Former South Carolina governor challenges President Trump for the 2020 GOP nomination

This is a rush transcript from "Your World," September 11, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

NEIL CAVUTO, ANCHOR: Our alert today, the markets notwithstanding, remembering the event that shook America 18 years ago today.

Welcome, everybody. I'm Neil Cavuto.

It is a very different Lower Manhattan today, just as we are a very different country today. And you know what? We're all over it today, as we should be, remembering a nation that has bounced back and markets that had bounced back too. Both weren't supposed to happen. Both are remarkable stories.

And that's why we are leading with this story. It's that big and important, with Eric Shawn at Ground Zero on remembering those who lost their lives, market watchers Ted Weisberg and Art Hogan remembering how investments were considered lost, but came back, and then the former Homeland Security Secretary Jeh Johnson on what needs to be done to avoid a repeat of that horrible day.

We begin with Eric in New York City -- Eric.

ERIC SHAWN, SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Hello, Neil.

Well, on that morning, the first plane to hit the World Trade Center flew over my head. And although it's been 18 years, it, at times, feels frankly that not one day has gone by. And today, this morning, we witnessed the familiar ritual.

The family members, loved ones and officials gathered again here at what was Ground Zero and is now the gleaming World Trade Center to remember the loved ones who were lost. There was the reading of the names, the two moments of silence for when each tower fell, and the other two for when the buildings were hit, and then collapsed.

Their attributes and tears and, for many, the pain and sorrow, despite the years, have not receded.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not a day goes by that we don't think you're going to walk through that door. Thank you for always looking over mom and dad, Carolyn (ph), Darcy (ph), and all the cousins. Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: With all respect to our lost loved ones, this one is kind of hard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHAWN: And there is a new glade this year that represents and honors the 2,101st responders and others who have come down with cancer and other diseases and succumbed to those diseases after breathing the toxic air and working on the dust pile.

And, Neil, sadly, that number is expected to surpass the death toll of that day in a few years.

There was one noted speaker, Nicholas Haros, whose 76-year-old mother, Frances, was killed on 9/11. He tore into Michigan Congresswoman Ilhan Omar and the so-called Squad after her comments about -- quote -- "Some people did something on 9/11."

Here were some of his blunt and direct comments directed at Omar.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NICHOLAS HAROS JR., SON OF 9/11 VICTIM: I was attacked. Your relatives and friends were attacked. Our constitutional freedoms were attacked. And our nation's founding on Judeo-Christian principles were attacked. That's what some people did. Got that now?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SHAWN: And he directly blamed Islamic terrorism.

And, Neil, tonight, of course, the tribute in lights. The two beams that will soar and pierce the night Manhattan sky will be lit all night. They will be finished tomorrow at dawn. They evoke what was lost and a reminder of the threat that still exists -- Neil, back to you.

CAVUTO: Eric, thank you very, very much.

People forget that this was an attack also on the financial capital of the world, New York. It wasn't by accident that those towers were chosen that day.

And just to put it in perspective, the stock market never opened that day because of the attacks. It wouldn't open for another six days, but the day before, the Dow had finished at 9605. When trading did resume on the 17th, there was almost a freefall, stocks careening 684 points, the biggest loss up until that time in a single day, about 7.1 percent.

By the time the week ended, a collapse of about 1,370 points, 14 percent. But I want to put that in some perspective with this chart, showing from where we went down to where we are now, the Dow within a couple hundred points of a brand-new record right now.

We have essentially tripled in that period of time, a reminder that the chart itself can be jagged and confusing, and if you live in any of those down jagged moments, a little bit disquieting, to put it mildly.

But it is a testament to capitalism, as well as maybe us in this country, that we always come back. We always see the chart inexorably going up.

These gentlemen know it very well. They follow that chart and follow these markets well before then, since then, and even now.

Ted Weisberg, Art Hogan joining from outside the New York Stock Exchange.

Gentlemen, welcome to both of you.

TED WEISBERG, PRESIDENT, SEAPORT SECURITIES CORPORATION: Thanks, Neil.

CAVUTO: Ted, I would like to begin with you and get your sense of just the enormity of that. I mean, if you think about it, not only did we lose some of our best and brightest in the financial community that day, many who perished in the towers, but there was supposed to be a financial long winter, maybe even a depression.

Within a month, stocks were trading back to their old levels. What happened?

WEISBERG: Well, what happened, Neil, is simply what we are all taught from when we're little kids, that when we fall off the horse, we pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, and we climb back on that horse, and we simply just keep going, because we really don't have a choice.

I mean, this is -- this is America. This is the psyche of America. And this is one thing that the rest of the world, unfortunately, has trouble understanding.

As you pointed out, the stock market has tripled since those trading lows following 9/11/2001, a lot of ups and downs, a lot of hand-wringing, a lot of tears, but the general direction has been up, which is a reflection of this great country that we all live in.

CAVUTO: Art, I mentioned, looking at that chart, a lot of the younger workers on this show always tell me, oh, there goes gramps with his chart thing again.

But I like to point it out, only because, especially when you step back from it, those moments are horrific, just like 9/11, just like after the whole oil crises of the '70s, or the assassination of John Kennedy, or the Vietnam War, or even the financial meltdown.

And you're living in those moments. You can't make light of them or dismiss them, but, inexorably, we get through them. We go -- like, we go up from them.

And I like to think that that chart is as much illustrative of capitalism as it is us. What do you think?

ART HOGAN, MARKET STRATEGIST: No, I agree with you.

And I think when you back up and look at a chart like that -- and, Neil, you're very good at that at look -- taking the longer-term perspective and saying, this doesn't just represent capital -- the capitalist country that we are, the ability to raise capital for companies that are starting and the long-run success we have had.

It represents our country. And we have had our ups and downs. 1987, obviously, that felt like that was the end of the world, when the market crashed in October. We certainly -- a couple of times in the last nine years, we have certainly gone in and out of terrible times in this market.

But when you step back and look at this, this is a country that has been able to pull itself up by its bootstraps and recover from a lot of terrible things; 9/11 was probably one of the worst.

CAVUTO: When you go back to that day, Ted, there are a lot of people that said, even to Dick Grasso, maybe you're not going to be ready to open this thing up. Maybe it's bad. You will tumble badly. Your system isn't in place.

And, sure enough, I mean, we did go into a freefall there, but he was insistent that you do open up, that you do get back to business, bumpy ride notwithstanding. What did you think of that?

WEISBERG: Well, I think he was right on the money.

And you probably can't see it in the camera, but over my left shoulder is a plaque on the wall of the stock exchange commemorating his spirit and what he did that day.

But it's what we all did, because that's what we do. We all went to work on that Monday, a lot of our raw emotions. Even now, to this day, 18 years later, when you're inside that building, and you hear a loud bang out in the street, everything stops and everybody starts looking towards the windows.

But none of us that were there then will ever forget it. And Dick Grasso was the spirit of the stock exchange. And to this day, he -- in some respects, he's still the spirit of what we do over there every day and what's been -- what's been done over there every day for the last couple of hundred years.

CAVUTO: You know, Art, people forget -- and you were there -- but we know about that unusual time when Republicans and Democrats came together. They sang, held hands on the steps of the Capitol.

But for the money guys on Wall Street, it was something a little different. They all cooperated with each other, helped each other out to get up and running again.

And that was even more remarkable, in a financial sense, because you guys are normally going at each other tooth and nail, right?

HOGAN: Yes, absolutely, Neil.

That's such an important thing to remind everybody about, because, obviously, there are times in our history where we think about how divided we can be politically. And there were no Democrats and no Republicans in the weeks and months after 9/11.

The same thing was true in our industry, one of the most competitive industries in the world. And one of our largest competitors at the time needed a great deal of help, because they lost most -- most of their employees and a lot of their technology.

And all of us stepped in to make sure the people that were still around could get up and go and have a place to go to work and keep their business running.

So I think that that's the important part of what we can take away from this today is your reminder that that's what we do as a country. We help each other out, we pull together, and then we get better and heal together.

CAVUTO: All right, and neither of you were small parts in that comeback story.

Gentlemen, I want to thank you for that then and your friendship now. Much appreciated.

You know, my next guest was among the dignitaries attending a 9/11 ceremony today at Ground Zero, of course, the former Department of Homeland security secretary under President Barack Obama, Jeh Johnson.

Secretary, good to have you.

JEH JOHNSON, FORMER SECRETARY OF HOMELAND SECURITY: Thanks, Neil. Thanks for having me.

CAVUTO: I talk to a lot of young people. Both my sons, Secretary, were born after 9/11.

So, to them, it's an historic event. It's curious. It's gripping. They see it.

But how do you keep it alive?

JOHNSON: Well, that's a good question; 9/11 happens to be my birthday; 9/11/01 one was my 44th birthday.

CAVUTO: Oh, my...

(CROSSTALK)

JOHNSON: And the recollections I have of that day will stay frozen in my mind.

The last segment you had was very interesting about the reopening of the exchange six days later.

CAVUTO: Right.

JOHNSON: A good friend of mine, a woman by the name of Jody Gilardi (ph), who you probably never heard of, was a trader on the floor in 2001, one of the few women on the -- on the floor, who worked, along with these gentlemen, to get the machinery of the exchange back up again six days after that attack.

And it's a real tribute. And I thank you for doing that.

CAVUTO: That was rough, too.

JOHNSON: It was rough.

CAVUTO: I mean, they were not ready for that. And they had to do a lot.

(CROSSTALK)

JOHNSON: You were in the midst of a bomb blast in a war zone.

CAVUTO: Sure.

JOHNSON: And people -- I will never forget going downtown. There were people the day or two after the attack, just like the Pentagon, who came to work the next day and were determined to remain active.

And so it's a real tribute to the heroism of New Yorkers, the stories we continue to hear.

I go to the observance every year, and everyone from that period looks a little grayer.

(LAUGHTER)

JOHNSON: But, to a lot of us, it's still -- it's still a fresh memory.

Every day in September, when you have a bright clear blue sky, I always think about 9/11/2001.

CAVUTO: Right. Right.

But you think about it too, I mean, only yesterday, there was a briefing at the White House talking about going after the financing of terrorists and terrorist networks.

JOHNSON: Yes.

CAVUTO: And I'm thinking, almost two decades later, this is still a paramount concern, as it's been under Republican and Democratic administrations...

JOHNSON: Yes.

CAVUTO: ... that we can never lose sight of that, that there are still a lot of these bad guys around. They might not have been able to pull off something as epic...

JOHNSON: Right.

CAVUTO: ... but they sure want to, don't they?

JOHNSON: Neil, the -- the terrorist threat to our nation still exists.

It has evolved significantly since 9/11. I think our government now, our intelligence community, our law enforcement, our military are much better at detecting and preventing a larger-scale attack launched from overseas of the type of 9/11.

I cannot tell you the number of overseas plots that we have been able to prevent, interdict and detect over the last 18 years.

CAVUTO: Oh, I can imagine.

JOHNSON: Where we're challenged now are the what I refer to as terrorist- inspired attacks, the so-called lone wolf, inspired by something they see or read on the Internet, foreign terrorist organizations, and then, of late, violent right-wing nationalism, which often inspires people.

And, in fact, the Anti-Defamation League and others now track this and say that right-wing violent extremism, that type of violence, is outpacing all these terrorist organizations.

CAVUTO: But there's also Antifa and all these others. I mean, nuts are nuts, right?

So I guess what I'm asking is whether you see anything of the magnitude that happened this day 18 years ago happening again?

JOHNSON: Well, we can never say never. We have to continue to be vigilant.

And our national security is vigilant. We detect these things now at a much earlier stage.

CAVUTO: But they have to succeed just once, right?

JOHNSON: But -- correct.

And homeland security, national security, one failure equals 1,000 successes. We have to be vigilant. But we also have to -- I used to tell my people, don't -- don't prepare for the last terrorist attack. Prepare for the next terrorist attacks.

We have to see the trend lines. We have to see the threat streams and be vigilant. And we're challenged now when it comes to these more random, smaller-scale attacks. We're challenged in terms of where they occur, how they might occur.

And a lot of people ask me, what can we do?

CAVUTO: All right.

JOHNSON: And I believe gun safety is the key, Neil, I think, first and foremost, gun safety.

And, hopefully, our Congress will act, consistent with the Second Amendment.

CAVUTO: We shall watch it very closely.

Secretary, thank you very much for taking the time.

JOHNSON: Thank you.

CAVUTO: We will have a lot more after this, including a Dow that soared today. We're going to get into that as well.

Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: All right, Republicans are crowing about two big wins in North Carolina yesterday that in large part were maybe President Trump's doing, especially when he was there on behalf of Dan Bishop, who was the Republican presidential -- or congressional candidate for a closely monitored seat that they had to have.

Well, he delivered the goods. He had been down in the polls before the president's rally, won after that.

The Washington Examiner's Emily Larsen on the Trump effect that worked here, I guess, huh?

EMILY LARSEN, THE WASHINGTON EXAMINER: Hi.

Well, I think definitely President Trump had an impact on the race. But how much of an impact, yet to be determined. It's hard to tell with these special elections how much of an effect that will have.

But it's certainly something that I expect that President Trump will be looking forward to in 2020 going to key areas with these swing districts, where the GOP is hoping to win back, especially some of these suburban districts, from the Democrats, and using the same strategy.

Also, there was a whole lot of money pouring into this race, outside money, in a very, very competitive race. And, right now, the Republicans and their allies are outraising the Democrats by quite a bit. So that could be an advantage for them going forward.

CAVUTO: All right, now, much has been said of the fact that, in the end, these were close races. They were just a couple of points. But a win is a win is a win.

The president won this particular district where Bishop chalked up the victory by a dozen points on the last go-round. Some read into that maybe this is going to be a more stubborn district to pick up than in the past.

What do you think?

LARSEN: Well, certainly, it is not good news for the Republicans that a district that Trump won by 12 points in 2016, they won by only two points with their congressional seat this go-around.

CAVUTO: Right.

LARSEN: That should be trouble for them when the Republicans are trying to win back seats the Democrats won last go-around, and especially they're targeting places where Trump won, but also places where Trump didn't win.

And so if they're having trouble winning back a place where Trump did do very well, especially in those suburban areas -- I mean, in this district, the more rural areas were very red, but the more suburban areas near Charlotte were -- went -- were very blue.

And so, if they're trying to target those suburban areas, especially women voters, that's going to be a challenge for them.

CAVUTO: We shall see very much.

Emily Larsen, thank you very, very much.

Well, I wonder if Mark Sanford was watching this closely, the guy who is the latest to challenge the president for the Republican nomination. Maybe, given the president's performance here in helping turn around a losing candidate into a winning one might give him pause.

We will ask him. He's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: All right, we had a strong day in the markets today, the Dow up about 227 points.

The president says that's kind of the wind at his back right now, and he's very optimistic that it's those improving markets and the improving economy that will cinch it for him and give him another four years in office.

This next gentleman is trying to stop that. He is among three -- make them three -- Republicans challenging the president for the Republican nomination. He is the former governor of South Carolina, former congressman as well, Mark Sanford.

Sir, good to have you.

MARK SANFORD, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: A pleasure to be with you, Neil.

CAVUTO: You know, Governor, the president referred to your challenge, Congressman Joe Walsh, Bill Weld, that you're all the Three Stooges, you're all badly failed candidates.

What did you think of that?

SANFORD: Well, I think that's what elections are about. And that's what the voters ultimately decide in these equations.

But what I do know is that we have a profound spending and debt problem in this country, and it should alarm every conservative out there.

And the president himself and said: If you elect me, I will eliminate the debt over the eight years that I might be in office.

Instead, the numbers have gone in the reverse direction. And we're not having a conversation about it. On the Democratic side, there's a debate about more vs. more, and we're just not talking about it on the Republican side.

And I think we're walking our way toward the most predictable financial crisis in the history of our country if we don't address this, which is why I'm running.

CAVUTO: And what are you planning to cut or curb as a result of getting the spending under control?

SANFORD: Well, I would say, first, you have -- to fix a problem, you have got to recognize that you have a problem.

And I think that, sadly, there's a disconnect between voters out there, for whom I think this issue is still important -- that's the real premise of my campaign -- and people in elected office who aren't talking about it.

It's the three monkeys routine of, I hear no evil, I see no evil, I speak no evil on the issue of debt and deficit.

CAVUTO: No, I understand that, Governor. I understand that.

SANFORD: Yes.

CAVUTO: But what would you cut?

SANFORD: Yes.

CAVUTO: I mean, obviously, others have talked about that fact that the debt has ballooned.

(CROSSTALK)

SANFORD: Everything -- every -- to answer your question -- to answer your question, Neil, everything.

I was the author, when I was in Congress, of a plan called the Penny Plan. And, again, if people -- Americans are amazing, the way they will respond to a threat, if they view it as a threat. We don't see our debt and spending as a threat right now.

But if they did, I believe they would rally around, as Americans, Republicans, Democrats, and all of us would get in the boat together, if we're forced to get in the boat together, because we see this as a systemic threat, which is what Admiral Mike Mullen, who was the former chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, described it as, the biggest threat to our country, the debt.

(CROSSTALK)

CAVUTO: I understand that.

But the Penny Plan gets -- in every single program, you would, on the dollar, cut...

SANFORD: Every single program.

Well, no, what it does is, it forces action.

CAVUTO: Right.

SANFORD: What it says is, if Congress won't act, then we will go across the board and cutting a penny from every program out there, a penny out of every dollar.

And I think it's a great place to start.

CAVUTO: Does that include Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid?

SANFORD: Everything. Everything, because...

(CROSSTALK)

CAVUTO: How do you think that will go over with those who are on Social Security, those who are on Medicare? They're going to go, oh, he's going to raid me and all that.

SANFORD: Well, I think that a grandmother or a grandfather out there, there's no person they love more than their grandkids.

And they would gladly give up a dollar, if everybody else was giving up. Now, they're not about to give up that dollar if everybody else is protected and got their stuff covered, which is, again, I think the beauty of the Penny Plan.

Let's all get in the boat together as Americans. Let's recognize...

CAVUTO: And that includes defense? You would not leave anything out?

SANFORD: Nothing out.

CAVUTO: Would you raise taxes, Governor?

(CROSSTALK)

SANFORD: No.

CAVUTO: I get what you're saying. Would you raise taxes?

SANFORD: Well, let me be clear.

It doesn't say we're going to cut a penny from every dollar. It says, if you don't come up with more targeted cuts, we will cut a penny from every dollar.

CAVUTO: But you know they won't come up with more targeted cuts.

SANFORD: Would it raise taxes? No.

CAVUTO: All right, so if they don't come up with more targeted cuts, you revert back to the Penny Plan, and you do not, do not raise taxes?

SANFORD: No, we have consistently been about 18 percent of GDP over the last 70 years in this country. You can only squeeze but so much blood from a turnip. And I think we ought to leave the taxpayer alone.

CAVUTO: It's not an attractive platform, I understand. Certainly, the urgency -- and you're absolutely right. Democrats and Republicans have failed at this.

But do you -- can you hang your hat on a battle for the Republican nomination for president by saying, I am all about cutting this largess?

SANFORD: It's the truth. It's what we have to do as a country, because, if not, the financial markets will do it for us.

And that process has been historically bloody. For savers, for investors, for the American dream, for jobs, I mean, we got to confront this reality. We cannot continue to pretend that this financial storm is not about to come ashore, because I believe absolutely certainly that it is.

I mean, think about this. If you look at the last 70 years, household -- I'm going to get into numbers. In fact, I won't get into numbers. I'm going to get too wonky real fast.

But think about this. We will spend more on interest than we do on national defense in 36 months. We will spend more on interest than we do an all children's programs at the federal level in one year.

We're, again, headed toward a spot that is absolutely unsustainable, which is why Admiral Mike Mullen would say what he said in terms of warning about the consequences of the debt buildup.

CAVUTO: No, no, you're right. It's been a ticking time tomb, whether that is the solution. But you are addressing it.

We will see what happens.

Governor, thank you very, very much. Good having you.

SANFORD: Yes, sir. Pleasure.

CAVUTO: All right.

Back to the man he wants to defeat, the president of the United States, right now for the Republican nomination. It's going well for him, and he says, when it comes to this whole China trade deal thing, some signs that it could be going really well.

Peter Navarro, his trade adviser, here to tell us -- after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: All right, it's a controversial decision, but the president wants to just go ahead right now and pull all vaping products, especially the ones that are targeted at kids from the market.

Forget about whether he can do that. Is it high time he did do that?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT: The supply chain of China, which was this unbreakable, powerful tool that they had, is breaking up like a toy, because companies are moving out. And China wants to make a deal. We will see what happens.

We have to make the right deal for this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: Those comments lifted the market, the president sounding optimistic on concessions he says the Chinese are already looking at.

They have already announced that they are going to hold off on additional tariffs and ban certain products that they were considering with that, including food for livestock, and lubricants, and a host of other developments.

A man behind that and maybe triggering a lot of that is the president's trade adviser, Peter Navarro, who joins us outside the White House.

Mr. Navarro, good to have you. Thank you.

PETER NAVARRO, DIRECTOR, WHITE HOUSE OFFICE OF TRADE AND MANUFACTURING POLICY: How are you today, Neil?

CAVUTO: I'm fine.

Is it your sense that this maybe is coming together? Or are we going to be let down again?

NAVARRO: So, the only thing I will have to say is what the president said should be taken at face value.

And the Chinese are coming here. And there's going to be discussions with Ambassador Robert Lighthizer. And let's see what happens.

In the meantime, what I would like to talk about today is something that's going to be really important for Americans. This is the issue of the Universal Postal Union, Neil, which is an organization we -- which America helped found hundreds of years ago.

Basically, what it does is set international postal rates. And last year, the president found out that, under the system of that organization, Americans were really getting taken to the cleaners.

We were -- were importing a lot of small packages, and only about 40 percent of those costs were being borne by the foreigners. So he said, fix it.

We issued a notice of withdrawal from the Universal Postal Union last October. This is coming to a head this month in Geneva. I'm going over with a delegation with the State Department.

And we have on the table two options that an extraordinary Congress could vote on that would keep us in the UPU, but really get a great deal for America. But if we don't, we're out.

CAVUTO: But why now? Why now, though, Peter?

I mean, I was reading through this and seeing, all right, we're getting screwed, apparently, when it comes to this postal rate, that our guys are paying more just to move packages around and all that. I get that.

But it seems like you're in the middle of this big China fight, and now this fight.

NAVARRO: Yes.

So, really, they have -- one has nothing at all to do with the other. This issue actually...

CAVUTO: I know. That's my point. So, why not one fight at a time? The big one is with China, right?

(CROSSTALK)

NAVARRO: Hang on, Neil. Hang on. Let's -- let's understand what's going on here.

President Reagan years ago acknowledged that we had a big problem there. Nobody ever did anything about it. President Trump said, let's fix this in Trump time, which is as quick as possible.

So what that means is that we issued a letter of withdraw last October through the State Department.

CAVUTO: Right.

NAVARRO: Now, under the terms of the Bern Treaty, that means that we have up to a -- we have to wait a year to withdraw. So just by circumstance and happenstance, that comes this October.

What we're trying to do -- and I think we're working really well with many, many countries -- is to come up with an agreement that keeps us in the UPU, but gets us fair self-declared rates, so that American workers, manufacturers don't take the short end of the stick.

And the USPS...

CAVUTO: I understand.

But you're saying that, if you get your way, you want out, right, I mean, that you want out of this whole thing?

NAVARRO: So -- so, two things are certain.

Either we will get a favorable vote in Geneva, or we will exit. Now, the good news about that is, I have been working literally every week with a high-level task force to make sure any exit would be seamless, so Americans won't see any difference in terms of their mail.

What we will see...

CAVUTO: But, Peter, you hope not. You hope not.

NAVARRO: Hang on.

CAVUTO: But, Peter, no, think about it. In the middle of this massive fight with...

NAVARRO: But you can't be against, Neil -- hang on. Hang on.

(CROSSTALK)

NAVARRO: You cannot be against this, Neil. You cannot be against this.

CAVUTO: It doesn't matter if you're for or against.

I'm just saying, it's one fight at a time. You see, when you have got this fight with China that is a priority.

NAVARRO: This is apples and oranges. We can walk and chew gum.

CAVUTO: No, no, you just said that you would want -- one of the options is to leave this organization, right?

(LAUGHTER)

NAVARRO: Sure.

CAVUTO: In the meantime, you are having the fight with China.

NAVARRO: We can walk and chew gum at the same time, Neil.

CAVUTO: Really? Do you think you can?

NAVARRO: This -- I do think we can.

And we're doing this beautifully with us. This is something that every American should be rallying behind, because it's really -- it's scandalous that foreign -- foreign nations can send products here to undercut the prices of our manufacturers, put us out of work, and we have to pay them.

CAVUTO: No, no, Peter, you have got a worthy battle here. No, no, this -- you make a -- you make a very good argument.

NAVARRO: All right, so let's not make a big deal out of this, Neil.

This is on the calender.

CAVUTO: No, no, Peter, it's the same thing.

NAVARRO: This is on the calender.

CAVUTO: When you take on countries, or you take on Japan, you take on South Korea, you take on individual countries, as you're taking on China, you're spread all over the map on this.

NAVARRO: Oh, come on now. You can't be against this, Neil.

If you're -- if you're -- we're not spread all over the map. We have a high-level delegation working with over 50 countries on this. We're going to Geneva. We have got an extraordinary Congress, which is only the third one in over 100 years for the UPU.

We're doing this by the diplomatic book, Neil. And you should be applauding us.

CAVUTO: Why now? Why now?

NAVARRO: Because it takes a year to get out. And we put our denun -- our letter of withdrawal last October.

And so we're going through the process of it. And I think we're going to get a good outcome.

CAVUTO: So, you think something can happen. Do you think -- all right, you think you will get a good outcome.

Do you think you're going to have a deal with China?

NAVARRO: That's a separate matter, right?

CAVUTO: Yes, it is. Yes.

NAVARRO: Can we agree on that? OK.

So let's -- let's also agree that this UPU thing, if we just focus on that, that's good for America. Can we agree on that?

CAVUTO: Fine. I hope it works out. I hope it works out.

NAVARRO: All right, so let's go back -- let's go back to China.

CAVUTO: I'm asking about China. Do you think -- you're optimistic you will get your way on this? Will you get -- are you confident you will get a deal with China?

(CROSSTALK)

NAVARRO: I have got two -- two rules when it comes to these negotiations, Neil.

First, it's the Lighthizer rule that we negotiate behind closed doors. Nothing leaks to the press.

The second rule is the Navarro rule, which is to say that, if you hear anything about these negotiations from unnamed government sources, it's probably fake news.

So I have got nothing to say about what's going to happen. I have got nothing to speculate on. We negotiate behind closed doors. Take the president at his word that we are going to get a great deal or no deal.

Take Ambassador Lighthizer at his word that he's going to negotiate in good faith. Take the Chinese at their word that they're coming here in October.

And, by the way, the stock market, this economy is going to be contingent on a lot of things, including China, but pass that USMCA in the next 30 to 60 days. Let's get rate cuts by the Fed.

CAVUTO: All right.

NAVARRO: Let's get the Germans doing a fiscal stimulus. Let's get the European Central Bank lowering their rates.

There's a lot of bullish things going on, Neil. This doesn't always have to be a fight.

CAVUTO: But do you worry, if the China thing doesn't -- nothing happens soon...

NAVARRO: This doesn't have to be a fight.

CAVUTO: .... if it doesn't happen soon, do you worry that the same market that -- and you're quite right, it's been soaring. And a lot of that optimistic talk from the president helped.

That, if we don't keep getting this, they are going the other way?

NAVARRO: I don't worry, Neil.

What I try to do is see the chessboard and get things done. And that's why this Universal Postal Union thing is going to be so important for America.

We try to win one battle at a time, focus on it, and do what's best for the working men and women of America. And I think, again, I would ask everybody watching this show to take a look. I have an op-ed in The Financial Times today. Read it.

Support us. We got the support of the National Association of Manufacturers, the Chamber of Commerce.

CAVUTO: No, it's a very good -- it's well-written. It's well-written.

It just seems to me like you have got a lot of fights with a lot of people at the same time.

NAVARRO: Yes, this is -- this is a good, good fight to be fought. It's time to do it now.

We're going to Geneva. And we're going to get a good result one way or the other. And this is something, Neil, that you should celebrate.

CAVUTO: But do you lose track of these fights? Do you ever lose track of the people, all the people we're taking on?

NAVARRO: So, who are we taking -- we have got a great deal with Canada.

CAVUTO: The world.

NAVARRO: Hang on.

We got a great deal with Canada and Mexico that Congress has to pass. We just had a great deal with Japan that's moving forward. We're talking to the U.K. as soon as they solve their Brexit deal about getting things. We're getting investment from Europe.

I don't see always conflicts that you allege. We're working with every single one of our ally.

This president, President Donald J. Trump, is getting fair deals for the American people. And we can -- we can do more -- more than one country at a time, Neil. Trust us on that.

CAVUTO: You're convinced of that, and that it's not confusing people?

NAVARRO: Well, the proof is in the pudding. Look, this president...

CAVUTO: We don't have -- no, we don't have a China deal.

NAVARRO: Hang on, Neil.

CAVUTO: We don't have a deal on this.

(CROSSTALK)

NAVARRO: Hang on. Hang on.

This president promised he would renegotiate the South Korea deal. Check that box. He said he'd renegotiate the NAFTA deal. Check that box. We're just waiting for Congress now.

He said he would crack down on China. We are negotiating.

So, we are doing what the president said he would do back in June of 2018 in Pennsylvania on the campaign trail.

CAVUTO: All right.

NAVARRO: He's kept every single one of the seven promises on his trade policy speech.

CAVUTO: But you need a done deal, right? You need a done deal, right?

NAVARRO: We are -- we're moving. We have -- we have to...

CAVUTO: All right.

NAVARRO: We would love the USMCA to be a done deal in the next 30 to 60 days.

CAVUTO: Yes, so many battles, so little time, Peter.

We will see what happens.

NAVARRO: Oh, Neil.

CAVUTO: All right.

NAVARRO: You got to be -- you got to get behind us a little better here.

CAVUTO: Thank you very much, Peter.

NAVARRO: Help us out.

CAVUTO: Very good seeing you.

NAVARRO: Help us out, Neil.

CAVUTO: Peter Navarro.

All right, let's get a read right now on the ban on e-cigarettes.

We're going to be getting a lot more on that and an update on that right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: Vaping has become a very big business, as I understand, like a giant business in a very short period of time.

But we can't allow people to get sick. And we can't have our youth be so affected.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: All right, the president going one extra than that, though, pulling some e-cigarettes off the shelf after holding a meeting today on vaping-related deaths.

Never mind the fact that a lot of the folks saying, however you feel about vaping, you just can't automatically do something like that.

Family Physician Dr. Jen Caudle says there is a problem going on here. She's not here to discuss what the president's doing, but more about how real the problem is.

It is a real problem, right, Doctor?

DR. JEN CAUDLE, FAMILY PHYSICIAN: Oh, it's a huge problem.

I mean, honestly, vaping and e-cigarettes and things like that, in terms of kids, this is the most commonly used tobacco product among kids. And there's a big problem with that.

What President Trump seems to be trying to do is to get rid of the non- tobacco-flavored vaping products. And one of the things I hope is that kids will stop using them so much.

Remember, a lot of these vaping products have nicotine them. Nicotine is highly addictive.

CAVUTO: Right.

CAUDLE: And in kids, we don't know how nicotine affects the developing brain.

We also know that kids who use electronic cigarettes tend to be more likely to use regular cigarettes down the line. And, finally, Neil, to be honest with you, there's a lot more than just nicotine in these e-cigarettes, a lot of chemicals that, honestly, we don't have a lot of long-term data about that.

CAVUTO: No, no, I grant you that.

I just wonder, though. I mean, it could be a slippery slope, that it's a product. If you want to keep it for adults, that's fine. For kids, if you want a separate -- I get that.

But I guess some of the fruit and related flavors that are an enticement to kids, but what if they're an enticement to adults? They can't have them.

Do you worry about, that then a pox on everyone if he ultimately succeeds in getting all these yanked?

CAUDLE: Yes, I understand what you're saying. You're basically saying, should we -- should adults be restricted from getting the fruit flavors that they want? Why should they be impacted when we're concerned about kids?

CAVUTO: Especially if they're trying to get off cigarette smoking, which at this point is a far bigger health hazard.

CAUDLE: Well, it is, but there's kind of two issues here.

Number one, my opinion about that is yes. Remember, kids are developing, they are growing. E-cigarettes are not even indicated for kids under the age of 18.

And we're finding that these flavors, the bubble gum, the mango, the you name it, is probably the main thing that's luring kids. So, no, if we have a chance to curb that, even if it's at the expense of adults' choice, I will be honest with you, Neil, the family doctor in me is really coming out here.

OK, so the adult doesn't get the mango flavor. I know that they want it. But if we know that kids are going to be less likely to use these products, and we can potentially affect millions of lives, I'm all for that.

And the other thing is, Neil, the other thing is, you're right. There are a lot of people in terms of adults who use e-cigarettes to quit smoking. Now, I will be honest with you. There's a lot we can talk about with that.

But there's -- it's not necessarily an FDA-approved way to quit smoking for adults. This is what I would say. If they help you quit smoking, I think that's great. But there are many people who use e-cigarettes and still smoke cigarettes.

CAVUTO: Is that right?

CAUDLE: So, again, I just want to say -- yes, yes.

CAVUTO: All right.

CAUDLE: So I'm not saying they're bad. I'm just saying we don't have a lot of long-term data on it.

And when it comes to kids, we need to protect our kids.

CAVUTO: All right, for the kids who are having lung problems and the rest, how serious is this getting?

CAUDLE: Yes.

CAVUTO: I mean, we know about the six deaths. Real quick, your take on that?

CAUDLE: Serious, like, very, very, very serious.

This is like -- this is like nothing we have ever seen. And reading a lot of the latest data, it seems like, of course, we know that these cases are related to vaping. And to not buy illicit devices, and really just stop vaping, that's really the most important thing.

But this is serious.

CAVUTO: I hear you, Doctor. Thank you very, very much.

In the meantime, we lost a legend today, a business legend, who stated his case and ticked off Republicans and Democrats alike. He's gone now.

Remembering T. Boone Pickens.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CAVUTO: His hostile takeovers made him a billionaire, even though, to meet him, he was never really hostile at all, affable, calm, very self-assured.

T. Boone Pickens might have caused hell for big oil executives on whose companies he had set his sights, but, for Pickens, it wasn't personal, it was just business. He preferred corporate reformer to corporate raider.

And for this oilman turned all sorts of energy alternatives man, it was about making sure it was America, and only America, providing those energy sources, not OPEC, not anyone else.

Energy independence was his goal. In no small way, he made it a reality. He bet big. He won big. He lost big. He was that big.

But for this billionaire who only liked to joke it was only money, just his talking about his exploits in corporate raids would end up making him still more money.

Pickens' book "The First Billion Is the Hardest" became a sensation, unusual for a business book. As The Wall Street Journal pointed out, his fans were legion, young and old, liberal and conservative.

Presidents sought him out here office and, in the case of Ronald Reagan, relied on his financial support for the library he would build after leaving office.

They valued his counsel as much as his cash and his cachet. To hear him was to want to hear more from him and the epic corporate battles that would define him.

Pickens would electrify audiences, as much as he would petrify executives. He was that rare corporate figure, bigger than life, on a mission to say energy self-reliance should be this country's mission in life.

And he preached it everywhere, including this show, many, many times.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: Would that mean ruling out, as the president has, some of this screen technology and solar, et cetera?

T. BOONE PICKENS, FOUNDER & CHAIRMAN, BP CAPITAL: Of course not. Those are resources that we need to develop over time.

Get on your own resources in America, and your economy will recover.

I'm for anything American.

CAVUTO: Right, wind and everything else.

PICKENS: You have heard me say that. I have the battery. I don't care.

Wind and solar. Lost a bunch of money in wind. But, anyway...

CAVUTO: Yes, by the way, you're not a billionaire technically anymore, right?

PICKENS: No, I'm not.

CAVUTO: No, you're like a 950-millionaire, something like that?

PICKENS: I don't remember, but...

(LAUGHTER)

PICKENS: But I got trimmed.

We're neck deep in natural gas. You have more natural gas in the United States than anyplace else in the world. And it's unbelievable because our...

CAVUTO: Environmentalists say, go slow, go slow going for it.

PICKENS: Pardon me?

CAVUTO: Environmentalists say, go slow going for it.

PICKENS: Well, go slow? I mean, listen, when somebody steps up and says, don't do this, don't do that, I say, OK, fine, what's your idea?

You got Trump three, four months ago: He won't be around. He's not a serious candidate.

Yes, he's a serious candidate. And people like him. I mean, the guy is he -- could he go wire to wire? He could go wire to wire.

CAVUTO: Would you ever entertain a role in his administration?

PICKENS: Sure.

I would like to be president.

(LAUGHTER)

CAVUTO: OK.

PICKENS: Neil, glad to be here.

Listen, hats off to you and Maria.

CAVUTO: Thank you very much.

PICKENS: You're the best moderators that we have had.

CAVUTO: Well, thank you. That's very high praise coming from you.

Let me get your take, first of all...

PICKENS: But, see, I have kind of trained you all too.

CAVUTO: Yes, you have. You have made us very smart about these type of issues.

You're in a boat with Barack Obama and John McCain. One falls over. Who do you rescue?

PICKENS: Well, one falls over. Who do I rescue? One of them is still in the boat.

(LAUGHTER)

CAVUTO: It was stupidly worded, wasn't it?

Boone, it's always good seeing you. Thank you very, very much.

PICKENS: I have one more thing.

CAVUTO: Sure.

PICKENS: You didn't ask me about my orange shirt. I...

CAVUTO: I didn't want to embarrass you, but go ahead.

PICKENS: Tonight is OSU, Oklahoma State night at the Ranger Park. And I will throw the pitch, the first pitch.

CAVUTO: Oh.

PICKENS: And I get a chance to set a record for an 87-year-old to throw the fastest pitch at that.

CAVUTO: Not too shabby.

PICKENS: How about that?

CAVUTO: That is very impressive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CAVUTO: All right, he was a colorful fellow. We will miss him.

We will miss his energy and enthusiasm, T. Boone Pickens, dead at 91.

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