This is a rush transcript from "On the Record ," September 14, 2007. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, HOST: O.J. Simpson certainly has a knack for timing. His confession, which he claims is hypothetical, hit the book stores today. And talk about hot. This book is selling like hot cakes. It is already number one on Amazon.com. The family of Ron Goldman were awarded the rights to the book and renamed it, "If I Did It; Confessions of the Killer." Fred and Kim Goldman, the father and sister of Ron Goldman, join us.
All right, Fred, totally coincidental that O.J. Simpson is named a suspect today, but certainly you must have a thought.
FRED GOLDMAN, FATHER OF RON GOLDMAN: Yes, you know, it's remarkable. In some ways, it doesn't surprise me. He's someone that just lets go at any given moment and does whatever he feels like. I certainly think it's a coincidence, but it's — it's fascinating that, as always, he just decides to do something and feels justified in doing it. And based on the comments that you've made and the things that he's reported to have said, just another indication that he thinks that he can kind of do whatever he wants and he'll be able to control the status of things every moment of the way.
VAN SUSTEREN: Kim?
KIM GOLDMAN, SISTER OF RON GOLDMAN: You know what? I don't think it's a coincidence. I find it interesting that he's already contradicting what the other people have said. I think it's funny that he says he just walked in, like he rang the doorbell and had cookies with them as he was going in, looking for his stuff. I don't know. I think that, you know, it's a little premature right now to make any formal decisions, but I hope that they follow up and take the right procedures. This is not a case, again, that we want to start jumping to conclusions and...
VAN SUSTEREN: All right...
KIM GOLDMAN: I don't know. It'll be interesting to watch.
VAN SUSTEREN: What I will tell the viewers is a coincidence is that both of you are here because we had long planned the book, which is stunning, number one on Amazon.com. It's (INAUDIBLE) books don't jump up to number one like that. Are you surprised?
FRED GOLDMAN: Yes, I am surprised, honestly. It's a real strange event, given that, you know, perhaps his actions today prompted that a bit. The reality is, I hope that people read it. They'll read more about him. I think the book is telling. I think that his actions are telling. They're all put together, and it's the same person doing the same things over and over and over again, breaking the law, being dishonest. Maybe this time, we'll get lucky and he'll get caught.
VAN SUSTEREN: Kim, let's give the viewers a little bit of a tease about the idea — I mean, the book was actually written by O.J. Simpson and another person, which we'll get to in a second, which is also...
FRED GOLDMAN: Right.
VAN SUSTEREN: ... you know, completely intriguing, maybe a coincidence. I don't know. But the book is in O.J. Simpson's words, is that right?
KIM GOLDMAN: Yes. He sat down with Pablo Fenves, who was the original ghost writer for the book, and basically just regurgitated his whole story, and Pablo went back and put it into book form. And then they went back and forth, I guess, and made some edits, and here we are.
VAN SUSTEREN: In terms of the book, though — and I was lucky enough to get an advance copy to read it — is that — is that — and correct me if I'm wrong — is that O.J. says that all of it is true except for the chapter on the double homicide. Suddenly, that sort of jumps to fiction.
KIM GOLDMAN: Right. I mean, you know, keeping him when he's — he's — I was listening to someone today on one of your shows about him being a narcissist and having a God complex. And you know, it's incredibly consistent. This is his opportunity to just say what he thinks, you know, correct how the rest of us have gotten it wrong, except for this one little part that maybe isn't so true. But it doesn't deviate from the crime and from the evidence.
VAN SUSTEREN: Well, leading up to it in the book, Fred, the part that he says is true, is, I mean, that he acts like the big hero to Nicole, trying to save her from drugs and if only she had listened to him, you know, things would have been so different. She wouldn't have been killed by Charlie and this other person.
FRED GOLDMAN: Yes. Well, he's Mr. Wonderful. You know, he can do no wrong. Everybody else does wrong. And if they do wrong, it's their fault. If they do right, it's with his help. Yes, it's fascinating because he reaches that moment, and he's angry for all the obvious reasons of he's been rejected, et cetera, et cetera. And conveniently, he takes off and brings this perfect stranger with him, according to him.
VAN SUSTEREN: You know, the thing that strikes me (INAUDIBLE) so many things that strike me (INAUDIBLE) but the author, the co-author with him, is someone that we've seen before. He was a witness for the state against O.J. Simpson at the trial.
KIM GOLDMAN: Yes, he was one of the first witnesses, Pablo Fenves, who testified to the wailing dog...
VAN SUSTEREN: The plaintive...
(CROSSTALK)
KIM GOLDMAN: How could we forget that?
VAN SUSTEREN: How could we forget that?
KIM GOLDMAN: Yes. That was a little alarming to us. Honestly, I was shocked by that. And you know, he's an author, and I guess this was a great opportunity for him to sit down, and it was told him as if it was going to be a confession, and he was the appropriate person to write the prologue for this book. It was interesting to read what he had to say about his time with him.
VAN SUSTEREN: And I'll ask you whether or not he believes him or what he thought about him. We're going to take a quick break. Fred, Kim, stand by. We have much more to talk about.
And later: You know their names. They were major players in the O.J. Simpson murder trial, former LAPD homicide detective Mark Fuhrman and forensic pathologist Dr. Baden. They are here. They have read the book, and they join us to compare O.J.'s account from the book with the evidence. That's ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VAN SUSTEREN: Fred and Kim Goldman, the father and sister of murder victim Ron Goldman, are still with us. Now, the author — the co-author of the book with O.J. Simpson, the witness at this criminal trial, did you talk to him at all?
(CROSSTALK)
VAN SUSTEREN: Never talked to him at all?
KIM GOLDMAN: We haven't.
VAN SUSTEREN: Why — the title of the book is "If I Did It." Why did you keep that title?
FRED GOLDMAN: With a small "If."
VAN SUSTEREN: The "If" is real tiny, small. But it — so it's — so it pretty much is "I Did It."
FRED GOLDMAN: Right.
KIM GOLDMAN: We struggled with the title, quite frankly, but we realized that this book, it attached itself to him and to all of the notoriety and people would understand that this was his book. We didn't want anyone to ever think that we had altered it in any way.
VAN SUSTEREN: It's not altered at all.
KIM GOLDMAN: It's the original manuscript.
FRED GOLDMAN: Not one single punctuation.
KIM GOLDMAN: But if you look at it — I mean, it took me some time to get used to this, but I left it on my screen and I kept walking by it, and all I kept seeing was, I did it. I did it. I did it. And that ended up being kind of powerful to me.
VAN SUSTEREN: How many times, Fred, did you read the — I mean, you know, we've all pored through it (INAUDIBLE) book. Obviously, the murder scene in the book is the most devastating. How many times have you read that?
FRED GOLDMAN: I've only read that once.
VAN SUSTEREN: And?
FRED GOLDMAN: I read it slowly. I hesitated reading it the first time I read the book, and then I read it the second time. It's painful because I know that this beast murdered Ron. And he taunts Ron. He suggests that he taunts Ron and makes fun of him, all this after he's knocked Nicole to the ground, of course. It's painful. On the other hand, Ron didn't run and he lost his life because of it.
VAN SUSTEREN: Well, he was also the good Samaritan, bringing the glasses.
FRED GOLDMAN: Right.
VAN SUSTEREN: You know, which is — you know — Kim, in the book, he actually — I mean, this actually — what O.J. Simpson writes is a dialogue with your brother at the murder scene. How many times did you read it
KIM GOLDMAN: I read it — one time, I skimmed it, and the second time, I read it when we were on our way down to Miami, before we had actually been awarded the rights. And I was on the plane with one of our attorneys and I started crying. I couldn't contain myself, and I was so embarrassed. And it dawned on me that I was reading it and thinking, What a cop-out. And then it — the more I processed it, I thought, God, this is — this is what happened and this is what he did, and how dare he taunt him. And my whole feeling was my brother was found with his eyes open, and I have always hated the fact that my brother watched his killer walk away.
FRED GOLDMAN: That was the last person he saw.
KIM GOLDMAN: And so to know that leading up to it, that he was taunting him, that was tough.
VAN SUSTEREN: Fred, Kim, stand by. We're going to have much more in a moment.
And later: In "If I Did It," O.J. Simpson writes that he was joined at the murder scene by a mysterious character he calls Charlie. Is Charlie a figment of Simpson's imagination, or does he actually exist? Former LAPD homicide detective Mark Fuhrman, forensic pathologist Dr. Michael Baden think they know the answer, and they join us ahead.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
VAN SUSTEREN: Fred and Kim Goldman, the father and sister of murder victim Ron Goldman, are still with us. The name of the book is "If I Did It." It is absolutely gripping. If you think you know everything about the O.J. Simpson case, this is something that — you haven't seen it all until you've read this book.
In the book, O.J. Simpson says if he committed this double homicide of your son, your brother, and his ex-wife, that there was someone named Charlie there. What do you think about that?
KIM GOLDMAN: My first reaction was it was his alter ego or his subconscious, or he's crazy.
FRED GOLDMAN: Right. I happen to agree. There wasn't really a shred of evidence to suggest a second person. And this individual — you know, if he wanted to create a hypothetical, he would have had Charlie commit the murder.
VAN SUSTEREN: But — but I guess — you know, like, where's the knife, then? Where are the clothes? I mean, this would have been — this was a perfect way to explain, you know, where — you know, why some of the evidence...
KIM GOLDMAN: Well, he says he gives it to Charlie, and then you never hear about Charlie again. And he tells Charlie to move the Bronco, which...
FRED GOLDMAN: Which he didn't do.
KIM GOLDMAN: ... which he didn't...
VAN SUSTEREN: I mean, they didn't move the Bronco. That's right. That was a fact that was different. He says in the book that Charlie is supposed to move it.
KIM GOLDMAN: Right.
FRED GOLDMAN: Right.
KIM GOLDMAN: You know, we could sit and try to pick it apart, and what I was saying to you off-camera is this is a delusional person. This is someone who's crazy and who doesn't think logically because he's a killer. It's not — I don't know how to rationalize it and read it and try to put logic behind it.
VAN SUSTEREN: You know, I was so — I regret that the cameras weren't in on the civil trial. When you saw that picture — I mean, for a long time, everyone was looking for the Bruno Magli size 12 or 12-and-a-half shoes, whatever they were, and he said that — you know, that he didn't have them and that he wouldn't wear those ugly whatever shoes, he said in deposition. And lo and be hold, there he is, the photograph wearing those shoes.
KIM GOLDMAN: Right.
VAN SUSTEREN: Devastating.
KIM GOLDMAN: Yes. I wish that the civil case was televised only for the mere point of having his testimony be televised because that was — that was telling, to see him on the stand and to see him completely crumble.
FRED GOLDMAN: Yes, different kind of trial.
VAN SUSTEREN: Totally different. In this book, Domenic Dunn (ph) writes an afterword.
FRED GOLDMAN: He's a good friend.
KIM GOLDMAN: Yes.
FRED GOLDMAN: And he's a good friend. He sat next to us during the trial. He had a similar tragedy in his life. His son was murdered.
KIM GOLDMAN: Daughter.
VAN SUSTEREN: Daughter.
FRED GOLDMAN: Daughter. I'm sorry. His daughter was murdered. He's a good man.
VAN SUSTEREN: I suppose that unless you've been through this horrible, ugly experience, you probably really don't get.
KIM GOLDMAN: And you know, we've talked about this a lot. We can't ever expect people to have the same kind of passion...
FRED GOLDMAN: Anger...
KIM GOLDMAN: ... and anger and determination that we do. We are still amazed that people are still incredibly supportive of us and our family and our efforts 13 years later. But you really don't, unless you've walked in it, can truly understand, and we wouldn't wish it on anybody. We're grateful for the support that we have. But it — this — there is something about this that we can't walk away from. I mean, this — we have to do this on behalf of my brother and...
FRED GOLDMAN: If we walk away, it's as — for me, it's as good as saying it's OK, and it's not OK. And the only way we have to punish him is to take financial things from him and make him suffer in that sense.
VAN SUSTEREN: You know, I've been very supportive of (INAUDIBLE) book, and Denise Brown has come out swinging.
KIM GOLDMAN: It's disappointing and it's very sad to us that her venom is so strong against us, as opposed to being against him for writing it and for Justin and Sydney signing off on the deal back in March in 2006. She's in a tough spot. You know, she can't really come out against her niece and nephew. I guess I can try to understand that. But to pass judgment and to criticize us for pursuing justice on behalf of our brother, that's troubling. Our energy should be focused on him and what he did. He put us here.
VAN SUSTEREN: All right. The back of this book — and this picture...
FRED GOLDMAN: My favorite picture.
KIM GOLDMAN: That's my brother and I when we were 3 and 6. My dad took that picture when we were living in Chicago.
FRED GOLDMAN: That's how they were all the time, holding hands!
VAN SUSTEREN: It's unbelievable, isn't it?
FRED GOLDMAN: Yes.
VAN SUSTEREN: Still all these years later, still (INAUDIBLE)
Well, I hope the book sells well because it's just fascinating. And always nice to see both of you, Kim, Fred.
KIM GOLDMAN: Thank you.
FRED GOLDMAN: Thank you.
VAN SUSTEREN: Thank you both.
KIM GOLDMAN: Thank you for your support, Greta.
VAN SUSTEREN: And...
FRED GOLDMAN: Absolutely.
VAN SUSTEREN: ... we'll see what happens in Vegas. All right, thank you.
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