-13 gang.


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: We're here today to discuss the menace of MS-13. It's a menace. They exploited the loopholes in our laws to enter the country as unaccompanied alien minors. They looked so innocent. They're not innocent. Crippling loopholes in our laws have enabled MS-13 gang members and other criminals to infiltrate our communities. And Democrats in congress refused to close these loopholes, including the disgraceful practice known as catch and release.


GUILFOYLE: The president also calling out Democrats who he says came to the defense of MS-13 gang members after he called them animals.


TRUMP: I noticed recently where Democrats, Nancy Pelosi as an example, are trying to defend MS-13 gang members. I call them animals the other day and I was met with rebuke. They said they're people. They're not people. These are animals. And we have to be very, very tough.



GUILFOYLE: Meanwhile, a local police commissioner sounding the alarm on just how dangerous these gangs are to communities.


PATRICK RYDER, NASSAU COUNTY POLICE COMMISSIONER: We need help. When we have 40 percent of our homicides, and we have record low homicides last year, 40 percent are MS-13 related. And out of that six that they committed, four of them were butchers with machetes and buried into graves, shallow graves that the families cannot only identify but can't find. We need that support from the president. We haven't watching our back now. He's supporting our enforcement efforts, but we can also use some funding now from D.C.


GUILFOYLE: OK. So, the president tackling this issue head-on, Greg, and doubling down. He was faced criticism. He said he faced rebuke for calling and identifying specifically gang members from MS-13, calling them animals. He repeated that today, and then had some evidence to back it up from the local authorities.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Well, politically, this is a big win for him. In this issue, Trump's stance will register. For Trump, the MS and MS-13 stands for must stop. For the Democrats MS and MS-13 stands for misunderstood. And the more he shows the contrast, the better it is because the media and the Democrats they continually with Trump, they get bogged down in language and they always lose. They're so worried about the words and it reveals the lopsided priorities. So, you've got a president who is worried about jobs, terror, North Korea, gangs. Meanwhile, you have another side that's concerned that he calls gang members animals. It's like -- imagine your house being on fire and your neighbors are complaining that the fire engines are too loud. That's what this is. Democrats worrying about what you call gang members are neighbors saying, hey, could your fire engines keep it down while the house burns? Exactly that.

GUILFOYLE: Can you imagine? OK. So, the, you know, three alarms have been sent here, Dana, for MS-13. Obviously, something needs to be done about it. I saw you reacting to the statistics in terms of the number of homicides.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Forty percent.

GUILFOYLE: Absolutely. And the heinous nature of the crimes that they commit.

PERINO: I talked to a former prosecutor today who did a lot of these cases, especially in Maryland, who said that he thinks of MS-13 as the mafia of our generation. And that one of the ways they've gone after them is like they used to do for the mob through RICO, which is racketeering, and something, and something. I can't remember the exact words. But -- so I asked, well, then what laws that the president said today, like we need congress to do something, what do you think congress could do that could actually help law enforcement? And he said that he does believe that the lax border is a huge problem, because of the ability to regenerate and that they're recruiting at younger and younger ages. And, that this brutality - - he said it's almost ISIS-like in the killing.


PERINO: . and it's ratcheting up and it's getting worse. He also said MS- 13 was in about ten states in 2005, and by the late 2000's in all 50 states. The one thing -- I think today was important to bring attention to it. I did note that in Connell McShane when he was doing reporting for us today, that there's a local Democratic congressmen who was not invited to today's meeting and I think that was a mistake. I think -- because he said he would have gone if he had been invited. And why not try to co-opt some of them, Democrats, so that you can actually make this a bipartisan issue. And these people want to call it -- they want to make fun of the president for saying animals, like they just have to deal with their own politics on that side. But if you really want to solve the problem you will need Democrats, and the local congressmen is probably a good place to start.

GUILFOYLE: That's a really good point in terms of the take away. Good event today. It could be even better for something like that.

PETE HEGSETH, CO-HOST: Yeah. I mean, the sheer numbers -- great point, Dana, 2,000 members of MS-13 on Long Island alone. And the backdrop behind the president said secure our borders, protect our communities. And one of the participants said you can't protect our community until you secure our border. And the president has that wide view. They do regenerate. And the contrast you see between the folks yelling about the animals comment is the president wants the rule of law, enforcing laws we have, versus lawlessness. He wants borders versus open borders. He believes merit-based immigration is better than the Russian roulette, not to use Russia, but the Russian roulette of who knows who's coming.


HEGSETH: . why they're coming? What their intentions are. And, Greg, to your point, MS-13 is the perfect example. This president identifies opportunities to expose the left and the insanity that they pursue, catch and release, sanctuary cities. And MS-13 is that example, and everyone knows it. And it's a real problem for real people in their lives. And I think he's hit the nail on the head in this one.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. So, it's really an unfortunate position, the left find themselves, Richard, that they're defending these kinds of criminals.

GUTFELD: Name all of them Richard.

GUILFOYLE: . lawless criminals. But, now, the proliferation has spread to all 50 states. When you liken them to ISIS, it seems like perfectly appropriate because they are domestic terrorists in terms of the crime, the racketeering, the murders that they carry out.

RICHARD FOWLER, CO-HOST: So, listen, here's my take on this. So, when President Trump made the animals comment, he complained he was taken out of context, and he was. And what he's doing with Nancy Pelosi now is taking her out of context, completely. Nancy Pelosi's argument was a larger narrative about what the president's rhetoric on immigration overall and how this animal comment bleeds into that larger narrative. It was nothing to do with MS-13. If you ask any Democrat on Capitol Hill, they would say, yes, MS-13 is heinous, they're awful, and that's why we have laws like RICO, and other laws to make sure that gangs like that in this country don't spread. But you have to separate MS-13 from those individuals who, from the dreamers, you have to separate MS-13 from.


FOWLER: Wait a minute. Let me finish.


FOWLER: No, she did not. And let me finish. But think about the mother who left Guatemala, or Nicaragua, or El Salvador, the three most dangerous countries on earth. When they walked 3,000 miles with all their belongings and their children to seek freedom and to seek the American dream, they are nowhere near what MS-13 is.


GUTFELD: That's what he's referring to them.


FOWLER: That's my point. You cannot conflate -- you have to separate.

HEGSETH: She purposely conflate.

FOWLER: She did not.


HEGSETH: . when Trump said MS-13 are animals, he's calling all immigrants animals. He's calling all illegals animals.

FOWLER: No, no, no, that is not what leader Pelosi said. Leader Pelosi.

HEGSETH: Because they believe Trump is racist. And so, they want to make people think that he's racist, right?

FOWLER: Listen, you just twisted a whole bunch of things to create alternative facts.


GUILFOYLE: No, you didn't.

FOWLER: What Nancy Pelosi was trying to say was the president's rhetoric overall. When he came down the golden staircase and calls Mexican rapists and murderers, right? The rhetoric leads to the problem. Not what he said about Ms-13.

GUTFELD: All right. Let me respond to that. The argument that you're using is that it really doesn't matter what Trump said now, it's what he said then.


GUTFELD: Yeah. And, also, one could argue what he meant back then is exactly what he meant now, but he did it in a sloppy way. But the fact is this argument cannot work. You know, if somebody -- I didn't rob a bank, but maybe in the past I might have, so he's probably guilty. If he's not guilty now, he was probably guilty then. It's an illogical argument. You can't say, and I use this analogy before, when you find a hate crime and it turns out to be false, the left says, well, it's false here but it could be true somewhere else. It's actually deflection from actually just admitting Trump was right, and people like Pelosi are conflating.

GUILFOYLE: And, by the way, when you hear about public safety and you care about people, citizen in the community, being able to go to work, to take their kids to school, why would you take the side of people who are coming in committing heinous crimes, murders.

FOWLER: Nobody is taking the side of MS-13.

GUTFELD: Why are you in MS-13?

FOWLER: I am not.



FOWLER: I never even seen them.

GUILFOYLE: I have. This is the thing.

FOWLER: No, I get that.

GUTFELD: Why are you denying this?

FOWLER: We can all agree in this table that he's taking Nancy Pelosi out of context. Can we agree on that point?

GUTFELD: No, I don't think so.


GUTFELD: She took him out of context, and then he responded.

FOWLER: By taking her out of context.

PERINO: I think the left has played this incorrectly from a strategic standpoint. This is a community that you would think would actually like it if the Democrats that -- we understand that you're not like them.

GUTFELD: They're praying.

PERINO: But we are going to protect you by going after them. Like, I think the strategy on all this doesn't make any sense.

HEGSETH: Just admit one time the president might be right.


FOWLER: First of all, I would admit when the president is right, I will give the president (INAUDIBLE). But here, my argument is he is conflating regular immigrants who are coming here trying to seek the American dream.

HEGSETH: No, Nancy Pelosi is doing that.

GUILFOYLE: We're going to agree to disagree on that, because a little-bit heated there, but a little-bit heated over here. Watch this heated exchange between the head of ICE and Democratic California Congresswoman Nanette Barragan for suggesting his organization was anti-immigrant.


REP. NANETTE BARRAGAN, D-CALIF.: We'd love to paint immigrants as criminals. That is not the complete facts. It makes me sick to my stomach to keep hearing over and over again, painting the broad stroke in the picture as though these are folks who are coming here to do harm.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: First of all, no one on this panel is anti-immigrant. We're law enforcement officers enforcing the law that you enacted. So, to sit there and say we're anti-immigrant is wrong.


GUILFOYLE: All right, Greg, so people taking offense. If you say OK -- they're not saying they're anti-immigrant. They are for upholding the laws that are on the books. How is that anti-immigrant? How is that racist to enforce the law and ensure public safety?

GUTFELD: Again, it's an example of conflation and it happens a lot. Like, we've been in a situation where we will talk about Islamic terrorism and people accuse you of Islamophobia. Thank you. But I'm not actually talking about Islam. I'm talking about terrorists who happen to be Islamic, Islamic terrorism. I didn't say Islam. And therefore, people go, no, you are Islamophobic. This is the same argument. Like, how dare you come out against gangs who happen to be of a specific minority. You don't like that minority. No, you are actually guilty of doing that. If you hear MS-13 and hear innocent immigrant, that's on you, not anybody else.

GUILFOYLE: By the way, you seen one of these definitions in the dictionary of animal is an inhuman person, brutish or beastlike person.


GUTFELD: My nickname in the gym.

PERINO: Well, that's why the MS-13 gang member calls themselves animals.

GUTFELD: A lot of athletes, wrestlers.

HEGSETH: It's like ISIS, they pride themselves in that. Who could be more brutal?

PERINO: But did you notice in that hearing where the congresswoman was there, there was nobody else, no other congressional members was there to question him.

HEGSETH: I literally testified in front of congressional committees where there's nobody there.


FOWLER: When it comes to immigration and it comes to actually passing comprehensive immigration reform, because our laws were made in 1984, congress is missing in action. Missing in action.


GUILFOYLE: Well, they're MIA, but not MS-13.

HEGSETH: There're some good things in 1984 though.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Well, we've won that argument. OK. The NFL announces new rules for national anthem protest. Do they go far enough? That fascinating debate next.


TRUMP: Do you know what's hurting the game more than that? When people like yourself turn on television and you see those people taking the knee when they were playing our great national anthem.


PERINO: That was President Trump criticizing NFL players who kneel during the national anthem. Well, the NFL adopting new rules today to deal with this controversial issue. Teams can now be fined if players decide to take a knee and don't show respect for the flag, end quote. The league is also removing the requirement of players be on the field during the national anthem. The NFL players union is saying it was not consulted about the change and could challenge it if necessary. So, this is a story we covered all year, now the NFL is gearing up for next year. And, Pete, they're trying to get ahead of this. How do you think they came down?

HEGSETH: Not perfect but good. I mean, this is good development. The president was effective. The NFL is feeling the heat. The fans will ultimately decide because the locker room will become the new kneeling. I mean, what it says is if you're on the field, you must stand, but you don't have to be on the field. And the policy says shall stand and show respect for the flag and the anthem. So, it's not standing, its respect for flag and the anthem. That's what the president talks about all the time. You live in this country, you have the privilege of playing a game for millions of dollars, that gives you that opportunity, stand for the anthem. The NFL responded. Listen, their ratings took a hit, their attendance took a hit.

PERINO: And their fans didn't like it.

HEGSETH: And their fans didn't like it. And they responded to it and we'll see how it develops. What's going to matter is how the players react, because the only people fined are not the players, the teams are fined.


HEGSETH: So, how does that dynamic happen if a bunch of players get together and say we're kneeling and my team gets fined, I mean, that's on the coaches and the owners. So, it's not a perfect solution, feels like a half measure, but it's a hat tip to our president who says patriotism matters in this country.

PERINO: Well, I guess, one of the things was you don't have to be on the field, so if you don't want to stand for the national anthem, you can hang out in the locker room.

GUTFELD: Yes, always a fun time.

PERINO: Like, everybody will be.

GUTFELD: Anyway, you know what the thing is.


GUTFELD: . this political expression is no different to me than the celebration excess that you see. You should be penalized for unsportsmanlike conduct. And so, celebration excess is unsportsmanlike. Introducing politics into a game is unsportsmanlike. It's a sport, so it's unsportsmanlike. I've said this -- had to be a year and a half ago, and I've said, like, imagine if our viewers turned on The Five and instead of doing political conversation we were throwing the ball around for an hour. How upset would they be? That's no different than turning on NFL and having somebody introduced politics into something that is supposed to be enjoyable.

And, finally, if you really believe politically in something it has to be - - there has to be a risk. So, my suggestion is that you do it within the game. You actually kneel in the field, because that incurs a cost against your team.


GUTFELD: Take a knee, get the ball, and take a knee and see what happens, because then that shows real guts.

PERINO: All right. K.G., what do you think?


GUILFOYLE: I think this was, you know, a win for the president because he really took the forefront on this issue and stepped out on it. He got a lot of criticism, but he didn't back down on it because you -- he thought, well, you should stand. You should stand for the men and women that serve in this country for the flag, for the pleasure and privilege that we all get to be able to do our jobs, for them to be able to get on the field, for people to root for them or root against them. And, you know, show some respect for the military that serves because this became incredibly distracting, upsetting because people were all different kinds of causes, all of a sudden, saying they were changing the issue. You want to be socially active and you're upset about police, et cetera, go out, talk to them, work with your community, et cetera. That's what you can do. It's a better more productive way than showboating.

PERINO: Richard, listen to this. The Jets chairman, Christopher Johnson, says that he's going -- this is his take on it, that if somebody on the Jets takes a knee, that fine will be borne by the organization, by me, not the players. I never want to put restrictions on the speech of our players. Do I prefer that they stand? Of course. But I understand if they felt the need to protest. What do you think of his comments?

FOWLER: I agree with that. Here's the thing, I have big problems with Roger Goodell. Huge problem. I think most in the table have a problem with Roger Goodell. And I think he's got to go. But, I think there's a couple other problems with this particular rule. Number one, there were no players in this meeting when this issue was decided. The Players Association was left out it. It was a bunch of owners who got in the room and made the decision without consulting.

PERINO: You don't think that's fair?

FOWLER: I think it's unfair because the football is not football without the players, period.

HEGSETH: The players have been consulted -- millions of dollars going to players.


PERINO: Corporate makes the decision, and we're the employees, we have to follow it. We don't -- we're not in on every meeting.

FOWLER: But there's a distinction here because the NFLPA, they have a contract with the NFL, and when you levy a fine, the contract has to be negotiated by the official representation for the players.

HEGSETH: The fines are not in the players, it's in the owners.

FOWLER: But it doesn't matter. Anytime there's a new fine the players have to be party to that conversation, number one.

GUTFELD: But we don't go to -- like, at Fox.


GUTFELD: We don't go to meetings. And they talk about us all the time, Richard.

GUILFOYLE: Especially you, Greg.


FOWLER: But other problem I have I think this rule is very vague, the idea of respect for the flag. So, that means they're going to close every concession stand at the stadium? If that means they're going to force every fan to take their hat off?

HEGSETH: They should, actually, I would love that.

FOWLER: This is the question. This is a very vague rule. It's written very vaguely, and it's written to punish players for using their first amendment rights. Let's be very clear. The flag is nothing without our constitution, and the first amendment to that constitution, freedom of speech and the freedom.


GUTFELD: So it's about the flag. I thought it was about police brutality.


PERINO: But I can't come here and wear -- like, Kimberly and I can't come here and wear t-shirts that had like a bad word written on them. It would be against company policy, but it would be my first amendment right to walk around in the street with it.


FOWLER: That's apples and oranges -- taking a knee before this whole controversy was a sign of reverence. Remember.

HEGSETH: Oh, come on.

FOWLER: . Jesus took a knee in the Garden of Gethsemane.


FOWLER: Taking a knee is always been a sign of reverence. They're not putting a fist up. They're taking a knee when the pledge is happening. This is all they've done.


GUILFOYLE: That's not how you kneel in church.

GUTFELD: Kneel in front of a police station, if that's the case. Why kneel in front of the flag?

FOWLER: When the coaches talking to their players, everybody take a knee so you can hear me, hear me talking.


PERINO: Wow. We have to end it there.


PERINO: All right, new reaction from the president on the Russia investigation, and reports of an FBI informant in his campaign, next.


HEGSETH: Thank you, D.J. All right. President Trump is unveiling a new nickname for the latest development in Russia investigation. He's calling it Spygate. It's involving the FBI informant and his campaign. Well, the president is also taking aim at James Comey and James Clapper, the Jims, who are saying the FBI did nothing wrong.


TRUMP: We now call it Spygate. You're calling it Spygate. A lot of bad things have happened. Whey they look at the documents, I think people are going to see a lot of bad things happen. I hope it's not so. I mean, if you look at Clapper, he sort of admitted that they had spies in the campaign, yesterday, inadvertently. But I hope it's not true, but it looks like it is.


TRUMP: I think James Comey has got a lot of problems. If you look at what he did, if you look at all of the lies, the tremendous lies, if you look at all that's going on, I think James Comey has got a lot of problems.


HEGSETH: The president comments come ahead of tomorrow's meeting between GOP Chairman Devin Nunes, Trey Gowdy, and top DOJ, FBI and intelligence officials. Richard, I will come to you first. You deserve -- so, James clapper, these words came out of his mouth.


HEGSETH: The Jims. They were spying, OK, that was said as part of the quote he said. And James Comey, he says, well, no, no, no, it's not spying. Let me give you the technical term it's called confidential human sources. So, because he knows the technical term and Trump uses spines, somehow he's more sophisticated. It was all meant for his good. James Clapper admitted the same thing, he spied but it was good for him. At what point is there an acknowledgement from the left that there was legitimate political espionage going on against a candidate running for president?

FOWLER: So, I have a question for you.

HEGSETH: Oh, please.

FOWLER: So, you guys -- what you want from the FBI and the Department of Justice is accountability and transparency, right?

HEGSETH: Oh, someday, yes.

FOWLER: So, that's the same thing that Black Lives Matter and all these other groups have been asking for from police department's all across the country.


FOWLER: No, but it is the same thing. It's absolutely the same thing. Law enforcement being accountable.


HEGSETH: We're not talking about Black Live Matter. We're talking about the president being spied.

FOWLER: The president is asking for the same thing that activists all across this country been asking for.

GUTFELD: So the FBI should be wearing body cams? Is that what --

FOWLER: Maybe. We'll -- we'll know if they were spying on the president or not.

PERINO: You just can't plant body cams.

HEGSETH: Or wearing a wire. We don't know if he's.

FOWLER: The other point is that there's no facts here. Right? That's No. 1.

No. 2, all the informants, this is all -- this all happened after the formal FBI investigation was triggered and, according to the Nunes memo that he released, that FBI -- that FBI investigation was triggered by George Papadopoulos being drunk in London. That's the last line of the --


FOWLER: After that, after the Australians called our intelligence agency and said, "Hey, listen, you have a Trump associate over here saying he's got all this information." The FBI started to investigate it. And part of investigating is what are the Russians doing? How they're engaging in our elections? So that's exactly what happened.

HEGSETH: He never told the campaign.

GUILFOYLE: It's so disingenuous now, because they got caught with the hand in the cookie jar. And they're like, "Oh, wait. It wasn't me. We're just trying to do this to help you out, because we didn't want you to eat all those cookies, so we just sniffed into the jar."

It makes no sense, because the bottom line is they knew what they were doing, and they were engaged in an active, ongoing politically-motivated spying operation against a political candidate. There's no other way to slice it.

And the inspector general over the next few months is going to be releasing a series of I.G. reports that will be incredibly devastating and damning to the CIA, to the DOJ, to the FBI. So that's where your transparency is going to come through. Because -- and that's why you see New York Times" and some of the other, like, mainstream media enablers trying to get out ahead of the story to preempt, because they know the thunder is coming.

HEGSETH: Yes. Dana, the president tweeted earlier today, "It's clear that they" -- quoting Judge Andrew Napolitano -- "It's clear that they had eyes and ears all over the Trump campaign."

So you can sweat the details, how many informants, this or that, but they were clearly focused on getting to know what Trump was doing.

PERINO: Yes. And I -- I'm totally willing to believe that all of that happened, but I do go back to, like, when the president -- we just showed in the clip he said, "I hope it's not true, but it looks like it is."

So maybe they'll get some more information tomorrow at this briefing. The weird thing was it was only for Republicans, and I do think that Nancy Pelosi and Chuck Schumer were right to say there is the Gang of Eight, which is the ability to -- they should remember that was where the enhanced interrogation techniques were briefed. It never leaked. Nobody ever complained about it. It's a pretty safe operation to be able to put forward this information.

I asked Trey Gowdy today on the 2 p.m. show --


PERINO: -- if he would be willing to have them come. He said he wasn't in charge of the invite list. And if they could come and not leak, that would be great.

GUILFOYLE: That was a good interview.

GUTFELD: I love how James Comey was asked about this -- I don't know where -- and he said, "How will Republicans explain this to their grandchildren?"

And I figure it's easy. You can say this. "You know President Barron Trump? Well, his dad was unjustly persecuted --"

FOWLER: Oh, wow.

GUTFELD: "-- by deep-state agents --

FOWLER: You should have called him first, man.

GUTFELD: "-- who failed to see the greatness of Donald Trump."

But this is what -- just a simple comparison, OK? How can the media go crazy over a meeting with a woman over the Magnitsky Act and Donald Trump Jr. but then dismiss all of this other activity as a nothing caviar. I.E., Fusion GPS, the spies --

GUILFOYLE: Steele dossier.

GUTFELD: -- the dossier funded by Hillary. So all of that is nothing.

But if you repeat -- that simple comparison, comparing that to a meeting with a woman who tried to get in there to talk about the Magnitsky Act, that reveals the bias. If you are embracing one side of this story while dismissing the other side, betrays a certain measure of hackiness.

So we can all -- I think we can all agree at this point to bury the hatchet on this Russian mass and focus on how it can't happen in the future.

PERINO: Right.

GUTFELD: We all agree we don't want the Russians to be interfering. We don't want anybody interfering with our elections.


FOWLER: Let's pass some laws and strengthen our elections. And maybe if you invite Democrats to the meeting, we can work together.

GUTFELD: But they never stop talking about it.

FOWLER: Sorry. Devin Nunes leaks way more than the Gang of Eight.

PERINO: If they bring Chick-Fil-A.

FOWLER: Devin Nunes is the biggest leaker that I know.

PERINO: That's what the Democrats should do, bring Chick-Fil-A to a meeting. They'll be welcomed.

HEGSETH: I'm going to have to contest Barron being the heir. Maybe it is. I think it's going to be Eric Trump. I'm just saying. Making that up.

All right. Parents sue to kick out their employed -- unemployed.

PERINO: Unemployed.

HEGSETH: Employed. Unemployed 30-year-old son.

GUTFELD: Underemployed.

HEGSETH: Underemployed, unemployed. They've got a 30-year-old son. He lives in their basement. Greg is going to react to it, coming up next.


GUTFELD: On Tuesday, a New York state judge ordered a 30-year-old man to clear out of his parents' house. Michael Rotondo didn't pay rent or do chores. Basically, he's a tiny version of Congress. And so he was finally sued by mom and dad after he refused to leave.

A self-employed businessman, the parents have yet to see any of Michael's secret source of income.


GUTFELD: I'm beginning to wonder what that is.

His parents' home was actually a sanctuary city and he a sponge, approaching 31, reaped the benefits, apparently thinking everything should be free. He almost qualifies as a commencement speaker, or at least a Vermont senator. Yes.

Finally, after a pile of ignored eviction letters, the judge ruled for Mom and Pop, and he had to move out. But being good parents, they offered him money to find a place to stay and to fix his car -- secretly hoping he might leave town.

But they also gave him sound advice, including, quote, "Organize the things you need for work and manage an apartment." And, quote, "Sell the other things that have any significant value." That's pretty good. And he added this. "There are jobs available even for those with a poor work history like you." So true. "Get one. You have to work." Translation: Get off your butt and do something with your life.

So now evicted, he worried about what's best for him. Which was the advice just given. He did see his parents again after the ruling and said it was pretty awkward. On the bright side, he could always move into a Starbucks.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my gosh. This is the problem. That's why I'm going Dunkin', Dunkin' Donuts.


GUILFOYLE: They wouldn't allow any of this.

GUTFELD: You know, Kimberly, this guy's all over the news. He's going to be on Martha MacCallum tonight.


GUTFELD: I'm very excited.

I moved in with my mom when I was 23. I stayed for a year. I thought it was pretty good. Is this kid pushing it?

GUILFOYLE: Yes, I think he's pushing it. Because then didn't he go back to their house --


GUILFOYLE: -- after the judge told him "Get a life, get a job"?

GUTFELD: Yes, that's awkward. GUILFOYLE: And then he's like, "Knock, knock."

"Who's there?"

"Me again."

GUTFELD: Mm-hmm.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, so he's showing up to -- he's probably going to go find poor -- some unfortunate individual that will take him in.


GUILFOYLE: Because he's got his 15 minutes of fame. And they'll be, like, taking selfies with this guy. And then when that happens and passes over, then I don't know what he's going to do. Probably going to move back in with his parents.

But I mean, what kind of self-respect does he have? Look at these parents. They're so sweet. Look at them.

PERINO: How are you going to get a girl?

GUILFOYLE: Well, this is what I'm saying.

FOWLER: He has a kid.

GUILFOYLE: Well, he got one for a second, I guess. Yes. I mean, you know.

GUTFELD: You know what the solution is, Richard.

GUILFOYLE: Transacted for a moment.

GUTFELD: Is you just move in and become somebody's butler. Just become a butler. But a really bad one, a really lazy butler.

GUILFOYLE: Like a house --

GUTFELD: Or a lazy Susan.

GUILFOYLE: Or like a Kato Kaelin.

FOWLER: My only problem with this is that I think this word -- the word "millennial" in the screen behind me. Because all millennials --

PERINO: It's bothering you?

FOWLER: It is.

PERINO: You feel it's, like, speaking to you?

FOWLER: No, because millennials --

GUTFELD: It's true.

FOWLER: I packed up and I went to college at 18. And I was like, "Mom, I'm never coming back home."

She's like, "You can always come home."

And I'm like, "No, I'm going to get a job and I'm going to work." And that's what all my friends did. And we're all doing great, and we're all millennials. And there's tons of millennials that work at this fine organization.

PERINO: I love millennials.

FOWLER: And they work, and they have their own apartments. And they don't live at home with their parents, and they pay rent.

GUILFOYLE: There you go.

GUTFELD: I want to hear from him. This is on an --

GUILFOYLE: Oh, yes. Hear his voice.

GUTFELD: This is on an earlier show, on a network -- I can't think of the name of it.

PERINO: OK, fine.

GUTFELD: Starts with "C."


BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Do you not want to find your own place?


BALDWIN: Why not?

ROTONDO: I don't want to live there anymore. I -- I --

BALDWIN: You don't want to live with your parents?

ROTONDO: I don't like living -- no.

BALDWIN: Why don't you just move out of your parents' house, like tomorrow?

ROTONDO: I don't have the means to do that tomorrow. So --

BALDWIN: OK. Do you have a job?


BALDWIN: Then we wish we could -- take a sip of your water.

Don't you want to reconcile with them?



GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

FOWLER: Oh, boy.

GUILFOYLE: He needs immediate help.

PERINO: I kind of feel bad.

GUTFELD: Yes, do you feel bad for him? Do you think he might be --

PERINO: I feel bad for everybody.

GUTFELD: Yes, you do. But then he's doing the TV. And he could have moved out. So it's like, how bad do you --

PERINO: I think that the lure of being on TV, like you think, "I'll go on TV, and I'll tell my story." But you're not necessarily -- not everybody can talk when they get in front of a camera. He seemed, like, a little camera shy. I'm sure Martha MacCallum will be able to --


PERINO: -- pull a little more out of him.

GUILFOYLE: Hopefully, he's warmed up for Martha.

HEGSETH: He's just so bad at being a deadbeat. You want to stay at your parents' house forever?

GUILFOYLE: How do you do it, Pete?

HEGSETH: You can probably figure it out.

FOWLER: Tell us, Pete. How do you be a good deadbeat?

HEGSETH: Have a little side job, you know?

GUTFELD: Side job.

HEGSETH: Make them dinner once in a while.

GUTFELD: Do some chores.

PERINO: Do the -- do the dishes.

HEGSETH: Do a couple chores. You don't really want to do it --


HEGSETH: -- but you do it. And then they give you another year.

GUTFELD: Yes, yes.

HEGSETH: Instead he's like, "I will do nothing."

GUTFELD: Yes, yes, yes.

HEGSETH: "And you will have to evict me."


PERINO: That's a weird thing, having to go to court.

GUTFELD: They tried to evict him.

GUILFOYLE: Why don't they -- why didn't they call the cops? That's what I would do.

FOWLER: As a parent --

PERINO: If Ronan comes home, you're -- it's going to be open arms.

GUTFELD: Could it be that --

GUILFOYLE: I called the police when Six (ph) came over. It was amazing.

GUTFELD: I'm going to defend him and say that, because we're living longer, 31 is the new 13.

PERINO: I agree. No, that's what they think.

FOWLER: Whoa. I'm 31, and I'm not 13 years old.

GUTFELD: Well, I beg to differ. No. No, no, no.

GUILFOYLE: Now everyone's very worried.

GUTFELD: No, in the sense that, you know, you're living longer. You can stay longer at home.

PERINO: No, but that was a good point. So, like, what is the acceptable age? So let's just say it's 25.


PERINO: If we say that kids should be on their parent's health insurance until 25. I don't say that, but the law says that. Whatever.

FOWLER: Twenty-six.

PERINO: Twenty-six. So 30. Yes, maybe you're right with -- if you do, you know, age.

GUTFELD: I'm for close families, you know, multigenerational families. All right, OK, they're telling me to shut up.

GUILFOYLE: Wow, geez.

GUTFELD: Did you hear that?


GUTFELD: I can --

PERINO: No, but I can feel it.

GUTFELD: I was getting a shock in the ear.

GUILFOYLE: I heard it.

GUTFELD: I know.

Amazon users up in arms over a new policy. If you are a serial returner, you'll want to listen up.



FOWLER: Who here on set is guilty of this? Amazon cracking down on shoppers who return items too frequently, and in some cases, they're outright banning their worst offenders.


FOWLER: A spokesperson for the online retailer confirms closing the accounts of users who abuse their 30-day return policy, but they won't specify just how many accounts they've closed.

Kimberly, wow.

GUILFOYLE: Wow. Listen, they ain't closing mine down, because it is a constant stream. It's like 30 items in the last hour. Amazon Prime, word.

FOWLER: She was at work, so it wasn't her.

GUILFOYLE: Wasn't me. Wasn't me. They don't take that excuse. I have a reasonable return. It wasn't me. Yes, it doesn't work.

But I know. I really don't return, because it's just so much effort.

PERINO: It's a hassle. And you need a Peter to help you return it.

GUILFOYLE (in British accent): That's the thing. Where can I get my Peter? Peter, Peter, wherefore art thou? Peter? Yes.

PERINO: I noticed this story this morning, because it was the No. 1 story trending on The Wall Street Journal for, like, two days. And so I thought, what a first world problem to have --


PERINO: -- that you are so worried that you find out that "Am I going to get banned from Amazon for returning too much?" I don't think I will. I don't think I will.

FOWLER: How often do you return, Dana?

PERINO: I don't return all too much from Amazon, I don't think.

GUILFOYLE: I think she has some low-level anxiety about it.

FOWLER: Yes, she does. She's afraid she's going to be banned.

PERINO: I don't know what the metrics are.

GUILFOYLE: I'm not banned, for sure.

GUTFELD: I only return things that don't feel right when I use them, like underwear and toothbrushes.


GUTFELD: So I box them up, and I send them back with my own -- I have my own cellophane machine.

HEGSETH: Deodorant, too?

GUTFELD: Deodorant, as well.

I think the percentage of returns has to be large compared to purchases. So if you're a constant -- then that's it.

I predict that there will be a new service that returns things for you, because we are now just a service culture. I have -- I have Seamless to deliver my food. I actually have another service that eats the food. I can't be bothered.

FOWLER: So Greg, you should copyright that, like today.


PERINO: But there is one. It's called TaskRabbit.

GUTFELD: "iReturn."


FOWLER: It returns your items for you?

PERINO: Well, yes.

GUILFOYLE: They do, like, tasks.

PERINO: Tasks. If you do, like, "Hey, can you help return this for me?" And then they come and do it for you. But you have to pay.

GUTFELD: There's a bunch of animals.

HEGSETH: I just don't understand it. Is there a lot of money to be made in this industry of ordering and sending back? Otherwise --

PERINO: Hey, that's what the guy with no job in the previous block, that's what he could do.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, I think he might do that.

PERINO: I like this idea.

GUILFOYLE: But they don't want to say how many people that are doing this, because it would be bad for their numbers. And you know, if you believe this. "Whoa, Amazon's suffering."

HEGSETH: The returns can be as high as 15 to 30 percent of purchases. That's unbelievable to me.

PERINO: Yes, because sometimes they send stuff that's broken. That has happened.

GUILFOYLE: They do some time send stuff that's messed up. Like, I ordered Ronan a T-shirt. Like, little size medium boys' under T-shirts. And big boys' ones came.

GUTFELD: You don't have to return it. I'm right here.

GUILFOYLE: No, it would have been extra small for you. Yes.

FOWLER: Listen, I just think --

GUTFELD: That's what I wear.

FOWLER: I think Amazon should just warn people before they close. Like, right now they're not warning people. Like, warn me before you close my account.

HEGSETH: You know you're an abuser.

PERINO: That's why it's the No. 1 story on Wall Street Journal.

FOWLER: That's why Dana's nervous. It think she knows she's a return abuser.

GUILFOYLE: We're going to check with Peter.

FOWLER: We have to check on this one. Anyway, "One More Thing" is up next. Don't go anywhere.


GUILFOYLE: Well, it's time now for "One More Thing." Dana, what do you have?

PERINO: Well, it's been a show, hasn't it?


PERINO: Top it off with this. Dan Crenshaw, 33 years old, former Navy SEAL, won the Republican primary runoff election in Texas 2nd Congressional District on Tuesday night. Although Crenshaw won in a landslide on Tuesday, Republican operatives following the race thought he did not have a chance.

He's one of the guys that actually ran in his district. I don't know if you remember that when I did that as a "One More Thing." These are all the people that he beat. He is going to win, I think. And it's pretty amazing. So congratulations to another veteran who is on his way to being a member of Congress.

GUILFOYLE: All right, fantastic. Great story.

And also, following in the serving our country footsteps, Dana, a set of quadruplets -- maybe you guys saw this story -- in Michigan are now sharing another bond. And if you can believe it, they have all decided to enlist in the military after graduation. Bryce, Rose, Mason and Nevin Lees of Michigan are joining four different branches.


GUILFOYLE: The high school seniors choosing Navy, Air Force, Air National Guard and Marines. Siblings and their grandfather and brother-in-law inspired them to serve. And the sister, Rose, saying, quote, "Ever since I was little, I've always wanted to serve. I just want to help out our world."


GUILFOYLE: Now can you imagine the juxtaposition of these four amazing siblings and the low life that's, like, sitting there, scamming off his parents?

HEGSETH: The 30-year-old? Yes.

GUILFOYLE: I can't. Yes. Anyway.

HEGSETH: Very cool.


GUTFELD: All right. My podcast. You can go to It's with Dr. Drew. We talk about mental health issues. We talk about violence, and we talk about the opioid crisis. It's actually really entertaining but with a lot of serious stuff. And I ain't kidding around, so check it out. And I also just tweeted it, so you can find it there.

Meanwhile, it's time for --


GRAPHIC: Greg's Fox News.


GUTFELD: "Greg's Fox News." A lot of news in the fox universe. This is upsetting what has happened to fox right now. What is being done to fox is wrong. Take a look at this.

PERINO: What is this?




GUTFELD: Here's a fox that had just gotten a rabbit. He got his meal. Right? That's his meal. He deserves that. He spent all day getting that.

And then the an eagle comes and says, "No, I want the rabbit." And the fox has to fight for the rabbit. The eagle doesn't care. And of course, the eagle lost the meal.

So you don't mess with FOX. It's the bottom line. OK?

PERINO: We always win.

GUTFELD: Do not mess with FOX. We will take hold of the bunny, and we won't let go because we're animals. We're animals.

GUILFOYLE: Are you sending a message? Are you sending a message to Brian Stelter?

GUTFELD: Yes. Yes, the nation's hall monitor. Watch out.

GUILFOYLE: I just hope that Dr. Drew helped you out.

GUTFELD: I'm hopeless.


HEGSETH: You're right. You don't mess with FOX. I also -- it's an unwritten rule, I don't mess with Brian Kilmeade. I do whatever he tells me to do. Turns out today he was out on Long Island for the president's speech.


HEGSETH: He got an excessive interview with President Trump behind the scenes.

GUTFELD: That must have been tough for him.

HEGSETH: Don't -- you know what? Don't hate. He's working hard for that.

GUTFELD: I love Kilmeade.


GUILFOYLE: -- playing the game.

HEGSETH: You got it. Tune in tomorrow morning on "FOX & Friends." Reaction on North Korea, reaction on MS-13. But also, he's chiming in for the first time on the kneeling decision for the NFL. The president's central on that. They've got some big comments you're not going to want to miss.

Brian Kilmeade worked extremely hard for that interview. I take offense.

GUTFELD: I know. I know you've got to defend Brian but, you know, I don't have to defend him.

GUILFOYLE: It would be odd if you did.

GUTFELD: He was here yesterday. Was he here yesterday? Yes. Yes, that's enough.


FOWLER: I'll hold my breath for the new comment --

GUTFELD: I love Kilmeade. I love him, because I love to make fun of him.

GUILFOYLE: All right.

GUTFELD: Him and his hair.

FOWLER: Just when you thought the royal wedding was over, me and Kimberly are still talking about it here on "The Five."


FOWLER: And this time, instead of letting their beautiful bouquets go to waste, Prince Harry and Princess Meghan Markle put their floral arrangements to good use. After the royal wedding at Windsor Castle on Saturday, the nuptials, they donated the flowers to St. Joseph's Hospice in London.

PERINO: That's nice.

FOWLER: And this is beautiful. Beautiful woman holding these flowers. And the hospice tweeted the following: "Today we got a very special delivery. Beautiful bouquets from the" -- hashtag -- "#royalwedding flowers, which was given to our patients. Our hospice smells gorgeous and looks gorgeous, too. Such a lovely gesture." And we agree.


FOWLER: Me and Kimberly should have been there.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, darling. The royal -- We were texting during the wedding.

FOWLER: We were. We were texting.

PERINO: The best thing I saw today was the bad lip-synching from the wedding. Have you seen that on Twitter? It's very funny.

GUILFOYLE: I saw some good singing when it was --

FOWLER: That choir. That choir was epic.

HEGSETH: How many days ago was that?

GUILFOYLE: All right. We've got to run.

FOWLER: It's still a big deal.

HEGSETH: The flowers are still alive?

GUILFOYLE: Guys, please. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of the nuts over here. That means "The Five." "Special Report" up next. Hey, Bret in Los Angeles.

PERINO: Hey, why did you give him 12 extra seconds?

GUILFOYLE: Well, because he's Bret Baier.

BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS: Thank you very much. And early nonetheless. You gave me 7 seconds. Thank you very much.

GUILFOYLE: I think they're better spent with you.

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