Rep. Tim Ryan calls Trump’s historic visit to the DMZ an 'appeasement tour'
2020 Democratic presidential candidate Rep. Tim Ryan says he is very disappointed in President Trump's visit to North Korea.
This is a rush transcript from "Sunday Morning Futures," June 30, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MARIA BARTIROMO, HOST: Good Sunday morning, everyone. Thanks so much for joining us. I'm Maria Bartiromo.
Joining me exclusively straight ahead right here on "Sunday Morning Futures," Republican House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy with new reaction this morning to President Trump's historic crossing into North Korea to meet Kim Jong-un and the temporary trade cease-fire the president brokered with China's Xi Jinping.
Plus, 2020 Democratic presidential candidate Congressman Tim Ryan of Ohio is here.
Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna of California is here. He sits on the House Armed Services Committee and co-chairs the Bernie Sanders campaign.
Also ahead, Mike Pillsbury, who has been advising President Trump and trade adviser Peter Navarro on China trade talks.
Plus, Ken Cuccinelli is here, acting director for U.S. citizenship and immigration services, on the crisis at our southern border.
All that right here, right now, as we look ahead on "Sunday Morning Futures."
And we begin this Sunday morning with President Trump making history as the first sitting American president to set foot in North Korea.
Kim Jong-un accepted a last-minute invitation to meet at the DMZ, which the president tweeted out just before leaving the G20 in Japan for South Korea. Both leaders agreed to restart the stalled nuclear talks between Washington and Pyongyang.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KIM JONG-UN, NORTH KOREAN LEADER (through translator): I believe, just looking at this action, this is an expression of his willingness to eliminate all the unfortunate past and open a new future.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT: I just want to say that this is my honor. I didn't really expect it.
We were in Japan for the G20. We came over. And I said, hey, I'm over here. I want to call up Chairman Kim. And we got to meet. And stepping across that line was a great honor. A lot of progress has been made.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BARTIROMO: Joining me right now on the telephone, House Minority Leader and California Congressman Kevin McCarthy to react.
And, Congressman, it's great to see you this morning. Thanks very much for joining us.
REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY, R-CALIF.: Thanks for having me, Maria.
And what a historical night. While America slept, President Trump made history.
BARTIROMO: Let's talk about that, yes.
MCCARTHY: To be the first president to stop -- to take a step into North Korea.
Historians will study this night. They will study this week, because this is significant. This is the change of direction for the next 25 years, first the restarting of talks with China for trade on our -- really on our standards.
But to restart these talks after he rightfully walked away in Vietnam, this is the correct way. And, really, even those who dislike this president are going to have to give him credit. This is what he said when he talked about the art of the deal, that this could make America and the world fundamentally different for the next century.
BARTIROMO: Wow.
So talk more about the significance of it, because, you know, the critic wills push back and say, look, let's not forget the fact that North Korea has not done anything just yet in terms of denuclearization. The president has been trying to prod denuclearization and trying hard to get Kim Jong-un to think differently.
The significance of this meeting is what?
MCCARTHY: The difference is, they are no longer testing the places.
And study it in history. And remember when we had the Soviet Union, and President Reagan went to Moscow, went to the Soviet Union, sat with Gorbachev with Iceland, but had to get up and walk away, because it didn't bring the freedom that everybody looked for.
The liberal media criticized him. But, in a few short years, the Berlin Wall collapsed, and so did the Soviet Union. No way would this happen in the short term, but just think, where were we four years ago? Where were we in the Obama administration or the Clinton administration or the Bush administration?
We started this with people criticizing the president when he called him rocket man, but he brought him to the table. He was able to walk away in Vietnam and reset the stage. People said that was a terrible thing to do. But you look at Kim Jong-un, that he sat and he -- on his face, that he smiled with this president.
This president did it in a manner that let him save face, but now is bringing people to negotiate to denuclearize, that he showed him, because we're in a stronger hand today, their economics are in a very difficult position.
So America's in a stronger position to make the world safer, and the president did it with style that others have not been able to do it. And I give him a tremendous amount of credit.
Even though they dislike him, those who dislike him have to give him credit on what he was able to achieve. Now, it is not the end. But it is the restarting that, when we look back in history, this will be the moment, this will be the moment that turned the tables, just like in Iceland with Reagan walking away from Gorbachev.
BARTIROMO: So, what are you going to look at in terms of catalysts, in terms of where we are in terms of the denuclearization going forward?
What are the...
MCCARTHY: First of all, they haven't been testing long-term missiles anymore. So, that's a safer place to be.
BARTIROMO: OK.
MCCARTHY: They are economically in a tougher position. The president had shown them that he's willing to step across, that he's willing to go further than others.
So, you have go to build that trust. And that takes time. And I think these two men have built this trust that could make a stronger decision together. So it's going to be -- have to be probably in a phased, in a gradual step-by-step process.
But to restart it, to be in doubt before, makes it even stronger. And, remember, what had taken place since he left Vietnam? North Korea was then trying to become closer to Russia and closer to China. But this president has reset that stage.
And look at what we are doing with China. This G20, this last week, historians will study what the president has been able to achieve, just in this week, is so important.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
How significant a role do you think President Xi Jinping played in this? Obviously, he met with Xi Jinping at the G20 on the sidelines. Do you believe the conversation came up toward North Korea? And is this one of the reasons that the president was encouraged to go to DMZ?
MCCARTHY: Only history will tell us in the end that that took place, but I believe it probably did, because China doesn't want to have North Korea collapse, because what will happen? There will be -- all the North Koreans will try to be moving in across that border.
They don't want to have a destabilization over there as well. And they know for what President Trump has been trying to achieve. He's been utilizing China, at the same time trying to get to North Korea as well. He's put America in a stronger position in negotiations with China, where many people criticized him for putting the tariffs on, saying we couldn't sustain ourselves.
But, really, when you looked at it, this is where other presidents would not go. China had more to lose. If China maintains this position, the supply chain will leave China, will go to Vietnam, will go to other places, and will not come back.
You look at new car sales in China dropping by more than 15 percent. You look at the sales when it comes to domestically clothing dropping as well. They are in a tough position. And the president used this opportunity to reset the stage to get us on a more level playing field for negotiations.
BARTIROMO: Yes. Well...
MCCARTHY: And it is not just trade, but it's also, is the world is going to be safer? And I know he would utilize that as well.
BARTIROMO: Yes. No, I understand what you are saying.
From a national security perspective, this seems like this could be huge, but what about the China conversation? It looks like the president is lifting some of these pressures on Huawei. We have been talking about the national security risk that Huawei represents and that China in particular represents, broadly speaking. So what did the president just agree to with Xi Jinping?
MCCARTHY: Well, I have talked to the president a couple days when he's been over there in the negotiation. I talked to him right before he went in with President Xi Jinping.
But I don't know exactly what he's done, but I do know what the president has said all before. Huawei has a real problem. Huawei has the backdoor on the others. The president realizes that.
I think what the president allowed them to do is actually let American products sell to them for a short term, to make sure the negotiation is back on track.
But what he -- I know this president. He is not going to allow Huawei to get in across this world, because, as you have done -- and you're probably one of the leaders on this. I have watched the Huawei executives in with you, where it shows the 55 different backdoors these other countries have bought this product.
That's a real concern to me, because no one else has ever stood up to them. And if it is 10 years from now, we will have lost if we allow Huawei continue to grow and be a...
(CROSSTALK)
MCCARTHY: ... around the world, to our own friends, what they hear from us.
BARTIROMO: That's what I'm saying. And the president is agreeing now that Huawei can supply U.S. companies, despite the blacklist imposed upon the company in mid-May.
So, what should we think about? U.S. companies can still supply Huawei with the technology components that they need. Do you worry that the president is lifting the...
(CROSSTALK)
MCCARTHY: Well, that's a short-term basis. And you know the pressure that he has on China.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: But the one thing that the president is doing and the United States is informing the rest of the world that not to buy Huawei products.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: Do not let them in.
If you buy Huawei products, America will not share the information with you, because we cannot trust where it will go. That is still in a strong position of where -- and when the president comes back, I'm sure he will sit and explain it to the rest of the world.
BARTIROMO: Let me move on to another issue that you have certainly been vocal about, and that is social media and our right to privacy and our right to know who is selling our data and to whom.
Tell me where you are in terms of upcoming legislation on social media. And what do you want to see?
MCCARTHY: Well, this is what we started in the last Congress, because the power of social media today -- if anything on the Internet is offering you something for free, you are not the customer. You are the product.
They are taking your data. And it is not just the entity that's taking your data, who they are selling it to and the third parties and others. And there are -- there are certain companies that have so much control, Google -- 90 percent of all searches go through Google.
The power of what they have, 95 percent of the people could drop off if your ad is on the second page.
BARTIROMO: Right.
MCCARTHY: My concern is, as a conservative, I believe in private property. And that private property happens to be my data.
My data, I should know what you're able to take and collect from me.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: I should be able to move it, and I should be able to delete it, something very simple.
We need legislation such as that, and that's something that I'm working on, because I look at what the Democrats are offering, they think just to break companies up. That does nothing about privacy. They think to over- regulate it, where you create a utility and then you have no innovation.
That's really like a Dodd-Frank world of what they wanted to happen. I'm more concerned about, one, the privacy, but also the competitiveness.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: Google has been found guilty by the FTC in 2012 of what they did to Yelp and TripAdvisor, that we're not allowing new companies to rise and having a fair competition.
Those are things we should look at and actually have legislation that's universal across this country and not have Europe drive this.
BARTIROMO: Yes. Yes.
MCCARTHY: America should drive this.
(CROSSTALK)
MCCARTHY: This is where innovation is created.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: And make sure we're protecting people's privacy.
BARTIROMO: Yes, you make a really important point.
And Europe is a lot more aggressive than the U.S. has been. But then there's another side of this, isn't there, Congressman? And that's the censoring of conservative conversation.
I spoke with the president last week. And he's worried about this, particularly going into the next election, that the social media companies are going to choose a side and put their finger on the scale.
Listen to my conversation with the president this week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Twitter is just terrible, what they do. They don't let you get the word. I have so many people come to me: Sir, I can't join you on Twitter.
I see what's happening, 100 percent.
BARTIROMO: So, do you -- would you rather see competition, or do you want to see legislation coming down to actually...
TRUMP: Well, you may need legislation in order to create competition.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BARTIROMO: "You may need legislation in order to create competition."
Are we going to see legislation also addressing that, Congressman, in terms of the censoring of information and conservative conversation?
MCCARTHY: Well, there's not just that.
A few companies control so much, if you look at YouTube, Google, you look at Facebook, Instagram. But now that we found out from after the election that they did want to influence the election -- I know the Democrats try to go on this hoax of where Russia and other things are happening, but right with inside own country, the power with Twitter and others.
And that's why we brought these CEOs in to Congress last Congress. And every time before a company came in, they would deny something is happening, and the day before, then they would admit it. You had people who worked at Facebook, Republicans, who had to create their own group because they were fearful because of their own philosophy of whether they could work within that job.
You had what Google did to naming the California Republican Party, that our ideology was Nazism.
BARTIROMO: Yes. Oh, yes, I remember that, yes.
MCCARTHY: You had where they thwarted certain conservatives on Twitter, whether their message could get out.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: Shadow-banned them in the process of others.
This is a process. And you look at what they did to...
BARTIROMO: Right.
(CROSSTALK)
MCCARTHY: ... university. We had to go through. They said it wasn't happening.
BARTIROMO: That's right.
MCCARTHY: And then they weren't even allowing it on YouTube to be seen, and what they were rating people.
BARTIROMO: So, you're working on that as well.
MCCARTHY: And what they did to Ben Shapiro.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCARTHY: I mean, this cannot sustain itself. And that's why I thank you for you bringing it forward, to showing light.
But it comes to a point that we may have to legislate.
BARTIROMO: All right, we will leave it there.
When you come back, Congressman, we have got to talk about the border, especially since Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is headed to El Paso tomorrow.
We will see you soon, Congressman. Thanks so much.
MCCARTHY: Thank you.
BARTIROMO: Congressman Kevin McCarthy.
Still ahead on the breaking news of President Trump's historic steps into North Korea, 2020 presidential candidate Tim Ryan is up next, Trump administration China adviser Mike Pillsbury, Bernie Sanders campaign's co- chairman, Congressman Ro Khanna, and the man in charge of U.S. citizenship and immigration services, acting Director Ken Cuccinelli, all right here.
Follow me on Twitter @MariaBartiromo, @SundayFutures, and on Instagram @MariaBartiromo, @SundayFutures. Let us know what you would like to hear from this jam-packed guest list today.
We will be right back on "Sunday Morning Futures."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Welcome back.
President Trump's historic trip to the demilitarized zone between North Korea and South Korea ending with an agreement to resume diplomatic negotiations between North Korea and the U.S.
North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un praising President Trump for his willingness to move forward.
Joining me right now is Ohio Congressman and Democratic presidential candidate Tim Ryan.
Congressman, it's good to see you this morning. Thanks so much for joining us.
REP. TIM RYAN, D-OH, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thanks, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Your reaction to the president's move to the DMZ?
RYAN: I have a much different opinion than Kevin McCarthy has.
I think this has been the President Trump appeasement tour. I have no idea why he's shaking hands with a dictator who just in May was sending missiles into the Sea of Japan.
I mean, you don't reward that kind of behavior with a visit to your country from the president of the United States. There's been no progress at all. They have done nothing, talking about -- it is historic, but what has been done? Nothing.
And the whole deal with China, backing down on Huawei? Are you kidding me? What China has been doing with cybersecurity, what Huawei has been doing all over the world, and we're going to back down? I thought that was the one piece that we could count on President Trump to hold the line on for national security purposes.
And he's loosening what he did. I think this is very, very dangerous. I'm very disappointed in the president. Even those of us who really disagree with him on so much thought that, on the national security piece, he would at least hold the line, and he folded like a cheap suit.
BARTIROMO: Well, I think we -- let's walk through this, because the national security issue, certainly, this is a serious issue. I agree that this is something that we need to really focus on as it relates to China.
But, first, on North Korea, isn't it true that, before you can actually get denuclearization, you need to start with diplomacy? This is the first sitting president to ever step foot in North Korea. This is a historic moment.
RYAN: It is historic, no question, but for what?
I mean, you do these meetings, especially with a dictator, what progress has been made?
BARTIROMO: Right.
RYAN: What good faith has been shown? He hasn't sent a missile in the Sea of Japan in five weeks? I mean, really?
I just cannot believe -- I'm stunned that this president, who is supposed to be Mr. Tough Guy, tough business guy, has absolutely no progress made.
And it points to, he wants to be on TV. He wants the historic moment. He wants the theater of it all. But nobody's more safe in that region now. And now what's the incentive?
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: You are literally praising a dictator who was responsible for the death of an American not too long ago...
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: ... for the way they held this young -- this young boy.
And you reward that with a visit from the president? I mean, what -- I just -- I'm stunned.
BARTIROMO: Wow.
RYAN: I'm stunned by the whole thing. And I just -- I hope that -- I don't know what to say about it.
BARTIROMO: On Huawei, the formal ban has not -- a formal announcement has not been made in terms of formally lifting the ban on Huawei.
But could it be that the president is also taking into account the technology companies that complained that they were not going to be able to sell to Huawei anymore?
RYAN: Well, they can complain all they want.
The number one role, the number one responsibility of the president of the United States is to keep us safe. And Huawei has a history of accessing and allowing the Chinese government to access -- and we're just finding out too that Huawei is the Chinese government.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: They're propping this up like it's some kind of private company.
BARTIROMO: The president told us that.
RYAN: The reality of it is...
BARTIROMO: The president has been very clear about that. And he's right. You know, there are backdoors in Huawei equipment, that the data goes right back to Beijing.
RYAN: Yes. So, why are we loosening anything? Hold the line on that. That shouldn't be something you take off the table.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: And you are seeing Huawei technologies in rural America. You're seeing Germany making deals.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: It is going all over Europe.
This is something that we just can't back down on.
BARTIROMO: Well, you make a...
RYAN: And I'm very disappointed that the president would do this.
BARTIROMO: You make a lot of good points.
Congressman, I want you to stay with me, because I got to ask you about what's going on in your party, the ideological fight within the Democratic Party, the deep progressives vs. the centrists, as you are.
Also, much more ahead on the breaking developments out of Asia on two huge fronts, denuclearization talks with North Korea, the trade talks with China.
Trump administration China adviser Mike Pillsbury is coming up next.
We will also hear from House Armed Services Committee member as well Ro Khanna.
We will be back with Tim Ryan.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Welcome back.
And we are back with Ohio Congressman Democratic presidential hopeful Tim Ryan.
And, Congressman, I want to ask you about the debates last week.
First off, the night that the moderators asked all of the candidates, would you agree to give health care to illegal immigrants, they all raised their hand. You were not on the stage.
Would you have raised your hand to answer yes to that?
RYAN: Well, if we have undocumented people in the country, I think we do have a responsibility to make sure they have some basic care, yes.
I mean, they're -- but being a part of the Medicare program or something like that, that's a whole other conversation that we need to have.
BARTIROMO: Well, you are from Ohio. You are representing the working class.
RYAN: I mean, and it speaks to the...
BARTIROMO: And you're going to give illegals health care. What about American citizens, Congressman? What about your constituents?
RYAN: Well, that's what I was just going to say. The focus has got to be on getting health care to people in the United States.
And, right now, the Republicans had two plans they pushed, Maria. Both of them kicked 22 million people off of their health care. Thank God it didn't get far enough.
But they are getting rid of preexisting conditions. So what's coming out of the Republican Party right now is taking health care away from American citizens. That needs to be the focus. How do we make sure that people in America can have accessible, affordable health care?
And I support a public option for people to be able to do that. I think that's entirely appropriate.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
You talk about 20 million. Your colleagues want to take 180 million people off of private insurance. Let's face it. When you were there, the question was, do you -- are you OK with getting rid of private insurance?
One hundred and eighty million people are getting their health care from the private insurance industry. You didn't raise your hand on this one, correct?
RYAN: No, I didn't. I'm not for taking private insurance away.
I'm for some kind of public option. I think we have got to move to some type of Medicare for all system at some point, but the natural next step is a public option for people to buy into right now. And I don't believe we should be taking people's private insurance away.
But, look, when you see what the pharmaceutical industry are doing, I was just at my mom's a few weeks ago. She's paying 1,000 bucks a month in prescription drug costs. She's a working-class person, and just outside of Youngstown, Ohio.
BARTIROMO: Well...
RYAN: I mean, that's so unfair...
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: ... when these pharmaceutical industries are taking so much publicly funded research, and then turning around and gouging the consumer.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: We have got to address this. So, the question is going to be...
BARTIROMO: Let me ask you this, real quick, Congressman.
Kamala Harris...
RYAN: Yes.
BARTIROMO: ... a lot of people think she stole the show that second night. She said -- first , she raised her hand and she said, yes, I'm for Medicare for all. That means eliminating 180 million people with private health insurance.
Then, later, she changed her stance on that. She says, oh, I didn't understand the question.
Do you believe she didn't understand the question or is she now realizing Medicare for all is a loser?
(LAUGHTER)
RYAN: You will have to ask her that.
But I think we cannot be a party that goes into a general election taking private health insurance away from union members in some of these states that negotiated pretty good health care plans for themselves, sacrificed wages during the negotiations to get a good health care plan.
I just don't think -- we need to make sure that people have an option, and if they want to then go leave their private voluntarily, and go into the public option, they can do that.
BARTIROMO: The point is, is, how are you going to stand out?
The point is, Congressman, how are you going to stand out? Much of your party has gone severely to the left. You know that. Medicare for all is what we're talking about, because Bernie Sanders has that plan. We're going to talk with Ro Khanna coming up, the co-chairman of his campaign.
But you have got to do something to actually pass go with your party, who are massive progressives who want things like these socialist policies.
RYAN: Well, I tell you what.
My focus the other night in the debate was getting the focus back on the economic anxiety that people are facing, whether they're white, black, brown, gay, straight, man, woman -- 75 percent of the American people now are living paycheck to paycheck. They can't withstand a $400 emergency, or they economically unravel.
That's my focus. And I will tell you that my phone has been ringing off the hook, not just after our debate on Wednesday, but also the debate on Thursday, as President -- Vice President Biden was slipping a little bit.
My phone's been ring off the hook, because people are seeing me as the person who can emerge about a working-class agenda in the industrial Midwest, be able to be the top of the ticket, to go in to places like Kentucky, to beat McConnell, to go into places like South Carolina to beat Lindsey Graham.
(CROSSTALK)
RYAN: We have to got to win the Senate back too. And you got to win North Carolina, Kansas, Iowa, these states.
BARTIROMO: Well, you're going to have to come up with an answer on the border.
RYAN: A Tim Ryan at the top of the ticket...
BARTIROMO: You're going to have to come up with an answer on the border.
I mean, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez headed to the border. Why didn't you just -- why didn't you just take the Senate bill?
So, there's that as well.
RYAN: Well, no one is going to secure the border better than I am.
But the reality is, Maria, the problem is in Central...
BARTIROMO: Why? Why are you going to secure the border so well?
RYAN: Because you have got to put some resources there. Ninety percent of the drugs coming in are...
BARTIROMO: Your colleagues don't even want to put resources there. Your colleagues don't want that.
RYAN: That's not true. That's -- well, that's not true.
We want -- I want to put resources -- and I can't speak for everybody, but I want to make sure we have enough personnel down there, enough people to process people...
BARTIROMO: OK.
RYAN: ... that these people who are seeking asylum get some basic care...
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: ... so human beings aren't laying in their own snot for three weeks and diapers aren't getting changed.
But here's leadership, Maria. Going to Central America and getting to the root of the problem. Why are these people migrating to the United States?
BARTIROMO: Exactly.
RYAN: Because gangs are running Honduras and Guatemala and El Salvador.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: So, a real president would say, let's get to the root of the problem. Let's fix it, so these people can stay in their own homes in Central America.
BARTIROMO: Or a real Congress would get to work and overturn those loopholes, Congressman, right?
(CROSSTALK)
BARTIROMO: A real Congress is going to get together and say, look, you have got the asylum standards. You have got the Flores agreement.
Let's fix this, so that everybody -- we're not going to talk about a million apprehensions in 2019.
Real quick. We have got to jump.
RYAN: But that still doesn't get to the root of the problem of why people are leaving the country.
It's still going to be a destabilizing factor for Central America, for North America if gangs are running three key countries in Central America.
BARTIROMO: Right.
RYAN: Go down there and fix the problem. The president hasn't talked one lick about this at all. Play some offense. Go down there and fix the problem.
BARTIROMO: I think this is -- he has campaigned on this. He's been talking about not much else away from the border. He's trying to get Congress to...
RYAN: He's not talking about Central America.
BARTIROMO: He's talking about America.
RYAN: He's not talking -- in fact, he's cutting the State Department...
BARTIROMO: Yes, he's talking about North America.
RYAN: He's -- he's cutting the State Department funding that would be the very solution to go down to Central America and stop and secure that area.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: I'm not saying we have got to, you know, prop up the entire country, but make it secure enough, where people don't want to come to our country, where it costs us billions of dollars.
It's time for us to be smart. He likes this as a TV show.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: Same with North Korea. And he's acting like Chamberlain when he's going to North Korea.
BARTIROMO: Congressman -- yes.
RYAN: Same with China. He's backing down there.
He wants the TV show. He wants to win the 24-hour news cycle. He's not solving any of these problems.
BARTIROMO: Well, I think a lot of problems have been solved on the economy, Congressman.
But, listen, let's keep -- continue this conversation. I so appropriate...
RYAN: Not from where I come from, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Not -- not in Ohio, huh? I'm going to -- I want to take a look at some of those metrics.
RYAN: Seventy-five percent of the American...
BARTIROMO: Yes.
RYAN: Seventy-five percent of the American people still living paycheck to paycheck.
BARTIROMO: All right, Congressman, it's good to have you on the program.
RYAN: And that -- the work...
BARTIROMO: Yes, we will talk more.
RYAN: Thanks, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Please come back soon, Congressman Tim Ryan, joining us.
RYAN: Thank you. Thanks.
BARTIROMO: Up next, the man advising the Trump administration on trade talks with China, he is here, Michael Pillsbury.
Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Welcome back.
President Trump making history today, walking side by side with dictator Kim Jong-un on to the soil of North Korea, then meeting him back in South Korea, where he says they agreed to restart talks on denuclearization, all of this on the heels of the G20 summit in Osaka, Japan, where the president and his Chinese counterpart declared a cease-fire in their trade war.
My next guest advised President Trump and Trade and Manufacturing Policy Director Peter Navarro ahead of the summit.
Michael Pillsbury is with me right now. He's senior fellow and director for Chinese strategy at the Hudson Institute.
Mike, it's great to have you on the program this morning. Thanks so much for being here.
MICHAEL PILLSBURY, FORMER ASSISTANT UNDERSECRETARY OF DEFENSE: Thank you, Maria.
BARTIROMO: You may have heard Tim Ryan railing against President Trump...
(LAUGHTER)
PILLSBURY: Yes, I did.
BARTIROMO: ... in terms of what he did with Huawei.
First, can you go through what the strategy is with China at this point? What just took place in Osaka?
PILLSBURY: Sure.
The most important thing was to get President Xi to return his delegation to the talks. There was a major breakdown six weeks ago. The talks really faced extinction at that point. They were taking back a lot of major points and were refusing to go further on the enforcement mechanism.
And so it was a pretty bleak situation. I think what had to happen is, President Xi's team made clear in their media that he needs something on Huawei at this meeting. He also needed to have the tariffs at least not imposed at this meeting.
Otherwise, he would be saying no to any further talks. That's what President Trump did. It is a brilliant stroke. The president deserves a lot of credit. He hasn't spelled out the details of the Huawei matter. He hasn't said, you know, Huawei can be in 5G now around the world.
But he has focused on American technology suppliers of parts to Huawei. This gives President Xi the face he needs to face down his hawks in China and restart the talks. So it's a huge success for the president.
BARTIROMO: OK, but, I mean, we have been talking about and hearing from this president about the massive national security threat that Huawei is to America.
To lift that embargo, does that fly right into the face of what the president has been telling us for so long?
PILLSBURY: Well, this goes back to what the president did on the ZTE matter, Maria, as you know.
He hasn't said Huawei should be put out of business. He's talked about the national security threat from Huawei eavesdropping, backdoors, surveillance, a series of things that are just not acceptable.
So he doesn't want Huawei to get into sensitive sectors around the world. Our government is still banned from buying Huawei products. But it's something different to say we want to bankrupt and destroy Huawei. That's what the president has not done.
I actually had a meeting in London last month with the Huawei leadership. They make a distinction between keeping alive, like ZTE did, with 70,000 jobs for China, vs. being put out of business entirely.
I think that's the needle the president has threaded. He's not given up in any way. This fake news that this is somehow a catastrophe and he's surrendered on Huawei, it's just not true.
BARTIROMO: I see.
PILLSBURY: He has not lifted -- he has not lifted the ban. The effort to keep Huawei out of 5G in Germany, England, India, around the world, that's going to continue...
BARTIROMO: OK.
PILLSBURY: ... but not to -- no to destroy the company. That's what President Trump has allowed American parts to continue being supplied.
BARTIROMO: OK, yes, because, I had Andy Purdy, the chief security officer of Huawei, on my show on FOX Business last week.
PILLSBURY: I saw that, yes.
(LAUGHTER)
BARTIROMO: And he basically said, look, you know, there are no backdoors. And I said, well, wait a minute there are backdoors. And all the data goes right back to Beijing. But he keeps pushing back on that.
Look, Mike, before you go, I got to get your reaction to the North Korean news. Do you think that the meeting with China's Xi Jinping had anything to do with the president's decision to go to the DMZ? And what does that represent? Tell me what this signifies.
PILLSBURY: It represents progress on the big picture of trying to get this young leader to go with his grandfather, give up the nuclear weapons and go for prosperity, market liberalization.
This was another big success by the president. He's got to nudge the young chairman toward a really historic decision, and not be rude, nasty, call him names, that kind of thing. I think this is another success, very delicate, very nuanced. The step across the border was really historic.
So, we're looking at another success for something President Trump says Obama told him...
BARTIROMO: Yes.
PILLSBURY: ... this will lead to war, we will be at war soon, unless you do something.
BARTIROMO: Right.
PILLSBURY: So I think it is fake news to criticize Trump on these two fronts.
BARTIROMO: OK.
Well, real quick, in terms of a potential deal with China, I mean, why would the Chinese give in to not stealing intellectual property and forcing the transfer of technology, when we know they just reneged in May on those two issues? And these are the two big-ticket items.
PILLSBURY: There's two -- that's a great question.
There's two reasons. One is, they say they want to cut this out themselves. They are generating enough intellectual property themselves.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
PILLSBURY: They don't want other countries to steal it.
The other thing is, China is a very strong economy. If you look at IMF, World Bank, and even the CIA Factbook, China surpassed our economy three years ago in purchase power parity. They are bigger than we are, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Right.
PILLSBURY: A lot of people don't understand that. Trump is dealing with an equal power here.
He can't just spit in their face and say, you sign this agreement, or else go to hell. He's got to be very clever and nuanced. And that's what he's doing.
BARTIROMO: Well, let's not forget the consumers of the world are in America.
PILLSBURY: Yes.
BARTIROMO: Mike, it's great to see you. Thanks so much.
PILLSBURY: Thanks, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Mike Pillsbury joining us there.
For more reaction, let get to Democratic Congressman Ro Khanna of California. He's also the co-chairman of the Bernie Sanders campaign.
And, Congressman, it's good to see you this morning. Thanks so much for joining us.
REP. RO KHANNA, D-CALIF.: Maria, great to see you again.
BARTIROMO: Your reaction to the president's meeting with Kim Jong-un overnight?
KHANNA: I support the president's initiative. And, as a Democrat in the United States Congress, I will do everything I can to see it succeed.
Chung-in Moon, one of President Moon's senior advisers, was in my office two weeks ago, and he thinks there's a three-part framework to get a deal. First, the United States and North Korea should have a permanent peace agreement. We still have an armistice. We should move towards permanent peace.
If we do that, then I think North Korea will engage in massive denuclearization, 90 percent denuclearization.
BARTIROMO: Right.
KHANNA: And then, after that, we can talk about more flexible sanctions. So, I think the moment is there to have peace.
BARTIROMO: Well, would a potentially President Bernie Sanders, would he have met with Kim Jong-un? Would he be dealing with these issues regarding China?
KHANNA: Yes, he would have.
He said as much this morning, that he had no problem with President Trump meeting with Kim Jong-un. This shouldn't be a partisan issue. This should be an American issue. It is a dangerous situation. We need to engage in diplomacy to resolve it.
And President Carter, who I had met with a few months ago, had actually met with Kim Jong-un's grandfather and had been working towards a framework to get to denuclearization.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
KHANNA: I think there's a clear road map there. And I think we should applaud President Trump for taking that effort.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
Look, I have got to switch gears, ask you about the ideological divide within the Democratic Party...
KHANNA: Sure.
BARTIROMO: ... and Bernie Sanders, your guy's health care plan, Medicare for all.
We know that there's an enormous amount of pushback on Medicare for all. Not only is it going to cost upwards of $32 trillion, but it's also going to knock out 180 million people who currently get their insurance from the private sector.
How do you justify that, sir?
KHANNA: Well, two things.
First of all, the current system costs $49 trillion. So you have to look at it in comparison. What Medicare for all will do will reduce a lot of the pharmaceutical costs, a lot of the hospital costs, a lot of the insurance costs.
Second, if you read actually the bill, it allows for supplemental insurance. So, here's what it does. Medicare for all, you get health care. You get dental. You get vision.
BARTIROMO: No, I did read the bill. I did read the bill. I did read the bill, Congressman.
And it makes the private insurance industry unlawful. It's unlawful to have private insurance.
KHANNA: No, it doesn't.
BARTIROMO: In Bernie's plan.
KHANNA: It is like Britain's bill. You can have -- you can have supplemental insurance after Medicare.
And that is something that many people support, that you have strong Medicare. But if you still -- after you get everything, and you still want private insurance, you can have it under the bill in the House that I'm a co-sponsor of.
BARTIROMO: But you have got the -- you have got the bureaucrats running your life. The government is going to tell you if you can get that MRI or not. This is one of the issues with this plan.
KHANNA: No.
I mean, I think, look, if you -- if people who are on Medicare, if you ask them...
BARTIROMO: Yes.
KHANNA: ... most of them are very, very happy with it.
And what this will do is, it will strengthen Medicare. It will increase, by the way...
BARTIROMO: All right, we have got to jump.
KHANNA: OK.
BARTIROMO: Congressman, thank you so much for joining us. We appreciate it.
We will be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Welcome back.
Recapping our top story this morning, President Trump is making history, and he made history overnight, becoming the first sitting U.S. president to set foot in North Korea.
As we monitor these incredible pictures from the world's most dangerous border, we turn our attention to our own southern border with Mexico.
My next guest has just returned from El Paso, Texas, the same place that I was at the end of April, you might remember. We went and we saw the crisis firsthand. Congress has just passed a $4.6 billion funding bill to help ease the conditions at overcrowded migrant holding facilities.
One of the biggest unresolved factors in all of this, the loopholes in our asylum system.
Joining me right now is the man in charge of that policy, Ken Cuccinelli. He is the acting director of U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services and the former attorney general of Virginia.
Mr. A.G., it's so great to see you this morning. Thanks very much for joining us.
KENNETH CUCCINELLI, ACTING DIRECTOR, U.S. CITIZENSHIP AND IMMIGRATION SERVICES: Maria, it's great to be with you again.
BARTIROMO: So, you just got back from the El Paso border. I was stunned when I got back.
CUCCINELLI: Right.
BARTIROMO: First of all, give us your assessment and your reaction to what you witnessed.
CUCCINELLI: Well, first of all, the folks in Border Patrol are doing phenomenal work with almost no legitimate help.
You mentioned the supplemental bill that went through this past week. But it does absolutely nothing to solve the problems that cause this crisis. And particularly in the House of Representatives, that's intentional.
We saw this picture of the father and daughter who tragically died earlier this week. They came here because they wanted to exploit those loopholes. And Congress owns that responsibility. And we need to change our laws, and that means Congress, to close the loopholes that are attracting this mass migration north that we are not staffed or nor do we have the facilities to handle.
BARTIROMO: Well, why isn't this getting done?
I know that Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is going to the border tomorrow. And a lot of my sources at the border are not so happy about it, because she doesn't believe anything she sees, and she sort of belittles it.
CUCCINELLI: Right.
BARTIROMO: I saw it. You saw it. These detention facilities are overwhelmed because people have been on their feet walking for four months and hitchhiking, and then they go to the detention centers sick.
CUCCINELLI: Right. That's right.
And that's a problem as well. I mean, you think about the logistics of screening these people who come across uncontrolled into our country. You have medical screening. They have got to be held.
And, remember, the Border Patrol was designed and their facilities are designed basically to intercept, capture, process and return adult Mexican males. And they could do that in hours, literally in hours.
But now we're talking about people coming through Mexico to the border, and the Border Patrol...
BARTIROMO: Yes, saying they are a family.
CUCCINELLI: ... doesn't have the facilities to hold these folks.
BARTIROMO: Yes. And they say they're a family.
CUCCINELLI: That's right.
BARTIROMO: Ken Cuccinelli, stay with us. We have got to talk about that when we come right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BARTIROMO: Welcome back.
And we are back with acting Director of U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services Ken Cuccinelli.
Ken, I want to show you this shot of the debate the other night. When all 10 candidates were asked, in your plan, will the government provide health care for illegal aliens, every one of them raised their hand yes, providing health care for illegals.
Your reaction to that? And is this an incentive for those people in Guatemala, Honduras and El Salvador to say, oh, let me go to America, I can get free health care?
CUCCINELLI: Of course. Of course it is.
And it's those incentives that are the problem here that Congress refuses to fix and that take statutory fixes. We can't just issue memos, like President Obama did.
Courts strike those down when President Trump does it. And they defend the memos of President Obama, even when they were illegal, even acknowledged to be by the president, meaning President Obama himself, like DACA. So we don't have these options.
Congress has to fix these loopholes. And that means closing them. And I run the asylum system. We have over a 300,000-case backlog as we continue to be rushed at the border. We're doing everything we can to knock that backlog down.
But until Congress fixes the loopholes, meaning gets rid of them, and offers more incentives instead here, like the health care for illegals, we are not going to see an end to this crisis.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
CUCCINELLI: That's why people are rushing the border. That's why.
BARTIROMO: And this country has been open arms for as long as I can -- I know.
CUCCINELLI: Absolutely.
BARTIROMO: And -- but the fact is asylum is, is one thing.
CUCCINELLI: You know, Maria...
BARTIROMO: I remember when I interviewed people at the border back in April, and I said, what are you running from? Tell me about the unrest and the upset that you are facing.
And they said, oh, no, I just want to get a job for my daughter. I know that there's much better economic...
CUCCINELLI: I just want a job, right.
BARTIROMO: So, it's not -- how do you know if it's actually asylum seekers or actually just -- they just want opportunity?
CUCCINELLI: Well, overwhelmingly, they just want opportunity.
Plenty of them are lying and saying they want asylum and trying to make up cases for asylum. It is our job to filter through those...
BARTIROMO: Right. See? That's what I'm saying.
CUCCINELLI: ... and vet those cases to find only the true ones.
And what's happening here is, the liars are getting in the way of America's historic and continuing merciful approach to true asylum seekers.
BARTIROMO: Yes, that's exactly right. They are jumping the line.
CUCCINELLI: The whole system is clogged, including for the good ones.
BARTIROMO: Yes. They are jumping the line...
CUCCINELLI: They are jumping the line. That's exactly right.
BARTIROMO: ... to people who have actually done this in a legal way.
Ken Cuccinelli, great to see you.
CUCCINELLI: Correct.
BARTIROMO: Thanks so much for joining us this morning. Please come back soon.
CUCCINELLI: Maria.
BARTIROMO: Happy Fourth of July, everybody.
That will do it for "Sunday Morning Futures." Thanks for being with me. I'm Maria Bartiromo.
I will see you in a week. Have a good Fourth.
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