'Special Report' All-Star Panel on the costs of Biden's spending bill

This is a rush transcript of "Special Report with Bret Baier" on September 29, 2021. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES:  We talk about price tags. 

It is zero price tag on the debt. We are paying -- we're going to pay for everything we spend. 

JEN PSAKI, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY:  The president always knew it would be a compromise. That's why he has been engaging with and listening to a range of members on their points of view. Some have expressed publicly that they are not comfortable with $3.5, even though zero, it costs zero dollars. 

NANCY PELOSI, (D-CA) HOUSE SPEAKER:  It's not about a dollar amount. The dollar amount, as the president has said, is zero. This bill will be paid for. 

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL, (R-KY) SENATE MINORITY LEADER:  Democrats want to jack up Americans' tax rates, drain money from people's pockets, spend it on socialism, and then say the whole thing nets out to zero dollars? 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BAIER:  OK, it's not zero. It's just not. There is costs for these massive bills. The bipartisan bill $1.2 trillion. The tax and spend bill, human infrastructure, you want to call that, Democrats do, $3.5 trillion. There are costs to it. Plus, there are programs in there that expire over a certain amount of time, but during that time the people who are getting those programs really would like to keep them. So that's a challenge in the long term. 

Let's bring in our panel, former education secretary Bill Bennett, Byron York, chief political correspondent of "The Washington Examiner," and Juan Williams is a FOX News analyst. Bill, this really is hanging by a thread, and just doing the vote counting, and there is a lot of different calculations on the Hill, it look like the bipartisan infrastructure bill could go down if progressives really say we have got to do the reconciliation bill first. 

BILL BENNETT, FORMER EDUCATION SECRETARY:  I will yield to the closer student of this, Byron, but I expect it will go down. I don't know if it's a threat or the sword of Damocles that's hanging over Nancy Pelosi. She often pulls these things out with a vote or two, but she often has a larger margin than this. 

But if I could just say, a lot of nerve, chutzpah here, the part of the Democrat Party to be pushing these kinds of bills when we are looking at surrender in Afghanistan and what that means, invasion at the southern border, all sorts of other problems internationally. And they want to go and spend money we don't have to increase inflation. It's just crazy. 

BAIER:  Byron, just moments ago, Speaker Pelosi said it's still the plan to go forward with the bipartisan vote tomorrow. We'll see. We'll see. That's still the plan right now. Does the president want to go forward with it? 

You will have to ask the president. There is a lot of iffy wording here about how this process is going to go. But the bottom line is that there is a real battle between moderates and progressives over this. 

BYRON YORK, CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, "THE WASHINGTON EXAMINER": 

Absolutely. And if they put it off again, that will mean they just don't have the votes. But the very fact that Speaker Pelosi wants to vote on this traditional infrastructure bill, the bipartisan infrastructure bill this week, is a surrender for Speaker Pelosi and for the president. 

Remember, not that long ago the president goes out and issues a veto threat for the bipartisan infrastructure bill that he has just encouraged the Senate to sign because it had to be held hostage to this bigger tax and spend bill, the human infrastructure bill, $3.5 trillion. So now cooler heads have prevailed, and Democrats are looking at $1.2 trillion. It has already made it through the Senate. The bottleneck it got through. And if the House can approve it, they have got $1.2 trillion in spending. So it seems very unlikely to me that in the long run, and by that I mean in the next few days, Democrats are actually going to pass up the opportunity to put into law $1.2 trillion in new spending. 

BAIER:  But, Juan, that would be a loss for the progressive side, the progressive caucus, the Bernie Sanders. All the folks who say once you do that, you lose the leverage on the big thing, and they really want the big thing. 

JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS POLITICAL ANALYST:  Right, and so far the problem is that the Democrats in the Senate, well, here I'm referencing Senator Kyrsten Sinema and Joe Manchin, the so-called moderates, haven't said here's what we will buy. And that's the problem. That's the holdup, because the progressives want that number. 

I'm tempted here to quote Will Rogers, Bret, who said I'm not a member of any organized party. I'm a Democrat. And this arguing and the squabbling, it's loud. It's public. At times it's volatile. But this is how sausage gets made in Washington all the time, and the question is whether or not you finally put it into a package and present it to the public. And Nancy Pelosi's time as speaker, most of the time the plane lands and the passengers are cheering. 

But I must say, I agree with my colleagues tonight. I think this is looking very messy, and it's petering, it's on an edge, and it's making a lot of Democrats very nervous. 

BAIER:  There is a lot of shuttle diplomacy between the White House and Capitol Hill, the speaker, the Senate majority leader up in the Oval Office. Staff went to Kyrsten Sinema's office. Joe Manchin has been back and forth. He put out a statement, which was pretty telling in and of itself, saying "All of us regardless of party must ask the simple question, how much is enough? What I have made clear to the president and Democratic leaders is that spending trillions more on new and expanded government programs when we can't even pay for the essential social programs like Social Security and Medicare is the definition of fiscal insanity." This is Joe Manchin. "Suggesting that spending trillions more will not have an impact on inflation ignores the everyday reality that America's families continue to pay an unavoidable inflation tax. I cannot and will not support trillions in spending or an all or nothing approach that ignores the brutal fiscal reality that our nation faces." Bill, that does not sound like a guy who is moments away from being swayed into voting for the big package. 

BENNETT:  No, I don't think so. And I think he is looking at the larger picture and sees the absurdity of this. And, again, if you look at this through the long lens, this is really a ridiculous kind of thing to be proposing given the problems, the immediate problems we are facing and need to address. 

BAIER:  Byron, just wrapping up on these two days of hearings about Afghanistan. The House today, the Senate yesterday, "The Wall Street Journal" writes it this way about the Biden accountability. "The scandal isn't that the president ignored military advice -- he's is the decision- maker. It's his refusal to own his decision. Mr. Biden wants political credit for ending America's involvement in Afghanistan, but he is not willing to take the political risk admitting he overruled the brass in the process. The Afghan withdrawal is the greatest U.S. foreign policy humiliation in decades. The damage is made worse by the failure of accountability starting with the commander-in-chief." We spent two days really getting to that, the thrust of those questions. 

YORK:  Well, I do think the headline from yesterday in the Senate and today in the House is this conflict between what the generals told us, General McKenzie and General Milley told us, and what President Biden told us a few weeks ago in that ABC interview in which the generals say they gave their best advice, which was the U.S. should keep 2,500 troops in Afghanistan. If they were withdrawn, not only could the Afghan defense forces collapse, the whole government could collapse, which is exactly what's happened. 

And then we have the president saying, on camera he does not recall anyone ever telling him that. So this is something the president is absolutely going to have to talk about, and that will mean, as you just suggested, he is going to have to address this, not in a speech to the nation, but sitting down and taking real questions and follow-up questions about what he did, why, and when. 

BAIER:  And quickly, Juan. They are saying, the White House is saying, listen, he is ending this war, although listening to that testimony, the war is not over, and General Milley testified today that in six months, Al- Qaeda and ISIS could regain a big foothold inside Afghanistan. 

WILLIAMS:  Well, that's all true. But I think that going into this week we were thinking there is going to be some huge rift between the military leaders and the White House, the Biden White House. We really didn't get that rift. Nobody threatened to resign. Nobody said that the president acted without hearing what they had to say. And I think General Milley, all the attacks on him for talking to these writers, he came off as saying, you know what, I acted in terms of my command. I acted openly, and I acted in accord with the Constitution. I think the military came out of this looking pretty good. And we'll see what happens in terms of the Biden-Pentagon relationship. 

BAIER:  Yes. We have invited General Milley on SPECIAL REPORT. We will see if he comes. 

Up next, the Virginia's governor's race and what's the latest there. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

TERRY MCAULIFFE, (D) VIRGINIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE:  He's a total wannabe Donald Trump. He has been endorsed by Donald Trump four times. He says he is honored and pleased to have Donald Trump's endorsement. 

He is bought and paid for by Donald Trump. 

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Thank you, Mr. McAuliffe. 

MCAULIFFE:  He wants to bring Donald Trump style politics to Virginia, and we are not going to allow it. 

GLENN YOUNGKIN, (R) VIRGINIA GUBERNATORIAL NOMINEE:  Terry, you just made folks in Las Vegas a lot of money. There is over and under tonight on how many times you are going to say "Donald Trump," and it was 10, and you just busted through it. You are running against Glenn Youngkin. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BAIER:  Republican Glenn Youngkin, Democrat Terry McAuliffe, Virginia governor's race getting heated. It's also very close. If you look at the Real Clear Politics average of polls, recent polls, McAuliffe has a slight lead, but Youngkin has closed the gap. It's essentially tied. Here in Virginia, you can look at the polls, and the president's job approval is now under water. Virginia has traditionally been kind of purplish, more bluish, actually, in recent years. And one moment in the debate last night is already a Republican ad. 

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You vetoed the bill that would have informed parents that they were there. 

TERRY MCAULIFFE, (D) VIRGINIA GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE:  Yes, I stopped the bill that I don't think parents should be telling schools what they should teach. 

I don't think parents should be telling schools what they should teach. 

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BAIER:  That was a big moment. Youngkin jumping on that. We're back with the panel. 

Bill, your thoughts on this? There they are talking about school board meetings where parents stand up and say these books have all kinds of stuff in them and we don't want them in the libraries. That was that back and forth. 

BENNETT:  As you might guess, I have an opinion on that. Can I get a word, quick word on Afghanistan first, since the others did? 

BAIER:  Yes, sure. 

BENNETT:  They keep talking about strategic failure and logistical success. 

We are the parents of a marine. When our son was out in Pendleton, he was supposed to come to dinner with us. He couldn't come because they had lost one pair of night goggles. And the entire platoon and indeed the entire company was grounded because of one pair of night goggles. What's the issue, I said? Logistical failure, dad. Logistical failure. It's not allowed. 

Well, $80 billion worth of logistical failure and equipment, plus 13 dead in uniform, how many left behind, and who are we bringing into this country. Anyway, I just wanted to get that in. It was not a logistical success. 

Yes, with these parents telling teachers or advising teachers what to teach, whose children are they? Who is paying their salaries? This is ridiculous, totally ridiculous. And I hope Youngkin just keeps sticking it to him. 

BAIER:  Juan, this is a tight race and really will be a bellwether for things to come, perhaps, for Democrats. Juan? 

WILLIAMS:  Oh, well, I think -- look, I think that Virginia is turning blue, but it still has a lot of red in it. And I think that Youngkin is spending a ton of money to bring out that red. Now, last night he was asked if he would endorse Trump in 2024, and he said he would. So I think that really plays to the Democrats' strategy. Remember we had a lot of handwringing in California in that race just a few weeks ago, and the strategy there was to say it's the Democrats versus Trump. And I think that's what you are seeing McAuliffe do here. And Democrats are hoping the strategy works again. 

BAIER:  Yes. Roll Call has moved this, I think it was lean Democratic, I think it's toss up now, Byron. They are saying "A Youngkin victory would be a boon for Republicans. It would demonstrate the GOP's ability to win places that Biden carried easily in 2020. It's clear that Biden's standing is having an impact on Terry McAuliffe, and that dynamic would be relevant for the midterms. A Youngkin victory would become a blueprint for the suburbs for GOP candidates around the country." 

YORK:  I think that moment in the debate last night may be a turning point in this campaign. The idea that a candidate says he does not believe parents should tell schools what to teach is going to have a visceral impact. So the question is, is Donald Trump, as a subject, powerful enough to get Terry McAuliffe over the line? Remember when they used to say Rudy Giuliani's presidential campaign, everything he said was a noun and a verb and 9/11? 

BAIER:  Yes. 

YORK:  Well, you can say that with Donald Trump with the McAuliffe campaign. So we'll see if it works. 

BAIER:  All right, panel, stand by. When we come back, tomorrow's headlines. 

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BAIER:  Finally tonight, a look at tomorrow's headlines with the panel. 

Bill, first to you. 

BENNETT:  OK, Republicans break Democrats' streak and win in softball game. 

That's not my real one. My real one is Afghanistan -- Afghanistan revealed

-- colon -- strategic and logistical failure. 

BAIER:  Byron? 

YORK:  Mine is an evergreen headline. Senator Manchin, quote, I'm not there yet. So we can use that tonight or tomorrow night or next week or maybe next month. 

BAIER:  It's a headline for eternity. That's right. All right, Juan? 

BENNETT: Evergreen. 

WILLIAMS:  Biden gives Sinema keys to Fort Knox. He may even offer to move it to Arizona. 

BAIER:  Trying to get it across the finish line, that's right. All right, panel, thank you.

Tomorrow on SPECIAL REPORT, Defcon Congress hours from a true government shutdown. Tensions boil over between the parties on taxing, spending, funding, what will happen next with all these moving parts. We have got you covered up on Capitol Hill and around the world. 

Thanks for inviting us into your home tonight. That's it for this SPECIAL REPORT, fair, balanced, and still unafraid. FOX NEWS PRIMETIME hosted by Brian Kilmeade starts in just a few seconds. Brian, what do you say on that baseball game tonight?

BRIAN KILMEADE, FOX NEWS HOST:  His striking physique and oratorical gifts made him a standout. And in the north, he represented -- oh, I'm sorry, Bret. 

(LAUGHTER)

KILMEADE:  I got your book, and it says advanced reader. 

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