How does victimhood culture impact the African-American community?

This is a rush transcript from "The Ingraham Angle," February 21, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

LAURA INGRAHAM, HOST: -- and the border patrol. Thank you so much. I'm Laura Ingraham, this is “The Ingraham Angle” from Washington, tonight. Another jam packed news, day and night for us, we'll be on every angle we have every element of this Jussie Smollett saga covered for you.

Chicago PD lighting into him earlier this morning. Former Police Superintendent Garry McCarthy and current President of the Chicago Police Union Kevin Graham are both here to react, you don't want to miss that.

Plus could any lawyer on earth develop a successful defense for Smollett. Alan Dershowitz is here with the sauce on that. Plus who are the media and the political arsonists who fanned the smaller flames. We're going to name names. Oh yes, later in the show but first, the false allure of victimology, that's the focus of tonight's Angle.

After seeing your really strong reactions to last night's show about how universities are breeding grounds for victim hood and manufactured anger, we thought it was important to expand on this theme tonight. And given today's developments on a number of stories, this conversation we're going to have on “The Ingraham Angle” tonight is more important than ever.

The Superintendent of the Chicago police was visibly, understandably outraged by what his department and the community has endured because of Jussie Smollett's fabricated hate crime.


EDDIE T. JOHNSON, CHICAGO POLICE DEPARTMENT SUPERINTENDENT: When we discovered the actual motive, quite frankly it pissed everybody off. You know, because we have to invest valuable resources, a lot of the - what I want you all to really understand is when you all put things out there into the universe that's not actual facts then it causes us to have to chase all that stuff.

Those are resources and time spent that we'll never get it back.


INGRAHAM: Oh well, that's all well and good I guess but poor Jussie. Making a boatload of money per year, it looks like he was driven to this by his warped view of celebrity income inequality.


JOHNSON: This announcement today recognizes that ‘Empire' actor Jussie Smollett took advantage of the pain and anger of racism to promote his career. And why? This stunt was orchestrated by Smollett because he was dissatisfied with his salary.


INGRAHAM: Now what drove Smollett, a Supporting Actor on the Fox show ‘Empire' to think that this stunt, this victim narrative that he'd been assaulted by MAGA hat wearing thugs would get him a pay raise. Well, probably because he had seen others profit from the same routine and never get penalized.

There has been a long line of celebrity victims in recent years. People known only for their self-proclaimed victimhood. There was Colin Kaepernick who after staging is kneeling protests and disrupting the entire sport of football claimed he was being victimized by NFL owners who are keeping him from playing just because of his activism.


COLIN KAEPERNICK, AMERICAN FOOTBALL PLAYER: I believe in something even if it means sacrificing everything. So don't ask if your dreams are crazy. Ask if they're crazy enough.


INGRAHAM: Well, of course he got a multimillion dollar Nike contract and a hefty NFL settlement out of the whole deal so you see. Victimhood pays. And then of course there was Christine Blasey Ford like Smollett, Ford turned on the drama for the cameras.

And even when her charges didn't hold water, no substantiation, she was still invited by Sports Illustrated to be an awards presenter before the glitterati.


CHRISTINE BLASEY FORD, BRETT KAVANAUGH ACCUSER: I am honored to speak with you from afar about a woman I admire so much. Rachel Denhollander, I am in awe of you and I will always be inspired by you.


INGRAHAM: Now it's obvious for anyone capable of objective thought, if you're a liberal and you have an outrageous claim that implicates conservatives like President Trump, what they all stand for, well you'll probably get national attention. You'll get high profile interviews.

You'll be on magazine covers and of course, you get a lot of money. Blasey Ford made out like Batman, raking in over $800,000 via a GoFundMe account, was all for her security. And for a politically active Trump hating minor celebrity like Jussie Smollett, the lesson was learned.

Victimhood pays and often handsomely. Crying racism would be his ticket to fame and fortune, heck it, he's playing second fiddle to Taraji Henson on a show whose ratings were already on the downslope.


TARAJI HENSON, ACTOR: Who do you think you're talking to?


INGRAHAM: So he decided to write his own new role where the character would be someone important, a moral crusader on a mission to warn the whole country about the dangers of Trump. Now the absurd details of this phony attack confirmed all of the worst, most toxic of left wing caricatures of Trump followers. That they're this new breed of Klansmen, waiting around the corner of every major city to assault and lynch black and gay liberal.

So suddenly it was like 1955 in Birmingham all over again kind of like a really bad, Spike Lee film or something. And then when the fantasy came crashing down and police began to discover the lies, the real truth. Well, the pair of brothers buying supplies, those Nigerian brothers on the coordinated phone calls.

The evidence was overwhelming that Smollett had committed a poisonous fraud on America. So naturally Smollett media cooperators blamed conservatives.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're going to see conservative media probably play this up a bit.

DON LEMON, CNN NEWS ANCHOR: Sean Hannity is going to eat Jussie Smollett's lunch every single second. Tucker Carlson is going to eat Jussie Smollett's lunch every single second. The President of the United States is going to eat his lunch.


INGRAHAM: Unreal. So it's like heads they win, tails we lose. Trump supporters are guilty no matter what, no matter how egregious the underlying fraud, doesn't matter. And it should not surprise any of us that today's Democrats cling to this victimhood narrative with a political death grip.

After all, what do they have to do without it and with their lame track record, how can they possibly convince African-Americans that they're going to do better, be better off and they're going to have their wages lifted up better or they're going to have their neighborhoods safer or cartels are going to be kept out of their neighborhoods.

Gang members, MS-13 are going to be out of their communities, the Democrats are somehow going to be better than Trump at creating jobs. The answer is they can't argue any of that because they have no substantive arguments. But they can and they do sell victimhood.

And for that, they have a lot of buyers. This is how Kanye West put it about a year ago in a pair of tweets. He said, there was a time when slavery was the trend and apparently that time it's still upon us. But now it's a mentality. Then he wrote, self-victimization is a disease.

Well you bet it is because when any of us cling to victim hood, we give away our power, our power to solve problems and to better ourselves the old fashioned way. It's through something called hard work. And it's important to understand the left strategy here.

They'll use fabricated tales of victimization to divert attention from other inconvenient truths. Now remember, it was Smollett who crashed in and took the focus off of Virginia governor Ralph Blackface Northam.

Of course and his lieutenant Governor Justin Fairfax who's accused by at least two women of sexual abuse. Boy, that Virginia story faded fast, didn't it? And now that Smollett anti-Trump drama has blown out, the media has jumped on a story of that whack job Coast Guard Lieutenant who wanted to murder Democrat politicians.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is now the second time that we know about from the pipe bombs to yesterday, it's exactly what Donald Trump is encouraging.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Words are cheap to him but they have cost elsewhere. You look at this man and he's hearing that the media is the enemy of the people.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We all know the recent history of violence propelled in some parts by the President's rhetoric.


INGRAHAM: Again, this is so predictable, it's almost boring. But notice that when conservatives are truly victimized, physically attacked, when conservatives are actually targeted and shot for their political beliefs like Congressman Steve Scalise, the media, they have no time for that.

It's as if it never happened. In fact Nancy Pelosi admonished Republicans against laying blame on Democrats for that attack.


REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF., SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: I don't even go into the President of the United States but in terms of some of the language that he has used. When you have all the assaults that are made on Hillary Clinton, for them to be so sanctimonious is something.

It didn't used to be this way. Somewhere in the nineties, the public has decided on a politics of personal destruction if they went after the Clintons and that is the provenant of it and that's what has continued.


INGRAHAM: Well and despite the shooters devotion for Bernie Sanders, conservatives didn't rush in to connect the Vermont Senator to the shooting nor did they try to link Smollett criminal actions to his political heroes. Barack Obama and Maxine Waters because to link that would be unfair and it would be just plain stupid.

But many anti-Trump partisans in the media felt obligated to connect Donald Trump and his supporters to a story that was ludicrous from the get go.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What he said happened to him sort of fit in with a narrative, not a narrative but a reality for a lot of people in this country since President Trump was inaugurated.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And you think about what just happened to Jussie Smollett in Chicago. Unfortunately, we have racism germinating from the White House.

ELLEN PAGE, ACTOR: if you are in a position of power and you hate people and you want to cause suffering to them, what do you think is going to happen and people are going to be beaten on the street.


INGRAHAM: Well, the modern Democratic movement has abandoned the optimism and the idealism of John F. Kennedy, people like Patrick J. Moynihan. And now it's activist core pedal's non-stop anger and resentment. So in a decade, just a short decade, they've gone from hope and change to hate and rage.

And when 2020 comes around, I somehow doubt the message of you're a victim, will be let's be victorious and that's THE ANGLE. Joining me now with reaction is Garry McCarthy, former Chicago Police Superintendent and current candidate for Chicago Mayor and also with me, Kevin Graham, Chicago Fraternal Order of Police President.

Kevin, watching all of this play out over the last few days, I've been dying to talk to you. I know my viewers are dying to hear your perspective. How does it all make you feel?

KEVIN GRAHAM, CHICAGO FRATERNAL ORDER OF POLICE: You know, it's unfortunate that we expended a large amount of resources in the Chicago police department to try and uncover a hoax that was played on both the people of the city of Chicago and on the Police department for Mr. Smollett's personal gain.

That's certainly unfortunate and what it says is that in this society, we can go out and make outrageous claims and have everybody sort of swoon over this and you know, he owes the city of Chicago an apology, he owes the Police department an apology.

And he's going to face his day in court and it's not going to be well for him.

INGRAHAM: Garry, this is what the current Chicago P.D. superintendents said about the victims of actual crime. Let's watch.


JOHNSON: I just wish that the families of gun violence in this city got this much attention because that's who really deserves the amount of attention that we giving to this particular incident.


INGRAHAM: Garry, we had a one year old child shot just the day before yesterday, still unacceptably high unsolved murder rate attrition in the police force. Your thoughts on what the superintendent just said there.

GARRY MCCARTHY, FORMER CHICAGO POLICE SUPERINTENDENT: Well, first of all, I think that we really need to put this issue in perspective, this was a reckless act that thankfully nobody got hurt from.

You have to understand the history of Chicago and the red lining and the disinvestment in African-American neighborhoods that's going on here for decades and the anger that exists here and the polarization, the racial polarization that we have here.

You put that together with the Laquan McDonald incident coming out of it, the Jason Van Dike conviction, we have serious racial problems here and this is akin to pouring gasoline on some burnt coals and hoping that they don't go on fire. This incident could have turned into something really terrible for the city.

It's an assault on the city, he needs to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. The city should be filing a lawsuit to recoup the money that we lost.


MCCARTHY: With the expenditures that the CPD put into it and by the way, those same detectives who were always getting their butts kicked in the press, for low clearance rates did an exceptional job here and they need to be complimented for it.

INGRAHAM: Absolutely.

MCCARTHY: And lastly, I think that we have to do a better job of holding Kim Fox accountable for not being on the ground here right now. She's the state's attorney, she recused himself from this issue because she wanted to go to the Oscars. I mean this is unacceptable behavior.

INGRAHAM: Whoa, whoa, whoa, wait a second. Wait a second.

MCCARTHY: And it's got to be recognized.

INGRAHAM: Wait, wait, Garry, Garry, did I just hear what you said? That the state's attorney - because I thought it was the state's attorney had some personal connection to people surrounding this case or familiarity which I thought was odd because she had been on the case for a couple of weeks and suddenly she was recused.

So how do you know that - how do you know about the Oscars? How is this?

MCCARTHY: She is - there's pictures - there's pictures all over the place of her at parties at the Oscars even as we speak. So the bottom line is she had an obligation to be here, she was elected to do her job and when she comes up with the biggest political football that she's going to have as an African-American prosecutor, she fumbles it and she runs away. Absolutely unacceptable.

INGRAHAM: So you're saying this was no reason - so wait a second, so you're saying there was no reason for her recusal, that was all just a ruse to go to the Oscars?

MCCARTHY: I believe it's a ruse. It's absolutely ruse when she says that -

INGRAHAM: Okay, well, I can't establish that, I don't want to -

MCCARTHY: She made a reference.

INGRAHAM: Okay, she made a reference, I can't establish that tonight. I don't want to jump - I don't want to do what people did in the early part of this case but that's certainly an interesting assumption but we'll see whether that's true.

All right gentleman, what would require - what would justice actually require in this case? Chicago PD Superintendent Eddie Johnson had this suggestion today.


JOHNSON: Absolute justice would be an apology to the city that he smeared admitting what he did and then be man enough to offer what he should offer up in terms of all the resources that were put into this.


INGRAHAM: Well, Kevin, Smollett's legal team is not doing this. Tonight they're doubling down saying, "Today we witnessed organized law enforcement spectacle that has no place in the American legal system. The presumption of innocence, a bedrock in their search for justice was trampled upon at the expense of Mr. Smollett and notably, on the eve of a Mayoral election.

Smollett feels betrayed by a system that apparently wants to skip due process and proceed directly to sentencing."

Ain't no apology there, Kevin. Did the cops skip due process?

GRAHAM: No and we've witnessed that they've gone after the police on many occasions, when it's unjust but here there is an overwhelming amount of evidence that he did exactly what he said he did.

He has gone out and said, oh I was jumped and quite frankly, the evidence doesn't pan out that way. He needs to fess us up to what he did, he also needs to pay back the city and he needs to apologize because the detectives in the city worked extremely hard to try and find this.

INGRAHAM: All right, gentlemen, I hate to but thank you very much. He's not doing any of that, he's doubling down. It's the police that is at fault here, it's outrageous. By the way, there were a lot of bad actors during the whole smaller affaire and some still.

Now, let's start with some of the politicians. We're going to name names here. They were the ugly attempts at pure political politics, racial politics from 2020 contenders. Kirsten Gillibrand in a still standing tweet from three weeks back said, "horribly it's the latest of too many hate crimes against LGBTQ people and people of color."

Kamala Harris said, "This was an attempted modern day lynching. Cory Booker use identical language, "The vicious attack was an attempted modern day lynching."

When the facts started unraveling though, Booker and Harris demanded that we wait for the facts.


SEN. CORY BOOKER, D-N.J.: The information is still coming out. I'm going to withhold until all the information actually comes out.

SEN. KAMALA HARRIS, D-CALIF.: Okay, so I will say this about that case, I think that the facts are still unfolding.


INGRAHAM: Wow, that's not what was in practice in this case though and certainly not with Brett Kavanaugh. Then there are those who deleted their tweets, their initial tweets knowing that they won't be pressed by a compliant cooperating media like House Intel Chair Adam Schiff.

He said, "We pray for your speedy recovery, Jussie and reject this act of hatred and bigotry." He lives in CNN and MSNBC green rooms so he shouldn't be too hard to get a clarification from, right? Well, no luck so far from the media firefighters.

Well, the most powerful politician the Democratic Party, Speaker Nancy Pelosi, she wrote in a since deleted tweet, "The racist, homophobic attack on Smollett it is an affront to our humanity."

Well, the only affront to our humanity is the media apparatus that will circle the wagons to protect you from ever having to explain this away, Nancy. And speaking of the media, having a revelled in this entire story and then they're revealed to having just chased another hoax, they still reach the wrong conclusions.

Here's Don Lemon.


LEMON: In the court of public opinion, Jussie has lost, he's lost the fight in the court of public opinion.


INGRAHAM: I don't even know what that means, that's wrong. The sterling work of the Chicago PD is why he lost. Because there was hard evidence and it was legwork on. If it's not bad enough, they're actually defending their rush to judgment. Yes, they are, this from Van Jones and Keith Boykin.


KEITH BOYKIN: A lot of people say well, how could you believe the story from the beginning.

VAN JONES, CNN HOST: Because it happens.


JONES: This is a Jackie Robinson against homophobia in the black community, an icon, a beloved icon.


INGRAHAM: Jackie Robinson, what? Well, there are many other bad actors in this case, far too numerous to name in a broadcast relegated to just one hour. The more alarming take away is this. The Smollett case happened just one week after the Covington Catholics smear fell apart.

And if the same politicians, celebrities and media figures couldn't learn their lesson in that moment, what chance do you think they have for the next inevitable hoax? Coming up, the prosecutor charging Smollett laid out a pretty damning case against him, earlier today. So how can he possibly build the defense.

Alan Dershowitz with the answer to that, next.



RISA LANIER, ASSISTANT STATE'S ATTORNEY: Smollett stated that he wanted them to appear to attack him. Defendant Smollett also stated, he wanted the brothers to catch his attention by calling him an ‘Empire' F ‘Empire' N. Defendant Smollett also included that he wanted Ola to place a rope around his neck, pour gasoline on him and yell, this is MAGA country.


INGRAHAM: The Cook county prosecutor's office today laying out in detail, all of Smollett's alleged wrongdoing and given all that overwhelming evidence, does he even have a defense? Well, who should we ask?

Harvard law professor emeritus, Alan Dershowitz has staged some of the most infamous or famous defenses in legal history in the OJ case and many others. He joins me now. Okay, Alan, what's Smollett's defense here.

ALAN DERSHOWITZ, HARVARD LAW PROFESSOR EMERITUS: Well, his defense is that nobody ever gets prosecuted for making false reports. Tawana Brawley, remember back in the day, the people who defended her and created her fraud went free and went on to political and media careers.

There are many, many other instances of people who make false reports and they're never prosecuted. Look, we have to presume everybody innocent. If the facts are as the police say they are, if actually payments were made and a plan was hatched to put a rope around the neck and a police report was filed, then we have a potential for a serious crime.

I'm surprised that they charged only with some kind of disturbing the peace, that doesn't sound like this is what happened here so we have to wait and see -

INGRAHAM: Yeah but Alan, even as a defense attorney, Alan, even as a defense attorney, I was a criminal defense attorney too but should this matter here? I mean, to me given the toxicity of the charges, given the heat that is on Chicago in the race relations.

We just heard two very well respected, former superintendent of Chicago PD, current fraternal police President. This is - this is hot there so shouldn't this be like we're tonight, well, he'll just get probation, maybe he'll get - you know, just be probation, it's not going to be a big deal.

To me that just seems ridiculous.

DERSHOWITZ: I agree with you. I agree with you. We have to look at the context, we have to look at the pressures on the city and in the end, I do think a case like this if the evidence is overwhelming as it looks like it is, there'll probably be some kind of a plea bargain, some kind of a deal, he'll probably admit it and apologize.

And do some community service but I do think, I agree with you. I think people will make false reports or to go to jail. I think you know, in the Bible if you falsely accuse somebody, you get the penalty that the person would have gotten had the accusation been true so if in fact, these people had attacked him in this racist way and put a noose around his neck, they would have gotten some years in jail.

If you're going to follow the Bible, this guy would get the same penalty that he falsely accused other people of getting. We still don't know enough about the case in the sense of, were these people going to take the rap if they were caught, were they going to go to jail?

INGRAHAM: Well, apparently $3500 is not enough. First of all, Jussie's got to pay more for that.

DERSHOWITZ: That's not enough to go to jail.

INGRAHAM: They're going to sing like canaries for just 3500 bucks and they get extra $500 when they came back. I love that detail.

DERSHOWITZ: Look, I think in general, there ought to be a policy of prosecuting vigorously people who make false accusations.

INGRAHAM: Yeah, well, defense attorneys tonight are all over the place. Yeah, they're saying tonight, he's being framed, it's unfair and I want to place on the free for one of his attorney.

DERSHOWITZ: Let's look at the facts.

INGRAHAM: Yeah, Mark Geragos who joined the team. He was on CNN and he's tipping their hand on what the defense will be and then your friend Brafman from my LA times and let's watch.


MARK GERAGOS, DEFENSE ATTORNEY FOR SMOLLETT: Somebody tweeted yesterday or the day before and I thought it made a lot of sense. It said this is a Police Department that has had some issues.

BENJAMIN BRAFMAN, DEFENSE ATTORNEY FOR HARVEY WEINSTEIN: I think there are issues with the Chicago Police Department as a general proposition, whether or not they are alleged to have treated people of color fairly, whether or not they are capable of doing an investigation without any difficult issues arising.


INGRAHAM: So now it's going to be the Chicago PD is corrupt so Jussie's innocent. I love that one too.

DERSHOWITZ: Well, it's more than corrupt, what the suggestion is they're racist and I don't know how that cuts but look, I never condemn a defense attorney for trying to be creative and trying to come up with any possible plausible defence, that's what the 6th amendment of the constitution's about.

Let's wait, let's not rush to judgment, this does seem like a strong case but I want to hear all the facts before I come to any conclusion.

INGRAHAM: All right Alan, thank you so much. Now you heard me earlier talk on THE ANGLE about how the Democrats are clinging desperately the death grip on this victimhood narrative. But how did that impact the African- American community, the community at large?

Joining me now with answers, Bruce Levell. He's executive director of the National Diversity Coalition for Trump, and Henry Davis, founder of president of the Conservative Urban Project who is in D.C. for the celebration of Black History Month. Both of you, it's great to have you on.

Bruce, let's start with you. This is wild. So we've got Jussie makes $125,000 a year, by the way, the police make $48,000 a year. Bruce, that's not enough money, so you've got to get a couple of guys to come attack you.

BRUCE LEVELL, NATIONAL DIVERSITY COALITION FOR TRUMP: Laura, this keeps playing into the same old thing. Henry and I were talking about this in the green room about how the left always tries to portray black folks like us to intimidate us. I've always said, this is the biggest voter suppression in the land the way the left -- this is another example, to scare the big boogeyman of MAGA, don't go over there. They are bad people, et cetera.

But the disheartening part of it more than anything, Laura, is yes, we've had issues in the past. We have come a long way. The president tonight, oh my God, he was so on fire. Oh, my God.

INGRAHAM: We got some --

LEVELL: President Trump, you were killing it tonight. He was so excited. We have African-American history month. He was celebrating. Packed, jammed room. Screaming loud. He was so happy the fact we have the lowest black unemployment. We have all these great initiatives, $100 billion going to the opportunity zones. All this positive press, and they here we go.

INGRAHAM: That's the reason, though, Henry, isn't that precisely why they are selling this you're oppressed, you're a victim, watch out for the guys with the red hats because they are coming for you. It's the worst kind of scare tactic. But they are doing it precisely because things are getting better.

HENRY DAVIS, CONSERVATIVE URBAN PROJECT INC.: First of all, I really don't understand why so many people hate black people or people that look like me and him, hate this president. Because this man has done more than any other president has done for people that look like me and him than ever. I wear the MAGA hat wherever I go. I walk around St. Louis with my vote Trump or cry t-shirts on, because either you're going to vote Trump or you're going to cry.


DAVIS: And this thing about, what's his name, Jussie? Lord have mercy. Jussie just needs to go ahead and sit down somewhere in his cell, get some people put some money on his books, and fix him some roman noodles and some, and then he'll really be part of what people --


INGRAHAM: What is going on here? By the way, I have got to share something with you, because I know both of you are big Elizabeth Warren fans. But she kind of changed the subject away from Jussie to how the Democrats are going to help the African-American community, something that Trump apparently won't do. Let's watch.

It's a full screen. Sorry about that. She says "We must convert the dark history of slavery and government sanctioned discrimination in this country that has had many consequences." She continues "including undermining the ability of black families to build wealth in America for generations. We need systematic, structural changes to address that," and she is talking about reparations. Write a check. Write a check.

DAVIS: She is talking about the Democrats. That's what the Democrats are doing. That's why we as people that look like me and him are in the position that we are in is because of the Democrats. I'm trying to tell you right now, Laura, look, Donald Trump is the most pro -- and this is a quote from my friend Pastor Darrell Scott, who I will be working with him and Kareem and the Urban Revitalization Coalition when they come to St. Louis. I had to say that real quick.

INGRAHAM: You got that out fast.


DAVIS: Pastor Darrell Scott said that Donald Trump is the most pro-black president that we have ever seen in our lifetime.

INGRAHAM: They are petrified of Donald Trump taking even five percent of the black vote away. Kanye West, I think it was Kanye West who said get off that plantation. Is he right? He said, don't stay on that Democrat plantation.

LEVELL: Here we go again, voter suppression. Let's throw the big bad boogeyman into the room and intimidate us. Laura, this is serious stuff. At the end of the day, President Trump is going to be the champion that guys who look like us, they're going to build generational wealth for black America.

DAVIS: You better say it.

LEVELL: Like it's never been done before. Like myself. I am a 27 year business owner in Atlanta. There's many guys like me, many of us across the country that want that opportunity. This president, and I cosign with Pastor Scott, he will be the best, is the best president, the history, history.

INGRAHAM: OK, guys, two words. Victimhood -- what do you tell the African-American kid out there watching, maybe he's a 20-year-old watching, when they say you are a victim, you say to him?

DAVIS: That's a lie.


LEVELL: I ditto that. Exactly.

DAVIS: That what I say. I say that's a lie.

LEVELL: The numbers don't lie. I always say don't get caught up in the emotions. And I say this on every -- I've been on all these other networks, and I always say this, for black America, don't get caught up in the emotion.

INGRAHAM: What about the "s-hole countries" comment? And what about it's always --

LEVELL: That's emotion, Laura. That don't pay bills. That doesn't do anything except keep this junk going that has no substance in black America.

DAVIS: President Trump ain't scared. I say that he about that life. He got that --

INGRAHAM: I need one of those shirts.


DAVIS: For real? You want on, for real?


INGRAHAM: I am hanging out with them after the show.

DAVIS: Right on, Laura!


INGRAHAM: I want to just do a show with you.

All right, gentlemen, thank you.

DAVIS: Thanks, baby.

INGRAHAM: Up next, -- it doesn't bother me when he says "baby." It doesn't bother me at all. Other people would be offended. I'm like, bring it.

Violent attacks on conservative students on college campuses are getting out of control. Coming up, a debate on the roots of victimhood like we saw with Jussie Smollett. Does it begin in academia? That's next.


INGRAHAM: Attorneys for Jussie Smollett remaining defiant tonight that he is still a victim. But where does this cry for attention come from? Andy Ngo, he summed it up prefect in the "National Review" a couple of days ago, writing "Because of the mainstreaming of academia's victimhood culture, we're now in a place where we place more value on being a victim than on being heroic, charitable, or even kind. Victims or victim groups high on intersectionality points are supposed to be coveted and believed unreservedly."

But there's something more nefarious happening, do you think, on college campuses. Back in March of 2016, hen candidate Donald Trump had to cancel a rally at the University of Illinois because of violent protests and other threats. And in March, 2017, conservative Charles Murray and his group were literally attacked at Middlebury College. Glad I didn't go there. A professor was injured in that melee. And just this week at the University of California, Berkeley, a Turning Point USA recruiter was brutally attacked. We don't know what happened before this video but it doesn't look good.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jesus Christ! What?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You won this fight.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mother -- Racist mother -- You little --



INGRAHAM: You can hear that. Have you ever been punched in the face? You know how much that hurts.

We reached out to the university and police say they are investigating the incident. Joining me now is Charlie Kirk, founder and president of the group that was attacked and author of "Campus Battlefield." Also with me, American University student and activist Angelo Cocchiaro. Is that right, am I getting that right?


INGRAHAM: Cocchiaro. I'm so sorry. Charlie, how often do types of attacks happen against conservatives?

CHARLIE KIRK, FOUNDER, TURNING POINT USA: Far too often, and this one was one of the more brutal ones we've seen recently. And the narrative in the media in the last couple weeks before the facts came out with the Smollett case is he is a victim, and we cannot question it. This is a real victimhood. This is a student that was assaulted in the public square because he was tabling and recruiting for conservative values for our Turning Point USA chapter at U.C. Berkeley, which ironically was the original birth place of the free speech movement 30 or 40 years ago. But unfortunately, college campuses are not becoming safe places for conservatives.

INGRAHAM: There is a picture of him, by the way, in the middle. How have they not found him yet? And that's the guy he attacked, they kind of looked like the same person, actually. That's the guy who attacked. He was on HANNITY tonight, but there he is. Anyone knows this guy, call the authorities, because the university, the provost, I believe, the chancellor put out a statement saying this is unacceptable. We do not allow this.

Angelo, this is what Donald Trump Jr., he weighed in on this. He said when a liberal like Jussie cries wolf and fakes an attack he receives unmatched coverage, sympathy, and support, creating a tsunami of attention. When a conservative student literally gets punched in the face and is caught on video, it barely makes a ripple. Angelo?

COCCHIARO: Here's the thing with that, is that when this story first came out with Jussie Smollett, our first impression was that this was a legitimate hate crime incident. And the Since president Trump took off hate crimes rose 17 percent. That's numbers from the FBI's own statistics. So the reality here is that where Mr. Smollett may have fabricated this one incident, the reality that there are actual hate on the rise.

INGRAHAM: Angelo, that I believe is because more agencies are now reporting hate crimes. That's why that number seems a lot higher than it was previously because now you have more inputs before those agencies weren't reporting all into the national database for hate crimes. But any hate crime is a problem, and I agree with you. We don't want any hate crimes. But we are talking about the disparate coverage. And American University, George Washington University, Catholic University, Georgetown, all great schools right in this area. A conservative wearing a "Make America Great Again" hat on those campuses would be kind of risking it. That's a fact, would be risking it. And I know a lot of great kids who go to Georgetown. It's a great school, great people, but they would be risking it, wouldn't they?

COCCHIARO: I don't think that's true.

INGRAHAM: Oh, come on. I just to live right AU. I know it well. Good kids, but there's a lot of --

COCCHIARO: We just had an incident where a student came through our cafeteria wearing a confederate flag hoodie, didn't go to school there, wasn't a student. Had no threats of violence against him, but we did have some students who were uncomfortable with it. And they talked to the security there and asked them if they could do anything about it. They didn't end up doing anything about it.

INGRAHAM: Well, that's good.

KIRK: So this video, which is horrifying, if the attacker was making a "Make America Great Again" hat, this is all we would be talking about. It would be talking about right into the narrative --

INGRAHAM: Imagine if a kid like Jussie was hit in the face, like hit in the fact, hit in the face by someone who was a conservative kid, a college Republican. Angelo, you are a smart guy. Angelo, I am trying to get Angelo to be a conservative. I'm going to win him over.

KIRK: He will leave the left before we're done.

INGRAHAM: I am going to win Angelo over. He is too fun and he's too smart. I know you are. But you know there is a double standard out there. You can't be saying college campuses are balanced today. They're not.

COCCHIARO: Here's what the double standard is. The double standard, the difference here is that with the incident with Jussie Smollett when we believed it was an actual incident, you are talking about an attack against somebody who is a member of a historically marginalized group. He's a person of color.

INGRAHAM: Did you believe it when you heard it? Did you actually believe it?

COCCHIARO: I did believe it, yes.

INGRAHAM: Have you ever been in that neighborhood in Chicago?

KIRK: Streeterville.

INGRAHAM: Who the heck walks through Streeterville --

KIRK: No MAGA country.

INGRAHAM: -- at two in the morning with MAGA? It was ludicrous on its face. We've got people in the other room who were like, Laura, I didn't believe that for two second, people of color here.

COCCHIARO: One of the points you're talking about is the culture of victimhood, but the real toxic culture here is from the president. It's his dark vision for America and this idea that if you're --

INGRAHAM: He was having a great time today. He was having a great, great time tonight, Black History Month. It was over-subscribed. He had 300 people there, Charlie?

KIRK: Yes.

INGRAHAM: People couldn't get in because it was overpacked. I think Democrats want to hold on to this domination, political domination of one group. I think their time is up. I think people are now thinking for themselves. I think that's a good thing.

KIRK: Super quick. I have been doing this for six years now, visited hundreds of campuses. It's only liberals that try to kick me off campus. We never try to disinvite leftist speakers that come on campus. It is completely slanted in one direction. They are afraid of other ideas.

INGRAHAM: Angelo, I want you back. I'm going to bring you over. You're going to become a conservative. Angelo is too smart to be -- otherwise. I shouldn't say that. You can think for yourself, be whatever you want to be. Thanks, guys, thank you.

Up next, Judge Laura takes the bench. A park advocacy group filed a lawsuit in Chicago that could jeopardize the construction of Barack Obama's Presidential Center. But who has the legal upper hand? That debate and my gavel, next.


INGRAHAM: It's time for "The Arbiter" where two attorneys argue a case and I, Judge Laura, make the final ruling. Joining me now are attorneys Andrew Stoltmann and Robin Nunn. Here are the rules in the Court of Ingraham. Each attorney will have 30 seconds to lay out his or her case followed by a rebuttal. You both get to rebut the other. If the judge needs more information, each of you will have an additional 30 seconds to explain. And then I'm going to ask some questions. In the end, I will make my ruling. It cannot be appealed.

And on the docket tonight, the fight for former President Obama's Presidential Library. This week a federal judge allowing a lawsuit filed by a park advocacy group to go forward that, if successful, would prohibit the 20-acre exhibit to be built near Lake Michigan. So Andrew you are a Chicago based attorney. You have 30 second for your opening. Let's get 30 seconds up on the clock. Guys, the court is now in session. Andrew?

ANDREW STOLTMANN, NORTHWESTERN LAW, ADJUNCT PROFESSOR: It's real simple. Public land is for public purposes. And what we can't do is we can't have a $500 million vanity project, even for a former president, and take land from the public and give it to a private person. We just can't do it. It's a bad decision. What would people say in two year from now if President Trump would want to take 20 acres in Central Park and put his presidential library on it. Everybody would they that's lunacy.

INGRAHAM: Robin? Just made it under the wire, Andrew. Robin, your case?

ROBIN NUNN, ATTORNEY: Whether you agree with Obama's politics or not, the law is clear on this. and the city has the right to use public lands for whatever it wants, including for the Obama Presidential Center. There has not been a takings. This is obviously in the public good. And the people of Chicago are excited about it. As an African-American and a former resident of Chicago and a graduate of the University of Chicago Law School, this is clearly a good decision and something that will uplift the people of Chicago including many, many folks.

INGRAHAM: My affinity and love for the University of Chicago Law School aside, Andrew still gets to rebut you. Andrew?

STOLTMANN: Yes, look, that's silly. Nobody is saying that President Obama shouldn't get the land. It just shouldn't be parkland. There are 160,000 acres of land in Chicago, one percent are public land, public acres. Put it on the 99 percent that aren't public. It's simple.

INGRAHAM: Yes, but Andrew, this was transferred. This was land that was transferred to the city by the Park Commission.

STOLTMANN: Yes, for $100 for 99 years. That's a classic Chicago sweetheart deal. It's improper, it's wrong, and it shouldn't go through.

INGRAHAM: Robin, I want to read something to you. This is from "The Chicago Sun Times." This was an editorial from two days ago. "A small circle of Obama associates at city hall, the Chicago Park District, and the University of Chicago has largely controlled the process of where and how the center is to be built. It will eat up much more parkland than we were first led to believe. Roads will be eliminated and rerouted at a cost and inconvenience that will be unclear. Mayor Rahm Emanuel, the Obama Center's biggest cheerleader, has done his best to lock in Park District support for years to come long after he leaves office in May." It sounds like a sweetheart inside Rahm to Obama deal. How is this not a total inside job here?

NUNN: Judge Laura, you can't believe this. This has been something that's been open to public hearings. It's been discussed. It's been decided by the district and the city. There is no due process issue here. This is something that the public has an opportunity to opine on and has been approved. And it's by no means a takings. This still will remain parklands that belong to the city. It will just be a fixed term agreement in which the Obama Presidential Center will use that land.

INGRAHAM: Why is it, though, every time the Obamas are involved in some big financial thing, whether it's Solyndra, there always seems to be some inside deal or inside job. And again, love the University of Chicago, love the area. And I think a lot of people love this project. They just don't want it here subverting the law, Andrew, going through to the city instead of the normal process, selling it that way. That's the way you got around the legal strictures. That's what giving people pause.

NUNN: I think that --

STOLTMANN: Laura, that's it. Laura, that's it. Nobody has a problem with this project here in Chicago. But when you are selling this sort of land for $100 over a 99-year period, it's ridiculous, and Chicago has a history of those sorts of deals.

INGRAHAM: All right, time for a ruling, time for a ruling. I am ruling for Andrew here, and it has nothing to do with politics. It's the process that seems corrupt to the core for me. I don't like it at all. I think it stinks to high heaven. Counselors, thank you so much.

And stay right there. Some celebrities still defending Jussie Smollett. Tonight's Last Bite has the answers, next.



SHERYL LEE RALPH, ACTRESS: Is at a big bad mistake? Absolutely. But a lot of people have made some awful, awful, big, bad mistakes. Some people have even killed people. They're walking around free. So I'm just saying Jussie made a bad mistake. In his heart he's a truly good person.


INGRAHAM: That was actress Sheryl Lee Ralph, best known as the original lead in "Dreamgirls" on Broadway. Well, like we said, this 11 democratic apparatus will circle the wagons until Smollett is just thought of as a victim nationwide. That's what they hope.

Shannon Bream and the "Fox News @ Night" take it all from here.


Content and Programming Copyright 2019 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2019 ASC Services II Media, LLC. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of ASC Services II Media, LLC. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.