Attendee, attorney sound off about McKinney pool party chaos
New video shows different angle of Texas pool party aftermath on 'Hannity'
This is a rush transcript from "Hannity," June 9, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
SEAN HANNITY, HOST: And welcome to "Hannity." Tonight, the officer seen in this video of the aftermath of the out of control party in McKinney, Texas, has now resigned. Officer Eric Casebolt was on the force for nearly 10 years. And his attorney says that he has received death threats.
This is exactly what some eyewitnesses and protesters were calling for, but a resident of that neighborhood who saw what happened had a much different take. Here's what Benet Embry said last night right here on this program.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BENET EMBRY, MCKINNEY, TEXAS, RESIDENT: Basically, what the situation is, is a pool party gone out of control. There may have been 130 kids there. Only seven of those 130 kids, only seven, caused a whole bunch of confusion and ruined it for everybody.
This is not Ferguson. This is not Baltimore. This is not Trayvon Martin, Michael Brown or Eric Gardner or anything like that.
HANNITY: Let me...
EMBRY: What this is, is an out of control pool party.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: All right, joining me now with reaction, Jahi Bakari. His daughter shot the new video that we just showed you. Also with him is his goddaughter, Ladarienne McKever is with us. And also, she was at the scene. And also with us, the attorney for the family who threw the party. Emmanuel Obi is with us. Thank you all for being here. We really appreciate it.
Let me just start with your daughter took these images. And when I look at this video, and we slow down this video, the police officer did not pull out the gun on this girl in the bikini here. It was two young men. As you can see, they'll come around where the officer is behind him. And it seems that they are provoking him right there. That's the...
(CROSSTALK)
JAHI BAKARI, DAD OF DAUGHTER TOOK VIDEO: Wait a minute. You said he pulled out his gun. Didn't I hear that part?
HANNITY: I see that part. I'm seeing it.
BAKARI: That's enough.
HANNITY: But he didn't...
BAKARI: He didn't point it at the girls, but he pulled out his gun.
HANNITY: Yes, that's -- but he had two guys behind him. Did you not see the two guys go behind him, seemingly provoking him?
BAKARI: No. No, actually, they were in front of him.
(CROSSTALK)
BAKARI: They didn't provoke anything.
HANNITY: All right, look...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: I understand. But for our audience's sake, I think this is really important because if you're asking for somebody's career to be over, I think it's important that we see the facts here.
Now, you can see that the officer is dealing with the young lady on the ground. Now, coming up on the outside of him, other people are in his face. This guy is, like, mocking him. At that moment, he pulled out the gun. It wasn't on the girl. And then he put the gun by his side and he holstered his weapon.
BAKARI: I mean, here's the thing that's bothering me. You keep on saying it wasn't at the girls. We value lives of black boys and black girls. So the thing I'm asking is, what difference does it make if it was pointed at a girl or a boy?
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: I value all life, but I also value the lives of police officers. And when two people behind him are provoking him, he doesn't know what's happening there. He doesn't know if those guys have a weapon.
BAKARI: You just said in his face. He see two guys coming up in his face. Replay that video. You just said it. He saw those guys approaching him.
HANNITY: No, not really.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: If you look at the video, no, he doesn't. What happens is he's trying to do his job, and two people come and they are provoking the officer. That's obvious on the tape. He's dealing with the young girl right now. Here come the two young men. One is doing a little dance, obviously provoking the officer. And at that point, the gun was pulled out. Now, he didn't point it at anybody. He went back to the girl. He holstered his weapon.
(CROSSTALK)
BAKARI: He didn't point it at anybody? (INAUDIBLE) He shouldn't have pulled it out. I don't know what regulation (INAUDIBLE) allows you to pull your weapon out on unarmed children. Let's start with that. That's a child. And I don't care of he was a black officer, a white officer, or purple.
HANNITY: And how does he know...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: How does he know that they're unarmed when he only sees them out of the corner of his eye because they're provoking him?
LADARIENNE MCKEVER, ATTENDED PARTY: We're at a pool party.
HANNITY: But how does he...
MCKEVER: (INAUDIBLE) pool party.
HANNITY: Well, you guys -- but there was a lot of words being exchanged. There was violence happening...
(CROSSTALK)
MCKEVER: But he started barking (ph) the words first.
HANNITY: Wow.
MCKEVER: He started cursing at us first.
HANNITY: He what?
MCKEVER: He started cussing at us first. Yes. He came at us wrong...
HANNITY: Right.
MCKEVER: ... when we were trying to leave the premises before anything happened...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: ... there were kids that were causing trouble because I spoke to a lot of witnesses there, and that there were kids...
(CROSSTALK)
BAKARI: Wait a minute. Time out. Time out. Time out. Time out!
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: You don't want to hear my side. But there were also kids -- according to the people that I have interviewed, there were also kids that wouldn't listen to the officer, weren't leaving the scene and provoking the officer and not listening to the officers.
BAKARI: Sean, can I interrupt for a second? (INAUDIBLE) you did say -- you said that they were not leaving. He was saying, Go, he was saying, Come here, he was saying, Sit down, Don't move, Leave. Come on, now. He was not consistent at all.
HANNITY: Well, what do you want him to say when people aren't listening to him? What do you want him to do?
MCKEVER: Well, no one's going to listen to him if you're calling us (INAUDIBLE) names for no reason.
HANNITY: So -- so all the incidents -- to quote one of the residents, they said -- that actually called the police, he said, Well, you can't judge this whole incident by a seven-minute or -- or -- a seven-minute or a 30-second tape. He said, I saw the whole thing, and I thought the officers acted appropriately.
(CROSSTALK)
MCKEVER: But you haven't seen what happened when he first got there.
BAKARI: That's not a difference of opinion. Let me explain something to you, Sean. I don't care -- if it was a black officer, I would still be just as enraged. The thing that bothers me is, this guy, he literally was out of control. Why isn't that a factor in how you do your job performance? If you were to go to your studio and start slamming on your guests, you should be fired. That's not how you treat people.
HANNITY: OK. Appreciate you both for being here. Thank you for sharing your tape with us. A lot of differences of opinion here, as we showed you last night.
Joining us now is Emmanuel Obi is with us. And Emmanuel, let's get your perspective on this. Seems like a very, very difficult situation. Cops are often put in difficult situations. What about those two boys that seem to be provoking the police officer as he's trying to do his job?
EMMANUEL OBI, ATTORNEY FOR POOL PARTY HOSTS: Sean, thanks for having me. It's a pleasure to be here. You know, let's focus on the real issues here. And the real issue here is that, you know, for a law enforcement officer to use or prepare to use deadly force -- our law does not treat that lightly. There is a standard that has to be met, and that standard is that he has to have a reasonable belief of imminent danger.
HANNITY: You don't think...
(CROSSTALK)
OBI: Sean, let me finish. Sean, let me finish my point.
HANNITY: You don't think those two young men coming up behind him, provoking him, represented any threat to him whatsoever?
OBI: Sean, I...
HANNITY: Really?
OBI: Sean, I -- you know, it's interesting that you're using this word "provocation." But honestly, what happened here is that this officer's failure to properly employ crowd dispersion techniques. This guy was all over the place. He created -- he actually escalated the situation and then created a situation where he now he's assaulting and using unnecessary force against a young lady.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: That's not force, by taking out your weapon because you believe there's a threat behind you. That is not force.
OBI: That is preparation to use deadly force. And the law is very clear on...
HANNITY: Right there, two guys are behind him, and he's, like, Whoa! I can see from his position that he's thinking, Oh, my gosh, I don't know who these two guys are. Do they have a weapon? Are they going to come and attack me?
OBI: Well, maybe -- maybe if he had employed normal crowd dispersion techniques and not come in with his Rambo tactics and not completely abused his power and actually engaged in what law enforcement officers are supposed to do, which is relying on their training and deescalating a situation -- these are children, Sean.
HANNITY: Well, according to the eyewitness...
OBI: These are -- these are children.
HANNITY: According to the two -- according to the eyewitness quoted in the paper, and according to the gentleman we spoke to last night, they felt the police officers acted appropriately. So there's a very different opinion for people that saw the entire incident unfold, not just a snippet of videotape that we're showing here.
OBI: Sean, you know, that's interesting. But let's stay...
HANNITY: Interesting?
(CROSSTALK)
OBI: Let's stay focused on the issues.
HANNITY: ... are interesting. I agree. They are interesting.
OBI: Let's stay -- let's stay focused on the issue. The issue is the legal standard that must be met before an officer can prepare or even attempt to use deadly force. And I will submit to you that this video does not meet that standard. And therefore, his actions were quite unlawful.
HANNITY: I would submit to you that two young men that are provocatively provoking -- provocatively going up behind him as he is doing his job represents in the mind of an officer potentially a threat. And at that moment, that's when he drew his weapon, kept it down by his side, and then he holstered his weapon and went back to the woman after that potential threat was dealt with.
So I actually think he dealt with it appropriately. And I guess it's a difference of opinion.
OBI: Sean, the law does not allow officers to just react however they want.
HANNITY: It's not...
OBI: Their reaction...
HANNITY: It's not how they want!
OBI: Their reaction...
HANNITY: There was a real -- those two men represented a threat to that officer in his mind.
OBI: Sean, if I may be able to finish my point, maybe we can have a constructive discussion here. The officer -- there is standard that must be met. And whatever the force that is used in response to that has to be proportional to the threat. Here you have an officer that went into a scene, deliberately escalated the situation. And when that situation -- when his actions...
HANNITY: That is your judgment. But that is not -- your judgment is your judgment. That is not the judgment of the eyewitnesses that actually saw the entire incident unfold which you did not see!
OBI: Sean, you know, that's interesting. But again, let's focus on the...
HANNITY: That's interesting?
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: ... two eyewitnesses that saw the whole thing. I agree that's very interesting!
OBI: Let's focus...
HANNITY: Because they'll testify in court, too. And I think their testimony of having seen the whole thing might actually be more appealing to a jury than whatever your opinion is.
OBI: You know, Sean, you can sensationalize this, if you want. You can use all sorts of colorful language to describe this, if you want.
HANNITY: (INAUDIBLE) colorful.
OBI: You can -- you can use whatever type of description...
HANNITY: I'm quoting the eyewitnesses.
OBI: ... but again, from a legal standpoint...
HANNITY: Quoting (INAUDIBLE)
OBI: From a legal standpoint...
HANNITY: Right.
OBI: From a legal standpoint, our law imposes a standard that must be met before deadly force can be used.
HANNITY: He didn't use deadly force.
OBI: He prepared to use deadly force.
HANNITY: Because there was a threat. The two men behind him were provoking him in the -- in the course of his duties!
OBI: The response was not proportional to whatever...
HANNITY: In your opinion.
OBI: ... threat -- I'm not -- I'm not conceding that there even was a threat.
HANNITY: All right, I got to go. But the eyewitnesses have a very different view than you, though. All right, thank you for being with us. Appreciate you being here.
OBI: No worries (ph).
HANNITY: Joining me now with more reaction, from the activist group Justice Seekers Texas, we have Reverend Ronald Wright, and Fox News contributor David Webb.
David, you're sitting here -- whose side do you agree with here?
DAVID WEBB, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, first of all, everybody's trying to get to a conclusion, including the lawyer. We don't have all the facts. We don't have the witness statements. We don't know what was said by the kids to the cop, if anything was said.
And as I've said earlier on TV, we need to look at what was going on in the whole situation -- you know, over 100 kids, drugs, gang -- not gang activity, but kind of a rough crowd...
HANNITY: Well, a DJ tweeted out, Come to the party, pay $15.
WEBB: Adam Crosby (ph) was tweeting out before this. By the way, they were violating the community rules. The community rules said pool party, 20 people. This was a lot more than 20.
HANNITY: Right.
WEBB: So maybe they should answer those questions.
HANNITY: And according to the witnesses, apparently, the kids were not -- the kids that were causing the trouble, not all the kids, a small percent of them, were not listening to the cops and causing a big problem.
WEBB: You know, whether you like what a cop says to you or not, if they give you a lawful order, you're supposed to obey.
HANNITY: What about these two guys that come up behind the cop as he's doing his job? Because this is the issue in contention here. These two guys come up right behind the cop. He sees them, and he doesn't know what threat exists or doesn't exist. I think in that case, because it's so volatile, he felt threatened. And I understand why he felt threatened.
WEBB: This is the thing. I'm not drawing a conclusion whether he acted inappropriately or not...
HANNITY: Right there, those two guys are kind of mocking him...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: ... provoking him. Now, maybe he didn't need to pull out his gun. Maybe a stun gun would have been better. But there certainly was a threat to him!
WEBB: But he doesn't know at that time whether there's a threat or not. But he knows there are two people that are making -- they're in motion behind him. He's trying to collar what he considers...
HANNITY: All right...
WEBB: ... someone and put them down...
HANNITY: Let me bring in the reverend. Reverend, I want to get your take on this, sir.
REV. RONALD WRIGHT, JUSTICE SEEKERS TEXAS: Well, it could have all been handled differently, despite what a lot of opinions are being said and your opinion is being said of this situation. This all could have been handled differently. We're going to look at the 911 call and see what was initially the call brought in as to why the officer immediately jumped out of his car.
I spoke with the young man who videoed the tape the night of the incident. We spoke with him, and he gave me his opinion on what he thought took place. And of course, you know, he's a little young white -- young white kid. And he felt like that this was all done based on race. Now, we know that the officers could have handled it a lot better...
HANNITY: I had a guy on last night that said it was not about race. There was another guy quoted in the newspaper said it was not about race.
David, you wanted to weigh in.
WEBB: I'm sick of the instant race narrative the minute black kids are involved. You had a majority, a large group of mixed race but mostly black. If you have a bunch of them committing some kind of activity, it's chances are it's black kids that are doing it. In this case, it was. The white kid who videoed it doesn't matter. The actions of the kids matter.
HANNITY: All right, let me...
WEBB: We've got to stop going to this instant race narrative.
WRIGHT: From what I was told --
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: All right, I got to wrap. Thank you, guys. I appreciate...
WRIGHT: From what I was told...
HANNITY: Yes, really quick, Reverend.
WRIGHT: And so why weren't they addressed?
HANNITY: You wanted to add one thing? Go ahead, sir.
WRIGHT: Yes, I was told that from the young man that videoed it that the white kids were a part of what took place, and they were never addressed.
WEBB: That young man...
(CROSSTALK)
WRIGHT: Let's talk about the elephant in the room and not other things. It's amazing when it comes to African-American and black kids, we come up with all kind of excuses instead of addressing the issue.
WEBB: OK, hang on a second, Reverend...
(CROSSTALK)
WEBB: So let me ask you a question then.
WRIGHT: ... and he should have done it...
WEBB: Reverend what kind of ISIS-like attack would you like to see on cops? Would you like to see car bombings?
WRIGHT: I support the police department.
WEBB: Would you like to see shootings in malls? Would you like to see multiple rapes of a woman cop?
WRIGHT: I support the police department.
WEBB: You called for ISIS-like attacks.
WRIGHT: I support the police department!
WEBB: You're the one pushing this narrative.
WRIGHT: We need the police!
WEBB: You're part of the problem!
WRIGHT: I'm not saying we don't support the police...
WEBB: You said it...
WRIGHT: We need the police.
WEBB: ... on MSNBC!
WRIGHT: But the problem is you guys want to talk about everything but what is in existence. You want to talk about...
WEBB: I'm talking about what you said, that we know.
WRIGHT: ... child abuse, but you don't want to talk about racism.
HANNITY: All right, we're going to have to leave it there.
WRIGHT: That's your opinion. You...
(CROSSTALK)
WEBB: You said it, Reverend, your words. I'm asking you what type of ISIS-type attack would you like to see on cops?
WRIGHT: I said we support the police department! I said we support the police department!
HANNITY: All right, we got to leave it there.
WRIGHT: As a matter of fact, I...
HANNITY: We got to leave it there. Coming up, we have more reaction to this pool party incident in Texas. And are professional protesters being called in?
Also later tonight, wild brawls caught on tape. Two women duke it out at an Indiana Walmart in front of a small child who gets involved. And a road rage incident in California, where a van just literally misses a man as he's punched (ph) to the ground, straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: And welcome back to "Hannity." So should the police officer in the Texas pool party incident have resigned? Still with us are the activist group Justice Seekers Texas Reverend Ronald Wright is with us, and Fox News contributor David Webb.
I want to go back to what you said and what David was challenging you on, Reverend, that you said, "We're setting the stage for a terrorist attack in this country, and the group is not going to be ISIS, it's going to be USIS (ph), us against these unjust law officers and people who continue to allow racism to grow into the city."
You're making a comparison with police officers in America with ISIS and talking about attacking police officers, just vigilante justice if you deem that they're not behaving the way you desire? Is that what you're saying? You want open warfare against cops?
WRIGHT: No, and I said it again before you cut me off. We support the police department. We need the police department. It's not...
HANNITY: But address that statement!
WRIGHT: ... the entire police department...
HANNITY: You said that!
WRIGHT: ... but it's -- I know what I said, but listen to me. It's the people that are working for the police department. Black people are being tired...
HANNITY: Well, that would be cops!
WRIGHT: ... of being abused by police officers and people doing discriminating thing. The gentleman a while ago said something about black kids are doing this and black kids are doing that. But black kids don't run in elementary schools shooting up kids. They don't run into theaters shooting up kids. All we're asking is...
WEBB: First of all...
WRIGHT: ... is that we be treated -- all we ask is that we be treated like anybody -- here's what my point with the terrorist thing.
HANNITY: Hey, Reverend...
(CROSSTALK)
WRIGHT: It's amazing that it takes something like 9/11...
HANNITY: Reverend...
WRIGHT: ... for us to come together...
(CROSSTALK)
WEBB: Oh, you're dodging, Reverend. You're dodging and you're dancing, it's not going to work here.
WRIGHT: I'm dodging what? What am I dodging?
WEBB: What you did was, you threw out...
WRIGHT: I said black folks are getting tired of getting abused.
WEBB: You know what? Anybody gets abused, black, white or otherwise, would get tired of it, so take that off the table. That's a reality. However, what you do is you throw something incendiary out on another network so you can gin up the base. Then you get the rest of the people who come and do this. You don't want to address the issues. If you did, you wouldn't say something like that.
WRIGHT: The issue is black people are tired...
(CROSSTALK)
WRIGHT: ... of being abused in this country.
WEBB: And I've been in plenty of these parties, and...
(CROSSTALK)
WRIGHT: That's the issue.
WEBB: And this is not the way you're selling it. Reverend, most interactions between police, black, white or otherwise in this country on a daily basis are lawful, are carried out in some way without this kind of incident. This is not the narrative that fits the rest of the country.
HANNITY: All right, let me -- Reverend, let me ask you a question. Are you talking about Ferguson? Is that -- what specifically are you talking about?
WRIGHT: Not just Ferguson. Not just Ferguson, sir. There have been several police shootings here in Dallas.
HANNITY: Well, give me a -- give me a few other...
WRIGHT: This is not the first time...
HANNITY: OK, but Ferguson...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Wait a minute! Let's talk about Ferguson for a second. Ferguson was about...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Ferguson was about a young man that robbed a store, intimidated a clerk, fought a cop for his gun, according to multiple eyewitnesses, and charged at an officer. And the eyewitnesses cleared the officer! And if we look at black-on-black murder in this country in cities like Chicago -- the president never talks about that! He talks about...
WRIGHT: Well, you...
HANNITY: He talks about Michael Brown!
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: He talks about Trayvon Martin! Why doesn't he talk about...
WRIGHT: Well, here's my thing. I'm not going to talk about Trayvon Martin. I'm going to talk about Tabias Mackie (ph) and several other young men that have been here in Dallas that didn't commit those crimes that were gunned down by police officers. I'm not saying all police officers are bad. And it's not the blue, it's the certain white...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: You're basically calling -- you're calling for a terror attack almost when you say USIS...
WRIGHT: I'm not calling for it!
HANNITY: ... and that there's going to be an attack!
(CROSSTALK)
WRIGHT: I'm not calling for it.
WEBB: ... incendiary language. These are your words.
WRIGHT: I'm not calling for it. The police department...
WEBB: So why are you using the language?
WRIGHT: ... that don't manage their officers are calling for it.
WEBB: No, look, this is what happens, Sean, is we never get into some parts of the important discussion here. Teenagers -- if there's drug use and underage drinking, why was that happening there? If all of this was going on, as witnesses and neighborhood residents have seen said, why is that not being discussed? Instead, we're sitting here...
WRIGHT: OK, let's discuss that.
WEBB: ... talking about an irresponsible statement by a man who claims the title of Reverend that he wants to throw incendiary language into it. Police officers have a tough job. Citizens have a tough job. But if they don't work together, we're never going to have a safe environment.
HANNITY: All right, we got to end it here...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Pastor, we'll have you back, I promise.
WRIGHT: You just made a very valid point. You made a very valid point.
HANNITY: All right, we end at a point of agreement.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Were professional protesters actually called in to Texas? We have some evidence we're going to show you.
Plus, a vicious fight between two women inside a Walmart in Indiana caught on tape. A young child also got involved.
And that's not at all. Take a look at this road rage incident in California. Now, take note. This is what happens when police are not around. That's next.
And also, later tonight...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: So you got Philadelphia Hall. You got satellite trucks parked outside. You know, Ben Franklin (ph) comes outside, and I got Rachel Maddow and Sean Hannity jump (INAUDIBLE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: All right, Senator Lindsey Graham thinks I'm polarizing. He takes a shot at me. He'll be here to try to defend those comments. You don't want to miss that straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity." Anti-cop protesters have been popping up all across the country after select incidents with law enforcement. And one activist has also protested before -- get this -- in Ferguson and Baltimore, is now in McKinney, Texas.
Now, since yesterday, he has tweeted, quote, "I've seen so many people here in McKinney who I've seen march in Ferguson and Baltimore and Milwaukee and D.C." Another tweet reads, "Well, we'll make we the protesters into a 501(c)(3) one day soon, hopefully, in order to sustain this work. And no, I won't be getting rich." And finally, another reads, "Shut down McKinney."
Now, based on those posts, is it fair to say that there may be professional protesters at all of these incidents? Joining me now is the author of those tweets. Activist Deray McKesson is with us. And also from the Black Sphere, Kevin Jackson.
All right, Deray, you say that. Were you at all three incidents?
DERAY MCKESSON, ACTIVIST: I've been to many cities where the police have been violent towards people of color. And there have been many people who have travelled around the country in solidarity to stand with people to make sure...
HANNITY: Have you?
MCKESSON: ... that these stories don't go unnoticed.
HANNITY: I asked you if you've traveled.
MCKESSON: I have.
HANNITY: And you've been in Ferguson...
MCKESSON: I have.
HANNITY: You've been in Ferguson, right?
MCKESSON: Correct.
HANNITY: And you've been in Baltimore?
MCKESSON: Correct.
HANNITY: And you've been in McKinney?
MCKESSON: I've been in many places where the police have either killed people or continued to be violent...
HANNITY: OK.
MCKESSON: ... towards people of color.
HANNITY: So you're a professional -- is this what you do for a living, you want to set up a 501(c)(3) tax-exempt organization? Is this your profession now?
MCKESSON: You know, I'm somebody who's focused on justice. Is this a question that you're asking me because I'm a person of color? Would you ask white people this, too?
HANNITY: It has nothing to do with race, it has to do with is this your profession. I asked you -- you know, you're tweeting out that you go -- you're a professional protester. Is that what you do? You want money. You're soliciting money.
MCKESSON: If you've actually looked at my tweets, you've heard me say that I'm actually unemployed. You want -- you want this to be that narrative?
HANNITY: Well, how do you support yourself then? How do you support yourself, sir?
MCKESSON: I would encourage you to look at the rest of my tweets because...
HANNITY: OK, but I'm asking you...
MCKESSON: ... I've answered this question...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: How do you support yourself if you're unemployed?
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: How do you get the money to travel to all these places?
MCKESSON: Sean, will you keep yelling or will you let me answer?
HANNITY: I didn't yell once yet. But I'll be glad to. If you want to hear me yell, it's pretty loud.
MCKESSON: Yes, so Sean (INAUDIBLE) So here is the thing, is that like I said, I've been using my savings and contributions from my friends to do this work so far. And that has been -- that has worked. Again, when I go to different places, and when many people go to different places, this is about making sure that these stories are heard and that we're standing in solidarity with people who the police have harmed or killed or...
HANNITY: I got your point. Now I want to ask you this.
MCKESSON: ... making sure that people (INAUDIBLE)
HANNITY: Have you been part of any of the rioting? Have you been a part of any of the looting, sir?
MCKESSON: That's a good question. So I've actually not seen any rioting at all, so...
HANNITY: You haven't seen it? I've got the video. If you'd like to look in your monitor, I can show it to you, sir.
MCKESSON: I'm not -- I'm not...
HANNITY: A lot of minority store owners lost their entire life possessions in these riots.
MCKESSON: Sean, I'd encourage you to let me answer the questions. So again, I've not been a part of any rioting. There has been property damage in some cities. And again, I've not participated in that. And like I said before is...
HANNITY: Right. And do you think...
MCKESSON: ... I don't have...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: ... Michael Brown, who robbed a store and assaulted a clerk, and according to the eyewitnesses, fought a cop for his gun and charged at a cop -- do you still believe that false and proven false narrative of "Hands off, don't shoot"? Do you believe that?
MCKESSON: I think that Michael Brown should be alive today. And I think that he was murdered by a cop who used his power...
HANNITY: All right, let me go to Kevin...
(CROSSTALK)
MCKESSON: ... to be protected.
HANNITY: Kevin, I guess we have professional protesters. I mean, I - - nice way to make a living, I guess.
KEVIN JACKSON, THE BLACK SPHERE: Well, the first thing...
MCKESSON: Sean, don't lie.
JACKSON: The first thing I'd say to Deray is he had tweets out that talked about he hadn't been paid yet and he was waiting to be paid. But if he denies that he hasn't been paid, fine. But here's what I will tell you about Deray...
MCKESSON: So Kevin...
(CROSSTALK)
MCKESSON: ... not true.
JACKSON: Hey, let me -- let me just -- let me finish. You haven't been to the funeral of any cop that was killed in the line of duty. I'll bet you that. I'll bet you haven't saved up for that. I bet you haven't been to the celebration ceremony of cops who protected many, many black people for decades. I bet you've never been to one of those celebrations.
I bet you haven't been to the funeral of any of the kids that are killed that aren't in these types of scenarios, where race baiters and race pimps like you appear.
Those are the things that you should be caring about. I'll bet you don't care about these neighborhoods once you leave when you start problems, or the money that has to be paid to restore them when people like you leave.
You're just -- you're -- you're a sucker that's going around this country starting problems, not caring about what happens after the fact because it's giving you a bit of notoriety. You should just admit that. You're a race pimp!
MCKESSON: So Kevin, have you been to the funerals of all the victims of Sandy Hook, or all the victims of Katrina? Did you...
(CROSSTALK)
JACKSON: I'm not a professional...
MCKESSON: Do you care about those?
JACKSON: I'm not a professional running around the country to earn money to get this -- to do this nonsense.
(CROSSTALK)
MCKESSON: Kevin, you should stop yelling.
JACKSON: I want you to answer the question.
MCKESSON: I've answered the question many times. And I'll say it again to you, because I'm going to placed --
JACKSON: You're getting paid.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- where the police have killed people.
JACKSON: No, you're not. You're getting paid.
HANNITY: Do you believe a person is innocent until proven guilty?
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Do you believe cops are innocent until proven guilty? Do you believe people are innocent --
MCKESSON: What I believe is that that girl should not have been abused and Mike Brown should be alive, Freddie Gray should be alive. So I'm looking --
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: You don't care what the justice says. All right, I got to roll. Thank you both.
Coming up, shocking brawls caught on tape. Two women duking it out in Indiana Walmart in front of a young boy who joins in on this mayhem. Then a crazy scene from a busy road in California where a man nearly hits a man who was punched to the ground in a road rage incident. This is what happens when police are not around.
And then later tonight --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM, R-S.C.: So you're at Philadelphia Hall. You've got satellite trucks parked outside. Ben Franklin comes outside. I got Rachel Maddow and Sean Hannity jump all over. Don't give in, Ben.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: I'm to blame for all the polarization. Lindsey Graham takes a shot at me. I'll ask me why he did it coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity." Now, for all the cop haters out there, this is what happens when cops are not around. We have shocking video from an Indiana Walmart where a sickening brawl between two women and a small child gets way out of hand. Fellow shoppers, they do nothing to break up this fight. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You want it? You want it? Are you -- serious? Do you want it?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What you going to do?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come on.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You want --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There are kids all around here.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't do that.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Y'all knock it off. The kid is sitting there. Get the hell off of her right now.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Punch her in the -- face.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Come on.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mommy!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Unbelievable. This went on for several minutes without any interruption. And while that video is sad and disgraceful, watch this next clip I'm about to show you. It's even more shocking. This is a look of a violent example of road rage that took place just yesterday morning in Los Angeles. There you can see two men getting out of their cars fighting in the middle of a busy street during rush hour. And as you can see, one of the men almost got run over by a passing van.
Joining me with reaction Maryland Sheriff Mike Lewis and former NYPD detective Pat Bronson. Sheriff Lewis, let me start with you. I'm looking at these incidents. I'm looking at the rush to judgment in the pool party incident in McKinney where two guys sneak up behind the cop. He draws his gun I thought in a safe manner. And I'm thinking I don't think cops are going to want to do their jobs anymore. If this is now -- this guy resigns as a result of this because he's put on administrative leave, I think he just said I'm not doing this anymore. Is this what we're going to see more and more of?
SHERIFF MIKE LEWIS, WICOMICO COUNTY, MARYLAND: Sean, this is a pattern we're seeing across the country. It's certainly a pattern THAT I'm seeing with regularity when I communicate with different leaders across this country. Many police officers are resigning. They are seeking other professions. Why do we continue to do our job when we have a bunch of thankless individuals out there who don't respect us, who are very defiant? They are very disobedient. They're determined to do what they want to do. Laws were made for a reason. Think of them as hints. If you don't like the interaction you're having with police just try obeying the law. That might help.
HANNITY: I have people on tonight that disagree. I've had people that agree with me. We have this incident in Walmart. It's insanity to me. But that's when a cop is not there to stop it. The same thing with this road rage incident, there's no cop there to stop this. This guy, literally, they get out of the car. You can see it right there. He throws the first punch. Look how close he came to dying. And so my question is, when you watch this cop and these two kids come up behind him as he's dealing with this young woman on the ground, is that not viewed as a threat? That seems like a threat to me.
LEWIS: You bet it is, Sean. You bet it is. And we don't know all the facts. For every action there is a reaction.
HANNITY: We don't know if these kids are provoking the cop. That's when he drew the gun. Pat, what do you think?
PAT BRONSON, FORMER NYPD DETECTIVE: I was watching earlier conversation with your guests, and what he neglected, the counsel neglected to point out, he continually reverted back to the default position of use of force. What he didn't recognize or acknowledge is that the state constitution allows for this very interesting little equation called continuum of force. Continuum of force, as you well know and which he completely ignored, this is a perfect example of it. Guy pulls a knife on a cop, the cop pulls a gun. The guy advanced with a knife, the cop points the gun. The guy lunges with the knife, the cop shoots the gun. It's a reciprocal response.
HANNITY: But in this case he's dealing with one person.
BRONSON: Correct.
HANNITY: And these other two individuals very close to him. Obviously on tape what I can see provoking him. He doesn't know if they have a weapon. He doesn't know what threat they represent.
BRONSON: One hundred percent.
HANNITY: And we don't know the circumstances that led up to this, in other words what he knew about these. So look at this guy. He is sitting mocking the cop. And that's when he pulled out his gun. And he didn't point it at anybody. He holstered his weapon quickly, never pointed it at the young girl.
Sheriff, your final thoughts? Where is this all going to end?
LEWIS: Sean, I don't know that it is going to end. I truly don't, because there are race baiters all over the country now. We heard from the guy a while ago who travels the country. He's unemployed. We know exactly what he's doing. We know what he's going to be doing from here this point forward. Almost every American from an adolescent to an adult are carrying cellphones today with videotape capability. This is only the beginning. It's not going to stop. You can rest assured as long as the race baiters - -
BRONSON: I couldn't agree more. What you have here is when elected officials send a signal and a stamp of approval from the top like you saw in Baltimore. Rhetoric, but rhetoric has consequences. In this case they're lethal. Baltimore will reap what it sowed. As you recall the mayor said destroy in peace. It's a stamp of approval.
HANNITY: Thank you both.
LEWIS: You're very welcome.
HANNITY: And coming up next right here tonight on Hannity.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRAHAM: So you're at Philadelphia Hall. You've got satellite trucks parked outside. Ben Franklin comes outside. I got Rachel Maddow and Sean Hannity jump all over me. Don't give in, Ben
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Senator Graham takes a shot at me. I'll ask him why coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity." Three-term Republican Senator Lindsey Graham recently announced that he's running for president. But early last week shortly after declaring his candidacy Graham sat down with NBC News and seemed to take a shot at yours truly. Watch for yourself.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRAHAM: Like the constitution today, I think if you're a great senator, you have -- yes I'm trying to get to it. So you're at Philadelphia Hall. You've got satellite trucks parked outside. Ben Franklin comes outside. I got Rachel Maddow and Sean Hannity jump all over. Don't give in, Ben.
Just think how hard it is in today's 24/7 news cycle, talk radio, cable television, and money. There is a group telling you to say no about everything.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Here now to talk about those remarks as well as his 2016 run, the man himself, South Carolina Senator Lindsey Graham. Senator, let me start with the second part first.
GRAHAM: Hey, hey. How you doing?
(LAUGHTER)
HANNITY: I love when you go on with liberal commentators and Chuck Todd and take shots at me. That's great.
GRAHAM: You can handle it.
HANNITY: I can handle it. You're right. I don't mind at all and I'm not taking it personally.
Let me start with the second part. And Ben Franklin comes outside and there is Hannity and Rachel Maddow. Don't give in, Ben. Just think how hard it is in today's cycle, et cetera, just say no to everything. Here is my question. How well do you know me? And I mean this because --
GRAHAM: Very well I think.
HANNITY: I have a conservative solution caucus. I support tax cuts. I support the penny plan. I support energy independence. I support border security. I support a strong national defense. I have all of these things written down on my website and they have been there for well over a year. Aren't they solutions? I'm not --
GRAHAM: Absolutely. Absolutely, you have solutions. But so does Rachel Maddow. And the problem is we can't blend the solutions. If I had to pick between your list and hers I would pick yours.
HANNITY: Wow, that's a big concession.
GRAHAM: I mean, I'd take yours. But you know, we've been pretty good friends for a long time. At the end of the day, you can't secure your border until you tell the Democrats what's going to be with the 11 million. I'm not going to legalize 11 million and hope they will give me what I want with border security. So once we do secure our border, then what happens to the 11 million? Somebody needs to address that before you get Democrats on board, I think.
HANNITY: I don't think so. I disagree with you. I think you should secure the border first and then I think you can deal with it later.
Let me deal with the word "polarization." You're claiming that we're responsible for polarizing. I'm not going to dispute the term, although I don't take credit for being polarizing to the whole country. Wasn't Martin Luther King Jr. polarizing in a good way, standing up for justice?
GRAHAM: Yes. Absolutely. Sure.
HANNITY: Wasn't Ronald Reagan when he took on a sitting president in 76 -- I have three articles in front of me that describe Reagan as polarizing. He was polarizing, right?
GRAHAM: Absolutely. Pushing conservatism to be better is sort of what you do, I think. And on her side, I guess that's what she does for liberalism. But at the end of the day, I'm in a different business than you are. I've got to find somebody up here who is going to find the way to actually solve immigration. We've been yelling about this since 2006. And I have come to conclude whether you agree with me or not, you're never going to just secure your border first. You've got to have a plan that addresses all the moving parts and you have to have a plan that will tell the Democratic Party what happens to the 11 million.
HANNITY: You're talking about one issue. You know what, you supported impeachment. Wasn't impeachment a polarizing thing? And you said you'd do it again.
GRAHAM: Yes.
HANNITY: So you're polarizing?
GRAHAM: At times, yes I am.
HANNITY: And by the way, didn't you support the surge? I supported the surge. Wasn't that polarizing issue?
GRAHAM: Absolutely.
HANNITY: Do you regret it?
GRAHAM: No, not at all. It's not that I won't speak up and speak out. But there are some problems like immigration that I've come to conclude there is no Republican solution to this. Reagan and O'Neill, let's say that Reagan and O'Neill were around today and they wanted to adjust the age of retirement from 65 to 67. I bet you would be more supportive of that then our friends on MSNBC.
HANNITY: I support entitlement reform. I support secure borders. I support a strong national defense. I support a balanced budgets and stop robbing our kids blind. I support healthcare savings accounts. I support all those things.
GRAHAM: Me to. Would you support eliminating a deduction in the tax code and taking that money to pay down debt?
HANNITY: No.
GRAHAM: OK.
HANNITY: After we did the following first. You guys in Washington spend too much money. And until --
GRAHAM: I agree.
HANNITY: I think it's immoral what's happening in Washington. And I would cut a penny out of every dollar and eliminate baseline budgeting and you can balance the budget in six years.
GRAHAM: No, you can't.
HANNITY: I think you can. I've seen the numbers that you can.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: You don't cut. You just reduce the rate of increase.
GRAHAM: We're at 2008 spending levels. But here's what I'm trying to tell you audience --- 80 million baby boomers are going to retire in the next 20 years, $70 trillion of unfunded liability. That's going to make us Greece. When 80 million of use retire en masse in the next 20 to 25 year, we're going wipe that Medicare and Social Security. All the revenue to be collected in taxes by 2042 will go to pay the Medicare and Social Security bills. The discretionary budget is 32 percent of all federal --
HANNITY: All right, cut two pennies out of every dollar. Stop spending so much money.
GRAHAM: You can't even do it with that. Young people got to work longer and people in our income level are going to have to take a little less or we're going to destroy this country. I would do what Reagan and O'Neill did all over again.
HANNITY: You know, but here is what we've concluded here. You say I'm responsible for polarization. You're polarizing on impeachment. You're polarizing on the surge. Reagan was polarizing taking on a sitting president. Martin Luther King was polarizing in a good way. So being polarizing is not necessarily a bad thing, and I've laid out my solution. So you can apologize now.
GRAHAM: I'll apologize if I hurt your feeling, and I think that would be hard for me to do knowing you pretty well. But what I am saying is that your solutions don't work. At the end of the day --
HANNITY: My solutions don't work?
GRAHAM: No. It won't work that way.
HANNITY: Securing the border, living within our means?
GRAHAM: No. It won't work that way.
HANNITY: Don't spend money you don't have?
GRAHAM: How do you get Democrats to agree with that?
HANNITY: Well, have you guys have a majority in the House and Senate and I'm hoping you have a Republican president in 2016, staring in 2017. So at some point you've got to take a stand.
GRAHAM: We have taken a stand.
HANNITY: You said you're going to repeal and replace health care and it hasn't happened yet five years ago.
GRAHAM: Well, we've got a Democratic president. I don't think you're ever going to repeal and replace --
HANNITY: And you had the power of the purse and you didn't use it.
GRAHAM: You wanted to shut the government down expecting that --
HANNITY: By constitutional power.
GRAHAM: Where are we going to shut down the entire federal government? That makes zero sense to me.
HANNITY: I'm like Winston Churchill.
GRAHAM: I believe that you're a principled fellow, but I've come to conclude the Republican Party and the country as a whole needs to knock off some of this stuff. And you're not going to get President Obama to repeal ObamaCare because we've threatened shut down the government. Would President Bush have agreed to repeal tax cuts if the Democrats had threatened to shut down the government?
HANNITY: I think what we have is a situation where Republicans have constitutional power they refuse to use, and that, to me, is weakness. But I've got to end it there.
GRAHAM: Let's defeat ISIL.
HANNITY: Coming up next, we need your help. Our "Question of the Day" day is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity." Before we go, we want to share with you this funny comic that includes your truly. It is found inside a comic book called "Female Force, Hillary Clinton." Do I look really like that?
Anyway, now it's time for tonight's "Question of the Day." Are police officers now underappreciated? I think it's obvious, but we want to know what you think. Go to Facebook.com/SeanHannity, @SeanHannity on Twitter, let us know what you think.
That's all the time we have left this evening. We hope you'll set your DVR so you never miss an episode because we will miss you. Thanks for being with us. We'll see you back here tomorrow night.
Content and Programming Copyright 2015 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2015 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.
Get all the stories you need-to-know from the most powerful name in news delivered first thing every morning to your inbox