This is a rush transcript from "The Ingraham Angle," May 29, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
LAURA INGRAHAM, FOX NEWS HOST: I'm Laura Ingraham. This is "The Ingraham Angle" from Washington tonight. Violence erupting tonight in cities across the country. We see anger, some righteous, but a lot of it right now is frankly riotous and out-of-control. Lockdowns from COVID have put 40 million Americans now out of work and millions of others have been locked into their homes for weeks. You had a racially charged situation like the killing of George Floyd in Minneapolis, and sadly, you have all the ingredients for a combustible night or two or three.
Now, we're covering this story throughout the hour from the law enforcement veterans that we trust, local Minnesota politicians, business owners to Raymond Arroyo, who we will break down the media's handling of all of this. But we begin tonight in Minneapolis, a city that finds itself under a very tenuous curfew at this moment.
Fox's Mike Tobin is on the ground in Minne (ph) tonight with the latest.
Mike, set the scene for us.
MIKE TOBIN, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: I'll set the scene for you. About an hour (inaudible) minutes ago, the Minneapolis State Patrol got out with their loudspeaker truck and they (inaudible) the crowd against for this in that Third Precinct area that they're about to be in violation of the curfew order, that they needed to disperse. But they gave them that order, and there was a little bit of an exchange of tear gas, a little bit of exchange of bottles (ph).
And then we saw as 8 o'clock rolled out (ph), the state troopers and the National Guard all backed up - backed up the street as they backed up (inaudible) demonstrators, backed up (inaudible) numbers seem to grow. They--
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Watch out.
TOBIN: --that grew with intensity.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Watch out, watch out.
TOBIN: And now--
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I hear you.
(CROSSTALK)
TOBIN: Hours later, they backed all the way up. The people took to the streets and they just started--
(CROSSTALK)
INGRAHAM: I want to get you back in a safe situation there. So, Mike, hold that - hold that thought. We got a lot of horn - OK. We got you, Mike.
TOBIN: Let me ask you a question. You're out here. You (inaudible). Tell me what you're trying to get done. Why the arrest of Officer Derek Chauvin is not enough for you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because I feel like he killed more than just George. And I felt that at the end of the day, it's like how do we know they'll arrest that (inaudible) and we're not going to sleep until all four of them is locked down.
TOBIN: What are you going to do here tonight?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What we're going to do, we're going to keep on marching. We're not harming nobody. All we're doing (inaudible) city down. They - what they did earlier, they shut the city down. And they started using rubber bullet force and gas - teargas, (inaudible). A lot of people were tired. They say enough is enough. I can only control so much. But I have the whole city that's--.
TOBIN: With all the destruction and looting that took place last night, are you concerned that you get paid (inaudible)?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm going to tell you, yesterday, just walking - just driving right next to the swat team and we looked at them, they jumped out the car and they pulled guns on us. So, I was like, I'm not afraid - I'm not afraid (inaudible). And that's why I think the whole city (inaudible). And that's the reason why (inaudible) because we are--
INGRAHAM: All right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a block (inaudible).
TOBIN: Right. Fair enough.
(CROSSTALK)
INGRAHAM: Mike, we're going to - Mike. Yes. Mike, I know it's hard to hear you, and it's hard to hear the gentleman you are interviewing, but we're going to check back with you in a few moments. Maybe we get a little quieter shot there so we can hear it.
Now I want to go now to Atlanta, which is quickly evolved into complete chaos. Riots have broken out tonight, including outside CNN's headquarters, which was just breached by a protester.
Fox's Jonathan Serrie just got on the scene live in Atlanta and has the latest developments.
We've been watching this for a couple of hours now, Jonathan. What do you know?
JONATHAN SERRIE, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Several blocks away from where all the mayhem is unfolding, this is something I've never seen in Atlanta. I've lived in this town on and off since the early 1980s. This is a city that prides itself on its civil rights legacy. After the assassination of Dr. Martin Luther King, it was one of the few large cities that, instead of having riots, had a peaceful demonstration. Black people, white people locking arms and marching in solidarity.
When incendiary things happen, the people protest. The police here generally give the - they have a tradition of giving the protesters some space, allowing a certain degree of civil disobedience. Then when it gets to be a little too much, they express what the limits are and the protesters get back in line and go where they're supposed to be. Clearly, that did not happen today.
This is something I have never seen in Atlanta. Mayor Keisha Lance Bottoms is trying to appeal to that peaceful Atlanta tradition, that tradition of peaceful protest, calling on these demonstrators to stop doing damage, to stop vandalizing, because this is just not what we do in Atlanta, appealing to that.
She assembled a gathering of religious leaders, civil rights leaders, rap artists, members of the hip-hop community to appeal to the protesters to be peaceful, to get their point across in more effective ways than doing this violence. But how you get your point across by attacking CNN, by attacking a journalistic organization - I don't know what the strategy is - by tearing up your own city. I don't know what the strategy is or if there was no strategy.
Lot of people trying to figure out why now, why is Atlanta erupting this way like it has not in the past while you did have that high-profile case down in South Georgia, a black man fatally shot and killed. Initially, the men involved were not charged until the tape of that went public, and then you have the situation in Minneapolis. And then, add that to COVID-19. Peopled cooped up in their houses wanting to get out. Perhaps it was a perfect storm.
Talking about the civil rights legacy, one of those civil rights leaders - longtime civil rights leaders is Andrew Young, Former Atlanta Mayor, Former Ambassador to the United Nations. He tweeted this evening, "Tonight and tomorrow night, we have to round up the reasonable young people who are part of that group and let them know that they have made their point and now they hurt their cause."
Back to you.
INGRAHAM: Thank you so much. And we're going to check back into these hotspots throughout the hour. And again, appealing to everybody, make your voice heard, make your motions known, march, speak, rally, but what happened at CNN, if you're watching it earlier, it took your breath away. We had explosions, we had glass shattered, we had projectiles thrown at the police, we had the police then throwing - sending teargases into the crowd.
Again, for people who are just tuning in, we have a night of disturbance across the United States and a lot of people are very, very concerned about law and order throughout the country, and the peace of mind of those who are truly, truly worried about the civil rights movements, race relations, and on top of everything else, our health and our economy.
But now, I'm going to get on to how I was going to originally start the show. Courting chaos. That's the focus of tonight's Angle.
Heartache and anger over George Floyd's killing run deep. And it should, for his family, his community, and the entire country. And the pain was made even worse though last night when protest turned to horrendous violence in Minneapolis and then it spiraled across the United States. And of course, you're seeing that tonight. Now, George Floyd didn't deserve to die. And the innocent Americans around the very place where Floyd died, they didn't deserve to lose their dreams either.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know what I'm going to do. It hurts them. It's not fair. It's not right. We've been working so hard (inaudible). It is not just for me, it's for my family.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's heartbreaking for me and really for many members of our community because you can't find a business in any direction that doesn't have damage.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Inaudible) This is what feels like a warzone right there.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Be careful (inaudible).
(END VIDEO CLIP) INGRAHAM: In total, more than 170 buildings were damaged. Cars lit on fire. The police precinct burned. And for two days in a row, looting was widespread. Protests, but also violence and criminality spread across America.
Now, meanwhile, the Hennepin County attorney filed third-degree murder and manslaughter charges against Derek Chauvin, the officer involved. Now, will that indictment - those indictments and tonight's curfew be enough to kind of eventually quell the violence in the coming days?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Chauvin has been charged with third-degree murder and manslaughter. Your reaction just to that - just that fact?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's not enough.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: One officer has been taken into custody from what we've been told, but that is not enough and we will not be satisfied until all four of them are arrested and absolutely charged with the murder of George Floyd. (END VIDEO CLIP) INGRAHAM: Peaceful protest is the hallmark of a free society. We all know that. But what we're seeing break out across America, it's only going to make everything worse. There is absolutely zero chance that rioting or looting or destroying the good people's businesses or homes or properties that's going to result in a better life for anyone, especially African Americans.
Now, if history is any guide, rioting leads to what? It ends up leading to stronger law enforcement, longer jail sentences, and stricter rules for everybody. They end up devastating communities and driving out fearful residents and businesses. And the damage - the damage that's done can persist for decades. We heard a lot of faith leaders on the ground tonight saying that, some who were actually around in 1968.
A 2004 National Bureau of Economic Research study on those riots in the '60s found that they had economically significant negative effects on blacks' income and unemployment. Further, those effects may have been larger in the long run, from 1960 to 1980, than in the short run, from 1960-1970. The riots significantly depressed the median value of black owned property between 1960 and 1970 with little or no rebound in the '70s.
That means for the Twin Cities area, these riots could potentially reverse all of the economic gains made by African Americans over the last four years. So why do people then in authority, at times, actually sound like they're bending over backwards to avoid calling out those people who are dishonoring the memory of victims like George Floyd? They're holding back from actually calling out new acts of crime that are trying to co-opt a peaceful civil rights movement. Why do people even try to excuse that?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I disagree with only one thing that was said. The word "riot." What we're seeing right there is frustration and anger and rage and an uprising, because when people get good and sick of being killed for nothing in their own country and treated like sub-humans in their own country, people get mad. And people get sick of it.
(END VIDEO CLIP) INGRAHAM: And so much for leadership in a crisis. Right? The Democrat Mayor of Minneapolis is about as incompetent as they come. He actually ordered the city police to abandon the Third Precinct headquarters and just let everybody, give them their space, let the looters run wild.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MAYOR JACOB FREY, (D) MINNEAPOLIS: It became obvious to me that we could take a different route that would better assist both the public as well as the safety of our police officers. The building is just bricks and mortar. It's a building.
(END VIDEO CLIP) INGRAHAM: Apparently, this different route he was talking about involves not even trying to enforce the law. It may be bricks and mortar to him, but what do you think went through the minds of residents and business owners when they saw their local police station ablaze and the police just having to stand there and just take whatever was thrown at them, just not move? Do you think they felt safer? The residents who - innocent people just trying to make a living, take care of their families with antifa thugs swarming the scene, completely unimpeded.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. Mayor, there are people out there tonight that were saying things like where are the police right now? Where were the police, firefighters and National Guard to protect that Third Precinct and to protect that neighborhood?
FREY: We are doing absolutely everything that we can to keep the peace.
(END VIDEO CLIP) INGRAHAM: I can tell you if it was in one of the fancy suburbs outside of Minneapolis, they'd be protecting that. OK? So there's discrimination going all - a very expanded type of discrimination, but trying to virtue signal at the same time.
Now, you'd think after this horrifying killing of Mr. Floyd and the violence that now has spawned, it's spawned all across the country, that elected officials would act swiftly to bring order to the situation, to protect locals from harm and actual peaceful protesters from harm. Well, instead, Minnesota's AG, Keith Ellison, tried to refrain the rioting into almost a noble undertaking.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) KEITH ELLISON, ATTORNEY GENERAL OF MINNESOTA: Martin Luther King said many years ago that riot is the way that the unheard get heard. He didn't condone it. But he said to the nation as a person who always protested peacefully that don't just dismiss that and ignore it and relegate it to just criminality and bad behavior, actually ask yourself what's going on there and is it something that we as a society absolutely must pay attention to? I think we must pay attention to it.
(END VIDEO CLIP) INGRAHAM: Well, people were paying attention, if you could see that split screen when he was speaking, to a building burning down. Let that sink in for a moment.
Now, I think the nation is paying attention. They're watching this closely. They're disgusted by Floyd's killing and thank the good lord that they are. And they're disgusted by those who seek to use that pain as a pretext to push an agenda where there is antifa or just random anarchists or people who just want to cause trouble. Violence against innocent persons or property.
During eight years of the Obama administration, we had major riots in cities like Baltimore and Ferguson, Missouri. And remember, in both cases, those police officers were cleared of wrongdoing, but not before entire blocks and already struggling neighborhoods were totally devastated. Barack Obama was the nation's first black President. He remains a global - a global superstar and one of the most respected men on the planet. But he wasn't able to stop the madness.
In fact, at the - I think it was the fall of his last year in office, it shocked many to know that race relations had not only not improved in those eight years, they had worsened, eroded trust between law enforcement and inner-city America, as, let's face it, it's been a problem in our country since the civil rights movement or before that.
And we've had consent decrees and diversity training. We've had community policing events. We've had fairs and festivals to try to get people together, understand each other as human beings. And maybe some of it has helped around the edges. But more than anything, we see the images of what's happening tonight, we need a change of heart, we need a spiritual reawakening, all of us. And I mean all of us.
We need to foster a greater sense of respect for each other as human beings. That sounds trite and clich,. But the human aspect of this - and I'm talking beyond race. I know people don't want to hear it, but - as human beings, beyond race, beyond political parties, beyond any of that, now, can that type of reawakening be legislated? Well, I think if it could have been, I'm sure former presidents, including President Obama, would have tried.
And that's the Angle.
Joining me now is Mark Fuhrman, retired LAPD detective, Fox News Contributor. Also with me is Darrin Porcher, former NYPD officer and criminal justice professor.
Darrin, I want to start with you. You see this unrest spreading. And the scenes are shocking to Americans who haven't seen anything like this before. Obviously, the arrest and charges against Chauvin didn't make much of a dent. Your thoughts. And we'll start with what you saw in Atlanta tonight.
DR. DARRIN PORCHER, RETIRED NYPD LIEUTENANT & CRIMINAL JUSTICE PROFESSOR: I was a lieutenant in the NYPD, and oftentimes, one of the focuses in the department was to assess what the intelligence in the community is. The importance of that is this riot basically started before what happened to Mr. Floyd.
The police department failed to assess the pulse of that community and it now became a combustible situation. And the void in leadership amounted to nothing being done. As a result of nothing being done, it became a more combustible situation.
So now we need to coalesce with the federal troops, the state police and the local police, and they're going to triangulate and come up with a solution. But fortunately, we're trying to rebuild the dam after it's already broken as a result of the unfortunate incident that happened with Mr. Floyd.
INGRAHAM: Well, Mark - that's a very profound commentary that it doesn't happen on a night like this, it's been happening. And the Mayor today said we're used to giving protesters their space. And in some sense, that makes sense because you don't want to unnecessarily provoke people. But that strategy somehow did not work tonight.
And again, just for the sake of focusing on one place, Atlanta, with what happened in front of CNN. Explosions, cars on fire, the building was breached, windows smashed, teargas, projectiles thrown at officers. Finally, they did have to put on their riot gear because I think a bunch of them got hurt.
MARK FUHRMAN, RETIRED LAPD DETECTIVE & FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, Laura, you certainly can't legislate leadership. And that's one of the biggest problems here. And just like the professor said, those are very wise words, but when you get down to the levels of Minneapolis Police Chief, he's going to be looking for a new job, so is the Mayor.
This is something where leadership, you had to draw a line. And it was a trivial event that the police responded to that. They escalated into a slow-motion homicide. And this is what has inflamed this. It wasn't a Ferguson where you've got a quick movement of several seconds by two people that are engaged and an officer involved shooting occurs where you have two different points of view, two different levels of evidence and eyewitness testimony. This is on video, a slow and really painful thing to watch of somebody grinding somebody's face into the pavement until they're dead.
Now, that being said, it is horrific. But you can't dilute the justice by more rioting because eventually you're going to run out of buildings and then you're going to go into an area that isn't so willing to abandon the buildings, and those people are going to fight back, and then you're going to have a real problem.
INGRAHAM: Hold on, you guys. Hold on right there. We just have some breaking news in Brooklyn in New York, where a police precinct is now under threat. We'll go to that report now on the ground. We're going to go back to - we'll be there in just a moment. We have to get our shot there, guys.
Professor, I want to go back to you before we do that. When you see the images of Mr. Floyd on the ground, there - I could only watch it a few times. It's heartbreaking and infuriating. And then you see the images of American cities in flames tonight. And you think about 1968 and how it took Washington D.C., where I live, it took decades - Mark, you know, it took decades for it to come back in D.C., these neighborhoods.
So the sad thing is the neighborhoods that need the most revitalization or are just coming out of difficult economic times are then cast back down into despair because of what happens and the aftermath of a horrible criminal incident like this.
PORCHER: Well, that's true, but you want to amplify that times 10 in the wake of the COVID-19 pandemic based on the shortage of resources. And resources have been depleted immensely as a result of that. And if we look at the African American community in general, they believe that they've been recipients of a miscarriage of justice. And this is the way that they see to revolutionize how they should be treated by the police. Everyone deserves quintessential policing.
I'm a strong proponent in policing should be proceeded upon in an effective way. But at the same token, when we amplify our unwillingness or our dissatisfaction with an action that was committed by police, then that's when we need to sit at the table and come up with a more apt and, let's just say, poised level of an engagement between the police and community because police are public servants. They're here to serve the public. But at the same token, the public is a part of that partnership as well. It's a symbiotic relationship.
And when it becomes fractured, we see what's happening on the screen now. So we need to coalesce and have cooler heads prevail, sit at the table and devise a solution so we can get back to where we need to because this COVID-19 pandemic is destroying America as a result.
INGRAHAM: Mark, do you think that COVID-19 is part of this? We talked about it earlier today in our call for - with the staff, and I mentioned it and I thought, well, is that - is that bubbling up under the surface here, is that adding fuel to the fire? So many people have lost their lives. So many minorities have lost their lives. And people have been shut in. They've been shut in and a lot of restrictions on them. Is that part of this or a smaller part than perhaps one would lead--?
(CROSSTALK)
FUHRMAN: I think - anytime you have too much time on somebody's hands and they're idle and they're restless, something like this might ignite something. But I think what are we going to blame Baltimore and Ferguson on? I mean, those were actually situations where there was two sides and people didn't understand, and there was evidence that nobody knew about. This is crystal clear.
And the justice is not going to be given in the right amount in the power that it could when you're still prosecuting people from the riots that have actually possibly taken people's lives and destroyed entire blocks and communities.
INGRAHAM: We know that, unfortunately, businesses flee. They flee chaos. And businesses are needed in these neighborhoods. And it's really hard to build these businesses back. They found that in Ferguson. They certainly found that in Baltimore. And sadly, they're going to find it in Minnesota.
And gentlemen, I'm so glad we had both of you on tonight to give us some perspective on all of this--
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you.
INGRAHAM: --with all of your experience. Thank you very much.
And demonstrators, as I said, have taken to the streets in Brooklyn. We just learned some shocking details. Fox's Alex Hogan is on the scene now in Brooklyn with the latest. Alex?
ALEX HOGAN, FOX NEWS NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Laura, we're actually in Manhattan, but yes, we do have cameras there around the city. This is where some of the protests started. But across in Brooklyn, we're seeing some big changes there. There is far more police officers in the area than we were seeing earlier on in the day. We were seeing crowd of maybe just a couple hundred people now growing into masses there, walking around.
Of course, a lot of people are very angry, but some of that anger translating to larger energies, of course, that we're seeing in some of these crowds. So much so that police even had to bring in a bus to potentially put (ph) people onto those buses if they should get arrested. They also are calling a Level 4 mobilization. Basically that means, that's calling in any law enforcement that's in the surrounding area for some backup. A Level 5 would be the most and that essentially would be calling in all law enforcement altogether into the area.
So, again, tonight, we're seeing a lot of crowds in New York marching there to Brooklyn. We're seeing even a car on fire, reports of shots fired. So a lot of tension. But again, a lot of anger and people saying that they can't stay home even because of COVID-19, they have to ignore those guidelines and they need to voice this injustice that they're seeing. Of course, the Mayor is telling people to still keep in mind that they need to practice social distancing. It's just not easy, Laura, with these crowds that we're seeing tonight.
INGRAHAM: Yes. Alex, I'm not seeing a lot of social distancing tonight. That doesn't seem to be the--
HOGAN: You're not.
INGRAHAM: --top issue on people's minds. Thank you very much, Alex.
HOGAN: Yes. There are people--
INGRAHAM: Now I want to go across the country to LA, where rioters are swarming the downtown area and clashing with police.
KTTV's Bill Melugin is standing by in LA with the latest. Bill, what's happening there?
BILL MELUGIN, KTTV REPORTER: Laura, things are unfortunately really starting to pick up and escalate here in Los Angeles. We have one very small protest behind us here at LAPD headquarters. That's peaceful. That's not a problem. But just down the street from us, I'm sure you can hear the sirens in the background, a much more aggressive crowd is starting to take their anger out on LAPD.
I'm not sure if we have the video, but if we can pull it up, this happened within about the last 30 minutes or so. This is part of downtown LA called Pershing Square. You're going to see an LAPD officer goes in to make an arrest on somebody. He immediately gets swarmed by the crowd there, badly outnumbered. He continues trying to make that arrest.
The crowd continues swarming around him and eventually some of the people in the crowd start punching him, kicking him. Some start hitting him with their sign. He continues trying to make that arrest, but eventually, a good Samaritan in that crowd is eventually able to try to protect that police officer, eventually drags him out from what was a very bad and a very dangerous situation.
But what we've been seeing happening here in LA tonight so far is the marchers have been marching peacefully around the city streets in parts of the city. They've been trying to get on freeways. Police have blocked them in that area. They did that on Wednesday. They were able to successfully get on to the 101 Freeway, blocked traffic, where they swarmed some California Highway Patrol vehicles. But for the most part, up until about 30 minutes ago, things have been very calm, very peaceful other than that one incident over by Pershing Square where that LAPD officer was attacked.
This protest right behind us, very peaceful. Just some chanting, some yelling. But LAPD Police Chief Michel Moore, he put out a statement today essentially telling protesters, look, we hear your anger, we understand it, we understand why you're mad, we will protect your First Amendment right to free speech, however, we are getting concerned with some of the reports we're getting of our officers being attacked, of some buildings being vandalized.
They said they're going to draw the line tonight when it comes to public safety with the officers and with the public. They're going to start kicking up their enforcement making more arrests. That might be what we saw happen in Pershing Square. But Laura, as the sun starts to go down here, we're going to have to see how this night plays out.
INGRAHAM: OK. Thank you so much, Bill.
And my next guest is Lara Logan, host of the "Lara Logan Has No Agenda" on Fox Nation.
Lara, I've been online to track what the role of antifa has been in Minneapolis, Atlanta, and in New York, and unfolding now apparently in Los Angeles. What can you tell us about how they might be mucking things up and making these things very, very unstable?
LARA LOGAN, HOST, LARA LOGAN HAS NO AGENDA, FOX NATION: Well, what they're doing, Laura, is exploiting the existing conditions and exploiting the local residents, exploiting the very justified outpouring of grief and anger. They specialize in masking themselves behind genuine protesters, and exploiting these opportunities to agitate and destroy. These are professional antagonizers. They've been trained. They have manuals on how to do this with their tactics, their techniques, and their procedures.
And if you look at them in the crowd, you can start to pick them out because they're very different to the rest of the protestors. They typically wear black, all dressed in black - not always. They have different levels in the hierarchical structure. But you will see the ones, especially that are in this subculture of real professional antagonists and instigators. And they wear all in black. They often have equipment on their backs. They'll have gas masks that aren't the typical gasmasks. Theirs are the expensive ones. They will have DSLR cameras which cost thousands and thousands of dollars that the average protester doesn't have. They'll have communications equipment, like radios with miniature grade antennas. You'll see they have earpieces in their ears. There are repeaters on top of vehicles.
And these people come from the outside. And this is something, I've spoken today to counterterrorism people, law enforcement, intelligence people, and what all of them complain about is the fact that law enforcement has not been doing anything about the proliferation of these cells all across this country for years now. They have existed for a long time, but in the age of social media, the word that was used was "supercharged," right. They have become supercharged. And they are able to influence an extraordinary amount of people.
So you don't need a lot of them. You have them, and you have these professional agitators, they use and exploit the people around them. And what has happened in Minneapolis that's really interesting to people who study these groups is the confluence of Black Lives Matter and Antifa, because ironically, they make it all about the racial divide and this terrible racial injustice, but Antifa is mostly white. And they don't really care. They don't care about uniting the U.S. They don't care about getting rid of racism. Their slogans are about abolishing the police. They use sayings like the only good cops are dead cops. So they're not looking to reform the system or fix the system or anything like that.
You've got a black police chief in Minnesota, right. You've got many other black officials. They don't want to support those people. Those black people are not on their agenda. It's the people who can be exploited, because when Minneapolis is burned to the ground and any other city, like Ferguson, they move on. And who is left holding the baby? Who is left with the destruction? Who is poorer because their cities and their businesses have been burned down and destroyed? Yes, the citizens they say they care about, which they don't.
INGRAHAM: It's about creating anarchy and taking down the whole American system. They think America is a corrupt, awful, horrid, rotten place.
LOGAN: And regime change.
INGRAHAM: Oh, yes. It's all part of --
LOGAN: And what they're doing is they're provoking the police. Yes, provoking the police, provoking the National Guard. They want a replay of Kent State. And one thing I've seen is lots of people complaining about the police allowing the police station to be burned to the ground. What Antifa wanted was for the police to defend that building and to fight with them and capture those images of the evil policeman with his weapons attacking the innocent civilians. And they denied them that opportunity. That was very strategic and, in many ways, very smart. But what they have to do now is map those cellphone network, map the finances, follow the money, as always. Who is funding them?
INGRAHAM: Yes, Lara, Lara. Yes, Lara, we have to hold you there. I've got to go to breaking news in Minneapolis. Thank you so much for joining us.
LOGAN: OK.
INGRAHAM: Let's go to Pete Harrigan in Minneapolis -- Steve, sorry -- in Minneapolis telling us the latest. We have got more violence and more fires breaking out there. Go ahead, take it away.
STEVEN HARRIGAN, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Laura, we'll show you what it looks like here. We have got several cars on fire. We've seen one just go up and explode, the tires melted down on another, and a gas tank just blew up here, one of many fires burning right now in Minneapolis. And you can see they draw a large crowd of people who come to stand nearby.
And look, you can see some small explosions going on there. There's a lot exploding here overnight. We saw a lot of fireworks, but we also just heard some nine-millimeter shows fired up in the air as well. So a lot of these people you see on the streets in cars driving by to get a look at these. One thing you don't see, which I've got to tell you is pretty startling is we haven't seen any figure, any police figure, anybody, state police, anybody in the last two hours. So really people are on their own here.
INGRAHAM: Yes, well, Steve, you said nine-millimeter? shots ring out?
HARRIGAN: And this is just regular smoke.
INGRAHAM: Steve, hold on one second.
HARRIGAN: Yes, there's definitely small arms --
INGRAHAM: You heard nine-millimeter shots ring out?
HARRIGAN: Yes, there was definitely small arms fire, probably up into the air, often celebratory. But there has been a lot of fireworks as well. But it was clearly a small arms fire, we think up in the air.
And I guess, there's smoke from these cars burning, there's smoke from teargas, and the crowd is gathering, and there is no sign of any police. So if you have been in warzones or you've been in dangerous places, there is no soldiers. There is nobody here to keep things in order.
INGRAHAM: Yes, Steve, Steve, so our reporter on the scene in Minneapolis, just to reset for everyone, said that he hasn't seen a police officer in two hours. You see the scene there. While we understand we don't want to give Antifa the perfect shot, and I do get that, at some point you've got to save the city. At some point you've got to step in and save the city, Steve, otherwise these people are going to have nothing to go back to. And you have someone you want to talk to there.
HARRIGAN: A lot of people are out here watching, including Jabber (ph), who is 16. Jabber (ph), when you see these cars burning, as a 16-year-old, what do you think? Let me have a word.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think no justice no peace, no stopping till they're --
HARRIGAN: But instead of slogans, when you look at that, what do you think?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's sad, but it's what's got to be done.
HARRIGAN: It has to be done.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It has to be done.
HARRIGAN: Why does it have to be done?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Enough is enough.
HARRIGAN: Enough what?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Enough is enough. Police brutality, it's enough.
HARRIGAN: So we've got a 16-year-old watching cars burn here who lives a block away and says it has to be done.
INGRAHAM: I didn't like the sound of that. Steve, you have got to be real careful where you are right now.
HARRIGAN: Yes, we're going to back away from this car a little bit.
INGRAHAM: Yes. I would back up there.
So we heard earlier today from Minnesota authorities that this curfew was going to be in place, they wanted cooler heads to prevail, OK. They wanted people to protest, but take the temperature down.
HARRIGAN: Can you show me a cool head anywhere around here.
INGRAHAM: It hasn't worked. The curfew hasn't worked. Standing down orders didn't work. Bringing the National Guard in, I guess the National Guard is doing what? I guess they are protecting vital infrastructure I understand tonight. But the people of Minnesota and the people of Minneapolis, people of the United States and around the world are watching these scenes, going is this Kabul, or is this Minnesota?
We are happy to bring back Julio Rosas now. He's a writer for https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__Townhall.com&d=DwICAg&c=cnx1hdOQtepEQkpermZGwQ&r=tgDLkJy54PfJyWJwul3dKe54qGxqO7b7d5vjo7RcZds&m=bEzH_mPc1MNuRwRat6-pjxeNTK3h8sGQvdI8b8MkCRY&s=CKFg95bUZ8gXfe5a8ps7aY1Oz-lTlv8RHMR1h-wh6Qk&e= who has been covering these riots in Minneapolis. Julio, you just tweeted moments ago the riot police and National Guard have completely abandoned the perimeter they set up earlier. Rioters have chased them away. Given what you saw last night, where is this going to end up?
JULIO ROSAS, SENIOR WRITER, https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__TOWNHALL.COM&d=DwICAg&c=cnx1hdOQtepEQkpermZGwQ&r=tgDLkJy54PfJyWJwul3dKe54qGxqO7b7d5vjo7RcZds&m=bEzH_mPc1MNuRwRat6-pjxeNTK3h8sGQvdI8b8MkCRY&s=aksgPLnW1Y4QeyhQ0I-5O-GHqGdJxU9WxZgRkXeTyf0&e= : Not anywhere good, unfortunately. They had set up a perimeter around the area of the third precinct that had been torched last night, and that was there all day. Things got out of hand after the law enforcement told the crowd that had gathered that within 10 minutes they were going to be in violation of that curfew order. They weren't too happy with that, and so they started throwing all sorts of stuff, bottles, rocks, at the National Guardsmen and the riot police.
So of course, they were firing back with tear gas and, as I can attest to, other nonlethal rounds. But then they started pulling back, and they pulled back completely. Where we are right now, we're so many blocks away from where we originally started. And as you can see behind me, a lot of people are not obeying that curfew order.
INGRAHAM: Julio, we just showed the photo of where you got hit by the rubber bullets, that doesn't look too fun to say the least. But we just see that photo. But is that on your shoulder? Where is that?
ROSAS: No, that's -- it's right around here. The camera guy is telling me too show it off. It's right there.
INGRAHAM: Oh, my God. Well, that's not good.
ROSAS: So, yes, I am not too happy about it. Obviously, I was off to the side. I wasn't close to them, and I was doing what I'm doing right now, just reporting on it. I understand it's a very tense situation, but like I said, I wasn't near them. I was off to the side, and they still decided to shoot me. I'm just glad I didn't get hit in the face.
INGRAHAM: Julio, you are a former Marine.
ROSAS: A Marine reservist.
INGRAHAM: Marine reservist. That's a Marine, Marine reservist. But you can take it.
(LAUGHTER)
INGRAHAM: Julio, we are going to check back with you later in the hour.
But my next guest did with the Minneapolis police seemed incapable, they still seem like they're just incapable of doing. They are just giving up the streets. He's been protecting small businesses from rioters. Joining me now is Troy Bremer, a Minneapolis resident who, along with several others, put his own safety on the line to keep looters away from businesses near the police precinct that was burned down. Tory, you are seeing all of this unfold tonight. Tell our audience why you decided to take matters into your own hands.
TROY BREMER, DEFENDED FRIENDS LIQUOR STORE: Yes, we are a very close community here, Laura. Thanks for having me on. All this is happening probably about eight blocks from my home. And like I say, we are very close community, close-knit, and when we started seeing this progress east towards a lot of the businesses towards the east, because it kept progressing more and more, we decided to start kind of policing the whole area and just trying to help out as best we can. And we were keeping the looters and those things from continuing to come in and breaking into places. And it is literally like a warzone here, Laura. It's nothing like I've ever seen before in my life.
INGRAHAM: Well, what I'm seeing tonight, Tory, is more of the same of last night. We thought that order would be brought to the streets tonight, knowing that if you don't bring order to the streets, you're going to get spillover effect outside of these five blocks into other parts of the city and, as we've seen now, spilling over across the country. So what do you say about the leadership of your city tonight? I know it's a very difficult situation, but where's the leadership?
BREMER: I think it could be a heck of a lot better, Laura. I think we could have done a lot better job. I literally could not believe that we abandoned the third precinct police department. And, I just, I still can't believe it. Like I say, I'm eight blocks from this area, and the whole area by the third precinct literally looks like a warzone. It's like nothing I've ever seen before in my entire life.
INGRAHAM: This looks like Iraq or Afghanistan, the people who have seen images or been. And we just got this, Tory. Nassau County police chief source, they tried to overthrow the 88th precinct by the Barkley, numerous cops were hurt, so that's bridges so that is from one of our sources in New York. So when people who want to commit criminal mischief see a precinct as they saw in Minneapolis get overrun and destroyed, people feel like, hey, if they can do it, I can do it, and I can one-up them and I can do it better. Then you saw CNN's building attacked, and it goes on and on and on.
And I feel sorry for people who just started their businesses. They had COVID to deal with, now they have this to deal with. How do they get past this? It's just infuriating.
BREMER: My neighborhood will never be the same. It will probably take 10 years to rebuild. All the stores I shop at in my neighborhood, I try to buy locally just because I like to support those businesses, but I honestly believe a lot of them won't reopen, and it's going to change this whole neighborhood that I live in. Seventy-five percent of my shopping is locally, and it's going to completely devastate this neighborhood.
INGRAHAM: No, rioting never ends up working out well for the people in the neighborhoods it takes place in. Tory, thank you very much. We'll check back with you, and stay safe.
President Obama weighed in on the disaster unfolding in Minneapolis today, but instead of condemning any of the violence in the streets, he said this. For millions of Americans being treated differently on the account of race is tragically, painfully, maddeningly normal. This shouldn't be normal in 2020 America. It can't be normal. We can and must be better. It falls on all of us to work together to create a new normal in which the legacy of bigotry and unequal treatment no longer infects our institutions or our hearts."
Now, Obama's statement was clearly stalking horse for Joe Biden, who only offered up basically cliches.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Come together as one America. It's going to require those who sit in some position of influence to finally deal with the abuse of power. We must speak out. We must move on this. We must hold people accountable. It is absolutely essential.
There can be no excuses talking about our obligations to these people, our obligation to take responsibility, our obligation to stand up when we see injustice.
Our children are listening.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
INGRAHAM: Never has so little been said in so many words.
Joining me now is Mike Huckabee, former Arkansas governor, FOX News contributor. Also with me is Horace Cooper, co-founder of Project 21, and Tom Bevan, co-founder and president of Real Clear Politics.
Horace, shouldn't voters be speaking out or thinking about what has happened, not just tonight or this week or last week, but really, let's just look at the last decade. Last decade we had eight years of Barack Obama and Joe Biden, and by the end of it, as we showed that Gallup poll, I believe it was a Gallup poll in 2016, race relations were worse. But Biden comes along now, and says we just need to sit down and listen to people and hear them and validate them and so forth. Does that work in connecting with worried America tonight?
HORACE COOPER, CO-CHAIR, PROJECT 21: What former President Obama said, and the statement by Vice President Biden, it has demonstrated why after eight years with them having the pulpit, being able to stand up and explain to America what their objectives and their goals were, why we started off with such great hope and optimism on the basis of race in 2009, and then by the end of their term, America actually was more racially divided then we were before. It is these types of incidents. I'm not talking about what's happening in Minnesota. I'm talking about those who exploit these incidents for their political gain. The president, the former president often was willing to do that, and many of his supporters are.
Tom Bevan, we had Steve Harrigan on the ground, and he was talking for a moment or two to a 16-year-old in Minnesota and Minneapolis, and he said, it's police brutality, and we are fed up, we are done with it. And so the young people, they see these images, and they think this system is rigged against them and America is a racist country. And you have to turn that around. But that has been cemented in the minds of young people for many years.
TOM BEVAN, REAL CLEAR POLITICS CO-FOUNDER: Yes, and look, people look at that video of George Floyd, and nobody likes that. Nobody condones that in any way. But the problem is we should be able to address that, but also be able to condemn the rioting and the looting that is going on. You can do both things at the same time. And that's where President Obama said these things, but didn't condemn the rioters. And that's the only way that you can establish a sort of balance. Voters don't like to see that either, to see shots and stores burning, that, as you said, first of all, it's harms the community that it happens in, but it also hurts the protesters cause. It doesn't advance the cause that everybody wants to see.
So it's a tricky thing, and it's going to be interesting to see how the public views these two things the longer the riots go on. It could produce a backlash.
INGRAHAM: Governor Huckabee, I think Americans are just inherently good people, and they are optimistic people. They want to think the best of their fellow man. In our last minute, right now as we move forward, are people going to err on the side of we need fun order restored now, or do they want to keep this kind of cycle going until we reach some ongoing consent decree that will affect every police department in the country?
MIKE HUCKABEE, FORMER ARKANSAS GOVERNOR: Laura, you said it right, Americans are good people. Americans believe in justice, but they also believe in mercy. They felt mercy, they felt compassion, they felt horrible when they saw the systematic intentional murder of George Flynn (ph). That is repulsive to every single American.
INGRAHAM: Floyd.
HUCKABEE: That's the mercy of us. But the justice of us also says, you cannot let people go and destroy cities. Sadly, I was a teenager in 1968, and this is reminding me of 1968 when after the assassinations of Martin Luther King and Robert F. Kennedy and the Chicago riots during the Democratic Convention, Richard Nixon was able to lay a lot of fears across America and say there's got to be law in order, and Americans took that seriously. I think this could be another seminal year. We need that kind of understanding.
INGRAHAM: Yes, safety and justice. Justice for all and safety for all. Gentlemen, thank you so much tonight.
And has the media been fanning these flames? Raymond Arroyo joins us next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
INGRAHAM: We are now going to something a little different tonight, Raymond's review for a look at some of the atmospherics surrounding this Minneapolis situation and what it means. I'm joined by FOX News contributor Raymond Arroyo. Raymond, what have the media been doing to reframe or kind of change the coverage of what most regular Americans would see as criminal events, riots?
RAYMOND ARROYO, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Laura, if you watched any of the coverage today, even this evening, you would have sworn you were watching a march for literacy or the March for Life given some of this coverage. It's hard to depict what happened in Minneapolis as a peaceful protest, or what we're seeing tonight, while buildings and cars are being burned and in flames in the background. But some tried. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ALI VELSHI, MSNBC HOST: I want to be clear in how I characterize this. This is mostly a protest. It is not generally speaking unruly.
ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST: We are in a situation where people feel there is no other option but to take to the streets to have their voices heard.
DON LEMON, CNN HOST: These people are fighting for their liberty.
JEFF PEGUES, CBS NEWS CORRESPONDENT: We talked to a community activist, and he said to me, listen, we are tired. According to the people we've talked to, this is all of that pent up anger and frustration coming to a head.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARROYO: Laura, these are people that would have said the Titanic changed its cruise itinerary, OK. This spin here is unbelievable. Look, fear, frustration, a lot of us have felt frustration over these last few weeks. That is not a permission slip to go out and loot, burn, and destroy private enterprises as well as lives, to risk people's lives.
And I've been hearing this quote about rioting is how the unheard are heard, and they attribute that to Dr. King. Dr. King also said violence as a way of achieving racial justice is both impractical and immoral. He's right, and we're seeing it.
Now, the emerging political narrative we're hearing today is that the president was slow to respond, Laura, to the George Floyd case and the fallout. This is CNN's Brian Stelter.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA CORRESPONDENT: The president has been late on this situation all week long, late to react to the video of what happened in Minneapolis, late to react to the protests and the unrest. We are far past the point where the president should be weighing in for the first time on these matters.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARROYO: Laura, the president wasn't slow to respond. Local authorities were.
INGRAHAM: And look at what they're doing tonight -- nothing. Apparently they're just standing down again, and there will be more destruction, and a lot of these people, I think Lara Logan is right, a lot of them are Antifa, but not all of them. Some of them are local, some of them are out of state. But these are people doing real damage to this community. These are real people's lives, and we're entitled because we're mad about this horrific killing. I get everybody is mad about it. I understand. I understand that.
ARROYO: But Laura, the media has taken what was a private -- what was a local tragedy, rather, and turned it into national public trial. Now Joe Biden is jumping on the bandwagon. He tried to capitalize on it today. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't know all the facts. It warrants a full-blown investigation and a civil rights investigation as well. Were I president now, I would have the Justice Department civil rights investigation going on right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARROYO: The trouble is, Laura, the president had already authorized a Justice Department civil rights investigation and an FBI investigation. Biden is like the guy who finds a week-old paper and reads it as if it's breaking news. It already happened, Joe. It's amazing what's happening here.
INGRAHAM: When CNN and its building was under attack, and I'm watching it, Raymond, online, and some CNN people were tweeting about it, but it wasn't yet being covered, and I was thinking, I guess it's kind of hard to cover your own building, I guess it's hard to cover. But that was unbelievable what was happening, 1,000 people just smashing into the building.
ARROYO: Again, you don't achieve justice through unjust means. This is no way to make your message heard or focus on police brutality. And we're seeing -- these are wildings going on. We need restraint and we need leaders to come forward and take control of the situation from inside the community and outside.
INGRAHAM: We need religious leaders. President Trump is going to have to speak out as well, there's no doubt about it.
ARROYO: I agree.
INGRAHAM: But Joe Biden's interview with MSNBC took an odd turn when Craig Melvin asked this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: In light of what is happening in Minneapolis, if you don't choose a woman of color as your number two, what message would that send to the African American community?
BIDEN: I've already said I'm going to pick a Supreme Court justice who is a woman of color. I've already said my cabinet will be full of people of women of color, men and women of color. And I also already said that there are women of color under consideration. That is not the only criteria to determine who will be the vice president of the United States of America.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ARROYO: Laura, Joe Biden is captured, he is captured by that "you ain't black" comment. At this point he's going to have to give up the nomination and allow somebody to take his place because he's not good enough, pristine enough, perfect enough for the nomination. I don't know where this goes, but the pandering is not working for him.
INGRAHAM: No, no. Raymond, thanks, and we will check back with you on Monday.
That's all the time we have tonight. It's been a rough few months for Americans.
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