Democrats turn down Trump's offer of DACA extension in exchange for border wall funding
Trump blasts Democrats over latest border deal rejection as the partial government shutdown reaches day 31.
This is a rush transcript from "The Five," January 21, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: Hello, everybody. I'm Jesse Watters along with Jedediah Bila, Juan Williams, Dana Perino, and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City, and this is "The Five."'
BuzzFeed credibility taking another massive hit, President Trump's attorney, Rudy Giuliani, saying that the special counsel told them Friday that much of the report about the president instructing Michael Cohen to lie to Congress is false.
This comes after a Mueller spokesman issued a rare statement calling the so-called bombshell story, quote, "not accurate." The media now scrambling to save face after originally using the story to, of course, ramp up impeachment talk.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If this BuzzFeed news report is true, then we are likely on our way to possible impeachment proceedings.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Now, suborning perjury, telling someone to lie is a crime. It is also in the past been impeachable.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Well, directing some of the lying under oath is a crime, of course. And if proven, it is potentially impeachable.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If it were to be true, it means the president told someone to lie under oath, which very simply is a crime and it's impeachable.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Neither CNN nor any other major news outlet has so far confirmed BuzzFeed's reporting.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: NBC News has yet to confirm BuzzFeed's reporting.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: CNN has not independently confirmed this reporting.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: Despite the backlash, BuzzFeed standing by its reporting.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can't really get into like the details there. We really can't go any further at all in order not to jeopardize sources. But I can tell you that, yes, indeed, the same sources that we use in that story are standing behind it, as are we. The story is accurate.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What if the sources are just wrong?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They're not.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: And President Trump slamming this as the latest example of fake news.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: I think that the BuzzFeed piece was a disgrace to our country. It was a disgrace to journalism. And I think also that the coverage by the mainstream media was disgraceful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: Greg, we're laughing on Friday. Big, if true --
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Yes.
WATTERS: -- and what happened?
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: We called this. Once again, Five was ahead of the news and deserve a Pulitzer prize, each one of us. I love watching -- seeing BuzzFeed on reliable sources.
GUTFELD: That's like having Charles Manson on Family Feud. It's ridiculous. And another example when you see the media and the Democrats in lockstep so it's like a square peg that fits perfectly in a square hole. They just back each other up on this. And what's telling is the dog they often call in the Sherlock Holmes mysteries, Dana, the dog that didn't bark.
PERINO: Oh.
GUTFELD: The dog that didn't bark at the reliable sources interview was the missing reporter. What's his name again?
PERINO: Leopold.
GUTFELD: Leopold wasn't there. He's the dog that didn't bark. And when the dog doesn't bark, that's where the story is. He's the Achilles' heel. He's the guy who said he saw the stuff, right? And now he's not there. And then Brian Stelter asked these guys, you know, what -- have you seen this? I'm not at liberty to say. That's where the story is.
WATTERS: Well, you know, the BuzzFeed guy says this, Leopold person is doing some other reporting.
GUTFELD: Yes.
WATTERS: He's working with some other stories.
GUTFELD: He's latch in to a radiator in the Bronx.
WATTERS: OK --
JEDEDIAH BILA, CO-HOST: That's the guy who's been discredited a million times who fabricated stuff, who -- said that thing about Karl Rove being indicted. And now, he probably didn't see the evidence is my guess, and he just came up and said that, and now he's in trouble. This got me --
(CROSSTALK)
BILA: I mean, honestly, how can you even cover the story without looking into that guy, though? Like it's amazing to me, they put this story out, it has anonymous sources, they don't even look into the fact that this guy is a complete -- I mean, practically a fabrication himself. They peddle it out there. And we've gone from collusion to obstruction to subornation. Next, it's going to be Trump fed, you know, some dog cat-food. I mean, nothing is off the table here. It's just -- the story is crazy.
WATTERS: At least, he didn't put a dog on his roof. That's scandal.
BILA: That's like three weeks of coverage.
WATTERS: That's a big one. Juan, you looked puzzled as we're talking about the story.
JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: I thought Dana was going to say something, so I'm anxious to hear. But, no, I mean, to me, this is a sad story on a number of fronts. As we said on Friday, we don't know if this is true or not. But then you play the tape of people saying what if. And if it was true, it would be a bombshell.
(LAUGHTER)
WATTERS: All the big stories about this.
WILLIAMS: But I will say that we do know -- I mean, it's no -- I don't see that it's that big a leap from the fact that Cohen has pled guilty to lying to Congress about these things at the direction of client number one.
Now, the question is we don't know that Trump did this. We don't know if it was Trump's aides. But according to Cohen, that's what's on the record. And as you pointed out, BuzzFeed says they're standing by the story.
I'm very curious about this because it's interesting to me that BuzzFeed gave Peter Carr, I think is Mueller's spokesman, word that they were going to publish this story. No response from Mueller's office. And then Mueller's office does something unusual, which is to repudiate the story. I mean, to me, what they said was the story is wrong.
PERINO: That's actually what I was going to talk about.
WILLIAMS: And then BuzzFeed says, well, wait a second. Are you saying that this story is wrong about the grand jury part about you having the evidence, or is it wrong altogether? And that, I must say, we need to be careful on that point, just as we're careful about the BuzzFeed story.
WATTERS: Dana, what do you think about the significance of the special counsel coming out?
PERINO: Well, so I feel for Peter Carr in some ways. So I was a spokesperson at Justice Department for a while. When I was -- when I was there -- let's just take one example -- the Bush administration inherited a lawsuit that the Clintons filed against Microsoft. And there was settlement talks going on between the two parties and I got press calls every day.
GUTFELD: So did I.
PERINO: Is this happening? Is this happening? Is this happening? And all I was instructed to say was no comment. So I learned 101 ways to say no comment because you want to be thoughtful to the press and return their call but you can't see anything.
So imagine now, ratchet that up times a gazillion and you're Peter Carr, and all day long you get questions from the press, from -- I don't care if it's BuzzFeed, it could be the St. Louis paper, someone in San Antonio, some little guy from AP, someone from Fox News. Everybody is calling all day long. And Mueller has told you you're saying nothing at all, ever.
So BuzzFeed, in a way, I can imagine you get that phone call and you're like those guys again? Like, forget it. I'm not answering this. I've already told you we're not commenting on this.
But then the story gets out ahead, and then you see that all the other reporters are saying, well, if that's true, and I think that the pressure from -- of that made them have to come out and say like, I don't know what they're talking about. It does not have to do with the special counsel's office. The question is does it have to do with the southern district of New York?
WILLIAMS: Yeah.
PERINO: Those are two different things -- there are two different investigations and there's a wall between them. I don't know if they're sharing information. So that could be where these guys from BuzzFeed say that they have sources -- they haven't been specific as to where their sources is.
WILLIAMS: Well, they've said their stories are law-enforcement people, but they're -- not part necessarily of the special prosecutor. I will say this --
PERINO: Same say southern district of New York.
WILLIAMS: Right, so it could be --
PERINO: They're notorious --
(CROSSTALK) WILLIAMS: It could be that Mueller is protecting his office and saying we didn't leak this --
PERINO: Right.
WILLIAMS: -- but we don't know. I will say this though, even as everybody who is pro-Trump is celebrating this, you have to stop and say wait a minute, I guess this isn't a witch hunt. I guess -- what did Trump say, 13 angry Democrats going after -- I guess not.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Maybe that is good.
WATTERS: Look good.
WILLIAMS: What did you say?
GUTFELD: May be that -- I mean the fact is it's -- this is kind of encouraging news. I would say it's encouraging news if you're a defender of the president and you see this happening. It is, I mean, look --
PERINO: Or even a defender of the prosecutor.
GUTFELD: Yeah. I just like that -- that now they're trying to find a new bombshell. By the way, they've got to stop saying bombshell because it's an insult to actual bombs.
But the -- now they're saying, well, now the real estate deal with Russia probably went all the way up to the election. It's like that's your bombshell now? So you're blaming Trump for precisely what you, the critics did too, which is not take him seriously and not expect to win. So he was just doing his job until he lost, but then he won.
WILLIAMS: But he covered it up.
GUTFELD: No, he didn't.
WILLIAMS: Yeah -- in other words, even Giuliani said, oh, yeah, so why not to 2016, but initially he said no, no, we weren't doing any business. We had no business. No ties to Russia.
BILA: The message is also, though, these reporters, all you have to do is put the story out there. It doesn't matter if it's true. It doesn't matter if the sources are right. They count on people getting a tainted vision of Trump immediately. They count on that.
And then by the time the corrections come out or the rest of the story comes out, they count on people being like, oh, I didn't trust that guy anyway. You still can't trust him. That's all you have to do. It doesn't -- these reporters now can just throw something out there and everyone in media backs them up and says, oh, well, if Greg did steal that kitten from an elderly person, then he should -- and that --
GUTFELD: And I ate it.
BILA: And ate it. It's crazy.
WATTERS: I just can't believe Greg preys the special counsel if this --
GUTFELD: Yes.
WATTERS: This is a groundbreaking day --
GUTFELD: Always been a fan.
WATTERS: -- on The Five. All right, new video and details emerged from this red-hot controversy. We're going to show you, guys, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GUTFELD: It exploded all over Twitter, kids in MAGA hats taunting a Native American man. Well, not so fast. Soon after, other tapes surfaced where it appears the teens were doing cheers when approached by the drummer who beat the instrument in their faces. This was after different activists had approached and harassed the team.
So with more info, this news story seems different than the old story, how did this happen? Well, first, the media embraced the story because that's what we do. We can't resist being first. And it provided -- or can't resist being second. Anyway, and the media provided -- was provided their favorite villain, the red cap.
PERINO: Yep.
GUTFELD: Because for the press, you can't spell hate without hat. And the media -- I came up with that today.
WATTERS: That's good.
GUTFELD: Pretty good, huh? Anyway, the media knew this story also would distract from the BuzzFeed mess, so it was a nice break from their own humiliations. I saw the story unfold, and trusting my own eyes, I saw obnoxious teens.
My chaperone instinct kicked in. Meaning, if I'm critiquing libs all day, I should also police my own side as well. By the way, isn't that the big question here? Where were the chaperones? I always had them when I was in high school. I deserve them. Anyway, I said the kid should apologize but maybe it should be me for jumping the gun.
However, I do know this, this story has changed once and it's going to change again which is why it's up to us and to me not to take the bait when we're bored or possibly drinking on a Saturday afternoon. I've said it before, always be skeptical, nobody knows where a story goes. That's great advice I gave. Next time I'll take it.
All right, I have a question for you, Dana.
PERINO: Yeah.
GUTFELD: The big story today or one of the big stories today, all celebrities and media types are whipping off -- taking down their twitter in which they were bashing these kids. I left mine up because I feel that if you make --
PERINO: That's your principle?
GUTFELD: I think taking something down if you think it's wrong -- if a tweet endangers somebody, you should take it down. But I think you should always leave your footprints up until you take it all away.
PERINO: Right. I mean, in some ways, you know how like we complain that in the media like something will happen, and then there's a correction --
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: -- but the correction only gets a tenth of the attention as the original article, so I could see where you might want to take it down. But it does raise a very interesting question by -- they're trying to erase it so that, you know, like this whole fight in Europe, do you have a right to be forgotten? Well, one thing you have a right to do is you don't have to tweet.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
PERINO: You actually don't have to do it. But you should as an adult, in particular, have to own what you say. And if you got it wrong, you then -- you just add -- like, so I got it wrong.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
PERINO: If you try to get some attention, I guess, on that if that was the concern.
GUTFELD: Yeah. Jesse, the school may sue for slander. I also saw that on twitter. But I think it sounds like -- do they have a case?
WATTERS: Suing for slander is tough. It's a pretty high bar. I mean, the president wants to sue everybody for slander. Has he been successful? Probably not. But this is one of your better monologues, Greg.
GUTFELD: Oh, thank you.
WATTERS: What did you do differently this time?
(LAUGHTER)
WATTERS: No, I didn't mean that as an insult. I thought it was really good. I have a little different take.
GUTFELD: OK.
WATTERS: OK. Here's my take.
GUTFELD: That was a great insult.
WATTERS: This story became a controversy because the guy smirked.
GUTFELD: Oh.
WATTERS: Now, as a smirker (ph) I'd like to defend smirking.
GUTFELD: You're so right.
WATTERS: Smirking is not a hate crime. Smirking -- I do, when I'm either amused or content or calm. And sometimes it's used to defuse a situation because it's kind of a nonviolent thing. But people hate being smirked at. And I've often been said that I have the most punchable face on television.
GUTFELD: I've even said that to you.
WATTERS: People say that -- people say that to me on twitter all the time. And when I was looking at the story I saw that people are saying this kid had the most punchable face, besides Jesse Watters.
(LAUGHTER)
WATTERS: And for some reason, smirking elicits this reaction. But bottomline, Greg, the black Hebrew Israelites, they're not getting any attention here because they're the ones that instigated this entire thing and I've run to these people in the streets, they're some of the most racist, hateful people you will ever encounter in your whole life, and I understand why these kids were chanting and trying to create a counter protest in reaction to it.
GUTFELD: I don't know that -- I think they're chanting along with the Native American. But to Jesse's point about this group, I used to see them in Times Square all the time.
WATTERS: They're the worse.
GUTFELD: What is their -- I don't know that much about them. What is their -- what is their religion? What is their issue?
WILLIAMS: Basically what they're saying is that, you know, they're the real Israelites.
GUTFELD: OK.
WILLIAMS: And that they're the real people who are the chosen ones by God, not Jewish people and all the rest. And they have all sorts of -- sort of elaborate mythology, ideology, you know, religious theory --
GUTFELD: Yeah.
WILLIAMS: -- that puts them at the center of the universe. And they do say hateful things and they can be threatening. But what you heard here, initially, was that the Native American elder said there're only four of the Israelites and there was a big group of kids in the MAGA hats and all the rest. And he thought they were attacking because the Israelites were saying the offensive things, and then the kids were starting to come back and screaming at them. And he --
GUTFELD: I just saw them laughing.
WILLIAMS: Well, no, chanting or whatever the high school chant was.
GUTFELD: But they never said build a wall or whatever --
WILLIAMS: I don't know about that. But they -- so intervenes, according to him, when he told reporters was he intervened to stop the high school kids from attacking what he described as their prey, these four black guys, right? But then, of course, we see, subsequently, maybe not the case. But I will say that what strikes me is that both the Roman Catholic high school and the diocese both initially apologized based on what we first saw --
GUTFELD: Yeah. I agree. And I thought that they should apologize because what I saw, just the initial stuff that I thought. My first thing, though, was I just didn't see any adults there.
PERINO: Yeah.
GUTFELD: Now what we have to worry about is what happens to this kid -- this kid -- and now the student whose face is everywhere --
PERINO: Right.
GUTFELD: -- and is getting death threats because that's what happens.
BILA: Which is crazy. Yeah, he's saying he and his family are getting death threats. You know, I watched two hours-plus of this video from three different angles and I did find it fascinating that the only thing -- people were talking about this kid smirk, and they were talking about the chanting, and you could argue, you could say this is a bunch of, you know, high school boys and their parents may be need to have a conversation with them about when you're in a chaotic or antagonistic situation, just walk away.
Don't stand there. Don't stare somebody down. You could say that. But what if the kids so far from what we know, what did they actually do? There's no assault here. What you do have though is the black Hebrew Israelites shouting anti-gay slurs, racist slurs.
GUTFELD: They've called them blue-eye demons.
BILA: Yes.
GUTFELD: That's literally demonization.
BILA: Young clansmen. They called them school shooters. And they do that before and after the entrance of Nathan Phillips. So, what it looks like is a chaotic scene. And I watched it from every angle and I didn't -- I didn't see Nathan Phillips get surrounded by them in a menacing way. I saw him walk right into the scene.
So, I think in the age of twitter it's hard because see the story and you're right, you want to jump, you want to comment. But I was surprised to see how many people and I actually -- I have to commence some reporters. There were some reports on other networks that jump to conclusions and walked it back and said, listen, I'm sorry.
I shouldn't have done that. Because when you watch the whole video, it's so clear that these kids were being antagonized. How they responded, you could say, wasn't mature. I don't expect a high school teenager to be mature. And maybe they did say some crazy stuff that going to get unleashed. But as of now, the amount of coverage that they got for a root expression versus what those black Israelites said is astonishing.
GUTFELD: Well, I think if we learned anything, there's a future Jesse Watters out there.
(LAUGHTER)
BILA: And he's got the hat on.
GUTFELD: He got the hat.
WATTERS: I will never wear that hat. I'll get knock out.
GUTFELD: Yes. And why cover that hair.
WATTERS: Exactly.
GUTFELD: That hair is not made for a hat.
WATTERS: Exactly.
GUTFELD: All right. Look at that thing. It's just growing, man. It's a chia pet. Look at that.
WATTERS: Stop it.
GUTFELD: All right, President Trump unleashes on Democrats for rejecting a deal to reopen the government full of ideas they once supported, the hypocrisy ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PERINO: It's day 31 of the partial shutdown and President Trump is blasting Democrats for rejecting his proposal to reopen the government. The president offering up protections for DACA recipients in exchange for border wall funding, the Democrats are refusing to budge. Senator Chuck Schumer ramping up the rhetoric while slamming Trump's compromise.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D), NEW YORK: If he opens up the government, we'll discuss whatever he offers, but hostage taking should not work. The American people are overwhelmingly against it. The president's poll rankings are plummeting because even his own supporters agree that this is a bad tactic. And it's very hard to negotiate when a gun is held to your head.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: Republicans could be ready to force the hand of Democrats. Senate majority leader Mitch McConnell says he's going to bring up Trump's plan for a vote this week.
And just a moment ago, well, 13 minutes ago, actually, President Trump tweeted about the wall again and he said this, if Nancy Pelosi thinks that walls are immoral, why isn't she requesting that we take down all of the existing walls between the U.S. and Mexico, even the new ones just built in San Diego at their very strong urging.
Let millions of unchecked strangers just flow into the United States. And that actually was a question that I wanted to ask, Greg, which is the Democrats have said that the wall is immoral.
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: So if you're there, how do you then negotiate to getting to like a border security?
GUTFELD: I've said this last week. I said --
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: I've said that they should actually remove the walls between Mexico and -- I think I said this last week. By the way, is it a moral or immoral?
PERINO: Well, I think that -- well, you tell me. You're the editor.
GUTFELD: All right, it's immoral. We have a problem here. The more Trump negotiates with practical compromises, the more infantile and personal the Democrats seem to be taking this. But it shows the problem, they started at the wrong end. You should always begin with a multi-facetted approach.
The problem? The prison of two ideas. We keep saying you can only have one position, right? You're either for immigration or against immigration, and that is baloney. You can have a number of different positions on immigration. For example, my -- I'm pro-immigration. And I'm pro-refugee with extreme vetting. I don't see -- I think, you know, refugees make great citizens because they're grateful.
But you've got to have extreme vetting because you never know if there's going to be terrorists coming in, the whole skittle metaphor. But that is -- that is a -- that's -- I'm living outside of this prison of two ideas. And we're now stuck in this thing where you have to be this or this and it's killing the debate.
PERINO: The other rhetorical excess I noticed this weekend is that Democrats saying that the president is taking hostages. And again, it's just like wow. Are we really talking about that when we're talking about border security? The president has come up -- his position of like a whole wall, across the whole thing, like -- that hostage taking, that's take it to a new extreme. Hard to negotiate with that.
WATTERS: Schumer said that we'll reopen the government and we can't even discuss border security until you do that. Well, the president offered Nancy Pelosi that. He said, you know, what if we reopen the government, can we do a deal on a barrier later on?
And you know what she said, no. And then he said bye-bye and that was the time he walked out of the room. Greg brings up the point if you say you're for the wall, the Democrats have to say we're against the wall.
Thus, every reporter should be asking that very question. Congresswoman, senator, do you believe that we should tear down the existing wall since they're immoral, and since they obviously don't work? You would have the government reopened right now if we had a fair media in this country, because they would be asking these logical questions to Democrats and not protecting the Democratic position, and the intensity would be so strong on Nancy, she would have to come to the negotiating table.
So far, I believe she's lost this argument. If you look at her getting grounded on the flight, if you look at the Puerto Rican P.R. disaster. Trump is moderating his position. These logical arguments, they just can't argue with. All they say is, "Oh, it's mean."
So if you look at what he's offering, he's offering humanitarian assistance. He's offering changes to the asylum. He says only 280 additional walls to be needed and to be built.
And what are they saying? No? And millions of people are still not getting paid? I don't think it's very compassionate.
PERINO: Juan, the Democrats don't seem to think that they're losing.
WILLIAMS: They're not losing. I mean, it's -- you know, Jesse, if this was about the media -- I don't think it's about the media. I think it's about the president and his stand and what he considers to be a political symbol that he can't afford to lose on. They would have gone back and said, "Hey, wait a minute, Mr. President. I thought Mitch McConnell, the Republicans in the Senate joined in saying let's keep the government open. Let's keep people getting paid. Let's keep our economy growing, and then let's negotiate."
Initially, what the president say? "Hmm." And then he said no because the pressure from the right-wing talk show hosts. Or maybe the media, if they were fair would say, "Mr. President, you had a Republican majority for two years in the House and the Senate. Didn't seem to be a priority, did it?"
But here's the thing. He now goes after Nancy Pelosi's as radical. Radical? What's radical here is the president has a weak negotiating hand, and I think it's starting to show. I think people were disappointed with what came Saturday. Everyone thought this was going to be a big announcement. He said he was going to do something big on Saturday afternoon.
GUTFELD: You didn't like what he offered?
WILLIAMS: It was a dud.
GUTFELD: You didn't like what he offered?
WILLIAMS: It was a non-offer.
WATTERS: What don't you like about the offer?
GUTFELD: My God. This is exactly what you would want.
WILLIAMS: No, absolutely not. He said -- listen, let me just say. Remember, Greg -- Jesse -- Jesse was saying to me last week, "Hey, Juan, if it's so easy, why don't you tell me what you want."
Well, guess what? The president now is talking about, well, we could have more technology. We could have more border agents. We could have more judges. He sounds like he's starting to negotiate on the Democrats' terms. But he doesn't -- he doesn't say, "I'm going to stop this. I'm going to stop this shutdown."
BILA: This is how you stop it, though. He basically said -- originally, he was just talking about a wall, and I said that was a mistake, because he was only focused on the wall. That was the campaign promise, but he had to talk about other things.
Now he comes to the table, and he says, "All right. We need these barriers, but I'm also going to provide the humanitarian aid. I'm also going to provide the Border Patrol agents."
WILLIAMS: But he's not getting off the wall.
GUTFELD: He gave an extended --
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: Because you need the wall, Juan.
WILLIAMS: For what?
WATTERS: To reduce illegal immigration.
BILA: Hold on. Hold on, Juan.
WILLIAMS: Yes, you need the wall for him, not to say that he lost --
BILA: -- the Democrats --
WILLIAMS: -- and that he got -- he's trapped himself.
WATTERS: Juan, Juan. We need walls some places.
BILA: So Juan, in order to get done --
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: So what if that's --
WILLIAMS: We have walls.
BILA: Juan. To come on board, they would have to remove the wall. He would have to say, "OK, I'm not interested in the steel barriers that the Border Patrol agents have asked for." He would have to remove the component that's the wall in order for the Democrats to get on board.
That's because they want to deny him that talking point. So that he made a campaign promise; and if he includes that border security measure in there, it's a campaign promise fulfilled.
WILLIAMS: Let me say, the promise he made --
BILA: They're playing politics.
WILLIAMS: -- was Mexico will pay. I don't see that at all.
BILA: Forget about that. Let's --
WILLIAMS: Oh, forget about it.
PERINO: Juan, in the commercial break, I'll give you a point that would've been a better one for you to say.
WILLIAMS: All right.
PERINO: All right. Major 2020 news. Details next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WILLIAMS: The 2020 presidential field growing with Senator Kamala Harris now throwing her hat into the ring. But the Democratic candidate is already facing some very tough backlash.
Harris's record as the California state attorney general, for example, attracting scrutiny in a New York Times piece titled "Kamala Harris Was Not a Progressive."
Meanwhile, Senator Kirsten Gillibrand also facing criticism for charge -- for changing her stance on key issues, including immigration.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: What's the difference, though -- just help me on understand -- between your previous positions, which you characterized as wrong, and note empathetic, President Trump's positions today that you call it racist.
SEN. KIRSTEN GILLIBRAND (D), NEW YORK: I think what he's done is so horrible and so mean-spirited that I am nothing like him and never will be, because my values haven't changed.
(END VIDEO CLIP) WILLIAMS: And then there's Elizabeth Warren. She's being mocked on "Saturday Night Live."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KATE MCKINNON, CAST MEMBER, NBC'S "SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE": Am my likable? Prob not. Neither is a prostate exam, but you need one or you'll die.
I did the DNA test, and the test came back 100 percent bad idea. Who knew race science wasn't a good P.R. Strategy? Lost that fight.
COLIN JOST, CAST MEMBER/WRITER, NBC'S "SATURDAY NIGHT LIVE": Right.
MCKINNON: Lost it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: So you get into a situation, Jedediah, where people are saying, "Well, what is progressive," especially she was, the law enforcement officer as the attorney general. She didn't back things like standards for the use of body cams on cops. At other times, she didn't back the death penalty. What do you make of this?
BILA: Yes, people on the left are mad, because they're saying she's saying -- she's marking herself as a criminal justice warrior and they are saying no you weren't.
Gillibrand, too, is the funniest, too. Because if you look at immigration, which is such a front-and-center issue, the person saying that she wants to abolish ICE. And before she was very anti-amnesty. Wanted more deportations of illegal immigrants.
I don't know that the strategy here, because what wins the primary doesn't win the general election. So it's always interesting to me to see even folks on the right shift all the way right for the primary and then they have to walk it back.
And I'm just curious what Joe Biden is going to do if he jumps in. Because Joe Biden is known as somebody who can appeal to a wide range, I think. He's not viewed as a hard left. Is everybody in the Democratic field going to be very hard left? Is there going to be no moderate?
Because all these people were moderates, including Cory Booker. Even Elizabeth Warren took money from fossil fuel companies. Now she's totally opposed to that.
So is there going to be anyone in there that's palatable to a centrist Democrat, is what I'm wondering.
WILLIAMS: What do you think, Jesse? Who's your favorite Democrat?
WATTERS: I don't have one, Juan. You. You know it's you.
WILLIAMS: No, I'm talking about the candidates.
WATTERS: Well, listen --
GUTFELD: Mitt Romney.
WATTERS: I used to think Beto was going to go on some meteoric rise to the top and now he's weirding everybody out. And he's writing all these strange pieces on the Internet and traveling all across the country in, like, a Jack Kerouac kind of way; and I think he's kind of lost his mind.
Kamala Harris is a top-tier candidate, I would agree, and that's why everybody is dumping all this opposition research on her the minute she gets out.
Gillibrand, I think, is a flake. She's weak, robotic, and it's just all talking points.
PERINO: Hillary-esque.
WATTERS: I don't think she actually has any sort of authentic core values.
Warren, I think, is dead in the water, and the fact that "SNL" is making fun of her now, this early, means she's completely toast.
But I was talking to my uncle, who's a politician up in New Hampshire, and he gets calls from all these people. And, you know, they're testing the waters. Can I have your support?
In these early stages, in these primaries, you have to go to New Hampshire, and you have to talk to small groups of people. And they have to kick the tires, and you have to put your hands here and hang out at diners. And that's kind of how voters decide who they like, not by corny viral speeches on the Internet or, you know, shticky little things on Instagram.
WILLIAMS: But remember, you also have to attract the donors. You have to attract that social media audience that will generate the kind of enthusiasm.
WATTERS: Yes, you have to do both.
WILLIAMS: All right. So on the other hand, you get into a situation, Dana, where people say, "I remember when Kamala Harris interviewed Brett Kavanaugh during the hearings." That's more popular than anything Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez has done, and I think she's got the most popular video in the House.
PERINO: For Democrats, that's certainly true, but Republicans will never forget that either.
WILLIAMS: Right.
PERINO: I mean, that will be the thing. But for right now, she has to try to appeal to the Democrats.
And I think that today, when she was answering questions about her prosecutorial record, she didn't seem quite ready for all of that. And blaming her staff from at the time is probably not going to cut it for very long. So she's going to have to answer some of these questions.
She did some neat things. I mean, I think that some of us would agree. They had a big truancy problem. And so she said, "OK, right, you know what? Then the parents are going to have to pay that price. And the parents are going to be held accountable." And I think a lot of people would be like, "I kind of like that." So there's -- there's some stuff out there.
But I think her biggest problem is she doesn't really seem to have, yet, a way to articulate what is her rationale for running? So her slogan is "For the People," which is really --
GUTFELD: I've never heard that.
PERINO: And it's kind of like "Stronger Together." And I think she's going to have to have a better answer to "Why do you want to be president?"
Elizabeth Warren, she hates Wall Street. She hates the banks. Like, we know why she's running. Gillibrand wants to be the dissent. Kamala Harris, like, "For the People," I just don't think that's strong enough.
WILLIAMS: And Greg, you know, even with Biden, Biden today came out and said, you know, "I really didn't feel good about the criminal justice reform back in the '90s."
GUTFELD: Of course.
PERINO: Jeez.
WILLIAMS: What do you think is going on, Greg?
GUTFELD: Well, I don't think he's going to be the nominee. I think it's going to be the woman. 2020, it's 100 years, the 100-year anniversary of the women getting the right to vote. Right?
PERINO: Yes. Yes.
GUTFELD: So 1920. A hundred years. That is your motto. It's like 2020 is -- it's about time.
PERINO: Yes.
GUTFELD: The perfect vision. Anyway, Kamala, I think The Times helped her. And they did it on purpose, because if you -- whenever you criticize a liberal for being too progressive, what you're really saying is "you're smarter than you look."
WILLIAMS: Wait, they criticized her for not being sufficiently progressive.
GUTFELD: That's what I -- that's what I meant.
WILLIAMS: Oh.
GUTFELD: I'm sorry. I meant that. I mean that. When they were saying she's not progressive enough --
WILLIAMS: Right.
GUTFELD: -- they're actually saying, "You're smarter than you look."
I am off my game today. Anyway --
WATTERS: Your monologue was A-plus.
GUTFELD: Thank you, thank you. But no, the thing is, it's like, because then if you hear --
PERINO: Take a look, right.
GUTFELD: If you hear "Oh, she's not as progressive as you think," you go, "And 'The Times' doesn't like her," then I think, well, maybe she's pretty good.
But what's missing in all of this is who's going to get that plurality? You know, when you have 20 people, you don't need -- We used to have this argument over Trump. Remember, Trump had, like, 13 percent. And we're going, "But 87 percent don't like him." And it's like, but that didn't matter.
PERINO: It doesn't matter.
GUTFELD: It doesn't. So it's like, all you need is that one differentiation, that one voice that makes everybody seem old. That's the person. It will probably be -- well, it's going to be Michelle Obama.
WILLIAMS: All right. Someone tell her. Someone call Michelle Obama.
Tom Brady, trolling haters on his way to another -- another -- Super Bowl.
PERINO: Did you see -- did you see that?
GUTFELD: Did I see what?
PERINO: Did you see what Juan --
WILLIAMS: See the video that's being called epic right here on "The Five," next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BILA: There are lots of amazing highlights from the New England Patriots overtime thriller against the Kansas City Chiefs last night, but it's Tom Brady's Instagram post after the big win that has everyone talking. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(TOM BRADY SMILING SMUGLY)
GRAPHIC: 37-31.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (singing): We ain't going nowhere. We ain't going nowhere. We ain't going nowhere. We can't be stopped now. This is bad boy for life.
GRAPHIC: Still here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BILA: You know, I don't know. There's something about this guy, Greg. Like, I don't like somebody who gloats.
GUTFELD: Really?
BILA: It drives me crazy. I know he's a good player.
GUTFELD: I'm with you. You know, Jed, as the second most famous graduate of Serra High School in San Mateo, Tom Brady is attempting to steal my mantle.
Let's go to the chart here. No. 5 is Greg Jefferies, Serra graduate. No. 4, Barry Bonds. You all know about him. Lynn Swann. Tom Brady. I am No. 1, Greg Gutfeld.
He has to lose the Super Bowl. Because I am still going to be No. 1 as the most famous Serra graduate ever.
BILA: You know he's already won, like, a bunch of Super Bowls, though.
GUTFELD: We don't talk about that.
BILA: Dana, are you a gloater? Like, are you somebody --
PERINO: Am I a gloater?
GUTFELD: Oh, of course!
PERINO: Yes, I mean, that's really my reputation. I remember when we won -- remember when we won this legislative fight, and we were so excited. And the president looked at all of us. He said, "No one's dancing in the end zone tonight." You never get to.
GUTFELD: You're gloating over not gloating.
PERINO: I am a little -- I have --
BILA: It's true.
PERINO: Yes, that's true.
WATTERS: "How many books did you read this weekend, Jesse?"
PERINO: I read two. I have one I'm going to recommend to you. It's called "Manhattan Beach."
WATTERS: Can't wait.
PERINO: Listen, I'm a little conflicted on all of this. OK, on New Year's Eve, "The Five's" predictions, I'm -- I've got a great track record. I said the Rams are going to win at all. This was back in -- like January 1. And I said that Tom Brady is going to retire at the end of this. See, now both things could still come true.
WATTERS: By the way, you predicted the Rams in the Super Bowl, or winning the Super Bowl?
PERINO: Winning the Super Bowl.
WATTERS: Really?
PERINO: Yes.
WILLIAMS: That's pretty awesome.
PERINO: And you know who told me, Hamda (ph). My secret weapon.
BILA: You know, Jesse, this guy is very polarizing. They once conducted a poll on him, and he was the most loved and the most hated. Why is that?
WATTERS: Well, winners are polarizing. You know? Trump is polarizing. People love to hate them.
BILA: It's like a --
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: People love to hate, you know, tall, rich, successful, handsome people with supermodel wives --
BILA: Oh, that's true then, though.
WATTERS: -- that have many championship rings.
I mean, I like him. I'm not a Patriots fan, but I like him and respect him.
BILA: Yes.
WATTERS: He's -- you know, rubbed it in their faces a little bit, but he can, and he can afford to be cocky.
BILA: He smirks.
WATTERS: He's a smirker, too.
GUTFELD: Smirker.
WATTERS: Smirk respects smirk.
BILA: What do you think, Juan?
WILLIAMS: Wow, you know, you can't take much away from that. That's an odd -- I mean, he's -- he's beyond Hall of Fame at this point. Right?
BILA: That's true.
WILLIAMS: He's a tremendous athlete, tremendous performer under pressure. Talk about clutch. You've got to give it to him.
Does that mean I like him? No. Do I think the Patriots win every time? And about those calls. The officials, whose side are they on?
WATTERS: Wait, which game, Juan? You mean the Saints-Rams or you mean the Pats game?
WILLIAMS: The Saints-Rams. I think the Saints got cheated.
WATTERS: Yes.
WILLIAMS: But in the game with the Patriots, my gosh. Everything that happens, from the flubbed kickoff where the guy looks like he touches, maybe didn't touch it --
BILA: Oh, boy.
WILLIAMS: -- it goes to the Patriots.
BILA: OH, boy.
WILLIAMS: The interception goes to the Patriots. Everything.
BILA: Oh, boy.
(CROSSTALK)
PERINO: -- the passer.
WATTERS: Good one, Dana.
BILA: All right, guys.
PERINO: Have fun (ph), right?
BILA: "One More Thing" is coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WATTERS: It's time now for "One More Thing" -- Juan.
WILLIAMS: President Trump and Vice President Pence visited the Martin Luther King Jr. Memorial in D.C. today. Today is the national celebration of King's birthday. He would've been 90 on January 15.
The Nobel Peace Prize winner was celebrated nationwide with church ceremonies and parades, President Reagan signed and made into law the -- the kind birthday as a national holiday back in 1983, and since 2000, it's been celebrated in every state in the union.
In these politically-polarized times, by the way, King's words still ring with power. He famously spoke about a dream for America. It included this warning: "We must live together as brothers or perish together as fools."
Happy birthday, Dr. King.
WATTERS: Happy birthday.
PERINO: Indeed. All right. So you know how the games were quite anticipatory, and I had that feeling of anticipation.
WATTERS: You did.
PERINO: I did. I was watching -- I don't know how to do this, "Animals Are Great" or something. But anyway, this is what Jasper -- Jasper had the same feeling this weekend, because Caroline Fritz has a little Curious George windup thing. Do we have it here?
There we go. There we go. And see?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(JASPER REACTS TO MONKEY POPPING OUT OF WIND-UP TOY)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BILA: Ohh!
PERINO: So Jasper, we did this about a hundred times that night. And he - - it never got old.
WATTERS: Every time?
PERINO: It never got old. He just never learned that it was coming. Something was going to be there.
Some would call this animal cruelty. I'm going to say, I was just having a good time with my dog, and he enjoyed it very much.
BILA: I love that he kept being surprised.
WATTERS: Very smart dog.
All right. It's like when I hear Greg's monologue. I'm surprised every time.
GUTFELD: That it's good.
WATTERS: It's so good!
GUTFELD: It really is.
WATTERS: So good. All right. Speaking of so good, a pair of pants have been named after me. I repeat --
BILA: Oh, God.
WATTERS: -- someone named a pair of pants after Jesse. They're called the Jesse Pant. Go to Grayers and buy these. They're slim fit chino's. You know, I used to go into the store on Bleaker Street and try on the pants. They're a little baggy for me. So they made them just for me, the perfect slim fit chino. Go to Grayers.com.
PERINO: Are they high waters like the ones you wear?
WATTERS: They're not high Watters -- two "T's" -- at all. So go to Grayers and check that out.
GUTFELD: Are you going to give me a free pair?
WATTERS: No, Greg! I am not. And not I'm not having them send you anything. You're not a slim fit kind of guy anyway.
GUTFELD: That hurts. All right.
GRAPHIC: Greg's An Amazing Moment with Chris Cuomo (First in a Series of 1,300)
GUTFELD: "Greg's An Amazing Moment with Chris Cuomo (First in a Series of 1,300 Amazing Moments."
I always try to find my favorite Chris Cuomo moment of the week, and I think this one was it.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS CUOMO, CNN ANCHOR: God forbid you and I are out, which you know, happens on a regular basis. Somebody comes up and says something ugly to you. It happens. Who knows what happens to me for doing that?
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: You embrace them. You hug them.
CUOMO: Yes, I hug them. I hug them with three knuckles that make their eyes roll into their head, and they wake up 7 minutes with a headache later.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: Ooh. Tough guy.
GUTFELD: He's my hero.
WATTERS: Wow.
PERINO: What did you pick that -- why did you choose that moment?
GUTFELD: Because he is the strangest man on television.
WATTERS: You know what? Since I have the most punchable face on TV, I should hang out with him! He's going to get my back. And knock them out.
All right. Jedediah.
BILA: Yes, well, firefighters did some amazing work over the weekend on Sunday in animal rescue. They rescued a deer in Kansas, a dog in Ohio.
First the deer had fallen through ice and was stuck in 5 feet of water in a lake. Firefighters rescued it Sunday afternoon.
And nine hours away, members of the Blue Ash, Ohio, Fire Department were rescuing a Golden Retriever that fell through ice on Hunter's Creek. The city of Blue Ash has tweeted the dog was returned. The dog is doing well.
And these are the stories -- honestly, like, life can be so crazy, but firefighters are out there. I love firefighters, and I love people that -- that go and fight and protect animals. Honestly, like, that take time out of their day and go do these things. It warms your heart. So --
WILLIAMS: By the way, firefighters are due some kudos for helping out the FOX D.C. bureau this week.
GUTFELD: That's right.
PERINO: I know.
GUTFELD: Saved some animals there.
WILLIAMS: And also, our local --
GUTFELD: Bret Baier.
WILLIAMS: You're funny.
WATTERS: And you were thinking you're having a bad day. You are on fire. Just like the D.C. bureau.
WILLIAMS: And by the way, thanks to our local FOX bureau in D.C.
GUTFELD: Yes.
WILLIAMS: Because that's where all the shows had to go.
WATTERS: That is right. That's what I was watching this weekend, before the game.
Set your DVRs. Never mix an episode of "The Five." "Special Report" is up next with Shannon Bream. I rhymed that.
SHANNON BREAM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Well, Jesse, if I have to be an animal, can I at least be, like, the Golden Retriever? Do I get to pick?
WATTERS: Yes, yes. We will rescue you, no matter what happens.
BREAM: Thank you so much, Jesse. Good to see all of you.
Content and Programming Copyright 2019 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2019 CQ-Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of CQ-Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.
Get all the stories you need-to-know from the most powerful name in news delivered first thing every morning to your inbox