This is a rush transcript from "The Five," November 9, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Hello, everybody. I'm Jesse Watters along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Dana Perino and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

Liberals still expressing their rage that Hillary Clinton didn't win the election. Some of them screamed at the sky last night on the first anniversary of her loss.




WATTERS: That was actually at one of those spectacles. I forgot to bring earplugs. But we're going to have more on the show about that in a moment. But you know where Hillary is today? In Wisconsin. That to lament her crushing defeat in the state she never stepped foot in once during the campaign. Last night, the failed presidential candidate broke her silence on Donna Brazile's allegation she rigged the race against Bernie, and had too much influence on the DNC. She took a dig at her party's former chair.


HILLARY CLINTON, FORMER DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: I didn't know what she was referring to because as of now come out, that just wasn't the case. But the current DNC leadership really invested heavily in Virginia, and New Jersey, and other places. And I called the current chairman Tom Perez to congratulate him because he didn't get knocked off course. He didn't get overwhelmed by other narratives and stories coming out.


WATTERS: Brazile had words of her own for the Clinton team last night. Tucker asked her about what she wrote about campaign manager Robby Mook.


TUCKER CARLSON, FOX NEWS: You said, I'm quoting, I've work with men in my life from politics and I can sense when they get to this part of about not being able to deal with a woman. Without a racial thing it was a gender thing. Every time you mention that they're trying to shut you down because you're a woman, all these guys are like no, no, no, no, no. Then sexism too apparently from your book, which is totally weird since Hillary ran a whole campaign on breaking the glass ceiling. And here's the guy running her campaign, diminishing you because of your sex. It seems ironic maybe.

DONNA BRAZILE: No, it was dismissive. Condescending and dismissive, those are the words I characterize in the book.


WATTERS: Are you enjoying watching this, Kimberly Guilfoyle?

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Yeah. Actually, I find it politically fascinating. I do. And I love that she's out there telling the truth. A lot of people as we know are very intimidated by the Clinton machine and their political operation that has been threatening and intimidating for so many for so many years. To the point where they went ahead and said OK, we're going to put her forward when you had really great candidates as well, like Joe Biden and Bernie Sanders going forward because she felt it was her time and it was owed to her. OK. She had her chance. So now it's time to like move on and let the party grow and express. And the only way they can kind of do that is they actually our honest about what transpired, what happened. And Donna Brazile is trying to do her level best to put that forward probably, and probably against incredible odds in the aftermath of trying to tell the truth.

WATTERS: Are you on Team Donna or Team Hillary, Juan?

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: I don't see a need to divide them. I like them both. But I must say I do feel like.


WILLIAMS: Well, no. Because I think last night scream -- I feel like the 2016 election it never stops. It just goes on and on and on. And we're still arguing. You know, for the Republicans still demonizing Hillary as if she's -- I mean, I think Sean Hannity said the other day she was president. He didn't even realize she's not president.


WILLIAMS: Yeah. But I'm just saying is just goes on and on with this. And now, it's got to be -- I think Donna Brazile has a legitimate thing about being condescended, not being taken seriously by Hillary's team after she stepped in to save them in terms of the DNC.

GUILFOYLE: That's true.

WILLIAMS: And guess what, there's a contrary argument to what Donna said because Hillary Clinton, literally, financially bailed out the DNC, the same deal had been offered to Bernie Sanders. She took it, and in exchange, she started calling the tune about who they hired and what they had to say. And Donna said, well, so it seems like it tilted things. Now Donna has gone back on the rigging claim if you notice. So, you know, but to me it's like this feeds the, I think, the Republican narrative that, oh, there's such dissension among Democrats, when in fact the big split that we know especially today, tonight, is among Republicans after what happened on Monday -- Tuesday.

WATTERS: And we will definitely get to that later on the show, Juan. What do you think about the allegation of sexism and racism coming from Donna Brazile? You had Jen Palmeri at the top of the campaign. Huma Abedin. Does it strike you as kind of off?

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: No -- I trust women when they -- they know it when they see it or they hear it. Donna Brazile is not someone who throws around allegations like that. She did a lot. She was the first African-American woman -- or maybe even the first woman to run a presidential campaign when she was the campaign chairwoman for Al Gore. And, look, she -- this is amazing to me about Democrats. This is a person who has dedicated her entire life to Democratic activist politics. When she took over for Debbie Wasserman Schultz who was disgraced and had to step down, she took a leave of absence from ABC and CNN. She did not take a salary from the DNC. And allegations that she's just trying to make money and cashing in by selling a book, that really makes me mad because if we know anything about who was actually trying to cash in, it wasn't Donna Brazile.

WATTERS: No. She gave up a lot of money from this.

PERINO: And I admire her for getting out there. I do think it's not easy when you're like -- there's like shades of gray. It's like rigging or not rigging. Like probably should be a little bit more solid. But I feel like she looks liberated. And also, she has said that I worked hard to get Hillary Clinton elected. I'm excited about the Democrats going forward, but she wanted to tell her story. And when it comes to sexism, I imagine that if you're on the other end of the phone, you're in Washington, D.C., and you're getting a call from Brooklyn telling you that you know better in Brooklyn, what's going on in the country than Donna Brazile who spent her entire life on the front lines for the Democrats, it's probably pretty annoying.

WATTERS: Perhaps.

GUILFOYLE: And she's tough. I mean, she's strong, she's tough, she's been around, you know, and what she's saying.

PERINO: She's not a victim.

GUILFOYLE: Believe me, she's not.

WATTERS: No, she's not a victim. I've had my run-ins with Donna Brazile, and she's intense. She gets her message across.

PERINO: Did she call you honey?

WATTERS: No, I wish he did. I'd find that flattering.

WILLIAMS: Bless your heart, Jesse.

WATTERS: I think she did. I think that was meant as a put down. I want to get Greg's take on all of this, including this when she answered whether or not she gave a question to Hillary. Roll it.


BRAZILE: What I sought to do was to ensure that we had these issues on the table, and I made sure that our candidate -- I didn't want them blindsided. That's what I admitted to. That's what -- what WikiLeaks put out.


CARLSON: That's so good. You should do this for a living. That is hilarious.


WATTERS: She fed Hillary debate question and that was the excuse.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Yeah. That was a terrible answer. I know we all love Donna now because Donna is going after Hillary. But she's got to think about a better answer for that question because it is a definite flaw. I mean, she's accusing people of rigging an election. That's a rigging right there. The only way to settle this between Hillary and Donna is in the octagon. I think Hill versus Brazile, cage match, each armed with a book, only one leaves alive. You know the thing is -- Juan, you said that we're all demonizing Hillary. You can't demonize Satan.

WILLIAMS: Oh. And I think the fight is over before it began.

GUTFELD: The winner of all of this is Bill because at least Hillary is yelling at somebody else. So he can relax. He's tangling with Brazile. He's tangling with a Brazile.

WILLIAMS: it sounds like South Park. Didn't South Park put Jesus versus the devil in the octagon?

GUTFELD: Yeah. I was exaggerating. She learned her lesson. Next time, coincide your book tour with a political campaign because then there'll be a financial incentive to go to Wisconsin.

WILLIAMS: Could be. But I will say.

GUILFOYLE: Working harder at this at the campaign.

WILLIAMS: I will say this in response to what Dana said that I think that what Donna did in conjunction with -- there's a -- we'll talk about it later, the new Biden book, I think lots of people are taking on the Clinton -- what was the Clinton machine which dominated Democratic party since -- was it '92.

GUILFOYLE: That's what I'm saying.

GUTFELD: It's over.

WATTERS: Let's go to some screaming from some of Juan's friends. I've visited them last night in Washington Square Park.



WATTERS: Do you think screaming into the sky makes your side look good?

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Screaming into the sky makes our side look fun.





WATTERS: How do you feel?


WATTERS: Do you feel better? Do you want a pacifier?

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think so.



PERINO: Did they know you're from Fox?

WATTERS: No. I introduced myself. Some of them ran in the opposite direction.

GUTFELD: How many were there?

WATTERS: Only about 30, Gutfeld. There's more media than they were screamer.

GUTFELD: I'm going to say each screamer probably had their own reporter.

WATTERS: That's correct.

GUTFELD: I think that that's a bad sign for Republicans because the best argument for Trump are the hysterical anti-Trump reactions. And if that's going away and everybody starts getting back to normal, you don't have that villain anymore.

WATTERS: Oh, no, we're keeping it alive, Gutfeld.


WATTERS: Juan, would you like to defend Democrats on the scream fest?

WILLIAMS: I thought she was a wonderful.

GUTFELD: That was an amazing.

WILLIAMS: That was a great -- I ask you, was she a professional.

GUTFELD: She could do horror movies.

WILLIAMS: Yeah, that was pretty good.

WATTERS: Well, I found the whole thing embarrassing. And I'm embarrassed for myself.

WILLIAMS: Yeah. That's what I'm going to say because you had to show up and cover it.

GUILFOYLE: I don't think that was very cathartic for them. I think it was just too theatrical. And first of all, some of the screaming wasn't very good. It wasn't done properly.

PERINO: Did it look like they were having a little bit of fun though?


WATTERS: Yeah -- no, as Kimberly would say, cathartic experience and.

PERINO: It just wasn't very many of them. I sent you an article about Philly that six people showed up.

WATTERS: Yes, there were three people in Philadelphia. The resistance is strong, everybody. The resistance is strong. Coming up, can Republicans get tax reform passed? New developments today on their big push, next.


WILLIAMS: After a bleak election day Tuesday for Republicans, the GOP now moving full speed ahead on the tax reform. The idea, they don't want to face an even worse prospect big losses in the midterms come 2018. The senate unveiled its own version of the overhaul this afternoon with billions of tax cuts for corporations and some for Americans. The house measure was approved earlier by the ways and means committee after some last-minute changes. Now, can Republicans finally deliver on President Trump's agenda? Kimberly?

GUILFOYLE: I think it's going to be very difficult because now you see the party becoming even more fractured on this issue when they're not able to get consistent bandwidth and support across all areas and sort of factions of the party. And it's disappointing because we were all thinking this was going to be a big win for them. That this was a consensus building piece of legislation, a platform that they could put forth to ride into the next election to say, OK, we actually got something done. We're here about the nuts and bolts. We're with the party. It was going to be about limited government and putting more money in the pockets of the hardworking everyday men and women in this country that have been forgotten and left behind. And everyone was like, wait a second. What happen? And then you see their -- back away, taken a step back on the corporate stuff. So when you look at it, what kind of left of this carcass? And nobody's very happy with it. This is leftovers for no one, which is disappointing in my house.


WILLIAMS: Greg, I was going to mention to you. So President Trump called in from Asia to a group of Democrats and said.

GUTFELD: I know.

WILLIAMS: . oh, you're going to like the senate bill. Don't worry so much about the house. But I'm thinking, well, gee, if I'm a house Republican, I put myself on the line. What am I to think here?

GUTFELD: The only positive thing I can think is that this is a work in progress.


GUTFELD: But the reality scares me and this is why. The Democrats will never approve a bill that cuts spending or shrinks government. That will never happen. So they're never going to approve a bill that actually cuts taxes. Why is that scary? Well, Donald Trump is adamant about getting a deal done. Then that deal is going to make Democrats happy. And I don't like being in a position where, you know, I'm expected to help secure Donald Trump a victory if it goes against my principles. I mean, I'm a 2T guy.


GUTFELD: I'm a 2T guy, terror and taxes.

WATTERS: I thought you'll say Watters.


GUTFELD: You'll always thinking about yourself, but it's all I've got. It's all I got. These are the two big things for me, strong on terror, strong on taxes.


GUTFELD: I can't move on that. This is all I have left.

GUILFOYLE: C and C and dynamite.

WILLIAMS: C and C, that's it. All right. So now we're going to play a game, America. And in this game, Jesse Watters is going to be the house and Dana Perino will be the senate. So in the.


WILLIAMS: OK. You ready, guys? You're ready? You're ready? Here we go. In the house bill, all state and local tax deductions gone. What do you think, Dana?

PERINO: I think in the senate -- for as hard is that's going to be for many Republicans in high tax states, California, New England, New Jersey. In the senate, there are not many Republican senators in high tax states. So they don't care. And from a policy perspective, it matters more to them -- they don't think those deductions should be there at all. So I think that if you're worried about that, I think the senate is not going to do anything.

WILLIAMS: OK. Jesse, as the house and the senate version, the mortgage interest deduction is good. It stays in. So the housing industry should be pleased.

WATTERS: Yeah. Great for the housing industry. Great for me. It's great for people in places like New York and California, but if they're going to get rid of the state and local deductions, that doesn't really balance out.


WATTERS: Because your state and local are much higher than your mortgage tax deduction. Now -- and then they're phasing in the corporate tax cuts?

WILLIAMS: Yeah. That's what I'm.

WATTERS: That's not stimulating anything.

WILLIAMS: You know, I was going to ask you because I saw that the top bracket, if the senate keep seven tax brackets.

WATTERS: Yeah, another.

WILLIAMS: Right. Instead of the house -- the house has four.

WATTERS: So they're not actually simplifying the tax code.


WILLIAMS: He went ballistic the other day when you were talking about the upper bracket. I said they went from 39 just to 38 percent.

WATTERS: Oh, wow.

WILLIAMS: . in the senate bill.

WATTERS: Massive Reaganesque.


PERINO: But there's a good reason for this.


PERINO: And that is because what you're talking about -- not just that the Democrats don't want to cut spending. It's that the president doesn't really want to either. Where you can actually get spending reform would be on entitlements. Even the president on the campaign trail is very adamant. I'm not going to do it. Mick Mulvaney said I've tried to convince the president, it's necessary, and he said no. So that's why they're actually trying to fit it all in this box. And I don't think it's just about winning elections for the midterms or just supporting the president's goal. I think that on the merits, tax reform makes a lot of sense. There are some really good things in here.


PERINO: And actually, Larry Lindsey, who is an economic tax cut expert.

WATTERS: Oh, Larry.

PERINO: You know Larry.


PERINO: He says that the phase-in on the corporate tax rate really wouldn't have that big of an impact. And he said that because if corporations know that it's coming, they'll be able to work with it.


WATTERS: Wall Street didn't like it today, if you look at the Dow. And you have also -- I mean, like you said, tax cut is like pizza, even if it's bad, it's still good. People are keeping -- use of the bill is OK. Tax relief is still OK. But the thing is that there are some good things in there.

PERINO: Well, there are a lot of people who will end up paying more.

WATTERS: Yeah. Like you, and you, and you, and you.

GUILFOYLE: What about you?

WATTERS: Probably. I'm not as rich as you guys.


WILLIAMS: So in the senate bill, you can deduct medical expenses, which is a big concern for seniors. But still out of there are things like teachers and school supplies, you know, moving expenses -- a lot of the expenses, things that people previously deducted, gone. So it seems to offset any potential deduct -- you're shaking your head.

PERINO: I'm kind of -- because I feel like we've been saying forever that you get a once in a generation opportunity to reform taxes. And Republicans, conservative, for years, decades, have been saying you want a simpler, flatter, fair system. And it just feels to me like --maybe that's like, kind of in halfway, splitting a baby, maybe, but not really. And then they've got to do all these deal making. To me -- maybe it will stimulate the economy. But I wish that they would have -- just being able to do the right thing economically even though it would have been hard politically, and that is do the corporate tax rate cut and then figure out the individual stuff later because this is a mess.

GUTFELD: It's like taking half of a donkey and half of an elephant, and they go like this.


GUILFOYLE: We have to go back to like Herman Cain.


GUILFOYLE: And, boy, he can make some pizza too. So I'm for that.

GUTFELD: Where is he now?

WATTERS: Food court.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. Food court, oh, my gosh. Food court meets tax cuts, exactly.


GUILFOYLE: He's going to walk through that door any second. But also, there's so many people still talk about and kind of talk about the flat tax and they support the fair tax, but now this. I don't even know what happened. Like some kind of creature monster walked through the door, not what we're anticipating, and this was supposed to be their strong suit.

WILLIAMS: OK. So quick bet because we've got to go. Does it pass?

GUILFOYLE: I'm not feeling it tonight.



WATTERS: Yeah, I think it's going to pass. I don't like it.

PERINO: Something will pass.

WILLIAMS: Gregory?

GUTFELD: All things pass.


GUTFELD: I'm hoping right now it will pass.



WILLIAMS: You know this is not a happy group of Republicans. Ahead, some stunning accusations against the Republican senate nominee in Alabama. Breaking news, next.


GUILFOYLE: Now to a bombshell that could impact next month's special election for Jeff Sessions' old senate seat in Alabama. Some very serious new allegations against Republican nominee Roy Moore. Details from now from Peter Doocy who's live in Washington. Peter?

PETER DOOCY, FOX NEWS: Kimberly, a 53-year-old woman claims that when she was 14, and Roy Moore was just 32 -- he's 70 now, long before he became famous for getting kicked off the Alabama Supreme Court for leaving a 10 Commandment statue up. Moore kissed her, he touched her, he stripped down, he tried to get her to touch him in a sexual way, and she said she didn't want it. But tonight, Moore is not admitting to anything. He's calling this fake news. And part of an email statements from the campaign said this, Judge Roy Moore has endured the most outlandish attack on any candidate in the modern political arena. But this story is base Washington Post, alleging sexual impropriety takes the cake.

National liberal organizations know their chosen candidate, Doug Jones, is in a death spiral and this is their last ditch Hail Mary. The senate majority leader, Mitch McConnell, who Moore basically ran against in his primary, just said this, if these allegations are true, he must step aside. But not all Republicans have the patience to wait to see how this pans out. Senator John McCain says this about Moore, quote, he should immediately step aside and allow the people of Alabama to elect a candidate they can be proud of. But even if Moore does step aside, his name is still going to be on the ballot in December because we're within 76 days, and the law says the ballot can't be reprinted this late. Alabama also has something called a sore loser law, which means that since Luther Strange already lost this year, he can't run on the ballot as an independent. But he could stage a write-in campaign. Tonight, Strange hasn't said anything about a writing campaign. All he said is that the details he knows are very disturbing. Kimberly?

GUILFOYLE: All right. Peter, thank you for that report. So Dana, it's quite a development in a race that was heated to begin with. There's a little bit fractured in terms of Republican support with the president supporting Strange. And a bunch of other Republican, populist, Bannon, whatnot, supporting Roy Moore. This is a guy who's not gone out, you know, without a fight before when they wanted to remove him, he wouldn't resign. And now we have this situation, obviously, a very disturbing allegation. And if true, then there's no place for him on the ticket.

PERINO: So the Washington Post has four on the record sources. And to call it fake news, I mean, that would be extraordinary that you had four different people all lying about somebody. These are actually Republicans, the ones that were quoted. At least the one main one is. Obviously, it's disturbing. But I have to say this, the state auditor of Alabama, the way he tried to spin this is to say take Joseph and Mary. Mary was a teenager. Joseph was an adult carpenter. They became parents of Jesus, right? As Greg pointed out, actually, Jesus was Immaculate Conception.

GUTFELD: I remember that part.

PERINO: That doesn't make sense.


PERINO: And I think that if you are worried about speaking up about this because you might get political ammunition to your opposing side, that that is weak and wrong.

GUILFOYLE: OK. Greg Gutfeld, what do you make of the situation? And give us a prediction.

GUTFELD: Well, I mean, I will go on record and say that I'm against adult men hitting on 14-year-old girls. OK?

WILLIAMS: Good man.

GUTFELD: Thank you. Thank you for that. But it seems like it's raining bad men. You know, to paraphrase that classic song.

GUILFOYLE: Raining Weinsteins?

GUTFELD: Yes. It seems like another hour there's another tawdry tale. And what's happening now may be a form of justice, but there seems to be missing a process. Like, what do you -- what's next now? Does -- does the guy just step down and go away? Or is there some kind of investigation?

GUILFOYLE: Due process, yes.

GUTFELD: We seem to be -- there needs to be some kind of due process.

But it also does seem to tell you that, you know, ideology often blinds you to the potential flaws in the background of somebody. You know, Luther Strange seemed like a really good guy to me, but he wasn't as ideological pure as Moore, correct?


PERINO: No, I -- it depends on what are you looking for.

GUTFELD: I mean Trump. In terms of...

PERINO: From a conservative ideology, Luther Strange was much more pure.

GUTFELD: Yes, but I'm talking in the...

PERINO: In the new version of populism.

GUTFELD: In the new ideology. Yes. In the new -- we've replaced one ideology with another.

PERINO: Right.

GUTFELD; Is what I'm saying.

WILLIAMS: You mean that the -- he was more about Steve Bannon guy.

GUTFELD: Yes, right. And so that made you blind.

WILLIAMS: Luther Strange was much more a Mitch McConnell guy.

GUTFELD: Exactly.

WILLIAMS: And now -- and Bannon, in fact, just said yesterday, "Get McConnell out of here" and all that. But this is Steve Bannon's guy.

GUTFELD: Yes, that's -- my point is when you choose an ideology, which is like this is how it's going to be, you often -- you don't really do as much research as you should, because you're blinded by your own biases.

GUILFOYLE: OK, so also, Jesse, you have McConnell speaking out, saying if these allegations are true, he must step aside. So you've already got division, you know, in the party. How do you see this playing out and how quickly?

WATTERS: I don't see how this plays out.

GUILFOYLE: Luther could be a write-in.

WATTERS: It feels kind of gross talking about the political implications of this, because if these allegations are true, I feel horrible for these women. It's disgusting.

Even just the allegation itself, it's not just one person. It's multiple people. So the whole cloud, the whole stench around this guy, I don't see how he can represent Alabama in the U.S. Senate.

GUILFOYLE: He won't even be available (ph) for it.

WATTERS: Politics is a dirty business. And you know, innocent until proven guilty, but this doesn't seem like that to me. I'm just not getting that feeling.

So I think he should step down, do the decent thing. But I mean, to your point about the politics of this, I shouldn't even say it, but I mean, the Democrats obviously are going to capitalize on it.

WILLIAMS: Well, FOX had it -- and this is a little bit back -- but I think FOX had the race about even. Some people have...

PERINO: Yes, just last week.

WILLIAMS: OK. So some people had, though, Moore up a little bit. But the problem here is that Roy Moore's base is the evangelical community. And I know, you know, for people like me, I think, how do the evangelicals support Donald Trump? But how are they going to deal with this? Because this is rank hypocrisy.

PERINO: These allegations, I don't think that's even within the realm.

WILLIAMS: No, no. Grabbing women and stuff.

PERINO: That's what I was saying.

WILLIAMS: But this is much more. This is -- is that what your point is, that this is...

PERINO: It's not the same. I'm talking about...

WILLIAMS: Correct. I agree with you. But I'm saying for evangelicals, this is a real test. And Alabama, in the Bible Belt, this is going to be a difficult issue.


PERINO: I just don't -- I don't know where it goes. You know, I'm assuming that The Washington Post will have a follow-up story, and if Roy Moore has evidence that this is, indeed, fake news, that he should come forward with it, all of it.

GUTFELD: Yes, usually with these stories, another story encourages other people to talk.

PERINO: Which is why it's raining bad men.

GUILFOYLE: Hate when that happens.

Coming up, Greg exposes the truth about some race-related hoaxes coming up next. Stay with us.


GUTFELD: Now on to some lighter news: A few months back, we ran a clip of a superintendent at the Air Force Academy chastising racist cadets. His speech came after slurs were found on a dorm room message board belonging to black students.


LT. GEN. JAY SILVERIA, AIR FORCE ACADEMY SUPERINTENDENT: If you demean someone in any way, then you need to get out. And if you can't treat someone from another race or a different color skin with dignity and respect, then you need to get out. The power of that diversity comes together and makes us that much more powerful.


GUTFELD: Well, like many in the media, we ran this clip because it provided a powerful response to racism that the media demanded after Charlottesville. While the clip ran, I kept shaking my head for I'd seen this story before. The list of hate crimes hoaxes is long. Now we must add this one to the tally. According to The Air Force Times, a black cadet admitted to writing the slurs and he's since left the school.

So what's the response when we see stories like these exposed as hoaxes? It's never as huge as the initial response was when we assumed that it was real -- which only encourages more hoaxes, for the outrage over the crime is the only part the press seems to remember, not its debunking, which encourages the copycats. Which is why we're doing this now: So people don't keep thinking this kind of thing pays off.

Of course, social justice warriors will repeat the pathetic excuse that, while this racist act may not be true here, you just know it's true somewhere else. Which guarantees further opportunity for attention and likely another student's expulsion.

I know it's crazy, but maybe it's time we stop feeding the stories to the public before they're properly investigated. Who am I kidding?

All right, Juan, I think you owe me a steak dinner, because I remember after we did this, I said to you, "This isn't real."

WILLIAMS: You did say that.

WATTERS: You guys are making dinner bets on hate crimes?


WILLIAMS: That's because we're so compassionate.

GUTFELD: Yes, I think -- well, I first -- my head was...

PERINO: You shake your head, but you have this thing where you're just like...

GUTFELD: I'm going, "This is not true. This is not true." And then afterwards, I go, "Juan, steak dinner. I'm betting."

WILLIAMS: By the way, it's not good for you.

GUTFELD: It's not good for you, yes. I was going nuts.

WILLIAMS: I think we'll give you fish.

GUTFELD: I don't eat fish. You know that.

So what do you -- when you see this, this obviously puts race relations back. Because it makes everybody suspicious of accusations now, right?

WILLIAMS: Sure. But you know, I think the reason that you're doing this is that you think that this means that all allegations are somehow fraught. I don't think that.

GUTFELD: You're using that social justice...

WILLIAMS: I'm asking.

GUTFELD: No, I'm saying I told you so, Juan. That's why I'm doing it.

WILLIAMS: In this case, you tell me so, and there are other cases, because as you were speaking, as you were building the monologue, I think the viewers can see...

GUTFELD: There's a lot.

WILLIAMS: ... there's a list of people. But my -- my feeling about this is, look, if you ever look at my -- or at the Twitter account for this show while I'm on, you will know that there are some pretty harsh feelings...

PERINO: Don't look at it, Juan.

GUTFELD: Most of those, though, are from Kilmeade. So -- Kilmeade's got a lot of dummy accounts.

WATTERS: Yes, now that Twitter's 280, it's really bad.

PERINO: He spends a lot of time on it.

GUTFELD: He's a terrible person. He gets up so early, and then he just goes on after Juan.

Kimberly, is there some kind of punishment that -- is, like the punishment so -- a lot of times when people do these fake hoaxes, if they say they're under psychological stress, they need therapy. Should there be stiffer penalties for this stuff?

GUILFOYLE: I mean, you would think so, right? Because when you see kind of the cumulative effect and the collateral damage that results from things like this, it's really bad.

Remember, "Hands up. Don't shoot"? It really stimulates in a very negative way, you know, racial divide and injustice and crimes that are committed against individuals, personal and property damage. Really hurting communities.

And it's so far along after, sometimes when you find out that this wasn't true, that if you didn't sort of search for it to follow up on it, you wouldn't know. And that's why I think you did a great job...

GUTFELD: Thank you.

GUILFOYLE: ... on this one thing.

GUTFELD: Thank you.

GUILFOYLE: That you actually bring it up and you follow up and you track it down and say, "Remember this? When I was like, 'Hey, this wasn't true.'"

GUTFELD: Yes. I knew it was going to happen. Another hate crime that was exposed as a hoax, it was, Dana, a Kansas State student wrote slurs on his car. And it turned out it was the victim, a black male, who had written it. And so, when you hear the initial...

PERINO: Did he have to leave the school?

GUTFELD: I don't know. I didn't read that far.

WILLIAMS: He wasn't in the school.

PERINO: When it comes to this person from the Air Force Academy...

GUTFELD: Yes, he's gone.

PERINO: ... the punishment is that he just missed out on a wonderful educational opportunity.

GUTFELD: Right, yes.

PERINO: And so...

GUTFELD: Does he deserve a second chance?


GUTFELD: You don't think so?

PERINO: I'm not -- but I also think that this should not take away from what I think was a pretty amazing display of leadership on behalf of Jay Silveria, the lieutenant general who addresses the students immediately, takes immediate action with a pretty powerful speech.

GUTFELD: I don't know.

PERINO: Why? Are you going to take away from that?



GUTFELD: I don't know. I just am. Because I knew it was fake. And you know what, I can't...

PERINO: But he didn't know it was fake, and he felt like he had to do something immediately.

GUTFELD: Or was he trying to make -- cover his...

PERINO: Are you questioning the lieutenant general?

GUTFELD: I question everything. I question you right now, Dana. I don't even know who you are anymore.

Jesse, thoughts?

WATTERS: Thoughts, yes. Well, I think Kimberly's favorite poet, Shakespeare, said a lie travels halfway around the world before truth puts its shoes on.

GUTFELD: I don't think Shakespeare said that.

WATTERS: Is that a hoax?

GUTFELD: I think it was Jim Fix (ph). I don't know.

WATTERS: Either way, this happens. And this guy researching this says there's hundreds of these per year. We just had one in New York where a Muslim woman said, "Two white guys on the subway attacked me and tried to rip off my hijab."

PERINO: She had a...

WATTERS: Ended up filing a fake police report.

Now, the motivation for this is because people are struggling with personal problems, and they want to feel, as the victim...

GUTFELD: Important.

WATTERS: And they want the attention that the victim and victimhood gets. And the victimology industry is an incubator for these fake hate crimes, and they're mostly on college campuses, where you have these safe spaces, the micro aggressions, and everybody hates the straight white male.

So when these people get to college, their antennas go up, and they're always looking for sexism and homophobia and racism. And then, when nothing happens, they are forced to make them up.

GUTFELD: Instead of being a victim, be a victor. There's a T-shirt for you.

WATTERS: That was Shakespeare, too.

GUTFELD: That was Shakespeare, too. Maybe it was. I don't know. Maybe it was Shakespeare. I don't think it was.

PERINO: We'll find out in the commercial break.

GUTFELD: All right. A new twist in the violent attack on Kentucky Senator Rand Paul, next.


PERINO: Early reports were Senator Rand Paul was assaulted by neighbor Rene Boucher because of a landscaping disagreement. That resulted in six broken ribs and fluid around the lungs for Senator Paul.

But now the senator suggests the landscaping dispute claim is erroneous, and a statement from his senior advisors, Doug Stafford, says, quote, "This was not a fight. It was a blindside, violent attack by a disturbed person. Anyone claiming otherwise is uninformed or seeking media attention."

Senator Paul's neighbor has pleaded not guilty, but sources say Senator Paul has been told to expect federal charges against his attacker.

What's the federal charges? Is it because he's a senator?

GUILFOYLE: Yes, and so here's the thing. So when you have an investigation like this being conducted by the FBI, you're not supposed to talk about it. He shouldn't be making any statement, because this is a very serious matter. He was injured in a horrific way. He was attacked by a psycho coward who blindsided him and severely injured him.

So it's a bad situation. And when people say, "Oh, he's not issuing a statement." I mean, to suggest, like -- can you imagine if this was a liberal Democrat and somebody came and attacked him at his house and broke his ribs and fluid in the lungs and the whole deal? No. It would be a completely different way that this would be handled.

And for them to try to say it was about bushes or foliage or whatever, it's just absolutely ridiculous. I see this in the same way that I saw the attacks on the baseball game where, you know, Scalise was injured. This appears to be that somebody who's well-documented -- well-documented -- on his Facebook page as somebody who is very much against President Trump, wants impeachment, is very liberal in his ideology and committed a crime specifically, I believe, against Rand Paul because of those ideals.

PERINO: It did seem a bit bizarre that the statements coming out initially were about rules and regulations in the neighborhood about what you can plant and what you can't plant. Like pumpkins are not allowed or something like that.

GUTFELD: Yes, I don't -- I can't -- I don't know what to make of this. I mean, it's interesting how, you know, the closer you are to somebody, the more likely you don't like them. It's like -- it's like, why do anchors hate each other on shows when they only see each other an hour a day? You know what I mean? It's like these neighbors -- they always say good fences make good neighbors. Maybe they didn't have good fences. But there might be...

GUILFOYLE: You can't excuse this guy's behavior. It's completely...

GUTFELD: I'm not saying that. I'm just saying there's something else going on here that we don't know about.

And what would make me so angry to attack somebody and just -- we assume -- we keep saying he's unstable. We don't know if he's unstable. But what would make me angry to attack -- to go and attack a neighbor, that's what you should be asking yourself. We'll be right back.

PERINO: Jesse, what do you think? Will we ever really no?

WATTERS: Typical liberal, always blaming the bushes.

GUTFELD: Aaa! Well done! Well done.

WATTERS: I knew Gutfeld would have liked that one.

Just like Gutfeld, I sniffed this out. When I heard the guy's name was Rene Boucher, I was like guilty as charged.

GUTFELD: Oh, really?

WATTERS: Also, here's the deal. CNN put this thing out from the beginning. They did a report immediately afterwards that talked to a few anonymous neighbors that blamed the landscaping. No one was on the record blaming landscaping.

And then the Washington Examiner came out with seven on-the-record neighbors saying this guy had nothing to do with the bushes. It was all political. And then the real story got out. And they also bought, the media, the defense attorney's lying about this just being about landscaping. When have the media ever bought a line from a defense attorney so some guy that just assaulted someone?

And Kimberly's point is good. If Crying Chuck got clotheslined from behind on the New York City subway, that would be a national story.

GUTFELD: Why don't do it?

PERINO: These things can be mysterious. I'm not saying this was sane (ph). But remember when Senator Reid got all -- and that never actually -- no one ever actually understood. He said he was doing exercises.

GUTFELD: He got hit.

WATTERS: Fell off of a machine.

PERINO: No, a rubber band thing in the bathroom.

WATTERS: You bought that?

PERINO: Well, not necessarily. But Juan, I mean, is there -- do you think that we will get resolution on this?

WILLIAMS: Well, I think you've got to. Because it's going to go to some kind of a trial. And I think it's going to go. Right now it's a misdemeanor charge. It sounds like it's going to get ramped up, because it's going to be an attack on a federal official.

GUILFOYLE: It's going to go federal.

WILLIAMS: I must say I don't see why anybody who is anti-Trump would be attacking Rand Paul.

GUTFELD: Yes, that's what I don't get.

WILLIAMS: It doesn't make sense to me.

PERINO: All right. "One More Thing" up next.

GUILFOYLE: You know they talk on the phone every...


GUILFOYLE: You're so mean. You're the meanest person.

WATTERS: Time now for "One More Thing" -- Gutfeld.

GUTFELD: All right. Let's go to this thing, real quick.


GUTFELD: Greg's Etiquette News.


GUTFELD: All right, this thing, it's been a kind of a gloomy news day. If this doesn't make you smile, nothing will. Check out this otter eating at a dinner table.




GUTFELD: I don't think there's anything better on the planet then watching this otter, a domestic Asian short-clawed otter, eating with his hands at the dinner table like a normal child.


GUTFELD: What good manners! He has better manners than I do. Look at him with his hands. This is amazing. This is -- this animal has a soul.

GUILFOYLE: This is the most uplifting part of the show.

GUTFELD: Yes, now you know why I'm happy.

WATTERS: OK, Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: Mine is even better. Thank you so much.

So take a look at this adorable video. This shows President Trump showing the Chinese president video of his granddaughter singing in Mandarin. And this is Arabella, so take a look.




GUTFELD: Can't say that.

GUILFOYLE: All right. And President Xi said that she did a terrific job and deserved an A-plus. She is 6 years old, and she is the daughter of Ivanka and Jared. She's been learning Mandarin from her Chinese nanny. Isn't that great?

PERINO: Cute little hair bun. Adorable.


WATTERS: And effective diplomacy.

GUILFOYLE: I mean, the best.

PERINO: My turn?


PERINO: All right. So Veterans Day is coming up on Sunday. And so veterans, pay attention, because this is a pretty good deal. There's a company called, "We Work." And they have high-tech, fully operational workplaces, and they are starting something called Veterans and Residents.

So through the program, every six months for the next five years, they're going to sponsor work space for 100 veterans across ten cities. Lots of great cities on this. They have on-site counseling. They can help you get your business started. And they have also committed to hiring 1,500 veterans themselves over the next five years to support all of their business -- it's a growing company. And you can go to WeWork.com, Veterans and Residents, to learn more. I think it's a really good deal, and I would take advantage of it, vets.

GUILFOYLE: We love the vets.

GUTFELD: All right. Juan.

WILLIAMS: So for the first four days, Obamacare enrollment through the roof. Americans registering on Tuesday. Health care proved to be one of the most important issues, as you know, in Virginia. Maine voters also strongly support expanding Medicaid under Obamacare.

And now look at this. Here's Jimmy Kimmel promoting I don't know what, but he's promoting something, very -- called Trumpcare.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just found out about Trumpcare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just found out about Trumpcare, too.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My family got coverage we can afford, thanks to Trumpcare.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Trumpcare is the market-based insurance program administered by President Trump that meets his campaign promise for great affordable care.


WILLIAMS: Well, that's the message for politicians. Americans want good health care.

WATTERS: All right. Steve Scalise still recovering from being shot. He was racing his scooter through the halls of Congress with his fellow congressman, Representative Johnson from Texas, who actually was wearing a helmet. I'm not really sure why. But we don't know who won yet. They were taking bets on the side, we have learned. But good luck, and I'm glad Steve is back.

All right. "Special Report" up next.

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