Sowell: Politicians using race as their ticket to whatever racket they're running

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Sowell: Politicians using race as their ticket to whatever racket they're running

Hoover Institution senior fellow Thomas Sowell weighs in on Democrats' use of race to push their agenda.

This is a rush transcript from "The Ingraham Angle," March 6, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

LAURA INGRAHAM, HOST: All right. I'm Laura Ingraham and this is "The Ingram Angle", on a very busy ash Wednesday in Washington, so don't tweet about this.

All right, DHS Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen sounding the alarm on the border crisis, but the Democrats will have none of it - or maybe they're just too overwhelmed by the radical chic in their own party. And then they seem to have an anti-Semitism problem.

And our R. Kelly speaks out in an explosive new interview. I just watched it on the way over this studio, claiming he's not the victim - whoa he is the victim, not the women accusing him of sexual abuse. Dr. Drew Pinsky will analyze.

Plus Raymond Arroyo on why Will Smith isn't black enough for a new role, and what a new focus group will tell us about the future of the Democratic Party? But first the Dems big border lie, that's the focus of "Tonight's Angle"

Today Homeland Security Secretary Kirstjen Nielsen went up to Capitol Hill to share a little dose of something called reality with Congress.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KIRSTJEN NIELSEN, SECRETARY OF HOMELAND SECURITY: We face a crisis, a real serious and sustained crisis at our borders. We have tens of thousands of illegal aliens arriving at our doorstep every month. We have drugs, criminals and violence spilling into our country every week. Illegal immigration is simply spiraling out of control.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Now let's break it down to the cold hard facts. In the month of February, 76,000 illegal aliens were apprehended at the border, that's just the ones apprehended. A 30 percent increase from the previous month apprehensions, and from the year before it's even worse.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NIELSEN: This is an 80 percent increase over the same time last year and I report today that CBP is forecasting the problem will get even worse this spring as the weather warms up.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Could be getting worse, well, we could be looking, yes, at nearly 1 million illegals crossing our borders if the trends continue. If these numbers hold, every 4 months we'll import the equivalent of the population of Richmond, Virginia or Baton Rouge, Louisiana into the United States, and this isn't a national emergency?

Let's face it most Democrats know this is a crisis. The sheer volume of crossers is overwhelming our facilities. And liberals then blame Trump, point a migrant doesn't see a doctor immediately?

As with their embrace of infanticide and reparations, Medicare-for-All, Democrats have gone far left on immigration, and now they are in effect, for open borders.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MAZIE HIRONO, D-HI: There are other options - ankle braces - there are other options to incarcerating and holding everybody by the thousands.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Such as.

HIRONO: There are programs that will enable people to go into our communities and to be able to be tracked in our communities.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Well, she wants LoJacks on everyone, what is that - retract in our communities? They already put ankle bracelets on a lot of the illegal immigrants and they just tear them off - terrifying, that she doesn't understand the basic facts of immigration.

And while we're creating these grand new plans to hold the illegal immigrants accountable and retract them, let's not forget who's footing the bill here. Guess what the cost is, $82,000 per year per illegal immigrant in the United States. And then of course, the children they have, and then the children are citizens and then no one's deported.

Democrats prefer to focus though on non-citizens, their treatment, their medical care, their - and of course their race.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. NANETTE BARRAGAN, D-CALIF.: You wanted to separate children and families and you wanted to do it with compassion? You have no feeling, no compassion, no empathy here.

REP. AL GREEN, D-TX: White babies would not be treated the way these babies of color are being treated, Madam Secretary. This is about color. We've opened our doors - you're tired, your poor, huddled masses yearning to breathe free. Except we now have our quota of people of color.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: It gets very dramatic when you whisper. Now, the Democrats can't play chords, they stick to one maybe two notes and they're always off-key.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. BENNIE THOMPSON, D-MISS.: For the record, Madam Secretary, are we still use in cages for children?

NIELSEN: Sir, we don't use cages for children. In the border facilities that you've been to, they were not made to detain children. To my knowledge CBP never purposely have put a child in a cage if you mean it like this.

THOMPSON: Purposely or whatever are we putting children in cages as of today?

NIELSEN: Children are processed at the border facility stations that you've been at, some of--

THOMPSON: And I've seen the cages. I just want you to admit that the cages exist.

NIELSEN: Sir, they're not cages.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Well, what that is? See it up on the screen right there. That's a so-called cage that the congressman was referring to. But that - well, fed those - you know kind of a fencing thing. It's an enclosure for sure, was used by the Obama administration to detain illegal miners during their processing until they could be placed with sponsors.

Now where was the Democrat outrage when Obama was using the same fencing facilities that liberal do-gooders now deplore and make a big deal about at a hearing to get on shows like this? Well, instead of focusing on the surge of the border and the lack of facilities to house the people crossing the border, Democrats are throwing sand and throwing down the race card. It's about all they know these days.

When the CBP Commissioner Kevin McAleenan testified to the Senate Judiciary Committee that walls and barriers in key hot spots along the border had an immediate impact in reducing the crossings, Senator Dick Blumenthal, he didn't want to hear any of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RICHARD BLUMENTHAL, D-CONN.: Numbers of border crossings are still at a historic low compared to other times in our nation's history.

KEVIN MCALEENAN, COMMISSIONER, CUSTOMS AND BORDER PROTECTION: No Senator, they're not. We're on pace for over 700,000 crossings this year. That's closer to historic highs and historic lows.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: The Commissioner is 100 percent right. Over 60 percent of the total apprehensions along the border are now illegal family units and unaccompanied alien minors, those under the age of 18.

And new DHS figures find that those apprehensions of illegal family units have surged by 338 percent. But no emergency here, no crisis. And the apprehensions of unaccompanied children are up 54 percent, that's not dangerous for them, right? No emergency, no crisis? How about this?

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KIRSTJEN NIELSEN, SECRETARY OF HOMELAND SECURITY: Because of the increasing violence at ICE, when we have families with children, we have to give every girl a pregnancy test over 10. This is not a safe journey.

INGRAHAM: Girls are being abused, raped, and in some cases trafficked as part of these caravans and it is despicable what is happening to these young people. Congress needs to get its head out of the sand and stop this madness once and for all.

If someone crosses the border illegally with rare exception, they should be turned back immediately. Family units or people posing as family units would not make this dangerous trek once word spread in their home country.

Congress should pass this law. If you want to apply for asylum, that's fine. But you should do so in the safety of your home country. Or as is beginning to happen now, once you're in the United States and you declare, you should be set to Mexico until your case comes up for hearing.

We have a backlog right now of 800,000 immigration cases. The current system today, it's obvious - come on everybody knows this, Democrats know this, it incentivizes human trafficking, the abuse of kids and more illegal crossings period. That's why you have a big jump.

Any Democrat or any Republican who refuses to act now are the ones who are truly lacking in the feeling and the compassion and the empathy, not only for the illegal immigrants, but for the American people they're supposed to be representing, and that's "The Angle".

The House Democrats aren't doing anything about the crush at the border. They're too busy grappling with the growing radicalism within their own ranks. And now House Democrats are focused on watering down a resolution condemning anti-Semitism, and not even mentioning Congressman Ilhan Omar by name when she is the one this all should be really all about.

Fox's Peter Doocy caught up with her or at least tried to earlier today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PETER DOOCY, CORRESPONDENT: Congresswoman Omar, it seems like there's some confusion among your colleagues. Are you an anti-Semitic? Congresswoman, that's my only question. Just - would you support the resolution condemning anti-Semitism and other forms of bigotry?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: She's pretty chatty on Twitter. But suddenly cats got her tongue. Well, those are some pretty easy questions to answer Congressman Omar, so what are you afraid of? Joining me now with reaction Congressman Sean Duffy.

Congressman this anti-Semitic problem, we're going to get to the border issue in a second, because this is a full-blown crisis at the Southern border. Have you addressed this anti-Semitic problem within the Democrat ranks within your caucus and what's happening with Nancy Pelosi? She's caught here.

REP. SEAN DUFFY, R-WIS.: Well, she's losing control. So first off, you have to realize that Nancy Pelosi recognizes they have an anti-Semitic problem within the Democrat Party. So she says I'm going to bring out a resolution to show that we are not anti-Semitic and there's complete pandemonium inside--

INGRAHAM: Today caucus meeting--

DUFFY: --for Democrat Caucus today and they have to actually pull the resolution to say we're not anti-solution.

INGRAHAM: You can't even have a resolution condemning anti-Semitism, because the - was it the troika or it was Pressley, Omar and Tlaib and AOC, right? Those four standing together basically?

DUFFY: Yes. And they basically said, listen, why don't we say we're not anti all kinds of things, all kinds of isms. And so, it just shows how radical the Democrat Party has become. And some of the leaders of the party, you know this, are good friends of Louis Farrakhan, who said I'm not an "anti-Semite, I'm anti-termite".

I mean, this is the viewpoint of this party that is completely off the rails. And I think it's not - I would say it's funny, but it's not funny. I mean this is a real problem that we have in history and today in this party.

And I think, you know what, Nancy Pelosi if she had a backbone, she'd bring the resolution up and call these folks out and go, let's have a vote and let's see where you stand about anti-Semitism.

INGRAHAM: But from the reporting about this meeting - that was a closed- door meeting. There were loud voices and there was - basically it sounds like they were shouting and a big argument about this because the freshmen - the newcomers and Hakeem Jeffries, a few others, feel like this is a - this is like a targeting a Muslim woman.

So this is - all these Congressmen and Congresswomen targeting a Muslim woman, because she criticizes APAC or because she doesn't like everything Israel does. Is that what this is?

DUFFY: Well, that's what they're trying to make it into. But the deal is. This was a conversation about do we want to condemn anti-Semitism and anti- Semitism within the Democrat Party?

And you saw a real push back, because I think there's lot of Democrats inside that Democratic Caucus who don't want to take a vote on that resolution, which really exposes the true feelings of Democrats and the radical wing of the Democrat Party. And what they view - what they - how they see Israel, how they see the Jewish community--

INGRAHAM: Pelosi is freaking out though.

DUFFY: --and obviously anti-Semitism.

INGRAHAM: She can't lose the excitement and the energy of this new incoming freshman. We're going to get into this new focus group that was done which shows us a lot about where the power - I mean where the energy is turning out people to vote. So they're worried about turning those people off, are they not, she's worried about that?

DUFFY: She is.

INGRAHAM: Pelosi is.

DUFFY: She is. But the problem is, you have to win the middle of America to win elections. And most Americans condemn anti-Semitism. And so the fact that you're going to put a resolution out and you actually have to pull it - again--

INGRAHAM: It was announced. It was going to - it was going to be voted on tomorrow.

DUFFY: Tomorrow, yes, it was going to be tomorrow.

INGRAHAM: Tomorrow, I guess, finally.

DUFFY: --until the food fight happened.

INGRAHAM: All right. I want to move on to what's happening on this immigration issue. Fox viewers are very, very focused on this. I think Americans, when they really understand the sheer volume of border crossers, there's like, how is this happening?

DUFFY: Right.

INGRAHAM: The entire like cities of Richmond - that population is being brought into the United States, allowed into the United States every three or four months.

DUFFY: So I lived in Wausau, Wisconsin, 40,000 people in Wausau. So two Wausau, Wisconsins a month came--

INGRAHAM: 76,000 last month.

DUFFY: --illegally into America. And what I - and hearing and the clips that you played, I find it fascinating that Democrats are trying to say, we don't want to put kids in cages and this is a race that's played by the administration--

INGRAHAM: --coming here.

DUFFY: But the bottom line is, I thought what Nielsen said was really important that they're giving pregnancy tests to girls as young as 10 years old, because they know that women who come - young girls who come on that dangerous journey, they're raped, they're sexually assaulted, and they have to get pregnancy tests.

If you care about kids set up a policy that doesn't incentivize--

INGRAHAM: Incentivize people--

DUFFY: --the cartels and the parents to bring kids on that dangerous journey where they're sexually assaulted. If you care about kids, don't bring them.

INGRAHAM: They're making a huge, huge mistake with what they're doing, because they know it's a - do you do not agree with me, they know this is a crisis? They know it's a crisis.

DUFFY: Listen, absolutely. Can I say what that also gets me, they say we don't want barriers, we don't want walls, we want boots and technology. So we have a new Wisconsin Governor Tony Evers. We send our - Scott Walker, our former Governor sent our troops to the Southern border to give more support, more boots in the ground.

Tony Evers pulls our boots off the ground. So it won't build barriers and won't send the boots and the technology as a radical liberal Governor of Wisconsin. That's how extreme these people are.

INGRAHAM: Democrats are open borders, yes or no?

DUFFY: Open borders, absolutely. Can't stop.

INGRAHAM: I mean, they have to be. I mean, their responses were ludicrous. I mean, Obama has these fencing things to hold people for processing, what do they want, the kids to be thrown out on the street when they come here?

What are you supposed to do? They're trying to find sponsors - kids - and place them in sponsor homes. And what do you do you have to - I don't know what else you could possibly do. Obama found that dilemma, and they didn't have any problem with.

DUFFY: And it's temporary, they have no complaint about Obama. But all of a sudden Trump uses the same facilities and they go after the poor guy.

INGRAHAM: This is all they have race and that--

DUFFY: That's why we're winning suburban women. They want border security, they want safety, and they know that Democrats--

INGRAHAM: And so its safety for Americans and safety for these kids--

DUFFY: That's right.

INGRAHAM: --who are being brought in this journey. Thank You, Congressman. Thanks so much. And back to the controversy surrounding Congresswoman Omar and her questionable anti-Semitic remarks.

Here she is just last week saying, "Jews can't be trusted, because they have a split allegiance with Israel".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ILHAN OMAR, D-MINN.: I want to talk about the political influence in this country that says it is OK for people to push for allegiance to a foreign country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Joining me now is Brooke Goldstein, a Human Rights Lawyer and Founder and Executive Director of the Lawfare Project, and Osama Siblani, Publisher of The Arab American News

Osama how is that comment not anti-Semitic? The classic dual loyalty troop, how do you defend that?

OSAMA SIBLANI, PUBLISHER, THE ARAB AMERICAN NEWS: Do you know how many times I've heard and my community have heard of dual loyalty here in our community that Muslims cannot be trusted? How many times we've been called, go back to your - where you came from, to your homeland. No one said that this is anti-Muslin--

INGRAHAM: Really who in Congress said that?

SIBLANI: No one stood for our rights, no one said that this is - should not be said in America. We heard this--

INGRAHAM: OK. So, Osama you're saying that or you're equating what Omar said, a sitting Member of Congress, with some nut on the internet or something someone said who - offend the people all the time

SIBLANI: No, it's not.

INGRAHAM: --they say terrible things all the time and that should be condemned--

SIBLANI: They are not on the Internet, they are not in the Congress, they are members of the Republican Party, they are very, very close in their ideology to the Nazis, that's what they are.

INGRAHAM: OK. So--

SIBLANI: I mean, let's not just shove this under the carpet.

INGRAHAM: OK. So we've established that because there is anti-Muslim bias, which I have no doubt there is--

SIBLANI: And there is that Jewish bias too.

INGRAHAM: OK. Let me say, I just want to understand where you are coming from, I really do. So you're saying because there's anti-Muslim bias. That what Omar is saying about Jewish dual loyalty should get a pass? Is that it?

SIBLANI: No I don't think that should - but we should start the debate. There should be a debate. We should not stifle the debate in America. We should talk about - like, we talk about the Saudis, we talked about the Iranians, no one says that this is anti-Muslim.

INGRAHAM: Yes.

SIBLANI: They are a Muslim nation. So when we talk about Israel, we should not be equating this to Judaism. Judaism has nothing to do with Israel. Israel is occupying Palestinian land and Palestinian people and we should be talking and debating about what is Israel doing--

INGRAHAM: Yes, well, that's not what she is doing now.

SIBLANI: --to the Palestinian people.

INGRAHAM: When she - and let's Brooke get a chance to speak. Look, if that's what the debate is, that's a legitimate debate to have. And I think we have those debates a lot, especially on college campuses, because I've been to some of them, about what the role in peace process should be? Who stole what from whom, OK that's fine.

I have a problem with the analogies of the Jews and money and the Jews want the money and it's all about the Benjamin's baby, which you think--

SIBLANI: I don't think that this is what you said. I don't think that this is what you said.

INGRAHAM: Hey, Osama give it a rest. OK. Give it a rest, because I - she - Brooke didn't interrupt you, so just let her speak and then you can speak. OK? so Brooke, I have a problem so with how this is going down, because it is stereotypical, and I don't think we should be engaged, as much as possible, in stereotyping.

BROOKE GOLDSTEIN, HUMAN RIGHTS ATTORNEY: Right. And I think we all have to step back and take a look at the big picture here. The level of anti- Semitism that's being tolerated by the Democratic Party right now, I think, has risen to a level of a national emergency.

We have a Foreign Relations Committee which is responsible for defining and executing the --- and shaping U.S. Foreign Policy. We have someone sitting on that Committee who is a racist, whose views are more aligned with Islamic Jihad, than they are with the U.S. Constitution.

We have Democratic members of government who are campaigning with people like Linda Sarsour who is connected to the Palestinian Front for the Liberation of Palestine, a designated terrorist group.

And now we have a Democratic Party, that's been hijacked to the extent that it cannot even pass a resolution condemning anti-Semitism without being forced to water it down and make it meaningless.

Could you not imagine if they wanted to pass a resolution condemning racism against African-Americans and the Democratic said, we're not going to pass that unless the same resolution talks about crimes that blacks commit against whites?

INGRAHAM: But to - right. But to - Osama's point, is this - can this reach a point where you're stifling debate? I think that's what some are concerned about.

GOLDSTEIN: What people are doing right now--

INGRAHAM: --and if you don't want to stifle debate, you want to have an actual debate on points and issues, correct?

SIBLANI: Well, actually what's happening in here--

GOLDSTEIN: Right. But--

SIBLANI: --the Republicans are using this--

INGRAHAM: Hold on, hold on.

GOLDSTEIN: Foreign policy is not an excuse to turn around and accuse Jews of dual loyalty. Very often--

SIBLANI: That's not what you said, that's not what you said.

GOLDSTEIN: I'm just criticizing Israel--

SIBLANI: You are--

GOLDSTEIN: --this is exactly what she said. She's is treating things like for example--

SIBLANI: --You're putting words in her mouth. That's not what Ilhan said.

INGRAHAM: Well--

GOLDSTEIN: --"May, Allah awaken everyone to the evils of the Jewish state". That's something you hear in a sermon--

SIBLANI: That's not Ilhan said. You guys should stop putting words in her mouth.

INGRAHAM: All right.

GOLDSTEIN: That's not her memories of government talk in United States.

INGRAHAM: Osama when she made the initial statement about it's all about the Benjamins and for the little of money--

SIBLANI: But that's not what she said. She did not say that Jews have a dual loyalty, she did not say that.

INGRAHAM: OK.

SIBLANI: She said some okay members in the Congress--

GOLDSTEIN: That's she did.

SIBLANI: --some members in the Congress they have dual loyalty, yes, they do.

GOLDSTEIN: So where is her loyalty? Where is her loyalty? Is her loyalty to the U.S. constitution?

SIBLANI: They do. They do. There are people in the congress they have loyalty towards Israel - can I make a statement in here?

GOLDSTEIN: --protection under the law? Is that what your loyalty - she talks sounds more like an Islamic extremist--

SIBLANI: Can I, can I?

INGRAHAM: OK. One at a time.

SIBLANI: Can I make a statement here that the Republicans is using anti- Semitism in order to blackmail the Democrats and that should not happen. You should not allow it. Republicans should not be using anti-Semitism in order to stifle the debate or to blackmail the Democratic Party.

INGRAHAM: Osama, Nancy Pelosi condemned - it's all about the Benjamin's baby comment, OK.

SIBLANI: Nancy Pelosi is a pro-Israel congresswoman.

INGRAHAM: --is she part of the conspiracy? So she is part of the conspiracy - the Jewish conspiracy, is that what you are, sounds like you are getting toward the same territory that Ilhan Omar--

SIBLANI: I don't believe that there is a Jewish conspiracy. I believe that there is a pro-Israeli conspiracy.

INGRAHAM: OK. Well, the--

GOLDSTEIN: What--

SIBLANI: The pro-Israel elements in our society are trying to silence the debate.

GOLDSTEIN: --and the Democrat can deny that.

INGRAHAM: All right. We're going to - we got to continue this. I appreciate you guys both coming on - coming up, by the way. This singer R. Kelly, this explosive new interview that just came out, he's another victim - everybody's a victim here. Dr. Drew Pinsky joins me next exclusively. Stay there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

INGRAHAM: Singer R. Kelly is speaking out for the first time since being arrested and charged on 10 counts of felony, aggravated sexual abuse of young girls. He's been accused of everything from child pornography to running a sex cult over the past 25 years. But Kelly maintains his innocence and that he's the real victim.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

R. KELLY; AMERICAN SINGER-SONGWRITER: I didn't do this stuff. This is not me. I'm fighting for my (bleep) life. You're telling me what this (bleep). I can't - (bleep)

GAYLE KING, CBS NEWS REPORTER: Robert.

KELLY: Are you all trying to kill me? You're killing me now. Y'all just don't want to believe the truth. You don't want to believe it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Joining me now exclusively is an old friend Drew Pinsky, an addiction specialist and doctor to the stars. Dr. Drew what do you make of that interview? He's obviously extremely emotional, explosive and I was worried about Gayle King for a moment there.

DR. DREW PINSKY, CELEBRITY DOCTOR: Yes. I'm - it's good to see Laura, by the way. And I got to tell you, this is - a lot of celebrities have been scrutinized lately. And this is the first time I've been frightened for him, for somebody. I'm fearful this guy could hurt himself.

I mean, he really - his back is against the wall. He's financially in very serious trouble. He couldn't afford his bail. He couldn't afford child support. So today he was arrested on this. He can't have access to his children. He's being accused of very serious crimes. He is in big trouble and he is in desperate straits. So I'm actually worried about this guy.

INGRAHAM: Well, does it seem to some extent - can you tell, I mean, it's difficult - it almost seems like it's like an ongoing reality show drama. The standing up, hitting your chest - I mean it seems - it seems choreographed a little bit. I mean, if I had to - I'm not an expert you are. But that's just a layman's view.

PINSKY: Well, what you're looking at is you're thinking to yourself, I think you don't protest too much, right? It's like, real too much, it's excessive, doesn't mean he did that. We just don't know. We can't know for sure.

I mean, look, we're looking at a lot - we are looking at lot of celebrities' life with a new lens. I feel like we've all woken up from the slumber of the 70s when anything goes - I mean look at some of the lyrics from music from that era, they're talking about 14 year olds half the time.

You know all of a sudden we've begun to scrutinize these people that we have idolized, merely because of their music or their appearance on television or movies, and it is - it has been seductive and it is ridiculous. We're looking at things very realistically now. Go ahead.

INGRAHAM: Yes, he talked about what the parents of the girls - the alleged victims, their role in all of this. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GAYLE KING, CBS NEWS REPORTER: Azriel Clary, what can you tell - what is your relationship with her?

R. KELLY; AMERICAN SINGER-SONGWRITER: Right now? I'm seeing her. She is 21, I'm seeing her.

KING: She is 21?

KELLY: Yes.

KING: But did you start seeing het at 17?

KELLY: Absolutely not.

KING: Did you have sex with her when she was 17?

KELLY: Absolutely, not. Absolutely, not. Although, her parents wanted me to--

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Again, Dr. Drew, I mean, could that happen? I guess, it could if parents--

PINSKY: Well, you must have seen the--

INGRAHAM: --wanted money, I guess.

PINSKY: You must not have seen the Michael - you must not have seen the Michael Jackson leaving Neverland documentary, where - whether or not those allegations are true or not. You see how for somebody to be seduced - to seduce a young person, you have to seduce the entire family.

And fame - we have such - we elevate people with fame to such a degree, we are easily seduced by it and it's possible. I don't know. We just don't know what has actually gone on. One of the things he did say, a couple things came - jump down to me about his interview that I thought we're very interesting.

One is, he compartmentalized a lot. He talked about our R. Kelley vs. Robert and my understanding is he had some very serious trauma himself, and that's how people who are traumatized think. They compartmentalize the self and their emotions and that's sometimes how they carry out things that are not good.

This compartmentalized piece of themselves is disavowed. That's not really me. I'm really Robert. And they can do some awful stuff and be a good person at the same time. That's one thing that jumped out at me in this particular interview. There seemed to be a good deal of compartmentalization.

The other thing is something that I see celebrities do all the time which is the name they use out in the world, R. Kelly, again, versus Robert, it's not just compartmentalization. The thing you know of as the celebrity, they distance themselves from, as though that's just a cartoon character, so when people criticize that celebrity, R. Kelly, the it doesn't get to me, Robert.

INGRAHAM: Dr. Drew, I also want to get your thoughts on another big story you mentioned, the issue with Michael Jackson. And HBO is out with this new documentary about M.J. called "Leaving Neverland." And it details years the superstar allegedly abused two young boys. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's no thoughts of this is wrong or anything like that.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He told me if they ever found out what we were doing, he and I would go to jail for the rest of our lives.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Dr. Drew, why is this coming out now? I mean, it was -- he was on trial. He won, he had settlements. He's dead. What's going on here?

PINSKY: We don't know these guys, we don't know if the allegations are true or not. But I will tell you the documentary shows, again, the grooming process, precisely how it happens. If you saw Oprah's interview after the "Leaving Neverland" second part, she talks about that, how this is a really important for people to understand, that it's something people are drawn into. It's not painful and it's not an attack. It's a grooming process. And by the same token, because they loved that celebrity, they loved Michael Jackson, they wanted to protect them, they had all these ambivalent feelings that when they really woke up to what he had been doing to them, there was a flood of emotions and then there was a desire to talk about it.

So the theory here, if these allegations are true, is they finally got enough distance. And in fact in both men's' case, it was the fact that they had children that they started to look at the child and go, oh, my God, something did something to me when I was young. This unbelievable, and that's where the emotional flood broke through. And somebody chose to tell the story, whether it's true or not.

INGRAHAM: Again, he's obviously not around to defend himself. None of us knows if it's true or false. But that's the difficulty with doing --

PINSKY: Like I said, I just think we are waking up from a slumber. I really do. I really believe that we are waking up from a slumber from the '70s. I've been saying this -- all the years I was on "Love Line," I kept saying there is horrible things going on and we were accepting it. When you look at the pictures of Michael Jackson running around of the kids, you go, oh, my God. We were all groomed into accepting that. We have been through a period of history where a lot of things were acceptable that were not acceptable. And I think we are just waking up to that.

INGRAHAM: I think a lot of things are still acceptable -- I disagree. I think there's a lot of stuff that is pushing the envelope in family hour TV. That's all out the window.

PINSKY: Agreed. But we are waking up.

INGRAHAM: I think on some of this stuff, but I think the envelope is pushed. Watch some of the award shows, the way people --

PINSKY: No, you're absolutely correct. You're correct. I don't disagree with you at all, but there is stuff we are waking up to as though we have been in some kind of weird slumber. Just look at the lyrics of songs from the '70s sometime and think about what some of these rock stars were doing with young children, and people are like oh, they are rock stars. What are we supposed to do? Well, we are waking up.

INGRAHAM: Michael Jackson actually responded to some of these allegations in an interview on "60 Minutes" back in 2009 with Ed Bradley. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL JACKSON, SINGER: If I would hurt a child, I would slit my wrists. I would never hurt a child.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you still think that it's acceptable to share your bed with children?

JACKSON: Of course. Of course. Why not?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: He went on to say as long as it's platonic. And that was in 2003, by the way.

PINSKY: No, no, no, no. Nothing OK about it. I don't care who the 30- year-old man is, no. I don't care who he is. I don't care if half of his brain tissue is gone, no, no, no. That is not OK. If you read and watch the documentary, the kids talk about how they would go to toy stories and load baskets full of toys and run out. You would not let that happen as a parent. Your job is to teach kids how to get effectively into the world. And guess what, the world can be a very frustrating place. You don't get what you want all the time. Just that very -- just going to the toy store has me jumping out of my skin.

INGRAHAM: Again, where were the parents? It's the same question, where were the parents?

PINSKY: Seduced. They were seduced.

INGRAHAM: Everybody is seduced by the fame. Dr. Drew, it's great to see you. It's great to have you on tonight.

PINSKY: You, as well. Thank you, I appreciate it.

INGRAHAM: Up next, Will Smith facing backlash for, get this, not being black enough for a new role.

And wait until you see how a CNN panel reacted to a new Democrat star? Raymond Arroyo breaks it all down in this week's "Seen and Unseen," next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

INGRAHAM: It's time for our "Seen and Unseen" segment, where we expose the big cultural stories of the day.

Will Smith is under fire for not being black enough for Hollywood, and CNN features a Democratic star. Joining us now with all the details, Raymond Arroyo, FOX News contributor, "New York Times" bestselling author of the brand new book, "Will Wilder and The Amulet of Power." Congrats on that, Raymond.

RAYMOND ARROYO, CONTRIBUTOR: Thank you.

INGRAHAM: What is happening with Will Smith?

ARROYO: Will Smith, this might be -- we should have called this segment "Heard and Unheard" because I've got a little voice. This is what happens when you ride too hard in the floats with Ingraham.

INGRAHAM: That's a Mardi Gras joke.

ARROYO: Will Smith can't get a break where color is concerned, Laura. A few weeks ago, social media exploded over his role in "Aladdin." Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You really don't know who I am? Genie, wishes, lamp, none of that ringing a bell?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ARROYO: They said he was too blue.

INGRAHAM: Too blue?

ARROYO: Too blue. Now Smith has been cast to play Richard Williams, the father of Serena and Venus Williams, in a new biopic called "King Richard." Even prominent figures have taken to Twitter claiming Will Smith is not black enough to play the role. Clarence Hill wrote "Colorism matters. Love Will Smith, but there are other black actors for this role." George M. Johnson, "Just like Chadwick shouldn't have played Thurgood Marshall, Will should not play Richard. Skin color matters in how folks are to treated and navigated spaces. Is Alexandria Shipp playing Venus?"

Laura, I have a huge problem with this. It is constricting creative freedom and expression of artists, actors. They should be up in arms over this. In fact, I'm going to put up a picture of Will Smith. This is he and Dr. Bennet Omalu. This is a doctor he played in the movie "Concussion."

INGRAHAM: Which was a great movie.

ARROYO: You'll see Smith is much lighter than Dr. Omalu. Who cares? And by the way, Omalu loved Smith's performance. Chadwick Boseman played Jackie Robinson. Notice anything different? As you can see, he's actually a little darker than Jackie Robinson. Who cares?

INGRAHAM: Who care?

ARROYO: But we are focusing on this. And the new rule is you cannot play a race not your own as an actor. That's horrible. When you have got Ben Kingsley winning Academy Awards for Gandhi, Laurence Olivier playing Othello in a career-defining role. We should be open to actors' ingenuity and creativity are not closing the doors on anybody, black white, light, dark, it doesn't matter.

INGRAHAM: I loved "Hamilton." I loved it.

ARROYO: And Lin-Manuel would not have been able to play that role because he's took dark for the role, right?

INGRAHAM: Or too white -- dark, white. But I don't know, you keep going down this road, it's going to be --

ARROYO: We should be judged by the quality of our performances, not by the color of our skin.

INGRAHAM: And CNN this week convened a panel of voters who had voted for Hillary Clinton. When they were asked about Democratic upstart AOC, the panel went wild.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She's a badass. I love her.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Wow. What a woman.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Amazing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: She is the candidate of the future.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: She has the Democratic Party nervous. She really personifies where we expect things to go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Where we expect things to go.

ARROYO: Laura, whatever Ms. Cortez's social media skills, these voters are captivated by her image. One of them called her smart and intelligent. Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ALEXANDRA OCASIO-CORTEZ, D-N.Y.: And if we work our butts off to make sure that we take back all three chambers of congress, rather, all three chambers of government, the presidency, the Senate, and the House --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ARROYO: The presidency, the Senate, and the House. I think she meant the Congress and the judiciary --

INGRAHAM: The chambers of government. Branches, chambers, that's a formality.

ARROYO: Who is paying attention?

INGRAHAM: No, that's a formality.

ARROYO: They are wrapped up in her social media presence.

INGRAHAM: What does that tell you about branding?

ARROYO: It's everything now. It's everything.

INGRAHAM: Branding. That's why you always say Republicans are woefully bad at storytelling. Even on the border issue today, Kirstjen Nielsen has these dramatic numbers at the border.

ARROYO: Right.

INGRAHAM: And she is presenting the facts, but the way you present them is also important, yes? It might have kind of set that up.

ARROYO: As you can tell from our ashes, and you look like you did a drive- by.

INGRAHAM: The priest did a drive-by on me. He's like, get out of here.

ARROYO: I got the pastor's revenge. This is the biggest sinner in the world.

INGRAHAM: He really pressed down on you.

ARROYO: Today is Lent. People are giving up different things. Some churches are suggesting people give up plastic, plastic bags. I don't know why that would be. This is about subduing the flesh and conforming your will to God's. I don't know how giving up a plastic bag is going to get you there.

INGRAHAM: I'm against plastic. You know I go to the beach and I pick up plastic. I'm like one of those craze old people.

ARROYO: Are you against floss? Do you floss your teeth?

INGRAHAM: Yes I do. I do like floss.

ARROYO: That's plastic.

INGRAHAM: There's too much plastic. But the priest today at mass said it's not about you. It's not about you. I'm giving up -- it's about your relationship with God.

ARROYO: Right, and what he sees.

INGRAHAM: And what you do after Lent.

ARROYO: I'm not going to tell you what I'm giving up.

INGRAHAM: What are you giving up?

ARROYO: I'm giving up watching those R. Kelly interviews. Is this my camera? Is that my camera? Do I look stupid? Do I look stupid to you?

INGRAHAM: You've got to beat your chess. Then you'll fall over and they'll blame me for pushing you over.

ARROYO: But Gayle King, she got it early.

INGRAHAM: Gayle King handled that really well.

ARROYO: She was really good.

INGRAHAM: She's a total pro.

ARROYO: Sit down, Robert. Sit down.

INGRAHAM: All right, Raymond, thanks so much.

And stay there, because Hillary Clinton gets fact-checked on her racist allegations, the culture of victimology, and the socialism rising. Yes, a very special guest, renowned economist Tom Sowell is here next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

INGRAHAM: Oh, boohoo, Hillary Clinton seems to say she's not running in 2020, but she is running with the race card.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, D-FORMER PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I was the first person who ran for president without the protections of the Voting Rights Act, and I will tell you it makes a really big difference. It made a difference in Wisconsin where the best studies that have been done said somewhere between 40 and 80,000 people were turned away from the polls because of the color of their skin.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: Guess what. "The Washington Post" gave her four Pinocchios for that blatant lie -- 80,000 people turned away from polls? Joining me now on this and so much more, renowned economist, old friend, Tom Sowell, senior fellow at the Hoover Institution, author of the phenomenal book, "Discrimination and Disparities," which is now out in a revised and enlarged edition. Tom, thanks for being here. Why is Hillary saying that? I think she knows it's not true. So why?

THOMAS SOWELL, SENIOR FELLOW, HOOVER INSTITUTE: Because she thinks it will get her some votes. That's the reason politicians say a lot of things and aren't true.

INGRAHAM: Hillary Clinton, so many others are now talking about reparations. Trump is a racist. It's race, race, race, race, race. Immigration policy is racist. The race word is the constant. It's like abortion and race in today's Democrat party.

SOWELL: It is. And I have a feeling that many Americans would just as soon not hear any more about race. But there are people for whom this is their ticket to whatever racket they are running, including the political racket. And it's tragic. What's tragic is that there are so many people out there who simply respond to words rather than ask themselves, is what this person says true? How can I check it? And so on.

INGRAHAM: Do you think that with that Jussie Smollett case in Chicago, and now we have this R. Kelly guy who was accused of -- R. Kelly is not focusing on race, but the Smollett case became one about race. And it was almost like there were certain people out there who were disappointed when it seemed like this thing with a big hoax. They wanted this to be a racial incident, a racial hate crime, reinforcing the stereotypes that this is what's wrong with society today, the overriding problem in society today is one of race, Tom.

SOWELL: Well, it's like in football. They are to run that play until someone finds a way to stop it. And as long as it pays off, they're going to keep doing it. What's painful to me is how few people there are today who bother to check out the facts. In many cases, just the smallest effort at checking out the facts would cause so many of these things to fall apart. And we have a whole history of this, going back to the Tawana Brawley woman back in the 19-somethings, and then the Duke Lacrosse case. So there have been any number of these things. But as long as they keep succeeding politically, they will continue to run that play.

INGRAHAM: Do you think President Trump would do well to make, like, monthly trips to underserved, more underprivileged areas, or to traditionally black colleges, communities of color, where he can just talk about why his policies are working, and why the economy is growing opportunities, jobs, greater employment, et cetera. Would you recommend that he do that?

SOWELL: I don't think that the venue matters that much. But there has to be some thoughtful notions about how free markets and other kinds of activities that are different from one are normally heard, how those things impact. And I don't see any sign of that of any significance unfortunately from the Republicans. I never cease to be amazed at how many opportunities they let go by.

Right now, for example, Democrats around the country are lining up to stop charter schools from expanding, trying to cut back on them. And many of them are the very schools that are most successful, are the ones they are zeroing in on, places like Success Academy or KIPP Schools, and so forth. And the Democrats, I understand they have to do that because they are beholden to the teachers' unions. But why the Republicans don't say anything about it, that is what baffles me.

INGRAHAM: Truly pro-choice initiatives that actually help individuals instead of just focusing on blocks of individuals.

Dr. Sowell, AOC, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, she has spoken a lot about socialism and being a Democrat Socialist. She is a young person, 28 years old. But she is representing a decent chunk of the Democrat Party today. I want to play something for you and have you react. Let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OCASIO-CORTEZ: When millennials talk about concepts like Democratic Socialism, we are not talking about these kinds of red scare bogeyman. We are talking about single-payer health care. We are talking about tuition free public colleges and universities. We are talking about a living wage. We are talking about guaranteed basic levels of dignity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: It sounds good to a lot of young people, and this focus group from CNN we just alluded to, and they seem very excited about these concepts. What are Republicans not doing?

SOWELL: The Republicans are not saying anything that I've heard. Of course, all these things sound wonderful. It's just that we now have more than half a century of knowledge, a track record of these kinds of ideas being put into practice in countries around the world and failing time and time again. Not merely failing, but making things worse than they were before. Venezuela is the classic case. And yet during the whole period when people are starving in Venezuela under socialism, the young people right out of our colleges are flocking to Bernie Sanders because they are judging by his words and how wonderful it sounds and not by what happens when you try to put those notions into practice, as has been tried again in countries in Europe, Asia, Africa, South America.

INGRAHAM: It's failed everywhere. This is the worst repeat failed experiment we've ever seen. Dr. Tom Sowell, it is so great to see you tonight. Come back soon. Love your books.

SOWELL: Thank you very much.

INGRAHAM: So many of my friends are texting me, saying tell them we are huge fans. All right, Dr. Sowell, thank you so much.

We'll be right back with tonight's Last Bite.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

INGRAHAM: The Last Bite. "Jeopardy." host Alex Trebek announced tonight that he has stage four pancreatic cancer. But he's still keeping the humor and the faith.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEX TREBEK, "JEOPARDY." HOST: I have to host "Jeopardy." for three more years. So help me keep the faith, and we'll win. We'll get it done. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

INGRAHAM: We're praying for you tonight, Alex. And that's all the time we have tonight. Shannon and the "Fox News @ Night" team, take it from here.

Shannon?

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