Glenn Beck: Cruz campaign's actions 'totally reasonable'
Radio Host goes on 'The Kelly File' to react to Sarah Palin's attacks on Ted Cruz following Iowa caucuses
This is a rush transcript from "The Kelly File," February 3, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MEGYN KELLY, HOST: Breaking tonight. An all-out war between the Republican frontrunners. Just 48 hours after Iowa and days before the New Hampshire primary, Donald Trump accuses Ted Cruz of stealing votes and the responds is epic.
Welcome to "The Kelly File," everyone. I'm Megyn Kelly. It all started Monday night. Moments after Ted Cruz won the first in the nation Iowa caucuses. Donald Trump graciously accepted his second place finish. But now, oh what a difference a day or two makes as he suggests that Ted Cruz cheated and even stole support from fourth place finisher Ben Carson. Here is just a sampling of what's transpired over the past 48 hours.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We finished second and I want to tell you something, I'm just honored, I'm really honored. And I want to congratulate Ted.
What kind of people do we have running for office? No, it's -- honestly, really, really dishonest. And I think I know why. Do you know why? Because he was born in Canada.
Iowa, we love you. We thank you. You're special. We will be back, many, many times. In fact, I think I might come here and buy a farm. I love it.
I think what he did is disgusting. He said that Ben Carson, who is a fantastic guy had dropped out of the race during the caucus. I think it was a disgrace that he did it. And I don't think it should be even allowed. I think those votes should be taken away and there were plenty of them.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: And it did not end there. Trump also unleashed a flurry of anti- Cruz tweets such as the state of Iowa should disqualify Ted Cruz from the most recent election on the basis that he cheated, a total fraud. The response from the Cruz campaign, quote, "Reality just hit the reality star. He lost Iowa and now nobody is talking about him so he is popping off on twitter. There are support groups for twitter addiction. Perhaps he should find his local chapter." The judge liked that one. And then there is this from Senator Cruz himself.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: It is no surprise that Donald is throwing yet another temper tantrum or if you like yet another trumper tantrum. It seems his reaction to everything is to throw a fit. To engage and insults. But at the end of the day the Iowa people spoke. Donald Trump guaranteed a victory in Iowa and then he lost. And he doesn't like that and his reaction is that he breaks down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Chris Stirewalt is our Fox News digital politics editor. Stuart Stevens is a former Mitt Romney campaign strategist who has worked on every New Hampshire primary since 1996. He is the author of "The Last Season."
Good to see you both. So now Stirewalt, he is actually coming out, Trump is saying, I actually won Iowa. Actually, I won.
CHRIS STIREWALT, FOX NEWS DIGITAL POLITICS EDITOR: Right.
KELLY: Because he wants to discount I guess all of the extra Cruz votes because he wants to attribute them to Cruz telling carbon supporters in the caucuses that carbon might be dropping out or Cruz didn't but a surrogate did.
STIREWALT: Typical lying Canadians. You know that the Canadians cannot be trusted. Their bacon is round.
(LAUGHTER)
It is round. It's not long with streaks of fat. It is round. That's not bacon.
KELLY: The prosecution rests.
STIREWALT: The prosecution rests. Look, Donald Trump is making me crazy. Because he was doing everything right. He had learned a lesson. He had figured this out. His performance in Iowa was fine because he is going to go on to New Hampshire and have an easy win. He has got an easy win laid out for him in New Hampshire. He was doing the right thing and he was gracious. He even said that he had made a mistake or that not participating in only Iowa debate that may have cost him votes and he was experiencing some sort of humility and he is talking about this. And then something like inside him broke. And all of this stuff comes gushing out on and on and all the sour grapes. And you think you had it, man. You had it. You had it. You were walking into a victory in New Hampshire with the respectable showing in Iowa. Not great but whatever, and all of a sudden he throws it all away. I do not understand this.
KELLY: Stuart, on Trump's argument, does have a point that the Cruz people shouldn't have been telling people Ben Carson was suspending his campaign just because CNN reported that he was going down to Florida which he was. He later qualified to get his clothes. And the Cruz people say, they didn't get that update. But honestly we were on the set at the same time seeing the update saying, Carson is going down to Florida to get his clothes instead of New Hampshire? I mean, a logical person could jump to the conclusion that he's not in New Hampshire, he is not going for it there.
STUART STEVENS, STRATEGIC PARTNERS AND MEDIA: Yes, it's an absurd charge. I'm not a Cruz guy. Far be it for me to defend the Cruz campaign. But this really rests with Dr. Carson. If you're a serious candidate. You leave New Hampshire that night. You leave Iowa that night. You have a rally in New Hampshire 4:00 in the morning. You get up and you campaign. The fact that you are going to Florida instead of going to New Hampshire the next day is an indication that you are not a serious candidate for president. I'm sorry. That's how it is. So they are being accused of actually doing something that Donald Trump isn't doing, which is running a good campaign. I think the Cruz people should plead guilty to that and get -- they seem to be enjoying it as they should.
KELLY: But what about the mailers, Stirewalt? Trump is also upset about the mailers, Cruz's camp sent them out. They look like official notices to voters saying, voting violation. The voting, you know, not a lot of people have voted in your neighborhood. You better go vote. The envelope identified it as being from the Cruz campaign. But even the Secretary of State or the Republican is making noise about this that this may have cross the line.
STIREWALT: Well, look, politics is gross.
STEVENS: Politics --
STIREWALT: And it is the most heinous of all of the things that we do to each other. Politics is disgusting. Donald Trump has been a -- not just a participant. He has been the ultimate practitioner of the devastating insult and also the I heard or people tell me that he is a Canadian sleeper cell. I heard people tell me a guy says that he is not eligible and he will be ruined. I mean, he does all of this stuff all of the time. So it is rather unusual that he would take such offense at this. But, again, he didn't need to do any of this. He was getting where he wanted to go. And he has or had at least a victory lined up for him. He was like a guy who had a one foot putt left on the green and he is out on the fairway throwing his golf clubs and choking his caddy. Just walk up on the green and tap it in, man.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: Stuart, how does this play in New Hampshire?
STEVENS: I think it plays terribly in New Hampshire. You know, Donald Trump has tried to rewrite the rules of this process. He could have won in Iowa if he had spent time. If he sat down in living rooms. If he had invested in a real campaign. He didn't. He did what he enjoyed which is going around, having these big rallies and ranting for an hour and then leaving.
KELLY: How do you predict it will turn out?
STEVENS: Because it doesn't have a lot to do with getting elected president. And in New Hampshire, he should have gone around, visited people. There is a compact that has existed between Iowa voters and candidates. That they will invest a lot of time. They will be able to talk to them. And he hasn't been able to do that. So he is -- I think he is head to do defeat in New Hampshire in all likelihood.
KELLY: Bold prediction, Stuart, great to see you. Chris Stirewalt, you too.
STIREWALT: You bet.
KELLY: So, with Trump alleging fraud, we wanted to know, did Ted Cruz actually do anything wrong.
Judge Andrew Napolitano is our Fox News senior judicial analyst. So, there's the mailers that were sent out.
JUDGE ANDREW NAPOLITANO, FOX NEWS SENIOR JUDICIAL ANALYST: Right.
KELLY: And the report that CNN has issued that was repeated by Cruz's surrogates at the caucuses.
NAPOLITANO: Right.
KELLY: Did either cross the legal line?
NAPOLITANO: From the available evidence it appears they did not. We start with a couple basics. This was not an election. This was not run by the government. This was a contest within a private group called the Republican Party of Iowa. They set the laws. They set the rules. The state of Iowa does not. So, the general laws that would apply to an election do not apply here. Second basic principle is as Chris just said politics is not beanbag (ph). You can say rough and tough things. You can exaggerate. You can extrapolate.
It is perfectly reasonable for Congressman King to have said this guy is going to Florida? He is out of here. You reacted, Bret -- Baier reacted. Those of us who heard this watching you and Bret reacted the same way. It's a rational inference that he can make. The courts are not going to get into the business of second guessing words that people use during campaigns. Now, the flier. It would be impossible to prove that that flier, a, coerced people to vote who weren't going to vote and coerce them to vote for a particular candidate.
KELLY: Yes. The allegation is basically that they scare people into caucusing. But we don't know whether, A, it worked and, B, who they voted for once they caucused.
NAPOLITANO: It is unknowable and unprovable. And therefore, any allegation that someone is going to sue is made for political reasons. It can't be made for legal reasons. No lawyer would take the case.
KELLY: So when Trump says he won. Do we have the sound bite? Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: A lot of people didn't think that I should even go to Iowa. Actually I came in probably first, if you think about it. It's a total voter fraud when you think of it. And he picked up a lot of those votes. And that's why the polls were so wrong.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: But when he says he came in first trying to discount all the votes between himself and Ted Cruz.
NAPOLITANO: There is no legal basis for that. He is making a political statement as our colleague Chris Stirewalt just --
KELLY: Any basis to have another Iowa caucus. I mean, is there any grounds to go back to Iowa? Legal ground.
NAPOLITANO: Absolutely none. No court would take a complaint. No court would interfere with how people voted and no court would inquire of a voter as to why they voted. End of the story.
KELLY: Judge Napolitano, great to see you.
NAPOLITANO: Good to see you.
KELLY: For Mr. Trump -- Stirewalt has a point about the bacon. Mr. Trump's surrogates are joining in.
(LAUGHTER)
Right? It is. It's round. He is right. With Sarah Palin firing off a scathing attack on Ted Cruz today. The man she once endorsed for Senate. Glenn Beck picked Ted Cruz as the first presidential candidate he ever endorsed and Beck is here on Palin, next.
Plus, Brit Hume is here on all the candidates now bailing out and who is going to get the biggest boost from that.
And then hours after President Obama makes his first visit to a U.S. mosque, there are new claims about this place and alleged ties to terror. Was this the best mosque to pick? We will investigate just ahead.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: The suggestion is somehow that if I would simply say these are all Islamic terrorists, then we would actually have solved the problem by now apparently.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Breaking tonight. Former vice presidential candidate and Donald Trump supporter Sarah Palin is slamming the Cruz campaign on her Facebook page writing impart, Senator Ted Cruz was spot on when he once noted that millions of Americans are asking for accountability and truth. Which is why she goes on it's so curious and saddens us this lack of accountability with the lies of Cruz's own campaign. She continues, "Cruz's campaign chairman, U.S. Representative Steve King is lying. He told voters Carson was dropping out of the presidential race immediately before the Iowa caucus. The Cruz campaign's actions to destroy a good man's efforts to serve are no different than Obama's practice of not holding anyone accountable."
Joining us now, founder of The Blaze Glenn Beck. Glen, good to see you.
GLENN BECK, FOUNDER, THE BLAZE: How are you?
KELLY: So, Sarah Palin outright accusing the Cruz campaign of lying. Their explanation is, we thought he was dropping out based on a CNN report. We didn't see the follow-up report saying he wasn't dropping out. We're sorry.
BECK: OK. Let me just get this straight. First of all, I don't want to say anything bad about Sarah Palin. I don't know what she is thinking. I don't know where she is coming from. She is now calling Steve King, one of the most honest, forthright people that I know a liar. It is absolutely incredible what people will stoop to. Let's just look at this. You can see the timeline. CNN went on the air and said that he was going to lead - - Carson was going to lead the campaign trail to get a change of clothes. Does that sound reasonable to you, Megyn?
KELLY: I can tell you Bret Baier and I were sitting on the set and we all saw it and we all thought the same thing which is --
BECK: Yes. That doesn't make any sense. You know, they had clothing stores in New Hampshire. But, this comes a day -- I just want to make sure I get this right. WMUR on Sunday announced that Sam Pimm, the guy who raised about $4 million for Carson was now switching over to Cruz. Then on Monday, before the -- I have got to go home and get a change of clothes for a few days happened, every single person in the New Hampshire Super PAC for Carson quit and switched over to Cruz. All of those, plus the change of clothes would lead any reasonable person to think that he is switching.
A voting -- voting in Iowa is different than voting anywhere else in a primary. This is a caucus. Your job is to go and try to sway other people. So if I have information that the Super PAC guy just switched to Cruz. All of the people in New Hampshire just quit, and moved over to Cruz. And he is going for a change of clothes, when he has only got about eight days before the New Hampshire primary, it doesn't make any sense. And any responsible candidate would say, look, I don't know. CNN is now tweeting and saying that it looks like he may be getting out of the race. Go there and make sure that those Carson people who are the most closely align to Ted Cruz know this and see if they want to switch.
KELLY: Let me ask you this, Glenn because --
BECK: It's totally reasonable.
KELLY: -- she also goes on as I just read in this same post to say that Cruz's campaign's actions to destroy a good man's effort to serve. She is talking about Ben Carson.
BECK: I can't believe this.
KELLY: Donald Trump was the one with the belt buckle saying how stupid are the people of Iowa when Ben Carson was surging and calling Ben Carson's story, you know, just suggesting it was all a lie.
BECK: You know what's amazing -- you know what's amazing is, last week Donald Trump was saying that Ben Carson couldn't be -- couldn't be president because he calls people liars all the time. He called Harry Reid and Mitch McConnell a liar. We know that to be true. But this week, after he says you can't elect anybody because they call liars, he is calling him a liar.
KELLY: Yes. Trump said Cruz couldn't be president.
BECK: Look, I don't know what's going on, but here's where I come from. For we are being turned on each other and there is no reason to be turned on each other. A circus performer is turning the conservatives against one another. You couldn't have planned this better if you were a DNC operative. We have in Bernie Sanders an old man that is a socialist that just through the life expectancy, the normal life expectancy should be dead before his term ends.
KELLY: Oh, boy.
BECK: He is a socialist. Then, on the other side you have somebody who their own people say is, what was it 80 percent coming out of Iowa. Her own voters said 80 percent said she was untrustworthy. It's like going hunting for a deer that's spray painted orange and has no legs. The conservatives should be able to win this with anyone. You know what? This camera could beat them. This oil can beat those two. And what are we doing? We are looking and we're nitpicking when we have the most conservative man since Calvin Coolidge. We have four Supreme Court justices that might die in the next four years or retire.
KELLY: You are way off. You are getting depressing, everyone is dying.
BECK: Or retire, I got it from Bill O'Reilly.
KELLY: Sanders is dying. Half of the Supreme Court is dying. I have got to go because we are dying on time. We will do it over because we have more to discuss.
BECK: All right.
KELLY: I didn't even get to ask him why he has an oil can sitting next to him. But when Glenn comes back, we are going to ask him about the President's visit today to a mosque in Baltimore. And why Beck thinks the President made a very bad choice when he picked this particular mosque and he is not alone.
Plus, Brit Hume is next on all the Republicans getting out of the presidential race. And endorsement that just happened and who benefits from the changing dynamics.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Breaking tonight, Republican Senator Rand Paul and former Senator Rick Santorum both dropping out of the race for the White House today. Mr. Santorum wasting no time immediately declaring his endorsement of Senator Marco Rubio. And right now, in New Hampshire, less than a week away from the primary, Mr. Rubio is taking serious fire from his fellow Republicans.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEB BUSH , R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Everybody is going to say, oh my gosh, Marco Rubio is the guy. He is going to have to earn it. He is going to have to do what Chris Christie and John Kasich and I do and other candidates do. Go to the voters and directly make their case.
GOV. CHRIS CHRISTIE, R-N.J., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He is 62nd memorized speeches all of which we have heard over and over and over again for the last six years are getting a little stale and a little tired. And Senator Rubio needs to come up with some new material and needs to start answering questions. It sounds like he is in the witness protection program.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Brit Hume is our Fox News senior political analyst. Brit, good to see you. So, how does the race change today? Santorum is out. Rand Paul is out. And now it's Bush, Kasich, and Christie fighting Rubio for this so-called establishment lane.
BRIT HUME, FOX NEWS SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think, Megyn, that the number of supporters of Santorum and Huckabee got out were probably not enough to make a difference. And it's not clear to me in what direction they will go. Endorsements don't really matter very much anymore. And Santorum doesn't hurt Rubio by endorsing him but I don't think it makes much difference. And I don't know that Rand Paul supporters like his father's supporters may not be available to anyone else. That's the way it was with his father. They were a certain group and they liked him and I'm not sure how many of them were -- are available to Rubio or anybody else.
In the meantime, of course, Rubio because of the strong finish in Iowa, it looks like kind of the man to beat in what you called the establishment lane. They are attacking him because they are all looking for, you know, they are fighting over the same voters. And I suppose it's inevitable. He withstood, you know, Megyn in Iowa. He was under a big assault especially from Jeb Bush's Super PAC. And he seemed to weather that pretty well. Whether he will be able to weather the three way incoming in New Hampshire, obviously remains to be seen.
KELLY: What do you make of Chris Christie attack on him that the boy in the bubble as he called Marco Rubio needs to get out and start answering questions?
HUME: Well, look. Christie and Bush to some extent and John Kasich have basically been running for president of New Hampshire. And they made a big bet there. Rubio so far has run more of a national campaign, which means that he hasn't spent nearly as much time in New Hampshire as those others have. And obviously New Hampshire voters like that. They expect that. I have seen candidates overcome not coming there very much and win up there. But, it does make a difference. And I guess he can, you know, campaign feverishly there in the days ahead and maybe merge with another strong finish but those guys have been up there doing nothing else. It's ridiculous though for Christie to say that he hasn't been -- that Rubio hasn't been answering any questions. My lord, he has answered a lot of your questions. He is on the air all the time? He is taking questions from voters, he does town halls.
KELLY: Uh-hm.
HUME: So, it's kind of a silly thing to say. But, you know, at this stage of the game, I guess you have got to say something.
KELLY: You have been around politics for a long time, Brit. What do you make of the -- between Trump and Cruz now? Trump is saying, he is actually the winner in Iowa and that, you know, Cruz's committed fraud?
HUME: I don't think I have been around long enough to have seen anything like this.
(LAUGHTER)
I mean, I really have. And I mean, these two men are somewhat unusual candidates. Trump, of course, is the most unusual candidate I think any of us has really quite ever seen. Even more unusual perhaps than Ross Perot and he was playing unusual. Cruz is, you know, an arch conservative and a brilliant guy. He is not gifted with the -- what I would call the cuddly kind of manner that makes everybody kind of naturally gravitate toward him. And to see these two guys who were, you know, at the head of the PAC in this kind of fight over something that, you know, as Judge Napolitano pointed out earlier is kind of legally pointless is amazing. And, of course, how can you not be amazed at Trump who looked really sort of at his best the other night when acknowledging his loss in Iowa, then turns around two days later and starts claiming he was cheated. It looks like sore loser stuff and I'm not sure the voters in New Hampshire will appreciate it.
KELLY: Brit, pastel Brit, you look great. I like this version. And I like the new background. It's pretty.
HUME: Thank you, Megyn. I appreciate it. We did it just for you.
KELLY: And I learned when we were in Iowa together that Brit actually makes an effort at being pastel Brit. He has to put some time and some money into it, right, Brit?
HUME: Not a lot. But some.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: See, he cares.
HUME: Megyn, I shopped the sales.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: I'm glad to hear it. Great to see you, Brit.
HUME: Thanks, Megyn.
KELLY: Well, the O.J. Simpson murder trial is now playing out for a second time in a dramatic miniseries showing us a side of the case we have never seen before. We are not the only ones who have never seen it before. Alan Dershowitz is here with some fascinating facts you have not yet heard.
Plus, President Obama tonight taking fire not on his decision to visit a mosque today but for picking this particular mosque. Glenn Beck is back. Rick Goldstein is here as well on the controversy. And then we'll speak with two Muslims who were with the President today and get their take.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: From the World Headquarters of Fox News, it's "The Kelly File" with Megyn Kelly.
KELLY: Developing controversy tonight over a historic trip for President Obama. The president today went to visit the Islamic society of Baltimore, his first trip to a U.S. Mosque. While the White House says, this visit was about fighting intolerance, this particular mosque was once home to an imam with known ties to multiple terror groups.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: The first thing I want to say is two words that Muslim Americans don't hear often enough and that is thank you. You've seen too often people conflating the horrific acts of terrorism with the beliefs of an entire faith. And, of course, recently we've heard inexcusable political rhetoric against Muslim Americans that has no place in our country. No surprise then that threats and harassment of Muslim Americans have surged, and the best way with for us to fight terrorism is to deny these organizations' legitimacy, and to show that here in the United States of America, we do not suppress Islam.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Brooke Goldstein is a human rights attorney. Muhammad Chaudhry is Communications director for the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community USA. Saba Ahmed is the president and founder of the Republican Muslim Coalition. Saba and Muhammad were both with President Obama today. Great to see you all.
All right. So, Brooke, first of all, set it up for us. What -- what is the -- why is this particular mosque controversial?
BROOKE GOLDSTEIN, HUMAN RIGHTS ATTORNEY: It's controversial for many reasons because it has well documented ties to terrorism. I mean, just look at the imam at the mosque Mohammed Adam el-Sheikh who was the imam for 15 years total was a member of the Muslim brotherhood in Sudan in the 1970s. The Muslim brotherhood being the mother of all terrorist organizations that birthed Hamas, that birthed al-Qaeda. He told his congregation in 2004 that suicide bombings were justifiable by fatwas.
He worked for a group the Islamic Africa Relief Agency that designated by the Treasury Department as a terror organization raised hundreds of thousands of dollars for the Taliban for al-Qaeda. I mean, if the point of visiting this mosque was to show that mainstream Muslims are not extremists, then I think Obama's choice of the mosque really undermined that message. This is the type of mosque that President Obama thinks is mainstream Islam .
KELLY: Yes.
GOLDSTEIN: . represents mainstream Muslims. One that has tied to designated terrorists.
KELLY: Muhammad, does she have a point?
MUHAMMAD CHAUDHRY, AHMADIYYA MUSLIM COMMUNITY USA COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: You know, I'm not sure what happened and what his ties are but as member of the MDM Muslim Community. Muslims who believe in the Mount Maasai (ph) and the largest organized Muslim community in the country, we believe that there's a response to this is a campaign at true Islam.com where we have 11 points that the extremists use to do radicalized Muslims and Muslims using .
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: You're trying to educate young Muslims as to how it - how they start to get you?
CHAUDHRY: Absolutely. And what we're asking Americans to do and we sent a letter to 2,100 imams across country and inviting them to endorse these 11 points. So, I invite this imam and all imams in the country to join us.
KELLY: So, your cost (ph) is just -- your cost (ph) is just -- you're trying to shed light to light to young Muslims on how it starts because it's -- what your survey found is they -- they don't realize when their people are starting to radicalize them. The -- the questions are on the nose, but -- but on the subject of this mosque (ph) -- I'll give it to you Saba, what do you think because you were there. I mean, you say -- you said on this program, "We go to the mosque to pray, Megyn. We go to the mosque to pray."
So, you think maybe there was more harm than good done here by the choice of this particular mosque given the former imam there?
SABA AHMED, REPUBLICAN MUSLIM COALITION, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER: Well, Megyn, President Obama came to this mosque to cultivate Muslim American voters for the upcoming presidential election. I think he's gathering support from the Muslim American community and it's time for the Republican to do the same thing. There may have been issues with the mosque, I don't know, but the point is that the he is -- this is an election year and Democrats are going out of their way.
Bernie Sanders was recently at a mosque. All the Democrats are all over the Muslim community, and even though, Islamic values aligned with the Republican Party, we are pro-life, traditional marriage. We are pro- business, trade, things that we care about all align with the Republican Party, but sadly, all of the Democrats are getting all the votes because they are reaching out, going out of the way to be nice to Muslims.
KELLY: Yes.
AHMED: I think I want to see Republican candidates start showing up in mosques and, you know, I think that's the best way to get over the fears of Islam is to start visiting local mosque and especially .
(CROSSTALK)
GOLDSTEIN: Speaking at a terror affiliated .
KELLY: Go ahead.
GOLDSTEIN: . mosque is not how you cultivate the American Muslim community unless you think all Muslim Americans are sympathetic to terror and that is exactly the type of message that Obama is sending when he speaks at a mosque that host speaker such as Anwar al-Awlaki, the American born al- Qaeda cleric. ISB's (ph) own Web site links to the page of the Muslim brotherhood spiritual leader Al-Qaradawi (ph) used to link and then they took it down which -- and Al-Qaradawi (ph) calls the killing of Americans a religious duty.
CHAUDHRY: But this is our .
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: Go ahead Muhammad.
CHAUDHRY: . this is where leadership, and I think what we need to do is open up all our mosques. The -- the head of the Ahmadiyya Muslim community his holiness Mirza Masroor Ahmad that has said, "Come transparency in mosque, 24/7, open them up, so we see what's going on inside mosques." So, we alleviate the fears of Americans. We care about national security just as much as everyone else and opening up our mosque will do so.
KELLY: OK. But -- so, given that, isn't there a better choice? I mean, there was one report out today that this mosque was under surveillance. But that has not been confirmed by Fox News. But, you know, why not just pick one that's like there is no problem, right, Saba. Like just -- so that we don't have to have this discussion, right, at the end of the day. Because obviously, some mosques are used to do radicalize youth, and ss you point out, some mosques are used just to pray.
AHMED: Exactly and yes, we can find better choices but I don't know what would be the perfect mosque for such for Republican candidate to show up maybe in the New Hampshire mosque might be a good idea, but I think .
CHAUDHRY: Here's what I would . (LAUGHTER)
KELLY: Right.
CHAUDHRY: . here's what I would say .
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: But they're going to be overloaded with the Republicans soon.
CHAUDHRY: . we have 70 -- we have 70 mosques around the country, and I invite all elected officials to visit our mosques, and I stand behind .
AHMED: We have 2,200 plus mosques all over. I think.
CHAUDHRY: . all of those -- all of those -- all of those mosques, the Ahmadiyya Muslim community.
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: Maybe we'll go together. We'll go together.
CHAUDHRY: And we invite you all (ph).
AHMED: Yes, we do. I'd love to host you, Megyn at a mosque.
KELLY: We can come, too.
AHMED: I think we should go together. Yes, definitely.
KELLY: All right.
AHMED: We can totally do that.
KELLY: Listen. Thank you all for being here. Good discussion.
AHMED: Thank you for having me.
GOLDSTEIN: Thank you.
AHMED: Thanks.
KELLY: And guess who's back? Glenn Beck, he has some thoughts. Here they are.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: So, Glenn, what do you make of it, President Obama goes to visit this mosque today, the Islamic Society of Baltimore, in particular, to denounce the harsh rhetoric he's heard from Republicans suggesting Trump on the issue of Muslims coming to America and in America?
BECK: Could I ask you, could he have found a mosque that wasn't under FBI surveillance? Could he have found one that wasn't under FBI surveillance, one that didn't just turn out a guy who went -- or wanted to go to an army recruiting center and kill them all? I mean, it's absolutely incredible what this man and then -- and then to say that people in Jefferson's time thought that Jefferson was a Muslim because he had a Quran.
Let me show you something. This is called the Jefferson Quran. It came out in -- in Jefferson's term, you can see it was -- it was printed by Eliza Thomas. The first American edition of the Quran and here's what people actually said at that time, if you look at the very -- the very end. Think of this. They are asking you that every American should not read excerpts but should read the entire Quran, and it says, "You'll find this -- in this version, you will wonder that such absurdities have infected the best part of the world and will avouch that the acknowledge of what is contained into this book will render this law contemptible."
That's what people said about the Quran in the 1800s - 1806. We were at war with the Barbary pirates. Thomas Jefferson knew exactly. In fact, it was Jefferson that was the one who said, "We can't deal with these guys anymore." Read the Quran to try to figure out what it is, and when he realized that their laws and when he talked to the Grand Mufti their laws said, "We can kill you." He thought it was absurd and realized there's .
KELLY: And so .
BECK: . no negotiating with these guys.
KELLY: . so your point is what -- by the way, Brian Kilmeade has a whole book out on and I mean .
BECK: Yes, Brian.
KELLY: Very timely that Thomas Jefferson and Tripoli pirates.
BECK: Yes.
KELLY: But -- but -- so what's your -- what's your point? Your bottom-line is what?
BECK: My bottom-line is if the president wants to talk about Islam, he should talk about the difference between a Muslim and Islamist, and he shouldn't do it at a mosque that is under FBI surveillance.
KELLY: Glenn, always great hearing from you. Thanks for being here.
BECK: Thank you very much, Megyn.
KELLY: Also tonight, the O.J. Simpson trial getting a new look and a dramatic new miniseries, and Attorney Alan Dershowitz joins us with behind the scenes detail you have not heard before. We'll get his reaction, next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL MCGRADY AS "DETECTIVE PHILLIP VAN ATTER": Here at OJ's house, there appears to be blood on one of his vehicles and we can see drops of blood leading into the house. There are also two bloody gloves, one in each location that appeared to match.
SARAH PAULSON AS "MARCIA CLARKE": Wow. What were you doing at Simpson's?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're here notifying a family member. We just didn't realize he turned out to be a suspect.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ETHAN FLOWER AS "OFFICER ROBERT RISKE": Down that path there's that a bloody shoe prints. He exit through the rear.
STEVEN PASQUALE AS "DETECTIVE MARK FUHRMAN": He's bleeding from the left hand.
Nothing is disturbed. It's probably not a robbery.
Mark?
"FUHRMAN": Yeah.
BILL LIPPINCOTT AS "DETECTIVE": We got to withdraw from the case. They kicked it upstairs.
"FUHRMAN": To who?
"VAN ATTER": Detective Van Atter. Where are the kids?
"LAPD POLICE OFFICER": They are being held at West L.A.
CHRIS BAUER AS "DETECTIVE TOM LANGE": Have we ID'ed the male?
"VAN ATTER": How about O.J. Simpson? Anybody notify him yet?
"LANGE": We don't want a Belushi situation. Can't have him learning about this from his TV.
"RISKE": There is no media here.
"VAN ATTER": This is a double homicide in Brentwood, they'll show. So, anybody has Simpson's address?
"FUHRMAN": I know where O.J. lives. I'm Detective Mark Fuhrman. I was there years ago, family dispute. It's a few minutes away you.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Wow. That was a clip from the new miniseries American Crime Story, the people vs. O.J. Simpson. More than 20 years ago, the former football star was acquitted of murder in a case going to the trial of the century. And our next guest, Alan Dershowitz was in the middle of it all as a member of Simpson's so-called legal dream team.
First though, Trace Gallagher gets us up to speed on this miniseries. Trace?
TRACE GALLAGHER, FOX NEWS ANCHOR, WEST COAST NEWSROOM: Megyn, if TV is about ratings, reviews and reaction, the O.J. miniseries is off to a scorching start. FX says, the premier set a record with 5.1 million viewers. That's higher than "Sons of Anarchy" and "The Shield." Reviews are also glowing with some calling it scanned loosely (ph) entertaining and tour-de-force TV storytelling, but the reaction is mixed.
On social media, the comments have been mostly positive, but the major players who actually lived the trial of the century are not sharing the enjoyment. Former O.J. Prosecutor Marcia Clark says, "Watching the show was painful." Saying, quote, "Everybody seemed to forget that two innocent people were slaughtered. Not just killed, slaughtered." Fred Goldman, whose son Ron was killed alongside Nicole Brown Simpson says, he is furious the show ignores the victims. And Kim Goldman said this on "Fox & Friends." listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a little unnerving to watch your personal family story and a story that impacted us so greatly be played out for the national screen yet again.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: OJ's formerly famous house mate Kato Kaelin says, the show has too much Kato Kaelin and is inaccurate, and O.J. Simpson' attorney says, "O.J. doesn't mind how is he portrayed but doesn't like how Johnnie Cochran is portrayed." Megyn?
KELLY: Wow. Trace, thank you. Joining us is Alan Dershowitz who was an adviser to O.J. Simpson's legal defense team and author of the book "Taking the Stand: My Life in the Law." There he is in the courtroom. Alan, great to see you, Professor.
I know -- I was in law school when you guys were doing this case, and we all looked up to all of you because whether you thought O.J. was guilty or not that was an amazing defense that was put on. You say though it wasn't a dream team at all?
ALAN DERSHOWITZ, FORMER O.J. SIMPSON DEFENSE TEAM ADVISER: Oh, no. It was a nightmare team. The lawyers were competing with each other for media attention.
KELLY: Including you?
DERSHOWITZ: You know, I was back in Cambridge just writing faxes mostly. I was going to do the appeal if he lost. I was what he called the God forbid lawyer and, you know, I think this miniseries saw something else. Lawyers have leaked the information that they shouldn't have leaked.
KELLY: Why do you say that?
DERSHOWITZ: For example, we learned that he failed the lie detector test. That's not something that should ever have come out. The only people who knew that were his two lawyers and the lie detector guy. We learned that he tried to commit suicide. I didn't know that.
KELLY: You didn't know --
DERSHOWITZ: No.
KELLY: -- you learned that from this miniseries?
DERSHOWITZ: Yeah. And people shouldn't -- lawyers shouldn't be disclosing that kind of information. Lawyer/client privilege really matters. Now, we were a nightmare team, but the prosecution, oh my God. If you want to blame somebody for what you regard as a miscarriage of justice, they made every mistake in the book.
KELLY: What were the worst ones?
DERSHOWITZ: Trying on the glove in front of jury. I was there.
KELLY: It doesn't fit you must acquit.
DERSHOWITZ: Right. I was there, 2 feet away. Under California Law, they could have made him try on the glove outside of the hearing of the jury to see if it fit, but they were so arrogant. They did it in front of the jury, and he walked up to the jury and he said, "It's too small." At that point he didn't have to testify because he had testified with that cross- examination.
KELLY: Yes.
DERSHOWITZ: And then introducing Mark Fuhrman who's a smart guy. But he was hiding his racist past. That helped us win the case and --
KELLY: He knew about that. When -- when the prosecution put him on the stand, did you know about the tapes in which the "N" word was used?
DERSHOWITZ: No. But we had hints about him having a racist background and we -- we learned about the tapes gradually.
KELLY: Yes.
DERSHOWITZ: And then, of course, the sock, the magic sock.
KELLY: Refresh the viewers' recollection about this.
DERSHOWITZ: They claimed they found a sock on a white rag in front of his bed, but the video shows, there were no black socks on the white rug and the sock had blood of the victim and O.J. but the blood had EDTA which is anticoagulant not found in the human body. It was poured from a test tube and then finally that --
KELLY: And that was not -- you're not putting that on Fuhrman. You're putting that .
DERSHOWITZ: Oh, no, no. That's on --
KELLY: -- on Detective Vannatter.
DERSHOWITZ: -- Vannatter. He had access to the blood he had it at home. Then the sock had mirror images of the blood on all four sides. If you're wearing the sock and it gets splattered blood you have mirror images on first side and the inside but then the leg separate it and you don't get a mirror image but if you pour the blood on the sock you get four mirror images.
And so, all the jurors in the end, many of them thought he was probably guilty .
KELLY: Yes.
DERSHOWITZ: -- but they said, "The police tampered real evidence." That means can't trust the mountain of evidence. Some of the jurors may have said, "Even if he is guilty we're not rewarding cops for planting evidence." Others may have said, "We have some doubts." But remember there were also not all black jurors. They were three whites on the juror including a woman who we called the demon because she had previously turned around a jury that was 11 to 1 for acquittal and made them go for conviction. We tried to get rid of her.
KELLY: That's what you want at the defense.
DERSHOWITZ: No. We try to get rid of her, but she voted for acquittal. Then two weeks later, she had an interview and said, "Oh, I'm so sorry. I voted for acquittal. He was really guilty I should have voted for conviction." But you know, afterthoughts don't count.
KELLY: So, we had to talk about -- I want -- I want to talk about your thoughts on Fuhrman, who's --
DERSHOWITZ: Yeah.
KELLY: -- the frequent guest on this show now. I want to talk to you about why this case so resonated with Americans --
DERSHOWITZ: Sure.
KELLY: -- and still does to this day and another question when we come right back. Don't go away.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVID SCHWIMMER AS "ROBERT KARDASHIAN": O.J.? O.J.?
(BACKGROUND MUSIC PLAYING)
ANGIE PATTERSON AS "PAULA BARBIERI": He went out back.
(BACKGROUND MUSIC PLAYING)
"KARDASHIAN": The Bronco is gone.
(BACKGROUND MUSIC PLAYING)
BRUCE GREENWOOD AS "GIL GARCETTI": Yes, I got it.
"CLARKE": Oh, my God. We're going to look like morons.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Wow. That was another clip from the new FX miniseries "American Crime Story: The People vs. O.J. Simpson." Back with us. Now, Alan Dershowitz, a member of OJ's legal team. So, first of all, on Fuhrman, he comes on this show. What do you think of him now?
DERSHOWITZ: He's a smart guy, and I think he's rehabilitated himself. Look, he had a terrible past and did some terrible things and said some terrible things. He helped us win the case.
KELLY: Yes.
DERSHOWITZ: They should never have put him on. Marcia Clark was warned about him, and she didn't take the warning seriously.
KELLY: Yes. Why do you think the case is -- it still resonates with the -- the American public so?
DERSHOWITZ: Well, because I think racial divide still exist. So, black lives matter, the whole movement that we now see based on so many black people being killed brings back memories of the O.J. case. It was not an important case legally. Certainly, not my most important case. I have had many, many more.
KELLY: Yes.
DERSHOWITZ: But it was an important case in terms of exposing a racial divide that exist in America.
KELLY: Do -- do you think he did it?
DERSHOWITZ: Well, maybe Netanyahu once called me into his private office and said, "Alan, did O.J. do it?" And I said, "Mr. Prime Minister, does Israel have nuclear weapons?" Then he said, "You know, I can't tell you that."
(LAUGHTER)
And I said, "Aha, you know, I can't tell you that." Defense lawyers can never disclose anything that they learned in the case.
KELLY: Let me ask you this. Do you know whether he did it?
DERSHOWITZ: I don't know any more than most other people would do. He certainly always proclaimed his innocence in the loudest possible way. But we're each entitled to our own opinion, but defense lawyers have to go to the grave .
KELLY: Yes.
DERSHOWITZ: -- with their opinions of guiltiness.
KELLY: Certainly, in a civil case, the jury said that he did and he sits in a prison for a different crime.
DERSHOWITZ: Everybody has the right to make their own decision.
KELLY: And everybody has the right to a great defense lawyer. Unfortunately, not everybody gets it. Great to see you. We'll be right back.
DERSHOWITZ: Thank you.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Was that not fascinating? We're getting tons of -- of reaction on social media to Alan Dershowitz in this new miniseries. Let me know what you think. Go to facebook.com/thekellyfile. Follow on twitter@megynkelly. Let me know what you think about the cruise from (inaudible). See you tomorrow. I'm Megyn Kelly.
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