Special counsel appointed to lead Russia investigation

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," May 17, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Hello everyone, I'm Jesse Watters, welcome to THE FIVE on another night of breaking news.

The Justice Department announced this evening that a special counsel has been appointed to investigate the allegations that the Russian government attempted to influence the 2016 presidential election. Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein appointed FBI Director Robert Mulder to oversee the probe. President Trump quickly reacted saying, quote, "A thorough investigation will confirm what we already know. There was no collusion between my campaign in any foreign entity."

Joining us now live from the White House is FOX News Chief National Correspondent Ed Henry.

ED HENRY, FOX NEWS: Good to see you, Jesse.

WATTERS: All right. You too, Ed, so the Feds have been investigating Russia and the election and Donald Trump's campaign probably for about a year, it seems like. I haven't heard anything solid. Everyone is, you know, running around crazy in Washington on cable tonight. There's a difference between a scandal and a conspiracy. So, tell me, what exactly would this special counsel be investigating in terms of a crime?

HENRY: Well, here's the problem for the White House tonight, Jesse which is that, this is now a wide open investigation. The press release from the Justice Department makes it very clear that Bob Mueller, a highly respected former director of the FBI, wide support in both parties now has a vast power to investigate Russian influence in the last presidential election and, quote-unquote, "other matters." And so, what does that mean? Does that mean he'll also investigate General Mike Flynn? Will he investigate the President's dinner with James Comey? Another former FBI director.

And so, if you think back to the Clinton days and Ken Starr, a special counsel, a special prosecutor can start as one thing and become quite another, and to be very, very difficult for a White House. On the other hand, what is good news for this White House tonight is the fact that the President now perhaps can get back focused on taxes and health care and the other things he was elected to do while a highly regarded special counsel is now focused on the Russia matter.

So, to your question and to your point, if this president has nothing to worry about here, he will now have a highly respected investigator who will look at this and if there is nothing there at the end of it, the American people can have confidence that we can finally move on from this. Obviously if Bob Mueller though, now with this wide open investigation, does find a crime or crimes, that's a whole another matter and it's going to get very difficult for this president because of the fact that Mueller is known as someone with great integrity.

WATTERS: Yes. So, like you said it could really give the President some breathing room to enact his agenda in the next couple years or however long this takes. Let's take it around the horn, Kimberly Guilfoyle.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: All right. Thank you, Jesse. So, Ed, does this come really though as a surprise, that this was the direction that they were leaning in, it seems like they tried to get out in front of it in terms of saying, they wanted to have this happen to make sure to show that there was nothing improper, no kinds of impropriety going on here.

HENRY: It did seem like a surprise, because as you know, this president, his top aides have been resisting calls for a special counsel to be named. But the fact of the matter is that our own John Roberts, our chief White House correspondent is telling us tonight that from a senior administration official, when Don McGahn whose the White House counsel got the official call from the Justice Department that this is the way they were going to go with Bob Mueller, a special counsel, McGahn did went to the President in the Oval Office and they convened a meeting, Reince Priebus, the chief-of- staff, Kellyanne Conway, Steve Bannon, all kinds of top aides.

And what I find interesting in this reporting is that we are hearing that the President seemed measured in his response. You know that President Trump's critics are waiting for him tonight or tomorrow morning early, tomorrow, get on social media stop ripping either in the Bob Mueller or his critics on the hill. But instead we're hearing a much different portrait from the President senior advisors tonight that in the Oval Office, the President basically told his top aides, okay, this is the hand we've been dealt, let's move forward.

And so, to Jesse's point, this may give on the positive side, this White House some breathing space to get back to the business of the nation, you saw the markets, reacting it in negative way today, to all of this uncertainty in Washington. Okay. Now, it's going to be investigated, let's get back to business. And the President realizes there's nothing he can do at this point, a special counsel has vast power, there is no more resisting the calls.

And in some ways, that's good for this White House instead of the drip drip of not just Democrats but now slowly some Republicans on The Hill saying, yes, we need a special counsel and the White House, you know, what, that's over now, Kimberly. There is a Special Counsel, they have to dealt with it.

WATTERS: Yes. The President might be breathing a little sigh of relief here.

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: I want to be sure I get this straight, the Justice Department made this call and then the White House was told, correct?

HENRY: Yes. Because you have the number two official who helped write that memo that helped the President decide that he's going to fire at James Comey, he has the power to appoint a special counsel because remember the number one official at the Justice Department the Attorney General of the United States, the chief law enforcement officer Jeff Sessions has recused himself from all matters related to this Russia investigation because he was part of the campaign. So, the White House had no control over it. And their Attorney General had no control of it.

BECKEL: Yes. But it's a little unusual that they don't even know that this is going on. But I think it's good for them. I think Jessie made a good point. You know, up to now, they have so screwed up the communication on this stuff on the drip, drip, drip, and they could never get on the same page, this White House.


BECKEL: Now I supposed everybody could say, they've got a special counsel and were not going to comment on it.

HENRY: Right.

BECKEL: If you can't screw that up, well, maybe they could, but it would be hard-pressed to do it. But this White House might pull it off.

HENRY: Well, Bob, you know, previous administrations in both parties, whether you had a special counsel, or you had Congressional investigation, it's an effective tool and effective weapon as you suggest to say, when you are asked at the White House podium, Sean Spicer, what's the latest on the Russia investigation? We're going to stay away from that. We have a Special Counsel, Bob Mueller is looking at that. I'm going to talk about health care. I'm going to talk about taxes.

So, instead of that drip, drip you mentioned and the pounding that Sean Spicer and the President himself had been taking and others here at the White House, I'm not saying this is good news, there's a special counsel now investigating this. And so, Katie Bardador (ph), if there was, and I underline the word if, there were a crime or crimes here, Bob Mueller is respected and as a lawyer, is a former FBI director.

If there were crimes here he's likely to find them. But, so I'm not spinning this as good news but at the end of the day, you are absolutely right that this is a chance for the White House to insulate themselves and say that is going on over there, we're focused on the business of the country.

WATTERS: Dana Perino.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, Ed, you were in the White House briefing room, I was the deputy press secretary at the time when the Valerie Plame investigation was going on, and there was a special prosecutor Patrick Fitzgerald who was a U.S. attorney at the time in prosecuting attorney. What is the difference with Bob Mueller taking over here? And also, I do think they were sort of missing one other point. This is not just an investigation into possible collusion in between the Trump campaign and Russia. It's actually much bigger than that.

And I see this almost like a Rob Silverman report on WMD. Because it's about the overall Russia attempt to influence, it may be had nothing to do with the Trump campaign. But when you look at some of the things that Russia was doing to hack into twitter and social media and create fake news stories and all of that -- I actually think this could be very, very useful overall for not just America but for the civilized world to basically push back against this entity Russia in some sort of like a Robert Silverman type report that would be accepted in its conclusion.

HENRY: Correct. Because I think as you lay that out without a special counsel, President Trump could have been dealing with this, maybe not for weeks or months, but maybe years. On the other hand now, you could get a vast investigation to look at everything John McCain last night as a Republican, a senior Republican said this is becoming something like Watergate, drip, drip. The American people are not going to have respect for the investigation if it's done by people who are seen as close to the President, it must be some sort of independent probe.

So, to your point, I think, yes, this could be important for this White House to have some sort of good housekeeping seal of approval that this is not a crony of President Trump who was looking at this. On your question about a special counsel, special prosecutor, the law has changed. Remember the special prosecutor laws I recall several years ago, expired. And so now, the Justice Department has the ability to call a special counsel, what will that mean for Bob Mueller? We don't know tonight.

He then now has to hire lawyers, he has to have investigators. We're told that he's going to build on the current investigation with FBI agents but he's going to have to get office space here in Washington. He's going to get investigators. This could be a sprawling investigation. Does he just look at it as a, quote-unquote, "special counsel" that investigates and then recommends to the Justice Department whether or not there's a prosecution if there are crimes.

Final point, you are right. There is an important point everyone has to remember, which is that, this is not just about Russia influencing the election. When the Justice Department statement says, they'll be investigating the special counsel, other matters, that could mean the President's dinner with James Comey, the President's meeting in the Oval Office with James Comey, General Flynn and the money he accepted, there are all kinds of things that this can open the door to that could be very painful for this White House.

WATTERS: Greg Gutfeld, you're next.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Just to that point, when there's so many lanes, there's more lengths to this that in the supermarket, there might be nothing there. I mean, when you can't focus and instead you're saying, it could be this, it could be this, it could be this, it's because there is no this. So, you're desperately trying to find all these little things, but that's not what I want to talk about. I swear I can hear Hillary Clinton cackling in her makeshift shed out in the woods.

Because I think this is maybe for her a minor victory, a participation trophy after being just slaughtered by Trump in the election. If you remember in the book "Shattered," they detailed about right after she lost, the narrative that she wanted out, was that she lost because of Russia. And so, ever since then it has been about Russia, Russia, Russia, and now, that's what she got. The media is on board, everybody is doing her bidding, it's like she's never went away.

HENRY: Well, Greg, it was even more recent than the book "Shattered" and more recent than election night. Think about a week or two ago, when Hillary Clinton did that Q&A --


HENRY: And flat out said I was winning. If the election were held, I think she said on October 27th, I'd be your President --


HENRY: -- which is a remarkable thing to say because the election was not held then. As Sean Spicer said from the podium here behind me at the White House, the day after, he said if they had finished the Super Bowl at halftime, the Atlanta Falcons would have one. October 27th was ridiculous, that had nothing to do with it. It was not Election Day. And so, I think directly to your question, the fact of the matter is Hillary Clinton has not gotten over the result, maybe she gets some measure of justice tonight that this is all going to be looked at, but I think it's very interesting that remember Donald Trump and his advisors in the campaign encouraged this whole lock her up refrain and so now you have a very in serious investigator in Robert Mueller looking at whether or not there were crimes on the Trump side. We don't have any evidence that there was or is but now they are investigating it and they are looking at it very closely -- Greg.

WATTERS: All right. Thanks very much. More to come on tonight on THE FIVE, we'll be back right now.


PERINO: Back now with more reaction to tonight's breaking news. Special Counsel has been appointed to oversee the probe into Russia's interference in our election. The Justice Department has top former FBI Director Robert Mueller for the job and he has accepted.

Here with reaction from House Oversight Committee Chair Jason Chaffetz a short while ago.

REP. JASON CHAFFETZ (R-UT), HOUSE OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE CHAIR: I think they are feeling the political heat. May be they're watching a little too much television and reading too many newspapers and whatnot. But look, I have not seen any evidence of actual collusion. Where is the actual crime that they think they need a special prosecutor to prosecute? I just -- I haven't seen that. There's been a lot of flailing but that flailing started before January 20th.


PERINO: So, Jesse, here's the benefit, we've talked about how the White House actually is liberating if they take this opportunity to not comment, and they could talk about jobs, tax reform jobs, health care, jobs, and it's like, the relentless focus, have a good foreign trip and come back, and just let the chips fall where they may in terms of prosecutor. But why on the hill continued to try to do something like this for Congressman Chaffetz who is actually retiring and then like muddying the waters with more politics.

WATTERS: If I was about to retire, I would start working on my tan, I would start playing tennis, I don't know that he wants to get embroiled in this fiasco for. But I do agree with you and some of what Ed said, there are benefits to this special counsel. I admit I flip-flopped on this thing. About two weeks ago, need a special counsel, there's already multiple investigations.

BECKEL: You flip-flopped?

WATTERS: Yes. You know what? At least I owed it, Bob.

PERINO: It's actually pretty solid.

WATTERS: You know, because I can say, you know, that I flip-flopped and that's on tape. So now I believe because the heat has gone up so much, it really lowers the temperature on a number of levels. It takes the hole Trump fired Comey and obstructs justice narrative off the table momentarily. It gives Spicer a big sigh of relief and God know he needs to help out there. And another thing, it takes the Democratic messaging away that Trump is above the law and he's the king and he's stopping everything from going on, he's assaulting democracy and it says something very interesting. It could go into different directions. So, it could go into the Flynn thing, it could go that. But you know, where else it could go into? The unmaskers." It could go into the leakers.


WATTERS: Who knows where this thing ends up? This might end up blowing back on the Democrats.

PERINO: Absolutely. And Bob, I want to ask you this, the Democrats actually had supported Mueller during the Obama administration, he's like a guy, public service is in his DNA, he's been there in Washington for a long time, served in the Bush administration, join seven days before 9/11. Served in Obama's administration, they actually asked him to serve additional two years, that was 12 years. Will the Democrats accept his conclusion?

BECKEL: Oh, absolutely. And look, you cannot, I mean, the guy has got an enormous amount of strength among Democrats. And the good news I guess in the end here is whatever Mueller says is done, right?

PERINO: Right.

BECKEL: That's going to be it. And I think it's going to be accepted or going to be not accepted. But I mean, how do you not accept somebody like this? But here's the other thing, it opens up a whole avenue for more leaks. When you've got it, I mean, you look at this, special counsel, special prosecutors, the amount of leaking that takes out of this place, and one other thing, you got all this information in the FBI. You've got a new FBI director coming in, the good news is, that Mueller haven't been a former FBI director probably able to work with an existing agents, I think there could be some tension between him and the new director.

PERINO: Right. But one thing about Mueller Kimberly --


PERINO: -- is he's not a showboat in any way.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Absolutely.

PERINO: He does not seek the limelight. He is not a U.S. attorney who has a future in minds like Patrick Fitzgerald did in the Bush administration --


PERINO: This guy has already like had his name enforced.


PERINO: And he's public servant.

GUILFOYLE: And he's not, you know, a controversial figure like we've seen come across in law before, like Preet Bharara, that type of things, where people say, what are their future ambitions?

PERINO: Right.

GUILFOYLE: Obviously, this is someone of high integrity, high intelligence and competency. So, obviously if he can do this investigation, people can feel pretty certain in terms of the quality of it, the expense of it. But yes, you don't want it to be a deterrent to the President's agenda, the proposals in his initiatives that he wants to put forward and having those be counted and focused on in the press.

But I do echo Bob's sentiment that there's a real problem here in terms of opportunity for leaks. So, this is the time when the President really going to have to make sure that he has a tight team around him, that they made sure they're focusing on their agenda and they really try and control leaks and people that might be trying to do him harm from within that aren't supportive of his presidency.

BECKEL: Let me ask you a question.

PERINO: Let's get Greg into there. I don't have much time, Bob.

BECKEL: Okay. I had an important question, too.

PERINO: Well, I had a good point from Greg.

GUTFELD: Don't worry about it. I'll stay here.

PERINO: Now you tell us, can I ask you something, Greg, just comment on anything.

GUTFELD: Well, I think what's great about the investigation is like, you know, when you go to complain about a billing problem at a company and they go, oh, we were addressing at, where do you go after that? It's like, no, it's a problem, yes, Mr. Gutfeld, we're addressing that.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. He is the supervisor.

GUTFELD: Yes. He's the supervisor. He's addressing that. So now it's like you are pissed off about Russia, you just go, yes, we're addressing that.

PERINO: I remember my question.

GUTFELD: Yes. Okay. Well, what's your question?

PERINO: What Kimberly's point was that, the worst thing I guess would be leaks. The problem is the person who's actually been perpetuating the story is often the President himself. Do you think that he will be able to not comment?

GUTFELD: No. Like I said, it's who he is, he doesn't care, it says what he says. I think also this is a posturing pacifier, the Dems can suck on this, and they could stop instead of crying for Trump's head, they're going to be having to deal with this. And with the exception of Ken Starr. I can't remember any of these probes amounting to anything really memorable. It's like background noise for years. It's like a really boring version of law & order, it just goes on and on and on, it may outlast us.

BECKEL: Can I ask Kimberly a fantastic question?

PERINO: Wear and tear on the staff and --

GUTFELD: It costs a lot of money. It costs a lot of money.


PERINO: If there are consequences.

BECKEL: I will ask Kimberly very quickly. Does a special counsel go to the Justice Department and if they decide that they want to prosecute, he still has to do with the FBI director would do, right?

GUILFOYLE: That's a good question. So, basically he would be doing the same thing as Comey was doing, which was putting together an investigation, but somebody else would be hammered because Comey wasn't doing the investigation himself, he's like overseeing it, but he's going to collect these evidence and put everything together and put together his report based on those findings. But what he's not going to do is then step in to say, okay, they're making the decision.

PERINO: As you heard Ed Henry said that the law changed four years ago, and I don't think it's exactly clear and we will probably find out by the morning.

WATTERS: Can I get a little more credit for admitting I flip-flopped though?

PERINO: No, I said, that you are actually remarkably inconsistent in your thoughts but when you flip flop you do it in spectacular fashion.

BECKEL: You know, something that happens every ten years is memorable. We don't have to forget it.

WATTERS: Okay. Good.


PERINO: That's worth?

GUTFELD: Yes. I'm all right.

PERINO: No. But you have a great point.


PERINO: All right. Up next, Greg shares his thoughts that's when he'll give us his great point. It's all about the hysteria regarding President Trump.


GUTFELD: What happened to my music? Anyway, it's spreading: impeachmentitis. The symptoms: exaggeration, insinuation, hyperventilation.


REP. AL GREEN, D-TEXAS: I rise today Mr. Speaker to call for the impeachment of the President of the United States of America. For obstruction of justice.

GEORGE STEPHANOPOULOS, ABC NEWS: It's a big question, did President Trump try to block the FBI's Russia investigation, commit an impeachable offense.

GAYLE KING, 'CBS THIS MORNING': We keep hearing that I-word a lot. Is impeachment now on the table?

CHUCK TODD, NBC NEWS: The ground has completely shifted on Capitol Hill. So, yes, you're going to have hearings, I think we know what the summer is going to be. It's going to be the summer of Comey.

DAVID GERGEN, CNN ANALYST: I was in the Nixon administration as you know, and I thought after watching the Clinton impeach, I totally never see another one. But I think we are in impeachment territory for the first time.


GUTFELD: So, it's war, "Mean Girls"-style, a slumber party of un-sourced gossip followed by hysteria every single day. Now, Trump could be better but he's 70 and never had a boss who could fire him. But there's also never been a president more hated within The Beltway. After the election, the first word out of Hillary's mouth wasn't goodbye, it was resist and now they're all onboard doing her job.

But what does it really change? Nothing. It only makes the game more interesting. Our government has always done stuff that the public doesn't see. Problem is, Donald Trump doesn't hide it making him a leaker's dream. And so, we have this orgy of cable news air burning.

But how is this worse than the IRS scandal? You think Obama never slow-walked anything? You think he didn't tell the Russians to chill until he won? You think you didn't give Manning a pass? Give me a break, that's so much worse.

Oh, but Greg, that shouldn't excuse Donald Trump! Yes, it does. When those drooling defenders of Obama's errors now scream for Trump's head you bet it does. So, it's a pure media play like a 24 hour Super Bowl and it would end until there's a loser which won't be the media or the pollsters because like roaches they survive everything.

So, electing Trump, a disruptive force, was revolutionary. So now, what you are seeing is the counterrevolution led by a frantic force that slept through the last nine years. The whole thing is silly and overwrought. It's like a "Twilight" movie with old, ugly people.

BECKEL: Sort of a music.


GUTFELD: That's music to my ears. So Dana, is this impeachment talk overblown, under blown or just blown?

PERINO: Completely overblown, and nothing is more unattractive to me than overreach and also nothing can unite a party like in impeachment effort.


PERINO: So, if you look back at Bill Clinton after the Republicans impeach in there, what happened? Bill Clinton's popularity with the Democrats went way up and actually has never waned.

GUTFELD: That is true.

PERINO: I'm not saying that's going to happen here, and for his detractors, it's like every night they think that there's going to be some payoff.


PERINO: So like they're waiting. They're like every night they tune in like tonight is the night.


PERINO: Tonight is the night. It's going to be like impeachment is, I would say, 98 percent not happening unless there is some sort of evidence that comes forward that we might not even known him for like two or three years. So, I think they are chasing something that is not going to be the case. It doesn't mean that there isn't political damage to his agenda or the inability to actually get on message and stay on it, that's all true. But I think impeachment is way out-of-bounds.

GREG GUTFELD, THE FIVE HOST, FOX NEWS: Jesse, It seems like this is an example of like some contagious, highly concentrated mass hysteria like fainting schools in grade school. Somebody would faint and another person would faint then somebody would throw up and they would have to bring in the powder sawdust. JESSE WATTERS, THE FIVE HOST, FOX NEWS: It's contagious.


WATTERS: It's all all over television. I think the media is swinging for defenses here because they have nothing left in the bullpen.


WATTERS: If Nancy Pelosi is against impeachment, I think she is the voice of reason, I think you have to pump the brakes a little bit there. The only think that Trump has obstructed technically is Hillary moving into the White House.

GUTFELD: Which is the.

WATTERS: Let's look at what happened here here. He's at dinner and he says, Flynn is a good guy, I hope that he doesn't go down. That's not obstruction. That's not threatening the FBI director. Obstruction of justice you have to act with knowledge of committing a crime and have intends to undermine. And if that was true, then Comey is guilty of a felony for not reporting it immediately.


WATTERS: And Obama interfered in two ongoing investigations with chilling public statements on the IRS and Hillary. So, you know, I don't really think this is going to knock anything. He survived locker room talk. If you can survived a locker room talk, I think you can survive a memo from Comey.

GUTFELD: You know, Kimberly...


GUTFELD: I think the media failed to realize that they are talking about essentially a coup. Because they're trying to look for perceived injustice and build it into something bigger. But they failed to realize there are 60 million people plus that voted for Trump, civilians who voted for an idea.

You think you're going to try to get -- you think you're going to find a weasel way to get him out of office and not pissed off millions of people who will take to the streets? They're not thinking about the safety of the country.

GUILFOYLE: Or the well-being of the country going ahead as a free Republic. GUTFELD: It's not like impeaching Nixon or Clinton, people will hit the streets because they know you're trying to weasel this.

BOB BECKEL, THE FIVE HOST, FOX NEWS: You really think so?

GUILFOYLE: Well, what he is trying to say -- Bob, you're not tool alarmed, is that President Trump has very active and vocal supporters that helped carry him into the office. And so for the Democrats, I think it's very loose and they're over promising and they're going to under deliver to their supporters and constituents. I don't believe that they're going to be able to impeach this president. Based on what evidence?

Certainly nothing that has been put forward thus far. So they are doing this and they are hyping it and hyping it because they like the sound of it, they like the idea of it, they like the sound of the fund raising dollars and how it sounds back to their constituents. But they're not actually thinking about what's in the best interest of the country to try to undermine the presidency.

The other problem is it's not just that the mainstream media and the Dems and the liberals, there are people within the president's own party and I believe in his own administration that aren't really serving him the best way that they could, perhaps they're not all on board with his policies and his proposals and his agenda.

If I were him, I would tighten up the ranks and make sure that he has a real strong loyalty with him like President Reagan did, they called at Reagan's army, when he came in and he dismissed the people that weren't his people and brought in his own to go forward.

GUTFELD: Bob, should it scared the average American that a political party in the media are so in line, they're practically interchangeable on this issue?

BECKEL: I'm not sure the American people think about that much. You know, let me push back on you here for a minute.


BECKEL: Let me make a statement audible. You say that there's nothing there. How do you know? None of us know. We've got to wait for the facts to come out.

GUILFOYLE: Thus far.

BECKEL: So we shouldn't just dismiss it as saying it won't be impeachable. I don't know whether it will or not. My guess is neither will or not.

GUTFELD: But that argument cancels out. Because you just argued against your own argument. It's impeachable, it's impeachable, how do you know?

BECKEL: I didn't say it was impeachable. I said I'm the one against the chance of impeachment. Let me just say one other thing which is that I've set this table now for three weeks and listened to the constant drumbeat of jumping all over Obama. As one makes statement, you may not care, it doesn't matter to me. The next Obama comment is, don't ask me to comment on it.

GUTFELD: Okay. All right.

BECKEL: I'm out of that. If you guys can't defend your own guy and I -- this weakling (ph) needs a lot of defense, why don't you defend him instead of going back to Obama?

WATTERS: Because were making an analogy that President Obama said that there is no national security threat by having a secret server. And no one said anything about obstruction of justice then on the media. Now, Trump says almost the exact same thing but much less and now you're saying there is ground for impeachment of your party, it doesn't make sense.

GUTFELD: And somebody charged with the biggest release of classified documents in U.S. military gets 35 years in jail and Obama sent him home with a hero's welcome. And this is somehow worse.


PERINO: They have to deal with the reality that they have. If the president said these are the cards we deal, we have to play the best hand that we possibly can. And I also think that we don't know what the intent was. If it is true, then he dismissed aids from the oval office including the attorney general so he can have a private conversation with Director Comey about Michael Flynn, and he says, I hope you might do this, that's actually actionable.

If your boss or somebody on behalf of your boss is asking you or pressuring you to defend that person or this person, that is actually actionable. It might not be illegal, but it is considered wrong.

WATTERS: But Comey should have said something at the time if they believe that was obstruction of justice.

PERINO: Not necessarily, if he thought -- I actually -- I totally disagree with that.

WATTERS: He does have an obligation.

PERINO: No, he doesn't at the time. If he thought that he had control of the investigation, and they didn't feel that there was -- at the time.

WATTERS: In the statute, it says, when you become aware of obstruction of justice, you have to immediately report it to your supervisor or else.

PERINO: His memo doesn't say there was obstruction of justice. He hasn't actually testified yet, and that's what all you got. In addition, there is the investigation that Mueller will do and he has to testify in public hearing that will happen.

WATTERS: If the FBI director didn't agree with obstruction at the time, then I don't think it was obstruction.

PERINO: Well, then maybe that's what will happen. But I will say this does not actually make it definitive.

BECKEL: Dana, back to Trump. I think you're right but I don't think at all he had a responsibility to say that because it's an ongoing investigation, it's a piece of the investigation, and I just wouldn't be so quick to dismiss all this.

PERINO: I don't know.

BECKEL: You know, this is like, you know.

GUILFOYLE: I don't think anybody is. We say, we are going to wait to see what the results of the investigation are. We are talking about what we know thus far, what are the next steps in the process, due process to find out exactly what happened for the truth of the matter.

GUTFELD: I am so sick and tired of this high and mighty garbage, behind the scenes is never squeaky clean. Informants, police pay them off. When you pull back the curtain, the truth is in every walk of life, there is some kind of negotiation. We somehow elected somebody who only does is negotiate and unaware that somehow that's not part of the formal duty.

BECKEL: You've seen "The Wizard of Oz," I assume?

GUTFELD: It's a shady part of life.

BECKEL: Donald Trump is the guy behind the big smoke of the wizard.

WATTERS: That makes you the Tin Man.


BECKEL: You know, Jesse, that makes you the lion with the big heart? Willing to admit that you were wrong?

WATTERS: Thank you, yes.

GUTFELD: I just want to know who is Dorothy.

BECKEL: Now we've got about 10,000 others you can get to.

GUTFELD: Who is the wicked witch? Who is Dorothy? Let's move on. Coming up, President Trump is firing back against his critics. We are going to show you that next, are we? Yes.


GUILFOYLE: Welcome back to "The Five." President Trump travels to Connecticut today where he delivers the commencement address at the Coast Guard Academy. In his message to the cadets, Mr. Trump discussed some of the recent press coverage of his presidency.


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I want to take this opportunity to give some advice. Over the course of your life, you will find that things are not always fair. Look at the way I've been treated lately. Especially by the media. No politician in history -- and I say this with great surety -- has been treated worse or more unfairly.


GUILFOYLE: President Trump also explained how his administration overcame adversity to accomplish a number of goals.


TRUMP: We've saved the second amendment, expanded service for our veterans. I've loosened up the strangling environmental chains wrapped around our country and our economy. We've begun plans and preparations for the border wall. We are going to give you major tax reform. I didn't get elected to serve the Washington media or special interests. I got elected to serve the forgotten men and women of our country.


GUILFOYLE: And that was the movement that brought the president into the oval. Jesse, so this was a good speech today, to be there with the coast guard and addressed them. Obviously, this treatment by the media is something that is forefront in the president's mind, feeling that he has had a number of accomplishments that he's been able to carry forth but it gets lost in sort of the storm.

WATTERS: I think Anthony Weiner was treated pretty badly by the press but Trump is getting just eviscerated. These are the facts. I admit it's a little pathetic to say I'm the victim when you're the commander in chief, you're the president of the United States and the leader of the free world. But, the media has called Donald Trump a clan member, a sexual deviant, Hitler, (inaudible), a bigot, they've ridiculed his son, his grandson, his wife.

They smeared his business accomplishment, his books, his empire, his taxes. They've done everything they could to stop his presidency from going forward. So I can see why he's a little testy and I think it works for him because I think when he does this and he plays the victim, it really rallies the base because he is seeing despite the fact that he's a billionaire, he's a little bit of an underdog taking on the establishment (inaudible) dynasty.


BECKEL: Can I get my vomit towel now? This guy is a whiner. He's been a whiner all of his life. He's been handed everything he's ever got. Now he's about to fall below 30 percent.

WATTERS: Was he handed a billion dollars? BECKEL: No, he said about $200 million by his dad.

WATTERS: That's not true.

BECKEL: Yes, it was.

WATTERS: If you were handed -- what he was handed, you probably have lost it all.

BECKEL: Oh, I say, he loses three casinos.


BECKEL: Atlantic City (inaudible). You can't do that. It takes an idiot to lose a casino. And he's an idiot.

GUILFOYLE: See, you're whining. You whine about talking about Obama all the time. Dana?

PERINO: I think media bias is all relative, right? So with President Bush, the media said that he had traded blood for oil and it was repeated then by other people that I won't have to go into right now. Trashing the media does keep people in your corner but that's about it. Right now they have got to use President Trump's persuasive abilities at the bully pulpit to help try to get his agenda through.

I've heard today that the new polling coming in on the American health care is politically toxic for the Republicans. His voice is actually needed to try to explain to people why that bill makes sense, why tax reform makes sense. He also has a great concept for his foreign trip.

They've done almost nothing to lay that out. It would have been great at (inaudible) university or the coast guard to do that. But if you are going to talk -- when he talks about media bias, you can bet the media is going to pick up on it because it works for both, everyone wins and everyone loses.

GUILFOYLE: You're absolutely right. They should be doing a really good job to get this message out. This is a fantastic trip in terms of the way what they have structured and.

GUTFELD: There are a lot of people pointing out that when President Trump said a lot of politicians -- he's been the worst treated of all politicians. People pointed out what about those that were assassinated. It's so obvious what he was talking about, he was talking about a choreographed army of critics in media, entertainment, you name it.

But the thing is this. If it wasn't Trump who was elected as a Republican and if it was Rubio or Rick Perry or Ted Cruz, the people who hate Trump would hate to them only slightly less.


GUTFELD: So the idea that somehow they would be treating them differently, no. A conventional Republican candidate, they would see that person as evil because they see all Republicans.

PERINO: Look at what they did to Romney.

GUTFELD: Yeah. They vilify Romney.

PERINO: He's a nice guy.

GUTFELD: They vilify Bush, they vilify Reagan, they vilify Rubio over his pro-life stuff. Any Republican is evil to them. The only difference here is Trump is not just evil to them, but scary to them. And I kind of would rather have somebody that scares them in original.


BECKEL: He really scares people.


BECKEL: Yeah, he's a punk.


GUILFOYLE: Bob, I like my present from your friends. WATTERS: Yes, swamp swag.

GUILFOYLE: There you go.


GUILFOYLE: Drain the swamp, but not them.


GUILFOYLE: Up next, Michael Moore has a threat for President Trump. We are going to tell you about it after this quick break.


BECKEL: Welcome back. In 2004, Michael Moore, director of "Fahrenheit 9/11" had a documentary that was highly critical of President George W. Bush and the war on terror. He now says he's working on a new movie called "Fahrenheit 11/9" (inaudible) I'm going to pass because (inaudible) after the election (inaudible) says it will doom Trump's presidency.

This is what Trump keeps talking. That's dooming his presidency. But, Greg, what do you think? Do you think he's got the (inaudible)?

GUTFELD: I think it's really smart because he realizes the media will sell this movie for him, it will be featured on every single show because the people who are the gatekeepers of entertainment will eat this crap up. And I'm willing to bet, if Michael Moore created a movie poster and released 90 minutes of dead air, the media would still give it five stars because they just assume it's great and not even watch it. BECKEL: Okay. We've only got 90 seconds. Go ahead, Dana.

PERINO: Well, "Fahrenheit 9/11" did certainly I think have an impact on President Bush's popularity numbers but it didn't lead to impeachment. If you think this is the golden egg that's going to get you there, it isn't.

BECKEL: I don't want to see him impeached. I want to keep him around and win big numbers in 18. Go ahead, Jesse.

WATTERS: I mean, I think he looks good, he's lost a little weight. I definitely would comment on that. I've interviewed him a few times. I think he's a sincere, honest guy. He's been on Fox a few times. You know, I don't think he's a bad guy. I think he's a professional propaganda artist. The last few films he has had have been flopped, so I don't see this move the needle at all. Wishful thinking.

BECKEL: I feel he did pretty well. What do you think, Kim?

GUILFOYLE: I think it's so courageous of him to do this film, not.

BECKEL: I see. Okay. That's good. That ends my segment. I will see you all in a week by the way. "One More Thing" is up next.


WATTERS: Time now for "One More Thing." Dana?

PERINO: Okay. So, last week, we told you about a troubling story in San Diego area involving a 15 times reported illegal immigrant who crashed his family's truck, the family is returning from Disneyland, sending a 6-year- old boy to the hospital. The suspect is Constantino Banda-Acosta. He now faces state charges.

But we asked, why haven't the feds actually prosecuted him? Well, after our report and a little behind-the-scenes pressure, we can tell you the U.S. attorney's office in San Diego on Friday did the right thing and charged him with Illegal reentry, the first time he's been charged with that crime.

We were able to talk with the mother of the young boy, he's still in the hospital. She said that the thoughts and prayers that we've been able to help get for all of them has really helped her and sustained them, and she thanks all of us for thinking about him and keeping him in our prayers, hopefully he'll be out of the hospital.

GUILFOYLE: Very nice.

WATTERS: Thank you very much for that. KG?

GUILFOYLE: Okay. So, in a rare TV interview this morning, Gisele Bundchen - - you know who she is, Bob, right?


GUILFOYLE: Supermodel, wife of New England Patriots star quarterback Tom Brady. She revealed for the first time that her husband has sustained several concussions while playing football even as recently as last year. Take a listen.


GISELE BUNDCHEN, MODEL: As you know, it's not the most -- let's say an aggressive sport. Like, football -- he had a concussion last year. I mean, he has concussions pretty much. We don't talk about it, but he does have concussions. I don't think it's a healthy thing for your body to go through.


GUILFOYLE: Okay. The problem is the NFL is saying that they have no record of Tom Brady suffering concussion but will be investigating the matter. According to the league, the total number of concussions in 2016 including all practices, preseason and regular-season was 244.

BECKEL: It's unbelievable. There's been three quarterbacks who have gone down with concussions and had to get out including Troy Aikman and the NFL once again ducks on it, the cowards.

GUILFOYLE: They try to cover them as well so they don't have to sit out the game or the next game of the season. WATTERS: All right. Greg?

GUTFELD: Time for this. That's my podcast.


GUTFELD: All right. It's loaded on the web. You can find it. It's foxnewspodcast.com. I got slashed whatever. Dr. (inaudible) said, evolutionary psychologist, we talk about Trump, it's pretty good, now it's time for this. Greg's rich kid news. Rich kids are awesome, I can't get enough of them, they're so rich. I love it because they combined wealth with puppies. Let's take a look at this Instagram in England.

It is creating an uproar because this woman is using an adorable puppy to polish her two million-dollar Maserati. A lot of people are upset because they think this is a poor use of a puppy, but apparently the dog really enjoys it. You know what? The puppy probably has a better life than all of us. If she has a two million-dollar Maserati, imagine the dog house. So I salute you, rich kids of England. GUILFOYLE: The puppy probably eats better steak than you.


WATTERS: All right. President Trump received a ceremonial saver at the U.S. Coast Guard Commencement Ceremony today. There was a hot mike moment with Department of Homeland Security Secretary John Kelly. Roll the tape.


JOHN KELLY, U.S. SECRETARY OF HOMELAND SECURITY: You can use that on the press.

TRUMP: Yeah.


WATTERS: I think he needs to be investigated for that threat, very, very scary stuff. All right. Bob, what do you have?

BECKEL: You know, Dwayne Johnson, The Rock, everybody knows who he is, decided he wants to run for president. So recent poll out shows that the rock now beats Donald Trump, 42-38, and everybody up against him. As a matter of fact, if you look, Joe Biden beats him by 34, this guy is as dead politically.

GUTFELD: Fake news. He's not running for president, Bob.

WATTERS: The only polls that matter are on election day.

BECKEL: Oh, yeah, forget it.

WATTERS: All right. Set your DVR. Never miss an episode of "The Five." "Hannity" is up next.

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