Schumer applauds Trump as NRA pushes back

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Schumer applauds Trump as NRA pushes back

President Trump winning some rare praise from the Senate's top Democrat for signaling he's open to changing our nation's gun laws; reaction and analysis on 'The Five.'

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," March 1, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

Another meeting on school safety at the White House today as congress moves to take action. President Trump winning some rare praise from the senate top Democrat for signaling he's open to changing our nation's gun laws.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SENATE MINORITY LEADER CHUCK SCHUMER, D-N.Y.: I'd like to give credit where credit is due. The president has a lot of things right yesterday. He seemed to strongly endorse universal background checks, to ensure that people who shouldn't have a gun don't have access to one. Importantly, the president acknowledged that taking meaningful steps to improve gun safety is going to require bucking the NRA. So, the meeting and the president's comments were an encouraging step.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: Schumer unveiled a three-part gun control plan from Democrats today. He insists a ban on assault weapons be part of the senate debate. Marco Rubio pitched his own set of proposals, including confiscating guns from those who pose a trust. President Trump supports that idea, but not the NRA.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)

PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I like taking the guns early, like in this crazy man's case that just took place in Florida, he had a lot of things, they saw everything. To go to court would've taken a long time. Take the guns first, go through due process second.

DANA LOESCH, NRA SPOKESPERSON: There's a way that you can respect and protect due process and protect the rights of millions of Americans, while also hardening the schools and keeping kids safe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: So Greg, Senator Schumer said that they will introduce a bill and that they expect that it's possible -- I'm sorry it just came in, so I'm reading off my phone, could pass Schumer's proposal with mostly Democratic support and a few Republicans encouraged by President Trump, your thoughts?

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Not going to happen. That bill isn't going to happen. I can safely say that any -- with that language, it's not going to work. I think what President Trump was trying to get at, and he used imprecise language, is he's talking about a database for what he calls the crazy guys. A database where if school officials and police officers notice something wrong, it's not about due process, actually that is the due process. They say this person is a threat, but he hasn't violated any laws yet. But they say --there needs to be a database for that. Where that person goes and then you figured out later. But at that point, there's no gun. And it's in a civil court, so there's a low bar and you can go and get a judge to get, you know, through a court order. I think that's what he's getting at, but I don't know.

I think that's a smart move because I think that makes sense. Along with hardening soft targets in dealing with the mentally ill, these are all practical things. I think what the Dems are doing, which is very smart, they're piling their other stuff on there and they're saying they're lauding him. Whenever you get praise from a liberal, you should be very worried. But, I think we've talked about this before. If there's a Republican who moved to the middle, you know it's going to be Trump because he's a populist. When a populist here's somebody saying don't take away my guns, they'll say I'm with you, and then if somebody else's says get those guns away from those creeps, he'll say I'm with you, because a populist is with the popular opinion. And if the population has two different opinions, he will say yes to both of them.

PERINO: Well, I think what's happening too is that -- Jesse, there's a conversation happening in Washington, and that conversation might not actually lead to legislation, but there is movement in the state. So, for example, Rick Scott, the governor of Florida, they passed a law to increase the age to 21 in terms of purchase, and he's going to dedicate $500 million to harden -- to all the schools. That's a huge commitment for a state when you can spend it on a lot of other things.

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: That's an enormous commitment and he's feeling a lot of heat down there in Florida. It looks like he's doing the right thing so far. I do get nervous when crying Chuck endorses something. It makes me run on the other direction. But in this case, I think what the president, when he was using imprecisely language as you would say, it's a gun violence restraining order. So if someone hasn't committed a crime or hasn't been involuntarily committed to a mental institution but is killing animals and acting crazy and beating up his mother, is a mess, like the kid was in Florida, you go to a judge, there's due process, you say let's prevent him from buying a weapon or taking the weapon away.

Rubio supports this legislation. I don't see anything wrong with that in terms of the promise program they want to redo. These cops were dealing with this violent, ridiculous person down there causing mayhem and they weren't treating him like a criminal. Sometimes you have to treat an 18- year-old high school kid like a criminal and stop suspending him and putting him in timeout, and maybe, actually, make him pay the price. The background checks, I can agree with. I think that's common sense. It's all about sharing information. Whether you're suspended for violence, whether it's a crisis at your house and you've been called -- the police 55 times or whatever it is. Put that in some sort of system and make sure everybody has access to it. The raise in the age limit, I'm still a little wishy-washy. I haven't decided yet. I see on the hand you don't want an 18-year-old person, maybe to get a gun. But at the same time an AR -- the same time that wouldn't have prevented most of these mass shootings. Most of these mass shootings are people above 18. And if you're a hunter, if you like sports shooting and you're in our rural state, why deny them their constitutional right. I don't get that.

PERINO: Juan, is there something that the Democrats are seeing either on focus group or polling or gut instinct that they think this is an issue that it's right now for them to be able to put forward this law and say, well, we might be able to actually pass it?

WILLIAMS: No, to the contrary, I mean, the politics of gun control in this country are pretty clear, which is its most Americans who favor, as Jesse just said, universal background checks, closing gun show loopholes, going after assault weapons -- it's gun owners and non-gun owners. But.

WATTERS: I didn't say going after assault weapons.

WILLIAMS: OK. No, I'm saying that.

WATTERS: OK.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: Most Americans favored doing away with assault weapons. But the thing is, gun owners are single-vote type of people. I mean, they will vote on a single issue and that's guns. People who favor of gun control are not single issue voters, and therefore their opposition is diluting. But in this moment, what the young people down in Florida leading the way, I think you're seeing a shift in opinion. And the question is whether or not the shift is on the right. And I think that's why, pretty much like Greg said, Senator Ben Sasse in Nebraska said the president is reflecting the last person to talk to him. And you have people like Breitbart saying, oh, it's Trump's gun grab. So you see the people on the right reacting as if, oh, my God, what's Trump doing. But people on the Democratic side or on the left are like, well, let him do what he wants to do. But he's got a fight among people who supported him in 2016. And even with the plans that he's put forward, can it get 60 votes in the senate without strong Republican support? Can it get 218 in the house?

PERINO: So that's why -- Kimberly, why I said that maybe -- I'm not saying legislation can't pass this year, but it is unlikely I think that it would pass this year. But in the states you're doing things -- you're seeing things. And also the market is sort of dealing with some of this. Yesterday, Walmart said it would no longer -- that it was raising the age limit to 21 for its stores. And also, Kroger said the same thing, which I always -- I didn't know they sold guns there. I thought that was a grocery store.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Something you said I found to be very interesting, which was maybe there is a bit of a shift, and perhaps, maybe, in some sense on the right. And certainly, we're seeing a little bit with the president. He's trying to be very open-minded. Listen to both sides. Evaluate the situation because, perhaps, with the young people that were so personally and tragically affected by this, it has changed a little bit of the tone, the willingness to listen, to try to do something better because it's not politicians, although some of them were motivated in certain ways by different parental ideology and whatnot. That's what I think people are listening. Well, it's not this congressman, or this Republican, or this Democrat. It's people who were there, experience loss, and tragedy, and suffering, and they're being real in terms of how they experienced it, and genuine in terms of wanting to do something about it. Even the first lady commented on that. She says the children are using their voice and they're trying to get it out there to do something so it doesn't happen again to somebody else. And that's why, I think, you see the president making the shift.

PERINO: Yesterday, Michael Hamman, he's the legislative counsel for gun owners of America, Greg. He said, talking about the president, we believe he's gone from -- in his own words, the second amendment's best friend to the gun grabber in chief. And that, had Trump not run on support of the second amendment he would not be president of the United States today.

GUTFELD: Those could both be true. We knew this when we talk on The Five. He had very, I would say, center liberal beliefs for a long time about guns. And then he went -- he knew what he knew who he had to please. But this is what it's like when you get a populist. And for better or for worse, people are very pro-populist but you never know what the next day is going to bring because it's based on popular opinion. Here's my concern. What worries me as we're going to end up punishing law-abiding citizens. Not just in guns though, but in other arenas. For example, if you think -- if you decide to rig the system to make it harder for legal -- law-abiding citizens to get guns. You're not targeting the actual troubled -- the nuts, right? The civil tax system target the people who need to be targeted. You put them in a database. I'm seeing this happening with opioids right now. Donald Trump talking about suing -- the government suing pharmaceutical companies. So they're targeting law-abiding citizens because of a tiny percentage of abuse, right? They're going to go after the companies that create the drugs and they're going to go after -- they're going to make it harder for cancer patients and people with illnesses to get opioids because there's abuse. There's a small amount of abuse. It is a parallel argument to guns. The overwhelming majority of people who have guns are law-abiding citizens. The people that use legal medications are law-abiding people with cancer, with pain disorders. We are punishing people by creating -- by going after the system than actually going after the system abusers.

WILLIAMS: Well, I think we are going after the idea that there's been such a proliferation of guns in American society.

GUTFELD: So there have been medications. But do you see my point? There's a proliferation of legal medication.

WILLIAMS: There's a difference between a medication that actually has a purpose in terms of healing your body.

GUTFELD: A gun has a purpose.

WILLIAMS: Well, gun may have a purpose in terms of, you could say, self- defense for example, right?

GUTFELD: Right. It is.

WILLIAMS: What I'm saying to you that in other society people are able to defend themselves, and we have a problem with mass murders in society.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: My argument is that when you get the gun owners of America, which is to the right of the NRA. Don't forget that. They're more radical than the NRA on guns. So they are now putting pressure on the NRA. So, can the NRA say, you know what, Mr. President -- apparently that's what he said they told him in the lunch. We're willing to do something. We understand we want to make our nation safer, our children safer, as Kimberly was saying. But can they say that out loud without getting, you know, whiplash from the gun owners?

PERINO: We'll have to see. We'll keep talking about it, of course. Ahead, Vladimir Putin calls on the world to listen up to his big nuclear announcement.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUILFOYLE: Vladimir Putin loves to flex his muscles. And today, he did so again, propping up Russia's military might in his annual state of the nation address. He now claims his country has nuclear weapons that cannot be intercepted, rendering NATO's missile defense system as useless.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUSSIAN PRESIDENT VLADIMIR PUTIN: Russia was and remains a big nuclear state. But no, no one wanted to speak to us constructively. No one has listened to us. You listen to us now.

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: Any use of nuclear weapons against Russia and its allies, small or medium or any strength, will be perceived as a nuclear attack on our country. The response will be immediate and with all due consequences.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: The Pentagon says it's watched Russia's advancement of nuclear missiles for a very long time. And the White House commented today.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SARAH SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: President Putin has confirmed with the United States government has known all along which Russia has denied. Russia has been developing destabilizing weapons systems for over a decade, indirect violations of its treaty obligations. America is moving forward to modernize our nuclear arsenal and ensure our capabilities are unmatched.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: OK. So this was big news today. And you saw throughout the networks talking about Russia's nuclear capability, whether or not the United States has an adequate and up to speed defense system against some of these missiles. And that's one of the things that President Trump is trying to do is to get us up to speed, because in large measure what people have credited having this kind of mutual respect situation with Russia because we have the capability to do something about it and to prevent against it. We'll go to you, Mr. Russia.

GUTFELD: All right. Well, I am Mr. Russia, as you know. Russia will never change. We knew this. It is why Ronald Reagan was way ahead of his time with SDI.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, strategic defense initiative.

GUTFELD: Everybody on the left and the media thought SDI -- they demeaned it, they called it star wars. I wish we pursued that. But there is a difference between Russia and the rest of the world. It's called rationalism. They understand the concept of mutually assured destruction. It's a concept that all rational actors around the world understand. You're not going to blow us up. We're not going to blow you up. So let's just call the whole thing off. However, there're people who seek to end the earth for the promise of heavenly reward. They are not rational. ISIS is now spreading to other vulnerable regions around the globe. There's nothing more dangerous than a toxic ideology that regenerates indefinitely. And it's OK with destroying the world because to them that's a reward. There's no mutually assured destruction argument with them. That's scary. So we have to think beyond missiles from Russia, start thinking about cyber terror, which is a big deal because that can make you think there's a missile attack, and the attempt to paralyze our power grid, which would cause us to turn on each other. There's a reason why internet billionaires in Silicon Valley, billionaires buying land and moving to New Zealand.

GUILFOYLE: All right. So Dana, what did you make of Putin's comment? And then, so that you could comment on the United States readiness (INAUDIBLE).

PERINO: I think, in the last eight years, we had a president who really wanted to try to believe that there could be a nuclear free world. Like, that's the goal. And it's just so unrealistic. And the military -- Adam Kinzinger, the congressman from Illinois was on my show today. He said we are not prepared. And I said, well, that's not very reassuring. Although, he did say that our defenses could overwhelm Putin, so it's not that big of a deal. I do think that Putin is feeling a lot of heat. He has an election coming up. And obviously, he's going to rig it. But, he looks pretty small because if you think about -- ten days ago on February 7, the United States military absolutely kicked his rear end in Syria. There were many Russian mercenaries that were sent to Syria. They were basically doing terrible things to innocent people. We went in and took care of that. And the oligarch that's involved with all this Mueller stuff was in actually in charge of those mercenaries. So there's a lot of stuff going on here.

And I think what Putin was trying to do with this announcement -- who knows if it's even true, but that he was trying to make it look like the country of Russia is bigger and better than it actually is. In every single area of its economy, all around the world, their geopolitical efforts, the things they try to do here that they didn't succeed in in 2016, all of those things make that country look really small. But internally, he has to make it look like he's so big. One thing that's changing though when those social media posts started going up after those mercenaries were killed, he can't stop that. And so, he has to figure out a way to try to prevent people from getting information. And the best was to help the people of Russia is to get them more information.

GUTFELD: We should hack Putin's election so Trump wins.

(LAUGHTER)

GUILFOYLE: Now that would be clever. Some of the people would like to send him over to Russia, right, Juan? OK. So what do you make of this, Jesse?

WATTERS: This is Putin flexing. I agree with both of you guys. This is for domestic consumption.

GUILFOYLE: This is the new bow-flex?

WATTERS: Yes, right. Although, only Juan wants to see Putin's shirtless. The basic premise here is they've designed these tactical nuclear weapons where they can avoid a straight line. It doesn't go in a straight line so it's harder to defend. That's fine. The missile defense system that we have in Anchorage, Alaska, and in Eastern Europe, mostly designed for one or two missiles or from rogue regimes. They've always felt it was a threat to them. It kind of was to a certain extent. Like Greg said, if they're going to shoot six, we'll shoot seven. We're all dead. It doesn't matter. We're both rational actors. This is going to cost the Russians a lot of money. They don't have a lot of money. So I think this is a waste of money for them. But this is all about prestige and Putin wanting to be back like he was during the cold war. President Obama scrapped our tactical nuclear weapons, took them off the warships. And now, President Trump said we want to design two new tactical nuclear weapons, one on a submarine, one on a navy warship. And I think that was a response to President Trump's design there. It's funny to hear the Democrats not say much about this. You know, when there's a few bots around causing trouble, it's a cold war.

GUTFELD: Right.

WATTERS: Now they want to spend billions on missiles that can take out the entire country. I haven't heard Adam Schiff say anything. I haven't heard crying Chuck say anything. Where are the Democrats when there's an actual threat to national security from Russia? I'll let Juan respond.

WILLIAMS: I'll be glad to.

GUILFOYLE: How generous and benevolent of you.

WILLIAMS: But the thing about it, Kimberly, is I love listening to him.

GUILFOYLE: You have become very Zen lately.

WILLIAMS: Well, the thing is, you just got to let the man have his moment.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, I think to both of you want his mom on your side. So you feel like strength in numbers.

WILLIAMS: That's a good point. By the wat, I think it was Hillary Clinton who was tweeting this very day, and I believe she's a Democrat, about the president's failure to go out Russia and Putin by having violated.

GUTFELD: You know why she did that.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: He said nothing in terms of giving direction to the U.S. government to prevent a repeat of Russian interference in the next election. I think you guys are right about Russian insecurity. I think this is now the defining characteristic of all of Putin's rhetoric. He said in his comments, and I thought this was the towel, he said you have failed to contain Russia. Then he starts talking about the size, how these cruise missiles can defeat our -- you know, you forget, Jesse, it was President Obama who put, as a result of NATO and Poland being in it, a nuclear type of defense there. That aggravated Putin. That's what started all of the invasion of Ukraine and the rest.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: OK, fine. But here's the thing. I think that you have to understand that, going back to what Dana was talking about, this attack on U.S. forces, that Putin is pushing, if he had captured Americans. Boy, if he is testing President Trump's oath that he's going to get out of Syria. We'll see what happens.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Attorney General Jeff Sessions dining out with his top aides after he got a very public thrashing from President Trump. Was he trying to send a message or was he just hungry? Next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WATTERS: Jeff Sessions was publicly lambasted again yesterday by the president over his handling of the investigation into alleged surveillance abuses by the FBI. But the attorney general didn't lay low. He was spotted dining at a restaurant in D.C. last night with his deputy, Rod Rosenstein, and solicitor general Noel Francisco. Congressman Jim Jordan siding with the president against Sessions, calling for him to bring on a second special counsel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JIM JORDAN, R-OHIO: There was serious wrongdoing done at the FISA court. At least, all indications of that took place. That's why you need the investigation. The only one that can do it is a second special counsel. Appoint a second special counsel, Mr. Attorney General, and let get on with this and get answers to the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: Jordan is among 13 GOP lawmakers who signed a letter asking for a second special counsel. Greg, you weren't here yesterday when we talked about Sessions versus President Trump. What do you think about the drama?

GUTFELD: There are pluses and minuses to transparency. The plus is you learn more about government than any poly-side class. I know more about Donald Trump that I know about my first cousin. I mean, nothing more transparent. The minus is it's often like that couple that quarrel in public that -- if you ever go to a restaurant with a couple and they argue in front of you, you're just like, oh, God -- It's worse than when you're in a fight when you're watching other people fight. It's just like, "Oh, my God."

But he -- what we do know is that Trump vents, and then he leaves it up to us to figure out, on the spectrum of priority, like, how important it is. I would call him a bit of a diva.

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: Takes one to know one.

WATTERS: OK. Juan, second special counsel to investigate the FISA abuses? I mean, we know about the abuses. We know there was fraud perpetrated on the court. We know a political document was used to get a wiretap, and the court was deceived about who paid for it. Do you think that justifies -- oh? Do you think that justifies a second special counsel?

WILLIAMS: Is this a leading question, counselor?

WATTERS: I would -- I would agree.

WILLIAMS: No, I mean, I think that what Jeff Sessions said yesterday is, you know, he's going to -- as long as he's there, he's going to conduct himself with integrity and according to the laws of our country, our Constitution. And to me, that was a hell of a put-down for your -- the man who put you in that position as attorney general. A

But I mean, at this point, to go to dinner at Central with Rod Rosenstein.

WATTERS: Where did they go?

WILLIAMS: Central.

PERINO: Central.

WATTERS: I like how you say that.

GUILFOYLE: He's a D.C. insider, so he's got all the news.

GUTFELD: It's French for "center."

WILLIAMS: You know what's funny? It's right across from the Trump Hotel. Literally.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, yes.

GUTFELD: Well, he couldn't -- Sessions couldn't get reservations.

WATTERS: Sorry, it turned into a (UNINTELLIGIBLE)

WILLIAMS: That's pretty good.

GUILFOYLE: He even tried on OpenTable, by his name: "Magoo here."

WILLIAMS: Oh, my God. No, if he had said, "This is Magoo here," he might have gotten -- he might have gotten in.

GUTFELD: He got a tail (ph) by the kitchen.

WILLIAMS: By the way, is "Magoo" better than "idiot"? Because he called him an idiot.

GUILFOYLE: All right.

WATTERS: I don't know. Maybe it's a term of endearment, Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Moving on, yes. I'm sure he enjoys...

WATTERS: What do you think?

GUILFOYLE: Well, you know what, he's got to stick up for himself. He's the attorney general of the United States. He's expected to behave in an ethical manner, to pursue justice and all laws without political ideology or bent.

We've complained vociferously here when Eric Holder was involved with Fast and Furious, and gunrunning, and the whole deal. OK? And the border cover- up and all of the above.

And so now we have somebody who is trying to actually do the job in the way that he sees fit. It might be somewhat of a disappointment as to some avenues he's chosen or pursued based on somebody's political persuasion or support of the president of things that were said during the campaign. But he's got to see it through. I mean, he's just got to do his job. And there's a right way to do it and a wrong way.

WILLIAMS: So I just want to say something to you. So what happens if your man actually gets Sessions to leave? It's a terrible situation for him, because then you'd have Rod Rosenstein there; and nobody on Capitol Hill is going to approve a new attorney general.

WATTERS: I don't think he's leaving. I miss the old days of Ashcroft scandals. Those were much different than these.

PERINO: You mean the curtains?

WATTERS: Yes, the curtains over the chest of the statue. Can't we get back to those?

PERINO: I worked at DOJ then, actually.

WATTERS: Oh, yes? You had to defend that one?

PERINO: Well, thankfully, I had the environmental division, so I didn't have to worry about that one.

But you know, Central, they called it DOJ's lunchroom. This is, like, where all the big-wigs go when they're there.

I think that they've got to calm some stuff down in this administration. OK? Today you have also NBC has reported right before we came on that they're -- that they're looking to replace McMaster.

WATTERS: I know.

PERINO: And so this is a guy who actually was a super-competent guy who was done so much.

GUTFELD: He calls him "McMagoo."

PERINO: Yes. I mean, you know I don't like the nicknames.

But you know, then you had today also...

WATTERS: Mick McMaster (ph).

PERINO: .. Carson coming out and saying, "I'm going to -- we're going to send the expensive dining room furniture back." You had Pruitt saying, "OK, I will fly coach in the future." You have Zinke still getting questions about his travel.

And I just think, you've got a lot of accomplishments under your belt. You've got a lot more things to do. You've got a tough election coming up.

WILLIAMS: But do you think it's just chaos, Dana? I mean, because you've got Kushner...

PERINO: This is what I say also about a special counsel.

WILLIAMS: Yes?

PERINO: Just be careful what you wish for.

WILLIAMS: Absolutely.

PERINO: You want to ask for another one, and you're going to say that that's legitimate; and then you're going to try to call illegitimate on the other one? I think that's a really bad idea.

WILLIAMS: I just want to add in to what you're saying, because I think there's a lot of chaos. You know, Jared Kushner is being told he doesn't have full clearance. Wall Street Journal today is basically saying, "Hey, you might consider going home or getting involved with the 2020 campaign." Taking Hope Hicks away, taking Jared Kushner away. That poor president, he's isolated.

WATTERS: It was a lot more chaotic in the summer. Remember those days, Juan?

PERINO: I'm sure you feel very bad, Juan.

GUTFELD: I can tell the sincerity of your concern.

WILLIAMS: My -- my thing is there's chaos in the White House. We talked about this.

GUTFELD: No, I've done the math. It's the same pace of attrition -- or is it attrition? Is that how you say it?

WATTERS: Attrition.

GUTFELD: As "The Apprentice." If you do it by proportion of time, "The Apprentice" was one firing a week. The White House is one a month average. And by percentage of time, that's exactly one to one.

WATTERS: All right. Happy Infrastructure Week, everybody.

If you want quality of life, don't move to Greg's favorite state. He'll tell you why, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

GUTFELD: It's a case where being No. 1 means, really, you're No. 2. A new study ranks California dead last of all the states in quality of life, making it tops at being on the bottom.

States were ranked on everything from education to opportunity, from infrastructure to crime. But California scored low for one simple reason: It's impossible to live there unless you are super rich or homeless -- then come one, come all.

Just any U-Haul dealer. Renting a truck to go San Francisco to Dallas will cost 3,200 bucks. The return trip only 1,100 -- that's a 180 percent surcharge. And it's based on a truck shortage in California, because so many people are leaving one left-wing city to a more pragmatic, affordable one. So maybe Californians leaving California, they're the real dreamers.

But anyone who's been to L.A. knows the ugly truth: It's turned into a post-apocalyptic wasteland with 55,000 homeless in that county alone. Massive encampments have enveloped Skid Row under overpasses and streets nearby. S.F. isn't much better, spending millions last year on cleaning up human waste left on its streets by the homeless.

It's odd: We're living in a time where Hollywood embraces dystopian fiction, they spend millions trying to recreate the look of life after nuclear war. I could save them some money: Just grab an iPhone and drive downtown.

All right. I'm going to go to you, Juan. I never go to you first, so I thought it might be a time to ask this question. They have the large -- California has the largest percentage of poor, yet massive government services. What does that tell you? What does that tell you, sir?

WILLIAMS: That they're meeting the needs of the people?

GUTFELD: No, it's that they're not. Even with -- no matter how much money they have. They're not.

WILLIAMS: I thought you said they have a huge homeless population and the government spends a lot of money dealing with...

GUTFELD: And you have villages.

WILLIAMS: Well, here's the thing. You know, one, I think that the real reason they ranked at the bottom...

GUTFELD: Right.

WILLIAMS: ... is lack of human interaction, from what I read.

GUTFELD: I read that, too.

WILLIAMS: OK. So I'm just saying I think that you are on target in saying it's like the rich, you can live a fabulous life in California.

GUTFELD: Right.

WILLIAMS: But if you're not rich, then your rent is too high. People don't interact. And it's not a communal type place.

GUTFELD: Yes, everybody's driving.

WILLIAMS: Everybody is into their own private space. So to me, I understand what you're saying. But I had a question for you.

GUTFELD: No questions.

WILLIAMS: Why are conservatives delighting in California being ranked as the worst?

GUTFELD: Oh, no, I'm not. I think we like to be proven correct.

WILLIAMS: Oh.

GUTFELD: That when you see massive liberal bureaucracies fail, we go, "Why didn't you listen to us?" I'm sad that I have to leave California. I'm from there, Jesse.

WATTERS: So you have income inequality. You have pollution and segregated neighborhoods. What have Republicans done to this -- oh, wait. No, it's run by Democrats. All the things Democrats say they're against they're just doing it in their own state.

I've been to Skid Row. It was the scariest moment of my life. You know, I've been to every single neighborhood: South Side of Chicago; I've been to Detroit, everything. I did not leave the car, because they said it was so unsafe.

GUTFELD: That was your...

WATTERS: A bunch of white guys with expensive cameras walked outside into these encampments. It's honestly like Armageddon. It's post-apocalyptic. You have zombies on drugs wandering around. There's needles everywhere. There's no law enforcement. It's lawless; it's chaos. It's dirty. It's infested with disease.

GUILFOYLE: My God.

WATTERS: It's the scariest place on earth. You'd think it was in a third- world country. It's right next to city hall, and they tolerate it.

GUTFELD: Ironically, if you go to a Skid Row concert, it's actually enjoyable.

Kimberly, Bay Area. Sad? You're from the Bay Area.

GUILFOYLE: yes.

GUTFELD: San Francisco.

GUILFOYLE: I was born and raised in San Francisco, so I'm a native. Yes, it's very sad, I think, what's going on there. Because now -- because they think with liberal politics, that this is what love should look like. That you trash your city. That you allow anything goes. That you have sanctuary cities. You let the citizens get murdered. There's total lawlessness, and no public safety.

GUTFELD: Who's going to be the next governor?

GUILFOYLE: And also no public cleanliness.

I think Gavin Newsom. I mean, you know, he's in a tight race with Antonio Villaraigosa, so we'll see. It's going to be a battle of the mayors.

GUTFELD: And he's not -- he's not a typical liberal.

GUILFOYLE: But he was good when he was mayor of San Francisco. I was there. Although that was part of the reason.

WILLIAMS: Yes, yes, yes.

GUILFOYLE: I'm like, "Let's clean this up around here."

WILLIAMS: But don't forget. Don't forget, their -- the economy there is terrific. Right?

GUTFELD: For some people, Juan.

WILLIAMS: No, I'm just saying, it's like -- I think it's like the fourth best economy in the nation.

GUTFELD: Yes. We'll you've got Silicon Valley and you've got Hollywood.

I want to bet Dana.

PERINO: I lived in California but in a different place. I lived in San Diego for three years.

GUTFELD: Beautiful city.

PERINO: Ninety-nine -- well, '99, yes, until I went back to the Justice Department in 2001 after 9/11. And San Diego has been run by conservatives and Republicans for most of it's -- at least the county has. I wouldn't say that necessarily about the mayor, although the mayor is a Republican. I believe he still calls himself that. Kevin, hello.

But you know what's interesting? Democrats will say that Eric Garcetti, the current mayor of Los Angeles, they talk about him as a realistic candidate for president in 2020.

GUTFELD: Wow.

GUILFOYLE: He's very nice.

PERINO: Yes, I hear that.

GUILFOYLE: I worked for his father, Gil Garcetti. And I spent a lot of time at the family's House. And I lived with his sister, Dana, in Los Angeles.

PERINO: Is that right?

GUTFELD: It's a small world, isn't it? Do you know anybody else? I've got to go.

GUILFOYLE: California, everybody.

GUTFELD: The one thing that could change Oprah's mind to run for president. It's me! I could change her mind.

GUILFOYLE: Hope God sends a message.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WILLIAMS: She'd be the answer to the left's prayers in 2020, but Oprah Winfrey says she'll only answer to a higher calling.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OPRAH WINFREY, MEDIA MOGUL: When you have that many people saying something, I thought, "Well, gee, I've never in my life ever, ever imagined that I would be in politics. And I've always said no, no, no, no."

I actually went into prayer about it. Like, God, if you -- if you think 'am supposed to run, you've got to tell me. And it has to be so clear that not even I could miss it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAMS: So Kimberly, she says that billionaires are reaching out to her to say she can have money. People who want to run her campaign. What do you think?

GUILFOYLE: I think somebody I know wrote an article about it.

WILLIAMS: I wrote it. I did, I did.

GUILFOYLE: I mean, I think you're sort of making the case, right? Because people think that she's a strong candidate, that she's somebody that could be a contender. She's quite popular. She has broad appeal to a number of different constituencies and probably across political lines.

I think she would be a formidable candidate for any office that she decided to run for. I don't know how realistic it is. But I understand and appreciate that she's a woman of faith and prayer and saying that she would look to it as a higher calling, a public service. And also wait to see if, you know, God gives her the -- gives her the high sign.

WILLIAMS: The high sign. She says she wants God to make it very clear to her, Jesse.

WATTERS: Yes.

WILLIAMS: So Jesse, can she count on your vote?

WATTERS: I'm going to go with the big no.

GUILFOYLE: Wrong.

WATTERS: A big no. But she must be mentally ill, because she talks to God. According to Joy Behar, that's what that means. Remember, that's what you said about Vice President Mike Pence.

I like Oprah. I like listening to Oprah. When I hear her voice, she kind of brings me in.

GUILFOYLE: He likes her book club.

WATTERS: No. It's a compelling match-up. I would obviously think so.

I don't think she has the policy chops to run, but she definitely has a connection to the American people. You're saying -- why is that funny?

GUILFOYLE: You always say "policy chops."

WATTERS: She doesn't have the chops. What's her ISIS strategy?

GUILFOYLE: And then he -- and then Juan says...

WATTERS: What's her entitlement reform strategy? What does he think about health care? Is she going to give everybody free health care?

GUILFOYLE: ... "Well, what -- well, what was President Trump?"

TRUMP: No, he was steeped in policy for decades. Come on, Juan.

WILLIAMS: You beat me to the punch. You beat me to the punch.

GUILFOYLE: I've seen this show before.

WILLIAMS: OK. OK, but you know, it's amazing to some people that black women are now hot in this regard as potential opposition to Trump in 2020. Because you've got also Michelle Obama and Kamala Harris. What do you think of this?

PERINO: Well, I think that the idea that Michelle Obama wants to run for office is totally off-kilter. She does not. She does not want to go back to Washington. She doesn't want that life.

Kamala Harris absolutely...

GUILFOYLE: Does want it.

PERINO: ... she's boosting (ph) herself.

I would just like to make sure that all the liberals, including those in the media that made fun of George W. Bush for years and overexaggerated a comment that he made that was very similar to what Oprah just said. For years, they wanted to destroy him for saying that God had told him to run. And I just want -- when all of you praise Oprah for that I'm going to...

GUILFOYLE: Call hypocrisy, yes.

WILLIAMS: Well, let me go to the pope.

GUTFELD: Yes, I am.

WILLIAMS: What do you think about this prayer stuff?

GUILFOYLE: Is he the antipope?

WILLIAMS: No, no, that's why I call him the pope.

GUTFELD: The antipope. Great "Damned" song, by the way.

You know, Juan, because you just claimed that black women are hot -- are hot in terms of being a candidate for president...

WILLIAMS: I'm glad you cleared that up.

GUTFELD: ... Liz Warren has announced she's black. Yes, she just did. She announced she's black.

WILLIAMS: So Native -- Native American...

GUILFOYLE: Like Rachel, was it...

GUTFELD: Dolezal.

GUILFOYLE: Dolezal.

GUTFELD: I'll stop there.

WILLIAMS: All right. "One More Thing" is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: It's time now for "One More Thing" -- Jesse.

WATTERS: People always say I look like David Schwimmer, a.k.a. Ross from "Friends." But courtesy of Judy Werner, she found someone I look a lot more like. This guy from a 1930 vintage Listerine ad.

PERINO: Wow.

WATTERS: I think I look a lot like this guy. Let's see a two-shot. What do you think?

PERINO: Wow, that's pretty cool.

WATTERS: Yes, so I think we've found my doppelganger. And he used Listerine after shaving. That was what they did back then. They put it on their face.

GUTFELD: He could be your -- he could be your long lost grandfather.

PERINO: Really? It wasn't for a mouthwash?

WATTERS: I guess they put mouthwash on their cheeks back in the '30s.

PERINO: Wow. Wow.

WATTERS: We've come a long way.

PERINO: It as the Depression.

WATTERS: That's true. Use anything you had.

GUTFELD: All right. Today six years ago today, Andrew Breitbart passed away suddenly. He was one of my close friends. And I -- if you want to learn more about him, I know you've heard his name many, many times. But if you'd like to learn more about him, I've got -- I have two podcasts that I've recorded in the last couple of -- six months. One with Susie Breitbart, which is his widow. Wonderful person. And also the great Ben Shapiro, who was also a good friend of Andrew Breitbart.

These are on at the -- if you go to FOXNewsPodcast.com and you just scroll down, you'll be able to find these two podcasts. They're, like, 25, 30 minutes long. But it's just good to walk back in history and get to know the person you probably don't know but have heard a heck of a lot about. That's him on "Red Eye" with his incredibly, embarrassingly long hair.

WATTERS: What a guy.

PERINO: Rest in peace.

Juan.

WILLIAMS: OK, so sometimes movies reflect real life. Sometimes movies change real life. That's what's happening with the huge box office hit "Black Panther." Suddenly, black cats are in demand.

Usually, they're the last choice of people buying or adopting cats. But black cats, often associated with witches, witchcraft and spells, suddenly in demand with this hit movie.

In Colorado, a blogger announced his local animal shelter went from 50 black cats to none in the last two weeks. People are naming the cats after characters in the movie. And in Dallas, one movie theater offered two free tickets to anyone who adopted a black cat. The local shelter could not keep up with the demand.

PERINO: It's like the Dalmatians.

WILLIAMS: Yes, right.

GUILFOYLE: At least think they're getting some nice pet adoptions.

PERINO: Yes.

GUILFOYLE: A nice story, Juan.

PERINO: My sister, the cat-aholic, would love that.

GUTFELD: Thirty-seven cats now.

PERINO: A little bit nutty. That's Angie Machock in Colorado.

All right. Anybody catch this yesterday? Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: Viewers, if you think Jesse is wrong and that dogs do have personalities and spirits, please send him a text or...

WATTERS: I also say to all those potheads that don't like Dana and what she said about your lovely weed in Colorado, e-mail her.

PERINO: It's on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: All right. So we got some responses. I'm going to go through them quickly.

David said, "I was pretty sure Dana was right. I asked my dog, and she confirmed it."

WATTERS: Oh, boo.

PERINO: Daisy says, "Clearly, Dana, every dog has a unique personality. Jesse needs to get a dog. I suggest a Pug."

No. 3, Joseph, he says, "I agree with you, Dana. First time I can say I don't agree with Jesse Watters."

No. 4, "Jesse is always wrong. As long as we do not clone Streisand, all is OK."

And No. 5, I'm going to throw you a bone. PatsFan, he said, "I love you both, but I'm with Jesse on this."

WATTERS: All right.

PERINO: That's one vote.

WATTERS: My Pats Fan. Yes, I got inundated with emails. Probably shouldn't have said that. I teed off a lot of lovely dog people.

PERINO: All right. We've got plenty of time for K.G.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you so much, because today is a very, very special day. A fantastic, fabulous fan of "The Five," Robert Conrad, is celebrating his birthday, his 83rd birthday today. And we call him Uncle Bob. We got this little special message from him, for -- from Wild Bill, his friend who is - - also just thinks he's fabulous. He's had a legendary life and a TV career spanning over five decades. And he's best known for playing Secret Service agent James West in "The Wild Wild West," and real-life World War II fighter pilot Ace "Pappy" Boyington.

GUTFELD: That show confused me. "Wild West" was my favorite show. But if confused me, because the technology in the West.

WILLIAMS: That was the idea.

GUTFELD: It freaked me out.

GUILFOYLE: That's why you liked it. Greg wanted to...

(CROSSTALK)

GUTFELD: Remember, he'd take off his shoe? Remember he had stuff in his shoe? He had stuff. He had all these little tools. He was the original MacGyver.

GUILFOYLE: That's why Greg loves him so much.

And he's not done, Greg, because he currently hosts a weekly radio show on CRN Digital Talk Radio.

Happy birthday, Uncle Bob. We love you.

WATTERS: Happy birthday.

PERINO: Happy birthday, Jamie Zweiback (ph). I didn't forget.

Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." "Special Report" is up next. Hey, Bret.

BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Hey, Dana, thanks.

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