Trump critics extend attacks to president's supporters

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This is a rush transcript from "The Five," August 16, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, and Greg Gutfeld. It's 9 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

We begin tonight with the continuing fallout to President Trump's reaction to the white nationalist violence in Charlottesville, Virginia, over the weekend. In an emotional moment, the mother of the woman who was allegedly killed by a man sympathetic to white supremacist causes spoke out today.


SUSAN BRO, MOTHER OF CHARLOTTESVILLE VICTIM: They tried to kill my child to shut her up. Well, guess what, you just magnified her.


Say to yourself, what can I do to make a difference and that's how you're going to make my child's death worthwhile. I'd rather have my child but by golly, if I have to give her up, we're going to make it count.


PERINO: Well, President Trump guess today, blame, quote, "both sides for the violence in Charlottesville leading several high-profile CEOs to resign from two key White House advisory councils." The President responded on Twitter by saying, he was terminating the councils instead of, quote, putting pressure on CEOs.

The left isn't just attacking President Trump about Charlottesville, they're actually going after his supporters.


MOORE: They'll support the racist, you are the racists. That has to end. Sorry, I'm not letting anybody off the hook here. Anybody who enables, anybody who votes for and supports a racist is a racist. You are culpable, white America, I'm sorry. But there is redemption for you.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to speak for those of you voted for Donald Trump, every day there's something nuts. But you've been trying to ignore it because you don't want to admit to these smug annoying liberals that they were right. That's the last thing you want to do but the truth is, deep down inside you know you made a mistake. You know you picked the wrong guy.


PERINO: But it's not just the left that's being critical, the Republican Jewish coalition which has stood with Mr. Trump during past controversies released a statement calling on the President to, quote, "Provide greater moral clarity in rejecting racism, bigotry, and anti-Semitism," end quote. The Republican Party is saying it wants nothing to do with white supremacist.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We have no place in our party at all for KKK, anti- Semitism, racism, bigotry. It has no place in the Republican Party, there is no home here. We don't want your vote, we don't want support you, we will speak out against you.


PERINO: So, Greg, I love what Ronna Romney said right there because I feel like that's what President Trump could have said. If we don't need you -- if the truth is that there is such a small part of society, they can be ridiculed and they don't actually need them for their vote.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Yes. No, it's a good message unlike Michael Moore's message which is not a message but a threat. What he's basically saying, if you don't agree with me on this particular issue, we will ruin you. Because there's no faster way to ruin somebody than by calling them a racist. And he is smearing 60 million people. And a lot of people that are like him believe or not.

Because I think he was one of the people predicted that Donald Trump would win and he was sympathetic to those people. I think he is finding a lot of energy and mileage out of this. But you aren't going to win in the hearts and minds by calling people racists. And especially if that person who you are attacking doesn't think they are racist. So, you should actually -- if you really feel that way, you should ask them how they feel instead of simply smearing them.

Ask them if they are racist. And if they say, no, they aren't, then go well I think you are instead -- and then have the conversation. But just to smear people, and this will never happen. I'm just saying that this is how it would happen in an actual dialogue. But when you start from this point of smearing people, you are eliminating debate and you are increasing the likelihood of violence.

Michael Moore increases the likelihood of violence by smearing people because he's saying, I can't have a conversation.

PERINO: There's additional follow-up today, Kimberly, just across the country where there are confederate statues. So, overnight, Baltimore took theirs down and then in Virginia today, the Democratic candidate for governor said, I think the confederate monuments in Richmond should be taken down, therefore forcing the issue in the upcoming election down there. With the candidate Ed Gillespie saying, well, let's let local communities decide. But this is, I can respect that idea but this is definitely a national debate.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: It's absolutely and it's really escalated and it's really become, you know, a political domino in terms of the effect of what's happened, what's transpired. People dismayed and disappointed, and feeling that the President needs to speak immediately with a moral clarity on this issue. He made a great statement 48 hours later but then now it's escalated into, you know, a further national upset, and people are really deeply hurt and offended by it.

And, you know, that makes me feel bad, it's very sad to see. Because, you know, we are better than this as a country, we've come so far, we would love to celebrate all the things we have in common and the values that we stand for as a country, welcoming so many from all different walks of life and all different religions and nationalities. And that's the place that we fought very hard to be and that's the place that we should be proud of today. So, I hope that we can move forward.

PERINO: I'm not sure, Jesse, if there is a policy -- a fallout for the policy is going to be that great, we don't know. But this is council that the President has put together, they were mutually beneficial both for the President and for the companies. And then there was a decision that started -- I just read a piece that on Sunday night -- there was a call to the CEOs that said, what do you think? And by this morning, the President was like, okay, we'll just end it right here. It's not necessarily great going into a fall when you need a budget and tax reform and other things like that. Not to say those companies want to be supportive but what do you think?

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Well, Trump was elected to do business for the American people in the businessmen are bailing out, that's not good for American business. You know, a lot of these businessmen are very skittish. The first hint of controversy they're going to bail anyway. The Trump's business savvy guy and I think he recognizes it now. And I'm very glad Trump did not discuss Nazis today. Very glad.

Sometimes let's say, you have an argument with your girlfriend or your boyfriend and you really want to win the argument. And sometimes you win the argument but you lose over the long-term? And, you know, there is no doubt about it. Donald Trump got to bloodied up. He may have won the battle with the press the other day but he definitely left with a lot of scars. Technically he was right, both sides were violent, one side was most -- much more morally repugnant than the other side and that's what the media was expecting him to condemn and he fought back on that.

He was more focused on the physical violence instead of the ideals that one side was putting forward. So, the Saturday and the Monday comments I thought were fine and I understand them and they are terrific. But then, the press conference yesterday was very high risk. Takes a lot of courage to go in their swing when you're talking about neo-Nazis, talking about neo-Nazis, not the best territory you want to fight on in an argument. It's kind of, even if you win, you lose.

PERINO: Well, you could win it easily though.

WATTERS: Well, right. But I mean, that's not Trump's style, I mean, he has to defeat the press. And do it mercilessly. So, I think the thing that the business community really had trouble with was the one line in the press conference yesterday when he said, there were some fine people who were marching peacefully in the rally to prevent the removal of the confederate statue. Well, fine people are also marching alongside with neo-Nazis.

He really litigated the riot. And, you know, you kind of don't want to really delineate, you know, who the good people and the bad people, it's still kind of a neo-Nazi rally. And I think that's where he got caught up. Now, a traditional politician would have just done what most politicians would have done, kick the Nazi in the face, comforted the nation and moved on.

But Donald Trump is not a traditional politician. It's kind of like the Obama birth certificate situation. He pushed that hard, it got a lot of attention in the beginning but eventually became a losing hand for him and then had to stop talking about it. So, I'm glad to see the President now has to stop talking about Nazis, that's going to be a good thing. But I know that Donald Trump is not racist in his heart. You said this the other day, he's not a bigot, he is very generous, he is very compassionate, he loves all Americans.

And he gave the media an opportunity to really smear him, because they're going to take whatever he says out of context and uses words against them. So, he has to be very careful. I know Donald Trump likes to punch and he moves forward and he punches like a boxer. But sometimes you want to see the President with a little bit of head movement and dodge and weave. Because he comes out after the round, he's got some cuts.

PERINO: Oh, boy!

WATTERS: So, I think he realizes that now.

PERINO: "Hannity" is up next. I'm getting.


PERINO: Oh, really? Important points. Juan, there's a -- vice news did a piece with a young woman reporter who I thought was very brave, and here's some sound for what was there. This was a unite the right event that was organized by Nazis, for Nazis, meant to bring Nazis together. Not like a big unite the riot, like the big Republican Party coming together.



"Jews will not replace us." "Jews will not replace us." "Jews will not replace us." "Jews will not replace us."


PERINO: Interesting to me. That guy Chris Crocker (ph) who was featured in that piece, Juan, tonight Facebook has deleted his account.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Yes. Because no doubt he is under attack. But the fact is, I mean, it's an important piece of journalism there Dana because what you see is that was principally on the Friday night, they are marching across the University of Virginia campus. And there is nobody there protesting against them. That's them defining themselves with those anti-Semitic statements. Carrying the torches, that are so reminiscent of crosses burning on black lawns on the like and they're talking about Jews won't replace us and blood and soil which are anti-Semitic slogans with powerful meaning.

So, they are defying themselves. So, the next day, when they show up and now the protesters show up and the protesters are ready because you have these young men who have weapons and torches and the like, then somehow Donald Trump says, oh, that's an equivalence. So, to me, and I think I said this yesterday to you. The people who fight Nazis are not to be equated with Nazis. And people who stand up for American values and say that we despise this kind of action, it's not in keeping with our heritage are not to be equated with white supremacists and neo-Nazis.

You know, Bernie Sanders had something really interesting to say today that I think is so important for us at this table to hear. Bernie Sanders said, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan, and you mentioned Romney McDaniel, also, we don't want these kind of people in the party. We don't want it.

PERINO: We don't like your vote.


PERINO: And we don't need it.

WILLIAMS: Right. And what Bernie Sanders said was, the only major American political figure right now who is offering any comfort to these people is President Trump. I mean, it's unbelievable. You have no GOP support. You have nobody, you know, not Gary Cohen, not Manukin (ph), you have CEOs leaving in droves. I mean, CEOs, Wal-Mart, GM, 3M, Merck, these are major American companies saying, Mr. President, you're wrong on this.


WILLIAMS: No, it's not just about the media, it's not just about people trying to unfairly target the President because of politics. There's something beyond politics at play here.

GUTFELD: Can I respond to the, you know, you talk about fighting Nazis. And what you see a lot on Twitter from a lot of people is, they're comparing the anti-fa to soldiers landing on D-Day.

PERINO: Yes. That was ridiculous.

GUTFELD: Let's make sure that you don't use every crisis, you know, you don't want to let it go to waste. But don't use it to mainstream another violent group because there was another violent group there which is what's happening right now. The media is actually mainstreaming anti-fa, using this kind of crassly, this event to mainstream of violent group. And I think it's really an important. Juan, you're right to call out a violent groups on your side.

Both sides should do that. Now, this is where I'm going to get to a point about white, you know, during the campaign, I never tried to Trumpsplain what he did because there are other options available. It's not my place to explain his mistakes. As a president now, I tried to give them the benefit and I tried to analyze and understand the mistakes he makes. Based on my experience, the only obvious answer I have for what he did was pure ignorance.

When I woke up on Saturday morning and I saw the pictures of the tiki stuff, I had no idea what that was. I think it was some weird -- like who were these guys going to a luau? No clue. Throughout the afternoon, I never heard of any of those groups. That's ignorance. Because as a right wing libertarian at FOX News, my focusing on anti-fa and all those people that are out there beating up protesters and I never heard of these guys.

And my guess is perhaps he had never heard of them either so he saw four groups there. He saw counter protesters spoiling for a fight, counter protesters not spoiling for a fight, racist marchers spoiling for a fight, other marchers not spoiling for a fight. That's how he saw it. He was likely wrong. He was wrong. But do you see what I'm trying to say? It came from an ignorance about what was going on.

PERINO: Except that, reportedly, he was given a statement to bid which had all the stuff that he said on Monday, in the Saturday statement that he decided not to read.


PERINO: So, I would say, I don't think that the ignorance argument works. His people knew about it.

GUTFELD: I could see stupidly thinking that, oh, there were like, there were these people that showed up who were interested in history, if you didn't see the flyers. Like I never saw the flyers until today --

PERINO: They are horrible.

GUTFELD: And they are horrible.

PERINO: I think he was right not to comment on the guy who actually have killed Heather Heyer because that had just happened and --

WILLIAMS: I don't think there's any way to say Heather Heyer, as her mom said today, may her legacy live on. You know, my sympathies go out to you. There's no way she came there as a violent person.

GUTFED: No, of course not.

WILLIAMS: I don't think it's fair to say that, oh, suddenly the people who were protesting came there equally.

GUTFELD: I agree.

WILLIAMS: So, to my mind, when you hear Michael Moore say things, and I don't think Michael Moore is about persuading anybody, I think it's all about expressing outrage, you think he is commercially sensitive. He's pushing something, he's pushing his new show --

GUTFELD: -- which is terrible.

WILLIAMS: But I think that if you look back, you can't just say, oh, everybody who, you know, is white and has voted for Trump, oh, don't worry about it, we know you have a good, you know what, Trump antagonized a lot of people. The anti-immigrant stuff --

GUTFELD: Well, Juan, you're willing to take a broader stroke.

WILLIAMS: We got to think about, no, right now, are you enabling?

WATTERS: Juan, that's like saying all Muslims support Islamic terrorist. That's painting with a broad brush.


WILLIAMS: I think, you know what we have tonight?

PERINO: Your segment will continue actually in the next -- if that's okay. We actually have more to say about this. Coming up, Greg thinks the media is guilty of big-time hypocrisy. We'll tell you why right after this quick break.


GUTFELD: Yesterday, roughly 80 percent of the total air time of the non-cable network news was devoted to Donald Trump's presser. Here's more from today:


LESTER HOLT, NBC NEWS: There's been no mad rush to the microphones today by surrogates to try and defend President Trump as we've seen after past eyebrow-raising moments.

ANTHONY MASON, CBS NEWS: As a rule, former presidents don't criticize their successors. But after the violence in Charlottesville and President Trump's defense of far-right protesters, former Presidents George and George W. Bush put out a joint statement today.

DAVID MUIR, ABC NEWS: We begin tonight with the backlash against President Trump, several of the nation's top CEOs from companies he'll know, Campbell's soup, Pepsi, Wal-Mart bailing on the President's business councils.


GUTFELD: Now, I get it: This is a red meat that drives the story line of a racist president, a racist president we all helped elect, all the networks were there. It's weird, as the media pines for unity, they foment friction. Go outside for a minute though and everything seems fine but turn on the TV, race war is coming. By attributing the acts of ghoulish racists to a party or large swaths of America, they steer us away from civility on toward fury.

The media has different rules depending on the guy. I remember one network linking the shooting of Stevens Scalise to his voting record. How is that not condemning both sides? And if you point out the past violence of antifa, of course, that now means you endorse Nazis. I don't know how you get there.

Anyway, Americans can handle far more than the media's binary thinking. We know ugliness when we see it and that tribalism leads to harm. By removing the communicative step between emotion and violence, we're left with fringe maniacs and bike helmets.

My dream: That the media steps out of its team sport thinking and examine how they increase division. Whether it's white nationalists, black power groups, anarchist, antifa or Aryan nations -- the appeal of superiority through identity, that's the disease. By linking toxic tribes to large parties, all the media does is help it spread. Instead, let's isolate and quarantine it.

Dana, you said you had a good point about this. So, I will go to you.

PERINO: Well, I was just thinking, well, we have covered it for three days straight.


PERINO: But I also think that for the networks, racism Trump's Russia.


PERINO: So, the only thing that was able to get Russia off of --

GUTFELD: -- or North Korea.

PERINO: Well, right. Well, I think North Korea was like a legitimate crisis. Russia is the story that they would wanted to tag the President with every day.

GUILFOYLE: With collusion.

PERINO: Yes. And the investigation. But if you're on the left and you want to go after President Trump, isn't it better, you can for sure say he's a racist when you can't prove collusion.

GUTFELD: Right. I see what you mean.

PERINO: So, the media was like, okay, now we got another thing.


PERINO: I do think however that the media that you're talking about like this sort of the network news, that's all watched by much older people. So, then the echo-chamber is fomented. The thing that the business CEO said today was one of the things they were, especially if they were consumer facing business, the onslaught from social media was huge.


PERINO: And so, they were facing campaigns against their companies because of this that you didn't necessarily see on TV.

GUTFELD: Right. And it's hard to question the accuracy of those onslaughts. You know what I mean? Ten people can feel like a thousand people.

PERINO: How many are real?

GUTFELD: And how many are real? We know that from the past. Juan, my fare in questioning the proportional value of this coverage, that it was so much for one story?

WILLIAMS: You know, I was thinking about it, because to me it what was interesting looking back is that none of the networks covered the press conference.


WILLIAMS: Zero. There was no live coverage of the press conference.

GUTFELD: That is a good point.

WILLIAMS: But then subsequent to that they all ran to make it up and say, oh my God, what a press conference. If you were watching live and I think there has been news stories, there has been news stories now about the response in the moment including here at FOX to oh my God, what just happened, how come he said that? People are starting to say, I would going to cry and all of that.

And you hear in the immediate aftermath from Republicans, I mean, on this network, Charles Krauthammer saying, it was a moral disgrace. Guy Benson saying, Trump lost me in that moment. Kat Timpf saying, she was about to start crying despite her make-up. You hear people saying, well, that was something. And I think that signals to you that it's not just media or far left people but people like would just like, wow, what just happened at Trump Tower? What did he do?

So, it was compelling. Now, in response to what you're saying about this Trump, that or whatever, I think when you are at a point where we are talking about race wars, were talking about the country being so deeply divided, I was on TV on one of our shows, "OUTNUMBERED" and one of our co- hosts started crying. I mean, anything I say is going to be taking wrong or misinterpreted, I'm going to be called a racist. I just want to talk to you. It's just that kind of emotionally powerful. So, I think if news media doesn't pay attention, Greg, I would be startled.

GUTFELD: I worry though, Kimberly. I'm not interested in comfort from a network, I just want context and clarity. And without context and clarity, I worry that it doesn't help inform the public, it actually infuriates the public and makes this kind of racial divide worse. But I could be wrong.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Amplifies it.


GUILFOYLE: And to your response when you have to cover it and it's important to have, you know, peaceful and meaningful discourse about it. But yes, I don't want to live in a right left paradigm.


GUILFOYLE: You know, where you have to take sides and line up on this. Shouldn't we all be on the same team? People that believe in that liberty and the principles that this country was founded upon. I don't want it to be a place where people just really kind of sits there and try to poke the cage on extremism on either side. Of course you denounce absolutely what happened and what these people stand for, there is no place for it in any society, in any country, in any place whatsoever. Okay? So, that's very simple.

And I think trying to further explain it is where the President got in trouble and trying to say, oh, there was violence as well from the other side. They were wrong too. It's not even necessary to go there. Just call it out for what it is, shut it down and try to show the country that we stand united together against people like this.

GUTFELD: Last word, Jesse.

WATTERS: The media through gasoline on the fire and now they are complaining it's too hot. I think the percentage of the white supremacist population in this country is .03 percent. And the media treats these people like they have a lot of juice. Anti-fa? The media totally sanitized these people. They don't even interview them. I haven't seen one legitimate news interview with an anti-fa member and they are all the way out there. They're everywhere.

And then Black Lives Matter, they've elevated that group big time and they are responsible for a lot of violent acts. So, you have this kind of tribal collision course in Charlotte where all of these people descend on to one place in a very lackadaisical police department and it's a powder keg. Now, Trump has been called a Nazi for a year by the media. A Nazi commits a crime, now Trump is an accessory to the crime, that's outrageous.

And for a decade, the media has pushed that white privilege needs to be eradicated. Now they see speech and certain symbols need to be eradicated. But then you have a lot of these, quote, "Marginalized groups" that, you know, they can do anything, they can riot, they can break the law, they can yell and they can scream and they can block traffic. But they're righteous because they have justice on their side. So, when the media creates division, they do that to create conflict because conflict creates results for the left. Because eventually the culture is like, you know, what, I don't want to deal with it.

GUTFELD: All right. On that note, we have more mainstream media -- Tom Brokaw goes after President Trump again while calling for unity. That's next.


WATTERS: Back now to Charlottesville incident impact on our nation. President Trump's response to the violence created a storm of controversy. Can he find a way to unite America at this challenging time? One of his media critic's Tom Brokaw is not optimistic.

TOM BROKAW, TRUMP'S MEDIA CRITIC: It really does require presidential leadership of a higher order to bring the country together. Does he come out and read some kind of a statement? That is not going to be enough. He is going to have to find a way to stitch the country back together again and I don't know whether he is capable of doing that in his own mind.


WATTERS: I disagree. The President has a big rally scheduled in Phoenix on Tuesday, his first one since the violent clashes in Virginia. I think we're going to hear more words from him that will help ease the tensions. Kimberly what would you suggest the President say at a rally next week, or would he say anything?

GUILFOYLE: Well I think that he should say something, because obviously this story continues to grow in the public outrage continues, the president really wants to get back on message to talking about working men and women, that he felt so move by across this country that he thought they were forgotten. Get back to the jobs in the economy, he really can't do that unless he declares this, you know once and for all definitively and denounces them. And that is it, and no equivocation, that is not his position. It's a very specific as to one issue and that is what he needs to do. Look straight through the camera, the American people and tell them what's in his heart and how much it disgusts him.

WATTERS: What words you advise the president to use?

PERINO: I would advise him to use them sooner than next Tuesday, I wouldn't wait. Who knows what would happen between now and then, I think he would benefit from doing a one-on-one interview with some journalist of his choice in a setting where he can look Presidential and he can answer all the questions that are out there in a way that comes from the heart. He is done that before. He hasn't done a television interview like that and a very long time.

WATTERS: Are you suggesting Watters world?

PERINO: No, Sure whatever. I don't think it would be the right place for this. I would do something where that is actually a unifying thing.

WATTERS: That hurts.

PERINO: I would do the one-on-one interview, and then he can move on in to the rallies as he enjoys.

GUTFELD: I'm a little pessimistic about the whole thing. I don't see how he governs, how can he reduce this calamity and move on, if the opportunity is just denied him, just across the board by the media and you just do not let go of this. Like a dog on the bone. There's also this weird thing. If there is a reward you get as a Republican or conservative, it's called the strange new respect reward to end the left will hand you that when you distance yourself from a leader. By the way the right does it to the left, when you see a liberal move away, or criticize a liberal leader, you get accolades and I'm telling you its very appealing. When the people who normally make fun of you suddenly really like you and that is a huge temptation for a lot of people.

PERINO: It only lasts about 30 seconds.

GUTFELD: Yes that is true.

WATTERS: A lot of these rallies are really wheeling and dealing in free- form, do you think the President can stick to a script and read the prompter or just cut it loose?

WILLIAMS: I don't think is going to stick to the script, it's not his habit. I think what happen over the weekend when he didn't issue the statement and read the pro forma statement and then he comes back, I think you heard what is in his heart. People say we need to see the good that is in his heart, but I think what's in his heart is pretty apparent in this was everybody's so appalled with what he said.

WATTERS: You know what's in the president's heart. He is not a racist man.

WILLIAMS: I heard of my friend Kimberly Guilfoyle say that on her show. But all I have are his actions. And I must say his actions are not good on this place. I don't understand if your son-in-law is Jewish Kimberly, how you can have people marching through the streets and have people say --

GUTFELD: I still didn't see that.

WILLIAMS: When he goes to Phoenix, the news is going to be whether or not he is going to pardon Joe Arpaio. That is the big deal. This place into the racist, all along he has built up this kind of reputation especially in minorities but also among Democrats that he plays racial politics to his advantage. I'm just telling you, he is got to deal with that, he is got to deal with the fact that John McCain, Jeff Flake; two Senators from Arizona both have condemned these statements. This is what he is up against. He has really put himself in what Tom Brokaw says is a box it's good to be hard for him to get out.

WATTERS: Tough timing on that Arpaio part of that goes down. Attorney General Jeff Sessions is continuing his campaign against sanctuary cities. This time taking aim at one of the nation's biggest cities, will tell you which one will may come right back.


GUILFOYLE: Going after sanctuary cities is one of the Trump administration's top priorities with Attorney General Jeff Sessions, threatening to hold funding from jurisdictions who don't comply with federal immigration law. Mr. Sessions was in Florida today praising Miami- Dade Counties Policy of cooperating with the feds and attacking America's murder capital Chicago.


JEFF SESSIONS, ATTORNEY GENERAL: Respect for the rule of law has broken down. In Chicago, I suggest the so-called sanctuary policies are one sad example of that. These policies do far broader damage to the country than many understand, at its root, it is a rejection of our immigration laws and a declaration of open borders.


GUILFOYLE: Ok there is something else to talk about. All right Greg, what do you make of it? He is calling out Chicago which he has done as well.

GUTFELD: I guess this is a story about this city because other cities haven't done it. It's unusual that a city is following the law. I go back to my original point that if you can have a sanctuary city for one want to break, why can't I have my own? Why not to be a libertarian where you legalize everything or you have a whole town where you can drive and bumper cars. Maybe there's a town that has no pet restrictions, you can have an elephant in your apartment.

PERINO: That must be a big apartment.


GUTFELD: It would be. My point is it's absurd. Why can't we decide what kind of sanctuary city we want? I want to vape at a bar for god's sakes.

PERINO: Don't you do that already?

GUTFELD: I sneak it.

GUILFOYLE: I know I am ousting you.

PERINO: I think one interesting here is this is a nonpartisan mayor in Miami and he decided to do this and he is not trying to make some sort of partisan argument. He is saying here are the reasons why I want to do it because it's better for my city. The differences in Chicago, Rahm Emanuel, obviously a very prominent Democrat and he have said I want to sue the Trump administration, because of this. For the law and order President, this is a very good issue for him. It's better for him in Florida than it is in Illinois.

GUILFOYLE: Jesse, what do you make of this in terms of Sessions approach and coming at a good time trying to talk about this issue instead of others?

WATTERS: Rahm is a great punching bag of four Sessions in Sessions is probably a better punching bag for Rahm, I think other mayors are going to be looking at this showdown and see how it plays out. Rahm got the court on his side probably, Trump hasn't had a lot of luck and has courts but Sessions has the law on his side, I believe and a lot of money, so we will see how it plays out. Miami reminds me of Kaddafi. Remember when Bush toppled Saddam and then Kaddafi said I will give my WND Program that is what kind of happens in Miami. I know I've made this point before you Juan, but it's worth reiterating to you especially.

WILLIAMS: I am all ears.

WATTERS: Phoenix used to be a sanctuary city. Dropped its sanctuary city status and crime went down by 20 percent. That saves lives. That is not racist.


GUTFELD: That is a new segment Jesse Watters that is not racist.

GUILFOYLE: We just keep winning here.

WILLIAMS: I'm so glad you're not on the defensive, but I will say this, the reality of what's going on in Miami is about $500,000 that they would have lost. That is nothing. The big ticket was that they are trying to get federal support for a billion-dollar mass transit system. This mayor who was a Republican, if not elected in the Democratic-Republican way, he is a Republican. The Democrats are up in arms saying this guy is playing too, I'll use a quote Trump racist policy that he is allowing it to go forward. You have the state of California, Chicago, so many other cities who say -- this is interesting because I think conservatives should be very sensitive to the idea of localities and states setting their own laws and not having the federal government to bigfoot them and tell them exactly what to do.

PERINO: Not in immigrations.

WILLIAMS: Not on immigration.

WATTERS: Gun laws that don't jive with the rest of federal laws how would you like that? Everybody arm up, everybody gets a bazooka. Why is it ok when it comes to immigration?

WILLIAMS: Of course it's not ok, there's not a similarity.

WATTERS: Greg just made a great point, if anything goes it in a locality, what's the difference?

GUTFELD: I'm saying public.

PERINO: A lot of Americans are still looking for answers on that secret tarmac meeting between Bill Clinton and Loretta Lynch. Right before Hillary Clinton was cleared by the FBI. We could be getting those answers soon, stay with us.


WILLIAMS: As Republicans love to remind you Attorney General Loretta Lynch had a meeting with Bill Clinton last June at a Phoenix airport, while the FBI was investigating his wife over her private email server. Now Jay Sekulow one of the President's attorneys has been trying to get the Justice Department documents related to that Clinton-Lynch confab. Previously the DOJ said no records exist but now the feds are changing their story.


JAY SEKULOW, PRESIDENT TRUMP' LAWYER: I'm holding in my hand a letter that I received yesterday where a rather unprecedented move, the FBI has reopened that for you investigation to produce relevant documents to the inquiry that we now know exists. That doesn't happen. This is a positive sign.


WILLIAMS: So the question is what's to come of it? They had 400 emails released early. We found out that Loretta Lynch sometimes used an alias, I think it was Elizabeth Tarlov, we also found out they were concerned about the optics, Greg what do you think?

GUTFELD: This was the most improper meeting Bill Clinton ever had with his pants on.

WILLIAMS: Thank you. Dana.

GUILFOYLE: I'm surprised at how many people in the Obama administration used aliases to communicate. Remember at EPA, the woman who was there used Richard Winter. I don't think that is appropriate and shouldn't be allowed at all. I guess it's good to get these out. Turnabout is fair play. In four or eight years, President Trump will no longer be President and his supporters will not like it if the next President tries to look back in all sorts of things going back to 2008.

WATTERS: I can't believe the Obama administration forgot to shred these documents, it's shocking. What happened? What I find confusing as they talked for about 45 minutes, President Clinton and Loretta Lynch about golf and grandkids. I don't even think golfers talk for 45 minutes about golf. I didn't know she played, I wonder what her handicap is. They talked about grandchildren. So the grandchildren at that time for Bill Clinton was like an infant, the kid doesn't even speak, what do you say about an infant?

GUILFOYLE: He got an older sister.

WATTERS: Really? Is it something when they talked about? They don't believe what Trump Junior said in his meeting but they buy everything they said on the tarmac, I got it.

GUILFOYLE: I need my "One more thing."

WATTERS: Where is it? I am hungry.

WILLIAMS: The Democrats all say the story is overblown and its old history.

GUILFOYLE: I think - well I don't think it is old history, yes it's a previous administration but it's something that people weren't able to get definitive clarity and answers on, because there is want documents that relate to it now all of a sudden there are a lot of documents.

WILLIAMS: In fact I think it's time for it DOJ, to juts square up and be honest, you got something, show it, one more thing up next.


WATTERS: It is time now for one more thing, Jesse?

WATTERS: Dana thinks she got dog omt's, I've got a better one. Roll it.


WATTERS: Demon dog! That is all I got, the demon dog.



GUILFOYLE: So freaky. It's my segment, hold on, Kimberly's food court.

WATTERS: I am hungry.

GUILFOYLE: You're in my shop. You're ruining my segment. We did some investigative reporting for Kimberly's food court because that is what we do it's how we roll. We talked and we ate these delicious Cheetos. They had a Cheetos pop-up, it's extremely popular, all sold out. These are the fabulous dishes. Cheetos meatballs, clearly Greg almost split his pants try to get up to get them. You're my prop, and tomato soup right here, flaming hot and white cheddar Mac and cheese and flaming hot chicken tacos. Isn't this delicious?

GUTFELD: I'm going to skip my secrets to happiness. But my podcast tonight go to Fox News that is Charles Fleischer. If you don't know who that was, he was the nemesis -- he was the voice of Roger Rabbit, a brilliant comedian but a fanatic about mathematics and the universe. Check it out, it's a good podcast.

PERINO: I'll tell you what podcast posted tonight. Its happy anniversary to my husband Peter, we met 20 years ago tomorrow on an airplane, and in honor of that we are going to post excerpt from my book up on Facebook so you can see. Maybe there will be a picture of one that was 20 years ago.

GUILFOYLE: Happy Anniversary.

WILLIAMS: Happy Anniversary.

GUILFOYLE: All right Juan.

WILLIAMS: History was made Monday for the first time a black woman was chosen to lead the 4400 member corps of cadets at west point military academy. Simone Askew became the first captain and she will lead her classmates, speak on her behalf, and listen to her reaction.


SIMONE ASKEW, FIRST BLACK WOMAN TO LEAD WEST POINT CADETS: I was excited but also thinking what a great team we are going to have. It's humbling but also exciting as I step into this new opportunity to lead the court to greatness with my team with me.


WILLIAMS: What a change from last year when a group of black women at West point were criticized for posing and solidarity of the black lives movement, this is awesome, congratulations to her in the military.

PERINO: All right. Set your DVRs and never miss an episode of "The Five," now "Hannity" is really up next.

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