Brit Hume: North Korea holds South Korea hostage

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Brit Hume: North Korea holds South Korea hostage

Fox News senior political analyst talks options for confronting the rogue regime on 'The Story'

This is a rush transcript from "The Story," July 5, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, FOX NEWS CHANNEL HOST: Breaking tonight, the Trump administration issuing a warning to the global community: stand with the United States against nuclear-armed North Korea or America will hold you accountable. That's "The Story." Good evening, I'm Dana Perino in for Martha MacCallum. That stark message delivered to the world super powers as the president touches down in Poland ahead of the G-20 Summit where he will face North Korea's enablers. It was a little more than 24 hours ago, while American celebrated Independence Day that North Korea test launched its newest weapon, a missile capable of reaching Alaska while carrying a nuclear warhead.

The Pentagon noting: this is like nothing I have ever seen from the Hermit regime. Earlier today, U.S. Ambassador to the United Nations Nikki Haley, addressed an emergency meeting of the U.N. Security Council leveling a warning to North Korea's backers. "Make no mistake. North Korea's launch of an ICBM is a clear and sharp military escalation. The United States is prepared to use the full range of our capabilities to defend ourselves and our allies. There remains more that the international community can and must do. We will look at any country that chooses to do business with this outlaw regime. The world is on notice. If we act together, we can still prevent a catastrophe. We will not repeat the inadequate approaches of the past that have brought us to this dark day."

For years, the world has looked on as North Korea started its people and threatens its neighbors. Now that the rogue regime has become a clear and present threat to the U.S. mainland, it looks to be President Trump's problem to solve. Brit Hume joins me now, he is Fox News senior political analyst. Brit, this would -- I think you would agree, be considered the most urgent problem to date for President Trump's foreign policy team.

BRIT HUME, FOX NEWS CHANNEL SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. He's now confronting what the world, I think, has regarded for many years now, many decades now, really, and a series of American presidents as well, as an almost insoluble problem. And the reason is not just the development of these advanced weapons, which we're now seeing being tested. It's been the fact that the North has, for decades now, literally had a gun to the head of South Korea's capital of Seoul. Not with a particularly advanced weapon, but because with a vast store of conventional artillery capable of inflicting unspeakable damage on Seoul with its population.

Seoul, South Korea, the capital of course, with its population in the neighborhood of ten million people. Look, if the United States and its allies or the United States acting alone were to attack North Korea, the conflict would not last very long and North Korea would be resoundingly defeated, but at what cost? And the cost would be felt by the people of South Korea. So, they have a gun to their head and that has been a restraining forest against the series of American presidents and other countries in the world seeking to deal with North Korea's outlaw behavior.

PERINO: we know, Brit, that President Obama in the transition. Mack told President Trump that North Korea will be your biggest problem and when I think that the administration felt they had more time to deal with. Based on your experience of coming right up covering White Houses, what do you think is happening inside, living on a foreign trip to Europe where he will be meeting with the G-20, obviously North Korea will be discussed. What are the options they are looking at?

PERINO: We know, Brit, that President Obama in the transition period told President Trump that North Korea will be your biggest problem. And one, I think that the administration probably felt they have a little bit more time to deal with. But based on your experience in covering White House', what do you think is happening inside the White House now? The president just leaving on a foreign trip today to Europe, where he'd be meeting with the G-20, so obviously, North Korea will be discussed. But back at the White House, what are the options that they're looking at?

HUME: Well, that's always been the question: what are the possible options? Obviously, it would be wonderful if China were to say, gee, you know, were now part of the big international trading system, we've got -- you know, we've got interests all over the world now, we have a very important trade relationship with the United States and other countries and we don't -- we really can't afford to have this outlaw regime under our care behaving the way it is and we are going to move against them. Because, you know, North Korea is already heavily sanctioned by nations all over the world, including the United States, it is basically a failed state propped up by some of its neighbors and friends, particularly China.

PERINO: Right.

HUME: So, if China were to be able -- could be brought fully to bear, which is yet to happen under any president, something might come of that that we'd be sure of military action. If that is not to happen and it does not look like it is happening, despite some earlier hope that it might be, then the question gets much more difficult because, you know, obviously we have the weaponry and we, I suppose, could try to impose additional sanctions on North Korea.

But that process is the very process that you heard Nikki Haley just described as the one that's been tried before and has never worked. So, it is a bit of a mystery exactly what the administration has in mind. You know, we put forces in the area, we sent these signals and so on, but what happens if you actually use them? And that is where the question of the potential damage to Seoul and its millions of people come into play. And I've never heard anybody articulate strategy, a military strategy to get around that problem.

PERINO: Earlier today, I was reading some of the notes you had sent in because a lot of people wonder: what in the heck is going through Kim Jong-Un's mind? Is he crazy? You don't think that he's crazy, you actually think something else.

HUME: I don't think he's crazy and I don't think his predecessors were crazy either. This is a dictatorial state that is, in all respects except possibly military has failed, but it has been blackmail the rest of the world into allowing it to continue along its way and propping it up by virtue of the fact that it holds, you know, the country of South Korea hostage because of the military arrangements and the geography there. Seoul is a very short way -- South Korea, from the border there was all this artillery is amassed.

PERINO: Yes, and millions of people living there.

HUME: Exactly. Population in the Seoul area estimated at 10 million and if you count the whole region, many millions more. So, this is a very vulnerable situation and we simply don't have the armament that I know of, that would be capable of -- you know, we could take out a lot of their artillery, no doubt about that, we could do that. But whether we could prevent a devastating attack on Seoul is a question that's been answered in the negative every time I've ever heard it asked.

PERINO: Well, that's certainly, been talking about it this week and we'll be checking in with you. Brit Hume, so thank you so much.

HUME: Thank you, Dana.

PERINO: OK. North Korea's nuclear ambitions likely to cast a long shadow as world leaders gather in Germany for that G-20 Summit we were just talking about. President Trump arriving in Poland just hours ago, ahead of the G-20 in days of meetings that could provide a reset of sorts with Europe. And of course, tensions running high as the president gears up for what could be his most important foreign leader meeting to date: a face-to-face with Vladimir Putin. Chief White House Correspondent, John Roberts, is live in Warsaw with the very latest. John?

JOHN ROBERTS, FOX NEWS CHANNEL CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Dana, you said it a second ago and I think it's very true that this could potentially be when the president meets with Vladimir Putin, this will be a full bilateral. Initially, it was thought it was going to be one of those quick meetings on the sidelines of the G-20, but it'd be a full bilateral meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin. Russia is widely seen and this goes back to be 2012 election campaign, where candidate Mitt Romney said it, as America's biggest strategic adversary.

The president has long advocated having a more constructive relationship with Russia. And this meeting that he has with him on Friday could either be the beginning of the thaw or it could really kind of cement the freeze between the two countries. I have to tell you, there was a lot of skepticism among America's European allies, including here in Poland of Putin's intentions and there are a lot of people who were worried about America forging closer ties with Russia. I mean, you take Poland, for example, that shares a long border with Ukraine.

We all know what Russia is doing in Ukraine. It also shares a border with Kaliningrad, which is a -- you know, it is part of the Russian Federation and Kaliningrad City is home to the Baltic fleet. So, a lot of people will be watching tomorrow when the president gives his big speech in Krasinski Square, which was the historic sight of the 1944 Warsaw uprising against Nazi Germany. Will he talk about the promise of having better relations with Poland -- with the Russia, rather, or will he talk about the potential threat from Vladimir Putin?

As far as his visit here to Poland goes, it looks like the president is going to be on friendly territory. Andre Duda, who is the president of Poland, shares very much the same sort of political ideology as the president does. And when he speaks at the Krasinski Square, it's expected that he could have upwards of channels, 15,000 people there and it's likely that they will be very welcoming of the president. There could be some protests because the Law and Justice Party, which is the governing party here in Poland has attracted some protesters. But likely, if there are some, they will be small in number and probably kept at arm's length.

Then let's head toward the end of the week when the president goes to Hamburg, Germany, for that G-20 Summit. Potentially, a chance to repair relations with some of the older European countries, if you will; like France and Germany, particularly, on the issue of climate change, but if you look at what Angela Merkel said last week and she'll be meeting with President Trump one-on-one on Thursday night. She's very skeptical about the president's stance on withdrawal from the Paris Climate Accord, suggesting that Europe may need to go it alone against the United States.

So, that's a high-stakes meeting as well, as will be the bilateral meeting, Dana, between the president and the Chinese President, Xi Jinping, on Friday. The two of them seem to have a good relationship at Mar-a-Lago, but it was during that meeting that Xi Jinping promised he was going to do more about North Korea. The president, in that tweet this morning, basically saying it looks like the Chinese are saying one thing and doing another when it comes to North Korea. Noting the trade has gone up between the two countries in the first quarter of this year. So, I think that could potentially be a very interesting meeting as well. Dana?

PERINO: All right. John, thank you so much. And thanks for staying up for us. So, what exactly is at stake for the United States and the World at the G-20 this week? So, joining me now is Ian Bremmer, president of the Eurasia Group and foreign affairs columnist for Time Magazine. What would be your goal if you're the United States going into the G-20?

IAN BREMMER, PRESIDENT, EURASIA GROUP AND COLUMNIST FOR TIME MAGAZINE: Get through it without, you know, sort of too much -- you have to understand that Trump's America first policy and his willingness to shoot from the hip on any issue, which plays very well to his base, play particularly badly outside the United States. So, this will be the first time in history in G-20 that the American president will be so personally disliked and distrusted by a majority of leaders around the table. And so, he's not coming into comfortable territory when he goes and he does his rallies in the United States, the Deep South, the Midwest and the rest, that's very friendly territory. Here, he's actually coming into a table of his peers, whether or not he sees them in that way and it'll be more hostile. And I think that's going to be a challenge.

PERINO: What you think will happen in the meeting with President Putin? Do you think it will be sort of a positive outcome or like what John was saying that Europeans are concerned there might be a better relationship between America and Russia? Some people in America think well, that wouldn't be so bad, but a lot of people might think that this could actually look bad for Europe, especially if you're one of those NATO countries that are concerned about your future.

BREMMER: Look, it's obviously a very controversial meeting and here in the United States, a lot of the mainstream press has had their hair on fire about the idea that Trump is going to meet with Putin. I think the meeting is going to go well. I think he could care less about the fact that it's upsetting the Europeans. Trump has made very clear this is something he wants to do. He's going to go ahead with it. So, I think he'll come across looking from his perspective and those that like Trump, they'll be delighted that he's continuing to say, I don't care, I'm absolutely meeting with Putin, I'm meeting him on my terms, I'm not going to do what other people tell me that they I should. Now, how much can he offer, is an open question.

PERINO: But what about at the G-20? Because you will have China, Russia, South Korea and the rest of the world, they're all at the table and North Korea will be very much on their mind. I would imagine that President Trump will try to actually force the issue at least with those countries. What do you think?

BREMMER: I think that's right. And Europeans aren't going to do very much. I think your analysts are quite correct that the only country that can really put a heavy move on North Korea, as Trump put it, is China.

PERINO: And how -- what would that look like?

BREMMER: Well, I mean, they are responsible for about 90 percent of North Korea's economy, it's both trade and aid. They also have more political connections with the North Koreans than anybody else. But if the Chinese weren't willing to squeeze North Korea when they were posing that kind of threat in the region, why would they suddenly do it's just because they're starting to pose a threat to Alaska or the continent in the United States?

It's very clear that's not going to happen. The magic of Mar-a-Lago between Trump and Xi Jinping was by far the best foreign policy success he's had since he's become president. And yet over the last few days, we've seen very clearly he's going to unwind. They've had one phone call; the two presidents, it's not gone very well in the last couple of days and now going to see each other at the G-20. It's by far the most important moment.

PERINO: Face to face if important.

BREMMER: It's much more important than Putin's --

PERINO: Before I lose you when President Trump meets with Putin, what should they talk about in regards to Syria?

BREMMER: They're going to talk about the fact that we need to re-engage the de-confliction between our air force and theirs so that we don't have mistakes: an America aircraft shooting down a Russian or vice versa. That would be a disaster. It would force confrontation. Nobody wants to see that. But I'm not in any way surprised that Trump has no intention of bringing up the Russian hacks against the U.S. election, irrespective of what Trump may or may not have done with the Russians historically. It doesn't matter. He is very important to him to show that he had a legitimate electoral victory in the United States. Bringing up the election hacks after Obama did very little is completely it's against his personal interests. He's a man that's going to put his own interests before National Security; the country on that, we've seen that already, he's not going to bring it up.

PERINO: Any good point of the fact that there is an investigation in the country --

BREMMER: Absolutely.

PERINO: We're going to talk later in the show about the electoral project commission that Kris Kobach of Kansas' running for the --

BREMMER: No political advisor of Trump would conceivably tell him that he should be bringing this up in this conversation.

PERINO: But the staff can bring it up if they have to.

BREMMER: If they wish. I doubt it's going to happen.

PERINO: All right. Ian Bremmer, always amazing.

BREMMER: Thank you.

PERINO: All right. Up next, with all of these breaking news stories today, CNN was busy tracking down the man behind this video. So, why is the network now being accused of blackmail? Chris Stirewalt, Mollie Hemingway, and Richard Fowler will help explain that up next. Plus, the head of a Trump's voter fraud commissions is de-commissioning -- I'm sorry, that more than 40 states will not share information as fake news. Ahead, we separate facts from fiction on the issue.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The reaction of some Secretary of States and Governors is frankly bizarre because the information that is being asked for by the commission is public information.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: Developing tonight, as President Trump lands in Poland ahead of this week's G-20 Summit in just 24 hours after the North Koreans successfully launched an Intercontinental Ballistic Missile, CNN still finds himself focused on this video President Trump tweeted on Sunday, even tracking down the videos creator on the popular site Reddit. Now, while the network did not release the subject's name, they offered what many saw as a veiled threat, writing:

"He said he is not going to repeat this ugly behavior on social behavior again." Adding this ominous line, "CNN reserves the right to publish his identity should any of that change." Here now is: Chris Stirewalt, Fox News Politics Editor; Mollie Hemingway, Senior Editor at The Federalist; and Richard Fowler, a Nationally Syndicated Radio Talk Show Host and both of them are Fox News Contributors. Chris, I have to ask you, when he went to journalism school, at what point did you ever find out that, you know, intimidating your sources was a good idea?

CHRIS STIREWALT, FOX NEWS POLITICS EDITOR: I don't want to -- I don't want to say something too unkind, but journalism school is substantially a bad idea.

[LAUGHS]

PERINO: Oh, please.

STIREWALT: Especially as compared to the more important thing, which is to start when you're young and work hard and figure it out and make a lot of mistakes, hopefully before you get to the national political --

PERINO: But intimidating your source is probably not within that learning pattern.

STIREWALT: Not, because you learn early on that when you choose and are given permission to protect the identity of a source when you grant anonymity, that's a big deal and you're supposed to have a good reason for doing it and it's not on the basis of that person's good conduct or behavior.

PERINO: Yes. Who are they to decide, Mollie? I mean, this is what I can't understand that they get to decide if he has good behavior and they're going to basically hold his name, hostage, in case he steps out of line with whatever they think is appropriate?

MOLLIE HEMINGWAY, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR AND SENIOR EDITOR AT THE FEDERALIST: This is what is so chilling about it. I mean, leave aside whether it's really wise for a major media corporation to be so hurt by a funny meme that they track down the originator of that meme and threaten to expose him. But this line that they put in there that if he publishes content that they deem -- and they didn't explain what their secret standards were-- but if he publishes any more content they don't like, they reserve the right to ruin his life.

That's just not something that any media organization should do, that's chilling, threatening and kind of a way to go after anyone who criticizes CNN. And that's not something that that media organization can afford, at the same time it's trying to say that freedom of speech and freedom of the press are on the dangerous ground right now.

PERINO: That's a good point. I actually -- you can't have it both ways, right? Cry wolf in a sense. Richard, imagine if CNN had just decided to brush this off and laugh about it. I understand that they worry about their brand and that they are worried about the press, but now this is the, I think, the fourth or fifth day we were talking about this. And in some ways, they just keep advancing these stories. The Daily Wire earlier today reported that it's possible that they might've even had the wrong guy who created a little meme on the internet.

RICHARD FOWLER, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR AND HOST OF A NATIONALLY SYNDICATED RADIO TALK SHOW: Here's the thing about this: I feel as though the Trump administration -- this is as Greg Gutfeld-like way to put it. This is like a marriage gone bad. Donald Trump needs the media, and the media needs Donald Trump's tweets, so they exist symbiotically. So, they have these battles between each other. But what I do agree with Molly is this statement was absurd. And I don't why they put that last hanger online at the bottom of the statement, to begin with. But here's the thing: I think this -- the CNN was given a gift here. They could've revealed his name and said, this is all part of the media -- they're trying to smear us, the Trump camp. The fact that they made him anonymous was like basically having a Mercedes-Benz and returning it for a Jalapeno.

[LAUGHTER]

PERINO: I guess that goes down for you to think. Let me ask you about becoming the news rather than just reporting the news, Chris. I think that's what dangerous thing -- because Richard's right that -- part of the Trump winning story is about the media and the media winning, and the media losing, the media bashing and back and forth, and then pushing back against Trump and vice versa. But when the news organization becomes the news story, I think you can try and lose sight of what you are supposed to do. And that's true for any news organization, this one included, that you don't want to become the subject of a news story, and certainly not perpetuate it.

STIREWALT: Sure. And when President Obama and people around him were working to make Fox the story, that was -- that was something worthy of resisting. I think in this case, people who are not deeply involved in the clannish, vicious, awful nature of American politics or at least some of American politics that people who are reflexively barking in one direction or the other every time one of these bones are thrown out in the kennel. For people who aren't there, they may look at this and say, why am I supposed to care so much about something that means nothing? That really goes nowhere.

Yes, there are larger philosophical considerations to be made here. Yes, there are more important things to talk about. But unless you want to go out and be barking mad on behalf of Donald Trump or barking mad on behalf of CNN, you sort of look at this and you go, what larger purpose? What is larger concern of the American people being served here? And you realize it's nothing and it's mostly a distraction to keep people occupied on one side or the other.

PERINO: Although, Mollie, in some way, does the war with the media sort of give cover to maybe some of the cabinet secretaries who are advancing policy while the immediate basically cover itself?

HEMINGWAY: Yes. A lot can get done while people are distracted by things that are less important. But I would say, following up on what Chris is saying, too many media organizations are fighting the president rather than simply covering him. And that is dangerous, because the media do need to hold this president and this administration accountable and it becomes very easy to tune out what people are saying when they cover out outlandish stories, when they're covering ice cream or they're doing a front page, top of the new story on who -- what random person made a funny internet joke, instead of more substantive news. So, it actually is a threat that people should be wary against. We need credible media organizations at this time and all times.

PERINO: Of course we do. OK. Richard, I'll give you the final word.

FOWLER: I agree with -- I would copy and paste what Molly said here because I think that's part of the problem and that's part of the Democratic resistance problem. We're over here focusing on Russia. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, Betsy DeVos is deregulating the Department of Education from here to high hell and nobody is talking about that it, nobody is covering it. The same thing is happening at EPA, same things happening at energy and I would really like some of these journalists to say, listen, we'll leave this Russia stuff behind us, we'll see what happens in the investigation. But meanwhile, like -- they're really hurting American people at all of these respective agencies and we should be covering that instead.

PERINO: I will tell you as a former White House press secretary that a lot of those government works are never even talked about because the reporters are so focused on the White House. And then there's a big federal government out there to cover.

FOWLER: That's right.

PERINO: All right. Thank you, everybody.

FOWLER: Thank you, Dana.

HEMINGWAY: Thank you.

STIREWALT: You bet.

PERINO: OK. Tonight, gender identity thrust into the spotlight as a newborn and his birth certificate has touched off a legal battle with the parents refusing to assign the baby a gender. Governor Huckabee says, gender politics is getting out of control and he joins us ahead. And no health care development, no easy ride for Republican lawmakers heading home for the holiday. We'll show you some of the angry confrontations the Senators face in their home state when brand-new Fox News contributor, Jason Chaffetz, joins us on his experiences with these types of town halls.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am also concerned there's something mentally wrong with Donald Trump. Why don't you say it, Congressman?!

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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: Developing tonight, Republican senator's maybe still on vacation, but this 4th of July was anything but a break. And they faced angry and frustrated voters upset at a health care bill that is stalled and doesn't look like it won't get a vote anytime soon. Correspondent Mike Emanuel is live from Washington with more on some of the voter angst out there. Mike?

MIKE EMANUEL, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, hi, Dana. This is what Republican leaders were worried about, their members going home for the Independence Day holiday and getting hammered by local headlines and activists on the left. Senator Ted Cruz was greeted by protesters during his visit to McAllen, Texas, yesterday. Many complained about the senate's efforts to pass health care reform. Cruz tried to make the best of it, noting, isn't freedom wonderful? And other parts of the world they would face violence government oppression.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: We also have health care for American citizens, and since Ted Cruz is one of the senators who's standing in opposition in Washington, we had to seek this opportunity to speak to him today on Fourth of July. We came out here to express ourselves.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

EMANUEL: As for GOP critics of the health care bill, Ohio senator, Rob Portman, continues making the rounds across the buckeye state. He's expressed his concerns with the senate health care package and is visiting some addiction treatment centers. Portman is putting the spotlight on the rising number of overdoses in Ohio, and elsewhere, and worried about the funding efforts to scrap ObamaCare. Maine senator, Susan Collins, is one of the most vocal moderates against the senate health care reform package. Her office put out pictures of her marching into a parade. Collins said health care was the only issue that came up, and she said she was praised for taking her stand against the current bill. Collins supports funding Planned Parenthood, which puts her at odds with many conservatives. It's been noted a number of other Republican senators have been keeping a low profile. They were well aware activists on the other side would be looking to embarrass them. Dana?

PERINO: Well, thank you, Mike, for that. Joining me now for more, new Fox News contributor and former Utah congressman, Jason Chaffetz. Sir, welcome to the Fox News family. It's a pleasure to have you aboard. Although you're in Utah.

JASON CHAFFETZ, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Thank you. I'm glad to be here.

PERINO: I wish you were here. Next time you're in New York, come by, for sure. So you have very relevant and recent experience. I want to ask you, how hot does it have to get in one of those recess visits for a congressman to change his or her mind on a vote?

CHAFFETZ: Well, I don't know that it necessarily swings the vote, but you try not to be embarrassed because it ends up being on YouTube. But, hey, that's part of leadership. I mean, when you're out in front and people are kicking you, they're kicking you from behind because you're out in front. You're leading. And so, look, Republicans, their deal with America was, if you give us the House of Representatives, we can play defense. If you give us the senate, we can play a little bit of offense. You give us the house, the senate, and the presidency, then we can actually get things done. And so, here we are seven months into it and they haven't passed the bill yet.

PERINO: But I want to ask you about that. Something that I'm curious about because, obviously, we covered ObamaCare extensively, the passage of it, and then the fallout from it, and the entire time the Republican said, you know, we will repeal and replace. And then, the plan was not there. What do you make of that? Was there something to introduce that just couldn't get enough support, or was there actually never really a plan that they had ready to go?

CHAFFETZ: Well, I was first elected when President Obama became the president, and after that health care bill was passed, some 50 plus times, we voted to repeal it and now it's for real, right? That was almost pretend, now it's real.

PERINO: There's no consequences from it.

CHAFFETZ: Yeah. I was the chairman, and we were told in November and December, that, hey, we're going to frontload the schedule into January, so that by the time the president is sworn in, and its President Trump, he will have a bill sitting on his desk. And I can tell you, there's a great deal of frustration in both the house and the senate that there is not yet a bill because it really feels like they haven't even gotten together and figured out a plan yet that can get 218 votes in the house.

PERINO: What was actually going to be on that January 20th plan? Is that what we're looking at today?

CHAFFETZ: No, no, it's nowhere close. But we were told repeatedly by leadership that, hey, get ready in January, it's going to be there, and we're going to be able to look at it, and we've been talking about this for seven years, and here we are turning the corner into July, and you still can't point to a single thing that will unite us.

PERINO: So as I understand it, you would actually be supportive of the idea that some senators, including Senator Rand Paul and Ben Sasse, have put forward about just repeal and then reform it later. But on our colleague, your new colleague, Marc Thiessen wrote a column today saying that would be a disastrous idea because then Republicans will end up owning all of the problems and not have actually put in forward any solutions yet. So why do you think it's a good idea?

CHAFFETZ: Well, I just want to do what's right for America. What's wrong right now is ObamaCare. I mean, how many times we have to read stories about incredible increases to premiums, deductibles, how many places -- they don't even have a choice in so many counties nearly -- I think its 30 percent, like one choice in their plan. So it is imploding, repeal it. And guess what, that will catch the attention of congress, because congress is notorious for just working towards deadlines. But congress is always in session. It's perpetual. Unless there's an actual deadline you won't compel action.

PERINO: And as you say, members of the congress prefer action to inaction.
So you think there will be a vote before August 1st?

CHAFFETZ: Well, I've always felt like the July 4th was some artificial deadline, but believe me they do not. Members of congress, the house and the senate, they do not want to go back into the August work period, where they're going to be out for four or five weeks, they can't just hide. You know, for one week or a 4th of July. I heard something like less than five senators actually made public appearances during that time. You can't go all through August and have no appearances. They're going to have to get something done I think by the end of July?

PERINO: Yeah. You would be really pale too by the time you went back after Labor Day.

CHAFFETZ: Really tan. Worry about the ones that are really tan, Dana. That's the orange you got to worry about.

PERINO: I'll be watching. All right, congressman, thank you so much for joining.

CHAFFETZ: Thank you.

PERINO: All right. President Trump's commission investigating voter fraud is running into some heavy resistance. Tonight, the man leading that effort is blaming the media for trying to derail his work. Plus, police say one of their own was assassinated this morning. What you need to know about her killer's violent anti-cop background.

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UNINDENTIFIED MALE: This was an absolutely unprovoked attack on the two officers sitting in this (INAUDIBLE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: Breaking tonight, the man tap to root out voter fraud in America, firing back. Last week, Kris Kobach, the vice chairman on the White House commission on election integrity, who is also running for governor of Kansas, sent a letter to all 50 states requesting voter information. As a result, he and his commission experience some bipartisan blowback accusing the commission of threatening privacy after reports that some 40-plus states stood against his efforts. He issued a statement this afternoon, writing in part, despite media distortions and obstruction by a handful of state politicians, this bipartisan commission on election integrity will continue its work because the public has a right to know.

Charlie Hurt is a political columnist for the Washington Times, and a Fox News contributor, and Zac Petkanas is a former aide to Hillary Clinton campaign. Zac, one of the things that the Democrats have apparently said is that this is unnecessary, and yet you have a lot of people in the country that are worried about the integrity of the electoral system. Why do you think this is an unnecessary commission?

ZAC PETKANAS, FORMER AIDE TO HILLARY CLINTON CAMPAIGN: Sure, all the reason that it's an unnecessary commission is that -- its goal is actually not to look for voter fraud. There is very little evidence that voter fraud actually exists. In fact, more people are hit by lightning in the United States than commit voter fraud. And so, the states are really standing up to this administration for (TECHNICAL DIFFICULTY) consolidation of this information, names, addresses, birthdays, last four digits of social security numbers, in one place, which is a hacker's dream. And the second is how this information is going to be used. Kris Kobach, who you mentioned is running this commission, in the state of Kansas has used this very type of information to purge voter rolls of American citizens who shared names, for example, with undocumented immigrants. So we're very concerned that this information it will be used as a vehicle to do that nationwide.

PERINO: And yet, Charlie, there is concern across the country. In fact, you have President Trump saying in a tweet, numerous states are refusing to give information to the very distinguished voter fraud panel. What are they trying to hide? And one of Kobach's points is that most of this information is publicly available, and that the states that are hesitant are just awaiting to see what all they need to provide. And yet, Charlie, I do want to get your take on this because there are some Republican secretaries of states who are saying, hold on a second, Washington, D.C. is not getting hold of my information.

CHARLIE HURT, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Right. And of course, those Republican governors that have said that, they're kind of taking a states right approach to this, saying, look, man, the federal government screws up everything it touches, you're not going to get involved in this. We jealously guard this part of elections and we're not going to let the federal government ruin it. And, by the way, I applaud that because that's the way the framers intended the balance between state government and federal government.

PERINO: Right.

HURT: But, that aside, you know what, I think Governor Kobach is trying to do here is he's trying -- he wants to audit, it certainly Donald Trump wants, he wants to audit this. He wants to see how bad this problem is. And the point that Zac made about lightning, getting struck by lightning, that's bogus. We actually know how many people get struck by lightning. We have no idea how many people are, you know, commit voter fraud. We do know there's lots of evidence out there. In Virginia, for example, there are thousands of names over the past couple of years that have been found who are illegally on the rolls. And, yes, there have been efforts to purge some of those people, but why wouldn't you want to purge people who don't belong on the rolls.

PERINO: That's a good question, Zac. Why not find some sort of accommodation. This is a bipartisan commission. Surely, everybody can agree that you don't want people who are either here illegally or fraudulently voting to be on those rolls. I mean, isn't that something that you think you could agree with?

PETKANAS: If someone should be on the rolls, and they shouldn't be on the rolls, certainly. But that is not the way this information has been used in the past, certainly in the state of Kansas, or for example in the state of Florida, where they take a list of felons and then they match it against people who are not felons, and if you coincidentally share the same name and you show up, you realize that your name has been dropped off the rolls. That is not trying to make a correct list or a working list. That is an attempt, and I think a deliberate attempt, to suppress the votes, because most of those individuals tend to be members of the minority communities.

PERINO: Well, we'll see. The committee just getting started, they've actually have a meeting on July 19th in Washington, D.C. So we'll see how that goes. Thank you both.

HURT: Thanks, Dana.

PERINO: A parent in Canada successfully registering their child as genderless in health documents. Governor Mike Huckabee is here on the long- term repercussions of such a move. Plus, the cold-blooded assassination targeting one of New York's finest. U.S. troops come home -- I'm sorry, come under attack in Afghanistan. And details of Kathy Griffin's meeting with secret service after her disturbing photo of President Trump. Those stories are next.

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PERINO: Here are the other stories making news tonight.

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(INAUDIBLE)

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PERINO: That was a chilling call for help from the partner of NYPD officer Miosotis Familia, shot in the head this morning as she sat in her patrol car. The NYPD calling the ambush a, quote, unprovoked assassination. The gunman was later killed by police, and we're learning he had a history of vulgar anti-cop rants on social media. Familia, meanwhile, she leaves behind three children. And today, the Pentagon announcing the death of army private, Hansen Kirkpatrick, killed in a deadly mortar attack in Afghanistan that wounded two others. The 19-year-old was hit by, quote, indirect fire, in the Heldman Province, where Afghan security forces are locked in constant clashes with the Taliban. The incident is currently under investigation. Kirkpatrick's commanding officer called him a caring, discipline, intelligent, young soldier.

And finally, comedian Kathy Griffin not laughing tonight after reports claim she was questioned by secret service agents for over an hour, as the agency continues to probe that controversial photo of her holding the bloody head of President Trump. Griffin apologized for the stunt month, calling it a, quote, joke. Now to a case that is most likely the first of its kind. A parent in Canada is now fighting to omit their child's sex from the birth certificate, arguing the child should be able to determine if they want to be identified as a boy or a girl. Watch.

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UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Why is it that you want neither male nor female indicated on Searyl's birth certificate?

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: I don't believe that it's actually possible to get a totally, accurate, 100 percent of the time guess on that question.

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PERINO: Joining us now, former Arkansas governor and Fox News contributor Mike Huckabee. Governor, I'm sure that these parents know -- have the child's best interests at heart from their point of view. It may not be the choice that I make. But is this a situation where we have culture, science, ethics, and religion, all sort of clashing at once, and the government sitting there saying, well, we don't actually make the birth certificates like that?

MIKE HUCKABEE, FORMER U.S. GOVERNOR: Dana, this is a disturbing story on many, many levels. But one of them is because there really is one of two choices. A person is a male or is a female. That's a biological reality. You can pretend that someone, you know, is African-American when they're actually white. You can pretend anything you want. We all pretended things when we were children. But it doesn't change reality. And this is a disturbing trend where parents say that, well, my child can make that decision when he or she is six or seven. I've raised three kids. I've got grandkids. The truth is kids can't decide what they want for dinner. They don't have the maturity to make these kinds of decisions. And there're so many studies -- there is a great article by Doctor Michelle Cretella, president of the American college of pediatricians, in which she argues that this is really a damaging thing to children, it's disturbing.

PERINO: And so, you, as a former governor, if you were looking at this situation in your state, how might have you resolve this because you're talking about parents who love their child, and yet the state actually needs to, I guess, step in here and make a decision.

HUCKABEE: I think we've got to face reality. Sure, these parents, I'm going to say -- I'll grant and stipulate, they love their child, but they may not know how to love them in a way that makes sense for them biologically. Again, you can pretend that your little boy is really a little girl, but he's still a little boy. And unless you go through a gender reassignment surgery and change the biological nature of that child in the bodily functions, and there are many studies that show this is not something that ought to be entered into lightly. And, in fact, if it is, there are serious health consequences.

And even in Sweden, where there is a lot more support for LGBQ activities, please know that the suicide rate is 20 percent higher for transgender individuals. This is not something that people ought to smirk at or laugh about, it's incredibly serious, and a lot of people seem to be just staring in the face at reality and saying, no, it's not boy or girl. It's whatever I wanted to be. Well, I'm sorry, Dana, that's not the way life deals us. It just isn't.

PERINO: Well, it's certainly an interesting case in British Columbia, which apparently is the first of its kind. And I imagine, governor, it won't be the last. This could to be the beginning of a trend.

HUCKABEE: Well, it's already the beginning of a trend. There's a case in point, Katharine Hepburn, when she was a little girl, didn't want to be a little girl. She wanted to be a little boy, she cut her hair off. She went with the name Jimmy because she just didn't like it. Now she grew out of that phase and became one of the leading ladies of our time. But what if Katharine Hepburn had been allowed to just be Jimmy her whole life, that's the things were trying to deal with.

PERINO: A complicated topic. But we're always glad to have you help us think it through. Thank you, governor, and will be right back.

HUCKABEE: Thank you.

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PERINO: Thanks for being a part of The Story tonight on this busy foreign policy day. Tucker Carlson is next. And I'll be back in one hour with "The Five." So keep it right here, and we'll see you back here tomorrow night at 7:00 PM.

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