This is a rush transcript from "The Kelly File," May 18, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MEGYN KELLY, HOST: Breaking tonight, Donald Trump takes the lead in a hypothetical matchup against Hillary Clinton, and it comes as Mr. Trump readies for the fight of his political life.
Welcome to "The Kelly File," everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. In the past 24 hours we have seen new reports suggesting that Donald Trump is ready to change his image. Addressing some of his most controversial remarks. Hoping to convince voters, he's not the man Hillary Clinton and her supporters would have you believe. This shift in tone evidenced in my own sit-down with him that aired last night on the FOX broadcasting network. More on that in just a moment.
But first, to the brand new Fox poll that shows Donald Trump now leading Hillary Clinton in a head to head matchup, with 45 percent of the vote to her 42 percent. Trump has seen a 10 point increase since the Fox News poll in April. Thanks to a surge in support from Independents.
And that is where we begin with our chief political correspondent campaign Carl Cameron reporting tonight from New York City. Carl.
CARL CAMERON, FOX NEWS CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Thanks, Megyn. This is an important poll for Donald Trump. Because it shows nationwide in terms of the popular vote, Donald Trump has at least the capacity today in polls to actually beat Hillary Clinton. For us, let's go to the graphics and talk about the internals which show a very stark picture. Forty one percent view Trump favorably. That's a jump of 10 points to his benefit since March. Fifty six percent or a majority of the voters however still view him unfavorably. Clinton's popularity on the other hand is in even worse shape. She's gone down to a new low of 37 percent favorable. And her unfavorable is at a new record, 61 percent. Put a different way, that's almost two out of three Americans who just don't like her.
When it comes to trust and honesty, they're both in trouble. Fifty seven percent in the FOX poll say they do not find Trump honest or trustworthy. Forty percent say they do. Clinton on the other hand is in worse shape here as well. Sixty six percent say, she's not honest and trustworthy. Only 31 percent believe she is. So, with that type of negativity at this point, the candidates really have no political tactic or strategy other than trying to eliminate any candidate of the other candidate from being successful.
And to that end, Trump today took a positive note and tried to boost his own campaign by releasing the names of 11 potential Supreme Court picks. People that he consulted through the Heritage Foundation as well as the Federalist society. These are jurists and people around the country who got a clean bill of health from them. And Trump is trying to do is reassure conservatives and Republicans that they can trust him to at least keep the court conservative. Because otherwise, we are looking at a lesser of two evils election that is going to be one of the nastiest in modern history -- Megyn.
KELLY: Carl, thank you.
Well, in our special last night, I questioned Donald Trump specifically, on some of his more controversial remarks. And asked if anyone had ever hurt him. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: The comment about John McCain, you prefer people who weren't captured, the comment about Carly Fiorina's face. Do you regret any of those comments?
DONALD TRUMP, R-PRESUMPTIVE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Yes, I guess so, but you have to go forward. You make a mistake, you go forward, you know, you can correct a mistake. But to look back and say, gee whiz, I wish I didn't do this or that, I don't think that's good. I don't even think -- in a certain way, I don't think that's health.
KELLY: Has it happened that somebody has done something to you? You know, not a death in the family, but has done something to you to wound you?
TRUMP: I will say this. When I am wounded, I go after people hard. Okay? And I try to unwound myself.
KELLY: Most American parents try to raise their kids to not bully, to not name call, to not tease, not taunt. How can they effectively bring that message, when the front-runner for the Republican nomination does all of those things?
TRUMP: Well, I do it really, you know, I've been saying during this whole campaign that I would counterpunch, you understand that. I'm responding. No. I then respond times, maybe ten, I don't know. I mean, I respond pretty strongly. But in just about all cases, I've been responding to what they did to me. So, it's not a one way street.
KELLY: Stuart Stevens is a former Mitt Romney campaign strategist and founding partner at Strategic Partners and Media. Bill Bennett served as Secretary of Education under President Reagan and hosts the Bill Bennett podcast.
Good to see you both. Let me start with you on this Bill. Your thoughts about the interview and what we saw from Donald Trump?
BILL BENNETT, FORMER MITT ROMNEY CAMPAIGN STRATEGIST: Great interview. Good for you. But particularly good for Donald Trump. Seriousness, a tone of seriousness. You played a couple of excerpts. There were others too. And my guy, I almost fell out of the chair when I heard all quiet on the western front was his favorite book. That's a serious book that a lot of his critics have not read, believe me. But look at the last day. I mean, quite apart from the poll, Megyn, that interview in which I think we saw a seriousness of purpose, seriousness of mind, then the released of these 11 names. I know a number of these jurists. They're almost all first rate. Excellent. He visits Henry Kissinger, it gets hard to continue to say this guy is a bore, this guy has no idea who to talk to. This guy has no serious policy direction. He had a very good day.
KELLY: Uh-hm. Stuart, what did you make of it?
STUART STEVENS, FORMER MITT ROMNEY CAMPAIGN STRATEGIST: I thought it was the interesting side of Donald Trump that you don't get to see. The question is, just sort of as the campaign begins, where is it going to end, his ability to sustain this. Both of these candidates are in a terrible place. They're both ostensibly unelectable. Odds are, one of them will win. So, I think the challenge to Donald Trump here is to really be able to reach out, expand those who voted for him before.
KELLY: Did he make a step in that direction?
STEVENS: I think it's a very likable version of Donald Trump. The question is, you know, being a presidential candidate is all about how you react to stress. And what happened. That was a very un-stressful environment.
STEVENS: You're going to have very, very bad days on the campaign. You're going to have where you get to challenged --
KELLY: What about -- I asked him about why he got so angry after the first debate. He was talking about how he didn't like that question at all. And he thought, that's going on here and that explains his anger he said for, you know, that time.
STEVENS: Yes. I think the biggest challenge for Donald Trump is not to allow other people to modulate how you feel. When you are nice to him, when one is nice to him. He responds the same way. You have to be willing as president of the United States for people to be terrible to you and not respond in kind. He has to show that he can do that.
KELLY: Bill, at the end of the interview he said, I asked him if he doesn't win, will this all have been a waste of time? Or will he have had, you know, any impact on the messaging and he said, it would have been a complete and utter waste. Your thoughts on that.
BENNETT: Yes. It wasn't a commencement address remark, was it? Well, you know, at least we opened people's eyes to new horizons. It would have been a waste of time, waste of money. Candor is what he brings. Look, I agree with what Stewart says, Stuart said he's an expert on this. But, you know, Trump can continue to go in this direction. He can also make up a lot of ground, Megyn by saying, I'm sorry I've been boorish.
KELLY: He didn't seem he's sorry, and he's not going to -- if he didn't say it there in that exchange, where you know, he suggested that he didn't remember the retweets on bimbo and his own tweet using that word. That's what he wants people to believe that he didn't remember it, and then, you know, he came as close as he can.
BENNETT: He came maybe as close as he can. Maybe he can get a little closer, maybe you can get him a little closer. But he can talk about the fact that he's been boorish and doesn't have to be. He can also show that he's not boorish. That is an easier problem than saying, I'm sorry, boring. Which is what Hillary's problem is, and I'm not going to be in the future.
KELLY: The bore and the boring?
BENNETT: Yes. Well, the boorish and the boring. Anyway, he had a very good day. He should learn from this, I hope that he does. We need a serious candidate. And I hope that he continues on this path. So heartened by this 11 people.
KELLY: What do you make of this? Yes. The conservatives really like his Supreme Court picks. What do you make of these polls that show him now ahead of Hillary?
STEVENS: They're good news for Republicans.
KELLY: How important are they?
STEVENS: Well, I think it's important. Yes. I mean, if he was down, we'd say it's important. So, if he's ahead we should say it's important.
STEVENS: At this point against Obama, the last time we had an open election, McCain was seven up. Typically candidates wants to win the nomination, she wins the nomination, would go up by the other side's fighting. So, the real question here I think is for the Democrats, you know, they have a party that's very split now. How are they going to be able to put this together on a unified front?
KELLY: Uh-hm. And we are not seeing that so far. In fact, now they're talking about a possible contested convention for the Dems. Go ahead Bill, quickly.
BENNETT: Quickly. Yes. But Trump's not taking body blows any more from any of the other Republicans. And she is continuing to take body blows from Bernie Sanders.
BENNETT: Both from the supporters and these results. Each one of these results is depressing.
KELLY: Who sees no reason to get out from what we can tell. Gentlemen, great to see you.
BENNETT: No, he's not going.
KELLY: It's a pleasure.
BENNETT: Thank you. Thank you.
KELLY: So, my interview with Donald Trump earning lots of viewers and lots of reviews last night. It was the second most watched show on Tuesday on FOX broadcast in 2016. For that we thank all of you. However, it also earned the scorched of many in the mainstream media because it was not a takedown of Trump. Not surprisingly, many of these very critics failed to disclose their own bias against Trump, against FOX News or against the GOP. Here's just a few examples.
James Warren of Pointer.org writing for Vanity Fair called it as soft as a grape session. This is the same man who dismissed the entire Republican Party as, quote, "anti-female." Erik Wemple of The Washington Post has made no secret of his hatred for Trump calling him a bigot and a misogynist. Wemple wrote that I should dismember Donald Trump. Today, Wemple is upset that I did not, quote, "Get personal about what Trump's behavior has done to my life." As if an interview about Trump should instead be about me.
Hank Stuever at The Washington Post said, I brought too much attention to myself. He found the sit-down uninformative. More informative, Hank's true opinion of Donald Trump who Hank called a quote, "Hateful, nonsensical, vainglorious candidate." Amy Davidson of The New Yorker said I, quote, "surrendered to Trump," who she dismisses as a, quote, "brazen liar." This is the same woman who in January accused Fox News of using yours truly as a debate moderator not for any broadcasting talent but because it's fun to show off the oddity of a, quote, "smart blond."
Joining me now, Howie Kurtz. Howie, good to see you.
HOWARD KURTZ, HOST, "MEDIA BUZZ": Hi, Megyn.
KELLY: Is it possible that some of these folks don't like Trump or Republicans and wanted to see me take him out.
KURTZ: Well, first of all, a high profile interview like this is fair game for all the critics out there.
KURTZ: And I'll tell you what I think in a minute. But it does bother me when critics who despise Trump often from the Left aren't just upfront about that and would not have been happy with any interview that didn't lead him a buttered and bloody mess. Let me throw one more example at you. Slate's liberal columnist Isaac Chotiner who ripped the interview. He's called Trump a bigoted quasi fascist and fraud, a dangerously unstable demagogue. So, of course this is going to slam any sit-down where you didn't take a baseball bat to the guy's head.
KELLY: Correct. And you know, the question I have is, is, would these media figures have the same reaction, would they want a humorless, would they want a tough as nails, would they want a dismembering interview with Hillary Clinton or is it just when it's a Republican named Donald Trump.
KURTZ: Well, I think the question kind of answers itself. Hillary detractors might not have liked it if you had -- and I hope you will have a cordial exchange with her. Look, this was an interview that was awkward at times as you have said when you talked about your rocky relation with Trump. But getting him to express some regret, even use the word mistake as we saw in that clip. It's something that Trump almost never does. It's almost like an apology for him. And at times you got him to share some personal feelings which he's very loathed to do, and at times that was very difficult. And look, some people may not have liked the personality based soft focus interview. They probably wanted a drilldown on the issues. The kind of interview you might have conducted if it was an hour on "The Kelly File."
KELLY: On "The Kelly File." Exactly right. This is a different offering. And the whole show was different which we make clear going into it. I'll tell you this, my own view is this guy Callum Borchers of The Washington Post gets it right again. He's written many things in this election season that I found out very fair. Put it on the board. Hold on. Where is it? Where is Callum? Here it is. He writes this. "Anyone who expected Kelly to shred Trump for his conduct toward her must not have been paying attention to the policy of non-engagement she has followed since his rhetorical assault begin last summer. An angry altercation would have made exciting television, but it would have been wildly inconsistent with Kelly's previous conduct."
That's exactly right. I have not wanted to engage with Trump. I didn't want to engage there. I wasn't going to bring up the bimbo thing. I did not want to make it about me. We had to set that up a bit so people knew what we were talking about if indeed it went there. But I was loathed to get up there and go -- look poor me and what you did to me.
KURTZ: All of these organizations that are saying, well, it shouldn't be about you and Trump. They all wrote pieces in advance that were about you and Trump. Look, one other factor here, and that is, I think during those nine months when he was frequently attacking you on personal terms on Twitter and elsewhere. And you did not personally respond, you obviously talked about Trump on this program, there was an enormous amount of sympathy from the mainstream media for you. That kind of vanished when you dared to have a cordial conversation with Donald Trump and I think that may have changed some people's views.
KELLY: Yes. That's exactly right. But you know, as I said, right from the beginning of this thing, I was never going to love him. And I was never going to hate him. And those who assumed either one assumed too much. Howie, thank you.
KURTZ: Good philosophy for all politicians and journalists. Good to see you.
KELLY: Good to see you.
I will say that time gave a lovely review. There was one. He said some lovely things. I'm going to hold on to that one tonight when I go to bed.
What did you think, let me know @MegynKelly on Twitter and Facebook.com/TheKellyFile.
Well, Trump's new poll numbers are not just up in general. They are also up with women. At least among Republican women.
And up next, we have a powerful panel of women in politics with what we may be seeing here and why. Here they are. They are coming on over.
Plus, Mark Zuckerberg today met with some of the best known conservatives in the country. And two of the folks in that meeting tell us how Zuckerberg answered to claim a bias at Facebook.
And then the Democrats are so divided that party insiders are now publicly worrying the Democrats convention this summer could wind up looking like Chicago in '68. We will investigate.
KELLY: Have you made any mistakes in this campaign? You have said publicly you thought the retweet about Heidi Cruz was a mistake. Let me just--
TRUMP: Well, I said I could have done without it to be exact. I mean, I could have done without it. I guess you could say she's fair game because she's very much involved with the campaign. But I don't know, she just seems like a nice woman.
KELLY: But that -- you didn't like her looks.
TRUMP: You and I were having our little difficulty. You probably had some pretty nasty tweets sent your way.
KELLY: You retweet some of those. Not just the fans.
TRUMP: Yes. But not the more nasty ones. You would be amazed at the ones I don't retweet.
TRUMP: Well, there was a retweet. Yes. Did I say that?
KELLY: Many times.
TRUMP: Okay. Excuse me. Over your life, Megyn you have been called a lot worse, isn't that right? Wouldn't you say?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: And I said it's not about me. It is about young girls and women and the messaging. Even before my interview with Trump last night, questions about his treatment of women have been all over the headlines. Following a less than flattering front-page article from "The New York Times" that suggested the businessman has crossed the line with the number of women. Some of those women has since denounced "The Times" piece, one in particular, and now Donald Trump's daughter Ivanka is also coming to his defense. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: There's another woman who was quoted in the article that says that Donald Trump groped her at a, you know, at a meeting, at a business meeting.
IVANKA TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S DAUGHTER: Look, I'm not in every interaction my father has, but he's not a groper, it's not who he is. And I've known my father obviously my whole life, and he has total respect for women.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Your dad loves to tweet. And he's called women crazy, he's called them crooked. That's what he calls Hillary Clinton. He's even used the word bimbo. Do you ever look at those tweets and say, dad, no, tone it down a bit.
IVANKA TRUMP: I've certainly thought that certain things should be toned down. But not necessarily in relation to that. When I think about myself as a feminist, it's important that women are treated equally. And he treats women and men equally.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Joining me now, Katrina Pierson. Trump campaign national spokesperson. Kellyanne Conway who's founder and president of the polling company. And women trend. And was head of a pro-Cruz Super PAC. And Bethany Mandel, senior contributor at The Federalist who is not exactly pro-Trump. Great to see you all. Thank you so much for being here.
BETHANY MANDEL, THE FEDERALIST SENIOR CONTRIBUTOR: Thank you, Megyn.
KELLY: Let's start with that that he's a pro-opportunity offender, Bethany.
MANDEL: Yes. I mean, when you look at what he says about men and women, he gets personal and he gets sexual and it gets nasty with women in a way that it doesn't get like that with men. I've never seen a comparable term when he's disagreed with a male journalist calling them the male -- bimbo. Or discuss something equivalent to their menstrual cycle. These are very specific sexually disturbing targets, that are very unique to the female condition and being a woman. He thinks that that's a weakness and he hits it.
KELLY: Kellyanne, is she wrong?
KELLYANNE CONWAY, THE POLLING COMPANY AND WOMAN TREND: Yes, I disagree with that. I think you have to look at the full measure of the man. And Donald Trump can claim things about women that frankly Hillary Clinton, now his opponents can't, Megyn. He's employed thousands of women. He gave this woman Louise Sunshine has been over the news the last couple of days, he gave her a shot in real estate in the 1980s or so 70s --
KELLY: Can I asked you a question?
CONWAY: When no woman had that opportunity.
KELLY: I feel like there's no dispute about that. Right?
CONWAY: But it should be more important. It should be more important.
KELLY: OK. But let's get to that next. But I feel like Trump's record of employing women and promoting like Barbara Res to the top of construction in his company at a time when nobody doing that with women, that is undisputed even by his worst critics, it's the messaging about women, the focus on their looks, the sexualization of them. That's what gets women. Like thinking, why is he telling me I should lay off the damn candy?
Well, no --
If I want to eat the candy and you will keep your mouth shut about it.
CONWAY: Look, I think he even -- I think you got him to break new ground and make news last night frankly. And that he did sort of step back and say, maybe I would choose words a little bit differently. I think that's a level of humility. And frankly that's a father and grandfather speaking. I have three daughters. I don't want them to be talked about that way. But I would like them at some point in corporate America to have the kind of opportunities that he's provided other people. And I think you can see in these most recent polls, Megyn that women are starting to make their own judgment. There's still going to be a saturation for America's women of negative information about Donald Trump --
KELLY: It's happening now. Priorities has his ad out of his voice being mouthed out of women's mouth --
CONWAY: And it breaks no news. And by the way, I think it's un- coincidentally coming out at the same time as the New York Times article. Much of which has been disputed. I think they were a little over their skis on that article.
KELLY: But what do you think Katrina about, I mean, we're starting to see Republican women slowly but surely re-evaluate Donald Trump. The latest poll show that he's up 10 points with them just since March. Here's the number. He's at 65 percent approval from Republican women. Up 10 points from just March. And that was before when we saw him in the interview with me, sits down with Henry Kissinger today. Releases a Supreme Court, you know, Bill Bennett was saying, this is the beginning of Trump's signaling, just something different, not abandonment of who he is but something different.
KATRINA PIERSON, TRUMP CAMPAIGN, NATIONAL SPOKESPERSON: Right. And we've seen these numbers go up from the beginning of the Republican primary with women particularly -- I've been saying, Mr. Trump has been able to close those unfavorable gaps in record time. If you haven't seen the criticism of male journalists. You probably should check its Twitter feed because it's definitely there. Younger women today, which is what Hillary is struggling with, they're not really focused on the emotional aspects. And that's why the Clinton campaign is really turning women off. This type of old fashioned feminism where it was supposed to be about encouragement and empowerment and ambition and now it's about victimization. And you have to make me feel better. And women don't want a therapist for a president, they want a commander.
KELLY: They also don't want to be insulted based on their gender.
PIERSON: But they're not insulted based on their gender. Mr. Trump's criticism is very pointed, it's -- and he's a counterpuncher. He's not embracing this whole concept of women and Ivanka Trump said it best.
KELLY: But he goes to the women's place. I mean, he raises the point about certain issues that only women have, that, you know, he allegedly made a comment about. And certainly the bimbo comment. Those things and like the comment about, you're not a 10, and if you're flat chested you can't be a ten. It's like this is stuff that even if you like Trump, it's like, would you stop making comments about women's breasts and all the rest of them.
MANDEL: Yes. I mean, I think the most disturbing comments have about really been about sexuality. What he said to a celebrity apprentice contestant, you would look better on your knees.
MANDEL: When I heard that, my skin actually crawled a little bit off me. Like that's -- and even when he's trying to be complimentary, he still sounds scuzzy. When he talked about his daughter Ivanka and said I would date her. That's creepy to say. It seems like he has no sort of vocabulary for women that does not revolve around their sexuality and their justification.
CONWAY: Not that you hear 24/7. I mean, let's be fair. I think cherry picking, first of all, I think we all agree that certain things are disturbing. However, if you're going to cherry pick a tweet or cherry pick a half of comment and see that as the full measure of a man, I think that's unfair. And well, this is why that if the Clintons want to re-litigate what Donald Trump said in the '80s and 90s. Then they better be ready for having the whole Clinton --
PIERSON: But part of the problem, part of the problem is what she just said because Donald Trump did not say what she just said. So, we do hear Mr. Trump being quoted improperly and out of context. More importantly, particularly when it comes to policy as well.
KELLY: Whatever comment has been interpreted by different people different ways. But let me ask you this, because Hillary, one of the questions is going to come up about her about whether she sat by and let James Carville talked about, drag this $100 bill through the trailer park.
PIERSON: Bimbo eruptions --
KELLY: Bimbo eruptions. Did she stand up and say don't talk about women that way? You know what I mean, it's not to compare her conduct to Trump's exactly, it's been different.
KELLY: But does she have clean hands? You ask me if I ever called a woman a bimbo, if I've ever done that in my entire life, the answer is, I have not. And I never would. Could she say the same? I don't know.
PIERSON: Well, probably not. And for that reason, because we've heard all of these stories. And these women are speaking out. I want to see CBS call Kathleen Willey or Juanita Broaddrick, they can get their stories because this is what they want to focus on with Mr. Trump. Those women are fair game. Because we're not talking about Bill's conduct here, we're talking about Hillary Clinton's conduct and it's completely relevant.
KELLY: So for the record, not only did I ask Trump that debate question at that first debate, but I have had Kathleen Willey on the show, so there.
All right. I got to go. It's great to see you.
MANDEL: Thank you.
CONWAY: Thanks, Megyn.
KELLY: Good debate. So, we also have a sneak peek from an explosive behind the scenes report on the Trump campaign. Written by a man who spent the better part of five weeks embedded sort of with the businessman's team. And we have both that reporter and Eric Trump here to react to the news next.
Plus, Mark Zuckerberg trying to convince conservatives that there is no bias at Facebook against them. And we'll speak with two of the folks who met with him late today in a "Kelly File" exclusive. And you're going to know these folks. You're going to know them very well.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Everyone's lives are touched by Facebook. So, it's really important that Facebook adheres to some kind of standards of being fair.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Welcome back. We got new reaction tonight from an explosive behind- the-scenes look at the Trump for President campaign.
Over the course of the critical five-week period, from early March to mid- April, New York Times magazine reporter, Robert Draper, embedded with the Trump team trying to capture the chaos and the contender in a unique way.
He wrote up the results in a nearly 7000-word piece for this weekend's "New York Times" magazine with Mr. Trump's wild ride, "Down the homestretch with the impossible nominee."
Here to weigh-in in moments is Eric Trump, Mr. Trump's son and campaign adviser. He has a cameo in the story but first, we go to Robert Draper, writer for the "New York Times" magazine.
Robert, great to see you. Thank you for being here.
ROBERT DRAPER, NEW YORK TIMES MAGAZINE WRITER: Thanks for having me, Megyn.
KELLY: All right, for those who haven't read it, what is the headline? What's your takeaway?
DRAPER: Well, I think the headline is that Donald Trump is the manager of his own campaign. He's the communications director for his campaign. He is in charge of everything in his campaign for better and for worse, and so these notions of trying to curb Mr. Trump, trying to make him more presidential, trying to land a more conventional scheme to his campaign haven't worked and not because of the incompetence of members of his campaign, but because that's the way Trump wants it and Trump, for better and for worse, has been Trump throughout.
KELLY: There was a moment where they brought in Paul Maniford to manage the conventions and people thought that he was replacing Lewandowski as the campaign manager.
You talk about a moment where Trump kind of put him in his place when it comes to managing the media. Tell us about that.
DRAPER: Sure. There was a press release that Trump wanted to put out relating to a woman named Cheri Jacobus who the Trump campaign had briefly considered hiring as a communications strategist.
He had written a few untoward tweet, shall we say, about Ms. Jacobus who then threatened to sue for libel. Trump wanted to counterpunch as he tends to do. Paul Maniford called in after having read the draft of the press statement, pleading with Trump not to put it out there and Trump using a colorful word said, don't tell me how to do PR, and the statement did go out.
KELLY: What do you think is the biggest revelation in the piece? I mean, what do you think is the most explosive piece of information?
DRAPER: Well, I mean there are a few things that, you know -- again, as you know Megyn, I mean, Trump is, you know, charmingly, maybe charmingly, maybe outrageously uncensored and he said some things to me, for example, when I asked about -- when I asked him where is the most dangerous place in the world that he visited, he joked first and said Brooklyn, but then he said, actually Oakland and Ferguson are two of the most dangerous places in the world.
And I found it to be unusual because for a man of his wealth, I think he actually has a fairly constrained view of the world and to suggest, let's say, Mogadishu and Oakland might be comparable. You know, might strike some people as a little bit bizarre.
KELLY: He also made news of you on the subject of abortion. He had had that moment with Chris Matthews, where Matthews asked him whether a woman, getting an abortion, if abortion were made illegal, should be punished. This is what he has told Matthews.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHRIS MATTHEWS, POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Do you believe in punishment for abortion? Yes or no as a principle.
D. TRUMP: The answer is that there has to be some form of punishment.
MATTHEWS: For the woman?
D. TRUMP: Yeah, there has to be some form.
MATTHEWS: Ten years, what?
D. TRUMP: That I don't know.
MATTHEWS: Why not?
D. TRUMP: I don't know.
MATTHEWS: You take positions on everything else.
D. TRUMP: I do take positions on everything else. It's a very complicated position.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: He later walked that back and with you he changed it even more. What did he tell you?
DRAPER: Well, what he said to me was, what he meant to say was that women already punish themselves and so that there shouldn't be any kind of jail punishment for them because they are already essentially flagellating punishing themselves for having committed an abortion.
Now, Trump, after he made those remarks, went offstage and his campaign team said perhaps we could talk about this, he said, no, I think it's just fine. And it was only when he was besieged with media requests, not only by members of the media but also by CEO's, did Chris Christie's political staff actually draft a message that kind of threaded the needle between the pro-life movement and the concerns of women. So ...
KELLY: So you're telling me he walked off that stage, it was flagged for him as an issue and he was like, no, I don't want to change it?
DRAPER: That's what I'm telling you. Yes.
KELLY: Fascinating. Great job. Thanks for being here tonight, Robert. All the best.
DRAPER: Sure thing.
KELLY: Joining me now with more, Eric Trump. He's been on the campaign trail with his father and he's the executive vice president at the Trump organization.
Eric, good to see you. So, what do you make of that, that your dad stood by that very controversial statement until he was, you know, sort of hit with the advice of many campaign staffers saying, you cannot stick by that.
ERIC TRUMP, DONALD TRUMP'S SON AND CAMPAIGN ADVISER: I think it's refreshing, right? How many of the candidates you see every single day and they're being coached by 400 different people and they talk in these little generalities and sound bites and nothing they say has any meaning. Everything's so scripted. You know, everything's so censored.
I mean, here's a man who speaks from the heart. Here's a man who likes to control his campaign. Here is a guy who spent 1/20 of what every other candidate has spent and he's a Republican nominee. I actually ...
KELLY: That's not really on point because Trump's unfiltered nature is something that people love about him but what happened here was he said something really dicey.
And it sounds like the Christie people and others advisers are saying, you have got to walk that back. And what he ultimately -- first he said, no, I'm good, and then he did walk it back. He actually completely reversed himself on it and then actually came up with another explanation in this piece. That's what the reporter is saying.
E. TRUMP: Yeah, I think that's part of being a candidate. Sometimes mistakes are made, and you know, sometimes things are said and you're up there on stage. He's not reading off a teleprompter, remember that, Megyn. And he's out there ...
KELLY: What does he actually feel? That's what we're trying to get to. What does he feel when he said to Chris Matthews which he stopped by when he walks up the debate stage or what he said in the statement which reversed it?
E. TRUMP: I think it's a really tough issue. I think it's a really personal issue, right? I'm not a guy that talks about social issues. It's not -- that's not my job. I build hotels all over the place but I think it's a personal issue and I think it's a tough issue, and he spent a lot of time talking about, you know, the exemptions.
And he spent a lot of time talking about the nuances of that position. It's a difficult one, I mean, it really, really is. And I think he see people struggle with that issue every single day including, quite frankly, people who have been in politics their entire life. It's a very, very personal issue.
KELLY: And what did you make of -- you run the hotels which is good. Golf courses also are such great cool things, but what did you make of the story about your dad, the reporter is talking about how he runs his communications and he's done such an effective job with the media, about the whole John Miller, John Baron thing?
E. TRUMP: My father does run it, that's who he is, right? No different than he ran the hotels, no different than he ran the golf courses. My father likes to be merely involved in the details and I saw that thing and you know, I saw the miller thing and quite frankly didn't sound like him.
Even if it was him quite frankly, it's was 40 years ago. Listen, when I saw it, it didn't. Even if it was, it was 40 years ago. I don't hold much relevance to the whole thing. I think it's actually nice to see somebody that is intimately involved.
Again, it's the difference between somebody who is who's very macro and somebody who is very micro and somebody who actually is a doer versus a dictator and somebody who's a delegator.
I think that's refreshing. I mean, I want to see the person in the White House ultimately. I want to see that person be a doer. I want to see that person take action as opposed to kind of sub it out to a million different people. That's the father I know, and that's the man that's become an enormous success.
KELLY: I got to run (ph). We are four seconds with a heart break. Eric Trump, great to see you, sir.
E. TRUMP: Thank you, Megyn.
KELLY: Stay tuned. It's Facebook next.
KELLY: Breaking tonight, we are getting a firsthand account of a highly publicized meeting between Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg and several high profile conservatives.
The meeting today came on the heels of a bombshell report, claiming that Facebook intentionally prevents conservative stories from trending on its popular site.
Joining me now, two people who sat face-to-face with Zuckerberg today, Dana Perino, co-host of "The Five" and former White House Press Secretary under George W. Bush, and Tucker Carlson who's co-host at "Fox & Friends Weekend" and editor-in-chief of The Daily Caller.
Great to see you both. You look adorable. You look like you're getting ready to go to the senior prom together. Your parents are going to pick you up in a limo behind us.
DANA PERINO, FORMER WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY FOR GEORGE W. BUSH: And by senior you mean old. Senior mean old.
KELLY: You look like 16 tonight. It's amazing you were White House Press Secretary at 13.
OK, let's dive right in and figure out what happened at this meeting. Let me start with the headlines. He hasn't yet admitted any fault. In his most recent statement he went out there and said, we have no evidence that this report is true, which has led to websites like "The Federalist" to say, you guys are being played. He's using you for cover so he can say, I met with the conservatives, there's nothing to worry, and that you were but pawns in his game. I'll let you take that one, Dana.
PERINO: I didn't get that sense. They still maintain in their investigation they do not have any direct specific evidence and that it's against our policy.
But I will tell you this. From the mood of the meeting, they definitely don't think this is a joke. They didn't think this meeting was just a cover your you-know-what with the Conservatives and placate them.
I found them to be pretty genuine and sincere and that they acknowledged that they have a trust problem with a significant portion of their customer base and that they were trying to figure out a way, at least a first step, to open a dialogue so that they can try to fix it in the long run.
KELLY: Tucker, you actually run a Conservative website, The Daily Caller.
TUCKER CARLSON, THE DAILY CALLER EDITOR-IN-CHIEF: I do.
KELLY: You were one of the victims in this case, if in fact they're doing it. Were you persuaded that they're going to do something differently?
CARLSON: I'm persuaded to worried. I run a business that's highly reliant on Facebook. Is anybody who does online news is and -- so I understand the power.
I mean, look, they are far more powerful as a disseminator of news than first or any of the newspaper of the early 20th ever was. They're the most powerful ever. They're self-aware enough to know that, they're self-aware enough to know they have a huge problem with Conservatives who don't trust them.
Secrecy is the heart of what they do. The algorithm is obviously proprietary. You don't know what's in it but you have to trust them in order to play along with them.
So yeah, they get that they need to do a lot of work to persuade conservatives. The case we made in part was look, everyone who works at Facebook probably comes out of a similar culture and shares the same set of political presuppositions. Is that a problem itself? Is it an airless room? And they sort of acknowledge that yeah, maybe that's a problem.
KELLY: It's tough to find a bunch of Conservatives out in Menlo Park, Dana? I mean, they are going to have to draft from like the middle of the country if they want to fill the rink with Conservative-leaning young people. But the question is whether - really, how can they fix a problem they don't acknowledge exists?
PERINO: I think there are a couple things, Megyn. This issue that sparked this meeting was really just the straw that broke the camel's back.
There were a lot of concerns raised tonight that had nothing to do with the particular issue of the trending topics which is that issue, was Facebook - - do they have some contractors that were suppressing Conservative viewpoints and news in order for Liberal viewpoints and news to rise to the top?
That was a specific issue that brought us all here. But that really wasn't just the concerns. I actually think on that side of things, as we were listening to them, that part of the business is relatively new, the news feed that everybody uses everyday that's about 10 years old, it's very mature.
But the trending topics thing is new and they know that they have a lot of work to do. There were lots of concerns raised about their policy on community standards, who gets blocked and for what.
And what was interesting is I saw and Tucker that we were kind of pushing on an open door because they recognize that they have a problem. And it's based on trust. It takes years to build this trust and just a moment to lose it.
The thing that Tucker said is true as well which is that you don't have a lot of other places to go right now, so Facebook is this very popular platform that a lot of people are using, and that there was, I think, a willingness from Conservatives to say, we know we need you. But you need us too.
KELLY: That's true. Conservatives have very high interaction on Facebook and Fox News, in particular, has very high interaction on Facebook. But let me ask you Tucker, can you ...
KELLY: ... because Glenn Beck was there. Were you all in there together or was it just -- how does it work ...
PERINO: I got to sit by Glenn Beck.
KELLY: ... and what's it like in the room?
CARLSON: That's the interesting question, and unfortunately, we're bound by this. We've agreed not to be specific about who said what.
KELLY: That doesn't count.
CARLSON: Let me characterize it this way. A group of Conservatives is as united as the Republican party is right now, which is not very and so it ran the gamut. You had a couple of people including some well-known people that basic kind of sucked up -- you're so wonderful, we're so glad to be with you.
And then you have other people who have asked questions. But the problem is that Conservatives basically don't believe in the kind of action that would force a business to comply.
So a Liberal group would show up, we're going to boycott you, we're going to call you names, we're going to hold you before the rest of the committee. Conservatives also, by definition, don't believe in using the power of government to crush businesses they disagree with.
KELLY: Love you guys both. Enjoy the prom.
PERINO: Bye, Megyn.
CARLSON: Thanks, Megyn.
KELLY: Be responsible. Thanks for doing this.
CARLSON: Be responsible. Drive safely.
KELLY: So the fight between Bernie Sanders and Hillary Clinton has become so ugly that party insiders are warning the Democratic Convention could end up looking like Chicago at '68. That story is right after this break.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. DIANNE FEINSTEIN, D-CALIF.: It worries me a great deal. You know, I don't want to go back to the '68 convention because I worry about what it does to the electorate as a whole and he should, too.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: How about that? Chicago '68. Ten thousand protesters running headlong into 23,000 police and National Guard members outside of the DNC in Chicago. The results were ugly.
This weekend, rowdy Bernie Sanders supporters shut down the Nevada State Democratic Convention. The scene there evoking bad memories of chaos that rock the democrat convention back in '68. Trace Gallagher has the report live in L.A. Trace?
TRACE GALLAGHER, LOS ANGELES FOX NEWS: Megyn, by the time Bernie Sanders arrived here in California last night, the very mention of Democratic party leaders brought a loud chorus of boos and obscenities from Sanders supporters who believe the democratic primary system is rigged.
That feeling was never more apparent than at last weekend's Nevada Democratic State Convention, where debates over how delegates are divided led to shouting and angry demonstrations.
On California Democratic Senator Barbara Boxer appealed for calm, she was booed off-stage, later saying she feared for her safety. And the Nevada Democratic Party chair actually did get death threats.
Sanders issues a statement that condemned the violence but it mainly called for change in the party establishment, quoting, "If the Democratic Party is to be successful in November, it is imperative that all state parties treat our campaign supporters with fairness and the respect that they have earned."
Senate Minority Leader Harry Reid called Sanders' statement "silly" and the Democratic Party national chair accused the Sanders campaign of adding fuel to the fire. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. DEBBIE WASSERMAN SCHULTZ, D-FLA., DEMOCRATIC NATIONAL COMMITTEE CHAIRWOMAN: I understand that there are people that would like to fan the flames and, you know, distract from our task at hand. That plays right into the Republicans' hands.
We're going to be united and we're going to come together and I'm very confident about that.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GALLAGHER: Others believe this nasty tone will carry into the Philadelphia Convention and on toward election day, hurting the party's chances of keeping the White House and winning back the Senate. So, while Hillary Clinton has an almost unbeatable lead in delegates, she's also leading a party with deep divisions. Megyn?
KELLY: Fascinating. Trace, thank you. Tomorrow night we'll have Bernie's campaign manager right here. We'll be right back.
KELLY: Big announcement to share tonight. I have a new book coming out in the fall. Thank you, thank you. It's called "Settle for More," my life motto.
Ever since I heard Dr. Phil years ago say the only difference between you and someone you envy is you settled for less.
I was not a happy person then, in my personal life or professional life and I resolved to settle for more.
The book shows how I changed my life with plenty of laughs and some tears and lots of amazing times here at Fox News along the way.
And I will also speak openly about what happened in my life during the dustup with Donald Trump this year, offering details I've only shared with my husband, thus far.
You can preorder it now wherever books are sold. It hits stores November 15th. And I will also show you how I did this. I don't have it quite right.
"Settle for More". See you tomorrow at 9:00.
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