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Dueling Republican and Democratic proposals to end the partial government shutdown die on Senate floor
Published January 24, 2019
This is a rush transcript from "The Five," January 24, 2019. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
DANA PERINO, HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Dan Bongino, Marie Harf, Jesse Watters, and Greg Gutfeld who apparently can't hear anything. It's 5 o'clock in New York City, and this is The Five.
It is back to square one after two bills to end the government shutdown failed to overcome filibusters in the Senate. We're awaiting comments from President Trump. We'll bring them to you when we get them. Mitch McConnell and Chuck Schumer now talking about a temporary bill that would reopen the government for three weeks, the White House saying President Trump would sign it if it includes a large down payment on the wall.
In the meantime, both sides are ramping up the heated rhetoric after President Trump postponed the State of the Union until the shutdown ends. This is after Nancy Pelosi blocked him from delivering the speech in the House chamber, Republicans and Democrats trading blows over who's to blame.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: The State of the Union speech has been canceled by Nancy Pelosi because she doesn't want to hear the truth.
REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF., HOUSE SPEAKER: It is so unimportant in the lives of the American people in terms of -- especially those who are victims of the shutdown, hostages to the president's applause line in a campaign speech.
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL, R-KY, SENATE MAJORITY LEADER: She seems unreasonable. She seems to have a dislike for the president that is hurting the country. And this idea of not letting the president speak is really overplaying your hand.
SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER, D-N.Y., SENATE MINORITY LEADER: Mr. Donald Trump, president, you care about security? You would open the government now. You're the only one standing in the way.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think it's a national disgrace. I think it's an embarrassment. It's unprecedented.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We believe the President of the United States, with the aid and abetting of the majority leader of the United States Senate has taken the government of the United States hostage.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This idea of literally shutting, the slamming the doors of the House chamber and holding the State of the Union hostage, enough is enough. Release all the hostages.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: OK. So we're releasing hostages. We're not having the State of the Union. But the State of the Union, I guess, is off until the shutdown is over, so there's that. Now try to get the government back up and running. Dan Bongino, your thoughts today on how this all played out.
DAN BONGINO, HOST: Well, I think President Trump kind of has the Democrats in the corner here. I mean, they keep coming out and say they want to reopen the government. Yet, he stipulated on a lot of major points they've agreed to one the past. I mean, is this a principled party or not? Are they the frauds I know they are? They've already -- I don't agree with a lot of these stuff, but --
MARIE HARF, HOST: Happy Thursday.
BONGINO: No. It's true. Marie, you know --
(LAUGHTER)
HARF: I'm so happy to be here.
BONGINO: I love having you here. But they've already agreed on DACA, they've agreed on TPS, and they've already voted for five times the amount for border wall funding. So can you give me a principled reason why the Democrats still want to keep the government shutdown?
HARF: Because when you say they've agreed on DACA, what they agreed on was a permanent fix legislatively, not basically a 2-year protection because the Supreme Court already protected them for the next year, and basically, Donald Trump fixing a problem he himself made. Donald Trump --
BONGINO: No, Obama made the DACA problem.
HARF: No, DACA was enforced --
PERINO: No, that was an Obama thing.
HARF: Yes. And President Trump withdrew it.
BONGINO: So you agree it was an Obama thing, not a Trump thing?
HARF: It was an Obama policy that Donald Trump withdrew from.
BONGINO: Right. Because it was completely against his Article 2 power --
PERINO: It's fun when you two are here because it's like The Two.
HARF: No, but this is the challenge. DACA would still be in effect today if Donald Trump hadn't ended it. That is a fact.
BONGINO: But it wouldn't be a problem at all if Obama didn't start it.
HARF: You can tell those --
BONGINO: But you agree, right?
HARF: -- millions of people who were brought here through no fault of their own that they can leave and go to a home they've never known. You can tell them that if you like. I'm not going to.
BONGINO: I will.
HARF: The problem here is -- the problem now is the Senate today, I think, demonstrated to the president -- and I think this is part of the reason Mitch McConnell brought both bills up -- that neither plan has -- you know, Trump's plan doesn't have enough votes. The Democratic bill actually got more votes than that Republican bill, including from five Republican senators.
So I think Mitch McConnell was making very clear to the president this isn't good enough. And so, now, Lindsey Graham is talking to the White House. Maybe there'll be some movement here. But I don't want to wait three or four weeks to get movement while people still don't get paid, and February 1st comes and they can't pay rent. That's what I don't want.
PERINO: Right. What's the way, Jesse, to just break this whole logjam?
JESSE WATTERS, HOST: I wanted to see the president ignore Nancy and just walk right into the House Chamber on that date and force Nancy Pelosi to stop the speech. That's the kind of drama that I really expected.
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: And I feel like the president should've called her bluff and just walked in and given the speech and made her turn out the lights. Make her call the sergeant-at-arms and arrest the president so that he can speak.
PERINO: Look at that beautiful sunshine.
WATTERS: Isn't that gorgeous out there? The sunshine or me? OK. The sunshine. I think what's happening now is that you can't reason with Nancy Pelosi and you can't reason with the Democrats. You just have to beat the Democrats, OK.
PERINO: Is that what we should do?
WATTERS: Because -- here's why. They're never going to actually vote for a wall. And the more facts you explained to them, the more expert testimony they hear, the more videos of little migrants crossing the border and no one is stopping them --
HARF: Tunneling under a wall, those videos.
WATTERS: -- that cannot change their opinion. They're dug in and they're never going to change. So, I don't know what they're going to have to do. He's going to have to give a big speech at a border city or something like that and cook up some deal in the Senate because right now it just looks like a stalemate.
PERINO: Because that's what's on my mind, Greg, is what's the way to -- this is the back-and-forth for 34 days. You know sad face?
GREG GUTFELD, HOST: I just drew a little sad face.
PERINO: Why? Are you sad?
GUTFELD: Yeah, I'm sad. I'm sad about this whole thing. It's like parents are fighting and I'm just in my room.
PERINO: There's no way for like -- yeah.
GUTFELD: Yeah, there's no way to get --
PERINO: You want to come out.
GUTFELD: I don't want to come out of the room because it makes me sad. See, what happens is -- go ahead, complete your thought. I'm sorry.
PERINO: I'm wondering how -- neither side is being persuaded by the other right now.
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: I don't see how you just beat them. There's not enough numbers.
GUTFELD: Here's an interesting -- OK, so when I run out of things to say about a topic like this, I just go back and look at the media. Luckily, the explanation for all of these logjams has to do with the media. I looked at the chyrons on CNN and MSNBC over the State of the Union, Trump backs down, that was there chyron on both CNN and MSNBC.
So you see the business model at work that they need the polarization. They need the conflict. They need this to keep going. So there's no incentive for the Democrats to actually compromise because if they do compromise, their allies in the media will turn on them.
So their resistance is constantly being validated by their favored media. So MSNBC, CNN do not want to compromise. Therefore, you will not have a compromise. Even as Dan has stated, Trump has moved more than halfway.
BONGINO: Yes.
GUTFELD: I mean, he's picking off Ann Coulter, and that means you're doing something. You're compromising if you're ticking off Ann Coulter --
HARF: I mean, look, we can all sit down and think there's a deal to be had. Let's say 5 billion for border security, including some barriers, the Democrats have voted for before in exchange for a permanent extension of DACA and TPS. That's like a compromise. I think we could all probably agree --
GUTFELD: The compromise is always -- is right there.
PERINO: So in The Daily Briefing, Donna Brazile said Nancy Pelosi is going to propose something tonight, do you know anything about that?
HARF: I know it's still being talked about. I don't have a good sense for what's in it. I have a feeling they won't go quite as far as I just did in terms of 5 billion for border security, including barriers. I think the biggest -- Democrats do believe there should be barriers --
GUTFELD: Right.
HARF: -- in many places.
WATTERS: Can you say that again, please?
GUTFELD: Yes.
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: Repeat it so Nancy can hear.
HARF: We've said it. Democrats have said it.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: No, no, the point is why won't they come up with a plan?
HARF: They are right now. I know Speaker Pelosi is working on it. I also think that we now have what could be something to compromise off of. We've seen two bills that don't have enough votes. We now have a starting point for negotiation.
My whole theory, though, has been let's have those negotiations. Those could take weeks. So we need to just reopen the government so people are getting paid.
WATTERS: Here's an idea to get people paid, the House Republicans put forth three bills that would pay the furloughed workers while the government stayed shut down, and Nancy Pelosi and the Democrats killed all three bills.
PERINO: But the Republicans were able to get -- they had on the first vote they only got six Democrats. Today they got 13 --
WATTERS: They're slowly picking off Democrats votes.
HARF: Those are motions to recommit. They can't put forward bills. They're not in the majority. That's a legislative tactic. It's not a real thing, Jesse.
WATTERS: You could still put it forward and then you can have it taken up by the majority.
HARF: It's not a real thing, it's a legislative tactic.
WATTERS: How it's a tactic they can work if Pelosi puts it on the floor?
HARF: No, he can't.
WATTERS: Yes, he can.
(CROSSTALK)
BONGINO: -- Democrats, right, who were just elected in swingy districts as compromise. Swingy district --
WATTERS: Those districts sound like fun.
(CROSSTALK)
BONGINO: -- and explain to people in their first term in office how they didn't vote for this bill, knowing the Democrats approved five times as much border money in the past.
PERINO: Can I ask you something else, Dan? I was reading this piece today that there were some conservative groups who are concerned that the wall is too much of an obsession that they want to see other things like e-verify which would require employers to make sure that their workers are legal, and other things that are possibly even more important for actual immigration either reform or whatever they want. What do you think of that?
HARF: That's why Tom Cotton voted against the president's plan and other - - I think Mike Lee and others, right?
BONGINO: Here's the problem. This is the read my lips moments. This is not about immigration. I think everybody at this table knows this. This is about a political victory that has to happen because of Donald Trump loses on this the Democrats --
(CROSSTALK)
PERINO: Are you admitting that?
BONGINO: No, it's true. The Democrats are looking to impeach Donald Trump.
(CROSSTALK)
HARF: Wait, I'm sorry, it's not an emergency?
BONGINO: No, no, no. I said this is -- they're going to move to impeachment and this is a political win he needs right now. Everybody knows -- of course -- this is common sense. He cannot lose this fight. This was a solemn promise he made. And, Dana, this works (ph) for Trump, thought, because he made a promise. And for the first time in D.C., you're getting a non-swamp rat who's actually trying to stick to it. That was his thing.
PERINO: OK, Dan. Can we listen to Nancy Pelosi?
GUTFELD: No, I don't --
PERINO: She is on the House floor, live.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. NANCY PELOSI, D-CALIF., SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: -- temperature remains below freezing. Americans like Julie from Iowa who says that farmers already are hit hard by tariffs will feel the squeeze even more now.
Americans like Sarah from Colorado whose new job at the V.A. is on hold, adding to wait times for veterans who need health care services. And they say a veteran who compose nearly a third of our federal workforce, 31 percent, our veterans who have security clearances, who are at risk, which are at risk, when you can lose your security clearance if you lose your credit rating.
And you can lose your credit rating if you cannot pay your bills on time, your mortgage, your rent, your car payment, your credit card bills and the rest. Credit rating goes down. Your -- the vulnerability of your security clearance goes down -- is increased.
So, it is harmful to our veterans to be doing this, and it's important for everyone to know how they are affected because our veterans who have donned the uniform of our country to protect us and then carry on their commitment to public service in the public sector as federal employees, in some ways still continuing to protect us in other ways, meeting our needs in another way.
All of them affected by this shutdown. Or like Lily from Georgia who says food stamp recipients will go hungry, many will lose subsidized housing. State and local services will be overwhelmed trying to make up for the losses. As one woman did --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: All right. We've been listening to Nancy Pelosi, she's live on the House floor. It's interesting, though, because, Marie, they've decided to go away for three days. The House was -- basically told her Democrats, go home. How can you get, actually, things done if you are not there?
HARF: Both the Senate and the House throughout this entire process have worked very short weeks. They've taken a lot of time off. They've taken long weekends back in their districts. They have not --either chamber throughout those entire 34 days, seems like they're in a hurry to get it done.
Well, what would be interesting -- I mean, Dan asked before we went to Speaker Pelosi about how Democrats would message this. I think right now they would say we voted nine times to reopen the government, and now -- we'll have tonight put forward an alternative plan to negotiate over. Why can't we do that? Why can't we basically limit the disagreement to this one thing, reopen the rest of the government, and then fight over that for three more weeks?
WATTERS: Permission to cite a poll.
HARF: And the polling --
WATTERS: Permission to cite a poll.
PERINO: You've got 25 seconds, go.
WATTERS: OK. This is a CBS poll. This is not what I would call fake news because I agree with it. This is the question --
HARF: So honest, I love it.
WATTERS: -- which do you want Democrats in congress to do now, OK? Refused to fund the border wall, 43 percent; Agreed to budget with wall funding, 52 percent. The majority won it.
PERINO: All right, Fox News alert. We have tape from President Trump. Let's listen in.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: So thank you all very much. I appreciate it. Thank you.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you open to this idea of a temporary spending to reopen the government --
TRUMP: Well, one of the ideas suggested is they open it. They pay a sort of a prorated downpayment for the wall, which I think people would agree that you need. You need the wall. In fact, I see a lot of the Democrats are all -- almost all of them are breaking and saying, look, walls are good. The walls are good. Big difference from what you had two or three weeks ago.
And the vote -- we have the vote on our bill which we won 50 to 47. That was our bill. But we got one Democrat. It was 50 to 47. And we need, as you know, we have to get 60. We don't have 60 votes, so we need Democrat support. We didn't get Democrats support other than from -- actually, wonderful man, as you know, Senator Manchin. And -- who's doing the right thing for his people. I mean, he's doing the right thing for West Virginia, frankly.
And the other bill, it was 52-44., and that included a lot of hurricane relief for a lot of different states. So it's sort of not something some of them really voted for the hurricane relief which I felt they needed. That was 52-44, but you need 60, so that didn't go anywhere.
So we knew they both were not going to go anywhere, we thought. And now Mitch is negotiating with Chuck Schumer, and we'll see what happens. I think they just left the meeting. They just had a meeting. I think they're going out to see their people. But they've just left.
So we had two bills. I think we did very well. The Republicans held, except for two. The Republicans held -- two were not there. They couldn't. They were unable to be there. So there were two non-votes. But even with two non-vote, I think they would have been good votes for us. It's 50 to 47. We won. But we need 60 votes because of the 60 vote rule. And so, I just really want to thank the Republicans for holding.
Again, on the other one, that was the opening up, 52-44, but you need 60 votes, so it's a long way short. And a lot of that -- a lot of those votes were based on the fact that there was hurricane relief for certain states.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- temporary spending without money for the wall just to reopen --
TRUMP: Well, I wouldn't be happy with it. I wouldn't be happy. But we have a lot of alternatives. Honestly, we have -- everybody -- look, for the most part people agree, when I say everybody, I would say almost everybody agree we have to have border security. We have to have a wall in order to have border security. You cannot have border security without a wall.
I mean, we can play games and we can talk about technology. We can talk about drones flying around. You know, right now, formed is an 8,000 person caravan, and the caravan is heading our way. Congratulations. We have another one. We stopped the first one. We stopped the second one.
I wouldn't say that Tijuana is too happy, but they are happily living in Tijuana right now. And a lot of them have gone back. But we stopped them but it's very tough. And if we didn't have a wall in those areas, it would have been very hard to stop them. We have the military and we have the border patrol. They've done an incredible job. And ICE has done an incredible job all over the country, frankly.
We've removed thousands of MS-13 and others out of our country. But if we had a wall, we wouldn't have that problem. It would be great. So we have a lot of alternatives. But I'm just honored that almost all of the Republicans voted for our bill. Our bill is the bill that we were really focused on. But we had almost all of the Republicans, so the end result was 50 to 47. The Democrats lost one that came over to our side. So they pretty much held and we held. And again, we were missing two Republicans. They couldn't vote. They were not here.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- movement to end the shutdown soon?
TRUMP: Well, I have to find out. After this meeting we'll find out. But right now, Mitch McConnell is meeting with Chuck Schumer, and to see -- we'll see what happens. They're meeting to see if they can work out something, maybe on a temporary basis where we start.
But I have -- you know, we have a lot of alternatives. There are a lot of people that want this to happen. I'll tell you who wants this to happen. The military wants this to happen because this is a virtual invasion of our country of drugs, of human traffickers, of so many different things, of criminals. It's an invasion of our country.
And the military wants this to happen, and the border patrol wants this to happen. And, by the way, border patrol said all of the drones flying up in the air, having a lot of fun flying drones all over the place, they don't mean a thing when they looked down and they see thousands of people rushing our border. The only thing that works is a strong barrier, a wall.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you talked to Nancy Pelosi --
TRUMP: I have not. I haven't spoken to Nancy Pelosi. No. No, but I'm here, you know. I haven't left except for a beautiful evening in Iraq. I've been here for a long time.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Mr. President, Wilbur Ross said he doesn't understand why federal workers would need help getting food. Do you understand --
TRUMP: No, I haven't -- I haven't heard the statement. But I do understand that perhaps he should have said it differently. Local people know who they are, where they go for groceries and everything else. And I think what Wilbur was probably trying to say is that they will work along.
I know banks are working along. If you have mortgages, the mortgage use -- the mortgage -- the folks collecting the interest and all of those things, they work along. That's what happens in times like this. They know the people. They've been dealing with them for years and they work along.
The grocery store -- and I think that's probably what Wilbur Ross meant, but I haven't seen his statement, no. But he's done a great job, I will tell you that. Yes?
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- Venezuela, I just want to know, aren't you worried to leave the American diplomats behind?
TRUMP: Well, we're looking at Venezuela. It's a very sad situation. That was the richest state in all of that area. It's a big, beautiful area and, by far, the richest. And now, it's one of the poorest places in the world. That's what socialism gets you when they want to raise your taxes to 70 percent.
You know, it's interesting. I've been watching our opponents, our future opponents talking about 70 percent. Number one, they can't do it for 70 percent. It's got to probably be twice that number. But, maybe more importantly what happens is you really have to study and take a look at what's happened to Venezuela. It is a very, very sad situation. So, we've our eye very closely on Venezuela, very closely.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. President, if Mitch McConnell and Chuck Schumer can come to some sort of agreement, will you support the result --
TRUMP: It depends what the agreement is. I mean, yeah. But if they come to a reasonable agreement, I would support it, yeah.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Even if there's no wall funding or does it have to have wall funding?
TRUMP: I only -- look, look, I have other alternatives if I have to, and I'll use those alternatives if I have to. We want to go through the system. We have to have a wall in this country. We have criminals pouring into our country.
And I'm not talking about the southern border. They don't stay there. They go through -- they permeate all throughout the country, including places like Wisconsin, a lot of -- a lot of different places and that's the problem.
I say that we would cut our crime -- you know we're doing very well in crime rate compared to past years and past administrations. But I think our crime rate will go way down, and I know our drug rates, our drug -- what's happening is the drugs are pouring in.
And yes, they come through the ports of entry, but the big trucks come through areas where you don't have a wall and you have wide open spaces. We have to have the wall. You'd stop drugs. You'd stop human trafficking.
I mean, human trafficking where they tie up women and they put duct tape on their mouths and they put them in the backseat of a car or in a van. They don't come through a port of entry because the people at the port of entry are going to see that. That's not like hiding drugs in the engine or in the hubcaps. And they have incredible, ingenious ideas.
I mean, frankly, I've said some of these people are so genius, if they were ever legit they'd become very rich people. But what they do is they go through the ports of entry with small stuff. But the big stuff comes through areas where you have nobody watching.
I mean, you have hundreds of miles of open space, and they go out there and they're loaded up with drugs or they have women in the backseat of the cars with duct tape all over the place. It's a disgrace.
And you don't catch them. They make -- you don't even know the difference between Mexico and the United States. They make a left turn after they go out 20 miles, 40 miles, 5 miles in some cases and less, they make a left turn, they're in the United States, and then they do whatever they have to do.
You need the wall. And we can all play games and we can all talk about technology. I know more about technology than anybody. If you don't have the wall, the technology doesn't work. First of all, the wall is based on -- I mean, it's all based -- any technology works only with the wall. Not going to work otherwise. You need the wall.
In fact, a lot of the technology is put on top of the wall. That's how you see it, the cameras and everything else. I mean, they literally put the technology, they fasten it to the wall. And then you have drone technology, and that's great in terms of -- what are you going to do? Are you going to follow the people?
First of all, once they step into the country, you know what happens, right? You know what they do. It's called -- what do they call it, do you know? They put one foot in our country, right? And we've got them. That's it. So the drones don't help us. We have to keep it out. We have no choice but to have a wall or a barrier. And if we don't have that, it's just not going to work. So, it's very important to me. All right, one more question.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What's your message to federal workers for missing another paycheck this week?
TRUMP: I love them. I respect them. I really appreciate the great job they're doing. If they -- you know, many of those people that are not getting paid are totally in favor of what we're doing because they know the future of this country is dependent on having a strong border, especially a strong southern border because we have tremendous violence and crime coming through that border, we have tremendous drugs, we have human trafficking, we have MS-13 and gangs pouring through those borders, and if we don't strengthen those borders, we're going to have a big problem in the future.
One of the people I blame is myself because the economy is so strong right now, stronger than ever before. Today, today, right now, we have more people working in the United States that has ever worked in this country before. That's a great complement. So I blame myself, OK?
But the fact is people come up because our country is doing so well and they want to break through our borders. The fact is we want them to come up. We have a big -- we took in more people last year legally than we have been a long time because we need them because we have a lot of companies are coming into our country.
So we need people coming in. I want people to come in but they have to come in legally and they have to come in through merit. They have to be able to help companies. And if they don't help companies and if they don't help our country, we can't do that, folks. We just can't do that.
(CROSSTALK)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Why did you decide to agree to Nancy Pelosi that --
TRUMP: Well, it's really her choice. I mean, I would have done it at a different location, but I think that would be very disrespectful to the State of the Union to pick some other place. I could have done it. I could have gone to a big auditorium and gotten 25,000 people in one day, and you've been there many times. But I think that would be very disrespectful to the State of the Union. So, what she said I thought was actually reasonable. We'll have the State of the Union when the shutdown is over.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When do you think that's going to be?
TRUMP: That I can't tell you. That I can't tell you. But we have a lot of alternatives but we need border security. OK. Thank you very much, everybody. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you, John.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: That's the president. I think he's in the Cabinet Room or maybe the Roosevelt Room, doing a little briefing on trade.
GUTFELD: That's the Roosevelt Room, Dana, I remember it.
PERINO: Is that the Roosevelt Room?
GUTFELD: Yeah, I remember being there.
PERINO: I actually think that's the Cabinet Room, actually. Thank you. They have windows in the back, and there are no windows in the Roosevelt Room. Jesse, we have about 30 seconds to wrap that up for us.
WATTERS: Sure. I mean, the Democrats are allergic to facts. Their brains have been furloughed. I'm just gonna deliver some straight, stone cold numbers so people could listen and hear the truth. People say the drugs only come through the port of entry. The border patrol just released statistics. They've just seized 700 pounds of cocaine. It's a lot of gear, Greg. Seven hundred pound --
GUTFELD: Tell me about it.
WATTERS: -- of cocaine in a group of 253 illegals. That's a lot of people with a lot of cocaine coming across the southern border. Go figure.
PERINO: Go figure. All right, we're going to come back. We have to take a quick break. More of The Five coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WATTERS: Well done.
GUTFELD: Weezer. New Weezer.
As the chaos in Venezuela unfolds, we must ask how did this happen? Socialism.
The country's annual inflation rate is 80,000 percent. I'm no economist, but I would call that a lot. In such circumstances, people are faced with grim choices. Either eat their pets or move to Cuba.
Many modern-day socialists will scream, "But no, no, no. Venezuela isn't socialism as it's supposed to be," which is what socialists have said about every single socialist country since forever.
Venezuela isn't socialism, like Cuba isn't socialism, and Nicaragua isn't socialism, and Zimbabwe isn't socialism and so on. To infinity. That's the key difference between socialism and capitalism. Capitalism doesn't need liars, because it doesn't have to be perfect to work. It's decentralized. So one glitch only goes so far.
But socialism is centralized. One error and the whole thing goes to hell, which is why it needs force to survive. Like Hugo Chavez, the dead strongman once embraced by the American celebs. Sean Penn, Danny Glover, Oliver Stone praised the man from their comforts of capitalism. And as long as apologists exist, the media just shrugs.
For the press, Venezuela is the opposite of Covington. Covington was exciting viral video, inflammatory tape they couldn't get enough of. Venezuela, it's a 12-year death spiral, so easy to ignore. We didn't.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: Venezuela, the socialist nightmare that Stone and Penn embraced, they've got no food, no supplies, no toilet paper.
It's a crap show without toilet paper. Seriously, they don't have toilet paper in Venezuela.
Venezuela, a place literally full of crap, since socialism made toilet paper scarce.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: I don't know about that shirt or my obsession with toilet paper.
Anyway, so now the press calls Trump's actions provocative by recognizing Venezuela's opposition leader. They can go to hell. Or worse, Venezuela.
So Dana, apparently, Russia is upset with Donald Trump.
DANA PERINO, HOST: Yes.
GUTFELD: And the -- there are politicians here who are in agreement. Are they in cahoots with Putin?
PERINO: Well -- are they colluding?
GUTFELD: Yes, are the Democrats in cahoots with Putin over Venezuela?
PERINO: Well, think about whose side they're on here.
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: Right? So yes, you have, like, the bad boys of the world, Putin and his cohorts. They're the ones who always band together and say, "America, you better stay out of this," because --
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: -- they're good friends with then Hugo Chavez, now Maduro.
My advice to them is, like, why don't you put -- feed your own people and police your own area and leave this part to us? Because I think that this is a really good thing.
Not only did President Trump recognize Guaido as the actual legitimate leader. We'll see how that goes. But the other thing they did that was very diplomatically skillful and smart. They got all the other leaders in the region, like the new president from Brazil, Bolsonaro. I can't remember the guy's name from from Chile. But they have all said, "We back this move, as well."
GUTFELD: Yes.
PERINO: Saturday, Secretary Pompeo will come to New York. He'll have -- I don't know if he presides over the emergency session at the U.N. But that's what this is going to be about. And it's about time.
GUTFELD: Marie, when will you confront the Democratic Party over their modern socialists? Because here, you have this going on; and AOC and Bernie are still waxing nostalgic about this deadly ideology.
MARIE HARF, HOST: It's -- so I --
GUTFELD: What are you going to do about it, Marie?
HARF: You know -- me personally?
GUTFELD: You, personally.
HARF: So I don't like most of Bernie Sanders' or AOC's policy proposals. I also think it is way -- a huge stretch to compare them to what's happening in Venezuela. We can take them on on their own and not say they want us to be Venezuela.
When it comes to Venezuela, I would say we, as the United States, should promote our values and do things like -- like recognizing this interim president. But we have to just keep in mind what is the best way that we can effect the outcome we want?
GUTFELD: So you're saying assassination?
HARF: And sometimes -- and sometimes the United States has tried to get certain outcomes by being too involved in other countries' internal affairs, by supporting opposition leaders or revolutions. So we just have to keep in mind that we have a little bit of a checkered history here.
The other thing I would bring up is the diplomats that are still there. The -- President Maduro has asked them to leave. The present we are recognizing now has asked them to stay. As of right now, they're staying, but now they are in the middle of a very tense security situation. They are sort of being used as pawns here on the ground by both sides. That concerns me. It worries me a little bit.
GUTFELD: I don't know. Dan -- Dan, I don't see both sides here, though. Because it's like 12 years, this was a beautiful country.
HARF: And he still has the military, right? So --
DAN BONGINO, HOST: The GDP of Venezuela was 334 billion. It's been wiped out to 94 billion. Socialism is a plague and a stain on humankind that has a 100 percent success rate of failure.
GUTFELD: Yes.
BONGINO: And I'm tired of these Democrats saying Denmark is socialist. It is not. Socialism is a government control of the means of production. Those are capitalist countries with big-government entities. Stop conflating the two, because you're confusing a bunch of impressionable people out there.
Socialism is death and destruction, and I'm glad you mentioned the apologists, because they're at fault, too. Fascism hasn't escaped this. Socialism has, because of people like Bernie Sanders.
GUTFELD: Jesse, would you do, President Watters?
WATTERS: Oh, that's a scary thought. Resign. Resign and take money elsewhere.
No, if I was a reporter on Capitol Hill, I would go to AOC, and I would say, "Look what's happening in Venezuela. Care to comment?" And -- just a suggestion.
But obviously, this is a CIA operation. You can't allow a failed state in South America where the Chinese and the Russians come in and take over. I mean, this country is awash in wealth, in mineral wealth and oil and gold and --
PERINO: And good people.
WATTERS: And good people. And you can't let it descend into chaos.
The Monroe Doctrine has to be upheld.
GUTFELD: Named after Marilyn.
WATTERS: I wish I went to your school.
GUTFELD: So did I.
Anyway, Savannah Guthrie receiving backlash for her interviews with the people at the center of the face-off controversy. See it next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WATTERS: Savannah Guthrie is being blasted following polarizing interviews with key players at the center of the controversial video everyone has been talking about. She's facing criticism for being overly tough on Nick Sandmann while asking Nathan Phillips softball questions. Here's some of what Guthrie asked the student.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SAVANNAH GUTHRIE, NBC NEWS: Some people see as a young kid with a smirk on his face.
Did anyone say, "Build the wall?"
Do you think if you weren't wearing that hat, this might not have happened, or it might've been different?
There were more of you than them, but you felt like they were stronger?
There's something aggressive about standing there. Standing your ground. You both stood your ground. And it was like a stare-down. What do you think of that now, when you think about that moment?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: And take a look at the interview with the Native American activist this morning.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GUTHRIE: First question, how are you doing? It has been a whirlwind few days for you.
How did it make you feel? What did you think about his words and his explanation and his version of this encounter?
Did you hear anyone say, "Build that wall?" It isn't audible on the video clips, I think, that are out there, but did you hear that?
And how did you feel in that moment? Did you yourself feel threatened?
He didn't think he owed an apologies, but he does wish that he had walked away. Is that enough for you, or do you think he should have apologized?
Do you think, sir, you should've walked away?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: So the tone totally different with both people. And even now, Dan, as the evidence has come out that this guy is a liar and he was the one that walked over to the young students and banged a drum in their face, and then lied about what happened and ridiculed the students afterwards, Savannah is treating him like the victim, like he's owed an apology.
BONGINO: Now Savannah's interview was a complete disgrace to humankind. I mean, standing there? Standing there is now an act of aggression? No, it totally was. Standing there -- listen to America. Here's a message.
You wear a MAGA hat wherever you please. You get -- there's no buzzer here for me. Don't worry. I'm used to the FCC, though. You wear it wherever you want. You understand?
This kid did nothing wrong. "Make America Great Again" was an expression used by Bill Clinton. There is nothing wrong with it. It's a political slogan.
And the fact that he was standing there is now an act of aggression, is so ridiculous. Savannah Guthrie should resign in disgrace after asking such a stupid question.
And then giving Phillips a pass on the fact that he suggested he was in theater in Vietnam when he wasn't?
HARF: She asked him about that. Did you watch that interview?
BONGINO: She gave him a total pass on the question. She should have doubled down like she doubled down on this kid.
And by the way, these are kids. These are kids. Everybody needs to keep that in mind.
GUTFELD: Also, he -- he allowed that lie to continue. There were many, many opportunities where people would say he's a Vietnam vet. He was in Vietnam. And he was, like, powerless to say, "No." Never -- he let it slide. And she let it slide.
Behind all of this, thought, if you step back, it's again identity politics. On that gameboard, there's only two pieces: Oppressor and oppressed.
BONGINO: Yes.
GUTFELD: When you look at who -- who the players are, of courses, the white kids in the red hats, they're the oppressors. The Native American lone man is the oppressed.
And no fact can get in the way of that, even if the lone Native American is a congenital liar who's -- you know, who's fibbed on a lot of things, who walked over there, who may have incited this.
And the kids, even if they were just nervous, maybe they could have acted a little bit better. But they were probably acting like kids. They probably did better than I would do. But that doesn't matter in the oppressor versus oppressed gameboard.
HARF: Why can't it -- each side has been using this from the beginning for political reasons. I've never been happier to not be on Twitter.
GUTFELD: But who started it, Marie?
HARF: Oh, right, because we're doing kindergarten taunts now. I've never --
WATTERS: Wait a second. Whoa, wait a second. Wait a second.
HARF: Wait --
WATTERS: There's conservatives in the media that corrected the false record.
HARF: Jesse, I have --
WATTERS: No one was using it for political reasons until it became a huge controversy.
HARF: Everyone involved behaved poorly at times. Everyone involved should have walked away and done something different.
WATTERS: So your blanket condemnation when it's clear who started it and who lied?
HARF: You're doing exactly what I'm criticizing. We can watch an hour- long video, which I did, and say, "Here's what the students should have done differently. Here's what Nathan Phillips should have done differently. The black Israelites are just terrible."
GUTFELD: But that was impossible -- Marie, wasn't possible to do.
HARF: My point is why can't we do that and not just say --
GUTFELD: I can answer that.
HARF: Why?
GUTFELD: Because the initial reaction was so intense that it took all the oxygen out. The Washington Post, once they pushed that out there, there was no way you could -- I fell for it, and I'm really smart.
HARF: I guess my point is --
GUTFELD: All right. Let's go to Dana, because we've got to wrap this up.
PERINO: I just -- I have a reading recommendation. Caitlin Flanagan, she writes for The Atlantic. She wrote a piece that is a must-read, I think, if you want to know a little bit about the media's perspective, how they got it wrong and what they should've done better.
I also think that Savannah tried to be very delicate in both interviews, and I don't know if that was the right thing to do. But I certainly don't think she should resign.
BONGINO: No, she needs to go.
WATTERS: A disgrace to all of humanity
GUTFELD: I think she -- she should go to jail, Dana.
WATTERS: All right. After Gillette's toxic masculinity ad fiasco, another company is trying to please that same PC crowd. Up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
HARF: In the wake of Gillette's ad taking on toxic masculinity, Big League Chew is now taking a swing at gender equality in sports. The iconic bubblegum brand launching its first ever softball line, featuring a female character on its new packaging.
And we have it. OK, let's go around. You love it, right?
BONGINO: Listen, I don't have a huge beef with this. My daughter played softball. I mean, it's not a big deal. The Gillette story drives me crazy.
And I did kind of grow up on -- I love this stuff.
HARF: Yes.
BONGINO: I am wolfing -- can I have this, by the way?
HARF: Yes.
BONGINO: The producers, can you tell me, maybe, can I take this home with me? OK, thank you. This is going home, and this whole wad is going right in my mouth after the show, because I love this stuff. It's really that good.
HARF: Jesse, feminism at its best?
WATTERS: Yes, I don't have a problem with it either.
HARF: Oh, my God.
BONGINO: You didn't even wait till the end of the show.
WATTERS: I mean --
HARF: Dana.
WATTERS (with a mouth full of chewing gum): If this was like chewing tobacco and put a girl on a chewing tobacco advertisement, that would be going too far. Like Gillette, girls -- do you eat chewing tobacco?
PERINO: No.
WATTERS: Have you ever had chewing tobacco?
HARF: No, I have never had it.
WATTERS: So this is fine.
PERINO: I grew up with cousins that did, though.
OK. So here's my thing. I am happy with the -- put the girl on the Big League Chew, that's fine. But I would just tell young women, if you really want to get promoted, don't be chewing that gum at work like that. You don't want to be that person.
BONGINO: I don't know about that.
PERINO: I'm telling you.
BONGINO: I think it makes you look a little more relatable, chewing gum. Look at Jesse? Doesn't he look relatable right now?
PERINO: Yes, he looks like I want to promote him.
HARF: Are you OK there, killer?
WATTERS: I need a raise.
HARF: Greg, what do you think?
GUTFELD: All right. I am actually going to come out against this. It is just gum, right? So why is it necessary to create an appealing, masculine package for the girls? It is aping chewing tobacco.
And remember, candy cigarettes have been under fire, because they thought that was, like, some kind of gateway product to the real thing. If you let kids play with candy cigarettes. Now, are we going to let kids play with - - girls play with chewing tobacco, chewing gum?
You say, "Of course, it's no" -- but there's a weird little thing going on here. Achievements in equality are now measured by the adoption of bad or high-risk behaviors. OK?
So women live longer than men for a reason. They're not men. All right? They don't engage in high-risk behavior.
WATTERS: They don't chew tobacco.
GUTFELD: They don't chew tobacco. They don't drive fast. They don't necessarily do hard drugs, unless it's introduced to them by a high-risk male. And they don't -- so we're introducing this behavior as a virtue signal for equality when, in fact, it may unintentionally --
PERINO: We're actually superior from -- from the get-go.
GUTFELD: Yes, you don't need this. So your -- the virtue signal is harming its target. This is why virtue signaling sucks.
WATTERS: Are you saying women are slow drivers? Is that where you're going to go with that?
GUTFELD: No, they're better drivers. That's why they have lower -- that's why they have lower insurance.
HARF: Anything that makes women more play more sports, I'm all for.
GUTFELD: That doesn't make us play more sports.
PERINO: I will say one thing: It smells really good.
HARF: OK, we've got to go. "One More Thing" is up next.
WATTERS: It is good.
HARF: Stay tuned.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PERINO: It's time now for "One More Thing" -- Greg.
GUTFELD: I just want to let everybody know, I'm going to be on Tucker tonight, the show.
All right.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBOTIC VOICE (singing): Robots are great. Robots are great. Robots are great.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: Yes, robots are great, especially a robot dog. A lot of people like to kick dogs. Take a look at this.
Well, scientists have finally taught a robot dog how, once it's kicked and falls down, it can get back up.
Does this scare the crap out of you? I mean, this is definitely on the road to "Terminator." They're kicking this dog, right? This dog is --
PERINO: Never kick a dog.
GUTFELD: He's going to remember this. Do you know that this robot is going to remember everything in its nonconscious-thinking brain.
PERINO: Oh, my gosh. That's just terrible.
GUTFELD; It's going to do -- and you know why? You know why I love this? Because --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBOTIC VOICE (singing): Robots are great. Robots are great. Robots are great.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: All right. It's no "Animals Are Great."
PERINO: Yes, and never kick a real dog, ever.
GUTFELD: What about a robot dog? You're robotist.
PERINO: I don't care about the robot dog.
GUTFELD: Oh, you -- you just bought it. They're coming after you.
PERINO: Oh, my.
OK. So you know the 24-hour news cycle is sometimes hard to keep up with. Well, this toddler is feeling that way, too. You know, it's kind of hard to keep up with everything. But he likes to look at the words coming across the screen, right? He's, like, looking at all the captions. But he gets a little frustrated because he can't keep up. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(LITTLE BOY CHASING NEWS TICKER AT BOTTOM OF TV SCREEN, TOUCHING THE SCREEN)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No, no. Oh, no! No! Oh, no! Oh, no! No! No! No! Oh, no.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: That was so cute.
WATTERS: Very cute.
PERINO: Oh, and I'm not on anything tonight.
GUTFELD: Well, you're on something.
PERINO: Jesse.
WATTERS: OK, not everybody thinks animals are great, Greg.
I found one. This guy in India. Look at this video.
GUTFELD: Uh-oh. I'm afraid.
WATTERS: A guy in India gets pantsed by a bull. Look at that. Don't mess with the bull. You get the horns, Gutfeld. You get the horns. Look at that.
PERINO: Ouch, that's bad. That poor guy. Ouch. Ouch, ouch.
You're not on anything tonight?
WATTERS: Not on any show.
PERINO: OK. Marie.
HARF: So at the Cincinnati Zoo, baby hippo Fiona turns two years old today.
GUTFELD: You are obsessed.
HARF: She was born prematurely in 2017. She was only 29 pounds at birth. Usually, they're 55 to 120 pounds at birth. She almost didn't make it. She got this amazing care from the zoo personnel. She started to thrive.
She's now, today, weighs over 1,000 pounds. They gave her her own party today with a cake. She is the best. Happy birthday, Fiona.
GUTFELD: Very attractive.
PERINO: Dana, can you top that?
BONGINO: Well, I'm on Hannity tonight. "FOX & Friends" tomorrow, so I've got a two-fer there. Don't miss that. Yes, I can.
What is the new rage? The beard bouquet.
GRAPHIC: (MAN WITH ARTIFICIAL FLOWERS TWISTED INTO HIS BEARD)
BONGINO: This comes from the Dan Bongino "No, no, no, don't do it" file, ever. But he's not the first person to think of this, whoever -- he or she, we don't know.
PERINO: That's terrible.
BONGINO: Apparently, back in 2014, a company sold beard ornaments. Check this one out.
So I have an idea for an entrepreneur out there. They say FOX has a big audience. How about beard nuggets? Like chicken nuggets you can hang from your beard. Then when you get hungry, you flip one up. Right? Greg, what do you think?
GUTFELD: That's delicious. A lot of -- a lot of food ends up in people's beards, and I find that problematic.
WATTERS: That's toxic masculinity right there.
BONGINO: I want a royalty, by the way, if someone starts that up. I just want that -- I got it on record here.
PERINO: Yes, I don't think we're for that.
All right. This has been fun. Set your DVRs.
(CROSSTALK)
PERINO: Never miss an episode of "The Five." You never change the channel when this man is on, last name Roberts, first name John.
GUTFELD: Ooh.
JOHN ROBERTS, CORRESPONDENT: Beard nuggets, an image that I just cannot unsee. Thanks for that, Dana.
GUTFELD: A lot of food ends up in people's beard and I find that problematic.
(CROSSTALKING)
BONGINO: By the way, if someone starts that up, I just want that -- I got it on record here.
HARF: There we go.
PERINO: Yes, I don't think we're for that.
All right. This has been fun.
GUTFELD: Has it been?
(CROSSTALKING)
PERINO: Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five".
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