Bolling: Let's make RINOs an endangered political species

This is a rush transcript from "The Fox News Specialists," August 2, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

EBONI K. WILLIAMS, THE FOX NEWS SPECIALIST HOST: Hey, everybody. I'm Eboni K. Williams along with Eric Bolling and Kat Timpf. This is The Fox News Specialists. We'll get right to our top story today. President Trump along with senators Tom Cotton and David Perdue introducing legislation aimed at cutting down legal immigration into the U.S. The bill aims to downsize current family chain migration and implement a merit-based point system. The bill also focuses on Trump immigration agenda in protecting who he says our American taxpayers and workers who are hurt by the immigration system.


DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: For decades, the United States was operated and has operated a very low skilled immigration system, issuing record numbers of green cards to low-wage immigrants. The RAISE Act prevents new migrants and new immigrants from collecting welfare and protects U.S. workers from being displaced.


WILLIAMS: Cotton and Perdue echoed the president sentiments and praise the bill hoping it would gain traction in the Senate and eventually become law.


SEN. TOM COTTON, R-ARKANSAS: This bill is a sensible, incremental, common sense step toward reforming our immigration system, to make sure that it works for working Americans. It focuses only on green cards, those million green cards we give every year. The most precious thing a person could have in the world, the gift of American citizenship.

SEN. DAVID PERDUE, R-GEORGIA: This is a standard that we've been trying to get to for a long time, and this attempt is basically going to be successful because of one reason, one, it's been proven before and, two, it limits this effort to just the permanent legal resident issue.


WILLIAMS: And just a few moments ago, at today's White House press briefing, CNN's Jim Acosta pressed White House senior advisor Stephen Miller about the immigration bill in a very heated exchange. Wow, take a listen.


JIM ACOSTA, CNN: This whole notion of, well, they have to learn English before they get to the United States, are we just going to bring in people from Great Britain and Australia?

STEPHEN MILLER, SENIOR ADVISER FOR POLICY: Jim, actually -- honestly say, I am shocked at your statement that you think that only people from Great Britain and Australia would know English. It's actually -- it reveals your cosmopolitan bias to a shocking degree that in your mind -- no, this is an amazing moment. This is an amazing moment, that you think only people from Great Britain or Australia would speak English is so insulting to millions of hard-working immigrants who do speak English from all over the world. Jim, have you honestly never met an immigrant from another country who speaks English outside of Great Britain and Australia? Is that your personal experience? That's not what you said. And it shows your cosmopolitan bias. And I just want to say.

ACOSTA: It sounds like you're trying to engineer a racial and ethnic flow of people into this country.

MILLER: Jim, that's one of the most outrageous, insulting, ignorant, and foolish things you've ever said. And for you, that's still a really -- the notion that you think that this is a racist bill is so wrong and so insulting.


WILLIAMS: All right, Eric Bolling, let's see. I'm going to get to Jim Acosta. That was a lot to breakdown there.


WILLIAMS: No, no, I've got to start with cosmopolitan bias because.


WILLIAMS: Stephen Miller, I mean this is a guy who grew up in Santa Monica and went to Duke University. I mean, come on.

ERIC BOLLING, THE FOX NEWS SPECIALIST HEAD: Here's the problem with what happened today. And I'm going to bring this all together right here, Trump came out with an immigration policy that I -- certain parts I don't like, but I think it's really, really important for the country. Merritt-based immigration is fantastic. You have at the top of the list, you have English speaking, highly skilled people, and then you work your way down and you do it that way. I would open it up to more people, but whatever. So he comes up with something, and limiting welfare to people who don't deserve to be on our welfare system. Fantastic, right? Great.

Conservatives are behind it going, about time, awesome. And then, they put Stephen Miller out there to deliver the message and look what we get. We get -- listen, he's a brilliant guy, OK? He's a great policy advisor. He is not a communications person. Don't put that guy in front of the cameras again. And the message gets stepped on because everyone is going to play that interchange with Acosta instead of talking about how great this immigration policy is. They really have to fix their communications department. That should never happen.

WILLIAMS: You've been consistent on that issue, Kat. I mean, that was a lot.


KATHERINE TIMPF, THE FOX NEWS SPECIALIST HOST: It really was. It was a lot. Look, the skills-based thing, a lot of economists say that that's a good approach. My issue is with cutting the number of green cards in half, pretty much all economists agree that that's not a great way to have things work out better for us in the economy.

WILLIAMS: Yeah. Well, there's a lot to break down and we've got much more. But let's first meet today's specialists. He is the chairman of the American conservative union, the former political director to George W. Bush, and the founder of Cove Strategies, a legislative communication and political consulting firm, but obviously he specializes in all things politics, Matt Schlapp is here. He's a nationally recognized teacher who said he wanted a much bigger classroom, so he nationally became a radio talk show host on Philadelphia's talk radio 1210 WPHT, he's also been named one of America's top 100 in Talkers Magazine, and he specializes in broadcasting and politics, Dom Giordano is here. Thank you both for being back with us. And we said before the show, you guys were together the last time too.

DON GIORDANO, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST: We switched places but that's good.

WILLIAMS: Yeah. We like to keep the rotation fresh.

GIORDANO: Exactly.

WILLIAMS: Don, I'll start with you on this. I think Eric Bolling is exactly right. For a very long time, both Democrats and Republicans administration have really failed to address the immigration issue. We have Donald Trump putting forward, but whatever you think of the bill, the first real kind of powerful change in immigration legislation in 50 years. Yet, it becomes a wedge issue now that you insert the way Stephen is setting this up here, in front of the cameras, this issue now around race, and gender -- and culture, rather, and it becomes a wedge issue when it should have been kind of an easy, at least introduction around this issue.

Don: It won't be easy because Democrats will be against it, and the Statue of Liberty was argued about for 20 times a day. My full name is Dominic Joseph Giordano. And if you told me I would be sitting here with Eboni K. Williams and talking about legal immigration and saying I'm on the side to say, yes, cut the numbers, bring in high-skilled people, that's exactly right, I would never believe it. But I've so had it and so is my listeners, with what's going on with illegal immigration. And also, things like diversity lotteries, and things of that nature, and the blue-collar worker America is under fire. And this is something relatively easy that Trump can take apart versus the battle over illegal immigration.

WILLIAMS: OK. Matt, let me ask you this. Many of us thought that the next big policy thing was going to be tax reform.


WILLIAMS: Yeah, a little bit. A little bit. Yet, here we are with, again, what's looking like -- at least starting to be a bit of a wedge device of issue around what legal immigration looks like.

SCHLAPP: Yeah. I want to first jump on what Eric was talking about, which is this is the thing that I'm really excited about with the new chief of staff, a new coms leadership coming in, which when they announced these things, you've got to work your outside allies. You've got to have groups ready to go. They did a great job with the announcement and with sending talking points after the fact, but they didn't build support for this before the fact. That's true on the hill, and that's true with the people who want to be with them. So I think that's just the learning thing they have to go through.

From a coms perspective, do we want to talk taxes, or do we want to talk immigration, or do we want to talk about some of the other subjects that came out that are going to be on this great hour?  And what I would take from a coms standpoint, my wife certainly agrees with me, is if its taxes, let's stay on taxes and let's sell it. And some of these other really passionate issues, they need to wait in line. We can wait in the cube. We've got to take care of them, but you've got to space these things out for the American people. When you throw everything on top on itself, it's harder for it to get pass.

WILLIAMS: And Eric, I'm scratching my head here because we saw what happen with the ObamaCare repeal and replace effort, obviously, failure there. We think the tax reform issue can be a place of buy in, place where the Trump administration can get some legislative points on the board. Yet, it almost seems like the administration, Eric, is more concerned with fulfilling campaign promises, which I'm not mad at. I get that. When you run on something as strong and powerful as immigration you want to deliver, but what about the timing?

BOLLING: Well, look, I think they thought this was. And I do think this is going to be a win for them. People have been waiting, conservatives have been waiting for the immigration reform policy out of the Trump administration. They've been waiting for the wall, some appropriations to start the wall. I mean, this is what he promised to do. I agree with Matt, though -- including the stock market at 22,000, everyone is waiting for the discussion about tax reform. I can't imagine that's not going to fly through. I know there's going to be the fiscal hawks are going to say how are you going to pay for it. There's going to be some fighting going back and forth. But they're going to get that. It's going to be a big, massive, beautiful tax package.


BOLLING: The timing being that they don't want to bring it out, roll it up before the August recess, is that.

SCHLAPP: Look, I'm OK with them talking about immigration. I would have thought it would have been wiser to do some principles and have some events around the country to talk about what a bill would look like, but I also understand that these two senators, Cotton and Purdue, have been great allies of President Trump, and they're ready to get going.

BOLLING: I don't know if Cotton.


TIMPF: This bill -- this is not going to become law.

SCHLAPP: That's right.

TIMPF: Most Democrats have a problem with it. A large number of Republicans have a problem with it. And it's -- I really, really, really resent the fact -- also it became this race-based thing because it's an economic issue. When you're cutting the number of green cards in half, we need workers in this country, and when you add workers, the economy gets better. Yes, for high skilled jobs, but also for the low skilled jobs because we need those workers also.

GIORDANO: It's not helpful, though, to people that are on those low wrongs also. There under pressure from these people you bring in.

TIMPF: There're 5.7 million job openings in this country right now. We should not be cutting the amount of workers, potential workers in half, especially when we have baby boomers.


GIORDANO: What about wages though. What about the wages though of these people? That's a constant issue. They haven't gotten a raise in how long because it can be undercut by people that are here illegally or even people that are coming legal.


GIORDANO: Should the American worker have to compete.


SCHLAPP: Look, the answer to your question, you're exactly right, we should have the immigration policies that give us the workers we need to grow our economy. What's one of our biggest problems in this country is we have people that want jobs, but we have jobs that can be filled because the skills gap is huge. If we're going to talk immigration policy, we also have in this bill -- it should also address the fact that we've got to get the American worker to a place where they can fill those slots.

WILLIAMS: So Matt, that's absolutely a critical part of the economy, this skills gap. And I'm a big proponent of vocational and tech training to get up there. But the other part.


WILLIAMS: Absolutely. But the other part, right, Dom, to your point. There are jobs, let's be honest, that no Americans want to do in this country. Nobody is picking oranges in Florida. Nobody is doing that for any amount of money. So let's be just candid about that.

GIORDANO: They will do it. They have to pay the marketplace -- I mean, there're some jobs, may be a limited number, Eboni, I agree, but people cannot continue to undercut with the wage should be.


BOLLING: Let me put the other hat on here, Dom. Then what happens is you're going to drive up the wages -- that will. This bill will actually if it became law will actually drive up.

GIORDANO: Exactly.

BOLLING: The American wage. But then it will turn around and drive up prices for the things that we're producing.


GIORDANO: Right, and I think you say that to Trump voters. Trump voters would support that. They want Americans to be doing this and they want wages to go up.

WILLIAMS: But they're going to pay more, too?

BOLLING: When you travel around in California, and there's not one -- I mean, not one -- but there's very few Americans who are bringing the vast majority of the produce from the fields to the marketplace, and that's because they just don't want those jobs.

WILLIAMS: Yeah. And those avocados and oranges and all those things go up, up, up.

GIORDANO: This theory, guys -- this theory has now infected the IT field. Now we're hearing the same thing with the visa program and these sorts of things. It's hitting IT workers.


GIORDANO: They're being undercut.

WILLIAMS: That's why I'm making a very important to your point, Dom, distinction between these skills gap issue that Matt is articulating and these kind of lower -- low skilled to say it mildly.

SCHLAPP: Let's go back to it, which is we have to have an immigration policy that isn't race base, right? We have to have -- not that this is, but we have to have an immigration policy that recognizes we want people that want to be Americans, eventually, or they want to be a part of this great experience, this American experience.

WILLIAMS: Opportunity.

SCHLAPP: And -- right. And we need to make sure that we are able to have the economic growth that we need. We have serious issues as a country. When I don't like is the indiscriminate number, that so is this number.

BOLLING: What does this do -- to say this as they were to get this through. What does it do to illegal immigration? Doesn't this force the.


BOLLING: Impetus on people to come over illegally because.

TIMPF: Yeah.

BOLLING: Come here illegally.

SCHLAPP: Here's the beautiful story about the presidential campaign we just ad, if you actually look at the activity on the border, and I think General Kelly deserves a lot of credit.

BOLLING: No, no, I lot of forward though.

SCHLAPP: I get it. I get it. But I get it. But I think the Trump administration is actually making that risk that you take to come here illegally, not so much -- so worth it for people. An I think even with the

legislation that were to pass something like this, I actually think we've got real good control on changing the psychological advantages people saw to come in illegally. I think it's been a fantastic change.

TIMPF: Some people are dealing with things in certain countries where they don't really care and they may try to come here anyway. And there has been less of that with a lot of the rhetoric that President Trump has used. But cutting green cards in half that is going to, I predict, cause illegal immigration to go up. And economists pretty well agree that it's going to have a bad impact on our economy because we need workers. We shouldn't be turning people away if they have exactly what we need. It makes no sense.

WILLIAMS: Right. Much more to come. Coming up next though, it's time to wake up, America. Eric Bolling asks a very important question. Why don't some Republicans want President Trump to succeed? Don't miss it, stay with us.


BOLLING: Time to wake up, America. Arizona Senator Jeff Flake is up for reelection in 2018. So Flake -- the Flake decided writing an anti-Trump book now would be a good campaign decision. Listen senator, I've been traveling the country for the swamp. When you get outside of D.C., New York, and L.A., the real people -- the real Americans love President Trump. So let's talk politics for a minute, senator. Candidate Trump won the Arizona GOP primary with 47 percent of the vote that was more than double his closest competitors Ted Cruz and John Kasich. And now to douse 22,000, a record 153 million Americans are employed. Neil Gorsuch is on the high court. And illegal immigration is falling like a rock. Tough to run against that, senator.

But watch out, Senator Flake, you might find a good strong conservative in your rearview mirror coming up on you hot. P.S., is it just a coincidence that you were born in Snowflake, Arizona, or is the good lord warning us all? Come on, Arizona. McCain and Flake, I know you're more conservative than those two. And then over in South Carolina, there's Lindsey Graham. Now Lindsey has been a front and center anti-Trumper. Aside from pushing back on almost every Trump policy initiative, Lindsey Graham a, quote, unquote, Republican, has been calling for more investigations of President Trump and Russia, even when most Americans are frankly sick of the Russia fake news story. Yet, Lindsey seeks out the television cameras and smiles as he deliver his brand of anti-Trump venom. Hey Lindsey, I just got back from South Carolina. You know what they love in South Carolina? Barbecue and Donald Trump. Now Lindsey Graham is up in 2020, South Carolina, so stay tuned.

This morning, this monologue was going to be about Republican senators getting behind Donald Trump, but I realized they just can't. Their egos are far too bloated to admit the president is succeeding. So now I'm thinking the party will be better without you. You see, senators, we real conservatives want the country to prosper, and maybe the best way for that to happen is to repeal and replace you three bad hombres. Let's make RINOs an endangered political species. I have to go to Matt Schlapp on that, because -- could the party be better without the RINO-type establishment Republican senators?

SCHLAPP: Look, I want to have a national party, which means that we're going to have some ideological differences. So you're specifically are saying these senators that failed to get behind the conservative platform that Trump is putting out there is undeniably a conservative platform, even if you have disagreements here or there. It's undeniable that if Hillary Clinton had won, she would have picked that Supreme Court opening. That alone can change a generation for America.

And so, I would say to these guys, you know, Jeff Flake started out with a really strong American conservative union -- Congressional -- in the house, it moved to the Senates, it's started to lower, and now he's in the 70's. He is really off is game. And really -- I think it's inappropriate for him to say that he speaks for conservatives with this new book. Brent Bozell came out, the son of the person who helped write the first Conscience of a Conservative for Barry Goldwater. I think he really stepped in at this time.

BOLLING: Dom, what do your listeners think when they hear, Jeff Flake, Senator Jeff Flake writing an anti-Trump book that has some really nasty thing to say about the president?

GIORDANO: They think this guy builds himself as a conservative, there might be fraud with this book. It ought to be ceased. They know of him, and that's exactly to Matt's point when they think of this guy. The second thing they think is here's another one of these guys who went the wrong way on health care, etcetera, attacking Trump. The Democrats are in lockstep. What is it that Trump has done that's so far outside what a conservative would do, his mannerisms and all that, put that aside, the policy has been, down the line, conservative.

BOLLING: All right, Dom. The policy, Kat, now let's talk the politics. Flake's up next year, is it a good idea to be writing this book in the year leading up to election?

TIMPF: Well, I suppose we'll have to wait and see how that goes. I think that there are some people who came out against President Trump when he was candidate Trump, and they spent a lot of political capital on that. And now, there in a place where -- they're going to kind of keep riding that. I don't think that every time a politician disagrees with President Trump, however, that it's because of that or that they're betraying conservative principles. I think there's a lot of betrayal of conservative principles going on in the GOP right now. Especially -- I mean, we could not have seen that a little more clearly when it comes to health care, and the health care bill they released that was an insurance bailout plan. I think a lot of that has to do with them being in bed with special interests. It's not always about a vendetta against President Trump.

BOLLING: Forty seven percent, Trump won the GOP primary in Arizona. And I'm not sure that a good political idea to write an anti-Trump book going through your election.

WILLIAMS: Yeah, I going to agree -- actually, you and Kat. I think Kat is exactly right, there's plenty of abandoning of conservative principles to go around within the GOP, but Eric, obviously, politically risky to say the least. I'm not really sure what the long game is for Senator Flake on this, because Trump is very popular. The other senator there, of course, John McCain, I think really just seems to be running away from the president consistently. I don't really know how that's going to play with the base there.

SCHLAPP: Let me tell you, Mike Lee had a lot of criticisms of Donald Trump throughout the election process. He came out recently and said at the Young Americans foundation conference and said, hey, if this is what Donald Trump is going to do, what we've seen over the last six months, bring it on. He's loving the conservative aspect to this agenda. So I think if you look at the policy, it's hard to make a conservative case against him.

BOLLING: But why is there such pushback by this establishment Republican.

WILLIAMS: It's what Dom said. It's not just -- I'm going to say it's not policy.


SCHLAPP: And I care more about the policy and what America needs to get back on track.

BOLLING: Is Arizona -- I'm going to ask you guys very quickly around the table. Is Arizona still a -- is it still a red state or has it gone purple?

GIORDANO: I think it's a red state. Yeah, I think it's a red state.

SCHLAPP: Red to purple. One of these states where a lot of new folks moving down there.


TIMPF: Also, conservative and Trump supporter are not the same thing anymore.

BOLLING: Yeah, I know. If you're not getting behind Donald Trump, you risk. I think you risk losing a Republican seat on the Senates.

SCHLAPP: Dean Heller, I don't think will come back, and I think Jeff Flake is putting himself in a very vulnerable position.

BOLLING: Quick thought.

TIMPF: Not all conservatives support Trump.

WILLIAMS: I do think Flake is vulnerable.

BOLLING: All right. Coming up on this intense news day, the Justice Department is reportedly redirecting resources to sue universities over affirmative action admissions policies. You don't want to miss this.


TIMPF: The Trump administration is taking heat for going after affirmative action. A New York Times report is claiming the Justice Department is preparing to investigate and potentially sue universities for what could be considered discriminatory affirmative action decisions. The report doesn't specify which universities that could be at risk. The DOJ investigations were reportedly target decisions that impacted white applicants. I'm confuse about this from a legal perspective, Eboni, because this already went to the Supreme Court with the Abigail Fisher, and they said that University of Texas, they're allowed to do what they were doing. So what could they be looking for here?

WILLIAMS: Yeah. I think this is a very kind of sexy, salacious headline, and people -- you say affirmative action and other than immigration or couple of other, buzzwords, policy wise. This gets the emotional railings going. But this is actually not that deep, Kat. It's not that complicated. I think what I hear from this DOJ, if it's true, this report here, they're making sure that it's going to be applied the correct way. So they're just making sure. You're exactly right, University of Texas has already affirmed the U.S. Supreme Court position that diversity in the classroom is of value. We do not have quota systems in this country. We have it for over twenty years. People are not admitted on the basis of race, gender, or anything like that. But race and gender can be one of many factors, OK, that is compiled in the student profile. And it's making sure that it's done correctly.

I guess these resources, Kat, in the DOJ are going to make sure that no white students in particular are being kept out of spots because this is being done improperly. So just, I guess, double checking, making sure that the formulas used are appropriate.

TIMPF: Yes, Eric, I would suspect this is something that looks very good for his base. I saw this, and I wondered if it was a political issue because of that Supreme Court decision already happening.

BOLLING: I think Eboni hit on what conservatives are mostly concerned about, that whether they -- we, they agree on whether or not affirmative action is a quote system or not. As long as it's applied properly, you can't really argue -- you can't really argue with it too much. It's when it becomes over affirmative action, when you -- I mean, you venture into strictly a race that's the reason someone gets into a program or...

WILLIAMS: Race or gender.

SCHLAPP: I appreciate -- and I do appreciate your overview on the legal standpoint, but I do think we have to ask ourselves a question. You know, we have a thing at the ACU called the Family Prosperity Index. And if you look at white, rural America, it is a depressing story that's unfolding with the opioid epidemic, with suicides, where people don't feel like they have an economic future, because they can't get the jobs that they need. It is a sad state of affairs, what's happening across this country.

All of these programs, I get it in the wake of Jim Crow, they need to make sure people...

WILLIAMS: No, no, no, but Matt, I think -- I'm glad you're -- can I...

SCHLAPP: But at what point do these stop so that everybody competes?

WILLIAMS: So no, so right now, that's important, what you're saying. And that's one of those many factors. I don't know if you guys have ever seen what the factor list looks like for most institutions. It's about 20 to 25 criteria. Socioeconomic, to your point, one of them, first-time generation. I myself, first-time college graduate, no matter of race. Those students have to be considered.

SCHLAPP: Right, but you have to understand. When you help one person and give them a leg up for one of these slots, you are knocking somebody else back. It's a fact.

WILLIAMS: No, no, it is not a leg up. Because that would be an improper application. What it's got to be...

GIORDANO: I think the Justice Department suspects they are improper. I believe they're improper.

WILLIAMS: Based on what, Dom?

GIORDANO: Based upon story after story that I've done.

WILLIAMS: What stories?

GIORDANO: I don't trust American colleges based upon the mentality. Well, I'll give you an example. How about Asian students?

WILLIAMS: What about them?

GIORDANO: Asian students are, per capita, the most brilliant students out there.

WILLIAMS: You know, most of the times, they have a cap. Do you know that, Dom? You're an educator.

GIORDANO: That's exactly right. They have a cap on Asian students. Now, why would you have a cap, just because people of a certain ethnic background, if they're the most brilliant people there?

WILLIAMS: So can I answer it for you?

GIORDANO: Do we do it in the NBA? Do we do that anywhere else?

WILLIAMS: Let me tell -- let me tell you something.


WILLIAMS: I don't like the cap.


WILLIAMS: But you asked why we have it. We have it because not me but the U.S. Supreme Court -- and you know this as an educator, Dom -- has decided that a diverse, in all the ways that that means something -- economically, socioeconomically, rural versus urban, racial, gender, you have it -- it matters. It helps create a better, sound institution. That's what the court says.

SCHLAPP: But the -- but the legal argument I appreciate. I'm just saying as a country we have to look each other in the eye and say...

WILLIAMS: At what point do we stop?

SCHLAPP: ... is that the way that we want it to be?

I'm OK with these conversations about race and how employment law works and how people are accepted into college. But when you see the backlash on people who don't -- aren't the beneficiary, because they're not diverse enough. In any of these programs...

WILLIAMS: I think we know it's not with race, though, right, Matt?

SCHLAPP: ... I think we have to say it's time to...

WILLIAMS: But that's the prong, right?

SCHLAPP: It's not just race.

WILLIAMS: Let's have a conversation.

SCHLAPP: Let's let the person with the best scores and the best resume get the spot.

GIORDANO: We need more objectivity rather than subjectivity. It's suspect. We need more objectivity.

WILLIAMS: That's a part of the criteria, too. You've got to put your essay -- nobody is going to be a black woman -- trust me, I know this -- with a bad SAT score or a bad GPA and get into University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill or U. Michigan or anything else.

SCHLAPP: And by the way, North Carolina is also not discriminating against anybody, that's absurd.

WILLIAMS: Right. Well...

TIMPF: And also, I think part of the point is this has been decided in the Supreme Court. So...

WILLIAMS: And we look at it every, about 10 to 15 years, Kat. To your point, Matt, when are we going to stop it?

SCHLAPP: Kat, I think it's a live wire. I actually think it needs to go back to the court again.

WILLIAMS: You know, it will go back to the court again.

GIORDANO: It will go back to it, because of what Sessions will do here.

WILLIAMS: It will go back over and over. And we have to revisit it...

GIORDANO: Exactly.

WILLIAMS: ... and make sure that it's still needed. I think that's very important.

GIORDANO: American colleges, suspect.

WILLIAMS: What's that?

GIORDANO: They're suspect.

WILLIAMS: OK. I don't know. What college?

GIORDANO: American colleges.

WILLIAMS: Oh, American colleges.

GIORDANO: I think they're suspect in this issue. And Jeff Sessions does, too, I think.

TIMPF: We'll have to wait and see.

Next up, Osama bin Laden's son wants revenge, and he's looking to wreak havoc on the West.

Also, be sure to check us out on social media. On Twitter, we're @SpecialistsFNC.


BOLLING: Welcome back to "The Fox News Specialists." Our specialists today are Matt Schlapp and Dom Giordano. Let's continue the conversation.

Bin Laden is back. Well, at least his son is. And he's seeking to exact revenge. Osama bin Laden's son, Hamza, is campaigning to become the new leader of al Qaeda and surpass ISIS as the most dangerous global terror group on the planet.

Hamza is a -- is the only son, I'm sorry, of bin Laden's favorite wife. He's believed to be 28 years old. He's described as a crown prince of terror and is also regarded as a poster boy of al Qaeda, looking to claim his father's place as the head of the organization.

I'll bring it around, starting with Eboni. This guy says, 'America, we're coming after you.' And he wants revenge for his father's killing.

WILLIAMS: Yes, well, the last thing we need, Eric, is another war to fight on the terror front. So of course, not good news.

But this is where, you know, I do appreciate President Trump being very consistent, very hard line around this issue of giving the generals the authority they need to figure out the best way to combat this. Whether that's through cyber or whether that's through really any, and keeping all of those options on the table. So whatever we are going to do to be effective on ISIS hopefully will work here, too.

BOLLING: Hey, Matt, how about Saudi Arabia getting involved? Because I think Hamza said he wants attacks in the kingdom.

GIORDANO: He wants to go right after the royal family for their assistance. Look, I think presidents often want one type of presidency and something else happens. And what's going to happen with Donald Trump's presidency is going to have little to do with many of the things we talked about in the first six months, even though I think it's been a good six months.

You look at China. You look at Iran getting a nuclear weapon. You look at North Korea. You look at what's going on with our destruction of ISI, but the way that war will go in other ways. This is really going to dominate. Some people say that North Korea will have the ability to hit us in 18 months. This is what's going to dominate the Trump presidency, and we've all got to be behind him on these big questions.

BOLLING: Dominic?

GIORDANO: Yes, I think so, and not discounting this guy and what his wishes are, I've always thought, and the best experts I've had on -- maybe you guys, too -- that ISIS is clearly the biggest threat we face, because they're not interested in the grandiose, the 9/11 type of stuff. They just say go and kill somebody, and inspire people out there. So I don't know about this guy's background or his resume as a terrorist.

BOLLING: Well, he was 12 when his father was killed.

GIORDANO: His father was killed.

BOLLING: 9/11.

GIORDANO: Exactly.

BOLLING: Right? He exacted the attack on 9/11. And he has now vowed to get revenge on Americans.

Kat, I want to ask you this, because I think you and I might agree on this. Every time you put down a faction of terrorists, they sprout up somewhere else.

TIMPF: Well, first of all, I'd like to say that I am shocked that Osama bin Laden's son turned out to be such a jerk. You know, really...

BOLLING: If you noticed, I said, the one son from his favorite wife.

TIMPF: Favorite wife, yes. Probably one heck of a lady, I'm sure.

But I agree with you totally. It's -- you know, you can take out this group or that group. It's really the ideology that you have to take out, and that's much, much harder to do. And I don't know that we're capable of ever completely erasing that. In fact, pretty sure that we're not. And if we just -- it's been a mess, the more and more we've gotten involved in that region.

It's an ideological thing. You completely wipe out ISIS, that's still not going to wipe out terrorism.

BOLLING: A little different, though, with this guy now saying he wants to attack us.

WILLIAMS: Yes, he's got a chip on his shoulder.

TIMPF: I don't appreciate that. I'm very against that. To the camera? I'm against terrorists attacking us.

WILLIAMS: Yes, certainly. We don't want, like, this generational build-up either, right, where this is just, you know -- coming not just from the ideological standpoint but from a personal standpoint, as well, which I think would make the whole thing even that much worse.

BOLLING: Schlapp, I wonder if the liberals are saying we need to get these people jobs so they won't hate us so much.

SCHLAPP: Well, by the way, that was in the Obama administration. They actually did say these radicalized folks, if they had economic opportunity, maybe this wouldn't happen.

I ran out of the White House on 9/11. This is a war we're going to be in until our lives are over, and we're going to have to take the right steps. And I like what President Trump and his -- and his cabinet are doing.

GIORDANO: That was a big moment. And I think it was Harf. It was one of the Obama people arguing, and I think with a Fox person, in the news type of thing, saying there are not enough jobs there. That's why there are terrorists. And we all know Obama...

SCHLAPP: ... Obama guy, I really do. It was so much fun to listen to their -- how they were going to solve the world's problems.

GIORDANO: Jobs programs, yes.

BOLLING: And don't forget: they also blamed climate change, as well, at one point. It's so hot there that they get radicalized.

GIORDANO: Exactly right.

TIMPF: I've -- yes, I've been pretty hot and sweaty before, but I've never thought about coming becoming a terrorist. Again, not bragging about my morality.

GIORDANO: We'll see what you do in the future.

WILLIAMS: I knew you are one of the good ones, Timpf. I knew that. I knew that.

TIMPF: Thank you. Thank you.

BOLLING: We'll leave it right there. When we come right back, it's time for 'Celebrity Justice' with Eboni K. Williams, giving us the latest on Bill Cosby, Kim Kardashian, and Kanye West's newest legal battle. Don't go away.


WILLIAMS: Time for "Celebrity Justice." So we've got three cases involving some big Hollywood stars. We'll start with Bill Cosby. This is an interesting development in his ongoing legal trial. Cosby's lead defense attorney, Brian McMonagle, is asking to withdraw from Cosby's sex assault case. McMonagle didn't give a reason why, but he did say that his client is taking the necessary steps to secure new counsel in time for the planned retrial later this year.

Eric Bolling, that is a very important step here, because if you want to withdraw...

BOLLING: More proof that he's guilty? Do we need any more proof that he's guilty? I would be running, too, if I was his defense team.

WILLIAMS: I will say, this would be an opportune time, before this new trial comes up, to get out of this thing. It's really hard -- a lot of people don't know -- to get out of a trial, once you've put your name on it as an attorney, because they've got to secure that new counsel. Otherwise that judge will tend to make you stick on this case, which nobody really wants to do.

TIMPF: I'm not a lawyer, but I do know that if I were and anyone, 'You want to defend Bill Cosby?' I'd say, 'No, probably not.'

WILLIAMS: Probably not.

TIMPF: Don't want to do that.

GIORDANO: Well, I'm a law school dropout.

WILLIAMS: I remember this, yes.

GIORDANO: So I have a lot to say here. Exactly right. McMonagle is the best defense attorney in Philadelphia, in the area. I would say most people think, in the country. The problem here is you have these dueling spokespeople and other lawyers who are -- that's why he's dropping out. That's what it is.

SCHLAPP: I'd like to think it's because he has a conscience.

BOLLING: There you go.

SCHLAPP: But maybe he just isn't getting his bills paid. Right?

WILLIAMS: No. I mean, come on, Matt. I mean, at some point, you can't cherry pick your clients, though, right?

SCHLAPP: Yes, you can.

WILLIAMS: If you're a defense lawyer...

SCHLAPP: You don't have to defend Bill Cosby.

WILLIAMS: If you're -- would you only defend innocent people? Would that be your mantra?

SCHLAPP: No, no you're going to give me the legal bar answer here, but I would not be able to walk into a courtroom and defend Bill Cosby. Would you?

WILLIAMS: Yes, of course. I mean, I've been a criminal defense lawyer. So I believe in the Sixth Amendment constitutional right for everybody to have a lawyer.

SCHLAPP: I do, too, and he'll get a lawyer. I'd like him to have a public one.


TIMPF: It's hard to date, though. It's hard to date.

WILLIAMS: What's wrong with that? What's wrong with that?

TIMPF: What do you do for a living? 'I defend Bill Cosby.'

WILLIAMS: I've been a public defender; we work hard for our clients. Trust me on that.

But we'll move on here to Kim Kardashian. She's facing a whopping $100 million patent infringement suit -- my goodness -- over the Lumi cell phone case that she endorses. Now, this case features an LED light for perfectly-lit selfies. But a man claims that he patented that same idea back in 2013.

And we'll get a look here. This is the Lumi case. I have one on my phone. Let's move it up here. Yes. And the funny thing is, I don't even take selfies.

BOLLING: I don't have one.

WILLIAMS: And you've got two phones.

TIMPF: I don't have one.


BOLLING: A hundred million dollars?

WILLIAMS: A hundred million dollars.

BOLLING: This is why we're doomed as our culture.

WILLIAMS: Too much litigation?

BOLLING: Kim Kardashian puts her name on a product, and it's worth $100 million.

WILLIAMS: Yes, that is true.

BOLLING: Because the product itself isn't worth 100 large.

WILLIAMS: No. There she is with the case. It's crazy. But this guy saying that basically, back in 2013, Harouni -- I'll go back to you, Dom, on this, almost lawyer. He says that he had something that was basically the same exact thing. He had a trademark for it, and here she goes with something brand-new. His sales have plummeted.

GIORDANO: I know she's reprehensible, but I've got to go with Kardashian in this. That's my ruling.

WILLIAMS: Yes, you're going with Kardashian. Matt?

SCHLAPP: I'm against Kardashian. I think when you develop -- on everything, by the way.

When you develop your individual intellectual property and that you own it and somebody steals it and you're willing to put your name on that product, she -- it's ill-gotten gains. She doesn't deserve the sponsorship of the product. I'm for intellectual property on this.

WILLIAMS: I agree with that, Bolling.

BOLLING: I already made my case on this.

TIMPF: Yes, I feel really bad for her, because she's so rich that people are always trying to sue her, especially when she works so hard by doing this. To that with one of those.

WILLIAMS: Do the duck face.

TIMPF: I don't have -- yes, I have thin lips. Sorry. I don't have those lips.

WILLIAMS: And that's why I don't have $100 million.

TIMPF: Sorry about that.

WILLIAMS: Exactly right.

So keeping it in the family, we'll go a little Kimye style here. Kardashian's husband, Kanye West...

BOLLING: Oh, gosh.

WILLIAMS: ... also facing some legal issues, the rapper filing a suit claiming insurers failed to him almost $10 million for his canceled St. Pablo tour last year.

So you guys remember when Kanye West was in Trump Tower, right, with Donald Trump.

BOLLING: Right. Right.

WILLIAMS: That was right after he was released from the hospital, I think UCLA Medical Center. And that's really the canceled tour we're talking about.

Kim was robbed in Paris. Kanye, some kind of undisclosed illness. He had to go to the hospital. And then the next stop was Trump Tower. But all those, you know, tour dates were canceled.

SCHLAPP: I don't know how they get by. I'm worried about them. I think you ought to hire Bill Cosby's former attorney. I mean, I'm really...

GIORDANO: Not busy right now. That's right.

WILLIAMS: He's withdrawing off the case. Dom.

GIORDANO: I think if he had insurance, though, all kidding aside, that's why they do it. Because these guys either get a cold or they're finicky, they get depressed or whatever, and they cancel tours. If you want to insure them, you're taking a big risk.

SCHLAPP: Or maybe he was just lazy and didn't meet the specifications in the insurance policy.

BOLLING: There it is, there it is. Right there, Schlapp. You hit it right on the head. Yes, of course, you can have an issue and call on your insurance carrier to pay your problems. However, you better -- you'd better be in that rider. And if it's not, he's out 10 million.

WILLIAMS: Yes, and his insurance company, obviously, Eric, must have...

BOLLING: Didn't he say he was just stressed?


WILLIAMS: That's going to be the argument. Right? Does that qualify? Because you're exactly right. You have got to be in that language, that it qualifies in their policy.

BOLLING: They're out of their minds to insure him.

TIMPF: Yes, I really, really, really feel for this family; and I think that we should all, as taxpayers, be required to subsidize whatever he lost. Because they're not doing well financially.

GIORDANO: Maybe President Trump will be called to testify. That's what you would do as an attorney.

WILLIAMS: Of course I would.

GIORDANO: For the state?

WILLIAMS: Tell me about the mental state of Mr. West. How did he seem...

GIORDANO: West, exactly right. Steve Harvey could be a character witness. I think he was there, too.

TIMPF: I actually like that idea.

WILLIAMS: Well, a lot of people actually said that they felt Kanye was a little bit out of his mind, not just -- well some people said that, for the Trump piece. But just in general.

GIORDANO: Don't give Bob Mueller any ideas.

TIMPF: Special investigation into Kanye West.

WILLIAMS: Kanye West and his insurance, a possible fraud scheme here. It's unbelievable.

BOLLING: That's even better. How's that? They should turn around and, if he did and it's not in there, turn around and sue him for insurance fraud.

WILLIAMS: Kanye West?

BOLLING: Yes. Yeezus.

WILLIAMS: OK, Bolling.

We have to say goodbye to our specialists, Matt Schlapp and Dom Giordano. Thank you for joining us today.

And up next, it's 'Wait, What?' Oh, boy. Don't go away.


TIMPF: And time now for our last segment today. It's time for...




TIMPF: All right, I'm going to start. I remember, I think it was last week, Eric, you did something in honor of your son, who was turning 19. So this is kind of the same thing.

Seven years ago today, I found a little kitty on the street. And he's just a little nugget there, but now he's big. And we've been happy together ever since, as you can see. He's clawing me there.

His name is Cheens, which his original name was Sergeant Pepper, and then it was, like, Pepper, and then Peppercini Pepper. And now it's Cheens. So it does make sense, if you have time to tell that story.

So very, very exciting.

BOLLING: And he's seven?

TIMPF: He's seven. He's seven. He was, like, six weeks old when I found him. He was dying, and he was in terrible shape. And I rescued him and -- from the streets of L.A. And actually, now he has a much better life than any of his brothers and sisters did.

WILLIAMS: Absolutely.

BOLLING: Congratulations.

TIMPF: Thank you. Thank you, guys.

BOLLING: Happy birthday, Cheens.

WILLIAMS: Happy birthday.

BOLLING: OK, so this morning I was in D.C. speaking to a group of amazing young people. Check it out. Young Americans -- Young America’s Foundation. Three hundred chapters across the country, tens of thousands of college and high-school-aged conservatives. And they are staunch conservatives. It was absolutely amazing.

And if you're interested, get involved in this. They own the Reagan Ranch, as well. Get involved in this group, Wonderful group, and really some of the smartest questions I've had in the last four or six weeks of touring with this book. Fantastic.

WILLIAMS: And that's inspiring. Because I think sometimes the younger generation across this country gets a hard time. But many of them are engaged and excited about this.

BOLLING: One of the biggest questions: I'm a conservative on a liberal campus, what do I do?

TIMPF: Yes, I believe it.

BOLLING: Listen, you've got to stand up and be proud of it.

WILLIAMS: You're right.

TIMPF: Eboni.

WILLIAMS: Diversity of thought, we encourage that here at 'The Specialists.'

So this is interesting story. So this is a couple, you guys, got married, disputed a $125 fee. That's their photographer right there, the blonde, and they ended up trashing her business. Free enterprise got her where you're going. For 13 years, she spent building a business. They trash it on all of the sites, Yelp and everything. So she sued, she fought back, she got awarded a million dollars for, like, false, negative ads and things like that for her entire business.

TIMPF: Whoa.

BOLLING: And the issue was that they were using lies, right?

WILLIAMS: Yes, lies. Making up -- making up fake accounts.

BOLLING: You saw the picture and go...

WILLIAMS: She was like, I don't think so. She fought back and got a million bucks.

TIMPF: Don't lie, kids. It's not good to do it.

All right. That's all we have time for today. We thank you all for watching. And make sure to follow us on social media, @SpecialistsFNC on Twitter and Facebook. Remember, 5 o'clock will never be the same.

'Special Report' is next. It's going to be so good. Make sure you watch.

BOLLING: Cheens! Is Cheens watching?

TIMPF: Yes. Cheens is watching. Happy adoptive birth for you, Cheens. I love you.


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