This is a rush transcript from "Fox News Sunday," February 24, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
CHRIS WALLACE, HOST: I'm Chris Wallace.
The stage is set as President Trump and Kim Jong-un repair to meet again. But will this week's second summit do anything to advance the denuclearization of North Korea?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT: Chairman Kim and I have a very good relationship, I wouldn't be surprised to see something work out.
WALLACE: We'll discuss the upcoming summit, the humanitarian showdown in Venezuela and why the president has changed his mind about pulling all U.S. troops from Syria when we sit down with the secretary of state, Mike Pompeo, live, only on "FOX News Sunday".
Then, House Democrats moved to block the president's national emergency declaration.
REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF., SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: There is no emergency at the border. It's a mythology of the president, not a reality.
WALLACE: We'll discuss the latest on the border wall and the 2020 presidential field's move to the left with Democratic Party Chair Tom Perez.
Plus, President Trump's longtime fixer, Michael Cohen, is set to testify on Capitol Hill. We'll ask our Sunday panel about that and when special counsel Robert Mueller will release his final report.
And our "Power Player of the Week", having (ph) millennials with a real- world playbook.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We have built a GPS for adulthood.
WALLACE: All right now on "Fox News Sunday".
And hello again from Fox News in Washington.
We begin with breaking news. Fighting broke out along the border in Venezuela as troops loyal to disputed President Nicolas Maduro blocked opposition-backed convoys attempting to bring humanitarian aid into the country. Several people died and some 300 were injured. The Trump administration condemned the violence.
That's only one of the challenges President Trump faces this week. On Wednesday, he meets with North Korea's Kim Jong-un for a second summit, this time in Vietnam.
In a moment, we'll speak with Secretary of State Mike Pompeo about North Korea, Venezuela, and other hot spots.
But first, we want to get a preview of the Trump-Kim summit from Kristin Fisher reporting live from Vietnam -- Kristin.
KRISTIN FISHER, CORRESPONDENT: Well, Chris, the location of the summit is very symbolic. Just a few decades ago, Vietnam was at war with the United States. Now, it is one of the fastest-growing economies in the world, all while retaining communist control. So, President Trump is hoping to show North Korea leader Kim Jong-un that if he commits to denuclearization, then his country can enjoy the same kind of economic prosperity as Vietnam.
FISHER: North Korean leader Kim Jong-un is on his way to Hanoi for his second summit in less than a year with President Donald Trump. At the first summit in Singapore, the two agreed to work towards the complete denuclearization of the Korean peninsula.
TRUMP: We now have a situation where the relationships are good -- where there's been no nuclear testing, no missiles, no rockets. We got our hostages back.
FISHER: But the Singapore agreement was light on specifics. The challenge in Hanoi will be to get the North Koreans to sign something more concrete. The North Koreans will likely ask U.S. to lift some of the sanctions that have been crippling their economy. While the U.S. will likely demand specific steps towards denuclearization first with deadlines and a verification mechanism.
But President Trump says he's willing to be patient.
TRUMP: I'm in no rush for speed. We just don't want testing.
FISHER: And while there have not been any ballistic missiles or nuclear weapons tests since the Singapore Summit, the U.S. intelligence community says that the North Koreans have continued to develop both of those programs -- Chris.
WALLACE: Kristin Fisher reporting from Hanoi -- Kristin, thanks for that.
And joining us now, before he heads off to Vietnam, the secretary of state, Mike Pompeo.
Mr. Secretary, welcome back to "Fox News Sunday."
MIKE POMPEO, SECRETARY OF STATE: Chris, it's great to be with you.
WALLACE: Before we get to the summit, I want to ask about the developing situation in Venezuela. Some small amount of aid did get through and reportedly some 60 members of the Venezuela national guard defected to the opposition.
But generally speaking, the forces stood for firm and stood by him. Is that a disappointment?
POMPEO: Chris, the Venezuelan people are speaking loudly and clearly. They understand that Juan Guaido is the legitimate president of the country. We are supporting that.
The Lima Group, the OAS, European countries all around the world have seen the devastation that's been wrought in Venezuela by this sick tyrant Maduro who's denying food to starving Venezuelans and medicine to sick Venezuelans. Burning trucks with -- this is the worst of the worst of a tyrant. If I think the Venezuelan people are seeing that. We saw yesterday the military begin to see it as well.
Some of this violence was clearly -- these colectivos, these gangs, the military wasn't as certain they wanted to lean into this violence. We are very hopeful in the days and weeks and months, the Maduro regime will understand that the Venezuelan people have made it stays numbered.
WALLACE: In a statement at the end of yesterday, you said the United States will take action. What does that mean?
POMPEO: We've already taken action. Action to support the Venezuelan people, and we'll continue to do that.
They have a duly elected interim president, Mr. Guaido -- we are to continue to support them. We'll continue -- the American people have been most generous, providing a couple of hundred tons of food, medicine, hygiene kits for the Venezuelan people, and then we'll continue to build out the global coalition, to put force behind the voice of the Venezuelan people.
What's happened there is a tragedy. There were five or six or eight killed yesterday, but there have been hundreds and hundreds killed from starvation over the past weeks and months. Millions of people having to flee their homes, 3 million people had to leave, 10 percent of the Venezuelan population. Those are the actions of the American people and the Trump administration, to support democracy in Venezuela.
WALLACE: But no military force?
POMPEO: We said every option is on the table. We're going to do the things that need to be done to make sure that the Venezuelan people's voice, that democracy reigns and that there is a brighter future of the people of Venezuela.
WALLACE: All right. Let's turn to the main order of business, for you this week, and that is the Kim-Trump summit in Vietnam starting on Wednesday. Before the Singapore summit last June, national security advisor John Bolton said, look, they have to give up their entire nuclear program before the U.S. does anything.
And here you were just after the summit. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
POMPEO: The complete, verifiable and irreversible denuclearization of the Korean peninsula is the only outcome that the United States will accept.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Is that still President Trump's position going into the summit -- complete denuclearization and no U.S. concessions before then?
POMPEO: There's been no change in U.S. policy since the time I've been secretary of state and, frankly, even before that, when I was a CIA director. Our objectives are clear. Our mission is clear.
President Trump has also said this is going to take time. There may have to be another summit. We may not get everything done this week. We hope we'll make a substantial step along the way.
I spent a lot of time with Chairman Kim. My team is on the ground today, continuing to flush out paths forward to develop a road map for a path forward between the two countries. And we are determined to achieve that.
It's important for the world's security. The U.N. Security Council has demanded, not the United States, but the U.N. Security Council has demanded that Chairman Kim give up these weapons systems. It's in the best interest of his country and I hope we can make a real substantive step forward this week. It may not happen but I hope that it will.
WALLACE: Why a two-day summit?
POMPEO: It might be one day. It might be two days. I'm confident if it requires even more time, we'll commit to that. There've been lots of conversations going on over an extended period of time, continuing even through last night, we are committed. And President Trump is committed to putting the hard work that it takes to get the outcome that the American people deserve.
WALLACE: All right. Obviously, you are not going to tell me what's been accomplished or what you think you're going to get at the end.
So far, at least on the outside observers, there's been some progress, specifically as Kristin mentioned in her piece, therefore no nuclear test, no missile test by North Korea since 2017. But in terms of denuclearization, handing over its nuclear weapons, handing over nuclear fuel, handing over nuclear missiles, there's been very little. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIKE PENCE, VICE PRESIDENT: We still await concrete steps by North Korea to dismantle the nuclear weapons that threaten our people and our allies in the region.
DAN COATS, DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE: We currently assess that North Korea will seek to retain its WMD capabilities.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: The question I guess is, as you head into the summit, has North Korea given any indication it's willing now to put meat on the bones? That is either going to turn over an inventory of its arsenal or begin to turn over some of its nuclear arsenal?
POMPEO: In June of last year in Singapore, Chairman Kim unequivocally stated that he would denuclearize his country.
WALLACE: But he hasn't.
POMPEO: There were other pillars that we committed to as well. We've made progress along some, less so on others.
This is a complicated process. The history is right, I was the CIA director at one point too, you will recall, Chris. The history is difficult.
The previous administration's policy, right, which was test -- allow the North Korean to test; pray -- pray they'd stop, and then, cower when they threaten us, right? Test, pray and cower has been upended by President Trump.
We put real economic pressure on the North Koreans. We've built out a global coalition. One of the critiques is that we go it alone.
We've built up the world's coalition to communicate to Chairman Kim that that was the time, now's the moment, and I hope we'll make real progress on that this week.
WALLACE: There is criticism that President Trump is unrealistic about his relationship and the threat coming from North Korea. I want to make a couple of points about this.
After Singapore, the president tweeted this: There is no longer a nuclear threat from North Korea, and he talks repeatedly about the strength of his relationship with Kim. Take a look here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT: We would go back and forth, and then we fell in love, OK? No, really. He wrote me beautiful letters. And they are great letters. We fell in love.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Why does the president say that?
POMPEO: Relationships matter, Chris. They affect everything in our lives, whether it's grand strategy and denuclearization, or simpler things.
Relationships absolutely matter. It's important that the two leaders are able to effectively communicate. I've observed this over the past weeks and months, I've watched them exchange messages. I've watched our team understand the messages that the two leaders have provided.
And now, we're going to get to have a second summit where the two leaders can sit and have a frank, candid discussion, explore options and I hope achieve what the ultimate end state is, creating a brighter future for North Korea and reducing the threat of the United States from the nuclear weapons that are today in North Korea.
WALLACE: Is President -- from President Trump's point of view, is the idea of formally ending the Korean War, which we have an armistice back in the '50s, or the idea pulling some U.S. troops out of South Korea, are either of those on the table for this summit?
POMPEO: I told you before we started, Chris, I'm not going to talk about the context of discussions or elements of the negotiation. I'm simply going to stay away from that. When we have an announcement, you will be among the first to know.
WALLACE: Well, along with everybody else in the world.
I'm going to ask you a slightly odd question but it's something we're going to discuss later on in the show. While you are sitting down with Kim, the House Oversight Committee is going to be conducting a public hearing on television with Michael Cohen, the president's former lawyer and fixer. Reportedly, he's going to talk about all kinds of bad or questionable things done in the Trump Organization.
Do you question the appropriateness of having that hearing, holding a public hearing that potentially could undercut the president while the president is on foreign soil negotiating?
POMPEO: Congress has its own authority. They can -- they can move how they choose to proceed. I know what we'll be focused on. I'm very confident that the president and our team will be focused on the singular objective that we are headed to Hanoi for.
WALLACE: This week, the president reversed course on Syria. In December, he said that he was going to pull all 2,500 U.S. troops out of northeastern Syria right away. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We have won against ISIS. We've beaten them and we've beaten them badly.
Our boys, our young women, our men, they're all coming back. And they're coming back now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: But now, it turns out they aren't coming back now. He announced on Friday that he's going to keep 400 troops there, including 200 on the border with Turkey.
Two questions, really, has he now accepted the prevailing view in the military that even if they lose all their territory, that ISIS will remain a threat? And secondly, have you gotten any buy-in now that we are staying there from Britain or France that they will keep troops there on the border to help protect our Kurdish allies?
POMPEO: Well, Chris, the predicate of your question I think is wrong. So, let me just try and address the policy there. The president has made very clear that the achievement of destroying the caliphate both in Syria and in Iraq, we forget Mosul, people forget Raqqa.
This is an enormous accomplishment of our administration and our partners in the region and we are very proud of that. Millions of people liberated from the terror of ISIS.
Our president has also been very clear that this is -- the threat from radical Islamic terrorism, it's real. It continues. And we've got to continue to fight it.
The announcement this week that we're still going to have a residual footprint inside of Syria makes sense in the context of our mission statement and the tactics will change as time goes on. We'll use different tactics in different parts of the world to fight back against radical Islamic terrorism. President Trump is committed to doing it.
WALLACE: Have Britain and France agreed to keep troops there now?
POMPEO: We're hopeful that we will have a coalition there. I don't have anything to announce this morning, but I believe that the Europeans will understand the risk and the threat and be partners alongside of us on this.
WALLACE: I got about a minute left. I want to ask you one final question. Hoda Muthana, the young woman who left the United States four years ago to join ISIS says that she wants to return here to face justice. You have said she's not an American citizen. She will not be allowed in.
She was born in the United States. She did have a U.S. passport and in the past other ISIS fighters, men, who we have captured have been brought back here to face justice.
Look, nobody has any sympathy for Hoda Muthana, but I guess the question is, why is her case different? Why not allow her to come back if she was born in the U.S. and has a passport and face justice here?
POMPEO: She's a noncitizen terrorist. She has no legal basis for her claim of U.S. citizenship. She's not coming back to the United States to create the risk that somebody should return to the battlefield and continue to put at risk American people, American kids, American boys and girls that were sent to help defeat ISIS.
She put them at risk. She's not a citizen. She's not coming back.
WALLACE: Even though she was born in the U.S.? Is the issue -- I'm just trying to understand the issue. Is the issue that her father was a diplomat at the time? Because they say he had stopped being a diplomat before she was born.
POMPEO: So, there's litigation ongoing.
Here's what I can tell you, we have a strong legal basis for our claim that she is not citizen and she's not coming back.
WALLACE: Secretary Pompeo, thank you. Thanks for your time.
POMPEO: Thanks, Chris.
WALLACE: Safe travels and good luck in Vietnam.
POMPEO: Thank you very much.
WALLACE: Up next, we'll bring in our Sunday group to discuss the fight for power in Venezuela.
Plus, what should we expect from the Trump-Kim summit this week? Will North Korea start to give up its nukes?
WALLACE: Deadly clashes on the Venezuelan border this weekend as forces loyal to disputed President Maduro largely stood by him, blocking most opposition efforts to bring humanitarian aid into the country.
And it's time now for our Sunday group. GOP strategist Karl Rove; columnist for "The Hill", Juan Williams; Julie Pace, Washington bureau chief for "The Associated Press"; and Josh Holmes, Senator Mitch McConnell's former chief of staff.
Well, Karl, where are we at the end of a tumultuous Saturday, is Maduro's hold on power stronger or weaker?
KARL ROVE, GOP STRATEGIST: I'd say weaker. And every day, the steady application of the force of the Lima Group and the United States will make them weaker, because inside the country, hundreds of thousands of people are taking to the streets or protesting at the border crossing points and there was Maduro as his military forces killed protesters dancing on the stage in front of a crowd in Caracas.
So, no, I think -- I think he has weaker today and every day that the United States and its allies -- what's interesting to me is that this was led by the Lima Group. This was led by the Organization of American States. The president receives a phone call before he takes action from Justin Trudeau.
This is multilateral action involving the United States and the steady application of force and protest inside the country will bring Maduro down.
WALLACE: But, Juan, the sad fact is for people who would like to see Maduro out that there have been a lot of talk that perhaps the military, armed forces would turn on Maduro, would side with the people, would side with the opposition. That didn't happen.
So what does the U.S. do now and how does president Trump and his administration and the U.S. avoid the image that once again here's the U.S. intervening in Latin America, what has happened dozens of times over the last century?
JUAN WILLIAMS, POLITICAL ANALYST: And not were to good result. We don't have a great track record of successful intervention. So many unintended consequences, so much resentments against the U.S.
You know, to me, Maduro is a vulgar dictator. I think people are suffering. I think that's why the humanitarian aid, why the Lima Group sees the necessity to get involved.
But I thought you were on target and raising the question with Secretary Pompeo about U.S. military intervention. We can have CIA and other people go in there and try to undermine them, but at some point, I think the American people say, why is it our job? Intervention in this area, I said, has not -- does not have a good track record and it also broaches the possibility that the U.S. would actually put military forces in to oust Maduro.
This doesn't make sense. It doesn't make sense with the public in terms of our foreign policy. It doesn't make sense, and of course it fits with the current push against all the charges of socialism that the Trump administration is advancing here against their Democratic opponents.
WALLACE: We'll be talking about that with Tom Perez in the next segment.
Let's talk about the other big foreign policy story this week, as we just discussed with the secretary of state, and that is that President Trump will be meeting with Kim Jong-un in Vietnam starting Wednesday for a second summit.
Here's what the president have to say about that this week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We started off with a very good meeting and I think we will continue that along. I don't think this will be the last meeting by any chance but I do think that the relationship is very strong.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Julie, how confident are U.S. officials that they are going to come out of this summit with something more than they came out of Singapore with, which were basically vague declarations of an intent to denuclearize?
JULIE PACE, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, THE ASSOCIATED PRESS: You hear two different things from U.S. officials. One, privately they say that their expectations of some kind of significant deal are pretty low in this summit. There might be more talk about denuclearization but the idea that they would come out with something signed specific with dates and verification is probably pretty low.
The other thing you do here is that there is some concern that the president, because he knows that the takeaway from the first summit was that it was vague, that there wasn't anything particularly specific, that he could get in a room with Kim and make some type of concession that goes against what his advisors wanted to do, that he could be so eager to strike some kind of deal that he could give something up. I think that is a real concern, particularly if you look at -- I know we will talk about this later, some of what will be happening in Washington while he is abroad. Michael Cohen, his former lawyer, who was going to be testifying, that he could be looking to direct attention in a different direction.
WALLACE: Josh, what's your sense among Republicans, particularly Senate Republicans, particularly Senate foreign policy experts, how do they feel about this summit and about giving Kim another big international platform, which always tends to weaken the sanctions regime? There are indications that Russian and China have loosened up since Singapore and not getting the big concession for the North Koreans on specifics of denuclearization?
JOSH HOLMES, FOUNDER, CAVALRY: I think the important thing to focus on is to look at this as a continuum from when the president was first inaugurated, I don't think there's any question that we were perhaps even at the brink of war with North Korea. They were launching missiles indiscriminately, some of which they were testing could hit the Continental United States. Clearly, we cannot ignore that, and so, you basically have to go paths at that point. You could approach the brink of war, or you could do what President Trump has been doing, which is engaging directly with Kim.
And I think -- you know, no question, there has not been the concrete signed agreements out of the first Singapore summit, and probably won't be out of this, but, you know, what's not happening is they are not sending missiles, they are not testing missiles. They are not sort of broaching that brink of war type fever that we were at for the first year of his presidency and I think that in and of itself is great progress.
WALLACE: Karl, you're the one person at this table who's had some experience with this when you were advising President Bush 43. When he head into a high-stakes summit, how much did he and his team, all of you, know about what you already had baked in the cake, what we are going to get at the end of the summer?
ROVE: A lot and that's one of the problems with our relationship with North Korea, we don't even have a common definition of what constitutes denuclearization. We don't have an agreement upon the process, what comes first, denuclearization, or sanctions relief?
And so, they really are -- they've had one summit but let's not kid ourselves, we are at the beginning of a process. We are not deep into the process. And we're going to face an issue here where what kind of concrete steps are the North Koreans going to take?
Sure, they are not sending missiles over Japan and they are not testing nuclear weapons, but maybe they don't need to test. We know they've got operative nuclear weapons and we know they've got the ability to send missiles. Whether they can marry the two together we don't know.
But what concrete steps are we going to take? In one of the key things that I think people are looking at when I talk to people in the foreign policy areas, the facility at Yongbyon, which is the only facility from which they derive fissile material, three elements they need for nuclear weapons and the question is, a test of seriousness is whether or not they will decommission Yongbyon and make it under an international inspection regime.
WALLACE: But I have to tell you, I talked to a foreign policy expert this week and asked him specifically on that issue and he said they've got enough fissile material already, they don't need Yongbyon. They've already got enough --
ROVE: They've got dozens of weapons. Let's not kid ourselves. Even if we came to an agreement that they are not going to make anymore, they have plenty of material, plenty of weapons. They will continue to use the material they have on hands to fabricate weapons unless there's an agreement to stop. And even then, in a country that is a virtual slave state, how the heck do we have an inspection regime that works?
WILLIAMS: You know, that's a very pessimistic view, but I must say it raises the question in my mind, Karl, why are we getting this matter platform, an international platform? Why are we legitimizing him?
And don't forget that the Chinese and the Russians have often operated in such a way to support this.
ROVE: Well, you ask the question, I will give an answer.
WALLACE: Real quick.
ROVE: The administration I think has made the determination that it's better to engage than to not engage. Now, we can argue about that, but we engaged and it didn't work. We didn't engage, and that didn't work.
The president has, so far, done -- got some things out of this, at least the hiatus --
WALLACE: All right. Let's wait and see what happens Wednesday and Thursday in Vietnam.
All right. We have to take a break here. We'll see you all later in the program, but we want to move on because when we come back, Democratic Party Chair Tom Perez joins us to discuss President Trump's claims Democrats are going socialist and we'll also discuss the party's effort to block the Trump declaration of a national emergency at the border.
WALLACE: Coming up, the Democratic presidential field for 2020 embraces liberal ideas.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. BERNIE SANDERS, I-VT, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We need to make public colleges and universities tuition free and lower student debt.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: We'll ask DNC Chair Tom Perez about the party's move to the left in a fight over the president's national emergency declaration.
CHRIS WALLACE: This week, self-described Democratic socialist Bernie Sanders jumped into the 2020 race, adding to a large and growing field of candidates who are taking the party further left.
Joining us now, the chair of the Democratic National Committee, Tom Perez.
Mr. Chairman, welcome back to “Fox News Sunday.”
TOM PEREZ, DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: Great to be with you, Chris.
WALLACE: President Trump is pretty clear about at least one way he intends to go after the Democratic Party and whoever you nominate in 2020. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: The Democrat Party has never been more outside of the mainstream. They are becoming the party of socialism, late-term abortion, open borders and crime.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Whether it's the green new deal or Medicare for all or suggestions about very high tax rates on the super wealthy, how do you defend against President Trump's charge and effort to portray the Democratic Party, your tax and spend policies, as socialist?
PEREZ: This is one of the oldest tricks in the playbook, Chris. You go back 75 years, when Republicans don't want to discuss the issues that matter to real people, they call it socialism. Social Security, when it was being debated, you had Republicans calling it socialism. The minimum wage in 1938, you had Republicans calling it socialism. Medicare, Ronald Reagan said, and I quote, Medicare will lead to socialized medicine. Medicare will lead to socialism in America. The Affordable Care Act. The Children's Health Insurance Program. All of those things were socialism, socialism. Why did they do that? Because they're wrong on the issues. They don't want to talk about pre-existing conditions. We're right on that issue. We want to make sure if you're diabetic you can keep your coverage. They don't want to. So they change the subject. And that's what they do.
WALLACE: OK. Some of those issues, climate change, health care have been around for a while, but a new issue came up this past week. Three Democratic candidates for president now say they support reparations, compensating the descendants of slaves. Here they are.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JULIAN CASTRO, D-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I have long thought that this country would be better off if we did find a way to do that.
KAMALA HARRIS, D-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: America has a history of 200 years of slavery. We had Jim Crow.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: And now Elizabeth Warren says she also supports reparations, not only for slavery, but for Native Americans.
You talk about some of these other issues and say, well, the Republicans have always called them socialist. Back in 2016, Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton, Bernie Sanders all dismissed the idea of reparations. And polls have shown that the vast majority of Americans are against the idea.
Are you comfortable with some of your leading Democratic candidates talking about reparations, compensating the descendants of victims slavery?
PEREZ: Civil rights is the unfinished business of America, Chris, and we've -- we've seen throughout our nation's journey that we have more work to do. And that's why Democrats are talking about it.
But what Democrats are talking most about right now is, how do we build an economy that works for everyone and not just the few at the top? How do we make sure that if you have diabetes that we will bring down the cost of prescription drugs? How do we build an infrastructure program that's going to put people to work?
WALLACE: OK, I understand that.
PEREZ: That's what we're talking about.
WALLACE: But specifically reparations. Do you think -- is that something that will be in the Democratic platform, the idea that we are going to pay the -- the country is going to pay reparations, compensations to the victims, the descendants of victims of slavery?
PEREZ: That's something that will be discussed during the course of the presidential nominating process. And what I -- what I think is going to be discussed at -- at length during this nominating process is, how do we make sure America works for everyone. I find it -- this -- the whole interesting thing about the continued use of the word socialism is that repressive socialist regimes, two of their most frequent qualities are, number one, they go after the press. They try to undermine the press. And, number two, they are -- they have endemic corruption.
And I find it very ironic when you hear this president using the word socialist all the time. I mean he -- Putin, Kim, Castro, what they all have in common is they were doing so many of the same things. You shouldn't be attacking the press the way this president does. It's unprecedented. You shouldn't be -- you shouldn't be golfing --
WALLACE: I -- wait a minute -- I got to -- I got to interrupt just for a second.
Are you putting the president in the same class with Putin and Kim and Castro?
PEREZ: I'm just saying authoritarian socialist regimes undermine the media. That is wrong. You shouldn't do that. Period. No footnotes. No exceptions.
Authoritarian socialist regimes have endemic corruption. You should understand that. We -- Democrats won in 2018 in no small measure because of the culture of corruption engulfing this administration.
WALLACE: You saw the clip that we played earlier where the president was going through the litany of things he says the Democratic Party has now become. One of the things that he talks about as Democrats is the party of open borders.
On Tuesday, the House Democrats are likely going to pass a resolution of disapproval against a declaration of a national emergency. Any concerns that the president is going to be able to paint Democrats as soft on border security?
PEREZ: When you look at the facts, the facts belie that, Chris. The -- the fact of the matter is that Democrats understand that you can have secure borders and the rule of law. That's what we have fought for.
And as you correctly pointed out I think in last Sunday's show, what this president has done is unprecedented. I think Mr. Miller was on this show. You correctly pointed out that there has been no factual circumstance where the president asked for x, Congress said no and the president went ahead and did it. That's why at the Heritage Foundation in 2011 --
WALLACE: I hate it when people turn my own words against me.
PEREZ: Well, but that's -- that happened.
WALLACE: Well -- well -- well played -- well played, Mr. Chairman.
OK, let's turn the Jussie Smollett case.
After he claimed that he was the victim of a hate crime, Democrats rushed to his aid. You tweeted, let's call it what it is, a vicious hate crime. Kirsten Gillibrand wrote, it's the latest of too many hate crimes against LGBTQ people and people of color. And both Cory Booker and Kamala Harris called it a modern-day lynching.
Here's how White House spokespersons Sarah Sanders responded to all of you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SARAH SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: It's another sad example of people so quick to want to attack and come after this president, much like you saw with the Covington kids.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Was this a rush to judgment and to play identity politics in an effort to attack the president?
PEREZ: You know, Chris, I spent the better part of a decade under Republican and Democratic administrations as a career federal hate crimes prosecutor. I saw these cases firsthand. If the allegations that have come out in recent days are true, it's unconscionable because hate crimes, the fact of the matter, are on the rise. And when you -- when you create a false situation, you are doing an injustice to all the people who have been victimized. Look at the ADL (ph) --
WALLACE: Do you think that you guys rush to fast to --
PEREZ: We had the facts. We -- we acted on the facts as we knew at the time. And -- and here are the facts that we know today. Hate crimes are on the rise. And in the aftermath of Charlottesville, frankly that was a layup for the president. He should have unequivocally said there is no place for this. And yet he was empowering, he was giving permission. That was wrong. And -- and we have to understand right now the fact of the matter, hate crimes are on the rise --
PEREZ: And that should be a bipartisan issue.
WALLACE: OK. Let me ask you about something that people would say would be a layup for you. Do you still feel that Virginia Governor Northam should step down for wearing blackface 35 years ago and do you support the Virginia House of Delegates holding a public hearing where the two women accusing Justin Fairfax, the lieutenant governor, of sexual assault, can testify?
PEREZ: Well, let's take both questions together.
PEREZ: I called for Governor Northam to step down. I think his ability to govern has been compromised. As -- as President Lincoln once said, public sentiment is everything. With it you can do anything. Without it, you can't do anything.
So I --
WALLACE: So should he still step down?
PEREZ: Yes, I've called for that and I think his ability to govern has been undermined.
WALLACE: And Fairfax?
PEREZ: I have -- I have a -- I have a concern in the context of having a part-time state legislature conducting the hearings. I have been unequivocal in making sure that when allegations of this nature are made, that they are investigated. I don't think the Virginia House of Delegates and the -- in the Senate are the right place to investigate it. We should have an independent investigation that should be prompt, it should be thorough, it should be fair and -- and it -- it -- that's what should happen.
I've got about a minute left. I got some bookkeeping to do.
Will Milwaukee host the 2020 Democratic Convention?
PEREZ: We have three finalists, Milwaukee, Houston and Miami. They are all in the hunt.
WALLACE: When are you going to decide?
PEREZ: And we're hoping -- we're hoping to make the decision within the next few weeks, at the most. I -- my goal was to make it by the end of the month. I hope to keep that. But my goal is to get it right. And if it takes a few days over, then we're going to make sure we get it right.
We have an embarrassment of riches, quite frankly.
WALLACE: Finally, you have scheduled 12 Democratic debates, six this year, end of this year --
WALLACE: Six the beginning of next year. Will Fox News get at least one of the 2020 Democratic presidential debates?
PEREZ: We haven't made that decision yet. We have made the decision on the first two debates. And what we're doing in the first two debates, Chris, is unprecedented. Two nights, making sure we have random draw. And -- and here's our goal, we want to make sure --
WALLACE: You know what also would be unprecedented? Giving us a debate.
PEREZ: Well, that's -- well, we'll see about that. But I -- well, here's my number one goal. My number one goal is to make sure that everyone gets a fair shake. If we have 16 people in the race, 15 aren't going to make it to the mountaintop. My job is to make sure that everyone and their supporters feels like their candidate got a fair shake. And then my other job is to make sure that whoever wins has an infrastructure that will enable them to thrive. And that's why I enjoy coming here, talking to you, talking to your viewers about our -- our vision of a Democratic Party, of a nation, frankly, that works for everyone.
WALLACE: Well, we welcome you. Thank you so much for joining us, Chairman Perez.
PEREZ: Always a pleasure.
WALLACE: Please come back, sir.
PEREZ: My pleasure. Look forward to it.
WALLACE: Up next, we'll bring in our Sunday group again to discuss the special counsel report which will be wrapped up someday, and President Trump's former fixer on Capitol Hill this week.
Plus, what would you like to ask the panel about the timing of Michael Cohen's congressional hearing while the president is overseas? Just go to FaceBook or Twitter, @foxnewssunday, and we may use your question on the air.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON COOPER, ANCHOR, CNN'S "ANDERSON COOPER 360": Do you still believe the president could be a Russian asset?
ANDREW MCCABE, FORMER ACTING FBI DIRECTOR: I think it's possible. I think that's why we started our investigation. And I'm really anxious to see where Director Mueller concludes that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Former Acting FBI Director Andrew McCabe, like a lot of people, anxious to see what Special Counsel Robert Mueller has found in almost two years of investigation.
And we're back now with the panel.
Well, Julie, first of all, explain to our viewers and to me why we get all these reports last week, the Mueller reports is coming out Friday, no it's coming out this week. Then suddenly we are, no, we don't know when it's coming out, but it's not going to be this week. And, secondly, what do your sources in the White House say? How worried are they really about the Mueller report?
JULIE PACE, "THE ASSOCIATED PRESS": So, on the first point, I think what you're seeing is some wishful thinking on people's parts. We've been living with the Mueller investigation for quite some time. And there are signs that it is drawing to a conclusion, in part because Mueller has handed off some of these investigations, some people on his team are moving on to other jobs. But the reality is, you know, we're not going to know when this investigation is done until it is officially done and Mueller tells Barr, the new attorney general, that he's done.
I think it's important to note that when that happens, that actually kick- starts another process, which is to figure out what becomes public. So that is not actually the end of this.
In terms of your second question, you know, there is some real anxiety in the administration about this report because it's just such an unknown. They are fairly confident that there's going to be nothing in the report that directly ties President Trump to Russia in terms of a phone call saying let's coordinate, some type of real smoking gun.
But there are other areas where they have a lot less certainty that relates to the question of obstruction around the firing of James Comey. Also this Trump Tower meeting that happened where Don Junior was present there. Anything that involved the president's family, his kids in particular, is of real concern. And, again, it is such an unknown. They -- they think they know what Mueller has based on conversations with lawyers who have represented people who have had conversations, but it -- but it remains a bit of a black box for them.
WALLACE: Well, I want to -- I want to pick up with the -- the -- one of the first point you made, which is after Mueller gives up his report, he gives it to William Barr, the new attorney general. And according to the regulations, that is a confidential report which Barr then has to decide how much to turn over to Congress and to the public.
Here's what Barr said at his confirmation hearing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAM BARR, ATTORNEY GENERAL: I am going to try to get the information out there consistent with these regulations. And to the extent I have discretion, I will exercise that discretion to do that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WALLACE: Karl, the Justice Department generally does not say anything about people it doesn't decide to charge. The Comey press conference on Hillary Clinton being a -- a pretty dramatic --
KARL ROVE, CONTRIBUTOR: A glaring example of not following the rules.
WALLACE: A -- of not following that.
But you've also got the fact that for the last two years House Republicans, particularly the Intel Committee, were pressing -- pressing the FBI to turn over a lot of information. It didn't like the FISA warrant. Isn't it going to be a little hard now to turn off that spigot if House Republicans or Barr or the president said, oh, no, we can't share this information?
ROVE: Yes, look, that's going to be the big battle, what's made public and wasn't not made public. And this rule was promulgated by Janet Reno after the expiration of the independent counsel statue in 1999. It's been enforced ever since then.
I'd make the argument this. I -- I thought it was absolutely dreadful. It was unsancted -- the sanctimonious Jim Comey blasting Hillary Clinton after -- after him declining to indict her. He had no authority to make that decision, incidentally. That was a decision that should have been made at DOJ. But having made that decision, taking it unto himself the power to do that, the -- then deciding not to indict her and then trashing her was -- it was a bad for -- this is several hundred years of American jurisprudence tossed out.
WALLACE: All right, but let -- let -- if --
KARL: So, having said that --
WALLACE: Wait, let me just ask -- no, let me just ask you this. So according to the Justice Department legal guidelines, they can't indict a president.
WALLACE: So the only person who could bring a president --
KARL: Right. Right.
WALLACE: I'm not saying that there's anything to do -- is Congress.
WALLACE: Don't you have to share any information with Congress?
KARL: Well, you get -- you get to the -- you get to the critical moment.
WALLACE: I sometimes kind of do.
KARL: You do brilliantly. (INAUDIBLE).
But -- but that is the key question. If they -- if they -- if they decline to indict the president because presidents should not be indicted while they're in office, that's the one thing that might need to be made public because that would need to be taken into consideration by Congress, which holds the ultimate power of impeachment.
But short of that, I don't think that they should make anything public because that's not what we should do in our system. Comey showed why that was wrong.
WALLACE: OK. I -- I -- we're running out of time here so I want to get to the -- another subject, and that is Michael Cohen, the president's former fixer, former lawyer, is going to testify in public before the House Oversight Committee on Wednesday. This very day that President Trump sits down with Kim Jong-un in Vietnam.
We asked you for questions for the panel about that and Barry Zalma tweeted this, why does the Congress have no respect for the president?
Josh, how do you answer Barry about the decision by the House Oversight Committee to hold a hearing with Michael Cohen, who's clearly going to say bad things about the president, right in the middle of a summit?
JOSH HOLMES, FOUNDER, CALVARY: Well, I think it's terrible. And I think it's a terrible precedent. I mean there used to be, not so long ago, this agreement when a president was overseas that you help -- you hold fire on domestic political disputes. This one is absolutely the highest rung on the ladder of a political dispute. We're talking about a former aide to Mr. Trump, who -- who has proven time and again is very interested in trying to harm him politically, just at a moment when the president is sitting down for something that can only be described as of top national interest for the international security of our country. So I think it's absolutely ridiculous.
One point I wanted to make in reference to whether this is public or not, we're not dealing with an intern escapade here as we were in the '90s with the Starr report. We're dealing with some sensitive information about a state actor of Russia in theory --
WALLACE: You're talking about the Mueller report?
HOLMES: Interfering with the election. There is definitely going to be some things that are redacted here. I absolutely am confident the Democrats will use that as an opportunity to say that the DOJ is not sharing everything. But, in the end, I think we're going to know everything that we need to know in this Mueller report.
ROVE: By law --
WALLACE: Wait, wait, wait, let me bring in Juan.
And you've been pretty critical, I think it's fair to say, of this president. Do you have any problems with a House committee holding a hearing, a public hearing, on national television, with Michael Cohen, when the president is over in Vietnam and in a summit with Kim?
JUAN WILLIAMS, POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, I think it's -- it hurts us, the American people, in terms of the voice of the president because I think Michael Cohen is likely to indict the president's character. He was the president's confidant, his fixer. And he's going to be talk about things like payoffs, potentially criminal activity I mean directed to involve himself at the president's -- at the president's will. So I think it is damaging.
But, remember, Michael Cohen was scheduled to have appeared much earlier. He delayed it. And this is just a consequence of that delay. So I don't think it was intentional action by the Congress in response to the question, who suggested that it's disrespect (ph) --
WALLACE: Well, I mean, I've got ten seconds. They could have waited until next week.
WILLIAMS: Well, they could have waited forever. But, you know what, he's going to jail. And so really --
WALLACE: Not until May.
WILLIAMS: No, but the point is, he's going to jail. And the point was, he was avoiding testimony and they want to get him now.
WALLACE: OK. Thank you, panel. See you next Sunday. And I will say, it may be inappropriate, but it will be good TV.
Up next, our "Power Player of the Week," how this millennial CEO is helping other people her age face the real world.
WALLACE: Remember when you graduated from school and went out in the real world and had to figure out by yourself how to deal with all sorts of practical problems? Well now millennial face those same challenges but they're getting a big helping hand.
Here's our "Power Player of the Week."
GENEVIEVE RYAN, REAL WORLD PLAYBOOK: It hit me how educated I was but how just underprepared I was. All of the things that you know you need to know when you get out there but along the way never learned.
WALLACE: Genevieve Ryan is talking about three years ago at age 26 when after graduating from Princeton and getting law and business degrees from Georgetown she started work at a big New York investment firm.
What didn't she know?
RYAN: Within finance, everything from checking accounts to investing. Health care, everything from health insurance to mental health to finding a new doctor. Living on your own, things like renters insurance, understanding how to find an apartment, sign a lease.
WALLACE: Ryan and her team interviewed over a thousand college seniors and recent graduates and found out she wasn't alone.
RYAN: Every person we spoke to said, I have no idea what I'm doing and what I have to deal with something in the real world, I call my parents. And that's a problem.
WALLACE: Meet Real World Playbook.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hey, you, ready to learn about life in in the real world?
WALLACE: A website Ryan and now a staff of six have set up to help young people make the transition from school to living on their own.
RYAN: We have built a GPS for adulthood. Here's the things you need to do to be successful. Here's how you can set them up and here's who's out there who can help you.
WALLACE: The website is free and offers advice and links to all sorts of practical information. For instance, the 50-30-20 strategy for budgeting.
RYAN: You know, after tax, if you make let's say $1,500 a month, so for people just starting out, you can put $750 towards necessities, you have $450 to put towards wants, and you've got $300 you want to put towards your saving.
WALLACE (on camera): I wish I'd known this about 50 years ago.
RYAN: Yes. Exactly.
WALLACE (voice over): So how does Ryan make money? They license an online course called Real World Ready to universities and employers that teaches practical skills. Parents can buy the three and a half hour course for their kid for $50. Here she is making her pitch at Princeton.
RYAN: This life transition is a rite of passage. And we all have valuable lessons and perspective to pay forward.
WALLACE: Ryan says a couple of thousand people have gone through the program so far and they're counting on new customers around graduation this spring.
RYAN: It's one of those things where the buck stopped nowhere. Where are you supposed to learn these things? Parents think that their kids learned it in school. Schools think that they learn it at work. And work thinks by the time you've gotten there, you must know what a 401(k) is, you must know what health insurance is.
WALLACE (on camera): You talk about personal finance. Are you guys making a profit?
RYAN: We're really focused on growth. We're a start-ups and start-ups are all about reinvesting, you know, their proceeds into growing to meet the needs of their market. And that's exactly what we're doing.
WALLACE (voice over): And Ryan is already planning to guide millennials through the next stage of their lives, offering a playbook for getting married, having children and buying a home.
RYAN: I think it's rare that you can find a problem without a real solution. Our mission is to change the way that people step out into the real world and start their lives. And right now we are doing it.
WALLACE: In the next few months, Ryan and her team will launch a new, more customized platform tailored to a user's specific needs.
And that's it for today. Have a great week and we'll see you next “Fox News Sunday.”
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