Why Jeb Bush needs to start fighting a competitive election
Mark Steyn explains why Trump has gotten under Jeb's skin; Columnist sounds off on 'Hannity'
This is a rush transcript from "Hannity," October 26, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
SEAN HANNITY, HOST: And welcome to "Hannity." Tonight, Donald Trump continues to dominate the GOP presidential field. A new Associated Press/GFK poll shows that a large majority of Republican voters think that Mr. Trump is the most electable GOP candidate, 71 percent saying that he would win the general election if he becomes the Republican nominee.
Dr. Benjamin Carson is close behind with 62 percent indicating that he would win the White House if he ends up representing the party. Now, 60 percent of Republican voters also said that they're confident that Jeb Bush would become president if he prevails in the primaries, 54 percent said Marco Rubio would take over as commander-in-chief if he were given the chance to run.
Now, Trump's success has made him a target of criticism, and he continues to push back against the attacks from his rivals. Let's take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Bush is out there. His campaign is a disaster. That's because I came along. I'm proud of it. So he's meeting now with Mom and Dad.
(LAUGHTER)
TRUMP: No, it's true. He needs counsel. And he was very angry over the week. He said, you know, if this is going to be this nasty, let them have Trump as their president.
By the way, Carson is lower energy than Bush! I don't get it! I saw him being interviewed. He's lower energy than Bush!
Rubio is controlled by his PAC, and he needs a lot of water on top of everything else. Did you ever see a guy -- did you ever see a guy sweat like Rubio? I've never seen anything like it!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: All right, here with analysis, author of "A Disgrace to the Profession" Mark Steyn is back with us. Look, I think it's funny. I listen to all of this. But if you're -- but when you listen to the comments of Jeb Bush this weekend, he didn't seem like he's laughing too much, or even Dr. Carson.
Is it getting too close now to the Iowa primary, they're taking this seriously?
MARK STEYN, "A DISGRACE TO THE PROFESSION" AUTHOR: Yes, I think Jeb didn't think he'd be in this position this close to Iowa and New Hampshire. And the fact is that kind of whiny little case of rich boy petulance where he said, Listen, I don't have to do this. I could be doing a hundred other way cooler things -- well, this isn't a monarchy. He isn't the crown prince. And he did have a choice about whether or not he wanted to do this.
So to get on TV in front of a camera and do his, You're not going to have Jeb to kick around anymore routine, I think gets to the way he's -- Trump is getting under his skin.
And Trump is actually quite effective at this. Trump has basically run rings around him all summer. Every time he says he's low energy, and then Jeb lashes out, Trump goes, Now you're high energy. I like that. He gets him talking about his brother for the whole of the autumn.
Now he's -- again, this remark about, Oh, now he's run back to Mommy and Daddy in Texas to seek their advice because the big schoolyard bully is beating up on him -- well, if he can't stand up to Trump, is he going to have to go back and see Mommy and Daddy when Putin is rude to him or when the Ayatollah Khamenei says, Death to Bush?
I mean, at the heart of Trump's low-grade insults is actually a very subtle strategy for undermining your opponent.
HANNITY: You know, it's interesting you say that. I had him on my radio show earlier today. And also Lindsey Graham lashed out out of nowhere. I mean, he's, like, 1 percent in the polls. I can't believe I'm losing to Trump and Carson. Well, Senator, believe i, because you are losing to them.
But I asked him specifically about Jeb Bush, and he used the exact same lines you're using, What are you going to do when Putin comes after you?
STEYN: Right. Right. And I think that's reasonable. I mean, the thing is, Lindsey Graham feels he has a reason for running, and he's running. And he's got 1 percent of voters who agree with him.
But Jeb's rationale is that he's the electable guy, he's the front winner (ph), he's the donors' choice. He's what the smart money in the Republican Party has bet on. And his numbers have tanked. And he's -- and actually, realistically now, Jeb should not be in a debate with Trump and Carson. Jeb should be actually moving down into the debate with Lindsey Graham and George Pataki.
HANNITY: But you know...
STEYN: This idea that -- Jeb's whole rationale depended on his sense of inevitability, of the coronation, of the fact that it was his turn and he was the moderate guy who had across-the-aisle appeal.
And Trump has actually blown that strategy apart. And the people who want the kind of moderate with a little bit of a -- just enough appeal to independents to get you to 50.00001 percent...
HANNITY: Yes.
STEYN: ... they're going to start looking elsewhere unless he gives a really rollicking performance in this week's debate. And there's no evidence -- Jeb Bush hasn't fought a competitive election this century.
HANNITY: You know, before I play the comments that he made on my radio show, I -- to me, this is like my martial arts training. And the bottom line is, I'm either all in, if I feel threatened, or I'm going to be all out. There's no in between. And it seems that Jeb has been trying to step his toe in, then pull back, and he wants to get in and he's really mad and it sort of expresses itself in other ways.
Here's what Trump said on the radio show about Jeb Bush.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well then he went to see his mother and father and -- because he wants advice. And you know, that's not what the people want. When you're dealing with Putin and you're dealing with all these people and killers and all the people you have to deal with, you know, you got to move quickly and you have to be nimble.
And he -- I was surprised. A lot of people are surprised by that step (ph). It's almost like he's getting out of the race, if you want to know the truth.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
HANNITY: I mean, almost the very thing you said. To me, Jeb's campaign needs to go all-in or just pull back and say, We don't want this fight.
STEYN: Well, also, you've got to be a happy warrior. You know, if you are going to be the moderate stand bearer, the establishment stand bearer, you've got to do it competently and you've got to do it enthusiastically.
And that's the trouble for him. You can't turn Jeb Bush into Trump. But right now, Jeb Bush is not even very good at being Jeb Bush.
HANNITY: All right, so...
STEYN: He is supposed to be that guy who has moderate appeal.
HANNITY: The guy that is coming in number two -- now, if you look at all the polls -- and we've had a lot of polls in the last week-and-a-half. Trump is winning every position nationally. He's killing everybody in New Hampshire, South Carolina, and even the other states.
STEYN: Right.
HANNITY: The only exception to this is in Iowa. Here's Trump talking about Dr. Carson, who's now leading there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I'm Presbyterian. Can you believe it? Nobody believes I'm -- I'm Presbyterian! I'm Presbyterian! I'm Presbyterian! Boy, that's down the middle of the road, folks, in all fairness. I mean, 7th Day Adventist, I don't know about. I just don't know about it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ben Carson has asked for an apology. Will you give it to him?
TRUMP: Well, I didn't say anything bad about it. I just don't know about it. I would certainly give an apology if I said something bad about it, but I didn't. All I said was I don't know about it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Is Iowa -- that's not really been a predictor in terms of who the nominee eventually will be. Mike Huckabee won. Rick Santorum won. Do you think that -- is it a different constituency, more evangelical voters? Is that the reason why Ben Carson's winning there, or is this perhaps an indication of a broader trend?
STEYN: No, I don't think it -- I think, realistically, Donald Trump is a slightly awkward fit for Iowa. He's a guy who said right at the start of his campaign that he's never felt the need to ask for God's mercy about anything he's ever done. You know, he and -- he's -- he's made so many smart moves that God has trouble keeping up with Donald Trump. That's basically Donald Trump's line on God.
And that might not necessarily a great fit for Iowa, and Ben Carson might be better there. But Ben Carson, I think -- I think would have great difficulty winning in New Hampshire and South Carolina.
And so it might well be the case that this is where, as Trump fades, Iowa turns to Ben Carson. But that's the interesting point. We were told that when the Trump bubble burst, all the senators and governors would still be standing, and it would be a question of whether people preferred Jeb Bush or Marco Rubio or John Kasich.
And the fact is that when Iowans took another look at Donald Trump...
HANNITY: All right, quick...
STEYN: ... they decided they quite liked Ben Carson. I mean, we've now got a huge...
HANNITY: Last...
STEYN: ... bloc of Republican voters who don't want anything to do with the senators and governors.
HANNITY: Last yes or no question. We're less than a hundred days from the Iowa caucuses. Can Donald Trump go all the way, in your view?
STEYN: Yes, I think so.
HANNITY: All right.
STEYN: I think that's what this poll shows, that actually, people now -- and again, this is what the donor class is going to do to him. If he wins New Hampshire and he wins South Carolina, the amount of money that will be spent trying to destroy Donald Trump...
HANNITY: Oh, I think it's going to come way before that.
STEYN: ... will be nothing like has ever been seen.
HANNITY: That's being telegraphed.
STEYN: Nothing that has ever been seen. This is a different kind of election.
HANNITY: All right, Mark Steyn, good to see you, sir. Thank you.
Coming up -- 2016 Republican candidates getting ready to square off during this week's debate. Geraldo Rivera, Monica Crowley are here with a preview.
Then later tonight...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUENTIN TARANTINO, DIRECTOR: When I see murder, I cannot stand by and I have to call the murdered the murdered and I have to call the murderers the murderers!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Left-wing Hollywood director Quentin Tarantino calling police murderers at an anti-cop rally in New York City. Former NYPD police commissioner Ray Kelly and Sheriff David Clarke are here with reaction. That's all coming up later tonight.
And also -- (INAUDIBLE) pretty disgusting comments as it relates to the rhetoric that they're using, and much more as we continue this edition of "Hannity."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(NEWSBREAK)
HANNITY: And welcome back to "Hannity." On Wednesday, the Republican presidential candidates will once again face off during their debate. So who has the most to gain or lose in Wednesday's showdown?
Here now FOX News senior correspondent Geraldo Rivera, Fox News contributor Monica Crowley.
You interest me because you love Donald Trump.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
HANNITY: No, it's...
GERALDO RIVERA, FOX SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: I love Donald Trump.
HANNITY: But you can't stand his position on one issue...
RIVERA: One issue.
HANNITY: Immigration.
RIVERA: But I am convinced that given time, I can sway him my way.
HANNITY: You believe that about everybody!
RIVERA: You, as well. But Trump is so specific about immigration and he's so draconian about immigration and he's so good on other issues, I think...
HANNITY: (INAUDIBLE) ask a simple question...
RIVERA: ... he is a guy who can win the election.
HANNITY: Why can't we just have people respect our laws and sovereignty? I'm for immigration, but legal. Why is it so dramatic to say -- Mexico, if you go in that country illegally, they either put you in jail or they deport you. Are they draconian?
RIVERA: The problem is his language, Sean. The problem is that he has gone to the extreme when it comes to his rhetoric. He has offended a whole race of people. And it's easy enough for him to back off and still have strong borders.
HANNITY: Well, I had...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: I'm not against strong borders.
HANNITY: I had Greg Abbott, the governor of Texas, on my radio show today -- 611,000 crimes were committed from 2008 to 2014 by illegal immigrants against Texans including murder and rape -- 611,000 crimes! That is a huge amount in one state.
RIVERA: I would submit that the vast majority of those crimes -- with all due respect to Governor Abbott -- fine guy -- I think the vast majority of those crimes are immigration-related. It's the crime of being here. It's the crime of returning here. Those are the crimes. There's crimes against Texans in the general sense, but they're not rapes and murders and robberies, generally speaking.
HANNITY: I went to the border, Monica, as you know, at least 10, 11, 12 times. I don't know the exact number. I saw the tunnels. I saw the drug warehouses, you know, floor to ceiling drugs being smuggled in to our country from the border. To me, it's simple. Obey the law, come in legally. We should expedite the process, not make it so burdensome, bureaucratic...
MONICA CROWLEY, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Yes, and look, the reason that Donald Trump's candidacy took off because that was the first issue out of the gate for him.
Two reasons -- one, Americans have a sense that they're losing control of their country, that their country is disappearing, and illegal immigration is the big reason for that.
The other thing is that illegal immigration is essentially the only issue, Sean, that has the potential to change the very nature of America. That's why people are responding to Trump and what he has to say.
And as far as language, Geraldo, I think a lot of Americans think there's no more time for niceties. There's no more time for diplomatic talk about these issues. You have to have a leader who's going to come out, tell it like it is, and punch back and...
RIVERA: Well, I don't think you can win the general election that way, Monica. I think that to take a position that is so intentionally raw and insulting to 45 million American citizens who vote, I think is very dangerous politically. Why not be a little bit more moderate in your language? Why not? You can accomplish the same goal.
CROWLEY: Well, I think...
RIVERA: He says nice things about Latinos.
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: And he's my friend, I'm his friend.
CROWLEY: I think there are a lot of people who traditionally vote Democrat who hear his language and actually like what he is saying. So you may be right about a big bloc of the Latino vote...
HANNITY: I think the country's shifted.
CROWLEY: ... but there are Reagan Democrats and blue collar workers who actually like...
HANNITY: Here's a question for you...
CROWLEY: Illegal immigration is threatening their livelihood!
RIVERA: This debate is now...
HANNITY: I got a question for you...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: This debate is going to be about economics.
HANNITY: All right, let's say it's Trump versus Hillary. Who are you voting for?
RIVERA: It depends on Trump on immigration. He is my abortion! You have to understand that, Sean. He is my -- that is my litmus test! My litmus...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: So wait a minute. Your litmus test is, do you support illegal immigration...
RIVERA: No, my litmus test is reason and compassion and understanding...
HANNITY: As defined by you!
RIVERA: ... of the historic relationships between the United States...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Sixty percent of Americans think Hillary's a liar, dishonest and untrustworthy. Do you think American people are wrong about her or right about her?
RIVERA: I -- Mitt Romney was the nicest guy. He was the nicest guy...
HANNITY: I didn't ask you...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: I supported his economic positions!
HANNITY: Are the American people right...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: He was against gay marriage. He was against immigration reform. He was --
(CROSSTALK)
CROWLEY: You're never going to convince him to vote Republican!
HANNITY: No, I'm not asking...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: That's not true! I voted for George W. Bush...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: I'm going to ask it one more time. Sixty percent of Americans think Hillary is a liar, dishonest, untrustworthy. Do you think those people are wrong?
RIVERA: I think that 60 percent of those people -- I'm not sure where you're getting that statistic from.
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: I think that Hillary Clinton is on a roll right now, and to...
HANNITY: A one-week roll.
RIVERA: A one-week roll?
(LAUGHTER)
RIVERA: So is Ben Carson on a one-week roll.
CROWLEY: It's a long campaign!
(LAUGHTER)
CROWLEY: So she's had a good week but...
HANNITY: Wait a minute. I don't think it was such a good week because it was exposed in the hearings that at the same time she's telling the American people that this was a spontaneous demonstration related to a YouTube video, she's telling her daughter, she's telling the president of Libya and the president -- the prime minister of Egypt that it's not related to a YouTube video and it's terror-related!
RIVERA: That's fair game.
CROWLEY: Look, one of the big reasons why this has blown up, the e- mail scandal, the server scandal, Benghazi last week, is because what we know is the most problematic scandals for any politician running for any office are the ones that reinforce an already existing negative impression...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Do you think she's dishonest? Do you personally -- do you think she's dishonet?
RIVERA: I absolutely think that she is a traditional politician. Let me tell you...
HANNITY: That's such a weak answer!
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: I'm going to get another sentence in here. I think that Republican have made a dire mistake in focusing on the wrong thing, on focusing on the night we lost our ambassador and trying to place blame in terms of the response of the United States military...
HANNITY: How about the lies she told us?
RIVERA: ... rather than concentrating on the spin, on the fact that she saved...
HANNITY: Spin?
RIVERA: ... President Obama's behind...
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Can I ask you a question. Is it possible for America to elect a person where 60 percent think they're dishonest and untrustworthy? Is that possible?
RIVERA: I think that it is...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: ... possible as we sit here tonight that Hillary Clinton will be the next president unless Donald Trump...
HANNITY: You don't answer a single question!
RIVERA: ... moderates on immigration...
HANNITY: Counselor...
RIVERA: ... and he is the only formal candidate...
HANNITY: I object, your honor!
(LAUGHTER)
HANNITY: He's obfuscating the issue! Last word.
CROWLEY: I would say that with Hillary Clinton, it's already baked into the cake that she's a serial liar. That's why I think Republicans should focus instead...
HANNITY: Did you hear that, baked in the cake?
CROWLEY: That's why they should focus instead on the competency rather than the lying issue.
HANNITY: I think the lying -- I think...
(CROSSTALK)
RIVERA: Let them eat cake.
HANNITY: Let them eat cake. Oh, great. OK, Maria -- Marie Antoinette here.
(LAUGHTER)
HANNITY: Coming up next tonight on "Hannity" straight ahead...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUENTIN TARANTINO, DIRECTOR: When I see murder, I cannot stand by, and I have to call the murdered the murdered, and I have to call the murderers the murderers!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: All right, left-wing Hollywood director Quentin Tarantino attended an anti-cop rally right here in New York City this past weekend. He called police murderers! Former New York City police commissioner Ray Kelly is here with reaction to those pretty despicable comments. Also, Milwaukee County sheriff David Clarke will weigh in on the war on cops.
And then later tonight, dramatic footage of U.S., Kurdish forces rescuing hostages held by ISIS in Iraq. Dozens of lives were saved, but why is the administration downplaying our involvement in that raid? We'll ask Colonel Oliver North straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity." It has been less than a week since New York City police officer Randall Holder was tragically gunned down by a career criminal. But over the weekend, in a disgusting and tasteless move, an anti-cop rally was held in New York City denouncing, quote, "police brutality."
Now, liberal Hollywood A-lister Quentin Tarantino -- he spoke at the protest. Listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
QUENTIN TARANTINO, DIRECTOR: What am I doing here? I'm doing here because I'm a human being with a conscience. And when I see murder, I cannot stand by, and I have to call the murdered the murdered, and I have to call the murderers the murderers!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: I thought a cop was killed. Here with reaction, the author of the brand-new book, "Vigilance: My Life Serving America, Protecting the Empire City," former NYPD commissioner Ray Kelly.
Commissioner, good to see you, sir.
RAY KELLY, FORMER NYPD COMMISSIONER: Sean, how are you?
HANNITY: Appreciate you being here. You did keep the city safe. Murder rate I think before you took over was, like, what, 2,500 a year, and you brought it down to 500?
KELLY: Well, it went down to 333 under the Bloomberg administration...
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: ... 245 in 1990.
HANNITY: So we almost -- it seems like a war on cops. It seems like it's open season on them People are now -- the Black Lives Matter movement literally chanting, "Pigs in a blanket, fry 'em like bacon."
KELLY: Yes.
HANNITY: They get -- the Democrats are going to do a forum with this group. What are your thoughts?
KELLY: Well, certainly, there's a rhetorical war on cops. There's a lot of verbiage out there. We saw Quentin Tarantino. That was absolutely disgraceful. And clearly, cops feel at greater risk because of it, because of the rhetoric that's floating around.
It's a dangerous job to begin with. We don't need that sort of talk out there. Doesn't help anything.
HANNITY: Yes. Let me put up -- in a closed-door speech, the FBI director, James Comey, actually indicated police are now scared to do their jobs. Here's what he said. He said, you know, they told me we feel like we're under siege and we don't feel much like getting out of our cars.
You still talk to the rank and file. You are so well respected in New York. Is that what you're hearing?
KELLY: Yes. I think Jim Comey is telling it like it is. Clearly, police officers are hesitating. They're not engaging in the way they engaged for the last two decades, quite frankly. That's why crime is down...
HANNITY: Yes.
KELLY: ... significantly throughout the country. But yes, police are backing off now. And anybody who denies that, I think, is just not facing reality.
HANNITY: The mother of this officer made a plea to reinstate stop and frisk in New York, which the murder rate's going up here, it's going up in Chicago, it's going up in most major cities, but here's what the mother said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think Mayor de Blasio should reconsider the stop and frisk because I think it's going to be a deterrent to these thugs who go around and taking innocent people's lives.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Yes.
KELLY: Police officers tell me that's just a lot more guns on the street. Obviously, stop, question and frisk is not the be-all and end-all, but it certainly is a deterrent, as far as someone's willingness to carry a gun on the street.
So it's a valuable tool. It's constitutionally valid. It was validated by a Supreme Court case, Terry (ph) versus Ohio. It's codified virtually in every state in America, and yet the -- certainly, in this city, it backed off tremendously. I think that puts all of us at risk.
HANNITY: Let me ask you one political question, and I want to ask you through the prism of this Minnesota march, Black Lives Matter -- Pigs in a blanket, fry it like bacon, and then hear the president defend them, and the Democratic Party will have a forum with the Black Lives Matter movement. Let's first go back to what they said. This was in Minneapolis.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PROTESTERS: Pigs in a blanket, fry 'em like bacon, pigs in a blanket, fry 'em like bacon.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do we want?
PROTESTERS: Dead cops.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When do we want it?
PROTESTERS: Now.
PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: The reason that the organizers used the phrase Black Lives Matter was not because they were suggesting nobody else's lives matter. Rather, what they were suggesting was there is a specific problem that is happening in the African-American community that's not happening in other communities. The African-American community is not just making this up. And it's not just something being politicized. It's real.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Democratic candidates are saying -- they're asked the question, Black Lives Matter, all lives matter? And they say Black Lives Matter. Don't Asian lives matter, Hispanic lives matter, white lives matter? I don't understand that answer.
KELLY: Obviously, all lives matter and...
HANNITY: Blue lives matter! Cops' lives matter.
KELLY: Of course. And we showed that in the city in 12 years of the Bloomberg administration. There were almost 9,500 fewer murders than there were in the 12 years prior to the Bloomberg administration. If history is any guide, the vast majority of those lives saved were young men of color, black young men, quite frankly. That's who's being killed on the streets of our cities.
HANNITY: All right, thank you so much, Commissioner. Appreciate it.
KELLY: Good to be with you.
HANNITY: Joining us now, Milwaukee County sheriff David Clarke, trial attorney Eric Guster joining us.
Sheriff Clarke, What do we want, dead cops, you know, pigs in a blanket, fry 'em like bacon. And all lives matter of black lives matter. People say black lives in the Democratic Party. I don't understand. Try and help me understand.
DAVID CLARKE, MILWAUKEE COUNTY SHERIFF: Well, there's no way to understand this nonsense, first of all, Sean. The claims made by Tarantino -- he's a limousine liberal. He's a 1 percenter. And the claims made by President Obama that this is not based on emotion, it's real.
It's just plain wrong. These claims are based on fiction. Once you strip away the myth, the lie, the propaganda, all that remains is the facts, lies put out and repeated over and over again by the president of the United States. They're not a substitute for empirical research.
The facts are these. In a three-year period, '09 to 2012, there were about 1,491 uses of force -- deadly uses of force by police officers. Sean, 61 percent of the people involved in those -- that use of force were white males, 32 percent black males, an almost 2-to-1 ratio. If there's anybody that's got claim on misuse of force, it's white males.
The other thing is this, again, data and research -- 0.04 percent of perpetrators of black homicide of police officers, less than one-tenth of one percent. And on the other hand, 93 percent of perpetrators of black homicide were committed by other black people.
The president of the United States lacks the courage to look at the black community and tell them to look in the mirror as the source of their problems. Most of these people that police come in contact with are engaged in some sort of criminal behavior, a call for police. If you look at the other data, their participation rates and violent crime are off the charts in terms and compared to their rates within the population of the United States, which is about 13 percent.
HANNITY: Eric Guster, let's go out with those numbers. They speak for themselves. If 93 percent of the murders of black on black crime and less than one-tenth of one percent involve a law enforcement officer, why are groups chanting about killing cops and frying them like bacon? Why is this group getting legitimacy?
ERIC GUSTER, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: Over 80 percent of white murders are committed by white people. So we can always play the statistics.
HANNITY: I'm not disputing that. But you're not answering my question.
GUSTER: To say that we're talking about this issue in this context --
HANNITY: Eric.
GUSTER: Let me finish.
HANNITY: Whoa, whoa, whoa.
GUSTER: You are talking about Black Lives Matter --
HANNITY: Eric, please.
GUSTER: Ten seconds --
HANNITY: I don't need your talking points. This is an important question. If less than one-tenth of one percent is with cops, but 93 percent are black on black crime, and you're right in pointing out in the white community -- wait a minute. Let me get the question out so you can answer it. Then the question then becomes, why is the president, why are these groups legitimizing a group that calls for dead police officers?
GUSTER: You're talking about -- and that's what I'm saying. You pulled out 20 seconds of chants from thousands and thousands of hours of people doing great work because black lives do matter, and the problem is that so many people have been ignored --
HANNITY: Don't all lives matter?
GUSTER: -- for centuries, and that's why this group is very important.
HANNITY: Sheriff, you want to answer that.
GUSTER: Not only is it important for us to acknowledge this group but to listen to their concerns. Now, there's a small fraction of people a small fraction of knuckleheads that are saying things that are not appropriate. But the overall reaction --
HANNITY: Oh, OK, you want to just put those comments aside.
GUSTER: It's amazing. You have to start doing that.
HANNITY: Sheriff, I can't put those comments aside. Your reaction?
CLARKE: Well, the whole black lives -- which I've renamed black lies matter, movement is based on a lie itself. It is the bastard child of "hands up, don't shoot," which we know is a lie. So that's why I said this movement is illegitimate. Again, I'll go back to the fact --
(CROSSTALK)
GUSTER: So you're saying he didn't get murdered?
CLARKE: Show me the data. Lies, myth, and propaganda do not substitute for empirical research.
(CROSSTALK)
HANNITY: Let him finish.
GUSTER: No.
CLARKE: The police use of force.
GUSTER: No. I'm tired of him lying on your show.
CLARKE: And you enter race, you know what you get according to a Harvard research --
GUSTER: No, this is about statistics, Clarke, and you know that. This is about statistics.
CLARKE: You get a random distribution. You get no pattern of any racism by the American police officer. Again all I ask --
GUSTER: Oh, so profiling is not racism? Profiling is not racism? Of course it's racism.
(CROSSTALK)
CLARKE: And I'll take a look at it. But to date Sean, I have not been shown any research that supports that lie.
HANNITY: All right, thank you both. Appreciate it.
And coming up, dramatic new video shows U.S./Kurdish forces rescuing hostages that were being held by ISIS in Iraq. The Obama administration is trying to downplay our involvement in the rescue mission. We'll check in with Lieutenant Colonel Oliver North. He is here to explain.
Then later tonight --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KATY PERRY, SINGER/SONGWRITER: I stand and I march with Hillary. I believe in her future, her vision. I believe in her policies. I believe in equal rights for men, women.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: All right, Hollywood liberal Katy Perry announcing this weekend that she's supporting Hillary for president. Do Americans really care? We'll debate that straight ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Welcome back to "Hannity." So we have dramatic new video allegedly showing U.S. and Kurdish forces rescuing hostages that were being held by ISIS in Iraq. According to the Pentagon, the raid was ordered after intel showed that, quote, "graves had been prepared for the hostages." American solder Army Master Sergeant Joshua Wheeler, he was killed in this raid, but the Pentagon, weirdly, is denying it was a combat mission. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ASHTON CARTER, SECRETARY OF DEFENSE: It doesn't represent assuming a combat role. It represents a continuation of our advise-and-assist mission.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Here with reaction, host of "War Stories," Lieutenant Colonel Oliver North. Colonel, why would they deny this was a combat role when we have the video, and we'll roll it again, showing that this is combat?
LT. COL. OLIVER NORTH, "WAR STORIES" HOST: It's hard to explain much of what goes on in this administration. The American people need to know the death of Master Sergeant Wheeler in a raid against hostile forces is a combat fatality. We ought to thank God we still have brave men in the armed forces willing to go into harm's way. Sean, the classical definition of a hero is a person who puts him or herself at risk for the benefits of others, and that certainly defines Master Sergeant Wheeler.
HANNITY: I think we ought to be proud of people like Sergeant Wheeler and celebrate his life and talk about his sacrifice. They just brushed it aside as if it was nothing. Going into that environment, that's a war zone.
NORTH: Look, the Peshmerga troops that he helped train, I'll be with them here next week, those are heroes as well. On this operation they saved 70 hostages from certain death. At the same time we ought to be praying for his family that the good Lord will ease their grief. And the president ought to personally offer the thanks of a grateful nation for such selfless sacrifice.
HANNITY: Well said.
NORTH: No matter what the Obama administration calls it, going on a raid with indigenous forces like Peshmerga is combat. And the Sec Def disappointingly has caught on the O team disease of misnaming everything. They can't name our enemy as radical Islamist jihadis. They can't call war what it really is.
HANNITY: They can't say "radical Islam" either.
Here's my next question. ISIS often wants money. In other words, they hold hostages, they make demands, they blackmail and we have a policy not to pay. What about families that would like to raise money, that would like to pay for the lives of their loved ones? Should we allow them to do it?
NORTH: First, none of these were American citizens.
HANNITY: Understood. But just asking generally.
NORTH: Well, look, you're talking to a guy who used to have to negotiate with Iranians for the lives of Americans. And I had to set a price. I mean, it's one of the most awful things you can experience besides ground combat, I suppose is worse. In the two years that we've been dealing with ISIS, this administration has been befuddled by what they need to do. And of course what we have to show for it now, ever since Obama's degrade and destroy strategy, is Putin is now there.
HANNITY: Yep.
NORTH: And ever since he arrived in Syria there's been more than 120,000 new refugees that have taken flight. It seems to me that the appointing of "Fighting" Joe Dunford as chairman of the joint chiefs of staff is already having some positive effect. Now what they really ought to do is dispatch a carrier strike group and a marine air to ground task force to the Mediterranean and tell Vladimir Putin to get the hell out of the way.
HANNITY: I don't think they'll do it. But I think you're right. Colonel, always good to see you. Thank you, sir.
NORTH: Sean.
HANNITY: And coming up next tonight right here on "Hannity."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERRY: I stand and I march with Hillary. I believe in her future, her vision. I believe in her policies. I believe in equal rights for men, women.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Why do I suspect she probably doesn't know any of Hillary's policies? Anyway, she got a ringing endorsement, Hillary did, from Hollywood a-lister Katy Perry this past weekend. But do voters care when liberal celebrities support a candidate? We'll debate that next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PERRY: I stand and I march with Hillary. I believe in her future, her vision. I believe in her policies. I believe in equal rights for men, women, pay.
(APPLAUSE)
PERRY: Oh, AND guess what? If you do want to start a family, you can still get paid while you have them. And maybe you should want to go to college but you can't afford it. Well, we're going to work that out, OK?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: Free college, free leave, free everything, free, free, free. Hollywood a-lister, singer Katy Perry announcing she's supporting Hillary Clinton for president. But when it comes to a presidential election, do you, the American people, really care what these Hollywood elites support? Joining us now with reaction, senior editor of "In Touch" weekly Kim Serafin and "Red Eye" co-host Joanne Nosuchinsky is with us. All right, so everything is free. Isn't that great?
JOANNE NOSUCHINSKY, "RED EYE" CO-HOST: Yes.
HANNITY: Free college, free health care, free child care, free family leave.
NORTH: Yes. Awesome. Can't wait. And apparently Katy Perry is going to help us get it. She kept saying "we," you know, like she's now a part of Clinton's camp, which is I guess great. As far as the American public really wants to see these celebrity endorsements, I don't think so because now we have celebrities running for office. Donald Trump himself is doing so well because everyone sees him as a big --
HANNITY: But he's not offering everything for free.
Kim, does this really matter? Do you think she has any influence over people?
KIM SERAFIN, "IN TOUCH WEEKLY" SENIOR EDITOR: I don't think celebrities sway somebody's vote either way. I don't think somebody is going to say somebody's supporting -- and I think this goes for either side. I don't think celebrities supporting a Republican or a Democrat it changes your vote. And by the way, Katy Perry was very positive. Her parents are Republicans, I should mention.
HANNITY: I did read that.
SERAFIN: So she's not going to go out and say nasty things about Republicans. Her parents are Republicans. They came to the White House with her when she did a Special Olympics ceremony.
HANNITY: Here's the question. "Washington Free Beacon" last week had an article that Hillary at the State Department paid men $16,000 more a year than women. Little problem.
SERAFIN: Again, I think people look at celebrities and it gets some attention. Katy Perry, yes, she came out and she made some comment, but she performed. And that is what you want. If you're a candidate on the right or left, you want someone to perform and entertain the crowd. And it gets attention. That's really the point. It gets people tweeting about it, posting on Instagram, people who maybe are not paying attention to FOX News or what's in the "New York Times."
HANNITY: That's impossible.
SERAFIN: Well, right. The few, few people. But if they're not reading political coverage they still knew about Hillary probably because they heard about Katy Perry's performance.
HANNITY: There is a little trick I do on my radio show. I'll ask somebody that loves Hillary. She's been in the public eye decades. Name three things that she's accomplished to make the American people's lives better. And I play the jeopardy theme. Nobody can answer. And the longer they talk, the funnier it gets, because nobody can name a specific thing.
NOSUCHINSKY: Have you read her book? Because apparently it's all in there. She sent it to every Republican candidate saying you can't saying anything nice about me, here's my book. But if you have to sell your book in order to get me to like you, that is not a good record.
HANNITY: She lied about Benghazi. She was writing her daughter, the Libyan president, the Egyptian prime minister, it's not about a YouTube video. And then she's telling us it was about a YouTube video. My kids get in trouble not for the dumb things they do, which they never do, of course, but when lying about it after. Why would America support someone they don't trust?
SERAFIN: Well, here's the thing. Going back to that thing that you said you do on your radio show, it's entertainment. And I think you have to do that in politics. That's why you're seeing Donald Trump.
NOSUCHINSKY: It's not about entertainment. If you lie, you need to own up to it.
SERAFIN: But I'm talking more about the celebrities endorsing. And you have to bring a little entertainment to politics. And I think that is the whole point of it.
HANNITY: Trump is entertainment.
SERAFIN: Ted Cruz said he would love to host "SNL."
NOSUCHINSKY: Katy Perry needs to be careful, though, and other celebrities because as these candidates become more polarizing, which I think Hillary really has become over the last few years -- a lot of my friends who are Democrats are going to Bernie Sanders now. They don't even want Hillary anymore.
SERAFIN: There are no celebrities --
NOSUCHINSKY: Because I think you're also seeing a shift because of maybe Donald Trump and the celebrity that he brings because he is such a celebrity, you're seeing all these Republican candidates go on late night talk shows. I've never seen this many Republicans --
HANNITY: Clinton played the sax on "Arsenio."
NOSUCHINSKY: OK, but Republican primary candidates? You have Carly Fiorina singing about her dogs on Jimmy Fallon? And I think you have to do this because you do have to reach out to this audience. Before it had been we don't want to reach out. I think we do need to, and I think it's great you're seeing Republicans candidates on late night talk shows.
HANNITY: Good to see you.
NOSUCHINSKY: Thanks, Sean.
HANNITY: I see you reaching out to the younger generation.
(LAUGHTER)
HANNITY: Exactly, something like that.
Al., when we come back, our "Ask Sean" segment is coming up next. We have a very important "Question of the Day." It has to do with the debate on Wednesday. That's straight ahead. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HANNITY: Time for the "Question of the Day." So Wednesday is the big debate. Who do you want and who do you think will win the debate? Just go to Facebook.com/SeanHannity, @SeanHannity on Twitter and let us know what you think.
Time for our "Ask Sean" segment. You've been sending in questions via Facebook and Twitter, things you would like me to answer. I've not seen it ahead of time. Here is tonight's question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Sean, this is Frank in New Jersey. Based on what we know about Hillary today, is she any closer to being disqualified from the presidency? That is my question.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HANNITY: I think we learned last week, and by the way, Frank, thank you. I think we learned that she lied when she was writing Chelsea and talking to the president of Libya, the prime minister of Egypt. She didn't tell the truth. She was telling them one story. It wasn't related to the YouTube video in the case of the Egyptian prime minister. And of course it was terror related. She was telling us it was about this video. She knew otherwise.
Now, does that disqualify her? That is going to be up to the American voter. I think she does have issues over the e-mails deleted, what, 32,000 of them. And if they're not about a wedding, a funeral, and about yoga, she might have some trouble, especially if they're about Benghazi or about the Clinton Foundation or if they had classified material. So time will tell. We have a long way to go.
If you have a question, just go to Twitter and use the #AskSean. And even better send in a video like Frank and we might just put you on TV.
That is all the time we have left this evening. We hope you'll set your DVR so you never miss an episode. We take attendance and it hurts our feelings if you're not here. See you back here tomorrow night.
Content and Programming Copyright 2015 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2015 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.
Get all the stories you need-to-know from the most powerful name in news delivered first thing every morning to your inbox