US paying price for not arming Syrian rebels, leaving Iraq?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," September 22, 2014. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone, I'm Dana Perino, along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Bob Beckel, Eric Bolling and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City, and this is "The Five."

President Obama heads to the U.N. tomorrow where he will continue trying to build a coalition to battle ISIS. Other nations are reportedly on board to launch air strikes with us in Syria. Would we have gotten to this point if we had armed the rebels in the country sooner? Former Defense Secretary and CIA Director Leon Panetta says he and others urged the president to do so back in 2012. He was on "60 Minutes" last night.


LEON PANETTA, CIA DIRECTOR: If we started providing weapons, we didn't know where those weapons would wind up. My view was you have to begin somewhere. I think in part we paid a price for not doing that in what we see happening with ISIS.


PERINO: Panetta also told 60 Minutes, he thinks we left Iraq too soon.


PANETTA: I really thought that it was important for us to maintain a presence in Iraq. The decision was that we ought to at least try to maintain 8,000 to 10,000 U.S. troops there, plus keeping some of our intelligence personnel in place to be able to continue the momentum in the right direction. And frankly, having those troops there I think would have given us greater leverage on Maliki, to try to force him to do the right thing as well.


PERINO: Leon Panetta was on 60 Minutes and he has a new book out, Greg, and it's called Worthy Fights which is why he was on 60 Minutes to promote that. I saw this as a distancing of Hillary Clinton from Barack Obama's foreign policy. Because Panetta, former Secretary of State Gate -- Defense Gate General Petraeus, they all said that they had the same advice including Panetta that Obama should armed the rebels and they shouldn't have left Iraq so soon. So I saw this as more of a political move in a way to sell a book.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: I think Panetta is Hillary's corner cut man, when she says I need a pants suit, he says how high. ISIS now sadly to me is becoming another political variable that is being manipulated to win an election much like Benghazi. We should be thinking about -- do this administration and whoever selling a book should be thinking about the people and not the politics and can't we all get together to get these bozos to eliminate this threat once and for all. Maybe they have been pretended that ISIS were Fox News, they might actually go after them. But the problem is, it's the reoccurring variable that shows up in all of these stories, politics, politics, politics. This is a war against evil and we're talking about the political nature of it to win an election.

PERINO: I didn't like that either. And I wanted to get your take, Eric, about -- in the 60 Minutes piece, they showed the photograph of those four senior advisers that I mentioned. And President Obama declined all of their advice. Their advice was collective, he decided not to take it, which is his -- he can do that. But all of them have less government since then. I mean, basically, if you're going to have advisors that you don't listen to, they probably won't stay around.

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: Where was Leon Panetta then? Why are we hearing about this now? Does he need the glasses? He's (inaudible) is 20- 20. Or is he just trying to sell books? You what, Dana, maybe there's the politics of let's separate, let's bifurcate Obama from Hillary Clinton and then let's make sure that Obama's strategy was wrong, and we'll go on this camp over here that will probably be a little bit more hawkish and get (inaudible). But you know, I'm no fan of the Obama foreign policy or the Obama administration period about anything about anything they're doing with the economy, what they're doing just about anywhere. But I don't think this is kind of an unfair shot at the Obamas.


PERINO: That's interesting, though, because I think what you're saying, when you write a book that's a memoir, that while you have the president that you work for still in office, I think that's what you're saying, Kimberly, is that it's just -- maybe you can wait two years before you try to, you know, basically say that the president made the wrong decision?

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Um no, the world can't wait. ISIS isn't waiting.

PERINO: I think that's also true.

GUILFOYLE: I hear what you're saying and I'm all for diplomacy, I'm for loyalty. I don't like rats in general. But here I feel that he is saying what he truly believes in. Sure, there may be a mixed motive, where he wants to sell books or maybe he's channeling Hillary Clinton. All I'm about is doing the right thing here, so I'll give credit to whoever's saying it, to be on point, to make the decision, to call it out, because now is the time for leadership, and not mincing words. I respect Leon Panetta. So when I hear him say something like this, that's speak phrase.


BOLLING: If he -- why didn't he say it when he was secretary, why now?


PERINO: Because they were working directly for the president and I think, Bob, maybe you can give us some insight into this, because on the democratic side, I think what they're trying -- that Leon Panetta was very respectful, I think that he is considered as a public servant that's given a lot back to America. But he's also quite a Hillary Clinton kind of guy. I mean he was chief of staff there. He's been with them for about 25 years.

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: Yeah. Well, first of all, I was on Leon's first campaign for the house after he split from the Republican Party and the Democratic Party and I have a lot of respect for him. But you and I both know after being in the White House, if all these people were so enamored with the idea of giving these (inaudible), put pressure on the president before he makes the decision. That's number one.

PERINO: That was in the press at the time.

BECKEL: Well, but not Leon. It doesn't seem Leon.

PERINO: It was all quiet behind the scenes, and I think they were trying to be respectful of the president, but also like, let it out be out there in the news.


BECKEL: You and I both know there's other ways to do that if you want to do it. But in any event, Leon is trying to sell some books, I understand that. I think he -- Eric is right, I think he want to say something. He should have said something the day he got out.

PERINO: Well, people said that about Secretary Gates, too, when his book came out.

BOLLING: Well, Bob, is being very consistent.

GUILFOYLE: But what is he supposed to do, not say it ever then, because he didn't say it then?

BOLLING: No. When gates book came out, he was critical of some of the Obama's policies. Bobie, you're very consistent when you said, look, he should have said it then, she should have stood up and say it then or at least wait until Obama was out of office. I remember you saying that, and you're being consistent here and I would agree with that. I would prefer a secretary of defense, of state, all of them to stand up and stay they have a problem with the administration.

PERINO: To resign, like why didn't they resign on principle?


BECKEL: Let's also not forget the fact here. The facts are that there was no clarity about where these weapons were going to end up. I mean, there was a big debate about that. And so...

PERINO: But now President Obama is actually doing what he said he -- and so how much time was lost in the intervening time?

BECKEL: But ISIS was not yet formed in the way it is now.

PERINO: But it was forming and I think the experts had the foresight and President Obama ignored them.

BECKEL: Well, the -- four of them did and a lot of others in the room did not.

PERINO: Well, I don't who were the, a lot of others? It doesn't matter. We're going to move on to another thing on Fox News Sunday yesterday, look, Brit Hume and Joe Lieberman.


BRIT HUME, POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: The United States is indisputably uniquely capable of conquering ISIS, but he's not putting the full effort into that at all, which is why I think the majority who doubt the efficacy of the strategy do so, they can see that this isn't a full hearted effort.

JOE LIEBERMAN, FORMER U.S. SENATOR: I thought that the president's speech to the nation about a week and a half ago was going to turn that around. And I'm afraid it didn't, because there were too many of what you talked about before, not just what we're going to do to protect you, Mr. and Mrs. America, but here's what we're not going to do. And I don't think that was particularly reassuring to the American people and it was reassuring to our enemies.


PERINO: Greg, Senator Lieberman was on yesterday because there -- he's part of a new effort called the counter extremism project which is going to be a private organization that basically, lets companies know who the bad guys are, what Brit Hume is saying, is that President Obama's -- that his heart is not in it, and it wasn't affective and then Joe Lieberman says it as well. I think not a banner weekend.

GUTFELD: I mean, this is -- this is not President Obama's passion. We have talked about it before. Obama wanted to fight against rising tides, not rising terror. His real anger stems from the frustration because he can't - - he would rather save the Earth than save America. Not saying he's against America, but he is so obsessed with being president of the planet. In this equation, President Obama's like superman and kryptonite is global warming, but America is Lex Luthor, we're always the bad guy in these equations, so it's hard for him to recalibrate the way he thinks and go, oh, wait a second, I'm the president of the United States, they're not the bad guy.

BECKEL: I have to say, we don't know all that's going on, nor do we know what might happen in October, which is absolutely...

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

GUTFELD: Your October surprise, Bob?

BECKEL: No. I mean, I'm just saying that...

GUTFELD: Is that a euphemism for something that happens in the bedroom.

BECKEL: There's a very real possibility that the president may do some things that may surprise a lot of people and do them right.


PERINO: Why wait until October, if there's something that can protect Americans now, why wait until October?

BECKEL: Because they don't have the pieces in place to do what...


PERINO: Why don't they have the pieces in place?

BECKEL: I don't know. These are questions you should go into the press corps and ask.

PERINO: Well, I'm asking them here. Kimberly, I want to ask you something.

Sure. PERINO: Earlier today John Kerry said that everyone agrees that their plan will work. But actually, I think everyone is saying, experts, not just me, but the people that are in the military, the State Department, diplomats, Intel, is saying that their plan is woefully insufficient.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. I don't know, I think he says, he feels that if he says it enough, people are gonna believe that it's the whole perception is reality, I think if he can kind of craft the public message, he can con us into thinking it's OK. It's obviously not good enough. It's never going to be good enough until ISIS is destroyed.

BECKEL: Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: You have to keep reinventing -- almost done, Bob.

BECKEL: I'm sorry.

GUILFOYLE: Keep reinventing and continue to strategize for your one objective and move on target, to destroy ISIS. That's why I don't understand. I agree with Brit Hume, we have the capability. We can do it right now. What is the hesitation? And I don't want to hear about this October surprise nonsense, because if they have something ready to go. Do it.


PERINO: Why would you call it an October surprise? Why won't you use natural security...

BECKEL: Wait a second, first of all, there are thousands of people involved in this. You're taking the words of people who are in position of power, all got out of positions of power, some to say. I think most of them are covering their butts or selling their books. But you can't just say everybody in the administration, everybody in international security intelligence believes that this is the wrong strategy, that it's not true.

GUILFOYLE: I think the generals do.

BECKEL: What generals? How many have you seen? How many of them?


GUILOFOYLE: The majority of them that are still active, and that are in fact...

BECKEL: I don't think this is going any at all.

BOLLING: How about chairman and the joint chiefs?

PERINO: Yeah, how about that?

BOLLING: That's a big one.

BECKEL: He said he agreed with the strategy until -- unless it contain.

GUTFELD: I figured out the October surprise.

GUILFOYLE: What is it?

GUTFELD: Valerie Jarrett and President Obama are the same person.

GUILFOYLE: I knew it.

GUTFELD: You've never seen them together, have you, Bob?

PERINO: Eric, you had to point on this, and then I wanna -- one more.

BOLLING: Very, very quickly, 60 minutes is about the oil?


BOLLING: Sixty minutes last night, they did a great job, they took apart what's really going on with ISIS. The king of Jordan and a Turkish high level Intel advisor, I'm talking about the oil revenues that they're making. They're also making revenues from electricity, they're going to sell electricity back to the people and back to the Syrian government, and they're also getting international donation. They can't do anything about international donations, they'll still come in. However, there's something you can do about the oil.

While I'm watching this, I realize what you could do -- now listen, oil comes out of the ground if you -- it comes out in certain areas, you can literally blow up these installations, blow up the oil installation where they pull it out of the ground and where they refine it. You're not doing anything to the oil -- hold on. You're not doing anything to the oil, it will still be there for the Iraqi people or the Syrian people or the Turkish people. Just stop ISIS from the ability to get it out of the ground and selling it on the black market.

BECKEL: Or that ruling infrastructure, take it back.

BOLLING: What's that?

BECKEL: Take it back. Take the wells back and take the electric back.

BOLLING: That's would be great, but wait...

PERINO: That's what Donald Trump wants to do.

BOLLING: Yeah. Take the -- barring being able to take it back, blow them up.

GUTFELD: But think of the -- what that would do to the environment, Eric.

PERINO: I mean that is great. GUIFOYLE: Do you know what happened, they got to Westside yesterday?

PERINO: Actually, you guys are so good at this, and you help me out so much, because ahead, they march to save the planet, but is the planet grateful for what they left behind? We're gonna show you what the greenies did to the Big Apple over the weekend.

GUTFELD: What's a Big Apple?

BECKEL: You left the garbage...


BOLLING: Welcome back. The eco-terrorists descending upon Manhattan yesterday, three or four hundred thousand climate activist showed off and let the carbon footprint like nobody's businesses. By carbon footprint, I mean, big SUV's, private jets, and a whole lot of garbage. In fact, this earth loving priest (ph) trash the place resulting cleanup is gonna cost a ton, and guess who's gonna pick the tab, the tax payer. When asked about their hypocrisy, my Cashin' In panelist, good friend, Michelle Fields, here's what they told her, Lionel (ph), had to say for themselves.


MICHELLE FIELDS, POLITICAL JOURNALIST: What are you hoping to achieve?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want to create 100 percent clean energy and we need to make a transition in this country, we need to show leadership. And that's why we're here.

FIELDS: What do you say to critics, who say you go on yachts, you're traveling, and then here you are, trying to get climate change?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Trying to get a climate march. Sorry.

FIELDS: Mr. Vice President, what do you think about electricity rates going up over this, sir? What about your own, sir?



BOLLING: I think that one was Kerry (inaudible) right there. Let's bring it around. Greg, your thoughts on the climate change...

GUTFELD: It's almost too easy, they created more waste than a sumo wrestler on laxatives, and they came to our town and they trashed it and then they leave. But you know what? Here's the thing, and, Bob, you have to agree with me on this. Most of the original leaders in the environmental movement are gone, they'd left because it's gotten too radicalized, because it's not about climate, it's about capitalism. These people did not go and protest China, they went to Wall Street. So, why did they do that? Because it's about making money, it's about profits that they don't understand. Meanwhile, they claimed that they blocked Wall Street By blocking a street. They don't believe that markets are electronic. So, they're sitting in the street like a bunch of numb skulls.

BECKEL: I think you're point is pretty well taken. I see there has been a merger of anti-business and some environmentalists. But I will say this, the amount of money it will take to clean up the streets of New York, they went right past my apartment building yesterday, and I saw a few things on the streets. But the amount of money we're going to spend to clean up superfund sites is about a big -- I bet you heard a word about that.

PERINO: That's not about global warming, superfund sites.

BECKEL: Superfund sites are corporations. That's what I'm -- Greg raise corporations.

GUTFELD: No. My point is, if you saw the people there, they were communists, they were socialists. It had nothing to do with the environment. What this is, and it's using the environment as a tool to denigrate the world's greatest system.

BECKEL: You call them communists and you call them terrorists, right?

GUTFELD: No, no, no.

BOLLING: Eco-terrorist.

GUTFELD: I'm talking about the actually groups that they were proud communists. They were there, they marched.

BOLLING: There were a lot of groups there. By the way, Bob, we have talked about this in the past, the U.S. National Snow And Ice Data Center, which is co-funded by NASA says that the Arctic Ocean with 15 percent ice is now a 6.2 million square kilometers, that's up 43 percent in two years. By the way, Al Gore, predicted by now -- by there would be no artic ice.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, I hear you.

BOLLING: But my point is...

BECKEL: They're taking the shipping lanes -- well, OK. You have your facts, we have our facts. We don't agree. You believe that everything is fine and dandy and the world's gonna be just fine. We believe there's a catastrophe coming. They have never been able to take ships all the way across the northern hemisphere, they're doing it now. And the Russians and the United States are now arguing over who should get that seabed, and there's a lot of fact on both sides. So, it doesn't do any good to call them names or to call them, you know, eco-terrorists. That sound a (inaudible) who would care about go wrong (ph).

BOLLING: They trashed the place.

PERINO: I just want to hold on to that thought, that it's not fair to call people names, if we can, like, replay that in the future, it'll be great. On Saturday the Wall Street Journal in the review section, the headlining piece was climate science is not settled. It was written by somebody who, everybody I think agrees, is a smart, reasonable scientist. I spent my Saturday watching on that. He did work for President Obama. Also, last week it was proven that the U.S and the EU, the European Union, that China has now surpassed the combination of our emissions, OK? So, that's really where -- all these people protesting, they will have no hardship. When you all protested against Vietnam, there was hardship. You were talking about people's lives and going over to fight against the North Vietnamese. In the climate debate, these people -- there's no harm coming to these people, they have to sacrifice nothing. You saw they get into their SUVs, they leave. There's actually nothing tangible, unless they want to go to China and fight for people's right to breathe clean air, then I really think their energy would be better off talking about some sort of energy independence here in America, such as fracking would be just more about productive energy.


BECKEL: They did change China's way of doing government. I mean, there are people who did protest that, and Tiananmen Square was a good example of that.

BOLLING: Can I get this in here? I want to see bleeding card progressive, fail miserably in Global Warming, explaining Global Warming, it's not the peoples fault, it's the Koch Brothers fault, obviously.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One of the biggest (inaudible) that the press has fallen for, is that -- is by blaming individuals for their own choices. That's not the issue, you're letting these people, you're letting the Koch Brothers run our country, sovereign our democracy. That's what you all to be paying attention to, rather than asking trivial and inane questions about whether not -- what kind of car somebody drives or whether or not they use cell phones.


BOLLING: Well, chemical point...

GUTFELD: It's always good when you're around a Kennedy that you can see his hands.

BOLLING: Right, but two hands. KG, it's not people who cause global warming...

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: I already think about that.

BOLLING:'s two brothers.

GUILFOYLE: Right. I know, but that's always kind of the go to -- I mean, I like Bobby Jindal, I think he's a nice guy. I disagree with his politics, agree to disagree, but nevertheless, my issue yesterday was the hypocrisy, because there was such a mess. I have never seen in all the parades Bob, this kind of mess as there was yesterday.


GUILFOYLE: At least throw away your garbage, practice what you preach. No, the Puerto Ricans, the Irish, no, I'm so sorry, both sides of me will it make a mess like that.

BECKEL: Irish -- anyway...


BECKEL: We are not getting late, you can come back to that quick. Bobby Kennedy is a guy who's firmly committed to what he believes in. The guy on The Wall Street Journal was one scientist.


GUILFOYLE: Yeah, he does River keeper, the queen does the river.

BECKEL: One scientist and there are lots of other scientists who disagree with him. The Wall Street Journal of course, went with this guy.

PERINO: No, that's not -- you know what the review section is? The review section is not the editorial page.

BECKEL: I did -- if the review section of the Wall Street Journal, I was not proper progressive, with you?

PERINO: Bob, I'll get you a copy of the Saturday Wall Street Journal, the review section is the separate from the editorial page.

BECKEL: No, I say it's not progressive.

PERINO: It has the entire progressive that people have.

GUTFELD: It was written by an advisor who works for President Obama. It was what we're talking about.

BECKEL: It is close to what of other advice you would like to (inaudible)...

GUTFELD: Going back, there's nothing wrong with caring about the environment, this has been hijacked by a different group of people. This is why you see people from Greenpeace that are no longer involved in this, because this is about, going after western technology. We had 10 million iPhones sold, I'm sure half of those people have those iPhones. But that corporation isn't evil, because they're using that phone. They go after oil, but how do you think that stuff gets truck there.


BECKEL: Why are you all upset?

PERINO: Yeah, what about that Bob?

BOLLING: How do you explain and how do you discharge your iPhone?

BECKEL: I want to ask you a question, why are you all so upset about this situation? (ph) If you're so right, and you've got all the science on your side, then just don't say anything, and let us go on and let us be a bunch of communists.


GUIFOYLE: Because you don't -- can your energy anymore.

PERINO: Because your inane regulations on the American economy is actually --

BECKEL: Our inane regulations?

PERINO: Yes, it is hamstringing the ability of the economy to thrive, and what we could actually have money and profit that could be reinvested to find the energy that Leonardo DiCarpio invested.


BECKEL: A lot of those environments .

PERINO: Out of control now.

BOLLING: President Obama's own words, if you decide to build a coal firepower plant, we will necessarily bankrupt you.

GUTFELD: And this by the way, is murderous, Bob. If Leo DiCaprio took one of his chartered jets and filled it with coal, and took it to a third world country where they are dying, because they burning toxic fuel, they're burning their own thesis, I've met you this many times. When you give coal to countries like that, you save lives. Coal saves lives, but because they're unaware of that, willfully ignorant. They have no idea they're playing into their hands. So, basically anti .

BECKEL: What is in the coal if you sell it to them?

PERINO: Why don't they keep it here in America so, we can get the profits? Mine is there.


GUIFOYLE: Time to go.

PERINO: I like profit.

BOLLING: She pled the fifth before Congress, but Lois Lerner had plenty to say in her first interview to the press, about that little IRS scandal. Spoiler alert, she's not sorry for anything she did, and KG has the rest coming up.


GUIFOYLE: Lois Lerner refused to talk to congress about her role in the targeting of conservatives at the IRS.


LOIS LERNER, FORMER IRS DIRECTOR: I have decided to follow my council's advice and not testify or answer any of the questions today. I will not answer any questions or testify about the subject matter of this committee's meeting. I will decline to answer any question on the subject matter of this hearing. I respectfully exercise my Fifth Amendment right and decline to answer that question.


GUIFOYLE: The Lerner that just opened up to political in her first media interview. She maintains, she didn't do anything wrong. She says, she's proud of her career, did the best under the circumstances, and isn't sorry for anything. And what about those emails that was deliberately destroyed you out? Well, Lerner says, "How I would know two years ahead of time that would be important for me to destroy my email. And if I did know that, why wouldn't I have destroyed the other ones that they keep releasing?" That was her duh moment.

What do you make of this?

GUTFELD: Well, when she says she's done nothing wrong, she's being true to herself. Because targeting conservatives isn't wrong. conservatives are exempt from protections of abuse.

But when you're usually doing something wrong, you don't plead the fifth and you don't hide from the press. Judging by her behavior, if she had fled the country, then she really would have been innocent. It makes no sense.

GUILFOYLE: Right. OK, Bolling.

BOLLING: She should be in prison. She embodies the worst possible characteristics of a government employee, you know, servant of the people: arrogance, above-the-law mentality, "I can never do anything wrong."

Look, just -- you want to be transparent, be transparent. Cut a deal and let us know what's going on. But just hurry up and do it already. A lot of people waiting to hear what you have to say.

GUILFOYLE: Mr. Beckel, you said you do not understand her strategy?

BECKEL: I don't understand her strategy, but also she's entitled to a day in court before we put her in prison. If they indict her, right, they -- she'll complete her trial. Maybe she'll end in trial; maybe she won't.

What I don't understand is why did she wait this long to come out with these things. And why Politico? I suppose they thought Politico would ask easy questions. I don't know. Why not before the cameras? Obviously that doesn't -- that's not the best forum for this woman. And I think probably it's too little, too late. But I still would like to see her get before a court of law before we all draw judgments about her.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, but you know what? It's so sneaky, Dana, and under handed, because she is avoiding the law. She's avoiding the public forum, which she is supposed to represent, and instead goes to Politico.

I'm happy for them. But the point is, now she's talking, because she doesn't want to come forward and tell the public the truth, so it's a way of king of getting out there for herself in a wrong way to do it.

PERINO: I didn't do a photo of Jasper this morning on Twitter, because this is the first thing I saw this morning, and I was just so angry that I put that aside.

GUTFELD: Thank you, Lois Lerner.

PERINO: I would just like to say, if I were in her shoes, I would like to think I had Tom Grace, some dignity, some honor, some self-respect to realize that to give an interview to inside the beltway type publication, where you're thumbing your nose at the rest of America isn't credible.

She also says in interview that she expresses gratitude for her legal team's friendship. What about a little gratitude for all the taxpayers that funded her salary all those years and her pension? She can't get a job. She doesn't need a job. She retired with full benefits.

GUTFELD: But you know -- you know what?

BOLLING: A hundred grand, she's...

PERINO: Right. She retired with full benefits. The taxpayers paid for it.

GUILFOYLE: So she's hiding the secrets.

GUTFELD: But she should also be grateful to the media, who advocated their responsibility in service to their king. If the IRS had actually droned the Tea Party, the media would wonder if those missiles were...

PERINO: Also, she's the one -- she said that she did nothing wrong.


PERINO: She told Politico she did nothing wrong. Let's remember how we even found out about this to begin with. She's the one that planted the question, clumsily so, at a conference, to say, "Oh, I just want to say there was a regularity or did some problems -- there were some problems. She was the one who started this ball rolling by saying that she had done something wrong."

GUILFOYLE: I know, and now she's changing it. But who did the advance on this interview? Because I think they already knew it was going to be a softball, because they tried to portray her as some sympathetic, you know, figure, but she's a lawbreaker.

BECKEL: She is -- she is -- it was very clumsy, to say the least, but I would defy anybody what suggests that political appointees in administrations have not, in one way or another, worked to affect the outcome of the president's...

PERINO: The IRS, you are not supposed to. So why can't they be held to a higher -- why can't they be held to the same standard as everybody else? Because they're Obama appointees?

BECKEL: Because the same standards as everyone else are not the standards they're held to.

BOLLING: You know what's even worst, Mr. Beckel? Is that O'Reilly asked President Obama regarding this, if there's any other corruption, any evidence of corruption. He said not a smidgeon. How about you let us decide if there's any smidgeons?

I have a hunch there's going to be a little bit more than a smidgeon of corruption.

BECKEL: I don't know. There hasn't been anybody in the Obama administration, has there?


BECKEL: Has anybody been indicted in the Obama administration? I can't remember.

BOLLING: What took you...

BECKEL: I'm saying other administrations had people indicted. We have not.

BOLLING: If she'd tell us what's on those e-mails and who told her to do what, then maybe we would.

BECKEL: name me an administration that has not had an indictment in the last four or five of them. Obama has not, as far as...

GUTFELD: He doesn't have to worry about it. Who's chasing him? Every single scandal, stays...

PERINO: Right, but why would Eric Holder protect them from everything, including her? Like, where is the U.S. attorney? Why can't the U.S. attorney find her. If she can do an interview with Politico with several aides, OK? And then she suggests that also that she's a target of anti- Semitism.

BECKEL: That's fair enough. Tomorrow I'm going to bring in the total indictments per administration. We'll see.

PERINO: Why do they care? I don't understand. Anyway, that would be great. That would be great to do some research and find that out.

GUTFELD: That's a good point, because she said that people were calling her names, which is not -- not a good thing. But using a government agency to intimidate people who disagree with you, that's a deed...

PERINO: She called them all crazy.

GUTFELD: Yes, that's a deed.

PERINO: She called them all crazy. She said conservatives are crazy. It's all in the information.

GUTFELD: But she -- I mean, name calling is not as bad as action. There were people who were victims of her deeds. I know name calling is bad, but that's different than deeds.

GUILFOYLE: All right, fine. We've got to go. I mean, it's been fun, though.

There are a lot of football players making headlines these days for all kinds of bad reasons. You've heard about it, but we have a great story for you next. Stay tuned for one athlete's incredible post-game interview that's now going viral. Greg has it.


GUTFELD: According to the news, the scariest thing ever isn't ISIS or Ebola. It's the NFL. From their current scandals, the media concludes that football is a vicious sport and sports in general are bad, for they breed a competitive ilk that punishes the weak and rewards the brutish.

If only we had less activity and more activism, which is why I thank Appolos Hester for reminding us why sport rules. Hester, who plays in East View High School Patriots in Georgetown, Texas was asked by a reporter how his team came back from behind.

Well, at first, I bet they started slow, they started real slow, and you know, that's all right, that's OK, because sometimes in life, you're going to start slow.


APPOLOS HESTER, HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL PLAYER: Well, at first we started slow, we started real slow, and you know, that's all right, that's OK, because sometimes in life, you're going to start slow. That's OK. We told ourselves, hey, we're going to start slow. We're going to keep going fast. We're going to start slow, but we're always, always going to finish fast. No matter what the score was, we're going to finish hard; we're going to finish fast.

Yes, they had us the first half. I'm not going to lie. They had us. We weren't defeated, but they had us. But it took guts; it took an attitude. That's all it takes. That's all it takes to be successful is an attitude. And that's what our coach told us. He said -- he said, "Hey, it's going to be tough. It's going to be hard. You're going to go out there. You're going to battle. You're going to fight. You're going to do it for one -- you're going to do it for one another. Do it for each other. You're going to do it for yourself, and you're going to do it for us, and you're going to go out with this win."

And we believed that. We truly did. And it's an awesome feeling. It's an awesome feeling when you truly believe that you're going to be successful, regardless of the situation, regardless of the scoreboard, you're going to be successful because you put in all the time, all the effort, all the hard work, and you know that it's going to pay off. And if it doesn't pay off, you continue to give God the glory. If you still lose the game, you continue to get yourselves back, and that's what we realized. Win or lose, we realized that it's going to be all right, and it's going to be OK. We're going to keep smiling. It was awesome, awesome.


GUTFELD: It is awesome. But it's not over, as reporter Lauren Mickler finds.


LAUREN MICKLER, REPORTER: We met earlier this week, and this was the enthusiasm I saw.

HESTER: Yes, ma'am. You can do anything you put your mind to, so never give up on your dreams. Keep smiling, no matter what you're going through. If you fall down, just get up. If you can't get up, your friends are there to help you. Your mama's there, your daddy's there. God's there. And I'm there to help you all. You're there. It's going to be all right.


GUTFELD: Can he have his own show, please? That speech was great, because it nails the beauty of competition, a reminder that many have forfeited winning for whining.

What you heard is real truth, the kind that existed before modern culture denigrated grit in favor of grievance. There is no "I" in "team," but these days, we know there are three and divisive.

Appolos's speech was not some trite teamwork baloney but an expression of the joy one gets from seeing results from hard work, discipline and a plan. Imagine if you could put that feeling in a pill, but you can't and that's the point.

That was - Kimberly, that was the greatest sports speech ever?

GUILFOYLE: I love his enthusiasm. And he plays sports, high on life. He's a young guy who's really excited about playing for the team. He's enthusiastic. I mean, it's very charming. Don't you think? It's very cute. I would love to see him in the NFL.

GUTFELD: Bob -- I don't think, Bob, this guy is going to have a single problem in life that he can't solve.

BECKEL: I think that's right. I do think he's been fired by Donald Trump.

GUTFELD: It's true.

BECKEL: He's a great inspiration, and I'll tell you. I played football for a lot of years. I've never heard all of us collectively say something like this.

GUTFELD: Exactly. Exactly, he just took everything and put it together.

Eric, this is what sports needs. I mean, you don't see enough of this.

BOLLING: I've got to tell you, if ESPN were smart, they'd start following him, not because of his sporting agility, because of what he -- the way he can put down a rant like that. And you know who else? Joel Osteen, that guy -- that guy's not a minister. No this -- what?

BECKEL: Sorry. I just...

BOLLING: He's inspirational, Bob.

BECKEL: Joel Osteen?

BOLLING: Yes, he is and so is this kid, Mr. Apollos, because he gave glory to God. Boy, this kid is -- look, I have a 16-year-old son. I hope he listens to everything he just -- this kid just said.

GUTFELD: I was like the little kid that ran out of the corner there and went "Aaaa!" I'm a relentlessly negative person.

PERINO: I'm actually surprised that you liked it. I mean, I loved it, but I'm surprised you liked it.

GUTFELD: Because the message wasn't about be happy or feel good. It was about work hard, and something good happens. So that, as a negative person, I like. I don't like, "Oh, you should just feel good."

BECKEL: Don't forget, he said if you fall down, there's a lot of people around to pick you up.

GUTFELD: That's true. That's a good point.

PERINO: I wish -- I just hope that our producer, Porter, is taking notes so that in the green room, we can have up -- you know up talks?


PERINO: That is something exciting. Rather than trying to beat us down all the time.

BECKEL: Want a Diet Coke?

PERINO: A Diet Coke would be great, too, as a matter of fact. I have so much enthusiasm, if we had Diet Cokes.

GUTFELD: The message from this uplifting speech is demand more soda in the green room.

PERINO: Or something like that.

GUILFOYLE: ... yourself. Be proud and positive.

PERINO: He's going to be awesome.

GUTFELD: Yes, he is. He's going to be -- when I'm out, he should be sitting where I am.

PERINO: That would be fine.

BECKEL: That would leave too much optimism at the table.

GUTFELD: That's true. All right. Ahead on "The Five," are women moodier than men? Or is it the other way around? We debate the science of the sexes, coming up.


BECKEL: Now here's a story that should make for interesting discussion, which I wish I didn't have to do. A new survey just determined that the average woman spends about ten days a year -- a year? -- in a bad mood for all kinds of reasons, something that strikes fear in the hearts of men around the globe, including me. But I think ten days is terribly underestimated. Dana, I...

GUILFOYLE: You said it was 100 in the green room.

BECKEL: I thought it was -- I thought it was ten days every ten days. But go ahead.

PERINO: It's unusual to be in a bad mood for the entire day. But I do agree that my husband worries about me getting in a bad mood.

BECKEL: I bet.

PERINO: And it happened on a Friday night. We were coming back from a Friday, and in the car, at the last minute, after a nice evening, Peter said, "Oh, by the way, I might be in the New York Post tomorrow."

I said, "Why?"

Well, in the morning, this was the picture that was in the New York Post.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

PERINO: There's the cyclist that ran into the woman that left her brain dead. The next day the cops were there to give tickets. Well, that cyclist on the right, he almost hit Jasper, America's dog, there in the middle. That's my husband scolding him, and the cop actually came over and gave the cyclist a ticket.

But Peter refused to give his name to the paper, because he knew I'd be, like, not happy that he was...

GUTFELD: So you put it on TV.

PERINO: Now -- but then everybody loved it, including Tucker Carlson called to give him props. And Kimberly...

GUILFOYLE: I think it's amazing. I find it very attractive.

PERINO: That wouldn't put you in a bad mood?

GUILFOYLE: No. I would put me in the best mood, because then I would know I was married to a real man, because he's not afraid to stand up for things.

Let me tell you: these cyclists are reckless. They almost run into children, small animals, me.

BECKEL: That's not the subject. That's not the subject.


BECKEL: That's not the subject. The subject is one about your mood. Did your husband say...

GUILFOYLE: I was saying that kind of thing excites me.

BECKEL: It does. OK. What gets you in a bad mood?

GUILFOYLE: Laziness.

BECKEL: Not being interpreted as what?

GUILFOYLE: Not being proactive.

BECKEL: Nothing proactive and laziness?

GUILFOYLE: I like somebody who's on the top. Like, get to it. Don't ask me what you already know needs to get done.

BECKEL: OK, that adds to it, too. OK. All right. Lazy. Get to it. OK. You could draw a lot of conclusions about what would make you moody about that.

Eric, have you been subjected to bad moods by your...

BOLLING: Bob, I think that number's way overstated. It's probably a lot less than 10 days.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God. That's hilarious.

BOLLING: So I did the math. And it comes to, if you consider every hour, it comes to 1.6 minutes per hour. But if you encompass sleeping, it comes to about three minutes per hour that women are in a bad mood.

PERINO: A day?

BOLLING: Every single hour. Three minutes every hour.

PERINO: Three minutes an hour per day?

BECKEL: Yes. Greg, you -- you're married to someone who is not originally from the United States.


BECKEL: Do you find any difference in moods from, say, her...

GUTFELD: Yes. There are cultural differences.

But I don't blame women for being in bad moods, because their role is to maintain civilization. They're the most important sex on the planet.

GUILFOYLE: You know it.

GUTFELD: We're only there as men -- we're only there to help. And you don't need a lot of us. You don't need a lot of us to help, which is why a lot of us are so lazy in our layabouts, which tick women off?

PERINO: Correct.

GUTFELD: So women have a right to be angry because there's just so many doofuses.

PERINO: Oh, you're right!

BECKEL: If they were -- if women were in more bad moods than that, think of how many fewer children there would be.

BOLLING: Do we know how many days men in bad moods?

GUILFOYLE: I don't know, but do we know how many...

GUTFELD: Our entire life is a bad mood.

GUILFOYLE: ... days Bolling's biorhythms are off? Woo! Let me tell you.

BECKEL: Bolling -- Bolling has yet to submit debate about anything that was any way...

BOLLING: How many days a year are men in bad moods?

GUILFOYLE: Bolling, you get in a bad mood.

BOLLING: Thirty-seven percent because -- 37 percent because being overweight. Here's the reasons, 37 percent is being overweight. Thirty- one percent, partner not listening. Feeling under the weather.

BECKEL: Who's that? That would put women in a bad mood? Well, that's probably why my wife is in a bad mood.

GUILFOYLE: Bolling, because like, not enough FOX News hours, that was he was angry that day. Not tan enough.

BECKEL: Just before we leave, could you go -- could you go through the three things you said were the ones that got you in a bad mood?

GUILFOYLE: No, because you want to make fun of me?

BECKEL: I don't. I just want to say that it's...

GUILFOYLE: I said not getting on it.

BECKEL: Not getting on it. That's what I though. OK, "One More Thing" is up next.


PERINO: It's time now for "One More Thing." Take a look at this. This happened at the Texas A&M/SMU game this weekend. See this football player there, Ryan Krieder, who is the person protecting the mascot there. See the dog there? It's Reveille. That is the Texas A&M mascot dog. He just stepped right in there to prevent him from being hurt, and the core of the cadets commandant, he is going to buy the boots for him, which are like worth $1,600. So a good deed goes rewarded, which is really nice to see. Right, K.G.?

GUILFOYLE: Yes, your good deed.

All right, so, you know it's not the royals, but it's kind of. It's "Friends." "Friends," yes, turns 20. The 20 most memorable quotes from the series you can see on there.

PERINO: Read them?

GUILFOYLE: We're not going to do that. This little interpretive dance after. How many of you here watched "Friends"?

PERINO: Oh, definitely.

GUILFOYLE: We have a little picture of it. People in the control room?

BECKEL: "Friends"?

GUTFELD: They're all dead.

PERINO: My sister love sit. She still watches it today. She loves it.

GUILFOYLE: Very cool.

PERINO: OK, Greg, you get to go next.

BECKEL: They're all good.

GUTFELD: It's time for...


GUTFELD: Greg's Crime Corner.


GUTFELD: All right, this is an amazing thing that's going on around the world right now. Take a look at this. There are groups of kidnappers going around, surrounded by big white circles. And what they're doing is, they're kidnapping cows. They take the cows. They're putting them in the back seat of their car.

PERINO: That is not cool.

GUTFELD: No, it's not cool at all. This is happening everywhere. This -- right now, this happened in downtown Manhattan, just last night. It may look like Russia, but it isn't. That is in New York. And they're driving away.

By the way, ironically, you can't find the faces of the cows on milk cartons.

PERINO: That's so weird.

GUTFELD: I know. They should, they should. So if you see a cow in a car and it's moving fast, or mooving, don't handle it yourself.

PERINO: OK. Very helpful, Greg. Thank you.

Eric, you're next.

BOLLING: OK. So Charlo Green, a CBS affiliate in Alaska, or a reporter for a CBS affiliate in Alaska, knows how to quit her job. Watch.


CHARLO GREEN, FORMER REPORTER, CBS AFFILIATE: And as for this job, well, not that I have a choice, but (EXPLETIVE DELETED).


BOLLING: She just quit. She just quit right there.

PERINO: We don't get to hear the back story?

BOLLING: Yes, but the problem is, they go back to the desk, and then there's this whole awkward moment with the anchor at the desk. Anyway...

GUTFELD: What did she say, by the way? I'm kidding.

BECKEL: Yes, right.

PERINO: She and Bob have something in common. Bob, you're last. Go ahead.

BECKEL: I want to give a shout=out to my old buddy, Donald Trump, who's you know, like a political extraordinaire. Donald sent out a tweet in support for Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. Can we put up the tweet?

What the Donald said was "Why would the people of Kentucky want a rookie senator? They have Senator Mitch McConnell, who may be the next speaker and bring dollars to Kentucky."

Donald, just for the future, let me tell you that Mitch McConnell will not be speaker. He would be majority leader. Speakers do not come from...

PERINO: All right. You can watch "The Five" live from your computer, smart phone or tablet. Go to FOXNews.go -- I'm sorry, dotcom --

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