Will President Trump retaliate against Syria?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," April 9, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

President Trump has a big decision to make. Will the U.S. retaliate against Syria? Bashar Assad, accused of using poison gas again on his own people.


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: It was an atrocious attack. It was horrible. You don't see things like that as bad as the news is around the world. You just don't see those images. We are studying that situation extremely closely. We are meeting with our military and everybody else. And we'll be making some major decisions over the next 24 to 48 hours. And we are very concerned when a thing like that can happen. This is about humanity. We're talking about humanity. And it can't be allowed to happen.


PERINO: The president is also putting Russia and Iran on notice, suggesting they may have played a role and could face serious consequences as well.


TRUMP: He may, yeah. He may. And if he does, it's going to be very tough. Very tough. Everybody is going to pay a price. He will. Everybody will. Excuse me?

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: U.S. military action, is it off the table?

TRUMP: Nothing is off the table.


PERINO: The attack in a town of Douma outside Damascus reportedly killed at least 40 people, many of them children. It comes almost exactly a year after the U.S. retaliated for the last Syrian gas massacre. An emergency Security Council meeting held at the United Nations this afternoon. Greg, a lot of people wondering if the United Nations has actually put any teeth behind or into this action. It came -- the attack came at the breakdown of talks between Assad and the rebels.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Yeah. The timing for this is so weird. Donald Trump -- President Trump says we're pulling out and a chemical attack presents itself which kind of says not yet. And they're very smart people, far smarter than me on this, who believe Syria is behind this. Tom Rogan wrote a piece today at the Washington Examiner. And I think Senator McCain. But this doesn't make sense to me for two reasons. Number one, Syria can't hide from retribution. So, clearly, if they're responsible, they will be bombed. It's not like they can run to the mountains. We're going to get you. We're going to bomb your airports. You Airforce will be gone. Number two, if you want America to leave, why would you do this? Maybe I'm not that bright, but why would you do this? But, anyway, aside from that, we're still going to retaliate. The reason why we're going to retaliate is because Assad is like O.J Simpson. O.J. didn't get found guilty of his real crimes of killing Nicole and Ron, right? He was found guilty of a later charge for armed robbery and kidnapping. The fact is, Assad has done enough bad stuff that if he didn't do this, so what?

PERINO: Well, to your point, Jesse, perhaps, I think that Assad has decided that the benefit of victory outweighs the possible repercussion from the west.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Right. He's desperate. And I think he's on his heels in this village where the rebels have really turned it up a notch. And I don't believe that he would do this without Russia's knowledge beforehand. They're the sponsor and they're the puppet master. But Trump was handed a mess in Syria. And that's not my comment. That's Obama's national Security Council spokesman, Tommy Vietor, who actually just said that himself the other day. And here's why. When Obama was president, there was a big leadership vacuum in the region, and Russian came in to fill it. Now, remember at the beginning of the civil war, the Obama administration spent a half a billion dollars to train five Syrian rebel fighters. So, it was a waste from the jump.

And then you have this incredible gas attack where Obama drew a redline, didn't respond. And Putin had to swoop in and then help President Obama save face, and organized this group to rid Syria of these chemical weapons. And people like John Kerry and Susan Rice bragged about bringing all the chemical weapons out of there. President Obama himself said it was the crowning achievement of his foreign policy legacy. That's obviously in tatters now. And it didn't help, you know, sending, I think, almost $2 billion in cash to the Iranians. So, right now, you have a proxy war, and it's probably just tribal. It brings in the great powers, America and Russia, but you have the Saudis and the Iranians too going at it because there's a major natural gas pipeline which, obviously, I don't understand, but they're trying to reroute it to the European Union. And.

PERINO: I think you understand it.


PERINO: That's what they're trying to do.

WATTERS: And Russia has, you know, this port city that gives its navy access to the Mediterranean. They want to keep a hold on that. They have an air base with about 1,000 personnel. And Syria allows the Iranian navy access to the Mediterranean. So, it looks like our side has ascended, the Saudis, the Israelis, and our rebels. And they're getting desperate. And I think Putin is probably hurting from the sanctions, and his oligarch friends are hurting from the sanctions, and energy prices are low, and they're just trying to test our resolve. I believe you can see President Trump seething when he's crossing his arms like that. The last time he crossed his arms like that was the fire and fury comment. So, I think they're going to pay, like he said, a very steep price.

PERINO: Juan, every major players is there, the United States and our western allies, Russian, Iran, perhaps North Korea, because we know that North Korea had been helping Syria before with nuclear material and possibly chemical weapons now, but also Israel. And when the attack started happening in Syria last night, the United States quickly said it's not us. And everybody else saying it's not us. Nobody will actually say that it's Israel. But what I notice is that Saudi not complaining that Israel took action.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: No. And I think it was very important for people to understand that Israel decided that they could take unilateral action. But, again, it's because the United States is there to back them up.

PERINO: Right.

WILLIAMS: And so, in a sense, Israel acting in a way that would help the United States and allow President Trump more time to decide exactly what is the appropriate action. I think it's very telling though that, you know, it was a year ago that he said Assad was not a priority for him, and that's when Assad did the chemical weapons attack then. This time it was his remarks in Ohio last week saying that it's time to get out of Syria, and now they act again. So, it looks like whenever there's a sign from the U.S. government that maybe we're not paying full attention, Assad then sees that as a signal for him to take action. He can do what he wants to do. And, to me, this is very troubling because it opens the door not only to Russia and Iran, but to also Islamic state coming back into the picture. If not Islamic state, than al-Qaeda. And don't forget the Taliban is right next door.

PERINO: Kimberly, the thing that's so disgusting about Assad is his willingness, over and over again, to attack children. Out of these 40 that were killed, many of them were children. Now, there're children and innocents are dying by lots of other means as well, but, you know, chemical weapons is not going to be our redline?

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Well, it should be, right? And it should have been there a long time ago. And now this is an opportunity for President Trump to show his resolve and his strength, that he will not tolerate these kinds of atrocities and genocide that's been going on over there. Really, this guy is just disgusting and outrageous, a lack of any kind of morality or humanity to murder children in this way. Obviously, Israel stepped up to the plate. Like we've said, they have the backing, you know, of the United States. I think that's a significant strategic partnership that really has -- going to be able to change the course of history in that region, which is so fraught with so many problems in terms of just the geo-complexities of that region, politically and otherwise. But, right now, this is going to say a lot, I think, also about, you know, President Trump, his presidency, his handle on foreign affairs and national security. He's shown the strength before and has worked. And I think he's going to respond rather quickly in regards to this.

GUTFELD: Can I respond to Juan, though? About -- OK. You know, when somebody -- when some big guy -- bad guy leaves a bar, and he's going to leave a bar, you don't throw something at the guy as he's leaving, you just hope he leaves. And what you said was that Trump saying that signaled Assad that there was a lack of attention and therefore he could take his own action. Why wouldn't he just do nothing and just let the big guy leave? Let the American power go.

PERINO: Just to add to that, just to reemphasize, what happened on Friday was that the talks between Assad and the rebels broke down. So, I mean, I don't know if there's causation, or correlation, or whatever, but there was an action in Syria that maybe they weren't paying attention of what President Trump was saying.

WILLIAMS: No, I think they were paying attention to Trump. And I think, as you've said.

GUILFOYLE: All things are true.

WILLIAMS: . you can't do one thing or the other might be. But, I think, for them, the United States is the Paris, the big guy walking out of the bar. Once you see the big guy walk away, for Assad, it was, hey, this is my country. This is what, by the way, what Vladimir Putin said that Assad is the legitimate president of Syria. And you can't --he says to Trump, you can't talk and act to a legitimately elected president in this way. It's interesting that President Trump then said to Putin, who is often times, you know, reluctant to criticize, you're wrong. I was really struck by that.

PERINO: I think they must have intel that says that.

WILLIAMS: I'm sorry, go ahead.

PERINO: I'm saying they must have intel that tells them that that they know, like, Russia -- they're like 119 million people or something. Like, this is a country that's trying to make some sort of investment in Assad, and they made a really bad bet in him.

WILLIAMS: Yeah, and it goes on and on.

PERINO: But, now, you have this seething cauldron, as Kimberly was saying, the geo-complexities, really makes for John Bolton having a big first day at the office as national security advisor.

WATTERS: Welcome to the job, John.

PERINO: All right, next, former Attorney General Loretta Lynch breaking her silence on that infamous tarmac meeting, what she's saying about that, James Comey, and more. Next on The Five.


WATTERS: This is a Fox News alert. There's some breaking news today on President Trump's longtime personal attorney Michael Cohen. The FBI raided his office earlier seizing documents. More now from chief White House correspondent John Roberts.

JOHN ROBERTS, FOX NEWS: Jesse, good afternoon to you. We know now that the FBI raided not only Michael Cohen's business office but also raided his apartment and a hotel room in which he has been staying. And I am told that the FBI took pretty much everything that they could find that was in the form of paper or electronic communications. Now, we don't know exactly what this has to do with, though in the course of seizing all the documents, it could have just been because they were there as part of it, not necessarily what they were looking for, were documents related to the $130,000 payment that Michael Cohen made in October 2016 to Stephanie Clifford, AKA, Stormy Daniels, as part of her agreeing to the confidentiality agreement that she has been fighting with her attorney, Michael Avenatti, to get out of for some time.

We've got a statement from Stephen Ryan, who is Michael Cohen's attorney. The attorney representing the attorney, if you will, who said the U.S. attorney's office for the southern district of New York executed a series of search warrants and seized the privileged communications between my client, Michael Cohen, and his clients. Ryan was advised that, by federal prosecutors, that the New York action was in part due to a referral from the Special Counsel Robert Mueller. So, that's where we now have the tie between what's going on here in Washington and what happened there in New York.

Cohen's attorney, Ryan, goes on to complain about the seizure of privileged documents saying it was completely inappropriate and unnecessary. It resulted in the unnecessary seizure of protected attorney-client communications between a lawyer and his clients. Ryan going on to say there was no reason for them to do this because Cohen provided thousands of non-privileged documents to congress and also separate depositions under oath. Stormy Daniels' attorney couldn't wait to show his glee at this latest development because he and Michael Cohen have been in a cage match over Stormy Daniels trying to get out of her nondisclosure agreement. Michael Avenatti in a statement to Fox News saying, as I predicted last week, CNN and MSNBC, Mr. Cohen has been placed in the cross hairs by Mr. Trump, he's been set up to take the fall. An enormous amount of misplaced faith has been placed on his shoulders. And I do not believe he has the metal to withstand it. If I'm correct, this could end very, very badly for Mr. Trump and others.

Again, we do not know the substance of what the FBI was looking for. Only that it came in part from a referral from the special counsel's office and, of course, Robert Mueller has been looking into Russia collusion. He's also been looking into the financial dealings of Paul Manafort and Rick Gates. He's got Michael Flynn on making false statements. He's got George Papadopoulos on making false statements. It would seem logical to assume, Jesse, that somewhere in the course of his investigation, Robert Mueller came upon some information that he thought that the U.S. attorney's office for the southern district of New York would want to know about. The U.S. attorney's office found it was compelling enough that they sent the FBI to Michael Cohen's office, home, and hotel room to pick it all up.

WATTERS: Wow, John, serious developments. Thanks a lot. We're going to continue to update you guys on this as we learn more. Meanwhile, it gave Jim Comey a queasy feeling, that's how the former FBI director felt when his former boss, Obama attorney general Loretta Lynch, pushed him to downplay the Clinton email investigation. It was Lynch's tarmac meeting with Hillary's husband Bill that ultimately led Comey to go public with the news of the probe.


JAMES COMEY, FORMER FBI DIRECTOR: Yes, in a, ultimately, conclusive way, that was the thing that cap it for me that I had to do something separately, to protect the credibility of the investigation, which meant both the FBI and the Justice Department.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Were there other things that contributed to that that you can describe in an open session?

COMEY: Probably the only other consideration, I guess, I can talk about in open setting, is at one point the attorney general had directed me not to call it an investigation, but instead to call it a matter, which confused me and concern me.


WATTERS: Now, in a new interview, ahead of Comey's book release, Lynch contradicts his account.


LORETTA LYNCH, FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL: This was a very sensitive investigation as everyone knew. And the issue when he and I sat down at that time, which, I think, was early in the fall of 2015, was whether or not we were ready as a department to confirm an investigation going on. When we typically do not confirm or deny investigations into anything with rare exceptions.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: To the extent though of it, he noted it, that it bothered him. Did he go to you and question your credibility with regard to the Clinton case?

LYNCH: We had a full and open discussion about it.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: He didn't raise any concerns for that?

LYNCH: And concerns were not raised.


WATTERS: OK. Kimberly, what do you make about Comey not raising the concerns directly to his boss' face? Do you think that's because, speaking to his boss, or he was a little bit of a coward. If you're going to say, you know, hours later, oh, you know, it really concerned me, but you never raised it, how do you square that?

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. I mean, I think if you have a concern, you need to raise it right away. Promptly and with, you know, speed and efficiency to make sure that you have the record set straight and that you have addressed any concerns you have, because, otherwise, then you're in explain game later on. And now you see here it's the problem, because you have prior inconsistent statements, which could be highly problematic any of this before the congress, the I.G., FBI, etcetera. There's a tremendous amount of exposure here. And I believe that she's trying to get out ahead of it with this book coming out, all of it to make sure and try to clean up the record for herself.

WATTERS: Juan, what do you think about the dispute?

WILLIAMS: Well, I just -- it's kind of puzzling to me to be quite honest. I don't understand why Jim Comey would say that. Now, we all know Comey has got this book coming out. It's going to be a big deal for the rest of the month. And I'm just curious. Now, Loretta Lynch said she wants to see what Comey had to say about why he came out of the last moment and have that long press conference in which he said they were not going to go ahead and file charges against Hillary Clinton. But, here's all the horrible things and the carelessness that she displayed in the use of the private email server. And she says she didn't understand it. It was a surprising way for the attorney general to be told by the FBI director of his decision. And so, I think that she said let's look for the book. Let's see how he explains it. It will be very interesting.

WATTERS: Yeah, I think there's going to be a lot of backstabbing among people who used to work for each other.

PERINO: Yeah, it's interesting. And I wonder if Comey has any of those, Kimberly has to remind me of the term for it, but those contemporaries notes to file, what's it called? Like the.

WATTERS: The memos?

PERINO: Is that what it's called? Like, memo to file or something.

GUILFOYLE: Memo to file that he referred to, that he said he took all the notes.

PERINO: Right. Because we know that Comey did that -- or he said he did that with President Trump. And I wonder, if he was troubled or concerned by something that Loretta Lynch had asked him, if he had a similar memo. And I were -- if any of us had a chance to interview him, we might actually ask that question. I'm also curious as to why she's doing this now, and then it occurred to me Comey has no natural partisan support anymore.

WATTERS: You're right.

PERINO: . not on the right or the left. The Clinton people probably dislike him more than the Republican people for sure. So, they want to get out ahead of this to try to, basically, muddy the waters for Comey going into what is going to be a very big to do with his book tour.

WATTERS: It's interesting, Greg, Dana brings up a great point. There's going to be people on the left criticizing him during the book tour, and, obviously, people on the right. Is it going to make him look fair and balanced, do you think? Or this is going to look like enemy number one?

GUTFELD: Yeah, everybody hates him. But it always goes back to the Clintons. Wherever you go, there they are.


GUTFELD: Like -- it's like weird horror film -- you look around, there they are behind the bushes. And the poor Democrats, they're like a building constantly trying to clean up after a lousy tenant that just left behind a complete mess. But, regarding these pair, you know, he called her queasy. She says it's full of bull. They're like two siblings, you know, pointing at each other over a broken window. Like, just blame it on the Clintons.

WATTERS: Blame it on the Clintons.

GUTFELD: Nine times out of ten, you're going to be right. You're going to be right.

GUILFOYLE: Pin the tail on the Clintons.


GUILFOYLE: Popular game here.

(LAUGHTER) WATTERS: Like a segment on The Five every day.


WATTERS: Ahead, a victim and a hero of Parkland massacre finally leaves the hospital and called out officials for failing to prevent the shooting, up next.


GUTFELD: So, it's been over six weeks since the Parkland shooting. During that time, we've seen marches, town halls and media spectacles both great and small. Heroes and villains have been made. Spokespersons anointed by cable news. But, up until last Wednesday, one person didn't take part because he had been shot five times as he tried to protect his fellow classmates.

Anthony Borges was released from the hospital, a teen no one had heard from until now. He saved upwards of 20 students. His attorney read a statement from him, which criticized the Sheriff Scott Israel, and others for knowing that the shooter was bad news before the attack but still did nothing:


ALEX ARREZA, ATTORNEY FOR ANTHONY BORGES: Both of you failed us, students, teachers and parents alike on so many levels. I want to ask you today to please end your policy and agreement that you will not arrest people committing crimes in our schools. I want all of us to move forward and end the environment that allows people like Nikolas Cruz to fall through the cracks. You knew he was a problem years ago, and you did nothing.


GUTFELD: Borges was too weak to talk, but his statement was strong. It reminded us of the facts. His criticism took as back to what was reveled post-attack: That tons of calls were made about the shooter over the years that he had emotional and disciplinary issues before coming to Stoneman Douglas. He was abusive. Still, none took action. The statement also mentions the PROMISE Program which allows young criminals to avoid arrest.

So, the question is, will this messenger receive the same platform and spotlight that others received? It's a sad reality in the world of cable news: We have to move on, other tragedies await. But, Anthony cannot move on, which is why we should press pause and listen to what he's trying to tell us. He cannot move on. The fact that Scott Israel can is a disgrace.

GUILFOYLE: Terrible.

GUTFELD: Yeah. Kimberly, we've heard very little from Scott Israel. The guy used to seek the spotlight, but now he's under a rock.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, because now the facts are raining down on him. And he cannot escape the truth. He tried to blame others. He demonized the NRA, Dana Loesch. He blamed the people at the school. He blamed everybody except for accepting responsibility for choices that he could have made that would have prevented this. When you have authorities been called 30 different times to Cruz's house and nobody does anything. Like, what else do you want someone to do in terms of getting involved and trying to do something to prevent future harm and violence and massacre? And if you don't learn from this situation, and you just focus just on guns, you're missing the point.

And for this individual to still have a job, the fact that he has not been suspended and removed from his position, to me is just astonishing.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: You know, Dana, he -- his father also called out Israel for using his son right after the shooting as a photo opportunity. And apparently, he gave his dad $100. There is just something very tacky - -

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Yes, please keep your money.

GUTFELD: -- and crass about this guy.

PERINO: Absolutely. And it's amazing that -- it will be interesting, once he's strong enough to talk, to hear from him about what kind of bravery it took for him to be able to stand in front of that gun --


PERINO: -- and take the bullets for his students. And I'm sure that they're looking forward to him getting back to school. He's really a remarkable young man, very inspiring.

GUTFELD: You know, Juan, he came from Venezuela for this. You know, I mean, the irony of leaving a place that is known --

PERINO: Right.

GUTFELD: -- for incredible high crime. And, you know, he wanted to be a professional soccer player, which isn't going to happen.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: I hope it does happen. I hope he -- I hope he recovers fully.

What struck me from this, it was very touching, was I think this is something from the heart of American students. He says, "I just want to go to school --"


WILLIAMS: "-- and feel safe. And I don't feel safe right now going back to school," is what he said. And to me, that just struck me as, you know what? This is no spin. This is no -- this is not taking sides. This is a young man saying, "I think school should be safe, and I should feel protected when I go to school."

I do think it's about guns. I thought last week, in the shooting at YouTube, you know, easy access to guns.

But from his perspective, even if we never settled the gun argument in the country, kids should be able to feel safe in school. And he makes a strong, compelling point.

By the way, the sheriff went to visit him at the hospital. So when you hear this from him, don't think this guy is just upset the president -- the sheriff hasn't paid attention. He's saying this despite that.


WILLIAMS: Thank you for the visit, but you should have done more.

GUTFELD: Yes, exactly. He felt that it was a photo op. Do you think -- what should be done with Israel?

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Well, the Florida Department of Law Enforcement --

GUTFELD: Bad Israel, not the good Israel.

WATTERS: Yes. The Florida Department of Law Enforcement has an open investigation. They'll submit their findings to Governor Rick Scott, and he can determine whether or not to fire him or keep him. And that should be coming momentarily. There's a great ambush by a local reporter, I believe --


WATTERS: -- from ABC that went and tracked Sheriff Israel down and got in his face pretty aggressively and said, you know, "Do you accept any responsibility? You know, what are you doing? You have to answer to some of this." And he weaseled out of it. And be didn't look like he was in control, Sheriff Israel. And then he followed him, and he was at a political event later that day. You know, with all the stuff going on in his community, he's out there hobnobbing with politicians and, you know, raising money and politicking. He just has a lot of misplaced priorities.

Like the Promise Program, got to get rid of it. Ideally, so you don't want to arrest a lot of a young black teenagers in high school. That's why the Obama administration came in and pushed it hard. Because it hurts their ability to get into college and things like that. I get that. But it can't be blanket.

I mean, this guy, like you said in the monologue, was abusing students in school, was suspended, was violent. This is a guy that had to have been arrested, because that would have triggered the inability to him purchasing a firearm.

And then, you know, for -- for CNN to shine a spotlight away from Israel and then towards the NRA, does such a disservice to the country. And they should be shining a spotlight on things like what Marco Rubio is doing. And you and I have talked about it. The -- I think it's something like the gun purchase restraining order. So you're balancing the ability to have the Second Amendment with, at the same time, protecting public safety. If some guy looks like he's a mental nut, you know you have a judge adjudicate it, and then you take the gun away.

WILLIAMS: You know, the judges and the social service people also didn't - -

WATTERS: They blew it, too.

WILLIAMS: OK, because I don't think it -- you know, I understand that you guys are upset with Israel, but I'm just telling you that there are lots of people who had the opportunity to act on Mr. Cruz and didn't act.

WATTERS: You're right: the FBI, the locals. And -- and what did Israel do? He set up a perimeter outside the school when the shooting was going on. And everything tells you, you go and you confront the shooter.

WILLIAMS: Well, that wasn't Israel.

WATTERS: Well, it was his deputies.


GUTFELD: So so you know, there is a GoFundMe page. A lot of those, we've got to check them out, to make sure they're real, for his financial support for -- for the family. And it's already raised $800,000. It's a legit GoFundMe page, if you want to check it out. Thanks.

GUILFOYLE: He used his body as a human shield to save 20 lives. God bless him.

GUTFELD: So gun control doesn't stop murders in the U.K., so the London mayor is now trying out knife control. How will that work out? Next.


GUILFOYLE: There is a big crime crisis across the pond. The murder rate has soared this year in London. More than 50 homicides since January. Most of the victims were stabbed to death, as guns are tightly restricted in Britain. So the mayor there has decided to now ban knives from the streets. Sadiq Khan tweeted, "No excuses. There is never a reason to carry a knife. Anyone who does will be caught, and they will feel the full force of the law" -- Greg.

GUTFELD: Yes, are they going to blame it on the cutlery and allied trade research associations?


GUTFELD: It's crazy. It's not just knives, by the way. It's acid. There's a lot of really crazy violent crime. The murder rate exceeded, I think, New York. With knives. And they also have gun crime even with strict gun control. They still have gun crime.

If you look at the knives, their knife problem, it's very similar to our handgun problem. Organized gang crime and lousy sentencing. These are the two problems that are the reason why there are gangs getting arrested. They go into prison for three months, and then they're out. And it's because they're not being sentenced enough for the guns. You sentence guns and you sentence knives the same thing: you go away a long, long time. That will do it. And arm the cops, please.

GUILFOYLE: And arm the cops. So Dana, what do you make of Sadiq Khan, who you know, has had his fair share of back-and-forth with President Trump, now going after knives? Acid will be next.

PERINO: I don't -- I don't think this particular thing has anything to do with President Trump.


PERINO: The statement that anybody who does -- anyone who is carrying a knife will be caught, is -- it's insane.


PERINO: It's not going to happen. A lot of people are going to have -- unless they're going to have, like, a massive drone program with metal detectors, like, flying through the streets of London.


PERINO: It's not going to happen. It avoids a similar thing that we talk about, which is the root cause. Why are murders up? Well, OK. OK, is it gang activity? If it's gang activity, get to the root cause of that. I mean, other big cities have dealt, like New York City has, with major homicide rates that were way just too high. It wasn't knives here. It was guns. But, you know, get after it and you figure it out. And you break up the -- break up the root cause and then you won't have to ban people's knives from their kitchens.

GUTFELD: But that might be, you know, that -- that might be stop and frisk. That could be bigoted, we've been told.

PERINO: Oh, well.

GUTFELD: If you profile.

GUILFOYLE: Profiling, right?

GUTFELD: If you profile.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, that's the thing. So Jesse, when you compare this to a lot of the rhetoric that we see in this country regarding guns and the focus on the weapon, the instrument used to harm or kill, now we see the focus here is knives.

But again, they're missing the larger point, which is why is it happening to begin with? Why are people choosing to take this kind of assaultive conduct towards others?

WATTERS: I thought it was an Onion headline when I first read this story. I didn't even believe it.


WATTERS: We joked about this when there was that mall slasher, the ISIS guy. This was on the heels of some ISIS shooting, and the left said, "We have to ban guns." And then some bad guy stabs some person and you say, "Oh, well, what are we going to do next, ban knives?"


WATTERS: And then everybody laughs on Twitter, but this is not a joke. This is real. This guy -- Khan is like the de Blasio of London. It keeps getting worse and worse and worse for him. It's turned into a joke.

You don't -- if something happens, it's bad. You don't just disarm everybody. You know? I think if you don't -- if you can't have a gun to protect yourself in London, then maybe you need a knife. So people sometimes protect themselves.

Or what if you're just carrying your knives to the kitchen, or to the restaurant, and you work in the kitchen or you work somewhere? He's going to go in and just -- you know, people have things sticking out of their pockets? You know, "Let me see. What have you got?"

PERINO: "Do you have a knife carrying permit?"

WATTERS: What about a butcher? Is a butcher going to be, like, under siege?

GUILFOYLE: Like a Ginsu knife sales person? Yes.

WATTERS: I know. You can't go door to door any more. It's crazy. And London is -- you know, they're in a heap of trouble.

GUILFOYLE: Well, and also, Jesse, his Twitter game is not good. Was not scary, wasn't fire and fury like President Trump.

WATTERS: No, no. Sad.

GUILFOYLE: OK. So what do you make of it? Is he on to something here, Juan, or is this fraught with problems?

WILLIAMS: Well, I'm interested in this, because I was listening to Greg, and I was thinking, "So imagine if we were watching Fred Flintstone and Barney Rubble, and they'd say, "No more rocks. Get those rocks out of your pocket. David and Goliath, you keep throwing these rocks. We're going to take the rocks away from you, young man."

The reality is, and the thing that really struck me here, was that there are more murders in London then New York City so far in 2018. And that's why the mayor is acting.

And by the way, you guys are wrong on stop and search. He, the mayor, is in fact, proposing that the police stop and search people for these knives.

WATTERS: So he's better than de Blasio.

WILLIAMS: No, de Blasio --

GUTFELD: Wasn't he originally against it, and then he changed his mind? I think he was originally -- yes, I think he was originally, years ago. Now he has to come around.

GUILFOYLE: He was for it, and then he was against it and then he was for it again. OK.

WILLIAMS: All right. But you guys want to then say this is the equation. That guns and knives and, therefore, he is to be mocked as if we don't have a problem with guns, which we do.

GUTFELD: We are lectured on guns from Brits every day.

WILLIAMS: I see, so you're not upset over the knives? This is really the same --

WATTERS: The reason we -- Juan, the reason we have the guns is because of tyrannical governments like Great Britain --

WILLIAMS: Oh, is that right?

WATTERS: Yes. Threatening the rights of the colonists.

GUILFOYLE: It's true historically.

WILLIAMS: You know, my man is a historian.

WATTERS: It's pretty obvious.

GUILFOYLE: He's got his own set of encyclopedias. It's amazing.

All right. Coming up, the liberal media has officially gone completely bonkers over the Russia investigation and President Trump. The proof, we have it all next.


WILLIAMS: As you know, the president says the press is biased against him. Perhaps he's not imagining it when it comes to some liberal media. Take MSNBC's Joy-Ann Reid. She's speculating about the president resisting arrest if Mueller's team comes calling.



JOY-ANN REID, MSNBC: What if he refuses to open the White House door? What if he fires and a Secret Service agent who would allow the federal marshals in? What of Donald Trump simply decides "I don't have to follow the law. I refuse to be held under the law. No marshal can get into this White House. And any Secret Service agent that defines me is fired"?


WILLIAMS: What do you say, Kimberly?

GUILFOYLE: I just think it's nuts. It's nuts. I mean, where do they come up with this? That's news coverage? To say maybe the president is going to refuse to follow the law or obey orders, or fire Secret Service if Mueller comes after him.

Like, "Knock, knock."

"Who's there?"


"Oh, no. No, Mueller, you can't come in, and whoever lets him in, they're going to be fired."

I mean, I think the whole thing is just ridiculous. So we already knew that they were biased against him. It's just further evidence proffered in that direction.

WILLIAMS: Well, play it out, Jesse. So we know what happened today. Right?


WILLIAMS: So the FBI goes after Michael Cohen, his lawyer. So if the FBI or somebody shows up and says, "Mr. President, if you're not testifying before the grand jury, you have to come with us. We're going to take you to the jail"? I mean, is that -- is this in any way realistic?

WATTERS: Yes, he'd probably, like, send Jared Kushner after them. You know? Put them out there. He'd calm everything down.

I'm pro-Joy Reid on this. You know, there's, like, what, 24 hours of cable news coverage? People speculate. They try to have a little fun. They're trying to get some excitement, trying to get some ratings. You know, we've done this before where you say, "What if, what if, what if?"

It's a fantasy. They fantasize on MSNBC all the time.

GUILFOYLE: Fantasy Island.

WATTERS: It's Fantasy Island. And that's been working for them. That's fine. You know, this is par for the course over there, though.

WILLIAMS: Wow, that was a surprise to me.

So let me ask you, Dana. If you, you know, go to the reality, and the reality is that John Dowd was advising the president not to stand for an interview. Jay Sekulow and Ty Cobb seemed to be telling him, we have reports today, prepare for the possibility of an interview. What do you say?

PERINO: I say it is all such speculation and hypotheticals. I don't deal in any of it. I just deal in, like, what the reality and what we know.

And I also think that, you know, you can spend the hour that you have to give on television anyway that you want. I do think that the Democrats have ceded so much policy ground and in talking so much about Russia that they have got to figure out a way to pivot.

They're in a perfect position this year, just because the way that the politics are and the math is, that they could actually win back the House. But if they don't start talking about Democratic policies of why it would be better to vote for the Democrat than the Republican in this midterm, they're just wasting their time.

WILLIAMS: So Greg, it's like the wicked witch. You know, they think the Democrats are like, will she come after them?

GUTFELD: I don't know. I was thinking, if MSNBC is Fantasy Island, Chris Matthews has to be Tattoo.

GUILFOYLE: Who's Mr. Rourke?

GUTFELD: Yes, you know, but you know what the thing is? What Joy did is exactly what I do when I'm at the gym. I daydream. Like, what would happen if I win the lottery? Or what if I'm looking great when I run into an ex. You do that half the time. But you run it through your mind to make yourself feel good.

But she actually verbalized it, which is kind of interesting. Could be an interesting segment that we all do where we verbalize our daydreams.

WATTERS: No, let's not do that. Are we on delay?

PERINO: Mine is pretty innocent in case you want to know.

WATTERS: Of course it is, yes.

PERINO: Playing tennis with my dog.


WILLIAMS: Oh, my gosh. All right, all right. "One More Thing" it's up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) PERINO: So it's time for "One More Thing." I'll go first. It's Jasper's birthday, and he's six years old today. This is -- he comes every year on his birthday. Jesse can't believe his good fortune. And Greg has a cute little toy that he keeps -- well, it's not really cute. It's terrifying him, but he's obsessed with it. And it's really good.

Anyway, always support -- always thank you all for the support for Jasper.

GUILFOYLE: I texted him happy birthday.

PERINO: And John O'Hurley gave us a shout out on the Beverly Hills Dog Show this weekend. Watch.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: First will be the Vizsla, please.

JOHN O'HURLEY, HOST, BEVERLY HILLS DOG SHOW: The Vizsla is your winner. Dana Perino, you must be a happy woman right now.


GUTFELD (imitating O'Hurley): Dana Perino.

PERINO: John O'Hurley, you're the best.


GUILFOYLE: That was very, very cute. I wished Jasper a happy birthday on text. I text him --


GUILFOYLE: -- through your phone. It's very cute.

So I had the distinct pleasure and privilege this weekend on Saturday night in D.C. to be the mistress of ceremonies for the sixth annual Operation Renewed Hope Foundation, their annual Purple and Gold Gala. And it was fantastic.

And Sean Spicer, a friend of the show, was the keynote speaker. And he was absolutely fantastic. Very funny and smart and was really nice, taking pictures with everyone. And he even gave me a challenge coin for the office of the press secretary.

PERINO: That's nice.

GUILFOYLE: There you go. And I attended with my son, Ronan. And that's Ronan, myself, and then his dad, Eric Villency, who is on the board. And his grandma Rowann. Got myself a little Ro-Dog in white tie. It's very cute.

And then also Lieutenant Cochran is in the picture, as well, with Eric. And that is Captain Avella (ph), who was pronounced two times for seven minutes. Really, just an incredible war hero. And he sang the "God Bless America." And also that's with Flags of Valor that also honors veterans which is really great.

So this is wonderful. They want to end the veteran homelessness by providing a range of services. And they work with landlords and rental agencies throughout D.C. to help them find homes. And that's two of my best friends from UC Davis that came to D.C. to see me, Charvito (ph) and Yvette with Ronan. A nice surprise.

PERINO: Sit down.

OK, Greg gets to go next.

GUTFELD: All right. You know what it is. It's --


GRAPHIC: Greg's Unicorn News


GUTFELD: "Greg's Unicorn News." It's actually National Unicorn Day. And do you know what to do on National Unicorn Day? You feed your unicorns. Do you know what unicorns love? They love ambrosia salad fajitas. And strawberry bacon and marshmallow steak.

GUILFOYLE: Jasper does not like that.

GUTFELD: And they love to eat in the bathtub.

PERINO: Jasper is, like, "Can I have -- when can I get a hold of that?"

GUILFOYLE: Well, it looks like a very evil unicorn.

GUTFELD: It is, it is.


WILLIAMS: For a guy who's 111 years old, Richard Overton had a fabulous weekend. The oldest living World War II veteran, grandson of slaves, mentioned he wanted to see a National Museum of African-American History. The message got through to the philanthropist and billionaire Robert Smith, who donated $20 million to build the museum.

He put Overton on a jet to D.C. Colin Powell called to welcome him, and the third oldest living American got a private tour of the museum. Next month, when he turns 112, I'm going to say happy birthday, Mr. Overton. America's oldest living World War II vet.

PERINO: He's amazing. Jesse.

WATTERS: OK, so occasionally Juan Williams will be wrong, and it's hard for me to hold my tongue and interrupt him and say, "Wrong." So I have a new prop that we're going to be debuting on the show. And I am just going to hold this up, and it says "wrong," instead of interrupting Juan. I know he doesn't like being interrupted. Gillian Fleischman (ph) sent this to me.



GUILFOYLE: Does that make your mom happy?

WATTERS: Yes. I just won't hit Juan with it.

PERINO: All right. Happy birthday, Jasper. "Special Report" is up next.

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