Restoring His Image

This partial transcript from Hannity & Colmes, August 23, 2001 was provided by the Federal Document Clearing House.

Click here to order last night's entire transcript.

Send your comments to: hannity@foxnews.com or colmes@foxnews.com

SEAN HANNITY, CO-HOST: Welcome to HANNITY & COLMES. We're glad you're with us. I'm Sean Hannity.

A busy night tonight. Coming up: Can a flurry of interviews do anything to repair Gary Condit's image? "Talk" magazine's Lisa DePaulo -- she'll join us tonight. Plus attorneys for Anne Marie Smith and Darrell Condit -- they'll also be on board.

And then later tonight, we'll bring you reaction to the Condit interview. It's a special midnight edition of HANNITY & COLMES. You don't want to miss it. We'll also be taking your telephone calls then.

But first, leading our debate across America on this Thursday: Washington intern Chandra Levy has been missing now 115 days. Tonight, after nearly four months of silence, Congressman Gary Condit is finally speaking out about his affair with Levy and his actions during the investigation into her disappearance. Until now, Condit has avoided the media and was less than forthcoming with the D.C. police. Will tonight really be any different for Congressman Condit? Will this be his moment of truth?

Joining us from Spokane, former LAPD detective Mark Fuhrman. From Washington, former D.C. homicide detective Ted Williams. And also from Washington, Fox News political analyst, contributing editor for "Newsweek" Eleanor Clift.

I want to start tonight -- Mark Fuhrman, I'll begin with you. My sources tell me that all my suspicions are going to come true. First of all, he's going to deny and won't answer the question about the nature of the relationship with Chandra Levy. But what an inside source has told me, not only will he do it, but he'll stick to a script, and it'll almost be identical. And he'll talk about how he's been married 34 years to his wife, that he's made mistakes, but out of respect to the family and a specific request to the Levy family, he won't disclose that.

Your thoughts?

MARK FUHRMAN, FORMER LAPD DETECTIVE: Well, first thing, Sean, is why is Gary Condit even in this situation? It's because of the relationship with Chandra Levy. And that relationship being a romantic one that we know usually ends up in a lot of love triangles that end up in a lot of violence

or ugliness, and sometimes even murder.

So if he's not going to admit that, it shows a very -- an incredible reluctance to participate in this investigation. So everything he said in that letter that was published today is absolutely a lie. He has never

cooperated. And if he says to the police that he was involved in a romantic relationship and then he wants to lie to this whole nation -- all we're doing tonight is doing a reelection campaign for Gary Condit...

HANNITY: Yeah.

FUHRMAN: ... to give him the opportunity to try to rehabilitate himself.

HANNITY: You know, Eleanor, we had you on the other night. I told you it would be a prepared script. I told you he'd be studying pamphlets. And apparently, according to my source, that prediction came true, when almost the exact wording is used over and over again -- "I have been married 34 years. I'm not perfect. I'm not going to disclose the relationship out of respect for the Levy family." He says the same thing over and over again. And I understand also -- my sources are telling me he even denies a relationship with the other women, including Anne Marie Smith.

What are your thoughts?

ELEANOR CLIFT, "NEWSWEEK" CONTRIBUTING EDITOR, FOX NEWS POLITICAL

ANALYST: Well, I think anybody in political life or public life understands that the best way to get a message across is to repeat it over and over. That's why, Sean, when you address even this subject, you always bring in President Clinton and his denial of an affair, because you want to convey certain messages. I don't find this in the least surprising. But we will get a half hour, at least -- interrupted, I guess, with some

commentary...

HANNITY: But -- but you know...

CLIFT: ... of what is...

HANNITY: But Eleanor...

CLIFT: ... and we'll be able to respond to what this gentleman...

HANNITY: We will. And America -- but America...

CLIFT: And I...

HANNITY: ... needs to be aware...

CLIFT: And that's all...

HANNITY: ... that this is a performance~!

CLIFT: ... we need.

HANNITY: But on the political question, you -- Dick Gephardt calls him a man of honor! You know, I've got to believe -- well, first of all, he is a humiliating disgrace. I've got to believe America can do better than a man like this that has now just orchestrated what we have witnessed before, which is a massive propaganda and spin campaign!

FUHRMAN: Sean, you know...

CLIFT: Everybody...

FUHRMAN: You know the one thing that's going on here...

CLIFT: ... in public life who has run into difficulties tries to rehabilitate themselves. And frankly, with the exception of O.J. Simpson, I think they all helped themselves. You have made this man an absolute caricature...

HANNITY: He has made...

CLIFT: ... turned him into a monster.

HANNITY: ... himself, Eleanor!

CLIFT: He is now going to be able to...

HANNITY: He has brought the suspicion!

CLIFT: ... present himself in three dimensions and be able to communicate with the American people on his terms. And he should be granted that audience.

ALAN COLMES, CO-HOST: Let me bring in Ted Williams. I have -- I have some -- my own sources. My sources will confirm what Sean Hannity's sources have said, that this is a sham interview. He had some key phrases. Some of the key phrases in the letter are some of the same key phrases -- "I'm not a perfect man" -- that my sources tell me he used in this interview tonight, that he was clearly coached, and he was going to avoid certain topics. Certain things were off the table. He was never going to answer the questions. Why go through this sham exercise, Ted?

TED WILLIAMS, ATTORNEY, FORMER D.C. DETECTIVE: Sean, what you're seeing is...

COLMES: I'm Alan.

WILLIAMS: I'm -- hi, Alan.

COLMES: How can you possibly make that mistake?

WILLIAMS: I'm sorry!

COLMES: Go ahead.

WILLIAMS: Alan, what you are actually witnessing and what we're going to witness tonight is the self-destruction of a congressman. Now, the American people are not stuck on stupid. The man has come out with this sham letter. It's a fraud on the American people. Let's try to be very clear here. Condit will not, in this interview tonight on another channel -- he will not discuss Anne Marie Smith and that affidavit. He will not tell anything about whether he had a physical relationship with Chandra Levy. Try to remember he has never said that he had a physical relationship. It has come out through leaks in the police department.

COLMES: Right. And...

WILLIAMS: This is a fraud on the American people, Alan!

COLMES: And so by the way, we're going to have the attorney for Anne Marie Smith, Jim Robinson, on later, who supposedly sent materials to ABC for this interview. I understand -- I'm not sure they were used or not. I guess we'll find out.

Eleanor, this is a sham. You -- you seem to me to be defending Gary Condit.

CLIFT: I'm not...

COLMES: I'm surprised.

CLIFT: I'm eager...

COLMES: I think it's bad for us Democrats to do that.

CLIFT: Excuse me...

COLMES: I think it's bad!

CLIFT: I am -- I am eager to see this man. I haven't heard him speak. I want to hear what he has to say. I also know that he's going to have an interview...

COLMES: Right.

CLIFT: ... with Michael Isikoff of "Newsweek" magazine...

COLMES: Right.

CLIFT: The questions are not going to stop with Connie Chung. We will have a much greater sense of who he is and what he's about after this. And let the people of his district make up their minds...

COLMES: But he's -- he's...

CLIFT: ... whether they want to send him...

COLMES: He's already had...

CLIFT: ... back to Congress.

COLMES: ... two...

CLIFT: He's been a good congressman. He is guilty...

COLMES: Well...

CLIFT: ... we know, of adultery. He is guilty perhaps of dissembling and not confessing adultery when initially, after that...

COLMES: But Eleanor, it's...

CLIFT: But that's all he is guilty of.

COLMES: It's not just...

(CROSSTALK)

COLMES: It's not just about adultery! It's not -- you keep bringing up adultery. I have said many times during the Clinton saga it's not just about -- you know, adultery shouldn't be a reason to impeach somebody. This is about a missing woman. This is about a woman about whom he would not come forth with information that even now -- and I -- I have sources who've seen the "People" magazine piece. He doesn't come forth there. The interview tonight...

CLIFT: Alan...

COLMES: ... source say he doesn't come forth there. In the letter, he wasn't forthcoming. He's had three opportunities I know of, and he has not been forthcoming in any of them!

CLIFT: Alan, forthcoming about what? He has...

COLMES: About what?

CLIFT: He has one central message to get across tonight, and that is that he is not guilty of any wrongdoing in Ms. Levy's...

FUHRMAN: Oh, I disagree.

CLIFT: ... disappearance.

FUHRMAN: The central message...

CLIFT: And that is all he wants viewers to take away...

FUHRMAN: No, no, no, no! The central -- the central...

CLIFT: ... from this evening.

FUHRMAN: The central message tonight is, "I want to still be a congressman, and I want you people"...

HANNITY: Absolutely!

FUHRMAN: ... "who live in my district to vote for me again."

HANNITY: Absolutely! He's running for reelection! Mark...

FUHRMAN: "So I'm going to try to be like you." He's going to say, "I make mistakes. I'm human. I love my wife. I'm sorry I hurt everybody." Forget about somebody's missing...

HANNITY: All right...

FUHRMAN: ... most probably dead. This is...

WILLIAMS: You know...

(CROSSTALK)

FUHRMAN: ... about Chandra Levy!

HANNITY: Guys, I got to stop you. Hang on a second. Now, we will dissect the letter that he sent out to his constituents when we get back. And also, we have a little bit of insider information, a source of mine will tell us how he answered the question about why he waited till the third interview to disclose the nature of the relationship with Chandra Levy. We'll give you that inside scoop when we get back.

Also coming up later: Will Anne Marie Smith be watching tonight's interview? Her attorney, Jim Robinson, is here. He also speaks out about that.

Also coming up: Darrell Condit's attorney, Jon Sale. And somebody who's been leading the curve on this story, Lisa DePaulo from "Talk" magazine straight ahead on HANNITY & COLMES.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

COLMES: Welcome back to HANNITY & COLMES. I'm Alan Colmes.

Later on in the show: Darrell Condit's attorney, Jon Sale, Anne Marie Smith's attorney, Jim Robinson, and "Talk" magazine's Lisa DePaulo will join us.

Back to our debate.

Mark Fuhrman, I want to put up here a little bit of what was in this letter that Gary Condit sent out to his constituents yesterday. The first part I want to talk about is this. He said, "When Chandra's dad called me to tell me she was missing, he asked for my help. I contacted the police to see if a reward fund would help find her. They said it would, so I started one."

But you know what he did? He left out -- he started that with campaign funds. It wasn't his own personal money. This was money he had in a kitty someplace for a campaign. It was contributors' money that he used for this.

FUHRMAN: Well, and you know, what's interesting about that, only Gary Condit at that time actually knew that he had the closest relationship with Chandra Levy in Washington, D.C. Her aunt certainly knew this. Her mother knew this. So Gary Condit should have certainly said, "I think I can help

you guys out with some of the places that she usually went and the people she went with because I was one of them."

COLMES: Also...

FUHRMAN: That's -- that's when you're concerned about somebody.

COLMES: Eleanor, another part of the letter. He says, "our issues and dedicated my community" -- he's dedicated to his community, to his family, says, "I hope you'll understand that I am not perfect and have made my share of mistakes." Dedicated to his family? This is a guy who's had how many alleged affairs? We believe they might be more than alleged. And he's talking about being dedicated to his family? I mean, that's a sham. That's a lie.

CLIFT: So he's a hypocrite. You know, lots of people are hypocrites. Look, he is trying to finally communicate with his constituents, to turn around his reputation. He is probably the most detested man in America today. So let's give him a chance to try to explain himself. He's going to have to answer some very tough...

COLMES: But you know...

CLIFT: ... questions. His career may have ended simply because he chose to have an affair with somebody...

COLMES: No, but...

CLIFT: ... who may have...

COLMES: Eleanor, that's not it!

CLIFT: ... encountered some wrongdoing.

COLMES: It's not simply that he chose to have an affair! That's not it! It's that he -- he maybe has an affair and was not forthcoming. He didn't talk to the police as forthcoming as he should have.

CLIFT: Frankly -- Alan...

COLMES: It took him to the third interview to acknowledge all he knew to the police. It's not just about having an affair!

CLIFT: No. Yeah, pundits like yourself are real exercised about it, but I don't see anybody from the police department or from the FBI worrying about an obstruction of justice suit or talking about him lying. And he may not...

COLMES: And if they did...

(CROSSTALK)

COLMES: Ted Williams, let...

CLIFT: But this does not -- this does not go anywhere.

COLMES: All right, let's have...

CLIFT: The sad part here is that there is no evidence. There is no evidence at all connecting him...

COLMES: Eleanor, I want --

(CROSSTALK)

COLMES: Ted Williams, go!

WILLIAMS: Eleanor, I beg to disagree with you. Look, the big question is why isn't the United States attorney taking a more focused look at this. This man attempted to obstruct justice.

HANNITY: Absolutely.

WILLIAMS: He hid a box, a watch box. He's told...

HANNITY: Absolutely.

WILLIAMS: ... Anne Marie Smith to lie. What else do we want from this man? This man is...

CLIFT: Because...

WILLIAMS: ... is supposed to be a representative of the Congress of the United States...

HANNITY: Hey, Ted...

WILLIAMS: ... and he's an embarrassment!

HANNITY: Hey, Ted, I agree with everything you said, and they ought to convene a grand jury for the issues of obstruction of which you refer. And I think Mark Fuhrman would certainly agree with that. And I think that's one situation.

Look, here's what my sources are telling me about this interview that took place tonight and what we're going to hear, the sort of spin and the tack that he has taken. For example -- and it's very Clintonian in nature. Asked by Connie Chung, my sources are telling me, "Were you forthcoming about the relationship?" "I answered every question they asked me in the first interview. I answered every question they asked me in the second interview." "But did you offer to them the nature of the relationship?"

And he dodges and he weaves and he ducks.

Ted, that's as Clintonian as you can get!

WILLIAMS: Well, I mean, you know, I don't know about the Clinton aspect, but I will say, Sean, that he is bobbing and weaving. He's on the ropes. I just cannot believe that the American people are going to buy this. Now, one of the questions I'm hoping Connie Chung will ask him, and I think the American people would want asked is, "Mr. Congressman, if you had a daughter"...

HANNITY: Great question.

WILLIAMS: ... "that was missing, the question I would like to ask you -- would you want a congressman to be forthcoming if he had an affair with her?"

HANNITY: Right. That's a great question. All right, let me put up on the screen -- Mark, I want to get to you on this question, and it has to do with -- "Since that day" -- talking about after Chandra's dad had called him, when he said in a letter released to constituents today -- "and every day since," quote, "I have cooperated and worked with law enforcement to find Chandra. I invited the police to my apartment. I asked to help" -- quote, "Despite my best attempts to help the police find Chandra, some have criticized me."

Is that -- is that false?

FUHRMAN: Oh, I think it's absolutely false. If he was trying to...

HANNITY: Seems like a lie.

FUHRMAN: ... help the police, the first thing you do is, time is of the essence. If she's missing or kidnapping, it's obvious. If there's no ransom note, I think we could think the worst in that situation. But

nonetheless, you tell them your relationship with her and anything that occurred.

HANNITY: Mark...

FUHRMAN: An argument between you and...

HANNITY: Absolutely!

FUHRMAN: ... his wife or anything else. Now, there's other things, Sean, here that nobody sees. The time line in "USA Today"...

HANNITY: Right.

FUHRMAN: Very interesting. May 1st, there's four hours when Chandra Levy is on her computer on various Web sites. How we know it's Chandra Levy?

HANNITY: It's a good point.

FUHRMAN: The second question is...

HANNITY: Good point.

FUHRMAN: Second question for Gary Condit -- "Where were you May 1st? Do you have an air-tight alibi?" And the third question is, "Do you have a key to her apartment?"

HANNITY: Great -- all great questions.

(CROSSTALK)

COLMES: ... take a break right there. Eleanor, we've got to say good night to you. We thank you for being with us.

(CROSSTALK)

COLMES: Nice arguing with you for a change tonight.

(CROSSTALK)

HANNITY: ... that Eleanor.

COLMES: Don't go anywhere. Coming up: "Talk" magazine's Lisa DePaulo joins the debate on HANNITY & COLMES. She's with us next. Stay with us.

Click here to order last night's entire transcript.

Copy: Content and Programming Copyright 2001 Fox News Network, Inc. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Transcription Copyright 2001 eMediaMillWorks, Inc. (f/k/a Federal Document Clearing House, Inc.), which takes sole responsibility for the accuracy of the transcription. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. No license is granted to the user of this material except for the user's personal or internal use and, in such case, only one copy may be printed, nor shall user use any material for commercial purposes or in any fashion that may infringe upon Fox News Network, Inc.'s and eMediaMillWorks, Inc.'s copyrights or other proprietary rights or interests in the material. This is not a legal transcript for purposes of litigation.