This is a rush transcript from "The Five," January 25, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hi. I'm Greg Gutfeld with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, and a pea bob is her sleeping bag, Dana Perino -- "The Five."

Donald Trump is at Davos. I know: What is Davos, you ask? It's the home of the World Economic Forum where world leaders and business executives drink expensive wine, eat fancy meat and throw up in hot tubs. And also tell us what's wrong with us. I was going to go but my Gulfstream has been acting up and my manservant then has an infected uvula.

But these elites won't be giving Trump a warm welcome at all and he's already pissed off at cliffs. Take a look at that. An angry mountain. Swiss activists did that. Pretty funny that there's activists in Switzerland. Please, their biggest problem is being confused for Sweden.


GUTFELD: But it's not like Donald Trump cares. In fact, the angrier they get, the more his economic policies stand out. But before the Euros go full anti-Trump, maybe look at us first. Our economy is on fire, so much so that Swiss could warm their hands on it. It's cause and effect. Because of the lower corporate tax, now even Starbucks -- Starbucks -- is giving workers raises worth millions. It's funny. A company raises its wages and Democrats go silent. I guess they just want the government to make those decisions. And now, Fiat Chrysler says the U.S. workers -- its U.S. workers will receive two grand in bonuses.

This is great news for you and bad news for all those vulnerable Democrats up for reelection who didn't back the bill, which means they can't take any credit. All they can hope for is a reversal of fortunes. That's a sad place to be, rooting for bad news so you might win.

I want to point out that many of us are wearing burgundy today. No reason why. It just happens.


GUTFELD: It just happens.

GUILFOYLE: It's interesting, isn't it?


GUILFOYLE: Not a secret society.

GUTFELD: No, secret society of burgundy. And so, Dana.


GUTFELD: I bet you have a theory about what's going down. His first day in Davos, and he's doing great.

PERINO: Yes, indeed, he is. And it looked to me like he was having a good time.

GUTFELD: Yes, he was.

PERINO: So, every time he's gone overseas, it's like, oh, actually, you know what? He has friends. He's making friends around the world, making relationships. This is actually, I think, one of the things that I imagine a Trump presidency would bring. So, he's a disruptor.


PERINO: This is my theory, I was going to say, if Steve Bannon were still in the White House and advising the president, I think this visit would look very different.

GUTFELD: That's true.

PERINO: The tone and tenor of it would be different. The speech would be different. Instead, what he's able to do there is go and say, hey, I'm the head coach of capitalism, and the world economy is going well. The United States is even kicking it into higher gear. So let's all work together. Let's do more. What all can we do here? I get the America First, not America alone type of thing. It's not my favorite rhetoric. But on the other side, I think that the leaders who are there -- there's some world leaders there but there's also business leaders. Reality has set in. For a long time they thought, well, President Trump really doesn't want to be president or he doesn't really want to run again. And now they're starting to realize after the first year that he governs very differently than he campaigns, and that they're figuring out a way to work with him, and today there was a roundtable that he did with some business leaders and all of them were like, we've got to invest in the United States and we're planning to increase that. And pretty soon, all of these companies -- there's going to be so many companies in America that are announcing bonuses that if you're the outlier and you have not announced bonuses, that will become something.



PERINO: Not bonuses for people like you, Jesse.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Oh, what's that supposed to mean?

GUILFOYLE: You're under contract.


PERINO: It's easier to say like which companies haven't gone ahead and done -- maybe, companies are still thinking about it because you hear news about it every day.

GUTFELD: It's such a good point. Jesse, it's like a weird version -- a combination of trickle-down economics and peer pressure. You start watching everybody -- I mean, how can you not deny this cause and effect. It's happening.

WATTERS: Well, it's not trickle-down economics. It's more of like a flood.


WATTERS: And it's not coming from the top down. It's broad base and growing out.

GUILFOYLE: Flash flood.

WATTERS: Yes, flash flood, water's world. It's not just a $1,000 bonuses. Some of it is profit sharing checks. They're getting checks $5,000, they're reinvesting in America.


PERINO: But also, they lowered the prices of -- the energy costs and several different utilities across the country.

WATTERS: That's right. And some companies are even throwing money into college funds for the workers and things like that. So, it's going to be very difficult for the Democrats to run against winning. I don't see how they do it. How can you deny your 401(K) exploding? How can you deny tax cuts?


WATTERS: They're like climate deniers. There winning deniers. It's so easy.

GUTFELD: That's a great line.

WATTERS: It's so easy and you could see it coming from a mile away, yet not one Democrat voted for the corporate tax cut, and the deregulation is responsible to. The only way they're going to have to run against him is just go super negative and try to bring out women, blacks and Latinos, which don't usually turn out in the midterms. It's not a sure thing winning back the house.

GUTFELD: I'm stealing winning deniers for my show on Saturday. I wrote it down. All right. So Juan, I want to play a sought from another network. I know. But you have to help these people out because nobody's watching. This is their take on Trump and Davos.


UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: And we should point out one other thing, the chair people of Davos this year, this year there are seven, I believe all of them are women. When I look at President Trump right there, I mentioned, -- was with him, Jared Kushner, Gary Cohn, Rex Tillerson. He's flanked almost entirely -- well, there's one, by white guys.


GUTFELD: So Juan, obviously, they have race on the brain over at MSNBC, nothing but white men. Clearly, this is a racist gathering. It must be stop. This is almost an alt-right event.

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Yeah, it could be, except it's overseas, right? No, I mean, you know, I think the economy is going great. I think everybody is excited. It's wonderful. But if you're saying that this is somehow good news that he's at Davos bragging about the American economy, let me tell you, there're several economies overseas that are doing even better.

GUTFELD: Like what?

WILLIAMS: Oh, there're so many, but China is obviously doing much better. Then you go into Europe.

WATTERS: Because workers get paid pennies over there.

WILLIAMS: Oh, OK, all right, so now we're making excuses again.


WATTERS: It's reality. It's like slave labor.

WILLIAMS: No, a minute ago you're saying the American economy is just booming. It's never been like this. Second thing to say is a majority of Americans credit President Obama, not President Trump, with response.

GUTFELD: Are they really Americans?

WILLIAMS: Oh, I see. Anybody who disagreed with Trump is not an American. Fake news, fake news.

GUTFELD: Kimberly.

WILLIAMS: Can I finish? And then, this morning papers have Republicans rebelling against Trump because he's raising tariffs.


WILLIAMS: . that are raising prices and people are saying don't do it. And then, don't forget, the farmers and others are still lobbying.

PERINO: They're not happy.

WILLIAMS: . against the idea that he wants to break apart and after. Break apart trade deals.

GUTFELD: This is what makes Republicans honest because -- I don't want a protectionist leader. I have a theory he's playing tough with these deals, but I don't think he's protectionist.

WILLIAMS: Well, I'm just saying, you know, there's a lot more to this story about the economy and the idea that he can run on the economy, obviously, if most Americans think the economy is booming, doing great, but they don't credit Donald Trump. That's not good news for Republicans.

GUILFOYLE: Let's see how long they're able to try to create an alternate reality. Alternative facts there and not accept that Donald Trump has actually done quite a bit here. I mean, look, he's got a housing rebound. The economy is accelerating. Job numbers up, infrastructure involvement up. And there's a lot of positive things happening here that you credit President Trump, including the corporate tax cuts. So, all of this is actually positioning not only the president but Republicans have something to work with in terms of these midterm races. So, he's in a very good position. He's there in Davos. It's fantastic that the president is participating and showing up there. Some of the people are quite upset that he's taking the press away from them. But he has wins on his side. And he's coming strong out of this whole battle with Schumer and DACA. So, you know, right now, this is a very positive positioning for the president.

WILLIAMS: You know what I think, is the fact is, that what you see at Davos, Kimberly, is people who are saying, I think the theme of the whole thing is fractured world, but we have a shared future in terms of a global economy. And so, they are going ahead in terms of trade deals. They're going ahead in terms of trying to work together multilaterally. Meanwhile, Trump is there saying, oh, no, this is about bilateral agreements with the United States, and he's saying we are putting the U.S. first and we are about isolationism, if not protectionism. That is not a happy message.

WATTERS: You know what amuses me, when the left says Trump was going to crash the economy. Then the economy accelerates and they say Obama gets credit for it.


WILLIAMS: How about the American people say that.

WATTERS: When people get a $1,000 bonus check in January 2018, how is that Obama's?

GUTFELD: By the way, I think the latest polls are 40 percent believe the economy is better has to do with Trump and the others one are split. So there's no majority of Americans.

PERINO: And for Republicans and President Trump, they're definitely improving just even in the last four weeks.


PERINO: And part of that is just all the good headlines. But I've got a couple points. One is that for Democrats who didn't vote for these tax cuts and tax reform, this could have been theirs. President Obama did want to cut the corporate tax rate to 27. The corporations were excited about that. But he wouldn't budge on individual rates because he wanted to increase taxes on the ridge. So, all of this could have been theirs. And the companies that have announced bonuses, imagine what they would have done.


PERINO: . to bend over backwards to try to help. So there's a missed opportunity. The other thing that works in conservatives favor is you see some companies pushing to $15 an hour. That was done without the government telling them they had to.


PERINO: So, that is another way for conservatives to say that the market works. The last thing I would say that is good for the president to do is as he meets with these other world leaders, Theresa May, Macron, and also, Kagame of Rwanda, there's going to come a time when he will have to ask one of these world leaders for a favor or for help and it will be politically unpopular in their country for them to do it, but if he has personal relationships with them, it's more likely they'll be willing to pony up.

GUTFELD: That's a salesman. You know, one last thing, Switzerland, my belief that they should not be allowed to have activists. If they are neutral -- No, they're neutral, they're not allowed to play. That's like dealing yourself at a blackjack table without any chips. You know what I'm saying? If you're neutral, you can't protest, how about that?

WILLIAMS: Neutral as a military power.

GUTFELD: I don't know. I don't read a lot.


WATTERS: Switzerland or Sweden?

GUTFELD: I get them confused.


GUTFELD: One of them yodel. One of them yodel, right? The Swiss yodel and Swedes.


GUTFELD: Fish? They fish. Don't do it at the same time, kids.


GUTFELD: All right. I think Donald Trump is going to come back with a few Norwegians. I don't know.



GUTFELD: Will President Trump be meeting with Mueller soon? He wants to testify other oath and he's looking forward to it, next.


WATTERS: President Trump has always said there was no collusion with the Russians and he's ready to talk to Robert Mueller to put an end to the investigation.


UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Are you going to talk to Mueller?

PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I'm looking forward to it, actually.


TRUMP: There's been no collusion, whatsoever. There's no obstruction, whatsoever. And I'm looking forward to it.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Do you have date set?

TRUMP: I don't know. I guess they're talking about two or three weeks, but I would love to do it. Again, I have to say, subject to my lawyers and all of that, but I have to do it.

UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: Would you do it under oath, Mr. President?

TRUMP: I would do it under oath.


WATTERS: Some top legal analysts, though, think it might not be the best idea for Mr. Trump.


UNINDENTIFIED MALE: This is an extremely dangerous situation to allow the president to get in because he does not know and cannot know as much about the case as Bob Mueller and his fellow interrogators will know. And he might very well say things which would lead them to other areas of investigation.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: It leaves me worrying that what's going to happen is that this investigation will end not with a bang but a whimper. The great worry is that because he doesn't have anything really substantial, he may go after obstruction of justice which would create a constitutional crisis.


WATTERS: Kimberly, it is very clear that it would not be a good idea for the president of the United States to go sit down with Robert Mueller and answer questions under oath.

GUILFOYLE: OK, so says top legal analyst, Watters' world.

WATTERS: Do you concur?

GUILFOYLE: I concur, consul. Yes, I think it would be a very bad idea. I don't think he should offer to give testimony. And I think the problem is when you do something like this it's very -- you can open up other areas and then they start going there. And also, inconsistent statements, problems like that, then they try to say OK, but you lied to investigators. They tried to then impeach you with some prior statement or get someone else to contradict you. So that's why you see his attorneys pushing back on it. End up saying, OK, wait a second. Let's see.

WATTERS: Ty Cobb cleaned that up pretty quickly.

GUILFOYLE: Under advise of council.

WATTERS: The cleanup hitter came in. Juan, he's probably just being a little cocky, wants to show that his confident, and doesn't have anything to hide. And maybe just went a little too far. You don't think he really wants to go in there and go toe to toe with Mueller, do you?

WILLIAMS: He's a very confident man, isn't he?


WILLIAMS: Well, there we go. I mean, he probably thinks he can sell ice cubes to Eskimos.


GUTFELD: You assuming they like ice cubes because they're Eskimos?

WILLIAMS: No. Gin and tonic.


GUILFOYLE: Gin and Tonic?

WATTERS: Where do you think the president, Juan, would be the most nervous or would get the most nervous answering questions from Robert Mueller? Where do you think he has the most exposure?

WILLIAMS: Well, he's got so much exposure. Well, he starts asking him about things like, well, Michael Flynn or the firing of Jim Comey. But let's just go with collusion for the moment. What about Michael Flynn? What about the fact that Flynn lied about contacts with the Russians? What about your son having meetings with the Russian lawyer, what about you asking the Russians to hack Hillary Clinton? I can go on.

WATTERS: So, the what about? OK. I think the president might be able to respond pretty effectively to the what about question. Dana, you went through this when the special counsel -- you didn't personally.

PERINO: I did not.

WATTERS: That has to be, probably, the most frightening thing in the world.

PERINO: As I recall, I don't remember precisely. I don't think there was ever a request to talk to President Bush about any of that. I don't remember that. Cheney, they did.

WATTERS: Can the president get out of having.

PERINO: I actually wanted to ask Kimberly that. I mean, I wouldn't volunteer an interview but can he be compelled to talk? I mean, it might not entirely be his choice.

GUILFOYLE: Right. This is what I like about what they suggested because you don't want to look like you have something to hide, that you're afraid, you're not being forthright because the perception of that could be worse, perhaps, than even him coming forward. What I like is a carefully tailored affidavit under penalty of perjury, sworn, that his attorneys with him, the system of council, prepared to show that he is.

PERINO: Because he might not have a choice, right?

GUILFOYLE: . by cooperating, right.

PERINO: But I also think that what he was doing yesterday was, it's not, maybe -- I think he's thinking three steps ahead. I don't necessarily think it's confidence. I think it is setting himself up to say, look, you heard me.

WATTERS: I wanted to.

PERINO: I wanted to. You heard me. I wanted to talk to them but it was the lawyers. My lawyers said no, so I've got to listen to my lawyers. Surely you can understand that.

WATTERS: I think you're probably right.

PERINO: Though there's the P.R. strategy.

WATTERS: I think you're right. Greg?

GUTFELD: I think he's probably really good at depositions.

WATTERS: He's got experienced?

GUTFELD: I mean deposition for him is like a dental appointment.

WATTERS: Like a Tuesday.

GUTFELD: It's Tuesday. But, he's kind of like -- imagine like a rock climbing wall that looks really easy and then you get there and it just goes flat. I think that's what Trump is like when he gets into a legal.

GUILFOYLE: Like Spider-man.


GUTFELD: There's no way to get on -- find a place because he'll be just like, I don't know, I don't know this, I don't know that.

WATTERS: Opposite of how he usually is.

PERINO: That's why I think it's probably going to be hard for people to say, well, he didn't -- he wouldn't have known that obstruction of justice was wrong. But then he has all this experience, so I don't know if that's going to wash.

WATTERS: But isn't obstruction of justice -- does it actually have to stop the investigation? And the investigation has still went on.


WATTERS: But he never impeded the investigation.

WILLIAMS: He tried.

WATTERS: But when he fired Mueller he didn't imped it -- or Comey.

WILLIAMS: Even this week, with the question that he put -- I guess it was to McCabe about, you know, who'd you vote for? I mean, these things are like indicating that he wants the investigation to go a certain way and not another way. He wants politics.


WILLIAMS: It seems to me the lawyers though for Trump right now are trying to use leverage, and I think Trump is part of this to say maybe we would agree to a written question and we'll give you written answers as opposed - - they don't want him before a grand jury.

WATTERS: Greg, you weren't here yesterday when the texts came out? Have you anything to say about the texts?

GUTFELD: Yeah. Apparently there's a lost and found. Who knew? I mean, where did they find them? Under the pillow where you lose your remote? This is insane. But you know what? They wouldn't have found them. They wouldn't have found them if there wasn't pressure from certain people to.

PERINO: I don't think that's true.

GUTFELD: Definitely.

PERINO: But the guy that found them is the inspector general who doesn't have a dog in the fight. They found them and like -- basically like 30 minutes.

WATTERS: Well, we do want to see these text. Demented Dr. Larry Nassar will now rot in jail for the rest of his life. The gymnasts he victimized want many more held accountable, up next.


PERINO: One chapter closed yesterday in the U.S. gymnastic sexual abuse scandal, but there is more justice to be served for Larry Nassar's crimes. Many people in power knew about the abuse and did nothing to stop it. The victims want to make sure they too are held accountable and that this never happens again.


UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: The USA gymnastics is really an organization that's rotting from the inside out. They created a culture of physical, psychological and mental abuse. But they also had a policy of not reporting sexual predators. When you have a culture that is abusive and then you have a policy of not reporting sexual abuse, you have created the perfect dynamic for a predator to be able to flourish.

UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was a combination of the wrong people being in charge and neglecting things that needed to be done legally and didn't do them. One hundred and ten percent shouldn't have never met this man -- in my life. Something went wrong.

UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: We need to hold these organizations accountable. USA gymnastics, United States Olympic Committee, MSU, they need an independent investigation. This is bigger than Larry Nassar.


PERINO: Hours after Nassar's sentencing, the president of MSU did step down. Not much accountability in Lou Anna Simon statement though. Listen, she said, as tragedies are politicized, blame is inevitable. As president, it's only natural that I am the focus of this anger. I understand. Therefore, I am tendering my resignation. Kimberly, is there -- are there more legal acts to be taken against people who might have known about this and didn't do anything?

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, potentially, I mean, certainly there will be civil lawsuits as well that can abound from this. First you usually see a criminal prosecution, you know, the proceeds of civil litigation or some kind of class action could come forward to suspending because there's certainly quite a large number of young girls who were victimized. Then it comes down to these organizations and them being held accountable. What did people know? When do they know it? It does really remind me of Penn State, and you think about it in terms of these abuses, like was someone told? Did they not document it? Did they allow it to continue? So, there's an ability there for them to bring something forward to say, you know, you had a duty to protect and to keep us safe, and yet you put us in a very vulnerable and dangerous, you know, position where we were victimized. And I think that the young women were quite articulate in terms of explaining their position and their vulnerability and using their voice to say that there should be more of a thorough independent investigation to these entities.

PERINO: Kimberly brought up what happened in the Sandusky trial. Remember, all the people there said, you know, never again. And I think it's interesting how human beings, we continue to learn these lessons over and over again, Juan.

WILLIAMS: You know, it's so sad and, you know, in reading and listening to the young women talk about it, it was shocking to me. They said that they were told that it was required that they allow this man to come into their hotel rooms, their dorm rooms anytime of night. No nurse in attendance and no restrictions on what he was doing. And they were told this is what you need to do. If you don't do it, you're going to be punished and you will be penalized in terms of participating with the team. So, what's interesting to me is the statement coming from the president of Michigan State because she's basically saying something that sound reasonable on his face, which is she's the president of a huge, important university, and how was she to know what some miscreant doctor is doing?

But on the other hand, you realize "The Indianapolis Star" broke the story. Other people have been involved, and it was a very slow response. And I can -- I would think that she should have known at that point something is wrong here. And we've got to protect children.

The same thing with the people who are on USA Gymnastics. I just think they become blind, in terms of pursuing competition, to protecting children.

PERINO: It's really remarkable how -- Kimberly said, how articulate they were, saying during the sound bite, they're...


PERINO: ... poised. They're so mature. And they were going through all of this inner turmoil, Jesse, and yet, they were able to perform and be just amazing athletes and students, as well.

WATTERS: Right, but I don't think USA Gymnastics thought of them as athletes. I thought they probably thought of them as just gold medal factories. I don't think they saw them as human beings.

There's red flags everywhere. This is the biggest sports scandal in history. Juan touched on it a little bit. I'm reading some of this stuff. The doctor never wore gloves. He's walking around not wearing gloves, alone in hotel rooms. He was the first call they were supposed to make at nighttime. He's isolating them in mandatory camps across the country where they're cutting off communication with their parents, their agents and their lawyers. And the minute you complain, you're told you're not on the team anymore?

I mean, it sounds like you're putting a serial pedophile in charge of young girls for decades, and no one saw anything abnormal about it. This is not just Penn-State-level scandal. This is Catholic Church level scandal. And I think Congress needs to get involved.

PERINO: I think that they went back. I think that there was a call for at least a hearing and maybe more.

Greg, Juan brings up "The Indianapolis Star." They -- investigative journalists were the ones that were the initial instigators that led to this lawsuit.

GUTFELD: Which meant that this stuff was probably percolating, just like the Harvey Weinstein stuff. It was percolating. People knew or heard things and then somebody finally said, "I'm going to go follow it up."

I think when you're seeing a lot of unhappiness after this, after the sentencing, because we realize there's actually no adequate punishment to fit the crime. There is no actual -- there's no punishment. I mean, I suppose you could skin him alive, but I don't know if we're allowed to do that.


GUTFELD: No, but I mean -- no. You would -- really, is skinning alive really that bad with this?

But I mean, people who argue against the death penalty always say that living in prison with the guilt of what you've done is actually worse than death. Every day -- and it's like, I disagree. I think people -- you'd be surprised what people can live with and adapt to. Human beings, animals evolved to their surroundings. He will figure out a way to live, unless, you know, he decides not to live because it's so unbearable, if people make it unbearable.

WILLIAMS: Can I ask Greg a question?


WILLIAMS: What do you think of this judge? Because I worry about the judge. I think she went a little -- I mean, you know, Larry Nassar should go to jail, but boy, she put on a show. Now, is it cathartic for the women involved? Is that what this was about? Or does she think that, because he's a bad guy, she can use the power of her standing to just beat the living daylights out of him?

GUILFOYLE: We talked about this yesterday.

GUTFELD: You know, I -- it's interesting, because the case is so heinous. That I do -- I had a tinge of misgivings about some of the high drama, but if there was a case that can forgive high drama, it's this one.

If it were a different case where it was like Juan Williams, you know, dealing with parking tickets or something like that that and somebody is, like, going "You work for FOX News. You're a terrible person." That's -- because there are cameras in the courtroom, and people get hyper dramatic. In this case, I can see -- I found it to be highly dramatic, but in this kind of case, it's almost like so what?

PERINO: Let me -- let me give Kimberly the last word. Because one of the things -- I listened to the daily podcast this morning, and they had interviewed a few of these girls about what it was like to confront him. And they said how cathartic it was, how they felt like a burden had been lifted off of their shoulders and that she gave them encouragement. And, you know, victims' impact statements are part of...


PERINO: The Supreme Court ruled...


PERINO: ... that this is allowed.

GUILFOYLE: It's permissible, and there's plenty of evidence to document that it is something that is very healing. It's important for them to have their voice. We talked about this yesterday.

In so many of the cases that I've prosecuted for sexual assault and domestic violence, crimes against women and children, the one thing that they say is to be able to be -- have their day in court and stand and face the person that has committed heinous crimes against them, is very empowering. And very helpful for them moving forward in their lives. The judge was, like, well within her rights to do what she did.

PERINO: OK. John Kerry is reportedly considering another run for the White House. The 2020 buzz ahead.


WILLIAMS: John Kerry's White House bid didn't go so well for him in 2004, but now there's word he may try again in 2020, this time to take on President Trump.

There's also a report floating around overseas that the former secretary of state has tried to undermine the president's Mideast peace efforts, advising Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas not to yield to President Trump's demands. But that report is unconfirmed.

So Dana, where do you go with this? What do you think?

PERINO: Well, I loved to see a little rematch of '04. Sounds good here.

WILLIAMS: Rematch?

PERINO: Well, remember, John Kerry ran against President George W. Bush in '04.

WILLIAMS: I don't think George W. can run again.

PERINO: No, no, I just mean, like, watching John Kerry run again would be interesting.

I have to ask my friend Michael Meehan what he thinks. He was chief of staff to the campaign, and I'm -- look, Americans usually give a president a second term. That is just historically what we do. It is very rare for a president to lose reelection. And I guess Democrats probably think that if they had a chance that this would be their time, but I don't know. I don't think that -- I don't think Democrats want to go backwards. I think they want to look for somebody new, and John Kerry is not going to fit that bill.

Plus, I have heard that President Obama has said that, if Joe Biden wants to run, he will have his full support. So if you're going to try to run without Obama's support, that's going to be tough.

WILLIAMS: Kimberly, what do you think about the report that he's telling leaders of the Palestinians, "Don't worry."

GUTFELD: Terrible.

WILLIAMS: "Trump will be gone in a year."

GUTFELD: Terrible. I'm sorry. Go ahead. That's the worst.

GUILFOYLE: I mean, that's not going to help him at all.

PERINO: It's not going to help the Palestinians either.

GUILFOYLE: It's not going to help the Palestinians, not helping Kerry.

GUTFELD: Idiotic. Traitorous.

GUILFOYLE: Outrageous, is what it is.

But listen to me, this is not going to bode well for Kerry. It's not. His time was up. It's done. He's not going to be able to win. President Trump would just clobber him. So I don't even know what they're thinking. I mean, Joe Biden is obviously a much better choice.

WILLIAMS: Jesse, what do you think?

WATTERS: Well, it's not the first time Kerry has been accused of being a traitor. Trump would devour John Kerry. I could see it now: "Boring, Bike-Riding John, the Iran deal John..."

GUILFOYLE: Like a burger with Heinz ketchup on it.

PERINO: Wind surfing.

WATTERS: "... married for money, Windsurfing Johnny, the plastic senator from Massachusetts. You know, smeared Vietnam soldiers." He would wipe the floor with him. It wouldn't even be close.

WILLIAMS: You think so?

WATTERS: I know so.


GUILFOYLE: I don't think he stuttered.

WILLIAMS: So Greg, the other part of this is, you know, that clearly, the Trump administration is holding money back from the Palestinians. They've recognized Jerusalem as the capital of Israel. These are things that the Palestinians and a lot of their allies overseas are saying, "Well, what happened to the U.S. as a fair partner, potentially negotiating a long- standing peace deal?"

GUTFELD: That is -- that is actually what he's talking about. It is fair, and it's disgusting what Kerry did, going over there, undermining the president. It's just wrong.

Watching John Kerry run. Think about that. It's like a praying mantis skipping. He is -- he is just garstoric (ph) totem pole without the flexibility. I'd call him a driftwood sculpture, but I've already said that once. And you're right: Trump is going to treat him like a bath mat; he's going to wipe his feet on his head.

PERINO: I do wonder if the Palestinians floated that story and that it's not true.

WILLIAMS: It's not been confirmed.

PERINO: The Kerry piece. It doesn't sound like something that he would do. And so it -- that could be fake news.

WILLIAMS: Well, the Palestinians have also refused to meet with...

PERINO: No, I mean...

WILLIAMS: ... Vice President Pence, which upsets President Trump, because Pence went over there to meet with them.

PERINO: What I'm saying is fake would be the -- that Kerry said to the Palestinians, "Just hold on. He's not going to be president in a year."

WILLIAMS: Yes, we haven't confirmed.

PERINO: I wouldn't -- I wouldn't put it past the Palestinians to make that up in order to get attention.

WILLIAMS: Yes, remember, you've got a lot of angles here.

So anyway, did you have a sandwich for lunch today?


WILLIAMS: You may be destroying the planet, you, according to some global warming alarmists. Anyway, Kimberly will have more next.


GUILFOYLE: Welcome back. I am very upset. Two of my favorite things, sandwiches and meat, they're coming under attack.

Did you hear, environmentalists are putting for a tax on meat, claiming hamburgers, steaks and other delicious delectables are harmful to the environment.

And then there are the sandwich police. You know them. Some scientists claim that they're bad for the planet, too, for all kinds of reasons because of ingredients and packaging.

So Dana, can you believe this ridiculousness?

PERINO: No. I saw there's going to be mandatory roof gardens in Denver.


PERINO: No, you can do -- you should go do "Watters' World" out there.

WATTERS: Mandatory?

PERINO: Mandatory roof gardens in Denver.

GUILFOYLE: Like greening the city and...

PERINO: I think the environmentalists should take a page out of the Donald Trump playbook and try to figure out a way to make the art of the deal.

There are a lot of conservatives -- it's a surprising number to me -- that support the idea of a carbon tax.


PERINO: And if they were to do that, then all of these other little things that they want to do that would hurt the things people are trying to sell for people to eat would go away.


GUILFOYLE: All right, Greg, what do you make of this? I mean, you're a carnivore.

GUTFELD: I am, and I'm going to break this story. I sent it around to you guys. No response. About how selling -- giving away at straws at restaurants, you can go to jail.


GUTFELD: You guys don't even read the stuff I send you.

GUILFOYLE: Just so you know, nobody got that.

PERINO: We weren't on the e-mail.

GUTFELD: All right, never mind.

GUILFOYLE: What is wrong with you? No one got it. You didn't send it to us.

GUTFELD: Let's talk about some evolutionary science here. Meat made us the king of all beasts, because there's no other way to get protein-rich nutrients than meat. You can say, "Oh, eat spinach." You're going to have to rent a U-Haul to eat all the spinach that you get from a steak. It's a fact.

The reason why we have these brains is because we ate so much meat for 200,000 years. So if you think about PETA and environmentalist groups, veganism, they're all able to exist now in 2018 because of the meat eaters of the past who built this amazing civilization that allows unfocused adults to chase their fringe causes.

GUILFOYLE: OK, so I don't get this. It's so crazy, Jesse. So they're saying that this causes global warming, all of it. I mean, it's unbelievable to me. What about the children, Jesse? Eat sandwiches.

WATTERS: You've got to do it for the kids. The Lunchables. Don't touch the Lunchables.


WATTERS: Americans will tolerate crazy left-wing environmental wackos to a certain extent. When they tell us we can't use the aerosol deodorant, we say, "Fine." When they say we have to put the bottles in a different bin and recycle.

PERINO: We say OK.


But you know what? Then they come after the meat and they come at -- no.



PERINO: We're drawing the red line on the meat?

WATTERS: We're drawing the headline at the hamburgers and the hot dogs. They've already talked about we can't drive certain cars. We don't like that. They've also said something about sodas. I think they don't like drinking big gulp sodas any more here in Manhattan.

So it's gotten to the point where it's become too ridiculous, and they're just climbing (ph) themselves.

GUILFOYLE: I had two hot dogs today. No bun.

WATTERS: Eww, no bun?

GUTFELD: Atkins? Atkins?

GUILFOYLE: Well, I didn't have any. No, I didn't have any edible buns. There was nothing.

WATTERS: Did you eat it with a knife and fork, or did you just...

GUILFOYLE: I cut it up and used a little spicy mustard.

WATTERS: Oh, my God.

PERINO: Did you have any pepperoni for a quesadilla?

GUILFOYLE: I also had pepperoni today, too.

GUTFELD: It's good. You know what? You're going to be doing this in ten years when you're my age, pal. No more bread. You're going to be eating nothing but meat.

WATTERS: What's wrong with brad?

GUTFELD: Carbohydrates, sugar make you fat. There's no question about that.

WATTERS: I'm not so sure about that.

GUILFOYLE: Also -- then what kind of diet are you on now?

PERINO: You should see my "One More Thing."


GUTFELD: I'm just saying.

GUILFOYLE: What happened over the holidays?

GUTFELD: You know in New York, they don't eat bread? They put toxins in their head.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Juan, what do you have to say about this?

WILLIAMS: You know what surprised me?

GUILFOYLE: This is coming from your folks.

WILLIAMS: You know what? Well, let me just speak -- before I get to that, Kimberly, let me just say what is surprising the most was they say the worst sandwich, the one that has the worst, most impact on the environment, is a breakfast sandwich with sausage, bacon and eggs.


WILLIAMS: They said it's the equivalent of driving 12 miles if you just eat one.

WATTERS: Well, then I drove all over the country this morning, because I had...

GUILFOYLE: Did you eat two?

WATTERS: Yes, I had two bacon, egg and cheese sandwiches.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God, they're so good.

WILLIAMS: Look at you.

GUILFOYLE: Would you go bacon, egg and cheese over, like, a sausage, egg and cheese?

WATTERS: I'd prefer the bacon, egg and cheese.


WATTERS: With the sausage as a nice little lean patty on there. I'll take the sausage.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. So it's -- Starbucks has a lean one.

WILLIAMS: It's worse than your private plane now in terms of the cost.

GUTFELD: If you put the bread on those sandwiches, what you're eating is ten times better than breakfast cereals, granola, yogurt. A big dish of yogurt, a big dish of yogurt from Chobani or wherever is like having ice cream for breakfast.

But if you have -- if you have lean meat, if you have protein. An egg, yellow, the yolk, not whites. Enough of this egg white crap.

GUILFOYLE: I'm with you. I eat the whole thing.

GUTFELD: Eat the damn yolk. The yolk is the most important thing.

WATTERS: You had yolk.

GUTFELD: I'm pro-yolk.

GUILFOYLE: By the way, it's tasty. It's beautiful. It goes down well.

PERINO: You can get this nowhere else on cable news.

WILLIAMS: You know what? You know what? I have one last thing to say.

GUILFOYLE: I had a hard-boiled egg too. I ate the yellow one. Lean over.

WILLIAMS: Hey, take it easy. A man eater.

But I will say, I was stunned to realize it's that Americans eat two times as much meat as anybody else in the world.

WATTERS: Well, that's because we win all the world wars, Juan.

PERINO: We've got to go.

WATTERS: We're undefeated.

GUILFOYLE: How about...

WATTERS: Don't fix what's not broken.

GUILFOYLE: I agree. Well, you know, there's more food stuff coming up. You know what I'm talking about. "One More Thing" next.


GUTFELD: All right. It's time for "One More Thing." I go first with this.


GRAPHIC: Greg's Total Bummer News


GUTFELD: "Greg's Total Bummer News." This story will probably be -- it will only be on this show on this network, on any network in America. The announcement that Mark E. Smith from The Fall passed away yesterday at the age of 60. Nobody else cares about this guy. This is the lead singer of The Fall, one of the seminal punk bands, one of the most disagreeable geniuses on the face of the earth. If you haven't heard of him, he's an acquired taste. I urge you to look up his stuff. Go on YouTube. Search "Cruiser's Creek" or "Dr. Buck's Letter." His music is amazing. And he will be missed.

GUILFOYLE: Have you ever played that on the show?

GUTFELD: I played -- I just played it today.

WATTERS: You just described yourself. Disagreeable genius, and acquired taste.

GUTFELD: Thank you! All right. Rest in peace, Mark Smith, Mark E. Smith, that is.

All right. Next up, Juan.

WILLIAMS: Well, my twin granddaughters love dolls. They're regulars at the American Girl place and own an army of Barbies. Now there's a new generation of dolls, Breaking Barriers. Mattel released photos of new dolls modeled after actresses Oprah Winfrey, Reese Witherspoon and Mindy Kaling who star in Disney's film adaptation of the beloved children's book, "A Wrinkle in Time." Fans on social media are gushing over the dolls, and the film's director, Ava Duvernay, noted how special it is to see a diverse representation of powerful women in Barbies.

So now I'm rooting for Kimberly and Dana as dolls.

GUTFELD: Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: I would love to be a doll.

GUTFELD: Transition.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you so much. It's time for "Kimberly's Food Court." Da, da-da, daa, neer, neer-neer.

OK. Taco Bell lovers, identify yourself. Greg.


GUILFOYLE: Yes. Jesse.

GUTFELD: Although my intestines disagree.

GUILFOYLE: The next time you place an order, you may want to just ask, do you want fries with that? Because we've got these super delicious Taco Bell cheesy fries.

GUTFELD: Look at that.

GUILFOYLE: They come with this, like, nacho cheese. Jess, what do you think? You've been eating a lot of it. It's got a little spicy kick to it. Do you love it?


GUILFOYLE: They have Mexican seasoning on it. And I mean, I think it's, like, a bargain, because you get the side of cheese.

GUTFELD: Taco Bell is the Edison lab of food.

GUILFOYLE: It's so good.

GUTFELD: They invent.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you so much. One dollar.


GUILFOYLE: One dollar.

PERINO: Wow, that's good. Like a bargain.

GUILFOYLE: You can get all of this.

PERINO: It's a bargain.

GUILFOYLE: But it's only for a limited time, so I think you should since the opportunity here.

GUTFELD: All right. Jesse.

WATTERS: OK, so we've reported all year the NFL has a lot of problems. Now the NFL has a new challenger. A new league is coming, the XFL. Remember Vince McMahon?


WATTERS: The wrestling tycoon? He's bringing back the XFL to compete against the NFL in 2020. It's going to be spring football. And there's going to be, I think, eight teams, 40-man rosters a piece.

GUILFOYLE: And no kneeling.

WATTERS: And he has some requirements about the national anthem and breaking the laws. Let's listen.


VINCE MCMAHON, OWNER, XFL: I think, again, it's a time-honored tradition to stand and appreciate the national anthem with any sport. Here in America, or for that matter, in any country they do that. So I think it would be appropriate to do that.

You want someone who -- who does not have any criminality whatsoever associated with him. And in the XFL, even if you have a DUI, you will not play in the XFL.


WATTERS: I can go to sleep to that voice.


PERINO: And I've got to tell you, Vince McMahon, if you need a communications person, I know somebody that would be very good. It's not me. But it's better than me.

WATTERS: Quickly.

PERINO: Don't worry. You will hit your hand here. French President Emmanuel Macron is going to be the first official state visit for President Trump this spring. He'll be bringing baguettes. Why? Because he's actually lobbying for baguettes to become a protected world treasure by UNESCO. It would be an intangible cultural heritage list, along with things like Belgian beer. So we'll see if President Trump will get on board.

GUTFELD: All right. Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." Like me on the French Riviera, he's bare. Bret Baier.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

GUTFELD: "Special Report" up next.

WILLIAMS: Oh, my gosh.

GUILFOYLE: What's wrong with you?


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