Is the WH properly handling the Wolff book controversy?

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," January 4, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Geraldo Rivera, Jesse Watters and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5:00 in New York City, and this is "The Five."

Did Steve Bannon betray President Trump? The president wouldn't answer that question at the White House earlier, but he did offered these words about his former aide now persona non grata.


UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: Did Steve Bannon betray you?


PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I don't know. He called me a great man last night. So, you know, he obviously changed his tune pretty quick. Thank you all very much.


TRUMP: Thank you. I don't talk to him. I don't know.


PERINO: Despite yesterday's public lashing from his former boss, Bannon had only nice words to say about Mr. Trump last night.


UNINDENTIFIED MALE: The president of the United States is a great man. You know I support him day in and day out. Whether going to the country giving the Trump miracle speech or on the show on the website, so I don't think you have to worry about that. But I appreciate the kind words.


PERINO: The ex-chief strategist now faces the threat of legal action from the president's lawyers over, quote, disparaging statements and violating an agreement not to disclose confidential information. He's been sent a cease and desist letter to avoid any further disclosures, so has author Michael Wolff, who published Bannon's quotes in a new book about the Trump White House. The president is trying to stop the book from being released, but it's now due out tomorrow, four days early. So Geraldo, I thought I would start with you on the legal front -- or Kimberly, you can take it either way. At this point the book is coming out. I mean, there's really nothing you can do legally, right?

GERALDO RIVERA, GUEST CO-HOST: Well, you could do a cease and desist letter. I am opposed to them. They show a kind of a panic. They bring more attention than, you know, they are ineffective. There's a first amendment in this country. They have the right to publish and then be sued. You know, it's obvious that there are plenty of problems with the book as seen through the eyes of the Trump administration.

But they're trying to stop it ahead of time does nothing other than to drive sales and it looks right. Charles Harder the attorney that they have hired is a real formidable attorney. He's the guy that crushed on behalf of Hulk Hogan. You remember? So, I think that's real. But why draw even more attention? It's really -- look at this fire. It's the kind of thing you don't want to do. All it's done is accelerate the publication.

PERINO: Yeah. Kimberly, I was saying earlier today that when you're dealing with a book P.R. situation if it's negative for your principles, there's two ways to deal with it, either try to ignore it and start a bit of attention or try to counterpunch. The president's statement was really strong yesterday, and Sarah Sanders had this to say earlier.


SARAH SANDERS, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I'm not going to waste my time or the country's time going page by page talking about a book that's complete fantasy and just full of tabloid gossip because it's sad, pathetic. There are probably more than 30 requests for access to information from Michael Wolff that were repeatedly denied. He never discussed this book with the president. He was repeatedly denied that, I think because we saw him for what he was and there was no reason for us to waste the president of the United States time.


PERINO: Sarah Sanders, Kimberly, is having to clean up a mess that she didn't start, which is inviting Michael Wolff into the White House in the first place.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Yes. Well, I mean, it's a problem - - look, they decided somehow, someway, that they're going to give him access and he has had access, a very high profile people like the chairman -- you know, or this company and former chairman. So, he's actually had the ability to get these kinds of interviews and get unfettered access, I think, you know, early on in the administration, probably not a very good idea. It's ill-advised because you're not going to let somebody be exposed to the shop the first day it opens. Like restaurants they open up it's like a lot of things that kind of going on.


GUILFOYLE: Yeah, yeah. Wait until it's baked in a bit and you've got a few dagger reviews. But beside that, then you let him in and he's like, hey, so he's like listening, right? He's paying attention to everything. He's quite conversational. He's talking to everyone. And what you think he may hear or not here, you know, he's picking up more than you think. You saw some of the Sean Spicer stuff where he's listening and absorbing the environment. That's what he does.

So, in a situation like this, it's vulnerable for a presidency, for an administration to put themselves at risk for someone like this that's obviously -- you know, a good writer that's going to write all this stuff out. And obviously, there's a lot of contention in terms of the accuracy of it, but he says he has tapes as well. The publishers are doubling -- let's be honest, they're trying to sell books. So because of all the hype, all of the news coverage that you see on absolutely every network about this, they want to capitalize it in a free-market society be able to get the sales out.

PERINO: That's the other thing, Greg, the P.R. nightmare that a White House might be going through on this -- like, it will end. It will be like two or three more days in the news cycle, probably the Sunday shows and then I think they'll be on to another topic.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Yeah. But that's the beauty of the Trump presidency. There's always something coming over the horizon. It blows your mind. This is the end of the world. No, hold my beer--

GUILFOYLE: He needs to do a Mika tweet immediately.

GUTFELD: Yeah, exactly. I have to agree with Kimberly, 100 percent on everything she said.


GUILFOYLE: Most men are.

GUTFELD: So it's news that it's chaos and dysfunctional when nonpoliticians actually move into a political realm. Isn't what this is all about? This guy is there witnessing cronies out and, essentially, you in. These are people that have not governed, who are just like the people who kind of vote. You can say, yeah, he's a billionaire. But he's kind of like your uncle. So your uncle just became president. I challenge that he's one of us if we became president we've had a similar -- maybe except for Dana because she's been there before, but we would have had a similar experience. And so, I think the book's message -- you made a good point about the writer too. This is not about a perfect White House. It's about a human White House.

PERINO: Right.

GUTFELD: These are not beautiful people from Davos, or Aspen, or Harvard. These are people who can barely shave. If you look, Bannon shaves half his face. These are people who are ignorant of politics but savvy of the streets. You put street fighters in there from Queens and elsewhere. And Democrats have to be consistent about this because they nominated a neo- fight over Hillary Clinton, remember? They did it first with Obama and they won.

So this was just the pendulum. Lastly, you said that Wolff is a good writer. He is a good writer. The reporting is strange to me that it feels like he's forcing observations and conclusions to fulfill the good story writing that he make. He has a great story. He writes in an active voice. But the reporting is in the passive. It's as almost things are happening without a reason, and I think that's weird. So part of me says, yeah, a lot of this could happen but it's like he's shoveling it into a way that fits a story.

PERINO: Maggie Haberman of the New York Times says it was a thin read, well-written, but could have used a copy edit.

GUTFELD: Yeah. You know what that is though, that's intense rivalry. That's her going, oh, I wish I had that book.

PERINO: They did a great saying, Jesse, that this is actually--


JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: It's like The Five came into the White House, and there is an author there documenting everything. All of a sudden, a year later it's like--


WATTERS: Kimberly was on the phone half the time. Gutfeld was complaining about his apartment. Jesse was a jerk. Juan was late.

GUILFOYLE: Geraldo lost his shirt.

PERINO: I was tapping my foot and being annoying.

WATTERS: Dana was judging everybody by her eyes. This is exactly how it would be.

GUILFOYLE: But would it be a true story?



GUILFOYLE: Wait a second--


WATTERS: But it's not true, half false, because they also say Trump didn't know Boehner and they came out with pictures of Trump playing golf with Boehner, so you don't know what to believe. But the bottom line is that Bannon betrayed the family. What's the quote from the Godfather? Never go against the family. He went after Jared, and he went after Don Jr.

PERINO: But he was doing that for months.

WATTERS: But he'd been leaking. This was a direct quote--

PERINO: He was on the record.

WATTERS: I don't know if he was on the record as pretty strongly--

PERINO: When he was in Alabama for the Roy Moore event on stage on live television he was talking -- he was basically making fun of Ivanka for saying that there is special place in hell for people like -- that are accused of things--


WATTERS: The Don Jr. thing. And then, you know, Jared--


GUILFOYLE: Not from day one. This was not any kind of kumbaya love situation between Steve Bannon, between Ivanka, Jared, Don Jr., Gary Cohn--

(CROSSTALK) PERINO: So that's the team of rivals concept then that could work for a president?

GUTFELD: I think it's more like Dallas.

(CROSSTALK) PERINO: Helped me out, Geraldo. Don't you agree with me?

RIVERA: This whole notion though where they make an observation as damning as the fact that they want to invoke the 25th amended that the president is having these memory and emotional lapses and he's not himself. This is such bunk. I'm sorry to say, but this is quoting people who spend no time with the president.

You know, I didn't spend any time with him over the Christmas holidays, but we were together for an hour coming back on Airforce One from Puerto Rico, and it was just the two of us and we've arrives. And I've known him for 40 years. We did the Celebrity Apprentice together, specifically 6 weeks -- every day. He's as sharp as ever he has, as relaxed as ever. In terms of his physical prowess, he can outrun me easily. And I think that to damn him in that way with a charge that is that vague and yet that incendiary, I think it's very, very unfair.

WATTERS: Trump is a fast runner?


GUTFELD: Geraldo is saying he can outrun you. I mean--


GUILFOYLE: No, but can he out-box you.

RIVERA: He can outspend me.


GUILFOYLE: By the way, people can say whatever they want. Bottom line is the president is very hardworking. He campaigned as hard as anybody that ran for the office of presidency. He had no lack of any kind, like fatigue in the situation. He was 100 percent all in, trying to win and get after it. Way more than Hillary Clinton, let's be honest. She was happy to collect dollars, and he was out there trying to collect votes, OK. Making all the stops. And it was 1:00 in the morning, he would show up there in Michigan and make sure that he made all those rallies and he'll talk to every reporter. Every time we were at one of those conventions or debates, et cetera, he was out there the whole time doing the press gaggle talking to everybody. And so they're trying to take that away from him. You know, say what you want about -- maybe send as many accurate criticisms, but don't go and misrepresent a lie about the man's ability and his stamina--


GUILFOYLE: He wanted to win. There isn't a day in his life that he doesn't wake up and say I want to crush it. I want to make the other guy cry for his mom--


GUILFOYLE: Me too, that what I feel.

PERINO: Last word to Greg.

GUTFELD: You know what, the thing is, some of these things could be true. I mean, he could eat cheeseburgers in bed. I mean, that's a problem?

GUILFOYLE: Who doesn't?

GUTFELD: Who doesn't. I mean, that's how I want to go, America.

GUILFOYLE: Pizza on your own bed.

GUTFELD: Let's say you look at some of the things and you think, ah, some of this could be true. Temperamental, impulsive, whatever you think. I want to quote this guy, he's a philosopher -- he said if a candidate or a person connects with you on one big thing, one big thing, then all the little things become little and they become acceptable, and it was something with me. I had a lot of problems with a lot of things, especially -- mainly about behavior and things we talked about at The Five, but the big thing which was the message over national domestic security. The fact that he nailed that down and since follow-through with that makes me accept the fact that -- yeah, he might say something that kind of like, oh, I can't believe he said that, but the fact is if you get the big thing right, the little things--

PERINO: It doesn't matter.

GUTFELD: -- don't matter.

GUILFOYLE: Give credit for the accomplishment--


GUILFOYLE: Twenty five thousand -- right, the people don't want to talk about it. They want to talk about whether he eats cheeseburgers. I mean, God, I hope so. I mean, cheeseburger, obviously, do amazing things to your body.


PERINO: New investigations into Hillary Clinton's private server again, next.


WATTERS: I've got some bad news for Hillary Clinton. The Justice Department has just reportedly reopened the investigation into the former secretary of state's use of a private email server, something President Trump has been asking for quite a while. A source tells The Daily Beast, Attorney General Jeff Sessions describes the probe as a way of gathering new information about the handling of classified documents by Clinton and here aide. And there's clearly reason for more investigating. Judicial Watch just found out that at least 18 classified emails were found on Anthony Weiner's laptop. He's, of course, the husband of Hillary's top aide Huma Abedin. So Greg, do we just need to let this thing go or do you think there's real reason to dig back into it?

GUTFELD: I just feel bad for every investigator that has to handle Anthony Weiner's laptop. God knows what's been on there. Hey, look--


GUTFELD: Special chemicals to spray it down. The guys come in hazmat suits. They've got like these tongs--


GUILFOYLE: They're like CSI tongs.

GUTFELD: Exactly. Dump it in a vat of acid.

GUILFOYLE: Black light.


GUILFOYLE: This isn't a professional show.


GUTFELD: Anybody in the lower office would be getting three hots and a cot, which is prison, not a Dr. Seuss book. But, I guess, at least somebody is being consistent about this in the sense that it's like Trump is like a dog that already caught the car and actually kept running. I mean, he still wants to do this. He's still going after this.

WATTERS: He said he wasn't going to do it when he was elected. He said he was going to let bygones be bygones. But now, I guess, after he's been attacked--


WATTERS: -- he's going to turn the heat up on the left.

PERINO: It's interesting to see if the DOJ is really doing anything. This is a story -- anonymous -- right, leaked to The Daily Beast. You have this story that say you have one Republican leaning strategist saying, well, this makes sense because -- would have finally some nonpartisan people and objective people look at her email situation. Then you have the other thing which is the White House continues to agitate about this. So Jeff Sessions like dribble something out every once in a while to keep the president satisfy, and to keep the story going that Hillary Clinton is really the culprit on email.

WATTERS: Do you think Jeff Sessions has been browbeaten by the president on twitter--


GUILFOYLE: On his little eyebrow?

WATTERS: Yeah. Poor Jeff.

GUILFOYLE: Poor thing.

WATTERS: Force into this.

GUILFOYLE: Well, no, I mean, look, you go where justice leads you, right? And he should be doing an investigation if there's new evidence have come to light. You have an obligation to go forward and actually examine it. Give a full, fair and impartial evaluation -- yeah, you do.


GUILFOYLE: By the way, if new evidence--


GUILFOYLE: Fine. If new evidence comes to light, why wouldn't you?

RIVERA: Get over it.

GUILFOYLE: Get over what? Get over crime?

RIVERA: What's the crime? Is there one scintilla of evidence that suggests the Russians got any intelligence from Hillary Clinton's private email server? Have we beaten this thing to death? This is like Benghazi. You already ruin the career of Trey Gowdy. Ruin the career of Jason Chaffetz--

GUILFOYLE: OK, wait a second. Wait a second--

RIVERA: I mean--

GUILFOYLE: Jason Chaffetz got hired here.


GUILFOYLE: I think he's winning. What is wrong with you?


RIVERA: This is so old, so stall, so pointless--

GUTFELD: But Geraldo, that's my point about the consistency. If you don't need the story anymore -- you won the election, you let it go. By not letting it go, it shows you're actually moral and consistent.

GUILFOYLE: I agree. When you shine a light on something, you're not ruing someone's career. In fact, Chaffetz sat in Jesse's seat.


RIVERA: OK. So what's the big headline in The Daily Beast story? That there was some guy -- some guy that serviced her private computer that lied to the FBI or misled the FBI. They chose not to prosecute him. They gave him immunity instead. So the guy got immunity. So where does it go from there? It goes no place. This is a waste of time and it distracts the Department of Justice. Makes them look like lackeys. Makes Sessions look like Kate McKinnon on Saturday Night Live for goodness sake. Jumping out of the closet and sitting on Trump's lap. I mean, it is really -- I'm so sick of it. Hillary's email is like Benghazi. It's like Benghazi in the sense there's nothing there, there.

GUTFELD: There's nothing there in Benghazi?

RIVERA: You get over, you move on. You want to go after the Democrats on something that makes sense--

GUILFOYLE: We're all in on Benghazi on this show.

GUTFELD: I think when they blamed Benghazi on a video, that was a pretty big lie.

GUILFOYLE: Right. And put the guy in jail.

(CROSSTALK) RIVERA: The first million times, I was with you.

(CROSSTALK) GUTFELD: I don't think you ever let anybody forget a lie that they haven't yet admitted.

RIVERA: Who's going to forget it? How can they possibly--

GUTFELD: Hillary lived off that lie.

RIVERA: Here you have the American economy humming along. You have people--

GUTFELD: I agree.

RIVERA: -- full employment.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah. But you can walk and chew gum. Why not examine both?

RIVERA: They wanted to look backward--

WATTERS: He's using his leverage because they're turning the screws to him on some unfair stuff. You said lock her up in the green room and I'm knocking to let you get away with it.


WATTERS: Joe Biden tearing into President Trump, again. Set off by that nuke tweet, ahead.


GUTFELD: All right.

Last night on CNN, otherwise known as the "Cannabis News Network," Joe Biden nailed Trump for poor judgment when communicating.


JOE BIDEN, FORMER VICE PRESIDENT: I think it is -- shows really poor judgment for the president to perform the way he does, particularly with tweets, but not just with his tweets. Words matter.

This is not a game. This is not about, you know, can I puff my chest out bigger than your chest?

It's not presidential.



GUTFELD: Wow. So Biden told Trump how words matter. This from a guy who could supply "America's Funniest Home Videos" with a decade full of flubs, not counting the words lifted from other people's speeches. Remember that?

But I kid, Joe. We know what he's up to. He's sticking his toe in the pool of the next election. Let's just hope, Kimberly, he's wearing swim trunks this time.

GUILFOYLE: Midnight swimmer.

GUTFELD: Yeah. He does tend to forget them -- swims naked.

All right. Fact is, labeling Trump's rhetoric as not presidential isn't just old news, it misses the point entirely. That rhetoric may be providing the progress missing when Biden was too busy hugging anything that moved. And America already gets it, Biden seems stuck in the past. He's Fred Flintstone in a Jetson world. And yet, he is the Democratic Party's new blood.

Fact: since Trump unleashed his tongue and cheek tweets, North and South Korea are now talking. It's amazing that a twice-divorced dude like Trump is such a good marriage counselor.

GUILFOYLE: Take it easy.


GUTFELD: Yeah. There's 17 between you two.

Other countries are finally coming around to our way of dealing with North Korea. Sometimes you've got to speak crazy to beat crazy, and it's way more persuasive than the analysis and paralysis that characterized Obama's chin-stroking navel- gazing.

Biden claims that North Korea is not a game. But come on, everything is. And the evidence here suggests that we're winning. Focusing on words not deeds reveals Biden's ignorance of success. Let's hope that's all he reveals.

Hmm, indeed. Gearing up, Kimberly, Biden? Is he gearing up?

GUILFOYLE: Gearing up indeed. He's a little chatty these days, right?

GUTFELD: Slow and chatty, doesn't win the race.

GUILFOYLE: But it's interesting because you see and his rhetoric sort of matches that, because you see like the Democratic Party and the left are like twinning with the mainstream media about this whole thing. The hyperbole of President Trump. It's so dangerous. What is he doing. These tweets, you know. We should make sure -- maybe they should be blocked. Maybe he should be impeached. This is reckless. It's endangering all of us. It's poking the cage of North Korea into action and making us all unsafe. And therefore, no one can sleep at night. Their silent screaming inside and little yoga balls. But he's appealing to that mood, that sort of like panic, euphoria over Trump. And the more they think he can tweet something they get excited. Because they think, wait a second, maybe this will be it. Maybe this will finally shed the light on him. But ultimately, I think, yes, Joe Biden is probably thinking he should have run instead of Hillary Clinton--

GUTFELD: Yeah. They've talked him out of it. Dana, he has had more gaffes than a gaffe making machine.

PERINO: Are we counting that now?


GUILFOYLE: It's a look back.


GUTFELD: It's funny that he is now the arbiter of this.

PERINO: Well, I think that -- I do think he's trying to put his toe in. I think that's one of the reasons he was speaking so slowly. He was trying to be very cautious--


PERINO: ... in his words, which is not necessarily what will help you win an election.


PERINO: Right? I think we just learned that.

I think that it's going to be different under President Trump, because he's not going to talk to our enemies the same way he talks to the United Kingdom and to Italy. Right? So talking to North Korea is just going to sound and feel a little bit different.

If North and South Korea this week had not decided to open up a hotline, and maybe hostilities deepened, I think that President Trump's administration would've had the flexibility to say, "That's exactly what we want." And we would be praising it and saying this is right, because we've got to freeze them out. So they're flexible, and they're just trying to figure -- I don't think anybody actually really knows what the end game is here.

GUTFELD: I think I know the end game, Jesse.

WATTERS: What's that?

GUTFELD: Everything is going to be great. Just generally.

WATTERS: In your world, it always is.

GUILFOYLE: I know, "LEGO Movie."

(SINGING): Everything is awesome.

GUTFELD: Exactly. Everything's going to be great. For the world. Not necessarily for me.

GUILFOYLE: He's disappointed (ph).

WATTERS: I don't think President Trump has been very presidential. I think he's been new-age presidential. And that's what Joe Biden's missing. It's a new Trump; it's a new presidency. And he was lower energy than Jeb. I've never seen Biden like that. It was kind of ridiculous.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

WATTERS: And to say that he has poor judgment, let's look back at Biden's judgment. Biden was against Russia -- Reagan putting missiles in Poland. He was against "Star Wars." He was against the bin Laden raid.


WATTERS: He voted against Desert Storm. Then he wanted to divide Iraq into three countries. Then he was for retreating from Iraq.

So the guy has got no legs to stand on. Why are we even listening to Joe Biden in the first place?

RIVERA: But isn't it not about Biden? It is about, in this specific instance, North Korea. So what happened?

As I said yesterday, it's about the deeds, not the words, and what happened? President Trump agreed to suspend the joint military exercises with South Korea, thereby lowering or conceding something to North Korea, making it more likely the North Korea South Korea rapprochement. And sort of the...


GUILFOYLE: Say it again.

RIVERA: The -- the making more likely the joint delegations for the Olympics. So there's real progress. What they have to do is understand New Yorkers are different.


RIVERA: He has a very flamboyant nature. There's an aspect of him that's, in terms of the charismatic reality show background that he has and promoting big business and creating big business. There's an aspect of him that is a lot of flash. But when it comes to the bang, you've got to look and see exactly what his policy is. And in this case, the policy is traditional; it's positive; it has succeeded, apparently, at least in this transitional stage. And I think you've got to give the president a break.

GUTFELD: All right. Joe Biden is the new blood of the Democratic Party. I'm excited about that, actually.

RIVERA: Yes, he liked that music you started with.

GUTFELD: Yes, he is -- he is a big fan of death metal.

GUILFOYLE: Red Death (ph).

GUTFELD: All right. Or thrash metal. Let's be specific.

Controversy over a new federal crackdown on weed, next.


GUILFOYLE: A big battle brewing over a Trump administration crackdown on marijuana and states that have already legalized it. Today, Attorney General Jeff Sessions issued a memo ordering Obama several administration directives to be rescinded. Ones that discourage the enforcement of federal marijuana laws in states where it's legal, like Colorado. That state's Republican senator was not happy about it. Cory Gardner was fired up -- didn't light up -- on the floor earlier.


SEN. CORY GARDNER, R-COLO.: Then-Senator Sessions told me that marijuana simply wasn't going to be on President Trump's agenda. That was back in the spring of 2016, and up until 8:58 this morning, that was the policy.

One tweet later, one policy later, a complete reversal of what many of us on the Hill were told, before the confirmation, what we had continued to believe the last year. And without any notification, conversation, or dialogue with Congress, completely reversed.


GUILFOYLE: Woo, up in smoke. Here's the White House on the subject.


SANDERS: The president believes in enforcing federal law. That would be his top priority. And that is, regardless of what the topic is, whether it's marijuana or whether it's immigration, the president strongly believes that we should enforce federal law.


GUILFOYLE: Colorado's U.S. attorney says today his office won't change its approach to prosecuting marijuana crimes, despite the Justice Department's shift. Ms. Perino.

PERINO: Well, I haven't been in Colorado as a resident for, I think, 23 years.

GUILFOYLE: But you keep up on it.

PERINO: If I were there, I would have voted against it, because I don't like it, and I know that it -- but it passed by, like, a big majority. And I think that, were it to be held up again for a vote, it would pass by an even bigger majority. They love the money; they love the freedom. And there's downsides to it, as well.

But I think what Cory Gardner is saying is that, on the merits of it, that he had a promise from Jeff Sessions...


PERINO: ... that this wasn't going to happen. And I think that he deserves an explanation, as do the rest of us, as to why there's the change.

But what Sarah Sanders said is absolutely true, and this has been a problem from the beginning with this. Is that there is a federal law that says that marijuana is a Schedule 1 narcotic. You have states that then passed laws saying it's legal, so then you have state law saying it's fine. Federal law, as you know, right, supersedes state law.

And so Obama administration was like, "Hey, U.S. attorneys, don't worry about it. Just like, pretend you don't even see it."

What Jeff Sessions is saying is that "We're not going to do that anymore. If you're a U.S. attorney and you want to go after something, especially the big weed, as it's called, big corporate weed, go for it. I'm not going to -- I'm not going to tell you not to do it."

GUILFOYLE: The big weed.

PERINO: So what basically has to happen is that if Congress really wants to fix this...


PERINO: ... then they need to pass a law to take marijuana off that list.

GUILFOYLE: They need to legislate. That's exactly what needs to happen. I love that. That was like little cartoons, little, like, how to become a bill. OK, Greg.

(SINGING): I'm only a bill.

GUTFELD: This completely confused me, this act. And I -- thank you for the clarification. Even though you're on the wrong side of the law. But...

PERINO: Actually, I'm on the right side of the law, federally.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, we're actually...

GUTFELD: Federally. But morally, you're wrong. But I'll get to that. You're an immoral person about pot. But anyway...

WATTERS: You roll your eyes at him.

GUTFELD: Yes, right.

GUILFOYLE: Deep freeze (ph), too. Deep freeze (ph).

GUTFELD: I think this is allowing Sessions to be what he wants, which is to go after gangs, be the law enforcer, while inevitably, like you said, it's going to end up letting the states make up their minds. So he gives these attorneys the discretion with limited resources and maybe -- then maybe it happens. Maybe it doesn't. But he can go like this and go, "Well, I did my thing, but you know, it will still be OK for the people who want to, you know, get high."

The big picture here for me is that drugs are guilty of coming in second. You know, alcohol got there first in this race as an acceptable form of release. And it was like we decided as a culture we can only handle one thing. We can only handle alcohol, which is arguably far worse than pot when it comes to so many things.

Maybe science will show us differently when we start doing research and we start looking at whether people are dying from this, dying in the same numbers that they die from alcohol, which is so lopsided. I mean, I think you can count on your hand how many people have died from pot overdoses. You may not even be able to count it on a finger.

GUILFOYLE: I actually liked your opinions about climate better than I'm digging this.

GUTFELD: My point is, this is a lot of wasted energy. Part of being human is seeking an escape from life. We have a right to pursue happiness, even though it is impossible. But happiness is OK if it's a martini or a pack of Camels, but if you choose happiness some other way, you get judged for it. And that is, to your point, immoral, Dana. And I'm very disappointed in you.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, well, oh, my God. OK.

PERINO: It's rare that I'm called immoral.

GUTFELD: That's why I'm doing it.

PERINO: I'm going to contemplate (ph) that for a little bit.

RIVERA: This is reefer madness. Come on. This is retro. This is sad. This is prohibition. This is going backwards.

GUTFELD: I agree.

RIVERA: We have an opioid crisis.

GUTFELD: I agree.

RIVERA: We have half the country's addicted to heroin and we have an attorney general wants to take the Justice Department...


GUTFELD: And pot can help with the opioid problem.

RIVERA: This is ridiculous. Isn't it?

PERINO: That's why they need to explain it better. They should've come out and had some sort of explanation rather than us sitting here thinking that they want to go after individual pot smokers. I don't think that's their intention.

GUILFOYLE: It isn't their intention.

RIVERA: But it certainly was not that clear from what the attorney general said.

PERINO: I know.

RIVERA: I just came back from Telluride, Colorado. There's no way -- they've got four big stores right downtown. There's no way they're going to go back on that.

PERINO: I think my cousin owns one.

RIVERA: California, lines around the corner. I bet 80 percent of the people watching right now have smoked pot.

GUILFOYLE: Guess what? Guess what? Dana's right.

GUTFELD: We're high right now.

GUILFOYLE: Explains a lot, Greg. Yes, no one is trying to dip into your pinot noir, pill situation, whatever you've got going on.

WATTERS: Roll them up, K.G.

GUILFOYLE: He does drink the pinot.

WATTERS: That he does.

GUILFOYLE: OK, but Geraldo, this is more like Dana is saying, it's a messaging and communications problem. I don't think they're trying going after the individual users; they're not going after people that are using this, you know, medical marijuana for medicinal purposes. This is where this -- the two worlds collide of drug trafficking, DEA, narcotics, guns, money. Where all of that is actually a big problem.

RIVERA: Yes, the potential $68 billion industry that is employing 250,000 people, and all this did was to put uncertainty where certainty seemed to be emerging. All this did was to...

GUILFOYLE: Well, they've got to fix it.

RIVERA: ... was to cripple people who had business plans and had -- you know, there was a market. And they were given a signal by the 44th president, and now the attorney general of the 45th president is changing the mind. It's only 2013. It wasn't like it was 20 years ago.

GUILFOYLE: Taking all their -- all their LegalZoom documents. OK. Jess.

WATTERS: I'm a hypocrite on weed. I smoked it, but I don't want want my children to smoke it.

RIVERA: That's a hypocrite.

WATTERS: I don't think it's very good for you. I don't think it's good for teenagers to smoke it. I get that teenagers are going to smoke it. I understand that normal adults are going to smoke it if they want to smoke it.

I don't think they should be drinking and smoking at the same time. That's a little dangerous. But if people have a medical condition, then if weed helps out, that's good. But I know that it's also been abused.

GUTFELD: You are riding a fence so hard...

WATTERS: Really?

GUTFELD: ... you should see a doctor.

GUILFOYLE: Is he trying -- is he trying to sell a (UNINTELLIGIBLE) again?


RIVERA: Who are you stroking here?

GUILFOYLE: How about everybody?

WATTERS: Let the states decide. I don't mind if its gay marriage, if it's weed. They voted for it.

GUILFOYLE: You're like a Groupon.

WATTERS: The people of Colorado want it. They voted for it.


PERINO: In all of those...

GUILFOYLE: You're like a Groupon coupon. Going after everybody here.


PERINO: If there wasn't a federal law saying that you couldn't. OK, so that is -- that is, I think, the thing.

WATTERS: Like Obama had a don't ask, don't tell deal with pot.

PERINO: President Trump is saying to the Congress...


PERINO: ... "Deal with it."

The other thing I want to say, there is a problem. I'll give you one example. And that is, if you are going for a government job in Colorado and you need a top-secret clearance, that you're going to be building airplanes...

GUTFELD: Good point.

PERINO: ... OK? So now they're running out of employees who can actually pass the drug test and get employed and work on these government planes. So either the Congress needs to do something...


PERINO: ... or the state needs to figure it out. Or at least the word needs to get out to these younger people that, if you think that you're going to work for the federal government, you are not going to be able to smoke pot. And that includes if you live in Colorado or Washington.

GUTFELD: Also military. Is it -- the military. How many young guys smoke pot who are good, strong people?

PERINO: And they're starting to -- they're starting to relax that. But I think that if Congress would take President Trump up on his offer to get this into a state of more certainty, it would be better off for everyone.

GUILFOYLE: And specificity. Otherwise right now, Cheech and Chong need not apply. Your buddy.

RIVERA: I can see Cheech working on an airplane.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Oh, boy.

RIVERA: I'm flying that baby.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Some folks in Oregon aren't happy about the state's new self-serve law. The fuel frenzy, next.


RIVERA: A rash of new laws went into effect as of the first. Big Brother taking a tiny step backward in Oregon. Oregon, one of only two states that prohibited drivers from pumping their own gas. Really. There was no self- serve gas in Oregon. New Jersey is the other state. Now Oregon, though, will allow stations in smaller towns, less than 40,000 people, to offer self-service.

That's apparently set off a Mach 5 panic. A local news station asking residents to react to this new freedom, that they can now sell -- pump their own gas. Hysterical responses gone viral. One: "I don't even know how to pump it." Another one: "I don't want to smell like gas." Another one: "I had to do it once in California while visiting my brother. I almost died."

GUILFOYLE: What the hell?

RIVERA: You ever pump your own gas?

GUILFOYLE: Believe it or -- what would you think the answer is to that question?

PERINO: Of course.

GUTFELD: "Which car?" is the answer.

RIVERA: What about your nails?

GUILFOYLE: I've ever done my own -- I think I'm better at pumping gas than doing nails. If I have to do anything, I can do it. Put it that way, right? Whatever it takes. But yes, I actually enjoy pumping gas.

RIVERA: Get out.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, I really do.

RIVERA: Why? The way it smells? Why?

GUILFOYLE: No, I don't like the smell. No. What? I like that you go in, you do it, you take care of it. Yes, I love to drive. I'm a very good driver. I'm very into it. I've driven, like, you know, sports cars and for commercial stunt driving and everything. So I like to go. I like to pump my gas. I like to make sure I'm putting in the good stuff.

WATTERS: You sound like Trump. "I'm the best driver. I drive sports cars."

GUILFOYLE: I can prove it.

RIVERA: It's a blue state. Do you think this is just, like, liberal, effetist [SIC] nonsense, Jesse?

WATTERS: You know, I don't know. If you grew up not pumping your gas, I could see why you wouldn't want to do it. I like to pump gas, too. You go in, you get the nozzle. You slash the card. I like to throw it in backwards, then you lean back on the car and you check everybody out.

GUILFOYLE: Talk to people.

WATTERS: Say hi to everybody.

RIVERA: But then if your hands are freezing and they stick to the thing.

PERINO: I know. I mean, because I grew up in Colorado. And so yes, when I was -- I always pumped my own gas. So when I got married, I don't ever pumped gas again. And also, if you go to New Jersey, they pump it for you.

But I do think it's pretty funny. From an economic standpoint, these small businesses are trying to find a way to stay alive and to save money, and one of the ways to do that is to allow for some self-pumping.

RIVERA: And yet, Greg, it deprives people who would be gas station attendants.

GUTFELD: That's progress. We don't have a lot of people that are, you know, steering horse carriages either.

GUILFOYLE: A lot of times they come out to

GUTFELD: You know, they offered this to me as a monologue, and I thought ripping people who -- ripping up people who can't pump gas would be kind of hypocritical, since I haven't driven in five years.


GUTFELD: And it is -- and I can break the simplest machinery. I was saying earlier, I broke two corkscrews this week.

GUILFOYLE: And all of your apartments.

GUTFELD: It speaks to a larger issue that we're moving away from auto life to the smartphone. The smartphone is replacing the car. We -- the highway is now broadband freeways. And so our minds are actually traveling, and we're not. Our bodies are staying put. That's why we're getting -- or I'm getting rounder. Because I'm not going anywhere, because my brain is going.

RIVERA: I don't know how that figures into this discussion on whether or not there should be self-serve gas.

GUTFELD: It's absurd that we're having a discussion that the government is telling us it's suddenly OK to do this now. That's absurd. What I'm saying is no one is driving anymore.

RIVERA: "One More Thing" is up next.



PERINO: Time now for "One More Thing." As you've probably seen, the entire East Coast is getting pummeled by snow. There's a lot of it. But that also means there is salt on the roads, and dogs don't like it. So you've got to put boots on your dog. And Jasper, here's an example of how horrible it is.


PERINO: He hates it. It's terrible. Peter took that video this morning. All he wanted to do is be with his Uncle Barry.

GUILFOYLE: I think it's so...

GUTFELD: You put salt on your rug?

PERINO: He couldn't stand it. No, he wears the little boots and so he doesn't get burned.

GUILFOYLE: But it's so hard to walk like that.

PERINO: Yes, they want their footing.

All right, Jesse.


WATTERS: OK. We have a miniature edition of "Mom Texts."


GRAPHIC: Mom Texts


GUTFELD: Hate that.

WATTERS: OK, so my mom texted me yesterday: "Jesse, really good show. But how about trying to come up with more meaningful and impactful 'One More Things.' Your score on that front is not soaring."

So in response to this, you remember how we had that little story last week about there was a tie in the Virginia House of Delegates, and they're going to have to pick it out of a hat in order to determine the winner?


GUILFOYLE: The Republican won!

WATTERS: Well, Mom, here's the winner.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The winner of House District 94 is David Yancey.


WATTERS: The Republican.


WATTERS: Take that, Mom.

RIVERA: She's a Democrat, your mom?

WATTERS: Yes, she's s Democrat.

Also, I want to wish my younger sister a very happy birthday, Eliza. There you go.

RIVERA: How old is she?

WATTERS: I'm not going to say her age on air.

GUTFELD: Very good. Conservative?


PERINO: Go, Kimberly.

GUILFOYLE: All right, thank you so much.

In other snow news, yes, a little girl in Tallahassee, Florida, saw snow for the first time yesterday, and she declared it the best day ever. So snow here in the northeast, as we know, is nothing new, right? But today we had this massive snowstorm. It was a snow bomb, a cyclone, whatever. So take a look at her reaction, how happy she was.


UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's snowing! I can't believe it.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is the best day ever.



GUILFOYLE: So cute. So see how happy she was, Greg? With a positive attitude. And even though they just got an inch of snow, she was joyful. She had a heart filled with gratitude.

GUTFELD: She's also not an adult and hasn't grown to experience the horrors of life.

PERINO: What do you have for us today?

GUTFELD: Let's roll it.

GUILFOYLE: Say some snowflakes.


GRAPHIC: Greg's Panicky News


GUTFELD: "Greg's Panicky News." All right. This is me reacting to the snow when I couldn't get my wine delivered.




GUTFELD: A lot of the deliveries were delayed.

WATTERS: Is that why you broke your corkscrew?

GUTFELD: I broke my corkscrew. I couldn't get the wine. I just ran around my apartment. I have a large apartment.

GUILFOYLE: See what pot does to you?

GUTFELD: Exactly.

GUILFOYLE: This is the problem.

GUTFELD: There you go.


PERINO: All right, Geraldo.

GUILFOYLE: You're not kidding.

RIVERA: My principle residence is now Cleveland, Ohio. I've been very, very blessed with the Cavaliers and with the Cleveland Indians.

The Cleveland Browns, however, worst team in the National Football League, 0-16.

GUILFOYLE: Sixteen, yes.

RIVERA: They are having a parade nevertheless on Saturday. They're walking counterclockwise around First Energy Stadium. They do have some great draft picks, so we are hopeful that believe-land will have a football team.

GUTFELD: Believe-land.

PERINO: And they raised some -- they raised money for charity with that parade, right?

RIVERA: And they did. Money's going to the Cleveland Food Bank.

WATTERS: Is that you, Geraldo?

GUTFELD: The Unknown Comic.

PERINO: Well, that was a fun show. That's it for us.

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