Trump presses need to defend western values in Poland speech
This is a rush transcript from "The Fox News Specialists," July 6, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
KATHERINE TIMPF, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Kat Timpf along with Eboni K. Williams and Eric Bolling. We are "The Fox News Specialists." The G20 summit in Hamburg, Germany, isn't even officially underway until tomorrow, but it's getting off to a heck of a start. Earlier, protesters clashed with police officers who used water cannons and pepper spray on demonstrators that were throwing everything from bottles to flares. This is a live shot of the protest. Things have unfortunately settled down a bit for the time being. But it was a wild scene. It was expected to be a contentious summit among world leaders, global tensions flaring. President Trump delivered a major address in Warsaw, Poland, earlier today with a forceful rebuke of the enemies aligned against America and the west.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: Just as Poland could not be broken, I declare today for the world to hear that the west will never, ever be broken. Our values will prevail. Our people will thrive, and our civilization will triumph.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TIMPF: Makes sense why President Trump would want to start things off in Poland, everyone cheering his name. It was like a rally in a foreign country for President Trump.
ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: I'm very, very optimistic about this foreign policy trip. It started in Poland, as you point out. Yeah, they do love Trump. They're yelling Trump quite a bit. But then he's going to go to sit down with bilateral meetings with Merkel, in Germany, President Xi from China, and also the big one everyone is keeping their eye on, Putin in Russia. It's going to be fantastic. I think he's going to leave there with the America exceptionalism number one, America first policy intact, and on display for the world.
TIMPF: Eboni, your thoughts?
EBONI K. WILLIAMS, CO- HOST: I think leading with values is smart, I think that's strong. I think, you know, this is the beginning of what, you know, I'm sure, hopefully, he's intending to be powerful and important relationships with these geopolitical leaders. So I think sticking to that, making it simple and clean the political will of the U.S. and the western world. Values message is a very good place to start.
TIMPF: Yeah, absolutely. All right. Well, it's time to meet today's specialists. She's the author of the New York Times bestseller, American Wife, she's the wife of the late fame U.S. SEAL sniper, Chris Kyle, and she's a Fox News contributor, but she specializes in doing volunteer work for the Chris Kyle Frog Foundation, which helps strengthen families support network for military members and first responders, Taya Kyle is here. And he is a former New York sports broadcaster, he's a former man of the year for the New York City patrolman's benevolent association, he's the host of the Steve Malzberg show in Newsmax TV, and he specializes in fighting back against fake news, Steve Malzberg is here. You won't get any of that here, sir.
STEVE MALZBERG, HOST OF STEVE MALZBERG SHOW: I know that.
TIMPF: Nothing but the real true fake news. That's real news.
MALZBERG: I left my boxing gloves at home.
TIMPF: Yeah, no fake news. So what do you expect in the next couple days? I mean, Poland, all the other countries, not going to be quite that simple and that positive, but it was a great place to start.
MALZBERG: It was a wonderful place to start. It was a great speech. And he left America first at home for a little bit. And he came and he talk about western civilization, and he pointed out how we're under attack on so many fronts, including, and he said it, radical Islam, which he did not say in his speech in Saudi Arabia. So I think that was significant as well. I'm looking forward to this. I think is going to be great. The media is going to hate everything he does, of course, because that is fake news. He's going to sit down with Putin. And I think Putin has to realize he's not dealing with Obama, who said, hey, go take Crimea. Hey, you want to go to Syria, go ahead, and by the way, a have more leeway after the next election. He's going to tell Putin, play ball with us. You've got to do this and we have to work together. Your economy is in bad shape, baby, so you need us.
TIMPF: What I hated about with the -- reaffirmed his commitment to helping Europe, of course. I hated that Europe was even sort of portrayed as the victim at all in the situation because President Trump was never asking them to do anything absurd. He was just asking them to do what they agreed to do. It was supposed to be an alliance where they're mutually working towards it.
TAYA KYLE, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Right. I think that's why it's appropriate that he's in Poland. Chris and I had the opportunity to go to Poland for a book tour and it was amazing. The people there --we got to sit on the river and they talked about the stories of being invaded. They remember what war is like. They remember they just built their city to look like Warsaw before it was war torn. So it is fresh to them, and they know what it's like to have an ally and have somebody who has your back. And what it's like when somebody promises to be there and doesn't show up.
So I think being in Poland is important, that's why he's getting the support that he's getting I think. And really, Chris fought with the GROM a lot in Iraq. The GROM is the Special Forces for the Polish. They showed up. I think it's just human kind, right? If I say I'm your friend, but when someone comes to attack you I don't show up, I'm not your friend. And so I think Poland has shown that they're the type of friend that when push comes to shove, they'll show up and fight with us. So we need to turn around and fight with them.
WILLIAMS: I think that's fair. I think, you know, there're so many outstanding questions from some across the globe as to what President Trump's international leadership will look like. Will he be there for his friends in the way that the world and our allies expect? I think, again, the shared values conversation becomes very important, and a great place for that to resonate and for him to put that plainly and bluntly for the world to see.
BOLLING: So Taya said something very important. They showed up. Poland showed up, they do. They showed up to fight when they say they're going to be an alliance with us -- in alliance with us, and they did. Poland is one of the five nations standing up to their commitment of 2 percent of their GDP to be spent on their own military. The U.S. is three and half. Poland is one of three others. That's important. I think what really, really resonated today, for me, was listening to President Trump this morning and he got into this area about energy and oil. We are now exporting natural - - liquefied natural gas to Poland for the first time ever.
And it really struck me. I happened to be on Fox & Friends. And it really struck me at that moment, that one of the first things he did, he rolled back energy regulations, and that gave us so much power to do so many things. You look at Poland. They're at the mercy of Russia. Poland imports a lot of their gas and energy from Russia, as does Germany, as do parts of Eastern Europe, who are just at their mercy. By pulling us off oil dependence of OPEC and other countries, Canada, we're becoming a much more independent and strong country.
TIMPF: Yeah, of course. Not everybody loves that, though. A lot of the protests that we saw today, those were anti-capitalist protesters specifically. Usually capitalist aren't protesting.
TIMPF: . we are contributing to society a little too much
BOLLING: Were they anarchist rioters, don't you think?
TIMPF: You bet, of course. If you're throwing flames then you're not a protester. You're a criminal. I think anybody would say that.
WILLIAMS: Not everybody.
TIMPF: I don't think the pro-flame throwing is a very, very big segment of the population.
MALZBERG: Any time the scarfs go over the face from here down, you know you're dealing with professionals and anarchists and violent protests.
WILLIAMS: And I never understand that anyway because if I'm a protester, and I protested during my earlier days back in college, I did so proudly. And I wanted to be seen and known. The anonymity to me always really undermines the message.
MALZBERG: So you're going to toss bottles and start fires.
WILLIAMS: No, I'm a lady.
MALZBERG: So they don't want anyone to know who they are.
BOLLING: You can throw a football, so I assume you can throw a Molotov cocktail as well.
WILLIAMS: You know -- it looks bad. I'm a bad football thrower. You don't want to see that, Eric.
TIMPF: During his Warsaw address, President Trump directed some pointed criticism at Russia.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We urge Russia to cease its destabilizing activities in Ukraine and elsewhere, and support for hostile regimes, including Syria and Iran, and to instead join the community of responsible nations in our fight against common enemies and in defense of civilization itself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TIMPF: Do you think, Eric, this is going to change things for tomorrow?
TIMPF: Do you think this is a preview of tomorrow or not?
BOLLING: I think I'm going to go back -- I think Steve mentioned something. I'm going to go back to the original comment about the energy market. Russia is on its heels right now. Russia's built, recently, over the last 15 or 20 years, on $60, $70, $80 barrels of oil, and now they've got $40 barrels of oil. They are an oil economy and they're hurting badly. So Putin can meet Trump and act like he's on an equal playing field with Trump, but he's not. The American economy is off to the races and Russia is kind of suffering.
TIMPF: You want to weigh in at all?
KYLE: Well, I think that, overall, if we just look at this from a psychology standpoint, it's never about what you have done. It's about what you're willing to do. And I think the thing about Putin is that we all know no matter if he's in a good position or a bad position, he's willing to do harm. And that's the same with North Korea. When you're dealing with people like that, it's less rational.
WILLIAMS: You're talking about political will, and I think that it's so important, and the president basically used those words. And that's the thing, we have a lot of power when it comes to North Korea and other places. I don't know that we've exercised the political will in the way that we could have. And I think that window, Eric, it's getting smaller and smaller and smaller, really, each passing day. I think at some point we've got to conjure up that political will to be forceful in a way that.
BOLLING: You have to hope that the bilateral with, especially China and Russia, are focused around -- surrounding North Korea. I know we haven't really talked about it. We're going to get to it in the next block. But that's what really -- they really need to hone that. We have a common problem, globally, with North Korea. Maybe China doesn't see it that way but they certainly should.
TIMPF: I think that they do. I think that everybody does. But, again, we'll get a little bit into that in the next block. Also in Warsaw, today, President Trump addressed the hardline he's taken on NATO.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: To those who would criticize our tough stance, I would point out that the United States has demonstrated not merely with words but with its actions that we stand firmly behind article 5, the mutual defense commitment.
(END VIDEO CLIP) TIMPF: Trump's backing of article 5 is sure to give European leaders a sign of relief going into this G20 summit. Again, as I littered to earlier, he never said that he didn't back it. He was just kind of saying, hey, guys, do you back it? Because you're supposed to be doing this and you're not.
MALZBERG: You're 100 percent correct. As Eric pointed out, it was all about the money. It was all about the proper contribution. And, of course, the media went and distorted it and said, well, you know, he's been vague, he's been this, but he has said it over and over again and never said the opposite which is very important. Today, all speculation, all the conjecture has to end because there you said it, but they're still going to find doubt.
TIMPF: He never said that as a president. Candidate, he said perhaps it was obsolete. But again, that was candidate Trump.
BOLLING: I actually think it's obsolete. This is something I'm going to push back on what Trump is doing here. We allowed Montenegro.
BOLLING: . into NATO. Montenegro's full economy, the full GDP on Montenegro is $10 billion. So if they put up 2 percent of their -- it's like $200 million. It's like a busy day on the seas for the United States military. Nothing. Air ball. But we have to defend them? And they're in Southeastern Europe. They're in a fairly unstable part of the world. I mean, this is a big NATO commitment. So they all, of the other 27, should be putting it.
TIMPF: Right. Like what I've always said, it's supposed to be an alliance, not a day care center. And you're supposed to give something in order to get something.
BOLLING: We took on another toddler, though.
MALZBERG: What about Turkey? I mean, if Turkey gets into a rift with Israel -- what Trump had said we're bound to defend Turkey against Israel, and it gets a little dangerous.
WILLIAMS: Well, and I think that's when people think about Trump being a disrupter in chief, right? That's I think one of the places that a lot of people are -- or should be, in my opinion, more willing to give him a lot more slack, right? Because if we wanted things to be done the way that they've been done just for the sake of doing them that way, I think the country could have gone into another direction, politically speaking. I think that's a space where Trump should really flex. And it's not about breaking commitments, but it's also about making sure the people hold themselves accountable to terms that we mutually agreed upon when going into the NATO agreement.
BOLLING: So here Trump, article 5, what that means is if any one member of NATO is attacked, the full member should have to get behind that country attacked. So article 5 says that we have to defend all 27 countries. Do we do that even when 22 of the 27 aren't making their commitment?
WILLIAMS: Eric, I don't think so. I know it's going to shock some people. I don't think so because, again, it's like a contract, right? If I breach a term, why do I.
TIMPF: They're not the victims.
WILLIAMS: Right. You breach your term, why do you get to be rendering of the benefit of that when you not shown up for what you've said you're going to do?
BOLLING: He just backed it. He just said.
WILLIAMS: I know. I think that was premature, actually. That's my take.
KYLE: Yeah. And I think people forget that NATO, they showed up in Afghanistan but not in Iraq. That's a big, big deal, right? So what you're saying is you're part of this agreement, and smoke and mirrors and on paper it all looks great, but the reality is it doesn't have any teeth. If people don't show up in Iraq when we need them, we're still there fighting.
TIMPF: Especially you look at where the problems are, you're going to get Belgium spending less than 1 percent and we're supposed to go to their -- all these problems all centered there? Come on, man. You've got to say something when it reaches that point.
MALZBERG: I mean, I don't disagree with what everybody had said, but I don't see how if someone is attacked we're going to take out the balance sheet and say let's see -- they only gave 1.5 percent. Sorry, you're on your own.
TIMPF: That's why you want to know now.
BOLLING: You have car insurance for a reason. You keep up. You pay your car insurance so the day you get into a car accident.
MALZBERG: But the all state just said you're covered.
KYLE: Yes, Steve, you're right, they know we will show up.
TIMPF: They know we'll show up, which is why it's even crazier that people are so upset that he's saying, hey, I'm not so happy about you doing.
MALZBERG: I'm with you all.
BOLLING: Why would anyone pay? How's this, if you're Poland, why would you pay you two percent? Why not go back to, I don't know, one percent.
MALZBERG: I agree with all of you. Everybody should pay. I agree with Donald Trump half from the beginning, but I think if push comes to shove, they're not going to say sorry. I don't think they will.
TIMPF: Well, I agree there. All right. Well, President Trump is warning of severe consequences for North Korea over its intercontinental missile test. What is being considered to put Kim Jong-un back on his heels? Next.
WILLIAMS: President Trump making his first public comments about North Korea's ICBM missile test and how the U.S. may be planning to respond, and during his joint press conference with Poland's president earlier today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: As far as North Korea is concerned, I don't know. We'll see what happens. I don't like to talk about what I have planned, but I have some pretty severe things that we're thinking about. That doesn't mean we're going to do them. I don't draw redlines. But I think we're just take a look at what happens over the coming weeks and months with respect to North Korea. It's a shame that they're behaving this way, but they are behaving in a very, very dangerous manner, and something will have to be done about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: So Eric, I see the president there and it actually reminds me a lot of the sit down that you had with President Trump a couple months ago, where he talked very specifically about his inability -- excuse me, his unwillingness, rather, to say in advance what he's going to do military wise. He will not draw a red line, we know that's a reference to Barack Obama's red line that he didn't really enforce. So inquiring minds want to know what you think, possibly, the president is talking about with this more aggressive take and stance.
BOLLING: You're referencing the first day we launch.
BOLLING: . May 1st. It was a Monday. He said I'm going to fix Obama's red line failure, meaning Obama drew the red line, Syria using chemical weapons on its own people. He violated the red line, never did anything as President Obama. Trump says he's not going to draw a -- I actually wish he would.
BOLLING: I wish he would draw a red line and say.
TIMPF: I disagree.
BOLLING: . you do this, you expect this coming -- and by the way, China, we gave you and them fair warning and if they continue to test another one of these things or get any closer.
TIMPF: I'm going to defend something that President Trump said that you don't agree with.
BOLLING: Yep, OK.
TIMPF: That's what going to happen. I completely agree with him not wanting to draw a red line because somebody like Kim Jong-un could easily see that as a dare. He's a reckless leader. And then, that forces us to have to act immediately even if we may not want to. That sort of puts the ball in their court rather than our court.
WILLIAMS: What is the alternative, though? Because I kind of feel like, at this point, so much of our plan that I've seen thus far when it comes North Korea, is basically betting on the fact that they will not go to a certain level. And I personally, as you said he's reckless, right? We know this about him. I'm not prepared to make a foreign policy position based off of what he might not do. That doesn't feel good to me.
TIMPF: It doesn't feel good to me to guarantee that we enter World War III by going and doing a preemptive strike. Are you talking about --what are you referring to specifically when you say do something?
WILLIAMS: Well, what I'm talking about isn't necessarily a preemptive strike. What I'm talking about -- I really like Eric's idea of aggressively downgrading their ability to further their nuclear program. I do think we're very late to that party. Obviously, that should have been done about ten years ago. But every passing day that window gets smaller and smaller.
BOLLING: A red line doesn't have to mean World War III breaks out. Red line could be if you do another one of these tests with a -- let's say a more dangerous warhead involved, missile test, then we are going to take out your missile system. We're not going to kill you. We're not going to destroy North Korea. We're just going to destroy your ability to deliver missiles.
TIMPF: You think they're just going to say, all right, fine, and that would be the end of it? I think probably not.
BOLLING: The missile is on its way to L.A., and let's hope we could shoot it down.
TIMPF: I obviously don't prefer that. I think we should make -- sure we have that ability. But a red line in a sense removes options from us. It will force us to act, perhaps, we wouldn't want to.
KYLE: I want to add.
BOLLING: Then don't draw the red line. If you're not going to do it.
WILLIAMS: Well, if you're not going to do it.
BOLLING: . don't draw the damn red line.
KYLE: Yes. We've been in a pause pattern since World War II. North Korea has been a problem, communistic dictatorship. South Korea has been very successful. We have U.S. troops in South Korea, and we need to be careful with North Korea, right, because if they explode then we've got our troops in South Korea at risk.
WILLIAMS: How about taking them away?
KYLE: So here's the deal, right, when Trump says I've got things I can do but I can't tell you, he can't tell you and here's why, because Saddam when he knew we were coming he started burying scuds missiles, chemical weapons, right? So you can't give them advanced notice. But you will have to take out launch pads. You will have to take out commanding control centers. You will have to take out ICBMS without them knowing that you know where they are because they're going to be hidden. I don't care what intelligence we have. So Trump can't reveal his plan, but he is letting them know a little bit. We know more than you think we do. The other thing is we have to be careful with China and our relationships. This has a ripple effect. If we do draw a red line, we have to follow through.
MALZBERG: I'm just going to say I agree with Kat because I just don't see daring a madman and telling them -- and I don't agree with telling him what you're going to do and when you're going to do it to a guy who's probably going to go ahead and say, go ahead, do it. Bring it on. I think preserve all options. And I don't want to see World War III either. I have an 18- year-old son.
BOLLING: When do you do it? Remember, North Korea invaded South Korea in 1950, started the Korean peninsula war.
BOLLING: . 35,000 or 40,000 Americans.
MALZBERG: Maybe we do it tomorrow, in a way that will incapacitate him so that he cannot take out our troops in South Korea. But don't say if you do this, we're going to come, and then.
BOLLING: Well, yes. And Kat is not going to agree with that part.
TIMPF: No. The red line is a dare for a dude like that. I absolutely think so.
KYLE: He's a risk too, though. And that's what we have to all remember here that they're both at risk. And they're both going to be bowing up a little bit.
(CROSSTALK) BOLLING: Do you drive, Kat? Do you drive?
TIMPF: I have before. I live in New York City.
BOLLING: Because the speed limit -- there's a sign say 55, does that make you want to go faster than 55?
TIMPF: I don't -- it does. And I don't drive anymore.
BOLLING: Maybe for that reason.
TIMPF: Which is for many reasons, I'm not very good at it. But, yeah, of course it does. And I'm also not Kim Jong-un. So not to brag, I have a little more decency than Kim Jong-un. Not to brag.
WILLIAMS: I agree. I don't think we should have a red line. But, again, I don't feel that I want to do a wait and see based off our reactive posture from Kim Jong-un, but that's just me. So up next, time to wake up, America, Eric Bolling ready to sound off on why Europe better get ready for President Trump and his America first stance. Stay with us.
BOLLING: Time to wake up, America. Protests rocked the beginning of the G20 summit in Germany, today, anarchists angry at President Trump for his America first initiative. So see folks, America first is good for, wait for it, America. European protesters are angry that America isn't footing the bill for every social justice issue the world can come up with. They're used to eight years of Obama where the president ran around the globe downplaying American exceptionalism. For eight year, Obama proceeded to give away the farm to Iran. Handing over $150 billion in cash for a nuclear deal to the Paris climate record, where Obama signed us up to pick up the tab for billions in Chinese and Brazilian pollution, while we cut our own emissions right here at home at the expense of American manufacturers.
It seems as if anyone and everyone got an American handout whether they promoted American values of freedom, liberty, and the free market, or not. Enter President Donald J. Trump, a new American president, a strong voice for American exceptionalism, a decisive leader. Trump pulled us out of TPP, he deregulated our energy markets. He said fix the Paris climate arrangement or we'll pull out and allow the darn thing to collapse. The Trump doctrine can be summed up with this, America first, globalists be gone. It resonates here at home and in freedom loving places like Poland. Listen to the massive crowds chanting Donald Trump and U.S.A. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
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BOLLING: Conversely, in places where open borders are the norm and big government sponsors everything, like the G-20 in Germany, riots ensue.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
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BOLLING: Time to wake up, G-20. America is back. Protest all you want. It won't shake the new American president, who's promoting a new American exceptionalism, and we freedom lovers thank God for that.
WILLIAMS: So, fine.
BOLLING: I heard you huff when I said Obama was prancing around the globe, downplaying American exceptionalism.
WILLIAMS: Here's why. Sure, President Obama was obviously a globalist. That is not to be disputed. It didn't start with President Obama, Eric. I think that we know that. I think that we know we can go to George W. Bush...
BOLLING: No problem.
WILLIAMS: ... Bill Clinton.
WILLIAMS: So for a long time, America has been on a trajectory of a more globalistic approach. So I don't disagree at all that President Trump is clearly a nationalistic, make America first message and that's largely when he got elected. That's fine, but we didn't just get there with Obama.
BOLLING: And Kat, I'm going to -- I'm going to have -- hold out hope that I think you would agree with some of these: breaking up the TPP things and being more nationalistic versus globalistic. Right?
TIMPF: Well, I'm all about American values, but where I have an issue is the nation building and trying to put those western values places that don't want them there and don't want us there. And then the problem spill over here.
So yes, I'm all about the western way of life, freedom -- love freedom, love liberty. Biggest fan of both of those things. And I'm also the biggest fan of not being the world's police.
BOLLING: What about it, Steve? Is Donald Trump, is he going to be able to keep the nationalistic, anti-globalist sentiment throughout the presidency?
MALZBERG: I believe he will. Notwithstanding the fact that the media and the left will bash them for it here. And I think the antithesis of America first is -- is nation building. I don't think that that's something that Donald Trump relished during the campaign. I don't think it's something he looks forward to as president.
TIMPF: Right. America first but not necessarily America everywhere. How's that?
BOLLING: Yes, and I think they were saying America first but not America alone, Taya.
KYLE: Yes, I mean, I think it's just an interesting concept. And I always try to simplify things, because I think most of these things, we can simplify it at a personal level.
Have you ever been in a position where you're supporting everyone else, and you're doling out the finances, and they're not showing up? At some point, as a human being, you go, "You know what? This is just not prudent anymore. This is not fair to me." And so you find a way to do it with grace and integrity to cut yourself off.
And so I think that it's just going to come down to a fundamental decision for people: have they been in that situation where they've had to draw the line? Or in their personal lives, have they been able to live in a world that was just all theory and philosophy and say, "If I had a million, I would support everyone. It's different when you actually have the millions, are supporting everyone and getting punched in the face.
WILLIAMS: I like you being simple about it. Because even as a kid, I kind of always wondered why America, with all of our own -- and we have the best country in the world, no doubt. But we have a homelessness problem. We have an HIV/AIDS problem. We have a joblessness problem. Yes, we've got a lot of things that we can do to improve the climate here at home. So why so much of our efforts and resources, quite frankly -- and I'm not saying national -- international aid is not a good thing, but certainly within reason, because we have a lot of things that we can do here at home. So I'm not opposed to that message at all, Eric.
BOLLING: Speaking of messages, Donald Trump found a way to continue the message that he's not going to put up with fake news, from Poland today. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I think what CNN did was unfortunate for them. As you know now, they have some pretty serious problems.
CNN has really taken it too seriously, and I think they've hurt themselves very badly. Very, very badly.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: All right. Let's go to the guy who is the fake news hunter.
MALZBERG: Well, I think in that clip, he's referring to the Reddit and the CNN, punching the CNN, and that -- that video and then CNN not only reacting but CNN basically saying, "We're not going to tell you the name of the guy who did this, because he promised to be good from now on. He told us he's going to stop his racist, you know, tweets, and he's not going to do anything like that again. He's going to be a good boy, so we're going to give him a pass." What kind of news organization does something like that?
TIMPF: I'll be honest with you, Eric, though. Interesting thing to bring up at a speech in Poland.
BOLLING: Well, I think...
TIMPF: I'm not sure they are sitting around dying -- hoping, you know...
BOLLING: I think he answered a question they were asking.
TIMPF: But still -- but still, just to go on and on about the CNN and the GIF. I'm personally tired of hearing about the GIF. I don't know if anybody else is tired of hearing about it, talking about it. I've got no more takes left on the GIF. So I really just would like that conversation to stop. But hey -- or bring it overseas on a tour, I don't know.
WILLIAMS: Kat just said she didn't want to talk about it anymore.
TIMPF: What else is there to say? Really?
WILLIAMS: I agree.
BOLLING: But the media, still one of his targets and deservedly so. I mean, I think I was listening to Donald Trump with the furious applause from Poland. And I think some of the other networks are saying, "Oh, this -- it's not that great. It's not that big of a deal."
KYLE: Yes, I mean, I think if you take it back to a personal level, I'm sure we all had people with some haters and things like that, right? And so we all had this personal decision to make. What good does it do and does it change anything? And you have to really answer that question for yourself.
For Donald Trump, it may be healthier for him to get that off his back and just -- and just slam some people. You know? But it's not always easy, but it might be the right thing to not talk about it and to let them...
TIMPF: There's other venues for getting things off your back. I don't know about haters, though. I've never had any.
BOLLING: None of us have, oddly enough.
TIMPF: Right, definitely.
BOLLING: All right. Let's leave it right there.
Straight ahead, more than 100 people are shot in Chicago over the Fourth of July period alone, despite an extra 1,300 cops on the streets. Why can't the chaos be stopped there? Don't go away.
TIMPF: Welcome back to "The Fox News Specialists." Our specialists today are Taya Kyle and Steve Malzberg. Let's continue the conversation.
Chicago is reeling after more than 100 people were shot between Friday and yesterday morning, including 15 dead. The city is now on pace to break last year's record level of gun deaths.
The astounding level of violence comes despite 1,300 extra police officers on the streets for the July Fourth holiday. The Chicago P.D. says it's now conducting a, quote, "very comprehensive review", but can they actually find a solution to solve this chaos?
Eric, time to end the drug war? What do you think?
BOLLING: I don't know. Look, again, I'm from Chicago, and I'm embarrassed to say "Chiraq," time and time again. A hundred people shot, 13 shot dead in one weekend? It's not getting better. It's getting worse.
Obviously, tighter gun laws aren't helping.
BOLLING: One of the most difficult cities in the country to get a gun, to get a handgun, to get a concealed carry. Maybe it's time, just let people conceal, carry in Chicago so they can defend themselves against some of this insane amount of crime.
WILLIAMS: Can I tell you all this? This is -- that's fine, Eric; that's a fine solution. It's not going to solve this, because this is something you can't legislate. And it's something that's not -- law enforcement is not the issue either.
This is a system. This is cultural. This is community. This is systematic. This is education. This is jobs. This is family units. This is -- this is the problem in Chicago. I know this because I went firsthand, because I don't like to talk about things I don't know very much about. So myself, Gianno, Richard Fowler, General Caldwell, we went to see, and this is what the community told us, y'all. It's not a gun control issue. It's not -- they could put 20,000 police on the streets. That will not change what we're seeing in Chicago.
TIMPF: Of course not, because if you're living this life of crime, a lot of it, which has to do with drugs and black markets to sell drugs, yes, you're not going to give up your gun. You're not -- you're not afraid of the punishments. And just because there's more police, that's not going to change it.
MALZBERG: There is no punishment; that's the problem. I heard the -- I don't know if he's still Chicago police chief, but I heard a couple of years ago, he was interviewed, and he said, "We don't have prison space." You've got to lock these people up and throw away the key.
You know, there was a crime bill in...
WILLIAMS: Lock them all up? Or what's the...
MALZBERG: Anybody who has -- goes around shooting people you lock up. It was a crime bill, 1994. It was too radical, so the Democrats took it out. If you use a gun in the commission of a crime, ten years. If you shoot it, 20 years, even if you shoot it in the air. And that's real gun control.
WILLIAMS: That's fine. I'm familiar with the gun control.
MALZBERG: But there is none.
WILLIAMS: And I'm familiar with the crime bill. It's not thwarting these people from doing that.
They're killing themselves, and they're killing their communities.
MALZBERG: It's because there's no such rule; there is no such penalty. There is no such penalty for those crimes.
TIMPF: Part of the reason for the overcrowding is because of a lot of people being locked up for nonviolent crimes. But you can weigh in.
KYLE: So I think you're both right in some ways, honestly. Right? Because you have to know that, if you commit the crime, you're going to do the time. And they don't know that right now in Chicago.
Eboni, I'm so on your page with this. Because the truth is, I heard a great quote from my friend Brian Birdwell the other day, and he said, "You're either ruled by the Bible or the bayonet." Right?
And the reason why you and I don't go out and murder people, is we have a conscience. Right? We have a code and morality that we won't do it. I don't care what somebody does to me. Unless they are breaking into my home and they are going to hurt my kids, I'm not going to kill them. Right? But I'm certainly not going to murder under any circumstances.
It's Christ. It's the church. Its godliness. It's community.
KYLE: They need strong people; they need strong men. And somebody has to roll up your sleeves and be brave enough to go into Chicago and...
BOLLING: Can I ask you, Eboni? I just -- I don't agree with you. I'll be honest and straightforward with you. I don't agree with you. I think it's got to some of both. Maybe you get into the community.
But you want to talk about strong leaders? Chicago has some of the strongest African-American leaders the country's ever produced.
WILLIAMS: No, they do not. No, they do not, Eric.
BOLLING: Was Barack Obama a strong African-American leader?
KYLE: Not for the kids.
WILLIAMS: Barack Obama is a strong leader. Barack Obama was a community organizer. I would not consider Barack Obama a leader of Chicago. That's what I wouldn't consider him.
KYLE: Can I get in on this.
BOLLING: He came from there.
WILLIAMS: Well, he actually came from Hawaii.
BOLLING: All right. Well, whatever.
KYLE: Eric -- Eric, I just want to -- I normally don't interrupt you, but I want to on this one, OK, because I speak from experience that if you have a young boy, and he doesn't have a father, I don't care who the mayor is.
WILLIAMS: That's right.
BOLLING: There are a lot of young...
KYLE: I don't care with the chief of police is. Wait a minute. Let me finish. They need a man to come into their life who is a strong man, who's a good role model and show them what it is to be a man. And that is what is missing over there. Morality and the strong personal connection.
BOLLING: But what is it about Chicago? It's unique to Chicago, this violence.
KYLE: It's out of control.
WILLIAMS: Right now it's Chicago. We've seen it in New Orleans before. We've seen it in Baltimore before. We've seen it in places near Detroit before. So this is an urban city crisis, Eric.
BOLLING: Well, how did these other cities solve it?
KYLE: It's the church and the morality in the community. They have to get involved.
WILLIAMS: The community has to step up. Yes.
MALZBERG: In New York City, they lock them up.
KYLE: That, too, right? Lock them up to do the time, but then get in there and love them. Show them what it's like.
MALZBERG: It's not either-or. If you could start young, absolutely. But if you fail, you lock them up.
TIMPF: A lot of this is connected to drugs also. We need to take a look at the way we handle drugs. We'll go from a treatment -- a treatment approach.
WILLIAMS: But why are people using drugs, though? We've got to look at the reason why a lot of people are using drugs. Right?
TIMPF: One hundred percent understand that. But the way we're handling drugs now certainly isn't helping.
BOLLING: Handing out big old-fashioned hugs and kisses in Chicago ain't going to stop the crime wave that's going on.
WILLIAMS: No, nobody is saying that. Nobody is saying that, Eric.
BOLLING: I'm trying to figure out...
WILLIAMS: This is about leadership within the home, right? So you're talking about Barack Obama. That's fine. Rahm Emanuel. Talking about leaders within the home.
TIMPF: Right. I'm talking about drastic criminal justice reform.
All right. Ten big sanctuary jurisdictions are claiming they're now in compliance with federal law, but the Justice Department is saying, "Not so fast." Stay tuned.
WILLIAMS: The Justice Department announcing it's giving close scrutiny to ten major sanctuary jurisdictions, including California and the state of New York. The ten cities, states and counties had received warnings from the DOJ's inspector general about their sanctuary policies. But ten locations have delivered what they claim to be proof that they're in compliance with the federal law.
But A.G. Jeff Sessions, well, he's a little skeptical, saying in a written statement today, quote, "It is not enough to assert compliance. The jurisdictions must actually be in compliance."
Now imagine this, Taya. The DOJ, Jeff Sessions saying, "You know what? I'm not trusting California, Nevada, New York City" to adhere to what he's enforcing, as stricter sanctuary city policies.
KYLE: Yes, I mean, they seem to have taken pride in not enforcing the laws that are in front of them. Which to me is odd, right? We're either in a lawless society or we're not. And if you don't like it, work on changing the laws.
But again, going back to the simple things, I think it's like a kid living under their parents' roof and feeling entitled and telling the parents, "Kiss off. I'm going to do whatever I want while you pay the bills." I think it's absurd. If you simplify it, it's absurd behavior.
TIMPF: Well, it's also not that simple, though, because the federal government cannot force state government to do its bidding for them. And immigration and enforcing immigration and borders is a federal job.
WILLIAMS: It is. It is, definitely a federal job, and that's the argument.
BOLLING: They can enforce if they wanted. I mean, you can enforce on a federal level and not necessarily -- and override the state.
WILLIAMS: By the way, that's what I suggested. I think that's the answer. That's how we don't have any more Kate Steinles and thinks like this. Stop letting the states...
BOLLING: Believe it or not, I'm a little more sensitive to the immigration issue than, I would say, most conservatives. Where I think we need to up our immigration, legal immigration rolls.
WILLIAMS: The legal. So we can fix that.
BOLLING: By double at least.
WILLIAMS: I agree with that. Let's fix legal.
But I do agree that we -- two wrongs don't make a right. Right? So since we have a slow, broken immigration system, the answer is not to bypass it completely.
But I think, Eric and Steve, I want your take on this. How about letting the federal government do what they're supposed to do with immigration and just take it out of the hands of the states?
MALZBERG: Well, yes, it's one thing not to cooperate or do the job for the federal government, but to hinder their efforts. And you know, we're seeing this. Look what we're seeing with the voter rolls not being handed over by various states. Lots of states.
WILLIAMS: I think that's different.
MALZBERG: It is different. It is different. But you know what? The only recourse that the Justice Department has is to try to withhold funding, as they're threatening to do. And I'm told -- I'm not a lawyer, and I don't play one -- and I'm told they may not have a case. It may not work.
WILLIAMS: They'll have a case.
BOLLING: And she is a lawyer.
WILLIAMS: Yes. It's always arguable. OK? We always can make the case.
But -- and Kat's been very consistent on this point. You know, it's one of those jurisdictional conflict moments. And we don't see it with just immigration. We see it around marijuana and various things, you know, where the states want to do it their way. We certainly love states' rights in this country, but at the same time there's a federal hierarchy that has to be at play.
KYLE: Yes, and maybe the federal government should not be deciding everything for the states. Right? We have so many people and so many different personalities. I would love to see the federal government go back to doing roads and security and call it a day.
MALZBERG: But this is a safety issue. I mean, these are criminals, and many of them are killing people. I mean, you just can't let them roam around because it's politically correct.
TIMPF: I'm not sure -- I'm not sure that people who come here illegally are necessarily what our problem with violence is. I think it's unfair to say that they're any more violent than anybody else would be.
MALZBERG: But they're here illegally, breaking the law in the first place. Why shouldn't they be taken care of and gotten off the table as a problem, when it comes to violence?
TIMPF: We're talking about two different things. I'm talking about in terms of violence. I wouldn't -- I don't -- I haven't seen any study that they're any more likely to be violent than any other person who's here.
KYLE: Yes, aren't we supporting the ones, though, who have committed other crimes? I mean, for the most part, we're letting it lie.
WILLIAMS: So you're saying something very important right now, because those are the two narratives. I am with that. Like, if we're talking about getting rid of people that create the most egregious violent crimes in our society, get them out of here. But other people. Right? But that's a different conversation than I think we're really seeing play out.
BOLLING: And I probably would agree with you. But take it one step further. Then do you pull back all these -- you know, this funding that we're sending to the states when they're clearly violating the federal law? If you want to say, OK, well, push it to the states, which generally I agree with, but then let's not continue to feed them so that the states can continue to break the federal law.
TIMPF: If they are violating the federal law. But many of them are not. They only found a very small number that were violating the federal law. Because the standard is you can't force them to do your bidding for you.
WILLIAMS: Yes, and you can't give them information you don't have.
BOLLING: Let's not hand over money so that they can continue to be a sanctuary.
BOLLING: Yes, defying federal law.
WILLIAMS: I don't believe in defying the law. We believe in the law and order here at FOX News.
BOLLING: "The Specialists."
WILLIAMS: So when we return, we will "Circle Back" with our specialists, Taya Kyle and Steve Malzberg. Stay with us.
BOLLING: All right. Time to "Circle Back" to our specialists, Taya Kyle and Steve Malzberg.
Taya, let me just give you a minute just to talk about your foundation very quickly.
KYLE: OK, that's very nice. Wasn't sure what you were going to bring up. But yes, the Chris Kyle Frog Foundation, the mission is to honor God and country by serving the marriages of those who serve. Their divorce rate is substantially higher than anybody else in the country, as far as a group goes. And we know that, if we can save that marriage, we're also saving the lives of some of these guys. I've gotten the calls when they're suicidal. It's their last safe place. They deal in an evil world. That's what they see, day in and day out. And they need a safe place. The women, too. I don't mean to be sexist. Not saying the guys. I'm saying that in a Yankee way, where it's "guys" as women and men. But yes, it's been an honor to serve them.
BOLLING: Great job.
WILLIAMS: Taya, I'll follow up on that quickly. When you talk about saving the marriage, because we know that it's not just the individual. It's the entire family that serves.
WILLIAMS: What's one piece of advice that you think you can offer these couples as they, you know, try to really battle this?
KYLE: Yes, I think it's a really difficult position to be in, because you're not sharing information with other people in the same precinct, battalion, whatever. There are a lot of reasons for that. But I think the biggest thing is to know that they're not alone. To reach out and know that this marriage has unique challenges. And we're working on getting them information on how it's different.
WILLIAMS: That's great.
MALZBERG: You do so much great work. I mean, everybody who puts on the uniform, I say, is a better person than me. You never put it on, but you are, too.
KYLE: I don't know about that, but thank you, Steve.
TIMPF: A lot of great work fighting the fake news.
MALZBERG: You're telling me.
KYLE: Yes, we're all doing our part.
TIMPF: You're fighting the fake news.
MALZBERG: I mean, look, look, it is kind of a silly thing to say, but it really is. I mean, I agree with Donald Trump. I mean, they have become, to a great extent, an enemy, and because fake news by omission is the greatest sin that they commit. They don't put things in perspective. Trump said this about a judge, but Obama said it, Clinton said it. FDR said it. They don't tell you that.
BOLLING: All right. We're going to have a leave it there. That's right. You've got to keep tweeting, Mr. Trump.
Thank you to our "Fox News Specialists" today, Taya Kyle and Steve Malzberg.
And we thank you all for watching. Make sure to follow us on social media, @SpecialistsFNC on Twitter and Facebook. Remember, 5 o'clock will never be the same. "Special Report" coming up in five, four, three...
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