New twists in the Jussie Smollett investigation

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," February 18, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino and you're watching "The Five."

President Trump was speaking in Miami where he warned against the dangers of socialism. The president is saying American stands with the people of Venezuela and stressed how socialism has ruined that country. The biggest reaction coming when President Trump declared, quote, America will never be a socialist country, which Jesse was -- the great line from the State of the Union speech.


PERINO: Saturday is a critical day. This is when the humanitarian aid that is on the border, that they're going to make a move to try to get it into the country, and the Venezuelan people, especially the army under Maduro, has a choice to make.

WATTERS: Yes. And "The Greg Gutfeld Show" will be following that closely on Saturday as that develops. I think this was a two-fer. You know, this was a foreign policy and domestic policy speech. You know you want to attack socialism abroad and at home.

I think he did that very nicely. He cast socialism as a philosophy that's dying, and cast himself as the leader of a movement that's ushering in change and more futuristic and hopeful, and really slickly melded socialism in Venezuela with socialism here in America.

When he was describing socialism as an ideology, he's talking about rigging elections. He's talking about a borderless nation. He's talking about seizing wealth, controlling industries, and using institutions to punish political enemies. He said those very same things about people here at home, and he's using that rhetoric to kind of molding people's minds, socialism abroad and here in America.

PERINO: The president, Greg, is taking great pains to make sure that the Europeans were supporting Guaido over Maduro. But when he speaks, he has the most words --


PERINO: -- the strongest words. He's the most powerful speaker.

GUTFELD: This is why having Trump in the White House now, whether you love him or hate him, is important because, remember, President Obama was absent during the Green Revolution. He was absent with Hugo Chavez. And he was there for Cuba.

So it's nice to have this difference. No one explains -- he said that socialism is dying, except here, right? It's not dying. It's because here our campuses do nothing to explain why socialism keeps failing. Its toxic premise is that it centralized. Capitalism, it's very simple, capitalism decentralize. So if one little part goes wrong, only that part suffers but everything else is fine because the individual rules.

With socialism, it's centralized meaning if the top rots, everything rots, which is why the Maduros, and the Chavezes, and every socialist Castro before them, they plunder and they don't profit because of the only -- you can't create a profit, all you can do is take. So that's the key difference. So if somebody can explain that to a high school student, socialism would be dead in a second.

PERINO: Katie, Maduro, the disputed president still has support around the world --


PERINO: -- and it's not a slam-dunk yet.

PAVLICH: Not yet. There are 50 countries in the world, they're supporting Maduro, 65 that are supporting Guaido. The U.N. is still recognizing Maduro. Those advocates for human rights and dignity are still recognizing Maduro.

But I thought it was interesting to see the president talk about socialism that were happening here, and the reason why is because, as Reagan said, socialism -- or freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction and you have to fight for it. The people in Venezuela are fighting against socialism there for freedom. And people in America are going to have to fight to keep socialism out of America.

PERINO: Democrats today called on President Trump to offer temporary protective status for Venezuelan refugees, Juan. What do you think of that?

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: I think it's a good idea. I mean, there's no defending Hugo Chavez or Nicolas Maduro. I think these guys are essentially tyrants. And I think that you can see the consequences and the quality of life in the country.

It's interesting that Mr. Trump who is, you know, always antagonistic to the idea of America playing a role on the world stage is willing to get involved here which -- you know, invites some questions and doubts because as Katie was picking up on about the U.N., the reason that I think people are slow to do this is you don't want other countries determining the leaders of another country --


WILLIAMS: That's seen as sort of intervention that's not acceptable. And President Trump has had that idea when it comes to places like, incredibly, Syria. But here, I think to Jesse's point, he sees some political advantage at home. I will get into it later, but I mean -- I think on that point --

PERINO: I think we can be convinced of both things. We're gonna --

GUTFELD: But you know hates this? Russia.

PERINO: And China.

GUTFELD: There goes the collusion.

PERINO: Russia and China, who are holding up the U.N. support, of course. All right, another twist in the Jussie Smollett case, we have the breaking details with Greg, next.


GUTFELD: Shall we call it on Smollett? The police no longer consider Jussie Smollett a victim. Cue faces covered in egg.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Two suspects who are apparently wearing Make America Great Again hats, though that is not yet been officially confirmed.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm disgusted by people who wear hats that say MAGA, Make America Great Again. I don't like that it's being put out there in the media that this is a possible hate crime.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And the media has really cast so much doubt on his story which I find so personally offensive.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And Senator Cory Booker said the vicious attack on the actor Jussie was an attempted modern-day lynching.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's coming from the President of the United States. He's dog whistling every day.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Danny, this is a horrible story. This is a horrible story.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The circumstance is horrific.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is America in 2019.


GUTFELD: This is America in 2019, right. And here I thought it was Pence's fault.


ELLEN PAGE, ACTRESS: It feels impossible to not feel this way right now with the president and the vice president, Mike Pence, who likes wishes I couldn't be married. Let's just be clear. Connect the dots. This is what happens. If you are in a position of power and you hate people and you want to cause suffering to them. You go through the trouble, you spend your career trying to cause suffering. What do you think is going to happen?


GUTFELD: Loved her in "Juno."

Meanwhile, we kept quiet. Sure, the idea of Trumpsters wandering in subzero Chicago at 2 AM carrying bleach and a noose attacking some actor from a show, they don't even watch, without taking his phone wallet or sandwich seemed about as real as me joining The View. But Smollett was the perfect victim for a media that deems any skepticism heresy. That's why these hoaxes are not rare. It's the press orgy that attracts them.

Now, looking dumb, the media circles its wagons. At CNN, they claim that only the celebrity press fell for this. Oh yes! Try CNN, The Washington Post, The LA Times, BuzzFeed, the Huffington Post, the Daily Beast. They're terrible. Rolling Stone, Slate ABC, poor Newsweek. They ate it all up. CNN says, Smollett's actions set back the movement. No, it didn't. Maybe it set back the hoax crime movement and that's good perhaps the media might think first, so we'll have fewer hoaxes, but don't count on it.

The media says no one should be pleased by the events that fake hoaxes hurt real victims, but they never mentioned the groups who are falsely accused. Seriously, this could have led to real violence against them. Instead the press, they parrot two lines. Even if this crime isn't true here, it's got to be true somewhere else. And how awful are the conservatives for pouncing on this now.

Sorry, if you're sad that this turned out to be a hoax. It's only because your network, your paper and your assumptions were wrong. Me, I'm pleased. A hate crime fell apart which once again proves we are less racist than the media wants us to be. I say once again, because so many hate crimes are reported. Then they go unreported once they're exposed as hoaxes and those hoaxes, they are easy to find though the media wishes you wouldn't look. They want you to forget them like they do every day, so they could commit the same damn mistake tomorrow.

I urge everybody to go check out Andrew Nogo (ph), his tweet. He's got a - his Twitter has just a phenomenal number of these hate crime hoaxes that will - they will blow your mind and of course we have - we've listed many of them. Dana, so far only one person has offered an apology for believing this. Michael Avenatti.

PERINO: 2020.

WATTERS: 2020. It's step--

PERINO: And it was a sincere apology.


PERINO: You like it for as much as you can do that on Twitter versus sincere as that was. What I thought was interesting in the montage is that you saw that some in the media were actually attacking reporting.


PERINO: Because they were using the word, allegedly.


PERINO: And how dare they use the word, allegedly, because obviously this was a hate crime. GUTFELD: Yes. How dare you. But the thing is, if you question it, you're - that's sacrilegious. You're probably a bigot, a homophobe, a racist. Jesse, people ask like why would Smollett do such a thing. And I've said this, we fetishize the victimhood. It makes you a hero. And if you are a sucker for attention, that's the best way - the easiest way to get it.

WATTERS: Smollett's got an album coming out.


WATTERS: March 2nd. So, he might have been promoting that as the show. He's thinking about maybe raising his profile in that way too. How stupid did he think the police were?


WATTERS: They weren't going to be able to figure this out. I mean what a low opinion of police do you have to have to be able to try to pull this off. And how cozy do you have to think you are with the media. They're going to run interference for you. And at this point, the media is not even looking for the truth anymore, they're just looking for a story. What's the classic line, don't let the facts get in the way of a good story, so they get the good story then they weaponize it against the Republicans. It's now a political hate crime.


WATTERS: And that's when you are motivated by hatred for Republicans to frame them. We've seen it with Covington, with Cavanaugh, with Smollett, you went way back in the model of Duke, UVA. or some other ones. Hands up, don't shoot. Benghazi, they blamed on a conservative filmmaker. So, everybody has to take a step back and say listen, the media in Chicago, they were the ones that got the story right.

GUTFELD: That's true. And they were hounded.

WATTERS: Yes. And they were called bigots.


WATTERS: In the tank for the cops.

GUTFELD: Katie,12 detectives, at least 12 worked on this. Could you imagine?

PAVLICH: Resources.

GUTFELD: All the resources.

PAVLICH: With all the murders going on.


PAVLICH: Chicago and the crime--

GUTFELD: On this.

PAVLICH: Real people who needed help that night in a polar vortex. Right. He played the race card twice. I'm waiting for him to play it three times. He did the first time by saying this was a hate crime. The second time he said, you don't believe him you're a racist and I'm just waiting on them now to say that the Chicago Police Department is racist and therefore you can't listen to what they have to say.

But for the record, the superintendent there is Eddie Johnson, he's black. So, they maybe - he can't play that card. This is why saying, my truth is absolutely ridiculous, because Jussie Smollett's truth was this, the fake letter that was sent, all the things that were said. And yet here we are now after this entire thing of smearing again of regular Trump supporting Americans. And everyone jumped on it and now we're not saying--

GUTFELD: Juan, to our credit. Three weeks ago, we were talking about in the green room and we said we aren't touching this because we knew something was going on, remember? WILLIAMS: I think we said, pretty clearly, we don't know all the facts.


WILLIAMS: And so, we held back, right.


WILLIAMS: But what I see here today is you guys are spiking the ball like this is proof that you know, Trumpsters and MAGA hat wears and everybody else--

GUTFELD: Didn't commit this crime. Yes. I'm spiking the football, because it was--

WILLIAMS: You're wrong.

GUTFELD: No, I am right, because It didn't happen.

WILLIAMS: Because we don't know all the facts yet.


WILLIAMS: He has some reserves, right. That's what--

GUTFELD: Judgment. Maybe, it will be MAGA hats then, Juan and you can spike the ball. WILLIAMS: He should talk to the police. He should give them access.

GUTFELD: But he won't.

WILLIAMS: If he wants to redeem what looks to be a farce at this point.


WILLIAMS: But the fact is Greg, hate crimes in this country have spiked. GUTFELD: No, they haven't. Not true. No, they haven't.

WILLIAMS: It's absolutely--

GUTFELD: Show me your stat.

WILLIAMS: Here they are--

GUTFELD: And I will rip intro shreds--

WILLIAMS: And not only gone up against Blacks, but Jews in specific.

GUTFELD: All right.

WILLIAMS: But here is what I want to say.

GUTFELD: No, I want to hear the stats.

WILLIAMS: I want to say this that what you have here is a function of confirmation bias. And my quote here comes from George W. Bush after some policemen were shot in Dallas. He said, too often we judge other groups by their worst example.

GUTFELD: Exactly.

WILLIAMS: While judging ourselves by our best insight.

PERINO: That's what Jussie was doing.

WILLIAMS: So, when you have a false flag like you have that guy Cesar Sayoc down in Florida, driving around - oh! all the concerns that - don't judge that, just wait. So, I'm telling you, you should wait. GUTFELD: All right. Hate crimes are up 17 percent because of a thousand additional agencies reporting it. If they report one, that's a 70 percent increase. It's not about an increase in hate crimes - right, I know. It's hard to handle.

WILLIAMS: Let me tell you, you don't want to jump - but you laugh and that's wrong.

GUTFELD: I'm not laughing. I'm just happy that we're less racist than you want us to be.

WILLIAMS: No, I would be--

GUTFELD: President Trump accusing Andrew McCabe of treason. His 60 Minutes interview next. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WATTERS: President Trump unleashing on disgraced former FBI, Deputy Director, Andrew McCabe after making these claims on 60 Minutes.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Discussion of the 25th Amendment was simply raised the issue and discussed it with me in the context of thinking about how many other Cabinet officials might support such an effort. The Deputy Attorney General offered to wear a wire into the White House. He said, I never get searched when I go into the White House. I can easily wear a recording device. They wouldn't know it was there. Now, he was not joking.


WATTERS: The DOJ is calling McCabe's claims false. And President Trump's firing back by saying, McCabe and Rosenstein purse a quote "illegal and treasonous plot against his presidency". All right, Greg. So, McCabe says, he opened up these investigations against the President and tried to invoke the 25th Amendment, because Trump was really rough on the FBI when he was criticizing the Hillary Clinton investigation. And he said some nice things about Russia.

GUTFELD: I have to say that this is similar to this Smollett case and that certain people, I think he legitimately bought into this conspiracy, because it was ginned up by the media. He primed the population to believe in these things. So, he bought the movie in his head that Russia, Russia was involved, and the media was a cheering section when the most obvious solution was that Trump ran a better game than Hillary and the media fed the spectacle with free airtime.

And Trump wasn't a politician and people were ready for that. That's the obvious answer. But McCabe chooses the absurd answer, which is the Manchurian candidate because of confirmation bias imploding into cognitive dissonance. We'll be right back.

PERINO: And McCabe, well one day I think when he says that Rosenstein wasn't joking. Rosenstein said that he was joking, and I can imagine it too, because apparently, they were in a heated conversation and McCabe's pushing him is like what you want me to do, wear a wire in the White House. I don't get checked. I could see how that might happen.

The other thing is with McCabe, I was watching with some folks last night and they're like seems very credible. He does. He was also fired for lying. So, it's like it's kind of - its little bit difficult.

WATTERS: He could be a very good liar.

PAVLICH: He's also been referred for criminal prosecution.

WATTERS: That's true.

PAVLICH: For lying under oath to both the FBI and DOJ Inspector General Investigator. So that's a problem for him. But you know how you know McCabe is a hack because Elizabeth Warren agrees with this notion that the 25th Amendment should be used.


PAVLICH: Against President Trump who was elected in a democracy by people who voted for him. WATTERS: Isn't it scary, Juan, Republicans and Democrats kind of conspiring to rein in the duly erect, the President of the United States.

WILLIAMS: Let me correct you.

WATTERS: Elected.

WILLIAMS: I think that's the next segment.

WATTERS: Anthony Weiner is coming on next.

GUTFELD: And he is duly erected.

WILLIAMS: But let me correct you, because I think that if you look at it, Andrew McCabe, Rod Rosenstein, Jeff Sessions are all Republicans.


WILLIAMS: So, according to him, Republicans and you know what I can't get over is the idea that this is a coup, the 25th Amendment. This is to your point, the 25th Amendment is part of the Constitution. So, they were actually following a constitutional mechanism intended to remove somebody who is--

PERINO: No. The 25th Amendment is--

WILLIAMS: You know what he said. Hang on. You know what he said? He said, this guy - said, I believe Putin with regard to North Korea, I don't believe that--

WATTERS: That sounds like fake news to me, Juan.

WILLIAMS: Oh! Yes. PAVLICH: I'll clarify real quickly. The 25th Amendment is not used to take out a President you don't like, it's used for an incapacitated President who has been in the hospital--

WILLIAMS: Correct. Yes.

PAVLICH: Or no longer carry out his duties.

WILLIAMS: So, it's part of the Constitution.

GUTFELD: I want to talk about Weiner.

WATTERS: Anthony Weiner, out of prison, what he's up to now and next on The Five.


WILLIAMS: Welcome back. Get ready for the return of awkward puns. Anthony Weiner is back. Weiner was spotted enjoying some takeout food after being released from federal prison. He served 15 months behind bars. The disgraced Democrat was convicted for sexting an underaged girl. He'll now spend the next three months in a New York halfway house. He has to register as a sex offender. As you can imagine, there is commotion at this table. Puns are ready. Go right at it, Katie. PAVLICH: Yes. I'm not going to do any puns.


PAVLICH: I'm going to try not to. First of all, he should be back in prison, because he had two straws in that bag which we all know it should be illegal in New York City. The second thing is, I would be so afraid if I was Anthony Weiner being out of prison because he basically made it - so, Hillary Clinton lost the election because they found all those emails on his laptop. So, I would want to be back in prison if I were Anthony Weiner.

And third, this reminds me of such good memories of Andrew Breitbart crashing that press conference in New York City when the media accused him of faking the story and framing Anthony Weiner. He took it all over it ended up all being true. And here he is now out of prison after being a convicted sex offender for openly sexting a 15-year-old girl.

WILLIAMS: Jesse, do you believe in redemption.

WATTERS: Yes, for me especially. Katie and I were just joking in the commercial break about how Anthony should have his head on a swivel, because Hillary might be down there with the car, with the lights turned off, ready to knock him out, because she blames him still for losing that election. I know The Post headline writers are pretty excited for the return of Anthony and I can't wait for the Trump tweet about Anthony back out of bars and roaming the streets. Watch out for the women and children. WILLIAMS: I think he's still married to whom in Aberdeen who was Hillary's top aide.

PERINO: Yes. I hear it. When you talk about redemption like he got convicted of a crime, he has served his time, he has continued his service time, he is going to get hounded by the media. I do think in some ways he deserves a little bit of space.

WILLIAMS: But Greg, you're not going to give it to him.

GUTFELD: No, I will. He's done his hard time. Anyway, I'm going to get - if I'm his agent here's what I tell him to do. Number one, reality television celebrity Big Brother asked for a million to start. You could do UK Big Brother, they pay well. Two, negotiate a book deal. Be frank in your book deal, $750,000 in advance.

I think he can get that. Marry yourself to a cyber security software company as a spokesperson. It'll be humorous. It'll work out. You are the cyber security spokesman, because you're the one who got caught and then volunteer somewhere to repair some of the damage. Then you - and do "The Greg Gutfeld Show" next week.

PAVLICH: Indeed. There you go. That's important.

WILLIAMS: Well, One More Thing is up next, stay with us.


PERINO: It's time now for One More Thing. So, one dog owners worst fear came true in Boston. He came home and found his dog Norwest (ph) had grabbed one of his down feathered pillows, tore up the place and the pooch was pretty unapologetic. He had a winter wonderland right there in his living room and that's how he acted when his owner got after.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Norwest (ph), what did you do?


PERINO: So, I don't think he feels bad. And Jesse in my attempt to help you with the dog training, this would not be good.

WATTERS: That's what my apartment looks like right now.

PERINO: All right, you go next. WATTERS: OK. So, I was in Colorado Springs over the weekend at the leadership program for the Rockies speaking to a great crowd of people. There I am. They laughed at all of my jokes. That's when you know, it's a very good crowd. I also spent some time in an oxygen room and met one of Greg Gutfeld's friends, Rob Long, who had some really nice things to say about Greg. I think the elevation had gotten to him.

Also, tonight, I'm going to be on the Fox Nation Quiz Show with Tom Shillue at 7 o'clock. It didn't go as well as I thought it was going to go. So, if you want to see me embarrassed myself--

PERINO: It's tough.

WATTERS: Not only on The Five, but also on Fox Nation. Check that out. PERINO: It's not an easy quiz. Greg?

GUTFELD: I have a ban to phrase in a while, but after this week, I'm going to ban this, pounce.


GUTFELD: It's a new phrase the media use it to describe anybody in the conservative media when you write about a screw up, a crime and injustice. Whenever we talk about it, somehow, it's worse, because we're pouncing. But if the Left is writing about it, they're shredding or exposing, but we pounce. Stupid.

PAVLICH: That was no video, nothing. No promotion?

GUTFELD: It's Monday.

WILLIAMS: He's warming up.

PERINO: All right, Juan.

GUTFELD: I'm pouncing.

WILLIAMS: I know you think it's a hassle to clear the snow off of your walk but look at what Robert Greenfield of Toronto man did in clearing the snow off of his ice rink.

PAVLICH: What is it?

PERINO: He's going to make a design.

GUTFELD: Good job, Dana.

PERINO: It will be - radio listeners.

PAVLICH: Yes, it's the Mona Lisa.

PERINO: Oh! The Mona Lisa.

WILLIAMS: He called it the Snow Lisa. He also said, it should be hanging in the igloo. That was Dana kind of joke.

PERINO: Very clever. I like it.

PAVLICH: Very good, Juan.

PERINO: Katie?

PAVLICH: OK. Going back to a place where my heart is. A 103-year-old, Rose Torphy, has become one of the youngest or newest junior rangers at the Grand Canyon National Park. The mother of three and great, great grandmother of 10 visited the National Park in January and took advantage of the opportunity to become a park steward.

The Junior Ranger Program revolves around education and participants pledging to protect the World Heritage site for future generations. And she said that she wants to teach kids how to protect the Grand Canyon because her parents taught her to care for the land. So, my parents taught me how to care for the land, the Grand Canyon is a beautiful place.

PERINO: Nice. Congratulations.

PAVLICH: It's not just a hole in the ground. So, if you want to take a vacation there, I highly recommend it.

PERINO: Indeed. And Jesse, so I'm from Colorado. Did you have to go to the altitude room because you were feeling uncomfortable?

WATTERS: No. They recommended that. I just maybe I was behaving abnormal.

PERINO: You needed more oxygen.

WATTERS: You know what I did though, I did some zip lining. Have you ever done that? Have you done that?

PERINO: I have done that.

PAVLICH: I have.

WATTERS: It's terrifying.

PERINO: Have you done that, Greg?

GUTFELD: Yes, I have done that. I did Outward Bound in Colorado once and I'll never do that again.


GUTFELD: They won't let me.

PERINO: You are more--

GUTFELD: A lot of those guys just break wind constantly because of the altitude when you're hiking. They're in front of you - bad guys are in front of you and they've just breaking wind. I'm never going to Colorado.

WILLIAMS: This is the problem what's causing greenhouse gas emissions. But I will tell you this, I once gave a speech in Colorado and the guy before me fainted.

PERINO: Fainted. That's how you know it's a good audience. All right. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." "Special Report" is up next.

Content and Programming Copyright 2019 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2019 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.