Police officers under attack: Treatment of cops in America

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," May 14, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Greg Gutfeld along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Eric Bolling and she pole vaults with a chopstick, it's Dana Perino: "The Five."

For the last few days a sick creep has roamed New York City attacking women with a hammer. Yesterday, he assaulted a female cop and her partner filled him with lead. Nice. Here's police Chief Bratton:


BILL BRATTON, NYPD COMMISSIONER: These officers had no chance to call for assistance, but rather they acted quickly and instinctively. Indeed, the whole incident that you will see took about three seconds from start to finish. During that, the officer O'Rourke was attempting to call on her radio as she was being struck and fell to the ground, her partner officer, making a literally split second decision to save her life, shot the suspect, seriously wounding him. Again, I want to commend both officers for their alertness and their behavior during the performance of this incident.


GUTFELD: So why are we covering this? Well, it's Police Week and FNC must balance the other networks' obsession with police misconduct. After all, who stopped this fiend? Not a student activist stinking of bong water or a CNN hack in fake glasses full of faux concern. Two beat cops did and they didn't hesitate for fear of outrage. Do you think Sharpton or your typical social justice screamer would have stopped this guy? Those cops did more in three seconds than they will do in a lifetime. It reveals who stands between you and the world's worst threats. Could you ever handle that job, Mayor de Blasio? No, you're busy staining the country on a self-promoting tour touting history's failures as new ideas:


BILL DE BLASIO, NEW YORK CITY MAYOR: We pledge to reach out all over the country to hundreds and hundreds of our fellow progressives and start a movement that would reach all the way here to Washington, D.C. and make an impact, so we could finally address income inequality.


GUTFELD: He's worse than Mayor McCheese. If he only knew the thin blue line separates us from the horribles.

Speaking of, the attacker is schizophrenic with many violent arrests, a pile of weapons and a public passion for blood dripping hammers. He was allowed to roam the streets like a lion loose in a playground. Until we rebuild our institutions for the mentally ill, such attacks will repeat and the only people who will stop them are the cops maligned for their fearlessness. That's true bravery, which in the face of easy criticism and outright insanity might be called senseless.

K.G --


GUTFELD: That's was great --


GUTFELD: That's great police work, but you're not going to hear about it, are you?

GUILFOYLE: No, and they caught a guy that was a suspect, that was at large, that was hurting women, wielding this hammer, you know trying to kill people and they dropped him, and this is after he assaulted a female officer. So thank God for their training and a split is second decision to be able to do this and put him down and avoid further harm. Then you've got to talk about the other issue, which is the state of mental illness in this country and what we doing about it? Because what you have is as the seasons change, people migrate that are suffering from mental illness from one town to the next depending on how the weather is. San Francisco in particular, pretty general like climate, like good not a lot of true seasons, so people like to go there and that's what you to. So, you know unfortunately, yes, our prisons are overcrowded with felons, with serious offenders. So, and the few beds that we have for mental health patients, you know are quickly filled up, people are dispensed some drugs and sent back out on their way.

GUTFELD: Yeah, it's absolutely right. The prison isn't a place for the mentally ill. Juan, this guy had a history of mental illness. So effectively, we're turning our police officers into frontier psychologists. They are the guys out here better doing the -- the shrink work that they shouldn't be doing.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: This is absolutely right. I must say this is right across political lines. I mean --


WILLIAMS: It surprise, but Hillary Rodman Clinton in her so-called listening tour, when she came at, the one thing that she said was, everybody from Nebraska to Manhattan is saying, we've got to do something about the rising percentage of mental illness in this country, we've got a find a way to deal with it. And you know, you look at the numbers, I'm seeing here, it said 15 percent of state prison inmates, psychiatric disorders and not only that, there's a high level of psychiatric illness among people who are homeless in this country. Again, you say, oh, they're homeless --

GUILFOYLE: It's sad.

WILLIAMS: I'm sorry?

GUILFOYLE: It's sad.

WILLIAMS: It's really. It's -- very sad to me. So this guy is out of control. Now, I will have one point of difference with you, my fair friend, which is I'm not crazy about people shooting people all the time. I don't - - I think this guy is a madman. In fact, I remember reading a novel long ago, one of those deadly sin novels by Lawrence Sanders --


WILLIAMS: Where the guy was hammering people in Manhattan. But, I mean, the idea that you had no alternative but to shoot him, I'm not sure. You've taser --

GUTFELD: Oh, I would -- I think --


GUTFELD: He was hammering a woman's head, Juan.

WILLIAMS: I agree.

GUILFOYLE: Oh my, gosh.

WILLIAMS: No, no, no. I don't -- there's no defense there.

GUILFOYLE: Juan, you don't have a quarrel with this particular situation, do you, because these are like life and death circumstances.

WILLIAMS: No. I think what the commissioner -- Commissioner Bratton was right. It was a split second decision. He had to do what you have to do.


WILLIAMS: To protect your partner, no questions asked. But I'm just saying, there is a tendency -- they don't shoot him, and I'm just never gonna bother that.

GUILFOYLE: I don't know. What are you gonna do? You go back and get the beanbag thing and tell her family when her head is bashed (ph) in --

WILLIAMS: Did I say -- did I say beanbag?

GUILFOYLE: I'm so sorry. I couldn't get the beanbag.

WILLIAMS: Oh, oh, stop.

GUILFOYLE: Stun gun, pepper spray.

WILLIAMS: You know tasers exist. You know -- you have tackling people are not.

GUTFELD: But this is an interesting point, Eric, is that -- we are now introducing into a police officer's mind, the fear of this -- of making a decision.

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: The split second decision is --


BOLLING: At the very heart of this. And when Juan says things like I'm not sure he should have been shot, that adds more indecision in the split second decision. Those are the types of things you hear from the left, you hear from de Blasio, you hear from liberals saying, hey, maybe there is a lot of issues with police and say the -- the African-American community. It puts a question in their minds, should I stop him? Should I frisk him? Should I shoot him? Is he going to kill or hurt -- kill somebody? And that missing out on that split second decision might, might actually kill people.


BOLLING: A lot of people --

GUILFOYLE: Cause to life.

BOLLING: Very quickly, also in play is all this discussion about whether or not cops are good or bad is a drain on the morale. Morale will kill any organization whether it's a sports team, whether it's a business --


BOLLING: Whether it's a military or whether it's a police department. One thing you don't want is a low morale, military or police department. So, the discussions we have, Juan, we should be applauding this cop for making the split second decision --


BOLLING: And taking out a bad guy. Was he mentally handicapped? He may have been, but at the time he was wielding a hammer --


BOLLING: And could have killed is somebody.

GUTFELD: Yeah, absolutely.

WILLIAMS: But let me just say as a human being, you should hesitate anytime you use deadly force against another human being.

BOLLING: I -- I would agree with you, but that's -- that hesitation should be a split second goal.

WILLIAMS: Oh, that's what it was --

BOLLING: You know what? Someone may die here -- goodbye.


GUTFELD: I ain't yet --

GUILFOYLE: Your life. It doesn't -- just (inaudible) shooting.

GUTFELD: But if I -- you see somebody with a hammer hitting a woman, shoot him.

BOLLING: Yeah --


BOLLING: Split second.

GUTFELD: Dana, de Blasio is going all over. His preaching the progressive word, his preaching stuff that never worked. That you know, shouldn't he be spending less time there in -- New York, preventing his city from imploding?

PERINO: I actually think he might be more popular outside of New York --


PERINO: Than he has here.

GUILFOYLE: Let him stay there.

GUTFELD: Well, that's -- much same thing like hepatitis.

GUILFOYLE: Greg, don't encourage him to come back. Don't encourage him --

GUTFELD: It was like --

GUILFOYLE: To come back. GUTFELD: OK. Hepatitis is great if it's not in your city.

PERINO: That's true. Let me tell you something, I think that he's picking the right moment -- right? So the left is ready for this. Look at Al Sharpton -- is that Al Sharpton right behind him? He's picking a moment to say, this is what the left do -- I can't tell if it is, but it looks like him.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, yes. Yeah.


WILLIAMS: I think so.

PERINO: The party has moved so far to the left, that now they're like insatiable, they want for of it. OK. So President Obama -- just had that big failure on trade at the hands of the Democrats. It's going to get fixed today, because Republicans are doing that for him. But the Democrats want to hear more of this progressive talk, like he can pick a moment and -- de Blasio is smart. He knows that this is the opening, because people are not that enchanted with Hillary Clinton, although they're likely to support her, but they're' looking for a different voice. Elizabeth Warren and de Blasio are actually filling that void.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God, please.

PERINO: They are.

GUILFOYLE: He's ruin New York. And please don't tell me, you think he has further political aspirations.

PERINO: I think that's exactly why he is on a tour.


BOLLING: He is on a national tour, now talking about income inequality, infrastructure and other liberal progressive ideas.


BOLLING: Why isn't he here? I mean, we have a city that is literally --

PERINO: Because I think he probably thinks that he's --

BOLLING: You know, at -- on the verge.

PERINO: I think he finally feels like he's done all he can do here.

BOLLING: Good. (ph)

PERINO: I don't think he think he's doing a bad job.

GUILFOYLE: The only one because it's like, five people showed up unfortunately for that election.

BOLLING: No, no, the question is, is he running for something else?


GUTFELD: Oh, he is.

PERINO: I think he's definitely positioning himself for higher office in the future, definitely.

GUTFELD: Yeah, but he plays a part of it --

GUTFELD: I think he's running for pot czar.

GUILFOYLE: He is part of the Clinton machine, very close to them. So he is not gonna even, think about stepping --

BOLLING: No, I don't mean for president. I mean the higher aspirations --

PERINO: Something? BOLLING: The higher political aspirations.

PERINO: Senate?

GUILFOYLE: One of the czar positions.

GUTFELD: I mean, this week is national police week and I think -- I'm sorry, I feel like Fox News is the --

GUILFOYLE: I like your blue.

GUTFELD: Thank you. Are we the only network that's talking about it? I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong.

PERINO: I don't watch other networks.

GUTFELD: I do -- I watch every network, when I am at the gym on the stair climber.

WILLIAMS: Oh, you know what? --

PERINO: Oh, I did too. You're right. They don't play - they don't air Fox.

GUTFELD: I don't see any --

WILLIAMS: Well, let me tell you, NBC, it's just police week.


WILLIAMS: Because they -- that's where police come to celebrate and we have a major monument to police --


WILLIAMS: And police sacrifices and names of police officers who were killed in the line of duty.


WILLIAMS: And I think that, you know what? There's such an outpouring. This is where -- again, you and I differ. I think most Americans have an innate respect for the police and for their authority.

GUTFELD: I agree.

WILLIAMS: So this is not a party of, oh, we don't like police. It's a matter of saying, do you know what, police have the color of authority to use deadly force and when police act in a way that's not consistent with the tremendous respect people have for them they should be able to say, hey, something is wrong here. You're a public service.

GUTFELD: But the emphasis on isolated events gets more attention in the media, and -- who kowtow to activists as opposed to pointing out these great events that happen when lives are saved.

BOLLING: Can I add -- can I point it out --

GUILFOYLE: But how about going up to an officer and say thank you or you can hug them like I do.

BOLLING: And why are we not --

WILLIAMS: Is that right?



BOLLING: Juan, as you point out on those instances where you think police may act inappropriately, how about the number that we have in a research that last year in 2014, cops killed in the line of duty up 89 percent from the prior years.


BOLLING: So, all this hesitation, all this question, I'm going to get called out? Am I doing the right thing? Is de Blasio going to say stop and frisk is bad? Should I -- is it contributing to higher fatality rates among police officers? --

WILLIAMS: Well, no --

BOLLING: I hope not. I hope not.

WILLIAMS: Of course not. And you know, you --

PERINO: Because it's agitating.

WILLIAMS: You throw out that number--

BOLLING: Because it's agitating, yeah.

WILLIAMS: You throw out that number without telling people. Yes, there was a big jump last year.


WILLIAMS: But in fact, it's lower than what the average is of officers killed each year with the 64 --

BOLLING: No doubt. No, I --

WILLIAMS: So I mean, just be fair.

BOLLING: It was a jump last year and we don't know what this year will bring either --


BOLLING: So you can't say -- it's not a trend yet.


WILLIAMS: I hope it's not a trend.

BOLLING: Me, too.


GUTFELD: Let's trend out. Coming up, more controversy surrounding the Clinton Foundation this time involving, large donations from ABC News, chief -- Political Anchor George Stephanopoulos.



GUILFOYLE: ABC News chief political anchor and former Bill Clinton operative, George Stephanopoulos has long celebrated the idea of a Hillary presidential run.


GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, CHIEF ANCHOR OF ABC NEWS: It's pretty clear that, if she decides to run based on what we know now for at least a while, she will be the front runner. And certainly, be one of the most experienced if not, the most experienced person ever to run for president.

(END VIDEO CLIP) GUILFOYLE: Today, we are learning that Stephanopoulos gave $75,000 to her family's foundation between 2012 and 2014. Some think he conveniently didn't disclose while covering Hillary's 2016 bid. Further complicating matters for Stephanopoulos are his recent attempts to discredit claims of Shady foreign donations to the Clinton Foundation laid out in Peter Schweizer expose, Clinton Cash. Here's the ABC anchor, aggressively challenging Schweizer on ABC this week and questioning the books claims on The Daily Show.


STEPHANOPOULOS: This is a tough one. Because, when you actually look at -- look closely at it, he even says, there's no evidence of any direct action taken on behalf of the donors. Do you have any evidence that a crime may have been committed?

PETER SCHWEIZER, AUTHOR, CLINTON CASH: I'm certainly -- I think it warrants investigation. What that investigation --

STEPHANOPOULOS: A criminal investigation?

SCHWEIZER: We'll see. And I think the evidence here is far more widespread in terms of repeated action than there were in those two --

STEPHANOPOULOS: As you know the Clinton campaign says you haven't produced a shred of evidence. We've done investigative work here at ABC News, found no proof of any kind of direct action.


GUILFOYLE: Hey, Eric, you have some strong opinions about this.

BOLLING: Yeah. And even before the Schweizer book came out when they announced -- when they initially announced what the debate schedule was, I had pointed out -- maybe it was when Hillary Clinton announced that she was going to run for president. I pointed out if Stephanopoulos who was salted into host, to monitor the debates, there would be a conflict of interest there. Now, that was before Stephanopoulos came clean today with his three -- $25,000 annual donations to the Clinton Foundation. So that makes it even, even more egregious. Stephanopoulos has now said he's gonna be there. Look, they have David Muir, they have backups second do it. He, he probably -- it's not even that he made these donations. It's that he pretended not to even talk about these donations, and then went ahead and defended the Clinton Foundation so aggressively. Can I just -- Dave Burgess is a great blogger, he'd sent me something. I think this is really (inaudible). Back in -- in the book, in search of Bill Clinton. In this book, they talk about Clinton quote, "Clinton, was usually blow at least once in the morning and straight into the face of George Stephanopoulos" that was Bill Clinton, and Stephanopoulos reported that "during the '92 campaign, each day, he braced for the morning outburst." So clearly Stephanopoulos and Bill Clinton and the Clintons have a very close relationship. Some would call it incestuous relationship. He should have recused himself a long time ago from any of the debates and maybe, even discussing anything to do with Hillary Clinton, possibly interviews with Hillary Clinton, too.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Dana, what's your (inaudible)?

PERINO: That would certainly make it hard to be the chief political --


PERINO: Anchor for ABC News. And I think ABC News from a crisis communications standpoint today, realized just how problematic this was and tried to get it all contained --

GUILFOYLE: How do you --

PERINO: In one day.

GUILFOYLE: How do you handle it?

PERINO: Well, I think that -- so, they have a statement from George Stephanopoulos, that then had to be amended later, because it turns out it wasn't $50,000, it was $75,000, so that's -- that's one thing. You never want to have to update a story like this. Second thing, though, is that they said that they -- they agree, ABC News agrees that he should have taken the extra step to notify us and our viewers and especially, during recent news reports about the foundation. But they say, he has admitted to an honest mistake and apologized for that omission and we stand behind him. So they're trying to get this contained in one day. I'm not so sure that's gonna work.

GUTFELD: If he -- but, you know -- you know what the response is to you when you say this, but Dana, you work for the Bush administration. But, you don't pretend -- besides, you bash George constantly, you can't stand him.


PERINO: I wrote a whole book about him.

GUTFELD: Yes. And it was horrible. It was a kiss and tell. But you don't pretend -- I mean, you don't pretend to be objective on your show.

GUILFOYLE: But this is an opinion show.

GUTFELD: Yeah, yeah. Your bias is --

GUILFOYLE: It's an opinion.

GUTFELD: You know, George Bush, your dog and pot brownies --

PERINO: Yeah, there's really no comparison.

GUTFELD: There is no comparison. So about that -- but you know that's going to come out, people are going to say about, wait, look at Fox. But no -- we don't hide it. And --


GUTFELD: Stephanopoulos hides it, and that's the problem.

WILLIAMS: Well, I will tell you what we don't hide. I think this company even gave money to the Clinton Foundation. I think there are lots of conservatives who gave money to the Clinton Foundation. I wouldn't be surprised given Bill Clinton's relationship with the Bush family, if some of the Bush family --


WILLIAMS: Didn't give money to the Clinton Foundation.

BOLLING: So the donations --


GUTFELD: There are problems.

WILLIAMS: No, the donation is not the problem.

BOLLING: It's hiding the donation. It's not --


WILLIAMS: But I think it's right. It's the ethics, it's the journalistic ethics and the fact that even though as George, and I will say this in his defense, he says it's a public record that he made the donations, the flaw here is that he didn't make a point of telling his employer, ABC News, or the audience at a time when he's involved in a fight like --

PERINO: It's a strange lack of judgment.

GUTFELD: Yeah, but --

PERINO: I actually think of -- it's a strange lack of judgment not to be paranoid and to think that maybe I ought to disclose this.

GUTFELD: Can I -- he -- he never thought it was a big deal --

GUILFOYLE: He should have said it was right.

GUTFELD: Because liberals in the media, they have a special key to this universe where they feel that they are exempt from such standards, standards that every conservative gets nailed for. Although, I will say this, great excuse not to donate money, but anybody comes around here with their Girl Scout cookies, I'm going to say --

GUILFOYLE: Oh my, God.

GUTFELD: I'm gonna say, conflict of interest.

GUILFOYLE: Terrible.


GUTFELD: If you decide to run for president.

BOLLING: Can you have the Boy Scouts?

GUTFELD: Yeah --


GUTFELD: They have cookies.


WILLIAMS: That's like Dana and baby showers.



BOLLING: Didn't just keep opening it fired basically for a political contribution that he didn't tell MSNBC about it? I'm pretty sure that's how the whole thing sparked up, right?

PERINO: Well, it was simply because --

GUTFELD: He has been fired many times, more than me.

PERINO: Yeah. With the Clinton Foundation, it makes the case that they do a lot of great work, I mean you had a great phrase about earlier that I probably couldn't repeat. But -- if they don't think about it as a political donation -- but now, in the clear light of day, in the midst of a campaign, it is scene seen as a political donation.

WILLIAMS: Well, I think what it is. It is all of a sudden the Clinton foundation is a highly, hot, politicized item. Given what's happened with the question of foreign donations and at like.

GUILFOYLE: Right. But that's what she's saying.

WILLIAMS: And that's what -- that's what it makes (inaudible). But I'm going to tell you something, I happen to agree if George Stephanopoulos is saying, the Clinton Foundation does good stuff and previously, it wasn't political, this was actually -- gee, Bill Clinton is a big name and he can do good stuff around the world, why not support him.

PERINO: But with Peter Schweizer, when he does the interview about at -- about the Clinton Cash book. He makes a point to say, kind of - you know, dismissively, but also to degrade him to say that you worked for the Bush administration for four months as a speechwriter, therefore, you couldn't possibly be neutral in this book. While at the same time, not disclosing the Clinton Donation, I think --

WILLIAMS: Well, that is like, come on --

PERINO: Yeah, that's not. It's right.

WILLIAMS: Be honest --


GUILFOYLE: But you make the point like why not err on the side of caution.


GUILFOYLE: Given the --


WILLIAMS: Everybody knew --

GUILFOYLE: With the news of the day.

WILLIAMS: Everybody knows Stephanopoulos worked for the Clintons. And then he had that big blow up with the Clintons and arguably, maybe he is trying to get back in with the Clintons, in had advance of the '16 campaign.

BOLLING: Well, what -- what a better way besides making a donation to the Clinton Foundation. Don't forget --

GUILFOYLE: This was better --

BOLLING: This is the guy who is going to be asking the questions of Republicans on stage in the debates. That is very problematic.


PERINO: It's what -- it didn't go well the last time.

BOLLING: Because, because if he's trying to get back in, as you point out with the Clintons --


BOLLING: He can ask questions a certain way. If you have someone who is leading, who is Hillary's number one adversary on the GOP side, he can lean on them hard. Let's say it's Jeb Bush, he can go after Jeb on some of the things he wants to or --

PERINO: But now, it will be harder for him to do that.

BOLLING: Now it really.

PERINO: So now, they are like overcompensate --


GUTFELD: They should have George Stephanopoulos -- he's going to recuse himself completely and have media matters run it.


GUTFELD: Why not?

GUILFOYLE: What a great idea.

BOLLING: Therefore, more fair.

GUTFELD: Well, yeah, more fair and balance? More fair and balance?

GUILFOYLE: Unbelievably.

GUTFELD: Get out there.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, I don't think they're going to be getting called. Perhaps, let's see. Do you think this story is going to have a second day to it?

GUTFELD: It helped the book, let's face it. It just breathed new life into that book.

WILLIAMS: We're having that --

GUILFOYLE: Perhaps it helps that.


GUILFOYLE: Well, I think they --

WILLIAMS: They have to run a bunch of corrections there.

BOLLING: I think he helped himself by saying, he wasn't going to moderate the debate. I think that said in any way.

PERINO: Yes. That's why I said that I think the ABC --

GUILFOYLE: To my point -- they buttoned it up.

WILLIAMS: No, no. No, no. Actually, your bigger problem is Mike Lee the senator from Utah said, he won't go on the Sunday show with Stephanopoulos. Now, that's a problem. If the Republican say --

PERINO: And don't think that he was pretty fair on the Sunday shows -- in some ways, so nobody likes to have to get up and go on the Sunday shows, so that actually --


PERINO: It's like me saying that I'm not going to go to any more baby shows --


PERINO: Because I don't want to go.

GUTFELD: You got hit by a lot of babies.

GUILFOYLE: Right. OK, enough -- about the babies.


GUILFOYLE: Babies are sweet. Something those babies -- all in the baby shower.

Coming up, President Obama has never been one to shy away from lecturing others and now, yet again, he's telling his fellow Christians what issues he thinks they should focus on, details, next.


BOLLING: President Obama has accused both Republicans and the wealthy of not caring enough about the poor. Earlier this week, he decided to go after religious organizations for the same. The president urged Christians to move away from issues like abortion and speak out more aggressively on poverty instead.


BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I think it would be powerful for our faith-based organizations, to speak out on this in a more forceful fashion. When it comes to -- what are you really going to the metaphor (ph)? Like, what's the defining issue? What's the thing that is really gonna capture the essence of who we are as Christians or as Catholics or what have you? That, this is often times viewed as a nice to have, relative to an issue like abortion.


BOLLING: Scratching my head. Greg, you start this one off.

GUTFELD: He need possesses the artificial wisdom of an arrogant grad student who came home to supper, to lecture his mom and dad over thanksgiving. The defining issue, believe it or not, for a lot of Christians, most Christians is abortion, because they're speaking up for -- a living being that cannot speak for itself, and he is basically saying, shut up already. I've said it before, I am not the least bit religious, but at least I stick up for the good work of religion and the cascade of benefits that come from religion. And at least I'm honest when I say that I'm not religious, and President Obama should do the same, because I know he is not religious. I don't buy it for a second and I think he is -- he's a karaoke Christian.

BOLLING: All right, Dana, what about the president telling Catholics, telling Christians what they should stand up for.

PERINO: Well, I would say, Catholics are Christians --




PERINO: That was a very interesting distinction that he tried to make. I'm for the protection of innocence --


PERINO: And I'm -- and I'm for the -- for freedom, which I believe is a universal value that every being -- human being is and that is a gift from God. And that part of that then means that -- you start there, protecting the innocence and then you help everybody along the way. I find it very strange to try to divide the country on religion. We can do more than two things at once.


PERINO: One of the things I talk about in my book is how my mom, through the Lutheran Church. We used to help resettle refugees from the former Soviet Union that would come over. They were trying to resettle in Denver. We used to have to take them washers and dryers and tell them how to get to the store where they wanted to buy the special spice for the grandma. We - - the churches did that. Government was not the ones doing that.

And I think that he could unite or divide, and he chose in this case again to divide. I don't understand it.

BOLLING: Do you want to refute this, Juan?

WILLIAMS: I was looking -- I thought you were talking to Kimberly. I refute. I don't know that it's a refute, but I don't -- I was trying to listen to Dana to pick up on what she was saying. Because it seems to me that all the president did was say, "Do you know what? Clearly, there are differences between liberals and conservatives over issues like abortion, right? OK. So let's not just have the evangelicals and the Catholic Church focus on abortion, but move..."

PERINO: That is so insulting.

WILLIAMS: "... to caring about poverty in a more prominent way."

PERINO: Do you think that -- do you think that's actually what he was saying because if so, if I were the Catholic Church, I would be furious.


PERINO: Who is educating inner-city black children all across America? The Catholic Church.

WILLIAMS: So what? I mean...

PERINO: Why does he say...

GUILFOYLE: He's totally removed from reality, divorced from reality. The work -- I went to all Catholic schools; and the outreach, the community service, children who wouldn't be able to otherwise afford to get a top education. And the Catholic schools will take you in. They will fund it. They have children from all different backgrounds, all different socioeconomic groups. And it's so encouraging to see the role that faith and spirituality and giving back that they play.

GUTFELD: Mormons die helping people, going to countries and they're killed.

BOLLING: All right. Let's do this. Take a listen to this. It stays in the same world. We turn the debate a little bit. Yesterday the House approved a bill banning most abortions after five months. It didn't take long for Hillary Clinton to weigh in, tweeting this.

"When it comes to women's health there are two kinds of experts: women and their doctors. True 40-plus years ago, true today. - H."

But Speaker John Boehner standing firm on his support for that legislation.


REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R-OH), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: We have no obligation, no higher obligation than to speak out for those who can't speak for themselves, to defend the defenseless. That's what this bill does. Because we know that, by five months in the womb, unborn babies are capable of feeling pain and it's morally wrong to inflict pain on an innocent -- human being.


BOLLING: All right, K.G. He's (ph) on your side.

GUILFOYLE: Do you know what? We have a public policy interest and as a country a duty and obligation to preserve the sanctity of life. When you are talking about a five-month-old, that is -- it's unbelievable to me, I don't know who would ever even fathom trying to take a life at that position, because we know that the baby is viable.

WILLIAMS: You know, I'm just surprised to hear that from you.


WILLIAMS: Because look, your life is important, too. And if -- who has an abortion at that late stage? Somebody who is having a medical complication, a problem.

GUILFOYLE: You're assuming -- you're assuming that.

WILLIAMS: No, I'm not making assumptions. You can look at the statistics. That's -- that's rare that women have abortions at that point. And so the women who are doing it, they have an abortion then because they've got a health issue...

GUILFOYLE: Right. If there is a health issue -- if there is a health issue, that's one thing, but you're being naive.

WILLIAMS: ... that's a threat to them or a threat to the baby's wellbeing.

GUILFOYLE: I have sat through these trials, like the trial of Dr. Kermit Gosnell, and there were plenty of people going in and aborting fetuses at that time and that gestational age.

WILLIAMS: That -- that is anecdotal, because it's a statistic that very few people have abortions at that point.

PERINO: No, it's not anecdotal; it's evidence, and that's why he was convicted. It's not just anecdotal.

WILLIAMS: And -- look, I said Gosnell -- but that's not the typical case.

PERINO: But there are exceptions.

WILLIAMS: Let me just -- One More Thing.

PERINO: But there are exceptions for the health of the mother in the bill.

WILLIAMS: No. It's got to be, because that's why Republican women were the ones who bought off this bill in January, because it didn't do enough for the health of the mother.

PERINO: That's why -- that's how the legislative process works. They go back. They fix it to make sure it's very clear the health of the mother is to be the No. 1...

GUILFOYLE: And why not embrace the science and the understanding, instead of operating in ignorance to understand that the baby can feel pain and sensation and all that. Why would you do -- I don't understand that. These are the same people that are, you know, against the death penalty, but they want to kill babies. I don't understand.

GUTFELD: And, again, I'm coming from a purely, I guess, nonreligious perspective. There's no -- me being against abortion has nothing to do with any kind of organized religion at all.

I think abortion sucks for the baby. The odds of getting that far in the competition to be born is astronomical and when you're -- it's like abortion is like getting struck by lightning right before you won the greatest lottery, and that to me is one of the most incredible injustices.

I don't think anything can be done. I think that this is the way the world is, but I don't have to like it.

PERINO: I agree.

BOLLING: We'll leave it right there. Coming up, the class of 2015 had some harsh realities to face after graduation this summer, and it turns out they might have the government to blame. We'll explain next.


PERINO: The graduating class of 2015 has some major hurdles ahead, according to an opinion piece in the Wall Street Journal. The writers warn that this generation might not be as successful as previous ones because of the government. They say the financial burden of rising healthcare costs, taxes, student debt and expensive retirement funds is going to make it harder for young adults to get ahead.

And this is written -- this is a new book called "Disinherited" by Diana Furchtgott-Roth and Jared Meyer, which I -- it's caught my eye because it was interesting to see, Kimberly, 3.5 million of them graduated. They're all going to be trying to find jobs. And they were making the case that regulations, including one of them, for example, if you want to be an interior designer it takes six years to get that license. And so you're accumulating the debt, and you're not getting the experience and the money in the meantime. That's just one example.

GUILFOYLE: It's really true. And it affects the overall economy, because they are so busy being in debt they have less discretionary income to be able -- that's going to be out to be consumers to help feed the whole system.

So it's tough. I find it -- it's hard. I feel bad for kids these days graduating, because there are fewer opportunities; and they have larger student debt. It's tougher to kind of get a start and get a head -- especially with some of these jobs. I mean, interior decorator, my God, you spend less time in medical school.

PERINO: Well, they actually make the point that an EMT, you can actually do that in a matter of a couple months.

Eric, the unemployment rate for youth between ages of 20 and 24 is 9.6 percent, compared with 4.5 percent for those 25 and older. Do you see that becoming a longer term problem and trend?

BOLLING: That's -- that's actually better over the last couple of years. It was to the 10 and 11 percent for a good long while.

They're saddled with a lot of debt, as Kimberly points out. They're going to come out of debt saddled with a lot of debt. Also with -- almost with like an entitlement attitude. They're -- honestly, I'm not being sarcastic, but they're just -- they're not a hard-working group of young people right now coming out. Maybe that will change.

It also -- there's an effect that's going on right now. There's massive amount of wealth in America. So people are leaving. They're dying off. Grandparents are dying, leaving it. Parents are dying, leaving it. This is somehow going to -- I don't know how this this is going to work out, but there is a good percentage of America's youth are going to be bailed out because they're going to inherit a lot of money.

So the title is the book is "Disinherited."

PERINO: Right.

BOLLING: I think it's the opposite. I think they're going to be -- there's a huge wealth transfer that's going to go to these people. But...

GUILFOYLE: Not really, given the taxes.

PERINO: We should want them to be successful. Right?

BOLLING: The point being that they may actually not...

PERINO: Have to work as hard.

BOLLING: Maybe find other avenues of...

PERINO: The AARP, which is the...


PERINO: ... for retired persons, spent last year $25 million on lobbying and -- but there is no corresponding lobbying group for youth.

GUTFELD: And their lobbies are terrible. If you're going to spend that much renovating, at least get some fine marble.

This -- this calls into the fact that young voters often vote against their own interests, because they vote romantically, not with their hands and not with their minds, which is fine because we were all like that at some point.

But they -- it's that they aren't working hard. It's that they're seduced by silly majors that are masquerading as meaningful ones. If you want to teach gender studies, then fine, then major in gender studies. But it's better to design a fender than to talk about gender. Because if you want it to make it in this world, you're going to need actual skills and not based on some weird naval gazing that passes for majors. Because that's the problem.

WILLIAMS: Wait a minute.

GUILFOYLE: It's like basket weaving.

WILLIAMS: Aren't you -- weren't you an editor for a long time?

GUTFELD: I speak from experience.

WILLIAMS: Yes, let me just say...

GUTFELD: I was an English major.

WILLIAMS: ... as a philosophy major, I think critical thinking and being able to write a sentence, to have an argument...

GUTFELD: I'm not talking about that Juan.

WILLIAMS: A liberal arts education is pretty good.

GUTFELD: I'm talking about divisive studies, where I am going to -- I am going to focus four years on gender.

WILLIAMS: Like African-American studies and all that. You know, I agree on that point, because I think you should go out there and learn something. Go ahead.

PERINO: I want to follow up on that with one thing from this book. The study says that roughly 44 percent of recent graduates were in a job that did not technically demand a bachelor's degree.

GUILFOYLE: Bachelor's degree, yes.

WILLIAMS: And that's why I wanted to argue with Eric.


WILLIAMS: How can you say these kids aren't hard working? I've got to tell you something. Let me just tell you...

BOLLING: This is going to come back to haunt me, I think.

WILLIAMS: It should haunt you.

BOLLING: The Gen-Xers.

WILLIAMS: Let me tell you something. I can't tell you the number of young people who call me -- I bet everybody at this table knows this -- and they're willing to take unpaid internships. They will come and live in your basement.

GUTFELD: I hired -- I hired 20 of them last week.


BOLLING: ... a whole generation.

PERINO: Are you...

BOLLING: No, no. No. Gen X is young, very young people.

PERINO: No, those are millennials.

BOLLING: I'm sorry, millennials.

GUTFELD; Millennials are a Pepperidge Farm cookie.

BOLLING: Millennials. Can we still be on...

GUILFOYLE: Those are delicious. Right?

BOLLING: There are going to be 90 millennials. Ten million more than baby boomers.

GUILFOYLE: Aren't they Milanos?

GUTFELD: Milanos.


GUILFOYLE: The Milanos, but they're so delicious with the chocolate inside.

GUTFELD: The Milanos are younger than the millennials.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, Pepperidge Farm cookies.

WILLIAMS: Well, why do you say they're lazy? I can't believe this. I want to take you down that road.

BOLLING: I want to talk about the Milanos stream.

GUILFOYLE: I mean, they're light.

GUTFELD: I don't like Milanos because they melt in your hand, and I hate - - I hate that...

GUILFOYLE: Well, because you're hot and sweaty.


BOLLING: You're fondling too much.

WILLIAMS: I will say one last...

PERINO: I have had a banner week of managing these blocks.

WILLIAMS: Guess so. I will say one thing coming back to your point, Dana, about "Arp."


WILLIAMS: AARP. Which is that I think that young people, much maligned by my colleague over here, they're the ones that are going to have to pay for all this. Baby boomers with the Social Security and the Medicare.

PERINO: And that's what the book -- and that's what the book is about. It's called "Disinherited." You might want to check it out in case -- especially if you are a millennial or a parent of one.

GUTFELD: Or a Milano.

PERINO: Or a Milano.

GUTFELD: Alyssa Milano.

WILLIAMS: Wait, some guy -- what about an Oreo?

PERINO: Coming up, President Obama hosted government officials of six Gulf nations today at a rare summit at Camp David over concerns regarding a nuclear Iran. We're going to talk about that next.



WILLIAMS: Today at Camp David President Obama met with senior officials from six Gulf nations, though only two actually sent their top leaders. Some see this as a political snub in response to concerns about the proposed U.S. nuclear deal with Iran.

So how big of a blow are these no-shows to future cooperation between these Gulf countries and President Obama? The president set to hold a press conference any minute now. FOX News will keep an eye on it and let you know if he breaks any news.

Eric, what do you think, snubbed?

BOLLING: Well, I would think they're basically saying some of our leaders are not necessarily the perfect health to travel. Others are saying they're very extremely busy.

GUILFOYLE: One is at a horse show.

BOLLING: Right. But -- not at the end of the day, because that's a banned phrase. But you would think they would make an effort to show up to this. But I do think it has a lot to do with President Obama. Remember, Iran gets the bomb, most of these Gulf states either are going to want the bomb or be really ticked off that we allowed that to happen.

GUILFOYLE: That we enabled it. That's what they're mad about. They feel like, you know, who needs friends -- enemies with friends like you? That's what they're pissed about the United States, saying, "You guys aren't helping us out at all. In fact, you're complicit. You're like accessories on behalf of Iran, because you're enabling them to be able to become a nuclear power. What's wrong with you?"

WILLIAMS: So, Dana, you're a spokesperson at heart. So let me just say...


WILLIAMS: ... what if you were thinking, "Oh, but, gee, wouldn't it be better if Iran was, in fact, more moderate and part of the effort to achieve peace in the Middle East, rather than a provocateur that's always stirring up the hornet's nest."

PERINO: I'm not an actress, so I wouldn't be able to do that. You're asking me to defend something that I don't think is possible.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. She can't say that.

PERINO: I think there is a desire and a belief that President Obama has that the world will be different if -- and that Iran will change, and I actually think that that's wrong. I think that the fundamental nature of the Iranian regime is evil. And I think that they intend -- nothing but bad things out of this deal.

And I think that the Arab leaders who didn't come, it's certainly not ideal for President Obama, but they did not want to endorse the effort by their presence. I think it was smart for them not to come.

WILLIAMS: Well, of course, what you're going to see, Greg, is that President Obama will say, "In fact, we're going to enter into a military pact with these Gulf nations who are in opposition to Iran." So you're going to see more military exercises, more commitment of military hardware. And those countries, in fact, rely on the United States. So exactly how are they to, you know, bite the hand that feeds them?

GUTFELD: Well, speaking of biting, this is -- you have to understand that this was supposed to be at Camp David. And the Gulf states hate camping. S'mores, ghost stories and campfire songs are illegal in the Middle East. So that's the reason why they didn't show up.


GUTFELD: They don't have s'mores. They hate -- marshmallows are a tool of the devil, especially when they melt.

WILLIAMS: You mean, like...

GUTFELD: Tool of the devil, marshmallows.

WILLIAMS: Marshmallows.

GUTFELD: I have nothing for this segment.

GUILFOYLE: Go to your paper. You always have notes. Go to your paper.

WILLIAMS: Well, you know, Campfire Girls, Camp David, this is good stuff, you know.

PERINO: I love Camp David.

GUILFOYLE: I was a Campfire Girl.

GUTFELD: Have you been there?


BOLLING: Why is it called Camp David?

GUTFELD: Why is it -- I know there's a reason.

PERINO: It's named after somebody's son.

WILLIAMS: No, no. Grandson.

PERINO: Grandson. OK. Grandson.

WILLIAMS: President Eisenhower.

GUTFELD: I got it right.

WILLIAMS: You got it right.

PERINO: David Eisenhower.


PERINO: I love Camp David.

WILLIAMS: Well, good.

GUTFELD: I had a friend -- I had a friend named David who was really camp.

PERINO: That's not the same.

GUILFOYLE: I was a Campfire Girl.

WILLIAMS: Well, I like -- oh, yes, I can't say that.

Anyway, "One More Thing" up next.


GUTFELD: You're looking live at President Obama giving a press conference at Camp David. Bret Baier will have all the headlines coming up in the next hour, but first it's time for "One More Thing." Stop laughing, Dana, you're first.

PERINO: It really is much more important...


PERINO: ... than what's going on at Camp David. I'm going to Florida, not Camp David. I'm going to Florida this Saturday and Sunday for book signings. Melbourne, Kissimmee, Brandon and The Villages.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my gosh.

PERINO: Hey, look, no Jasper treats. I love him, you love him, but if we get any more treats for Jasper he's going to become Fatsper. Can't have that.

And I'll just note, C-SPAN is going to air the Nixon Library event this Saturday at 9 p.m. and Sunday at 5 p.m. It is at the Nixon Library. It was very funny, and there was a special guest appearance by someone at this table. That's a tease.


BOLLING: Can you say Kissimmee, though?

PERINO: Kess-eh-me -- Kiss-i-me.

GUTFELD: Kiss me.

PERINO: "Kiss-i-me is better. Why don't they call it "Kiss-i-me"? Much better way to address it.

GUILFOYLE: You're so lucky you get to go to The Villages.

GUTFELD: I've been there. They've got these little cars that are amazing, just your size.

PERINO: I was going to say. You probably loved that.

WILLIAMS: I hope we get you back.


GUTFELD: Greg's Media News. Da-da-da-dun-da. Da-da-da-dun-da.


GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

GUTFELD: You've heard I got a new show. It's going to premiere at 10 p.m. on FOX News, May 31. That's a Sunday, 10 p.m. It's called -- get this -- "The Greg Gutfeld Show."

GUILFOYLE: Original.

GUTFELD: Yes. Do you know what it's about?

PERINO: Short stories.

GUTFELD: No. It's a cooking show slash music show slash travel show. I'll be cooking exotic rare birds which I then feed to rare mammals. And then I will eat the mammals. Then there will be a music portion where I do a capella versions of old Kansas songs.

PERINO: Awesome.

GUTFELD: Then I end with the travel segment where I visit a local park at midnight.

GUILFOYLE: That's called a variety show.

GUTFELD: Yes. So it's in a couple weeks.

PERINO: Congratulations.

GUTFELD: Put it on your schedule. It's called "The Greg Gutfeld Show."

All right. Where am I? I forgot. K.G.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you. I was like hypnotized by that craziness.

All right. Who likes some boxing? Who likes charity and giving back to people who have vision problems? Well, Charity Vision is hosting a spectacular event from the former presidential contender, Mitt Romney, and five-time heavyweight champion of the world, Evander Holyfield. Take a look.


MITT ROMNEY (R), FORMER PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Hi, I'm Mitt Romney, and you may recognize me from television or the news or just around town. You've heard my critics say that I'm out of touch, that I'm stiff, that I just don't relate to people. For years I've been listening to garbage like that, and I've decided to fight back.

How do you do that? By taking on the former heavyweight champion of the world.

EVANDER HOLYFIELD, FORMER HEAVYWEIGHT CHAMPION: Mitt, you can't run, you can't hide. Come get your whipping.


GUILFOYLE: He just looks so cute with his little hair out of place.

PERINO: It's really funny.

GUILFOYLE: A hundred percent of the proceeds go to actually performing the surgeries that are necessary to restore vision throughout the world. It's a charity that the Romneys work very closely with and his son. I think it's going to be fantastic. And I got to meet Evander on "FOX and Friends" today.

GUTFELD: Good for you. OK.

GUILFOYLE: Whatever.

PERINO: I met him, too. He's not that big.


BOLLING: So very quickly you know it's law enforcement week. We talked about that. Check out Westfield, New Jersey, High School, one of the art exhibits they have there. Now, you can't really see it, but if we zoom in on one -- a couple of pictures, this is an art exhibit called law enforcement police brutality.

Now, a friend of mine, a detective from Livingston Police Department e- mailed me this. He said the law enforcement community across the country is outraged at this. You know, I get the idea of free speech but, hey, teachers at Westfield, would you do it -- would you put up an art exhibit showing teachers abusing students? I don't think you'd do it, nor should you have done that. I'd like to see that thing taken down.

PERINO: I agree.


WILLIAMS: Well, this weekend I'm going to go give the commencement address at Franklin Pierce University up in New Hampshire. So I was thinking, you know, what should I say? What can I tell these graduates?

I think I would tell them what I would wish to tell, I think, graduates around the country. You know what? Surprise yourself. Go out, go places that you've never been, meet people that you think "I don't know anybody like that." Just surprise yourself. Surprise your parents. Do better than your teachers than you ever think possible.

GUTFELD: You're saying...

WILLIAMS: That's it for us. "Special..."

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