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Texas sheriff: Biden's 'destructive' border policies caused migrant surge

Jackson County sheriff AJ Louderback discusses the immigration crisis on 'Your World'

This is a rush transcript from "Your World with Neil Cavuto," May 10, 2021. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

CHARLES PAYNE, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: To the scramble to get a major U.S. pipeline back online after a massive hack attack, why this is quickly becoming a real pain in the gas for drivers.

Hello, everyone. I'm Charles Payne in for Neil Cavuto, and this is YOUR WORLD.

And if you weren't already feeling pressure at the pump, AAA warning of coming price spikes coming because of this Colonial Pipeline shutdown, this coming after its systems were taken down by a cyberattack. We will get into the FBI probe on who's behind all of this and what the White House is saying about this in just a moment.

But, first, to FOX Business Network's Grady Trimble in Chicago with the very latest -- Grady.

GRADY TRIMBLE, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Charles, the FBI and other federal authorities are pinning this attack, at least in part, on the cyber crime gang DarkSide, possibly operating out of Russia.

For now, Colonial Pipeline is bring back parts of the pipeline, but most of it remains offline.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELIZABETH SHERWOOD-RANDALL, WHITE HOUSE HOMELAND SECURITY ADVISER: And our role in the federal government is to take proactive steps to analyze the impacts of the shutdown on the delivery of gasoline, diesel and aviation fuel in states that are dependent on the pipeline, and to identify federal options for alleviating supply shortfalls should they develop.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TRIMBLE: This afternoon, Colonial Pipeline issued a statement saying it's planning a phased return to service of that pipeline.

It added in the statement that: "The plan is based on a number of factors, with safety and compliance driving our operational decisions, and the goal of substantially restoring operational service by the end of the week."

The impact that it has on your wallet and at the pump will depend on whether the company can meet that goal. AAA says you will notice the biggest impact in areas the pipeline directly services, like Mississippi, Tennessee and the East Coast of Georgia into Delaware. Expect to see an increase of 3 to 7 cents per gallon in those areas this week, according to AAA.

This comes as gas prices across the country are already rising. The national average jumped 7 cents this week to $2.97. If that increases just another few cents, the national average will be the most expensive it's been since November of 2014.

And all of this, Charles, couldn't have come at a worse time, as millions of Americans plan to hit the road for summer vacation. That could explain why oil prices remained relatively flat today, even though this ransomware attack has tied up much of the East Coast's fuel supply -- Charles.

PAYNE: Grady, thank you very much.

So, with gas prices already speeding toward $3 a gallon, the last thing we need is a major supply glitch at the pump. My next guest says things could get bad for drivers.

Amy Myers Jaffe is an energy research professor at Tufts University and joins us now.

Amy, we were already on the verge of something that was going to be big. It looked like it was going to be big. So how much worse can it get?

AMY MYERS JAFFE, TUFTS UNIVERSITY: Well, hopefully, they're going to get the pipeline back in operation. Just a couple days hopefully will not be that big an impact, because this time of year, many companies hold extra inventory getting prepared for Memorial Day.

So, fingers crossed that this doesn't turn into a bigger problem and that Colonial is able to restore service. But it is absolutely a warning sign that we need to be taking cyber more seriously along our energy infrastructure.

PAYNE: Yes.

And, OK, let's go down this path, because every time one of these attacks happens, I think the average person's like, how the heck could you not be aware that you would be a major target? And it's frightening for everyone involved. And now we all have to pay the consequence of this.

And private business blames government. Government blames private business. I mean, what does the industry have to do to protect itself and ultimately protect the consumer?

MYERS JAFFE: Well, this hat came on the business side of the pipeline company. So, one needs to be at least comforted by the fact that it doesn't appear to have gotten to the operational safety system, which would be a real horror.

But the company needs to look at their authentication systems and other ways that I someone can pierce their computer systems. They need to look at their firewalls again for all their operational systems. And companies today, these things should be elevated to the board of directors, where we're having full oversight, making sure that we have the top technology in place to prevent these kinds of invasions.

PAYNE: Yes, I agree with you 100 percent.

Thank you so much. We appreciate it, Amy.

Meanwhile, whomever is behind the attack, the Department of Justice saying their level of sophistication is -- quote -- "very high." The FBI saying a cyber-gang called DarkSide was used in the hack. And the White House getting questions today if another country might actually be responsible for this.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So far, there is no evidence, based on from our intelligence people, that Russia is involved, although there is evidence that the actor's ransomware is in Russia. They have some responsibility to deal with this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAYNE: All right, I want to get the read on the investigation from former FBI Assistant Director Chris Swecker.

Chris, when you read the statement from DarkSide, and from what we know so far, this certainly is an op -- feels like an operation either in Russia or one of the former Soviet countries. What can you tell us?

CHRIS SWECKER, FORMER FBI ASSISTANT DIRECTOR: Hi, Charles.

Yes, these attacks almost always come out of one of the former Soviet satellite countries or the -- Russia itself. At the very least, these criminal organizations are enabled by the Russian government, or they're supported by them.

And when I say enabled, I mean that the Russian government allows them to operate with total impunity. They don't do anything to stop them. And they often recruit them to do state-sponsored exploits when they need it done. So it's either state sponsored or it's enabled.

PAYNE: We just had an oil expert saying, thank God this was on the business side of the cybersecurity system of the company, and not on the operational side.

Is there any evidence or is there some -- are these also being used as some sort of a dry run perhaps? Could it be Russia, China, certainly North Korea, Iran? Because their targeting would be something different. And it feels like whatever it is, after two decades of complaining about this, it feels like we're more vulnerable now than ever before.

SWECKER: That's a great point, Charles.

I have been in the private security field as well. And it's very hard to get investments in cybersecurity or even physical security, which protects the cybersecurity side of things, unless you have a major problem. And CEOs need to get on the ball. Boards need to get on the ball.

In our critical infrastructures, I believe -- and I think this is supported by the intelligence -- that hostile foreign -- foreign governments try to embed themselves in our systems and wait for a strategic time to hit. So that means our financial infrastructure, our transportation infrastructure, the power grid, you name it.

All of our critical infrastructures are targets of hostile foreign governments. And, sometimes, they do use the surrogate. So this could be a dry run. I suspect, however, when you hear that DarkSide is the perpetrator here, that this was more for profit. This is a group that's enabled by the Russian government, but they don't always -- they're not always behind the exploit.

PAYNE: Right.

In the most recent infrastructure bill, I did not recall seeing a lot of money being put toward this sort of cybersecurity, a 100-year-old system. Everybody understands just how -- how vulnerable it perhaps it could be.

SWECKER: Right.

PAYNE: What role does the federal government play into all of this? Because all we ever get when these are happening are sort of finger- pointings, where the private sector blames government and vice versa.

Today, the Biden administration saying, hey, don't pay the ransom, and, also, of course, beef up your systems. But is there an overarching sort of obligation by the federal government to play a better -- a bigger role?

SWECKER: There is. And they have tried on several different occasions.

And they're trying now, based on an 82-page report that came out between -- a collaboration between private industry and government studying the issue. The problem is that industry doesn't like to have anything imposed on them, the private industry.

And there's a problem with reporting. It's hard to get a sense of the scope of the problem and all the intelligence that you need if businesses won't report it where it needs to be reported to the FBI or other agencies that handle this, the U.S. Secret Service.

PAYNE: Right.

SWECKER: So, it's hard. You have got to get a handle on it from a reporting aspect. And there has to be a uniform policy, I think, on whether you pay the ransomware...

PAYNE: Right.

SWECKER: ... because that incentivizes more exploits, et cetera.

That's the conundrum here. And then, of course, the payment goes to a criminal organization, which is against our anti-money laundering laws.

PAYNE: Yes.

And, of course, we know companies are paying this all the time. And, to your point, we never even hear about it. But -- and it's interesting, because it's not always damaging, outside of reputation and that kind of thing, but it's enough to keep this, make this a thriving industry.

Thank you so much, Chris. Appreciate it.

SWECKER: Thanks, Charles.

PAYNE: Well, the Biden administration trying to do damage control as employers try to hire, but they can't. Are changes to those extended benefits many businesses are blaming on the way?

And more migrants on way, by the way, crossing caught -- crossings are caught live on camera throughout the past three days right here on FOX, all as the White House says that the border is closed.

Let me ask you, does this look closed to you?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAYNE: Well, the White House today digging in, denying those extra jobless benefits are hurting the work force, despite business owners who insist that they are.

Later this hour, we will talk with a congressman with a plan to attack this crisis, but first to Peter Doocy at the White House with the latest -- Peter.

PETER DOOCY, FOX NEWS WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Charles, good afternoon.

As some employers go public with complaints they can't find people to fill open positions right now, the president is reminding Americans collecting unemployment they have got to accept a suitable job offer.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: It's easy to say -- the line has been because of the generous unemployment benefits, that it's a major factor in labor shortages. Americans want to work.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOOCY: But some red state governors in places like Montana and South Carolina are rolling back certain benefits to try to encourage their residents to go back to work.

At issue is that $300 a week in pandemic era boosted unemployment benefits. The U.S. Chamber of Commerce claims those benefits mean one in four Americans collecting unemployment actually make more not working and staying home instead.

So we asked the administration about that at today's briefing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DOOCY: Is the White House creating an incentive just to stay home?

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The majority of economists internally and externally of the White House don't feel that unemployment insurance, something that was done at a time where -- to help unemployed people get through a very difficult economic downturn during a pandemic, is a major driver in our unemployment data.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DOOCY: The president is going to host a bipartisan meeting of governors here at the White House tomorrow virtually, so that may be his next best chance to hear from state level leaders about why they think millions of jobs are not being filled right now -- Charles.

PAYNE: Peter, thank you very much.

Now, this as Vermont independent Senator Bernie Sanders tweeting -- quote - - "We don't need to end $300 a week in emergency unemployment benefits that workers desperately need. We need to end starvation wages in America. If $300 a week is preventing employers from hiring low-wage workers, there's a simple solution. Raise your wages, pay decent benefits" -- end quote.

Well, what do business owners make of that? And that -- my next guest is saying, not so fast.

Veneto Wood Fired Pizza & Pasta owner Donald Swartz is with us.

And, by the way, we did call Senator Sanders' office for an interview. We are still waiting to hear back from him.

Donald, we are really thrilled that you decided to join us.

Just give us your own experience with how this is shaking out with respect to -- you -- I assume you have job openings. Are you able to fill them?

DONALD SWARTZ, OWNER, VENETO WOOD FIRED PIZZA & PASTA: It's very difficult to fill the job positions right now.

We're post-pandemic. We would just ask our servers, everybody in the restaurant industry knows someone, and you fill a spot, a waiter spot, a busboy spot, kitchen staff. But it's been very difficult to fill positions at this point.

We were searching for a position for three weeks, and finally found someone. And we were lucky we grabbed that person up.

PAYNE: You know, Donald, I'm looking at a list of what states pay each week.

And Bernie Sanders was disingenuous with that tweet, because it's not just 300 bucks. It's $300-plus.

So, a state like New Jersey would be $300 plus $700; $1,000 is a lot to compete with, particularly for a small business. We're even seeing large businesses complain. Do you think you may find yourself having to either raise wages or even offer some sort of a bonus?

SWARTZ: You know, in a perfect world -- my employees are worth gold. In a perfect world, I'd be able to pay them more.

But basic -- basic economics, how much are you going to come in and want to spend in my restaurant for a simple dish of pasta or pizza, or the people that are delivering the products to the restaurant? So, it's a difficult balance as to how we're able to charge -- how much we're able to charge?

One solution from the federal government and/or here in the state of New York is, let's cut some of the taxes that are taken out every single week on the paychecks. Let the -- let the employers keep some of that -- employees.

PAYNE: Well, obviously, that's not going to happen, particularly in New York.

In fact, we're looking at the federal government ready to level taxes much higher. And I have argued on behalf of small businesses, particularly folks like you, that it's -- they're not going to get Jeff Bezos. They may advertise that this is going after Jeff Bezos and Amazon, but they're going to hurt someone like you and the people who work for you and your customers.

To me, it seems like a lose-lose-lose proposition, Donald.

SWARTZ: Absolutely, not only the customers, my suppliers. The cost of chicken is going up. The cost of wine is going up. It affects all the way down the line.

Lucky, we here in downtown Rochester, we have a beautiful downtown farm market. We can go down there and buy some supplies. Some fresh produce is right at the market. But even the prices there going right and dealing one- on-one with a farmer are starting to go up, because their costs are also going up.

So you're absolutely correct.

PAYNE: Yes.

SWARTZ: It's an unfortunate lose-lose situation.

PAYNE: Between the money the federal government's poured into the economy, the Federal Reserve, we never, never in the history of mankind have seen trillions of dollars pour into an economy.

And everything is going up. I mean, you are getting squeezed like crazy. But I want to ask about the workers, because I have a lot of concern about these people who are waiting at home, maybe for the perfect job, maybe for the extra money to run out. They don't realize that their skill sets are starting to erode, that their desirability will be gone once this thing turns around.

What do you say to workers out there who may not realize that they're actually not doing themselves a favor?

SWARTZ: It's tough. What can you say?

I think we're lucky here. We got back from the pandemic. And we were open, we were closed, we were redlined. And most of my employees came back. They wanted to work. They didn't want to sit home.

PAYNE: Sure.

SWARTZ: So, I think, in regards, we were lucky that that was able to work out for us.

The ones that don't want to work or want to stay home or continuously watch to collect it, I don't know what to say. Maybe that's not -- maybe that's not the employee that you want working for you.

PAYNE: That's another great point, although you need the workers now, when you get the demand, particularly after what you have gone through.

Well, you're a survivor. You have got a beautiful looking restaurant. And we will check in again with you maybe in a month or two just to see how things are going.

Thank you so much, Donald.

SWARTZ: Thanks for having us on.

PAYNE: Well, later in the hour, we're going to talk to a Republican congressman with a plan to end this crisis.

But, first, and after a failed test post-Derby, will Medina Spirit's enter into the Preakness now be denied? That decision is nearing. Plus, what's happening to all of those bets?

We're on it.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAYNE: Will a failed drug test disqualify Medina Spirit from the Preakness this weekend? Well, all bets are off.

And the head of a major teachers union now saying schools can fully reopen. What took so long?

We're back in 60 seconds.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAYNE: Hold your horses.

Will Kentucky Derby winner Medina Spirit be able to run in the Preakness Saturday, this after failing a post-race drug test?

FOX News' Aishah Hasnie is following all the developments in Elmont, New York -- Aishah.

AISHAH HASNIE, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Hey, good afternoon to you, Charles.

Yes, that's a great question. And that is the question of the hour right now. Basically, the Triple Crown races, the two remaining races are really up in the air when it comes to this horse. Bob Baffert still plans on racing Medina Spirit at the Preakness Stakes this weekend.

But if he is denied entry, Charles, then his lawyer says that they are ready to go with a temporary restraining order. Now, as you know, Medina Spirit tested positive for anti -- an antiinflammatory steroid called betamethasone.

According to Churchill Downs, there will be a second test, what's called a split sample. But Baffert has now been suspended from entering any horse at that particular track.

Now, Baffert announced this morning on "America's Newsroom" that he is hiring his own investigators. He's doing DNA testing to find out if this was a false positive or if the horse was somehow contaminated another way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BOB BAFFERT, HORSE TRAINER: He went from the Derby -- after the Derby, everybody's up there touching -- I mean, there's so many ways these horses could get contaminated, and when they're testing at these really ridiculously low levels.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HASNIE: Now, if Medina Spirit is disqualified, the horse will be stripped of its Derby title and that $1.86 million purse.

No decision yet coming from the Preakness Stakes. They say they are reviewing the facts. And, by the way, Charles, they have delayed, what is it called, the draw, basically where the horses are assigned their placement. They have delayed that now to tomorrow afternoon about 4:00.

So we may have a decision before then -- Charles.

PAYNE: Wow. It's going to be coming fast and furious, no pun intended, Aishah. Thank you.

Well, Medina Spirit is still set to run in the Preakness at Pimlico Race Course on Saturday. Churchill Downs has already suspended trainer Bobby Baffert, as you just heard, following that failed drug test.

Now, the Maryland Jockey Club said in statement -- quote -- "We are consulting with the Maryland Racing Commission and any decision regarding the entry of Medina Spirit into 146 Preakness stakes will be made after review of the facts."

Want to bring a FOX News Headlines 24/7's Jared Max to help us in this discussion.

First of all, Jared, your initial reaction. I got to be honest with you, I'm not a horse racing person. But I love the Kentucky Derby. I love the Triple Crown. And I love this story, a $1,000 yearling and just one of the great upsets. Your thoughts?

JARED MAX, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: The fact that, yes, Charles, only $1,000 yearling lets you know it's almost you can do $1 and a dream.

Good afternoon.

This is the biggest horse race in America, the biggest horse race in the world, involving a sport that really has been fighting for survival for some time now. So, to have the most recognizable person in the sport, and now seven-time Kentucky Derby-winning trainer Bob Baffert, have a horse beat test positive for drugs for a banned supplement that you're not allowed to use, a steroid, no, it doesn't look good.

When you look back, in November of 2020, a New York Times article stated that Bob Baffert has had 29 different failed drug tests over the years of different horses. It doesn't look good.

The odds that somehow that there was contamination and that's why this horse tested positive, do you want to believe it? It doesn't look good for horse racing right now. We will see what happens with this next sample.

PAYNE: Right.

MAX: But then, if you're a better, boy, did you lose on this one, because how can you trust the sport? If you bet Medina Spirit, you already cashed your ticket.

But if it comes down that Medina Spirit is disqualified, well, then, Mandaloun, let's say you bet him and you made a lot of -- put a lot of money on that bet. You're stuck out of luck, my friend.

PAYNE: So, Jared, I know Baffert has something of a -- some of these issues have come up in the past.

But let's point out that he's won at least 3,120 times. He was inducted into the Hall of Fame way back in 2009.

MAX: Sure. year

PAYNE: Three hundred and twenty million in purse wins. He's the only trainer, the second -- only two trainers have won the Triple Crown twice.

So he's been in this a long time. I think, as a percentage of the races he's entered, the amount of times these sort of issues have come out seem infinitesimal to me.

Now, this betamethasone also is legal, but -- this obviously, the initial reports said it was two times the limit. I mean, is -- can we hold out some hope that maybe there was a mistake here and maybe we will get some clarification, a different clarification, once the second tests are run?

MAX: I think -- Charles, I think we need to prepare for, what are potential explanations? Was there actually a shot given that maybe Baffert didn't know about? Was it given at a time before he thought maybe that the drug would still be in the horse's system, if that came to be?

He has all these wins? And, Charles, I have been talking with a lot of people in sports and even in horse racing about this topic. And I keep saying -- bringing up people like Barry Bonds. People say, why would Baffert need to do this?

Well, why did Barry Bonds need to do what he did? Why did Lance Armstrong need to do what he did? And so these are questions and why the biggest race, again, biggest race in the world, the integrity of it comes into question here. That's why we're talking about it.

PAYNE: Yes.

Jared Max, good to see you, my friend. Thank you very much.

MAX: You too, Charles.

PAYNE: Coming up, folks: Remember this?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PSAKI: We have continued to convey the message that our border is not open.

ALEJANDRO MAYORKAS, U.S. SECRETARY OF HOMELAND SECURITY: The border is closed.

KATE BEDINGFIELD, WHITE HOUSE COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: The president has been very clear the border is closed.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAYNE: Well, take a look at this. Does it look closed to you?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAYNE: Well, the Biden administration's continuing to say the Southern border isn't open, but the images coming from Del Rio, Texas, are telling a different story.

The area is experiencing an influx of migrants crossing through the country through the Rio Grande.

Bill Melugin is in Del Rio with the very latest on what he's seeing there.

BILL MELUGIN, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Charles, good afternoon.

I can tell you that from what we have seen on the ground here in Del Rio sector, the border here, it's just not closed. We have seen so much activity here over the last three days. Three days in a row, we have witnessed large groups of migrants cross the Rio Grande directly behind us.

Border Patrol here apprehending more than 700 migrants every single day. And I want to show you what some of that activity looks like, if we can pull up this video. This is from -- this is from this morning directly where we're standing right now on the banks of the Rio Grande.

This was a very large group of migrants, the biggest we have seen so far. It was a group of 52 Venezuelans who decided to cross the Rio Grande and present themselves to law enforcement here in the United States. You're going to see some of them had young children with them, infants.

Some of them were kind of struggling in the water. But this is something we have seen every day, largely with groups of Venezuelans and with groups of Cubans. And many of the folks that we talk to tell us that they're coming here to get away from the governments in their home countries, one man telling us they're from Venezuela, they went into Colombia, they got a flight to Mexico, then they took a bus here and made the crossing.

Now, the problem is, Border Patrol, they can't handle everything. They're completely overwhelmed right now. And take a listen to what one family told us. One man decided to bring his entire family here from Venezuela to find a better life. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RAMON RIMIREZ, CROSSED BORDER: I want security. That's what I want. I want security for my family. I want the security for us.

And I want to have a life.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELUGIN: And many of them getting emotional when we spoke to them just like that.

The video you're looking at now, these are local sheriff's deputies from Val Verde County here in Texas. Border Patrol, they're not the ones who are first processing or sorting through these migrants when they come across. It's these local deputies, because Border Patrol, through no fault of their own, they're just so overwhelmed.

They can't be everywhere at once. These local deputies have to sort through these migrants, then wait for Border Patrol to arrive, which can sometimes take an hour or two. If we can pull up some other video, you will see what happens when Border Patrol does arrive.

They usually show up here with one of their big transport buses. Then they're the ones who do the processing. And they will take them off to the centers, but the local sheriff here very frustrated by this, because he doesn't have a very big sheriff's department and he has to dedicate some of his deputies to sort through these migrants when they when they cross the Rio Grande here.

And those deputies are then not able to respond to local calls for service. Say there's a shooting or a stabbing on the other side of town. They can't respond to it because they're too busy working here. And the sheriff very frustrated by that. And he says D.C. needs to step up and make a change.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE FRANK MARTINEZ, VAL VERDE COUNTY, TEXAS, SHERIFF: It's tying up our resources. It's frustrating because there's no -- no answers that are being given. There's not a -- there's not -- I don't believe that there's a plan in place.

Right now, we need more manpower. We need people in D.C. to make a decision, do it -- do their job.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MELUGIN: And what we have been talking about here, this is just in the Del Rio sector. There are sectors all along the U.S.-Mexico border. And this is happening all over the place.

Take a look. This is drone video from our FOX drone crew down in La Joya, the Rio Grande Valley. This was shot this morning. And this just shows them on horseback apprehending more migrants. So this is happening all over the place, including here in Del Rio, the local sheriff here telling us, in his entire life, he has never seen things get this bad in terms of the immigration picture.

We will send it back to you.

PAYNE: Wow.

Bill, thank you very much.

So what does a Texas sheriff who is dealing with the migrant surge firsthand think of what's happening at the border right now?

Jackson County, Texas, Sheriff A.J. Louderback joins me now.

Sheriff, thanks for joining us.

I mean, just amazing images, particularly for a border that is supposedly closed. Just what do you make of it? And, also, I just got to tell you, when you hear the different countries, Venezuela, Cuba, of course, we have heard people from even outside of the -- this hemisphere coming through the borders -- it just seems like the crisis has gotten worse.

A.J. LOUDERBACK, JACKSON COUNTY, TEXAS, SHERIFF: Thank you for having me on.

And you're exactly right. And Sheriff Joe Frank Martinez was telling you the truth there. And truth is something we need more of about the issue there on the Biden policies that have caused this.

I mean, we have got everything from the Texas National Guard, the fine men and women of the Texas National Guard picking up garbage. We got sheriffs all around -- all around the state. We have got our border sheriffs that are inundated with no resources.

We have got our Texas sheriffs all over. We got law enforcement here in the state of Texas that are having to put up with chases. We have got a public that is scared to death about what is going on. We have children being affected by this. We have got car crashes. We have got bailouts that are going on here all over the state of Texas and extending into other states.

So, these issues are real. They're happening every day here in Texas and across this nation from these policies.

PAYNE: Sheriff, I was struck by the group of 52 Venezuelans who presented themselves to law enforcement.

When you speak with these migrants, are they telling you they feel like they have been -- I don't want to use the word lured here, but that they feel like, hey, this administration has sent out a siren call, and that they feel like all they have to do is make the journey, present themselves and they're good to go?

LOUDERBACK: Well, absolutely, this is true.

This is the message that was sent out after January the 20th with a change in policies. This is exactly what has happened. This was all planned. This was all put in place, the executive orders, the policy changes affecting ICE's ability to deport, CBP's ability to stop the eradication of the migrant protection protocols.

All of these things are policies that were put in place by this administration that -- destructive policies here that are affecting Texan lives here and American lives here in the United States.

PAYNE: Sheriff, I can feel your exhaustion and your aspiration.

We do say thank you for your service. And we will check in on you again real soon. Thank you very much, sir.

LOUDERBACK: Well, thank you. Thanks for having me. Thanks for listening about it.

PAYNE: So, here's the question, folks.

If extended jobless benefits are keeping people on home, I want you to meet, actually, the congressman who says, we don't need to keep them -- keep this going. We can change it.

Also, the head of the nation's largest teachers union defending the -- quote -- "go slow" approach on school reopenings. So is that the biggest holdup to this job market recovering?

We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAYNE: With employers struggling to find workers, and on the heels of that sharp miss in the April jobs report, my next guest is introducing a bill to cut extended federal unemployment benefits.

Georgia Republican Congressman Barry Loudermilk joins us now.

Congressman, tell us about your bill.

REP. BARRY LOUDERMILK (R-GA): Well, Charles, this is simple.

It's insanity that the government is paying people to be idle, instead of taking the millions of jobs that are available right now. I spent the last two weeks really integrating in the community, even working side by side with some folks in the construction industry.

And they are desperate to get people, not only to work for them, but to work for the suppliers. I mean, look at lumber prices, 200 percent higher than they were this time last year. And a lot of that is attributed just to supply chain issue of getting products to people.

And for the government to actually pay people more to stay at home than employers can afford to pay them to come to work is insanity. And how does a business compete with the big government like that? We can't.

PAYNE: And here's the thing, though. The federal government, President Biden in a jam.

On one hand, he's trying to take credit for the most jobs created in the first 60 days of an administration, even though very few of his policies, certainly his tax policies, haven't kicked in. But, on the other, he needs this urgency, he needs to sell the notion of fear, because he's got another $4 trillion in federal spending on the drawing board.

So, I mean, they're walking this line, this thin line. And, in doing so, they keep disrespecting businesses, particularly small businesses, that are saying, you're destroying us. They are not -- they're completely ignoring them.

I mean, what do you say to your Democratic colleagues about this?

LOUDERMILK: Well, I'm actually hearing this from some Democrats back home who are small business owners that they get to stop this insanity.

Look, they want to do this multiple-trillion-dollar job stimulus package. We don't need that job stimulus, other than just the federal government to get out of the way and get people back to work.

And it's not just the business owners. I talked to one guy in the construction industry who is very frustrated because he gets up before dawn, and so he can be at the job site by sunup, works until sundown, and then goes to another project their company has to work in the evening.

And when he does get to come home, he sees his neighbor two doors down sitting on the front porch drinking coffee because he knows that he doesn't have to go back to work yet because the federal government will continue to pay him to stay at home.

PAYNE: Right.

LOUDERMILK: It's frustrating to the worker as well.

PAYNE: Yes. Yes.

Wait until they get together over the weekend to play video games and you see sharp his neighbor's skills have gotten.

(LAUGHTER)

PAYNE: Hey, before I let you go, you mentioned reopening the economy; 165,000 women had to leave the labor force last month.

And I'm sure most of that's tied to the fact that these schools would not be reopened in these blue states, again, an avoidable mistake. Can we get this -- do you think we're finally going to get past that hurdle?

LOUDERMILK: Well, I sure hope so, if we can let the local school administrators to do what they -- I think what they feel is the right thing is get kids back in the classroom.

I mean, this is so important. Look, we can do it safely. We have proven it. Look at Georgia. We opened up back in May a year ago and started rolling things back out. We opened the schools again fully this year.

Everything is OK. It's time to get over the fear. It's time to get back to work and let Americans do the hard work that has made this country the -- what it is now.

PAYNE: Yes.

LOUDERMILK: But to get the Democrats to give up a big government program, well, you have to pry it from their cold, dead fingers, as they talk about our Bibles and our guns, right?

(LAUGHTER)

PAYNE: Well, yes.

Well, congratulations on your bill. Let's see how far it gets. Certainly, it's needed.

LOUDERMILK: Sure.

PAYNE: Thank you very much, sir.

LOUDERMILK: All right.

PAYNE: And on that topic, folks: Isn't it about time to get the kids back in school full-time? Well, now the head of a major teachers union is actually saying yes.

We will be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARTHA MACCALLUM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Are teachers going to require that all the students are vaccinated? And when is that going to be? Are you going to have everyone back in September, 100 percent in class, five days a week?

RANDI WEINGARTEN, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN FEDERATION OF TEACHERS: I hope so.

MACCALLUM: And will you require that every student who comes into the school is vaccinated?

WEINGARTEN: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PAYNE: That was the American Federation of Teachers president, Randi Weingarten, saying that she hopes kids can get back in the classroom by fall full-time.

And many are wondering if this is one of the primary reasons parents have been held back from the work force full-time.

I want to bring Washington Examiner's Sarah Westwood, Independent Women's Forum's Patrice Onwuka, and Democratic strategist Robert Patillo, joining me now.

Sarah, let me start with you.

And, by the way, we just got word that Randi Weingarten sort of putting a fine point on this, saying, well, we believe that the conditions have changed now, so that everyone can be back in full-time.

The big question is, why did she wait so long? Why now?

SARAH WESTWOOD, THE WASHINGTON EXAMINER: Well, Charles, the teachers unions have really been using the pretext of wanting to get back into classrooms to justify all kinds of demands on schools for months now, many of them that have had no basis in science.

They have been asking for precautions that go above and beyond what the CDC is recommending, asking for more and more funding for the schools, even though rescue packages passed by Congress have provided them that funding.

Now the teachers unions are starting to move closer to allowing the schools to reopen in person. That's partly because public opinion has moved so far for where the teachers unions are. Back last year, when the schools were closed, a lot of parents were sharing the concerns that teachers had about going back into the classroom. We didn't know a lot about how in person learning would contribute to community spread.

PAYNE: Right.

WESTWOOD: But now you're seeing the vast majority of parents eager to get their kids back into classrooms and the teachers unions have, up to and including now, been really out of step with where the public is on this.

PAYNE: And, Patrice, we just saw on Friday where this had an unusually harmful impact, an extraordinarily harmful impact, I will say, on women; 165,000 had to leave the labor force.

PATRICE ONWUKA, INDEPENDENT WOMEN'S FORUM: Yes.

PAYNE: And that was one of the reasons we had such a disastrous job support.

Certainly, these -- the teachers had to know all this time how this was impacting family life, particularly the ability for parents to earn a living.

ONWUKA: They should have, but I don't think that was their primary concern. I mean, I think they have been focused on using the pandemic as an opportunity to get some concessions, to continue to enjoy some of the virtual work and remote work that many other workers naturally enjoy.

It's unfortunate that the teachers unions have held the keys for schools. They have held our children's education's hostage, and now it's the kids who are suffering. And let's not forget, Charles, it's kids, black kids and brown kids, those are the ones who are going to be held back most, who are going to be behind potentially more than a year because of this remote learning.

I don't think it's an indictment on remote learning. But it is -- it does tell us that -- the challenges, that these school systems were just not prepared and just not willing to fully embrace what virtual learning would look like.

PAYNE: Sure. Not everyone is prepared for virtual learning, particularly a single -- a single-parent home, where the mother is doing a multiple of things, and she's not going to be able to teach or help these kids.

Robert, we already know that the wealth -- I mean, the educational achievement gap is wide, particularly in these progressive cities. It's going to be a lot wider. We may see like three or four years.

Should we hold teachers responsible to some degree for this?

ROBERT PATILLO, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Well, it's a governmental response, I think, we're looking at.

This idea that teachers and teachers unions do not want to teach I think is ridiculous. These are people who have dedicated their lives to educating the next generation. However, we do know that there -- it's estimated that between 530 and 710 teachers have died of COVID over the course of the last year.

Many school districts did reopen prior to having the proper personal protective equipment. And even right now, under 60 percent of the American populations actually even has one shot of the vaccination. And a state like Georgia, where I'm at, we're at about a 26 percent vaccination rate.

So it's completely reasonable for teachers unions to want to protect their membership from the risk of dying and try to have a go-it-slow process, where they can ensure that you have the proper vaccination rates, the proper PPE, so they can have a healthy and safe environment.

I don't think any of us want to go to a job that they may end up in us dying. I think it's very important to take the teachers' lives into consideration.

(CROSSTALK)

PAYNE: Go ahead. Go ahead, Patrice. Go ahead.

ONWUKA: Well, I would just -- yes, I would just say no one wants to go to work and potentially lose their life.

And I don't think anyone has made that argument. I do think that there's been a lot of fearmongering, and particularly among teachers and teachers unions, and not based -- that's not science-based, because let's not forget, we have seen private institutions, private schools and public schools in other countries successfully reopen and safely.

And we have learned those lessons. Yet they were not implemented for the beginning of this school year. And it's questionable whether it's going to get into the reopening this fall for full-time, full person -- in person learning.

So, I hesitate when I hear that argument, well, teachers are scared that they're going to die.

PAYNE: Yes.

ONWUKA: I think we have learned quite a lot from the past year.

PAYNE: Yes, it's kind of a specious argument.

(CROSSTALK)

PAYNE: Sarah, I have got less than -- let me bring Sarah in for one second, Robert, because I got just 30 seconds.

I will give her the final word.

But we have seen teachers put their interests before students in contract negotiations, things like that, before. It's not farfetched that they might be looking out for themselves, beyond health.

WESTWOOD: That's right.

And this is an instance where the Biden administration has a lot of influence over these teachers unions. Democrats do have these very strong ties to the teachers unions. And we have seen the Biden administration have no qualms about trying to override state and local leaders when it serves them.

PAYNE: Yes, let's leave it there.

I'm not sure who has the most leverage over who, unions over Biden or Biden over unions.

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