Gutfeld on nomination of Haspel and accusations of torture
President Trump's pick to lead the CIA faces questions over her role in enhanced interrogation program.
This is a rush transcript from "The Five," March 14, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hi, I'm Greg Gutfeld with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, and a pistachio shell is her canoe, Dana Perino -- "The Five."
Here's an experiment: type "torture" into Google and what do you get? Beyond snippets of Hillary's speeches, you'll see Gina Haspel, the first woman to be nominated to run the CIA. A 33-year vet, more than qualified to run the place with deep knowledge of our worst enemies and how to handle them, which means she must be stopped:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
JOHN BERMAN, CNN: On the other hand, there is controversy in her past. She was involved with the torture program after September 11th, and then, involved with destroying videotapes of the matter. Also, that might be something that could be problematic.
SEN. RAND PAUL, R-KY.: I oppose her because she believes in waterboarding should be something that we use, and I think America shouldn't be known for torture.
JEREMY SCAHILL, THE INTERCEPT: Gina Haspel does not belong as head of the CIA. She belongs in front of a judge answering to what she was doing running a torture operation at a black site in Thailand.
(END VIDEO CLIPS)
GUTFELD: They dig pretty deep for that one. All right.
Fact is, Gina made decisions that few people ever have to make. The world she operated in and the villains she faced, she didn't have the luxury of just talking about what to do, she had to do, because the call she answered demanded it. So, was it torture? It wasn't back then. And just because you don't like a tactic, that doesn't make it torture. Of course, you could discuss the merits of such choices with pundits on TV rather than doing her job. She'd probably be paid more. But instead, she took the risk and responsibility, so we didn't have to. She responded not just to the worst attack on our country since Pearl Harbor, but to a world-ending threat.
Sure, it's easy to say, but we're better than that, from a shiny newsroom. But if you think whatever she did was wrong, what is your alternative? Do you have anything beyond "don't do that"? Have you ever even thought this through all the way?
So here's a question for Haspel's critics" Imagine being in a situation where your family is in danger and a terrorist is withholding key information that could save them. Would you still consider "enhanced interrogation" sadism? With everything that's considered "mean" be off the table? Something tells me you'd rather leave that question up to people like Gina Haspel.
So, Dana, you know this story probably better than anybody. They keep calling this torture. Do they have a reason to call this stuff torture? I don't -- it's an opinion.
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, it's their personal opinion. There has never been a legal opinion.
GUTFELD: Right.
PERINO: Three attorneys general have looked into this. All of them have declined to prosecute. The program was ended when it was no longer needed. And I think about her in terms of a three-decade career at the CIA. And all of a sudden, now she's not suitable to work at the CIA? She's been the deputy director of the CIA for the last year and a half. She has a great reputation amongst, not just Republicans, she's been serving since 41's administration, but also with the Obama team.
GUTFELD: Right.
PERINO: And what I would ask people to think about is, have we forgotten what it was like on the morning after 9/11?
GUTFELD: Yeah.
PERINO: And what was happening? She was actually following orders, OK? She did follow orders that were based on a lawful program asked for by the President of the United States. And to the subject of that she destroyed evidence, there was no case that was ongoing when those tapes were destroyed.
And that might seem to some people like a distinction without a difference, but let me just tell you if you're in the CIA, do you have reason to believe that the congressional members of congress who are going to use this for decades. Now, we're almost 17 years after the fact and they still want to, you know, pick at this scab and not allow a woman who has an amazing record of public service to be able to serve? That really chaps my hide.
If there are clear reasons that she should not be allowed to run this department that have nothing to do with her work, that has not been questioned. The program does not exist anymore.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
PERINO: That to me, if there's a substantial reason, fine. Let's have that discussion. But this one -- and grandstanding is so despicable.
GUTFELD: And it's going to happen. By the way, I think chapping your hide is worse than waterboarding, from what I understand.
PERINO: Well, you could make that case.
GUTFELD: Yes, you could.
PERINO: Anything that I don't like -- like, honestly, sleep deprivation, pulling out fingernails--
(CROSSTALK)
JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Playing Greg's loud music the he played--
PERINO: They would definitely play that in a Thai prison.
GUTFELD: They do. What they do they play a lot of Metallica and Slayer, but to me that's not torture. That's beautiful music.
PERINO: So, one of the hardest briefings I ever had to do at the White House was, I woke up in the morning, got the New York Times, and there's the story that the CIA has destroyed interrogation tapes, and I thought oh, my gosh. And I had -- I talked to everybody that day, the president, the vice president, Mike Hayden, the former CIA director, and Steve Hadley, the national security advisor.
And I remember just having a private moment with Steve Hadley before I went to the briefing and he said, Dana, I just want to explain something to you. In those days after 9/11, this country had to make some really tough decisions, and they were tough, but they were legal and they saved lives. And I went out and I had the best briefing I'd ever had because I was confident.
GUTFELD: I think it's something hard to argue against her, but they will argue again. So Kimberly, if she was a Democrat and it was under Hillary, they would say any opposition to her would be sexist.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Should we say that? Because she's a woman, do you think it's sexist?
PERINO: I think it's ridiculous.
KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: You want us to say it, we'll say it. It's sexist.
PERINO: Is that going to help?
(CROSSTALK)
GUILFOYLE: But she's qualified. She deserves -- OK, Juan.
(CROSSTALK)
GUILFOYLE: OK, don't worry.
GUTFELD: A lot of things make you nuts.
(CROSSTALK)
GUILFOYLE: Yeah. But she's right, torture is anything, sitting right here.
(LAUGHTER)
GUILFOYLE: What else? I don't like beets very much--
GUTFELD: No.
GUILFOYLE: -- right? That's about it.
GUTFELD: But you love super beets.
WATTERS: Yeah. Those advertisers, Kimberly, just lets pay the bills.
GUILFOYLE: Exactly. Take it easy there. All right, let me slow my role. I think that she's unbelievably qualified. And whether male, female, based on her record, a career of distinction, someone who's able to make tough decisions, who is widely admired by her peers, she deserves this position. They're going to be in a tough spot. It works the other way because she's a female, because then they will say, OK--
GUTFELD: Yeah.
GUILFOYLE: -- why are you making these attacks against her? This could be considered sexist. She should get the job, and I do think they're going to pull a whole, you know, pork on her because--
GUTFELD: Yeah.
GUILFOYLE: -- some of the background and tactics. And you know what, because they're going to like the fanfare--
GUTFELD: Exactly, high drama.
GUILFOYLE: -- fodder for certain shows.
PERINO: Plus, the more they talk about this, the more President Trump is going to like her.
GUTFELD: Yeah, exactly. And it will be -- Jesse, there'll be Democrats galloping in on their moral high horses. There's also be Rand Paul, who's now going to oppose Pompeo and Haspel. He's great.
WATTERS: Yeah. The moral high horse, and the Democrats, the Obama intelligence agencies that spied on reporters, that lied to the American people in front of congress, that did a lot of really disgusting things and they didn't bat an eyelash then. So get off your high horse, get off your soapbox.
This woman is a patriot. She was trying to save lives after 9/11. I remember, George Bush on his last press conference said exactly what you said. You don't remember what it was like here after 9/11. They had to make a lot of tough decisions. And she made some tough decisions. And the head of her operation, Jose Rodriguez, says enhanced interrogation saved lives and foiled plots.
You know who also said it? Leon Panetta, the Obama intelligence chief. And he said that enhanced interrogation led to the location of Osama Bin Laden. Speaking of Leon, also Brennan, Clapper, and Morell, all the top intelligence people under the Obama administration all support this woman. So does Dianne Feinstein, which I find interesting -- Stein, excuse me. And the whole thing about her destroying the tapes, so she was told to destroy tapes and she did. Hillary destroyed tapes because she wanted to and that was under an active investigation.
GUTFELD: You have to admire what he just did there.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: And the justice department let them both off the hook, so that's fine. Now--
GUILFOYLE: Fair and fair.
WATTERS: This is a perfect example of media bias, because this is a woman who's about to shatter the glass ceiling.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
WATTERS: So she should be praised by the left-wing media. But instead, she's trying to be railroaded because she was nominated by a Republican. And the media for years has been saying that women should be celebrated because they're playing in the big boy's league, and they're tough, and we need tough women that can really, you know, take the fight to people. Now, we actually have a woman like that who made terrorists whine and whimper and they're trying to attack her.
GUTFELD: You know what scares me, I think that Democrat husbands are going to tell their wives not to supporter her--
WATTERS: Right.
GUTFELD: -- and they won't because they're so subservient. All right, Juan, I'm going to give you the argument that I always hear that our tactics, interrogation tactics, fueled the people who hate us. It's like we just make it worse because we're lowering ourselves to that level. Is that how you feel?
JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Yeah. I don't think it's very American to torture people, and neither does John McCain, who was tortured.
WATTERS: Not torture.
WILLIAMS: So what you get is -- and it is torture. It's what we're talking about.
WATTERS: Waterboarding is not torture.
WILLIAMS: Water -- well, I don't know. May be in your path -- you know, your free time you want to go--
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: I don't think that is rational or sane. Nobody in their right mind. So, I mean, maybe--
GUTFELD: Then, what is your alternative? What's your plan?
WILLIAMS: There're lots of alternatives. In fact, if you go and talk to the intelligence community, they will tell you they get more out of people when they don't torture them. But here's the thing--
GUTFELD: It depends.
WILLIAMS: -- I think the key here is, will she renounce the use of torture in confirmation hearings? I think that's what Dianne Feinstein had to say today, which is, look, she's got a great reputation in the intelligence community. They call her a pro's pro. But the law has changed. Torture is illegal. But in this administration with President Trump, who by the way, is always putting down the CIA, but said he thinks torture is effective.
What about Mike Pompeo who was the former CIA director? He too has said, yeah, I think torture might work. So the question becomes, wait a second, are we going backwards here? Having had a moment of conscience about this, where we were torturing people even after the fact. It wasn't any -- like, you know, 24 scenario where, oh, we've got to get some information.
GUTFELD: So we're just doing it for fun.
WILLIAMS: That has been now taken care of.
GUTFELD: We have no conscience.
WILLIAMS: The president can say -- the president has the right to say I need this information. Take extraordinary or enhanced interrogation tactics. But these people that she was torturing, those people--
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Juan, you water bored me without the water.
GUILFOYLE: But it's like floppy to the word torture.
WILLIAMS: How it's floppy?
GUILFOYLE: I'll tell you right now--
WILLIAMS: It's like waterboarding because it's putting you in a box?
GUILFOYLE: So, yeah, some of these guys are real losers and real wimps, OK? They're crybabies. You put a caterpillar on their shoulder and they cry for their mom, and no more jihad and they spill it. So, that to me is not torture, it really isn't.
WILLIAMS: Well, I'm just telling you.
GUTFELD: In the eye of the beholder, Juan, that's the problem.
GUILFOYLE: Loud music or there's some sleep deprivation. There've been changes in the law, she will follow the law as it currently stand on the book.
PERINO: Right.
WILLIAMS: That's what I think. The key point is, will she renounce the use of torture?
GUTFELD: Dana, would you break the law if you could save lives and ruin your career? Or would you follow the law and watch people die? That's an interesting question.
GUILFOYLE: Break it, Dana.
(CROSSTALK)
PERINO: She didn't. I mean, that's a bad hypothetical.
GUTFELD: Oh, is it?
PERINO: That leaves me to her saying that she didn't break any laws--
(CROSSTALK)
GUILFOYLE: Disqualified herself because--
(CROSSTALK)
PERINO: I mean, obviously, this is not -- it's not an easy topic. The things that these agents are asked to do--
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: -- are not easy. Do you think they want to do this? They've signed up to serve their country in order to protect us. But the notion that somehow Gitmo or these black sites somehow fueled more anger against western civilization is preposterous.
WATTERS: And that is a great point because after these enhanced interrogations were no longer used, the rise of ISIS--
PERINO: Yes.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
WATTERS: -- sprung up right after.
PERINO: It's an ideology.
WATTERS: So what do they have to do with each other? While the other thing is--
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: What does that have to do with anything?
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: You said when we were interrogating people in a rough way that that was making them hate us even more.
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: You just set it.
PERINO: What I'm saying is that they hate us no matter what. It's an ideology that we're fighting. Anyway, I think that she'll end up with 75 votes in favor.
GUTFELD: Good, all right. Excellent. Well, her arrest sparked an outcry spark from the left. We'll tell you the full story behind that video of an illegal immigrant pulled away from her daughters, ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PERINO: A big immigration win for Texas. A federal appeals court has upheld its crackdown on sanctuary cities. More on that in a moment. Meanwhile, remember this video?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(INAUDIBLE)
(SCREAMING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: So, an illegal immigrant mother arrested by U.S. border patrol, taken from her three screaming children earlier this month. Well, it's gotten a lot of attention. Protests erupted over it. But a key detail has been left out of the conversation. The woman was apprehended because she's suspected by the feds of organizing a human trafficking operation, which is one of the worst crimes against humanity, I think, Kimberly.
GUILFOYLE: Yeah, no doubt. I mean, let me tell you something, some of the cases that we've investigated and took a look at are worst horrors of mankind that you can imagine with human trafficking and what happens here. And it's unbelievable that it doesn't get a bigger spotlight. The United Nations has been decent, you know, in terms of trying to profile and put this out here so that we can stop this, but it's like really widespread in countries you'd be very surprised of as well. So, when we do stories like this, I think it's really important that people knows that this is happening, that this is going on. To put, you know, better awareness of it, and also to report abuses.
PERINO: Well, it's hard, Juan, these cases are never necessarily black and white. It's complicated. Often, in order to protect the integrity of the case or the people that are involved, information is held back until the case is completed. In this case, the children were probably taken away, perhaps, to protect them. And so, there are other cases. We know of the woman from Congo who was separated from her daughter, and there's questions there. Why would the federal government do that? What do you think about this case?
WILLIAMS: Well, I mean, obviously, human trafficking is reprehensible, but the way they did that was offensive. I mean, I think that's the upset is - - come to represent something larger which is separating parents from families and children.
PERINO: Yeah.
WILLIAMS: And so, it picked up on something that resonates with the broader public, and that, you know, the way the ICE agents operate looks like they're above the law. They looked like cowboys jumping out and grabbing somebody. And in this case, separating a mother from her children. But I think--
GUTFELD: Smuggler from her children.
WILLIAMS: I don't know what she is. I mean, I think that Dana is right to point out this awful charge of human smuggling involved, but that doesn't excuse the behavior of ICE agents. I don't think that we want to see police or anybody acting in that fashion.
PERINO: I don't think the police was that bad. I mean, I understand like ripping a mother away from her children, but in this case, I mean, the mother put the children in a bad position.
WATTERS: Yeah. It's the mom's fault that she was then hauled off like that. She's got stuck in the patty. You know, don't do the crime if you can't do the time, Juan. Do you want to be treated equally under the justice system? Man or woman? Illegal, legal? Listen, I believe the ICE agents in this case. Sorry, Juan.
WILLIAMS: All of it was an allegation. This is America, still, you know.
WATTERS: Juan, she's going to go through due process. That's fine. I didn't see her hurting this woman. I didn't see her throwing any elbows. I thought they were treating her fine. She was the one resisting.
WILLIAMS: Oh.
WATTERS: She was the one screaming and causing a scene. You know what, if the ICE show up for me, I'd go like this and get in the back of the wagon and have my lawyer deal with it. I found some interesting polling, Juan.
GUILFOYLE: No, you take your phone out for sure.
WATTERS: I know Juan loves polling. And I found something that's going to blow his entire argument out of the water here.
WILLIAMS: All right, go for it.
WATTERS: Sanctuary city poll, and it's done by Greg's alma mater, Berkeley, so we know it's correct, 74 percent of Californians opposed sanctuary cities. Sixty five percent of Hispanics in California oppose sanctuary cities. And 73 percent of Democrats in California oppose sanctuary cities.
PERINO: Well, Greg, you could talk about either one just to build on that a little bit. Texas, yesterday, got some news from the federal appeals court, which has said that its ban on sanctuary cities can continue to take effect while legal challenges continue, so.
GUTFELD: I would like to comment on that, but also on this arrest thing. Which one should I do first?
PERINO: Whichever.
GUTFELD: All right. About the arrest, originally this was seen as a martyr and an innocent person, and that is because the media is always desperate to find their poster child for their specific issue. We've been guilty on the right, but mostly the left, the media, they always try to find that exact perfect victim and it never turns out.
This is why -- if you see something that sounds too good to be true, they're ripping the mother away from the kids, it's probably not. Whenever we're about to do a story and we go, this sounds really, really, like, right up our alley, you've got to look at it and you'll find out there's a whole story behind that story. This is not -- you have to look at the background, and you find out it's too good to be true. Sorry, guys. You didn't get a poster child out of this one.
To that story, the reason why the Republicans succeed on this sanctuary city thing is because liberals have yet to realize that a wish is not a plan. You know, wishing that everybody could come over here, it's not a plan. So the actual liberal plan for everything, from the welfare state to homelessness, illegal immigration, step one, wish. Step two, see step one. Republicans always have a step two. Step one is like, sure, we want to have good people coming over here. Step two, we want them to go through the proper entrance with an enforced border policy. That's step one too.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: I'm going to quote Scott Adams.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: The problem is Democrats only offer--
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Democrats only offer half a plan. They've got to have the wish, but they don't have the follow-through--
WILLIAMS: You know what, you are engaged in a fantasy because I was reading--
GUTFELD: But I just told you the truth.
WILLIAMS: No, you told me a fantasy about wish and wishful thought--
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: -- morning news today says, virtually no illegal border crossings in 2017, lowest since World War II--
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: How did that happen?
WATTERS: No one crossed the border in 2017?
WILLIAMS: No, no, they've said lowest, virtually, the lowest since World War II. And here's Greg saying, oh, the Democrats just want people to march across -- this is ridiculous--
GUTFELD: What do you think sanctuary cities are? What do they need to find at? If you come here, we will not stop you.
WILLIAMS: That's not the definition.
GUTFELD: Oh, am I missing something?
(CROSSTALK) WILLIAMS: Guess what, the justification -- the justification is--
GUTFELD: To harbor criminals.
WILLIAMS: -- you want people to cooperate with law enforcement--
GUTFELD: Yes, you bring that up, but there's no actual statistical evidence--
(CROSSTALK) PERINO: Do you know what I wish?
(CROSSTALK)
PERINO: Tens of thousands of students across America walked out of their classrooms today to demand change to our nation's gun laws. The protest, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GUILFOYLE: Today, students across the country participated in a nationwide school walkout to demand action on gun violence. Some prominent lawmakers joined their protest.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: A lot of us will also be 18 by November, and that's when midterm elections start.
(APPLAUSE)
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: So I can promise you this, do your jobs, give us concrete solutions, and for once, value our lives over your bank accounts or we will vote you out.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: In the coming weeks and months, more of my peers will be slaughtered in their own classrooms, when their deaths will be dismissed as collateral, you know we have a moral problem in this country.
UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: I come to school to learn math and science, to be better in life, not to lose my life, and not have to learn how to dodge bullets.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: This afternoon, the house approved a bill to make schools safer and harden them against potential shootings. The stopped school violence act passed in a vote of 407-10, so very strong support, Greg, for this act.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
GUILFOYLE: What's wrong?
GUTFELD: A few things. Because we try to -- we tiptoe around this, because it's like teenagers. And I'm a little bit tired of tiptoeing. And -- but I want to be very careful about this.
No. 1, I said a while ago you don't want to let these causes be hijacked by other causes. Women's march, Planned Parenthood, the Center for American Progress. That happened. That bugs me.
No. 2, a protest should never be tied to a kind of implicit reward, meaning you're getting out of class. That taints it a little bit for me. I don't think the protest should accompany a reward. I think it should've been before class or after class. It has a feeling of a field trip. And you couple that with the attention you get from networks, it's a pretty exciting field trip. So I think there's a certain award -- reward there that taints the protest a bit.
And then I'm also worried about what it's like for students who don't participate. Will their teachers and the students that they go to class with treat them differently? Will there be peer pressure? Will the teacher think less of them?
You know, I did extra credit in high school for the nuclear freeze, a very left-wing thing. That amped up my grade. I got a better grade for doing that.
So I think there is going to be a correlation between participating in this and how you're graded.
But now the last thing, which is -- you know, it bothers me, is there's a bit of artificial restraint from parents or adults with this issue. It's like we're abdicating our responsibility to debate and criticize. We should be challenging teenagers, especially if they don't have the facts. If you're talking emotionally, you turn teenagers into adults by challenging them with facts. Emotion that's untethered to facts continues, especially when you're a teenager.
I know. I was a teenager. I lived off emotion. I was a liberal. So I think that it's important.
And also, you know, the FBI, an FBI executive just confirmed that there was an explicit, explicit tip about Cruz. So this isn't really about guns. It's about a lack of a follow-up, failure to catch a needle in a haystack, lack of a database that's very necessary. And I'm glad we're hardening the schools.
GUILFOYLE: I think this is more --
WILLIAMS: Who are you going to believe, me or your lying eyes? These kids marching because of the slaughter that took place in Florida --
GUTFELD: Right.
WILLIAMS: -- having a real response and offering real leadership where adults have failed. And instead, you want to talk about, "Oh, if this person didn't march, are they going to be punished? What about grades?" What about gun control, Greg?
GUTFELD: I think that's important. No, I think we've heard -- we've heard from you on this every day.
WILLIAMS: Well, let me just say, we haven't heard from the Congress, where they passed something today that has nothing to do with gun control, only to do with, "Oh, maybe we should consider hardening this or doing that." Nothing. It's like the NRA sponsored --
GUTFELD: Making the schools safer, isn't that what they want?
GUILFOYLE: I don't understand. Why wouldn't that be almost exigent circumstances that you should have in terms of public safety and how you've got a right to a peaceful and non-violent education in this country where you're not worried about what you're going to do if you're going to be shot or you have to hide in the school or what's going to happen.
You're worried about, "OK, let me see if I can, like, learn how to do algebra today," or "Let me see if I can learn how to read more books, or do something or learn something in science or decide what I want to do with my future, because I'm going to have one, because they cared about my school safety."
WILLIAMS: Yes, that's great.
GUILFOYLE: Yes, great.
GUTFELD: You said it wasn't great.
GUILFOYLE: But they're doing that.
WILLIAMS: No, I think that kids should be safe in school. That's why they're marching.
GUTFELD: No, but you just criticized what the -- never mind. Rewind it. You'll see what he said.
PERINO: Well, I -- so I feel for these kids. I think all of us do. I didn't go to school at a time when I thought that there would ever be an active shooter. And I tried to put myself in their shoes, or in -- myself in the shoes of the parents and the teachers, who you go to school and worry that this actually could happen to them.
I agree with President Trump when he said he doesn't like the idea of active shooter drills, because we shouldn't have to have them. So then you get the -- then you get to the question of the policy solutions. And that's where conservatives and liberals do have a breakdown.
Conservatives often go with logic and facts. And you follow those -- logic down --
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: -- and you realize, actually, that's not going to work. It's not going to help.
I think also, Greg, to your point. It wasn't that they missed a needle in a haystack. They missed a huge silo sticking out --
GUTFELD: That's right. It's true.
PERINO: -- of the haystack and decided not to do anything about it.
GUTFELD: That's the most infuriating.
PERINO: And still there has not been accountability.
GUTFELD: No, the sheriff's still -- the sheriff's still there. That's the outrage.
PERINO: Somebody should have brought that up today.
GUTFELD: Yes.
WATTERS: Yes, I mean, if I was in high school, I'd walk out, too. I wouldn't care what the topic was, what the protest was. I'd try to get out of class. So that's why -- one of the reasons why you see such big crowds, to be honest.
On the other hand, I don't doubt the sincerity of some of these gun-control students. They're doing what they want, and I encourage students of all ages to be politically active. I think that's a good thing, no matter the topic.
The only issue is I saw one of the high school students on MSNBC today. I had to watch. I was getting my shoes shined. And they asked them, "What do you want?" And the kids says, "Gun control." And then, to his credit, the MSNBC anchor said, "Well, what does that mean, gun control?"
PERINO: Right.
WATTERS: And the student says, "Well, I don't think AR-15s should be sold in this country. They are military grade."
First of all, they're not military grade at all. The bullet is about this size. The caliber is very small. And they just have military stylings. It has nothing to do with the gauge of it.
Second of all, I've seen a few other of these students, and they're very hyper-partisan. And that's their business. They can say whatever they want. But I think that's turning off a lot of independent Americans; and it's actually angering a lot of law-abiding NRA members to think, "You know what? This is making me angry. This isn't helping the conversation at all."
Greg also brought up the point MoveOn.org, Planned Parenthood, and the Women's March are behind this. So someone's obviously --
GUILFOYLE: Well, they're the organizers.
WATTERS: -- pulling the strings.
But Trump has to stay on this. Because when I heard that father at the forum say, "This has to stop and it has to stop now" --
PERINO: Yes.
WATTERS: -- we have to remember that dad, because we cannot let him down or any of the other parents.
GUTFELD: Yes.
GUILFOYLE: Indeed. I know. And by the way, my son walked out today. Let him do what he's going to do. Just don't use my last name.
WILLIAMS: Go, go, go! Go, go, go!
GUTFELD: But did he come back, though? That's the key. A lot of kids didn't come back.
GUILFOYLE: Exactly. It's happened. Even Democrats have had enough of Hillary Clinton. Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WILLIAMS: Hillary Clinton has come up with all sorts of excuses for why she lost the election, insulting some Trump voters along the way.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FORMER DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE HILLARY CLINTON: His whole campaign, "Make America Great Again," was looking backwards. You know, you didn't like black people getting rights. You don't like women, you know, getting jobs.
Part of that is an identification with the Republican Party and a sort of ongoing pressure to vote the way that your husband, your boss, your son, whoever believes you should.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: So that latest dig isn't sitting well with some members of the Democratic Party. Even Clinton's former aides and surrogates are now, some of them, speaking out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Look, this -- this is bad. You know, I can't -- I can't sugarcoat it. She was wrong. And clearly, it's not helpful to the Democrats going into the midterms and certainly not going into 2020.
She's put yourself in a position where Democrats are going to have to distance themselves from these remarks and distance themselves from her, particularly those Democrats that are running in the states that Donald Trump won, like Ohio and Pennsylvania. And Wisconsin and Michigan.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: So we have a situation here where you have people like Sherrod Brown, who's the senator from Ohio, saying these comments weren't helpful. So Greg, what do you think? Is this, in fact, something that you -- I know you have such a vivid imagination. Might imagine would hurt Democrats in the midterms?
GUTFELD: I disagree with everything I've ever said. I think she should stay. I think the party is wrong. She deserves to stay. She's the most qualified candidate they have. She should be running for 2020.
WATTERS: Yes.
GUTFELD: I think that, like, right now, the fact that they're treating her this way is disrespectful. She has to run again.
Her motto could be, "I'm still here, going nowhere."
But here's the problem. Here's the problem. You want to solve -- the Democrat Party want to solve the problem? She's greedy. She's doing these speeches to make money, getting paid. Every speech she picks up, the media goes after. So they should pay her not to speak. Like every time -- every time, like, she gets a call from -- if she gets a call from, I don't know, Harvard that's going to pay her 250 grand, the Democratic Party should say, "We'll give you 200 not to speak."
PERINO: OK. Good deal.
GUTFELD: Good deal.
WILLIAMS: So Dana, so the Republicans now, the Republican Governors Association falsely claimed that Clinton said Wisconsin is backwards. And then the Ohio GOP said, "Oh, yes, she said Ohio is backwards." Then they had to say, "Well, no, she didn't quite say that. We're sorry."
PERINO: Here's -- no, she basically said all the states in the middle are backwards. So I think you could probably make the claim if you're in one of those states.
She gives sore losers a bad name.
GUTFELD: Funny.
PERINO: And it's not going to be easy for them. The Democrats had a pretty good showing last night in the special election in Pennsylvania 13 [SIC]. Hillary Clinton --
WILLIAMS: Eighteen.
PERINO: Did I say 13? I meant 18. They -- she wasn't really a factor. President Trump was the factor, and Conor Lamb was a good candidate. So that happened.
GUILFOYLE: That's true.
PERINO: But as soon as she gets back on TV, it reminds everybody, like, "Oh, yes. We didn't -- that's right. That's why we voted the other way."
I do feel bad for her, because it's not easy to leave the stage gracefully. But Romney and McCain both did so. They did not give heartburn to their party. They let the -- they lost, and they moved on. And they've continued to serve in other ways.
WILLIAMS: So Jesse, do you think this will have any effect on anything other than Greg's love of Hillary Clinton?
WATTERS: No. I mean, it helps Republicans. I agree with Greg.
The special election we just had last night, Donald Trump won that district by 20 points. I guess that means that's a bigoted district. Oh, wait. They just voted for a Democrat. Maybe it's because all the husbands convinced the wives to vote for the Democrat. That's what she's saying.
She doesn't like the American people. She things half of them are deplorable. That's why she's not likable, because you can tell that she doesn't like other people.
She's misread the electorate. She didn't go to the three big states that you know, she was supposed to, and Trump busted the blue wall down. She can't read a room. I mean, every time she gives a speech, everybody falls asleep.
And she assumes that, because you disagree with her, you're a bad person. And that's why she thinks half the country is racist or sexist. It can't be because they disagree with her policy or that they connect with another candidate. It's because she thinks you're evil and you have bad intentions. And that's just not a good look for a stateswoman.
WILLIAMS: You never know --
GUILFOYLE: Yes, the best thing to happen to the Democrats, because they've been dying to get rid of her. Let's be honest. And like, finally, let's stick with this one, because the rest of them are waiting to come up. Kamala Harris and Oprah. And not Michelle Obama.
WATTERS: Oprah.
WILLIAMS: Boy, you would never know that this woman won the popular vote.
GUTFELD: Yes, she's like stuck in a revolving door --
WATTERS: So did Gore.
GUTFELD: -- so people can't get through.
GUILFOYLE: Yes, her coat got caught in it.
GUTFELD: Yes.
WILLIAMS: So is this for real? America might be adding a new branch of the military in outer space. Yes, the president is considering it. Next.
GUILFOYLE: Space Corps.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WATTERS: "Star Wars" may not just be a work of science fiction. President Trump is now floating the idea of creating a space force. Did Greg help him come up with the idea?
GUILFOYLE: Yes.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you like riding rockets, exploring other galaxies, and firing super-awesome laser beams all over space? Then you need to join the U.S. Space Force. You'll go space surfing with all-American Space Bros, chat with exotic space babes, eat out of this world space food, and defend earth from super alien space (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
It's all possible in the U.S. Space Force, because putting the word "Space" before anything makes it better. Don't believe us? Dog, space dog. Taco, space taco. Kat Timpf, Space Kat Timpf.
KAT TIMPF, FOX NEWS COMMENTATOR: Can I join the Space Force? Damn right I did.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The only thing we don't have, Space Maroon Five, because in space no one can hear horrible music.
So join the U.S. Space Force today. Warning: Limited space available despite space being infinite and capable of fitting all of us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: All right, Greg. From your lips to Trump's ears.
GUTFELD: That was from July of last year, I believe, that we came up with that idea. But it is true. Like, put "space" before anything: suit, space suit; party, space party; zebra, space zebra. Everything is better with space.
PERINO: Space Five.
WATTERS: Space Dana.
GUTFELD: Space Five.
PERINO: Space Dana.
GUTFELD: We should do that. Get a plane and go -- yes, just go up.
WATTERS: We can't even get them to pay for us to go to California, Greg.
GUTFELD: That is Space Five.
GUILFOYLE: It took six years to get --
WATTERS: It's not getting off the ground.
PERINO: Well, last year's budget proposal, the Trump administration shot it down, but a president can change his mind at any time. So I think it's possible. I also think it's a fantasy that liberals think "Oh, my gosh, they're going to weaponize space." Well, yes, better us than them.
GUILFOYLE: Sounds awesome.
WATTERS: You've got to catch up to the Chinese and the Russians, right?
GUILFOYLE: I want to do it. I've got the costume, the other half. Let me, like, matching Kat Timpf.
WILLIAMS: Well, I think -- I think that it's important to say the defense secretary doesn't like it. And the Air Force and Marines think, "Meh." So you know what?
PERINO: They're going to study it. That was what they're doing now.
WILLIAMS: But I like the idea, because if we can have more of those videos, go!
GUILFOYLE: I mean, ratings people would love it.
GUTFELD: I would enlist.
WATTERS: Go waterboard some aliens.
GUILFOYLE: It's all how you market it.
WATTERS: "One More Thing" is up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GUTFELD: It's time for "One More Thing" -- Juan.
WILLIAMS: Thank you, Greg.
Stephen Hawking, the physicist known around the world, died yesterday at 76. He was our generation's version of Albert Einstein, Sir Isaac Newton. I mean, he was a cultural icon, appearing on shows like "The Simpsons" and "Star Trek," as well as the subject of the movie "The Theory of Everything."
He dealt with Lou Gehrig's Disease starting in his early 20s. And for most of his life, could only at flex a finger, move his eye. But his mind remained superbly fit. His exploration of gravity led him into mind- bending discoveries about the properties of black holes. He was an earthbound inspiration to everyone who suffers from a disability and yet is excellent. May he rest in peace.
GUILFOYLE: Fascinating.
PERINO: Indeed. Amazing.
GUTFELD: Dana.
PERINO: OK, so I had a fun day today. Well, I mean, I always have a fun day.
GUILFOYLE: It's about -- it's about the gift.
PERINO: But my husband did something really great. And, you know, it's one of those times when you just fall in love with your husband all over again.
So there he is a Neptune City, New Jersey. He went to visit Lisa Rizzo's second-grade class for a special reading session. And he agreed to go, and he read two books to the kids. The first one was "Please, Mr. Panda." And another one was called "I Have an Idea." And then the kids voted, and they ended up going with the panda as the better book.
GUILFOYLE: Cute.
PERINO: That was really great that he took the time to go and do that.
GUILFOYLE: Awesome. Good job, Peter. Can't wait to see you tonight with Dana.
GUTFELD: Neptune -- Neptune City. That sounds exciting.
WATTERS: Is that space?
GUTFELD: Neptune City. All right, Jesse.
WATTERS: March Madness is here. Dana, that's college basketball.
PERINO: Oh, thanks.
WATTERS: And Pizza Hut is the official pizza of March Madness. And they came out with some shoes. They're called Pizza Hut high tops. And there they are right there. And you see the red. That's Marinara Splash, and it says "Hut" on the side. There's a little cheese grater. And when you push the button on the tongue, it orders a pizza to wherever you are.
So if you're watching March Madness, you hit the button on the tongue and then a pizza gets delivered. So just go to PizzaHut.com, download the app. It's Bluetooth compatible. I don't even know what that means.
GUTFELD: I don't know -- how do they do this?
WATTERS: But you hit the button and --
GUILFOYLE: No, because your Bluetooth is on the --
WATTERS: -- you get the pizza. And if you hit the other button on the other tongue of the shoe, it pauses the game for you. And so you can enjoy your pizza and then finish watching the game.
GUILFOYLE: I can't believe you didn't put them on. And then --
WILLIAMS: He did.
GUILFOYLE: No, here.
WATTERS: Where is the pizza?
GUILFOYLE: Jeez.
WATTERS: Can we have the pizza, because we just ordered it.
WILLIAMS: You pushed the button?
WATTERS: Oh, yes. You want to see? Here is the sneaker. Here is the sneaker.
GUILFOYLE: You should really leave these segments to me, I've got to say.
WATTERS: I thought they showed them on the screen. All right. Here we go.
GUILFOYLE: You butchered the segment.
WATTERS: No, I did not.
WILLIAMS: Oh, my gosh.
WATTERS: So there it is. See, I just ordered it, and there's the pizza. And Greg can't have any of it --
GUTFELD: I know.
WATTERS: -- because he's on the Atkins Diet.
GUILFOYLE: Why isn't there pepperoni on yours?
WATTERS: There's pepperoni in the green room, Kimberly.
WILLIAMS: Send in the anchovies.
GUTFELD: Smells like shoes. WILLIAMS: Oh!
GUTFELD: All right. So my podcast is up right now. You go to FOXNewsPodcast.com. I interviewed the great writer Kevin Williamson about the threats of immersive pornography. Which is interesting. I've never heard of -- hear that phrase. And also conspiracy thinking and tribalism. It's a great podcast.
But now it's time for this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRAPHIC: Greg's Media News
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: "Greg's Media News." So like I always do, sometimes in the morning, I decided to catch Joe and Mika. And Joe just wouldn't stop talking.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(SMALL DOG BARKING NEXT TO PLUSH DOG)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: Just look at this video. He just chats. Look at Mika, just has to sit there the whole time.
GUILFOYLE: Uh-huh. Uh-huh.
GUTFELD: While she just says "Uh-huh." And he said, "Trump did this, Trump did that. Trump is insane. Trump's a mess. Trump's going to be impeached." She's like, "Oh, God. Please stop talking about Trump." "No, I'm going to keep going."
Anyway. There you go.
WILLIAMS: Fascinating.
GUTFELD: It is. Thank you, Juan.
Kimberly.
GUILFOYLE: Yes. Time for "Kimberly's Royal News." Oh, my God. I am so confused with my pizza. Pizza.
OK, I'm sure the queen likes pizza, too. Oh, good.
So over the pond at Buckingham Palace, it's raining high-fashion, people, and I love this. Look at this fabulous queen. Because she has an umbrella -- see-through, as you noticed -- that matches every single outfit. And this is incredibly important when you are a royal and in the rain, dancing in the rain, because it rains about 30 percent of the year there. So she's got to have a very nice umbrella, and specifically she gets Fulton umbrellas.
PERINO: She should get a Weatherman umbrella. Rick Reichmuth.
GUILFOYLE: Rick Reichmuth, moved to be the official sponsor.
GUTFELD: All right. Well -- ick. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." "Special Report" up next. My favorite Bret since George.
BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Thank you, Greg.
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