This is a rush transcript from "The Five," June 14, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: This is a FOX News alert. Hello everyone, I'm Kimberly Guilfoyle and this is "The Five."
Just after 7 a.m. this morning, an active heinous political violence broke out in the suburbs outside of Washington, D.C. A gunman named James Thomas Hodgkinson, a 66-year-old from Illinois who belong to a Facebook group called terminate the Republican Party, open fire with a rifle at a group of Republican members of Congress. The GOP lawmakers were practicing for the annual Congressional baseball game, which will still take place tomorrow night.
Five people were wounded in the shooting, including Steve Scalise, the number three House Republican leader. He is recovering from surgery now in the hospital, and President Trump just made a surprise visit. More on that in a moment. Police shot the gunman dead, and a witness captured this dramatic footage of the shooting.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I assume people have been calling 911 already.
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GUILFOYLE: Joining us now, Doug McKelway, he is outside of MedStar Washington Hospital Center where Congressman Scalise underwent surgery earlier today and has been visited by the President. Doug, how is the Congressman doing?
DOUG MCKELWAY, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, the last report we have from the hospital is that he is in critical condition. That he suffered critical injuries and is in critical condition, but information from this hospital has been a very, very sparse. Unusually so. I've never seen anything like this in fact when you're dealing with a high level public figure who has been the victim of a gunshot wound. There have been a grand total of two communications from this hospital, one about ten hours ago, it was a tweet, and another about five hours ago.
Just over five hours ago. Another tweet, and that has been the sum total. We know right now that Mr. Scalise is being visited by the President and First Lady, a visit which has done very quiet and a sort of spontaneous visit. We didn't see helicopters overhead as par for the course when you have a presidential motorcade going through town. We even understood from the pool that some of the traffic lights in town were obeyed by the presidential motorcade. But they came here in an entrance not where we are.
This is a huge complex encompassing not just the MedStar Washington Hospital here, but also a VA hospital and the Children's National Medical Center. So, they came through some entrance that we have not seen bearing flowers which they have now delivered to the House Majority Whip. It is safe to say, and we are not hearing this from the hospital, but it is safe to say that given the fact that he was shot in the hip with a high-powered rifle, that it would not be beyond the realm of possibility that he will be facing numerous surgeries ahead.
So, devastating is a bullet wound of that sort. Oftentimes, we don't know this to be the case, but often times in this kind of injuries, you are looking at a team of doctors trying to repair and stem the blood flow, and then come back at a later date to do reconstructive surgery because these kinds of bullets can absolutely wreak havoc on human tissue and human bone. And so, it would be safe to say that Mr. Scalise is looking at a long term recovery indeed.
There is another patient here at the hospital. It is the Capitol police officer Crystal Griner who was shot in the foot. We also believe that the second Capitol police officer, Mr. Bailey was brought here, but his wounds were not from the gunshot. They may have been inflicted from just the chaos, and was brought here. He did not need treatment and was released. The head of the Capitol police office paid a visit here early in the afternoon and praised his officers here.
We also know that a couple of the other victims, Zach Barth for example, a staffer for Congressman Roger Williams, is being treated at an undisclosed hospital. We only know that because he tweeted that he had been injured in the shooting but that he was okay. And we later heard from a family spokesperson that he was wounded in the calf muscle. But the President and First Lady are still here, as best we know. Hope to have more information later on. Back to you.
GUILFOYLE: All right. Doug, thanks for that update. And obviously, our thoughts and prayers with the family members and with Mr. Scalise as well. It's very said.
Now, we want to learn more about this deranged gunman, and his brother has told "The New York Times" that Hodgkinson was distraught over President Trump's election.
And joining us now with more is Chief Intelligence Correspondent Catherine Herridge. Catherine, good evening.
CATHERINE HERRIDGE, FOX NEWS CHIEF INTELLIGENCE CORRESPONDENT: Well, thank you, Kimberly. Tonight the ATF is tracing two weapons, a shotgun and a rifle, as the name of the suspect identified by law enforcement, as 66- year-old James Hodgkinson tells FOX about an incident in Bellevue, Illinois last March that only stopped after police were called in.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He pointed the rifle towards the center of the timber back there and started shooting across the field. You know? And it was a high-powered rifle, and I thought good grief, there are houses over there.
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HERRIDGE: A Facebook page bearing the suspect's name includes photos of Bernie Sanders as well as anti-Trump rhetoric reading, "Trump is a traitor. Trump has destroyed our democracy. It's time to destroy Trump and company." Spokesperson for the American Society of Home Inspectors confirms that James Hodgkinson was a member of the trade association but dropped out in 2015.
A few years earlier, an Illinois newspaper reports tonight that the suspect sent letters to the editors reeling against Republicans and tax policy. In this August of 2012 letter, Hodgkinson writes, "I have never said life sucks. Only the policies of the Republicans." Late today, the FBI has said they are focused firmly on timing and motives.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE QUESTION)
TIM SLATER, FBI SPECIAL AGENT: What do you mean?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE QUESTION)
SLATER: Oh, I have no indication of why today at all.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HERRIDGE: And the FBI said that they believe the suspect got to Virginia in March and since has been living out of that white cargo van -- Kimberly.
GUILFOYLE: All right. Catherine, thank you for that update.
HERRIDGE: You're welcome.
GUILFOYLE: Okay. So, we'll take you around that table. And Greg, you know, just really a tragic day. Starting off at 7:00 a.m., you have people, you know, getting together to practice for the game for tomorrow, and then you have someone specifically singling them out because they are Republicans.
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Yes. I mean, the first thought I had in the morning was a comical one, which was like who gets up at 6:30 to play baseball? And it just didn't make sense to me. But then I started hearing everyone talking about how one needs to calm your rhetoric, and we need to start re-examine how we deal with each other. I don't know if that's right. Because I do feel that we should be angry, and we should be angry at the angry people. The people who have been waging a campaign of rage for decades, since the beginning of the Bill Ayers movement to the anti-fa, who romanticized violence and romanticized revolution.
This is not new. This is radicalism and its purest sense, and this is not senseless violence. People call this stuff says, no, there is a purpose to this. There was a reason why I did this. A story came out today about Betsy DeVos, right? Remember her? She has needed $8 million worth of security since she got the job for the last eight months or so since she became known or if she's going to get the job. Eight million dollars from the security. Why is it?
Because the tax on her were explicitly sanctioned by the media and by liberals because they felt that her beliefs on school choice and her beliefs on education were harmful. So it wasn't that she was wrong, it was that she was evil. And so, if you look at all of the arguments that are directed at Trump, or directed at Republicans, it's not that their policies are wrong, it's that they are immoral and that they are evil. And that sanctions the violent behavior, and that is not a new idea. That is an idea that has been around since the late 60s and the early 70s. This is a culmination of a toxic doctrine. And we cannot be surprised by this. This guy is a leftist radical.
GUILFOYLE: Yes, all the left. Okay, Dana. Your thoughts.
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, to add to that, I think that one thing that is fueling it, has been social media then allows you to funnel your desire for reaffirmation of your own beliefs, and you can block out other people, and you can join groups that make you feel like you belong. So if you want to hate Republicans, and now there is a place for you to go. It used to be that maybe you read the paper and you are mad, you turned it off, and then you go out and spend some time with your family. But now, you can spend the entire day fueling your rage, from both sides. But on this side, I agree with Greg. But on the Left, we've been talking about this for a while.
PERINO: And we have seen sort of the ramp-up of, it is not just resistance, which is what they called for, it is persistence and the resistance in terms of trying to destroy them. Make no mistake, political speech can inspire violence. And I would say, I would call this political terrorism. Because he attacked these men because they were Republican in order to advance his own political ideas. Terrorism is the definition of it.
Is that you attack innocent people to advance your ideology or your political idea, and that's what I think that we should be calling it, and be very open about that. Because, if we sweep it under the rug, a year from now, if the newspaper writes, well, there was a shooting and they just talk about the gun violence part, and not the actual, the ideological reasons for why they were targeted, that would be a huge mistake and a problem for us and trying to solve this overall.
GUILFOYLE: So disturbing. You know, just thinking of -- I've seen his picture -- what his family must, you know, be going through, and such a well-liked person. You know, very affable. Jesse, you know, Dana brings up a great point. It's that, groupthink saturation that you can just soak in it all day and find that positive reinforcement. That really tells you, oh, I know what I'm talking about. Look at all of these people. I have found them. They agree with me. And it really builds upon itself as a catalyst to what we see here, which is violence.
JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: I do want to be clear. This guy bears full responsibility for the shooting.
WATTERS: Yes, he traffics in an atmosphere that is producing vial content and allows people to kind of blur the line between right and wrong. And the question to be asked is, are the producers of this fake news and the hoaxes, and the slanderous rhetoric, are they at all responsible for something like this. And that question remains to be answered. I think Dana is right. This is political terrorism. This was democracy being shot today. When you attack a congressman, you are attacking the constitution.
So, the neighbor suggested that the Democratic rhetoric might have contributed to this. The brother suggested that this guy was very disturbed by Trump's election. And just looking at his social media account, his letter sent to the editor, sadly, this is par for the course for a hard-core anti-Trump Democrat. And there's millions of people's Facebook pages and social media accounts that look exactly like these guys here, and that is scary. To say, you know, you are part of the resistance, he's an occupy Wall Street guy.
He calls Donald Trump a traitor and an a-hole, and he is a Putin colluder. And, you know, this stuff builds up when you call Republicans greedy racist and you kind of mix into this toxic stew. You know, political hysteria, potentially, has consequences. And people on Twitter were accelerating this, which is also very alarming. And I think the resistance needs to start resisting committing acts of violence, and you just have to wonder has this hatred permeated the culture so much where people need to really take a step back and reflect, and say what kind of responsibility do I bear for contributing to this stuff?
GUILFOYLE: Uh-hm. Juan, your reflections? I know you have a lot of friends in DC and people that --
JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Well, yes, actually my friend worked for him.
WILLIAMS: So, he knows Scalise very well, and Scalise knows him and would greet us as father and son. So, you know, for me it's like, wow, I can't believe. You know, to me, I don't want to go to the level of this deranged, deviant shooter, and talk about the politics here. Because I don't think the politics are what's relevant. I think we've got somebody who is deeply disturbed, Kimberly.
WILLIAMS: And I think the record will show, I mean, without much effort, that this is a guy, we saw the neighbor talking about him shooting in the woods. Apparently, he had been living in the lobby of the Y in Alexandria for several months. He had foster children, one of them, Greg and I are talking about earlier, just burned herself to death after two months in her house, and another one subject to domestic battery at his hands and he was arrested for that though not convicted.
So, what you see is a picture of someone who is really awfully trouble. I mean, you could go back to Hinckley and the shooting of President Reagan, you can come forward to, I forget the name of the woman who was involved with the Gerald Ford shooting.
GUTFELD: Sara Jane Moore Squeaky Fromme.
WILLIAMS: Squeaky Fromme. Yes. A lot of really out of their mind people. So, you have a highly polarized country, as Jesse was saying a moment ago, but Jesse also said, and I thought, this really spoke to my heart. You know, you've got to hold people responsible on a personal level for taking this kind of action. We can have conversations about why someone with this record is allowed to have a gun in our country, but let's for just a second stop and say, this is not acceptable. You can't do this. These are people, I mean, I'm a Democrat and this guy and my son, more than friends. So, I'm telling you, this is horrible. This is not good.
GUTFELD: The thing is though, right now, the country is going through a period of anxiety because we have a large faction that refuses to accept the reality of the presidency. I'm not saying that induces people to violence, but under this weird cloud, people are acting strangely, and I know that capitalism and free markets, they don't advocate revolution. But socialism does. Socialism has always advocated revolution. Radical leftism has always advocated violent revolution. So, this guy was essentially radicalized by the left-wing media. He was radicalized, he was troubled. He was a violent disgusting human being, but he digested- ingested this information. We can't stop the information, you know --
PERINO: He took a metaphor as instruction.
GUTFELD: Yes. Exactly. But you look at the campus free speech stuff that's going on right now. The riots at Berkeley. The anti-fa. There was a woman in Harrisburg over the weekend. They took a poll with the nail at the end of it. I want you to Google this at home. Google Harrisburg, horse, and pole. She had a pole with a nail on it and attacked the police force with this pole. Stabbing it in the neck. That's anti-fa. These are the antifascists. These are the antifascists.
GUTFELD: These are the people that are saying the other side is evil, but that point justifies their destructive and deadly behavior.
GUILFOYLE: Awful. When you just see it. We're talking about just at the level of discourse. And can you imagine, I can't help but think, you know, God forbid if this was someone who worked for, you know, President Trump or his campaign or anything, I mean, the reaction of what it would be? And, you know, I've heard people today, blaming President Trump for something like this. I mean, it's just so vile and so disgusting. People really have to like take a moment and think about what they are doing and what they are saying. And why they are like, punishing people and accusing people because they have a certain political viewpoint of being --
WILLIAMS: Right. And remember when Gabby Giffords was shot, and people were saying all the stuff coming from the right, and the talk shows and people on the right said no, you have to hold the person responsible and this was a troubled derange individual. I remember the right said that. And I think you have to hold to that standard. Really, I don't care what you say, I don't care how mad we get at each other, or you guys get me around this stable, nobody wants to stoop to that level. You've got to be able to talk, to defend your point, to make your point. But I don't think this guy necessarily fits into the political line of debate and discourse in our country. I suspect that he is a mentally sick, unstable man.
WATTERS: I still think you can be mentally unstable and still traffic and a lot of the political narratives that are accusing the President of being a traitor. Of delegitimizing the President. Of calling him a Nazi, of calling him someone who has turned to subvert the democracy. And when you feed that to people, and you pump that into their brain, every single day to an unstable individual, and something like this happens, you start to think, you know what, it may be some of the stuff that we are putting out there isn't healthy.
WILLIAMS: I agree. Yes.
GUILFOYLE: Well, it's true. Because it's overwhelming saturation. It's not a small minority of people that are doing it. It's the mainstream media.
GUILFOYLE: You know, it's politics --
GUTFELD: But the big lie, and the big hypocrisy, is that we've been living in a place where the left has been saying, the right rhetoric is what leads to violence.
GUILFOYLE: Think about that over the break. Yes. When we come back, political reaction to today's assassination attempt.
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REP. PAUL RYAN (R-WI), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: We are united in our shock, we are united in our anguish. An attack on one of us is an attack on all of us.
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PERINO: Welcome back. All signs pointed today's shooting as being politically motivated and it's generated an enormous response from both sides of the aisle. Here was President Trump earlier today.
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TRUMP: Many lives would have been lost if not for the heroic actions of the two capitol police officers who took down the gunman despite sustaining gunshot wounds during a very, very brutal assault. Congressman Scalise is a friend, and a very good friend. He is a patriot, and he's a fighter. America is praying for you and America is praying for all of the victims of this terrible shooting. We are strongest when we are unified, and when we work together for the common good.
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PERINO: And then later, this was Bernie Sanders.
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SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I), VERMONT: The alleged shooter at the Republican baseball practice this morning is someone who apparently volunteered on my presidential campaign. I am sickened by this despicable act, and let me be as clear as I can be. Violence of any kind is unacceptable in our society, and I condemn this action in the strongest possible terms.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: Jesse, it must be quite a thing for somebody like Bernie Sanders to get the news that the shooter was a big supporter and was maybe sort of spurred onto action against President Trump because of his support for those policies.
WATTERS: I'm sure the Senator feels heartbroken over the volunteer being capable of doing something like this. And he put out a very strong statement, and in no way is he responsible for that, but Bernie Sanders supporters, on quite a crime spree recently. If you look at the shooter today, was a Bernie Sanders supporter. You had the Portland stabber killed two people, a Bernie Sanders guy. Reality winner. Criminal leaker allegedly. Bernie Sanders supporter.
So, not good for the Bernie Sanders people, and you know, on the other hand, a lot of violence coming out from the left recently. I remember the Trump headquarters during the primary in North Carolina, was firebombed. You had Democrats paying people to go into Trump rallies and throw punches. After Trump's election, you have people riding the streets and breaking windows and private property. And, you know, this violence is only coming from one side recently, so people need to think, you know, what's the common denominator here. This is where Republicans and Trump's supporters going out there and writing and burning things, and shooting Democrats, it would be a whole other story.
PERINO: Kimberly, do you have any update for us?
GUILFOYLE: Yes. So, this is just in from the MedStar Washington Hospital Center, an update on the condition of Majority Whip Steve Scalise. They said that Congressman Steve Scalise sustained a single rifle shot to the Left hip. The bullet traveled across his pelvis fracturing bones injuring internal organs and causing severe bleeding. He was transported in shock to MedStar Washington Hospital Center, a level one trauma center. He underwent immediate surgery, and an additional procedure to stop the bleeding. He has received multiple units of blood transfusion, his condition is critical, and he will require additional operations. We will provide periodic updates.
PERINO: No matter is that update. So, our prayers with him certainly and his family as they recover. I know that they were able Greg to get his wife here today. There was also the story that, one of the congressman I can't remember who he was, as the shooter was being taken down, he reaches over for Scalise's phone in order to call Mrs. Scalise so that she would hear it from him first and not from the media.
GUTFELD: Yes. That was very thoughtful, but you know, the story for today is also about what didn't happen.
GUTFELD: There was no heavy carnage by pure luck. I mean, and I worry, because the absence of carnage isn't as impactful, and I think we have to look at what happened. And think about what could have happened if the police weren't there.
PERINO: The only reason they were there was because Steve Scalise requires security because of his position.
GUTFELD: Everybody would have been dead. Yes. That's what I am saying. The target was hard and not soft. And so we have to remind ourselves, that thank God that there wasn't pure carnage, but pretend that there is. Just pretend that there is because it's the only way you're ever going to make any progress. If you just say, well, we praise police gets through, right? You know, and that is the extent of this. Well, you have to think like, what if everybody there was killed?
PERINO: And Juan, the police officer that was injured that they said was released because he did not have injuries that would warrant a hospital stay, that he actually was in the dugout and was able to, while injured, take down the gunmen.
WILLIAMS: Yes, it was pretty amazing performance by the Capitol police. And there are two officers there, the one that's still in the hospital, Dana.
WILLIAMS: The key point is here that you have people who are trained and who did their job so well. And I think demonstrated bravery. Senator Flake later said, that he went to visit the injured officer and said to her, thanks for saving my life. I thought that was very powerful. But I just want to make the point that, this is not the average person. It's not like everybody walk around with guns at the baseball game. You had trained professionals who took effective action and saved lives.
GUILFOYLE: And drawing fire at themselves.
PERINO: And testimony from the members of Congress that were there. From Rand Paul, Mo Brooks, Roger Williams, it's just amazing.
Stay with us, because once again, the Left is blaming guns for the latest shooting. And Greg will tell us why they are wrong. Ahead.
GUTFELD: After each incident, there is a reflex to blame everything and anything on anyone but the fiend responsible. We saw that last week with Orlando: It's a year later and gun violence still rules the narrative. It's always a tool but never the terrorists. And here we go again, the Virginia governor and others, spewing stats when facts would have sufficed:
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GOV. TERRY MCAULIFFE: I think we need to do more to protect all of our citizens.
There are too many guns on the street. We lose 93 million Americans a day to gun violence. I have long talked about this, background checks, shutting down gun show loopholes, we worry about this every day for all of our citizens.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: The man needs a math class.
Here's a fact: The shooter was a Sanders supporter. Do I blame Sanders? No. But replace Sanders with Trump and you have to wonder if the left would return that favor. After all, hasn't that been the media narrative for so long? That the hateful deplorables created a climate of violence and that the Party of Lincoln isn't just wrong, but evil?
So now there is violence, but not from the deplorables and all of a sudden we say let's not rush to judgment. I don't know. The left blames the right for everything bad. So why not return the favor so they might learn a lesson. Is that even possible? For another lesson, here's Rand Paul:
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SEN. RAND PAUL, R-KY.: I do believe that without the Capitol Hill police, it would have been a massacre. We had no defense. We had no defense at all. We are lucky that Scalise was there, because this was his security detail. Without them, it would have been a massacre, there would've been no stopping this guy, and we were like sitting ducks. We had no place to run.
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GUTFELD: Translation: Our leaders are better protected than we are. If it were just you and me there in that gun-free zone, we would be dead. So each grizzly act teaches us about vulnerability, whether it's Orlando, 9/11, or today the right response is to analyze risk and reduce it. People drown in water. The option isn't to blame water but learn to swim. What we learned today is not to just what caused the attack, but what prevented the carnage. Let's hope that sinks in.
So K.G. the common refrain is the length of the attack depends on the arrival of another gun which is what happened there. It was stopped before it got worse.
GUILFOYLE: Absolutely and when you just listen to the eloquence and just the facts from members of congress that were there, like Rand Paul, saying we were sitting ducks. It was just target practice for this homicidal maniac filled with hate and evil and vitriol for people that have a different viewpoint, to exercise their right to vote in this country and support a candidate. They are sitting there and this guy is playing target practice. Can you even imagine? Even with the police being able to arrive there in the 3 minutes. People who were there and said it felt like longer. You couldn't even move, and try to attend to the body of congressmen Scalise because he was on the ground for 10 minutes before they could get them out of there, because 50 rounds were being fired, unbelievable. Just when you think about the vulnerability here, you really do, when you think about it. That kind of harm that can come their way, by the way Greg, they were playing baseball so that they could get practice before they had to go to work.
GUTFELD: I know. Dana I said, 6:30 in the morning, they are older than me, and I'm not even out of bed yet.
PERINO: Before they take this very seriously. Believe me they were out there early because they want to win. At this point, they are still going to play it tomorrow night. It is for charity, the best bipartisan event in Washington, D.C., by far. Here's the thing for me. I could be reasonable on gun control if they could convince me with some data or some cost-benefit analysis, but they just say we need more gun control. Every one of these instances, I'm more convinced that the protection of the second amendment is really important.
WILLIAMS: I think the argument, Dana, is that you need better screening before people, you have to screen people. I think this guy was demonstrably mentally deranged. He shouldn't have been able to do it.
PERINO: We have no medical doctor saying that.
GUTFELD: No, but he is a leftist. Get out of here
WILLIAMS: No, I'm saying based on his behavior, the domestic battery, the firing, the guns, the woods, I think this guy was out of his mind. He was homeless at this time, and yet he had a permit to have these guns.
WATTERS: He had the domestic battery charge and he was never convicted of that. He was firing guns out in the woods, I don't know if that makes you liable to have your guns being removed from you. I think with the left wants to do now, they want to talk about guns as a distraction from the guy's left wing background. All the Democrats that are praising the heroism of these Capitol Hill police officers for stopping the attacker, what you think they stopped the attacker with?
WILLIAMS: Guns, but they are professionals trained to know how to use them. This is not Bruce Willis fantasy by some guy who said I am going to carry my gun into the Starbucks.
WATTERS: Good guys having guns is better.
WILLIAMS: Good guys who are trained.
GUTFELD: Democrats today are calling for unity. So what about all of their previous divisive rhetoric, we will talk, next.
WATTERS: In the aftermath of today's shooting of Republican congressman Scalise and for others, top Democrats like Nancy Pelosi are now calling for unity.
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REP. NANCY PELOSI (D-CA), MINORITY LEADER: Tomorrow we will go out on the field, and we will root for our team, and we will use this occasion as one that brings us together and not separates us further.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: That is a good thing, but should Democrats call for their side to tone down the vicious rhetoric we've been hearing lately? Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This will cost American lives if it ever becomes law. This will virtually lead to death, pain, and suffering to people's families.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If the bill passed today in the house became law, thousands of Americans would die.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is a killer for the American people, literally a killer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We know we have to de-carbonize our future. If we don't, it's a horror. People are going to die.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We do know that every racist in America voted for Donald Trump. That is a problem.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: So, Democrats say that when Republicans call terrace Islamic, that causes them to commit more violence. But when Democrats say Republicans are killers, wouldn't that make people cause more violence?
GUTFELD: Yeah. How do you change the tone of an ideology that portrays the other side as eternally damned? You cannot change this ideology, because it's a moral stance, it's not a political one. They believe we are bad. Let's take the obvious about the left on the right. We both have flaws. But the right is no drama and the left is all drama. That leaves itself to this highly romantic and intense language and imagery their persuasion is entirely emotional, so that is why they say that. We sit there and on the right, we are cold.
GUILFOYLE: We do the math.
GUTFELD: We do the math, and they condemn us to death.
WATTERS: Speaking of death, Kathy Griffin did the beheading. Snoop Dogg doing an assassination on his music video, Shakespeare in the park, showing Donald Trump being assassinated. How is not connected to any of this, if at all?
PERINO: I don't think that because people are doing vile things that the first amendment should be attacked or that if people shoot a congressman that this should lead to attacks on the second amendment. I think our founding fathers got it right initially. I would say that, when they look at that montage that you just said, they're probably going to play for an hour, they are have an opportunity here to do exactly what Nancy Pelosi just said. They were about to have a big fight on Capitol Hill about the health care bill. Let's see if they can actually fight on the merits and the math instead of on hysterics.
WATTERS: That is an interesting point, Juan, do you think a call for civility and discourse -- how long will that last on the Democratic side?
WILLIAMS: I think it's very difficult in the age of Trump. I think Trump has a great deal of responsibility here. If you stop for a second and think about this argument, people are now somehow beating up on the left by attaching this guide to the left, and I think to myself, all of the arguments we have been through in regards to pro-choice, a cult of murder and the like, that is very vicious language over a policy difference. People talk about policy, President Trump was reported to debate the house bill, that it was a mean bill. That would hurt people. I'm just telling you, that hyperbole you could say is out of line, but I don't connect it to the shooter --
WATTERS: You just contradicted yourself.
WILLIAMS: Let me respond to you. I think when you heard Trump back in the campaign to say that he would pay the legal fees for his supporters that have been charged with punching a guy in the face. When you hear him say I would like to punch somebody in the face. In the old days, we would have knocked him out of his seat. And then you say, you can't blame Trump when actual violence takes place then apply that same logic here.
GUILFOYLE: You asked how long it will last. Well, it already happened. He has already said, in the age of Trump, this is what happens, and that the president bears some responsibility for it. I see it very differently. I believe it's personal responsibility, and I believe in civil discourse and treating people with respect, and not being close-minded and judgmental and calling people that you don't even know racist, or sexist, because they may have a little bit of a different belief than you do.
WATTERS: Exactly. All right up next, President Trump says the Russian investigation is a witch hunt. A report out tonight shows he might be right.
WILLIAMS: A Fox News alert, a bombshell report from "The Washington Post" tonight says that President Trump now under investigation by the Justice Department special counsel for obstruction of justice. Chief national correspondent, Ed Henry, is at the White House with details.
ED HENRY, SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Juan, another big lead tonight, and I can tell you that the president's legal team is furious. Although in some ways, this is not really that new. Ever since the president fired James call me as FBI Director. Lawmakers in both parties have been openly speculating about whether there could be obstruction charges. Remember, Alan Dershowitz, a liberal expert said there was not a case here when the president allegedly told call Comey I hope you let the case against Michael Flynn go. What is new is that, tonight the Washington Post claims, special counsel Robert Mueller has his investigators interviewing top officials like the DNI Dan Coats and Mike Rogers the head of the NSA. We did not know that previously. What he is trying to find out is whether the president tries to get them to shut down any aspect of the Russia probe. Remember, Rogers at the NSA has testified the president never told him to do anything illegal or immoral," and Coat said he did not feel pressure to intervene. The FBI leak information regarding the president is outrageous, inexcusable and illegal. This is not the kind of pres the president wanted tonight. It's his 71st birthday. He has his family here so writing that. And also just a moment ago returned to the White House with family members after going to the hospital where congressman Scalise is. Just recently tweeting, "Scalise is one of the truly great people in very tough shape but he is a real fighter. Pray for Scalise." That is from the president, Juan.
WILLIAMS: Thanks Ed. Dana, described by "the Washington Post" as a major turning point in this investigation, no longer is it confined to Russian meddling or coordination.
PERINO: I think this is overriding by "the Washington Post" and the attempt to get more clicks. We already know that the senators have asked those same people that, so it stands to reason that Robert Mueller is doing a full investigation. Once he starts talking with other people that is when you start having leaks. There haven't been leaks up to now. I don't think the president has anything to worry about now. There is no accusation against the president at this point, and there probably will not be given all that we know already. They can't undo the tweets are the things they have said. I think they should just maintain the posture that they have had and they will be fine.
WILLIAMS: Kimberly, the part of the story that suggests that Dan Coats of the DNI and Mike Rogers of National Security were asked by the president to get Comey to off of Flynn. Does that constitute obstruction of justice?
GUILFOYLE: I don't see any evidence as far to suggest that lives up to a charge of obstruction of justice. Where did you hear anything there that there was obstruction of justice? I take the man for his word when he said that he didn't feel the president was trying to call off an investigation or anything like that. So, now we're just going to make it up? I want to know? That is desperate, to try to undermine his presidency and damage the United States, that will go through any length and make up lies about a president, so I think the answer is yes.
WILLIAMS: So, Jesse, you have a situation where some people didn't testify about conversations with the president before congress, citing the possibility he may want to invoke executive privilege. But now, in the situation, the law says you have to talk, because a crime is being alleged.
WATTERS: Listen, if Mueller wants to talk to you, you should probably talk to him and have a very good attorney. The timing of the story is very odd to me, coming on the president's birthday and after a Democrat shooting up a bunch of Republicans at a baseball game. It could be fake news, could be legitimate. We don't know anything about it. It looks like if it is true, they are looking for a cover up without a crime, again, because there is no collusion so it is just Trump talking, how Trump talks, but it is obviously trouble, if true.
GUTFELD: Of course he has to look at this as a part of the investigation. This is a nonstory. "The Washington Post" trying to change the narrative. No one is widening the probe. The probe is already there. It's business as usual. You can't let go of this. Talk about (inaudible).
PERINO: I think the media is trying to milk as much of this as they can. I don't think there's any new developing here.
WILLIAMS: Wow, I think this is a shocking develop it, but anyway, stay right there, some final thoughts next.
GUILFOYLE: Welcome back to "The Five." once again we want to read this new tweet from President Trump after visiting his friend. Congressman Scalise following surgery "Just left the hospital. Representative Steve Scalise, one of the truly great people is in very top shape. But he is a real fighter. Pray for him." On behalf of my colleagues here on "The Five" we pray for Representative Steve Scalise and his family and the others that were injured in this horrific act of violence today. Our thoughts and prayers are with them. That is it for us tonight. Good night.
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