Published January 15, 2020
This is a rush transcript from "The Five," January 15, 2020. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Welcome to Washington. I am Bret Baier. This is Fox News coverage of the impeachment of President Donald Trump. Coming up momentarily, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi holds what is called an engrossment ceremony. Earlier today, the House voted to send articles of impeachment to the U.S. Senate for a trial. This evening, clerk of the House, Cheryl Johnson, signs that paperwork officially, and then there will be an actual procession, part of which you will see on camera as the House parades the articles of impeachment over to the U.S. Senates. House sergeant at arms, Paul Irving, leading the way, the paperwork, escorted in blue folders, walked through statuary hall and the capitol rotunda to the secretary of the Senate Julie Adams, all very formal. We haven't seen it since 1998. We will show you that event live and talk about what is happening with the impeachment and where we go from here. You are looking live in the House, waiting to see House Speaker Nancy Pelosi show up there. Chad Pergram is our congressional correspondent. He is on Capitol Hill tonight with setting the scene for this formal event. Chad?
CHAD PERGRAM, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: Well, as you say, we haven't something like this in quite a while. But this is where House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and the impeachment managers and Cheryl Johnson, who is the clerk of the House, will get together. We will see as the Speaker takes some questions. Once they start, I'm told, that that ceremony will take about 15 minutes. They will then disappear for a bit and they will actually sign the paperwork and formalize it off stage. And then you will have the procession where Paul Irving, you might know him. He always announces the president when they have state of the union, Mr. Speaker, the president of United States. He will then escort Cheryl Johnson across the capital. Across the building, Mike Stinger, who is Irving's opposite number. He is the Senate sergeant at arms. He will pick yup the procession. And he will escort Cheryl Johnson, the clerk of the House, to Julie Adams, her opposite number, the secretary of the Senate or Adams designee. And we will actually -- maybe see them go into the Senate chamber. This is basically where they're saying this is what we have done in the House. We've impeached the president. We're alerting you. Some time later tonight, the Senate prospectively will send a message back to the House and say what you got. And then tomorrow, we will do this all over again where they will actually take the articles of impeachment plus the impeachment managers, the seven prosecutors who were announced today by House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. They will present them to the Senate and they will actually, you know, read the articles aloud before the Senate. Now, I'm told that that probably won't happen tomorrow before about 12:45, 1 o'clock. And they will also probably bring over the U.S. Chief Justice John Roberts. He'll come across the street. He will be -- administer the oath of office, and then they will swear in the senators as jurors, Bret.
BAIER: Chad, you know, the president obviously has called all of this a hoax. Republicans say there really is not a case here. Democrats say they will make that case. The announcement of seven House managers today by the Speaker, and she also hit tones of the Constitution, pointing back to the founding fathers, making this a big moment, she said, for all of our children.
PERGRAM: Right. And this is where Democrats have tried to make this case and say this is about the future. This is about future presidents. She often invokes the children, whether she's talking about healthcare or the Constitution. And the chair of the Judiciary Committee, Jerry Nadler, who will be one of those managers, you know, he talked about that the Senate is actually on trial here too, Bret.
BAIER: All right. Chad Pergram on the Hill, we will head back as all of this gets underway. Let's bring in Martha MacCallum, host of The Story, my co-host for political coverage, the Story obviously weeknights seven eastern here of Fox. Thought as we get this formal process underway, we talked a lot about today that this is all a foregone conclusion, but there is still this formality that, again, we have not seen since 1998.
MARTHA MACCALLUM, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: There is. And I think, you know, the formality of this moment is sort of what Nancy Pelosi has control over at this point to make sure that this is -- has the kind of momentum and has the kind of weight that she wants to give to all of this in the face of the fact that it has turned out to be a very partisan exercise, which is something that she said from the very beginning she didn't want to see. She said that impeachment was too divisive, an effort should take up unless there was an overwhelming case and bipartisan buy in and commitment to agreement on it. And she never did get that. We will always look back and wonder whether or not she was pushed into this. I think she will always consider whether or not she made the right decision here to move this forward. When it gets to the Senate, obviously she's going to meet with the -- senators but the big question now is this issue of witnesses, which is also being nudged a bit by the new evidence that has come forward and these very sort of, you know, ominous notes from -- and discussions about packages being delivered and surveillance of the Ambassador Marie Yovanovitch to Ukraine. There is a lot here in terms of fodder for the president's opponents to dig into right now. And whether that sways a 4th Republican senator to decide that they do want witnesses here is really one of the big questions tonight as we watch all of this begin, Bret.
BAIER: Martha, do you think that there is a level of concern at the White House about that prospect of witnesses in a Senate trial as we get ready to -- officially the articles heading over there and Mitchell McConnell taking the reigns of how this process goes?
MACCALLUM: I can't imagine that there isn't. We -- they obviously had a big day today signing the first phase of this China trade agreement. The president was feeling obviously very confident about all of that. The USMCA is also on deck to be passed as well. And that is a very big achievement for this president. There's no doubt about that. But he has said very clearly that he thinks impeachment is an ugly word, that he didn't want to be impeached, and Nancy Pelosi has tried to kind of, you know, hammer that nail in by saying that no matter what happens with this process the House of Representatives has impeached the president. And that is a forever sort of, you know, sign around his neck or an asterisk to his presidency. So I -- my guess is that there has to be some consternation about whether or not you're going to see a moment when John Bolton primarily sits down at that table and gives his take on all of this.
BAIER: Martha, stand by if you would. Let's talk now with Harold Ford Jr., former Democratic Congressman from Tennessee. Harold, your thoughts on this day, Republicans will say they are concerned that this opens the door to more partisan impeachments for other presidents down the road. Democrats say they are making a case that they think is open and shut.
HAROLD FORD JR. FOX NEWS POLITICAL CONTRIBUTOR: I remember 20 years ago, Bret. I was in the Congress. I voted against impeaching President Clinton. And I remember the pageantry that we're about to watch or we're anticipating here in the next few minutes with Speaker Pelosi. It was a different Speaker and different Congress. The Senate now has a responsibility. You have to hope that both Democrats and Republicans will take their pledge to be impartial in a very serious way. Although there is a foregone conclusion that he will be acquitted, I think all of the jurors have to be willing to listen. But if you are on the political team with President Trump this evening, you think how big of a moment this is from a positive standpoint, the jobs numbers, the economic numbers, the phase 1 of the China deal, the USMCA agreement, the incredible effort in Iran, the killing of this general. Any other person would be riding so high. But all of this news does put a damper here. As it goes to the Senate, Bret, I hope Democrats do one thing, that they focus solely on the national security implications of the president's actions. Whether he is convicted or not, I think going forward -- if we take anything from this in terms of a history lesson, it would be that no president should take any actions that would undermine national security in an effort to advance their own political interest. Now, whether this president has done that or not, he's almost admitted to some of that. So whatever Democrats do, whatever the managers do, and I think Speaker Pelosi did a really good job at some of these choices for managers, including this young guy, Jason Crow and Hakim Jeffries. These two young men, Jeffries and Crow, Crow a former army ranger and intelligence analyst. They are uniquely equipped to do this. So this is an interesting -- historic in a lot of ways, unfortunate for the country, but all these parties involved, House members -- Senate now has a role to play. And I hope they -- all Democrats and Republicans take it seriously.
BAIER: Seven House managers, 13 House managers last time for the Clinton impeachment. Stand by if you would. Andy McCarthy, former U.S. attorney to the southern district of New York. Andy, we spent a lot of time -- the gavel to gavel coverage of the House as they built the case. That's how it is supposed to go. Democrats said that they had to rush through that urgently because the president was a threat to the election in 2020 by his actions. Now there was this pause for 27 days. And we are waiting for the formal move over for the articles of impeachment, your thought?
ANDY MCCARTHY, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: Well, Bret, I think the delay obviously undermines the alleged urgency that was behind the effort in the first place. But my main concern, if I were leader McConnell and the Republicans in the Senate would be that this is not an open and shut case in the sense that the Democrats are saying it is shut. In fact, they are continuing their investigation. And as we have been discussing, they are throwing, not only this new evidence, but the prospect of perhaps more impeachment articles. Perhaps more witnesses who are just emerging coming forward. And my beef is that no federal judge would put up a situation -- a trial judge where he was being asked to try a defendant in a case, and at the same the prosecutors were continuing in the grand jury to investigate the defendant on the same charges and broadcasting whatever evidence they find to the media which, of course, would prejudice the trial. So I would certainly hope that McConnell will at least -- and the Republicans will at least entertain the thought of suspending this without prejudice and telling the House we're only going to try this case once. Let's try it when it's ready. It doesn't appear to be ready.
BAIER: Andy, what about this new evidence the Democrats, the House Intelligence Committee sent over. It includes documents from Lev Parnas, the indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani, the president's lawyer, some communications, text messages. It seems like there is evidence that the Ambassador Yovanovitch followed, tracked by some of these men. How does that factor in now? Obviously, it was not part of the case the House Democrats built in these various hearings, but it now heads over to the Senate.
MCCARTHY: Well, it's always obviously been a problem, Bret, though, because there's clear factual overlap between the indicted charges in the southern district of New York and the facts that were uncovered and the information that was uncovered in the House proceedings. To the point where a big part of the southern district case is what happened with Marie Yovanovitch, the ambassador to Ukraine, and her removal at the behest of Rudy Giuliani and some of his associates. That was a big part of the House proceedings. It's a big part of the southern district trial. The other wildcard here is I think it's pretty clear that Parnas is trying to leverage his potential importance as a witness in the impeachment trial in whatever plea negotiations he must be having with the southern district of New York. He obviously wants immunity, because if he testified in the impeachment case that would convict him more than likely in the criminal proceeding. I worked in the southern district of New York for 20 years. They don't give immunity. What they generally demand is that you plead guilty to the chargers and give full cooperation. So that may take some time to work out.
BAIER: You're looking live there, the articles of impeachment on the table. We're waiting for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. Andy, stand by, cast of THE FIVE standing by in New York. This is their hour on Fox News channel. It's here from Dana Perino and Juan Williams, Dana, your thoughts first.
DANA PERINO, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Well, I think that after this initial pomp and circumstance everybody should just settle in, because it could be possibly a long time. We're talking about possibly two weeks. There won't be a lot of new information. I see that the Speaker is probably getting ready here to appear. The senators can't really engage, and America feels like it's already heard all this. They heard it a month ago. Public opinion did not change either way. And I think that when either side gets frustrated, that the American people don't see it their way. They are missing the fact that if there was some big obvious case against the president, we would all know it. It would be really obvious. The fact that it's this muddled at this point and people are dug in, I think that means that you won't see a lot of movement. Plus, I would also add this. You have not yet seen the president's lawyers have a chance to layout their case. It's an impressive group of people. And they will be up against many of the people in the House that we know, some that we don't. And so that might be worth tuning into.
BAIER: Yeah. You're looking live at the Rayburn Room, by the way. And the House and all the reporters getting up to take a look at the articles of impeachment, they're on the table. They will be signed and then walked over, as we've mentioned, from the House to the Senate through the rotunda. Juan Williams, Republicans will say that the process in the House was faulty. They didn't have a chance to make a defense, a legitimate defense, as Dana points out. The president's attorneys and his team will in the Senate, your thoughts today?
JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS ANCHOR: Well, they are going to have an extensive opportunity. And I think they have got quite a team there. Pat Cipollone, Jay Sekulow, I think Sekulow will be on TV most nights. I think he's TV able. And on the other side, I think when you look at people like Jerry Nadler, I think Nadler knows it, has the command of the case. But I think the star there is going to be Adam Schiff. And Schiff, again, I think, you know, sort of TV ready. And I think part of this is public sentiment and building public support. And on that point, Bret, I think it's important to note that people are who critical of Nancy Pelosi for the 27 day delay are now going to have to deal with the fact that there is, as you've mentioned, new information continuing to come in as well as the possibility of the former national security adviser, John Bolton, agreeing or responding to a subpoena to testify. So all of that means that we have a changing dynamic, and it puts pressure on this political process. This is not a criminal trial. This is a political process. And from Pelosi's point of view, it puts pressure on a lot of the sort of moderate Republicans who are in some political peril to come along and support the idea of witnesses and documents. And this is an ongoing effort, not something that is to be viewed as static and having been already settled and discussed in terms of the existing articles of impeachment.
BAIER: Chad Pergram, again, our congressional correspondent, announced today House Speaker Pelosi saying that she is appointing seven House managers. As we look at those seven, some are familiar names from the process, and the committee hearing process, including Adam Schiff and Jerry Nadler. But what about the others on here, and any surprises as far as who has been named to make this case in the Senate?
PERGRAM: It's not a surprise that they picked a couple of freshmen. Sylvia Garcia of Texas and also Jason Crow of Colorado, you know, House Speaker Nancy Pelosi is very aware of this big freshman class. The majority makers, those that, you know, you know, propelled the Democrats to the majority. So she wants to respect that. It did not have older members. That's one criticism of the Democratic leadership had faced. And of the criticisms about her leadership, you know, she had a bit of a rocky, you know, time last foul. Some people thought she not have the votes to be the Speaker of the House. So this is going to be a very different group in that sense. I think it isn't going to be Jerry Nadler, the chair of the Judiciary Committee, who will be the lead manager here. In 1999, it was Henry Hyde of Illinois who was the chair of the Judiciary Committee, who led the effort against President Clinton. It's going to be Adam Schiff. And I should note that this is not Adam Schiff's first rodeo. He was the impeachment leader that Nancy Pelosi appointed him for a lower profile impeachment trial before the Senate in 2010. Thomas Porteous was a federal judge who was impeached. And that effort impressed House Speaker Nancy Pelosi. And that's why, you know, she put him in charge of the intelligence committee and now has asked him to lead the charge today. One other thing I should say, Bret, here is that the impeachment managers were all just told about 24 hours ago. They have been meeting in the basement of the capitol kind of plotting strategy, trying to figure out how they're going to go about this. If there's going to be 24 hours of debate and 7 managers, that's a lot of time that each of these manager would have, as you subdivide their time, presenting to the Senate.
BAIER: Yeah. Martha MacCallum, there is also the factor of the timing in the Senate trial. As these articles of impeachment move over there, it starts this process. But we don't know how long this could go. Dana mentioned it could go a long time. And if witnesses are in fact called -- and there you see Nancy Pelosi making her way to the Rayburn Room, it could be a big, big moment here especially for some of those candidates who are on the campaign trail.
MACCALLUM: Absolutely. You know, there's -- those senators who are running for the nomination have a lot at stake here in terms of the time frame and how much of that time gets eaten up by being in this trial. Then the other senators that we talked about before -- Republican senators who are in precarious electoral positions going into 2020. You know it's been said, but it's worth reiterating that if Democrats sort of lose this round on impeaching the president, there is another big round here for them. And that is the potential of flipping the Senate. Having it turn to a Democrat majority Senate, which would essentially -- if the president does win re-election tie his hands in the second term, Bret.
BAIER: Yeah. As we look live at the Rayburn Room in the House, Nancy Pelosi surrounded by her committee chairs making their way into the room packed with press. Again, the formal signing of the articles of impeachment, the House clerk will do that formally. There you see Adam Schiff, Jerry Nadler and others, the Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi.
NANCY PELOSI, HOUSE SPEAKER: Good afternoon. As you know, on December 18th, the House of Representatives upheld its constitutional duty and voted articles of impeachment against the president of the United States, Donald Trump. He said in the course of the debate that he did not uphold his oath of office to defend the Constitution of the United States. The president takes a special oath, a little different from the congressional oath. In fact, he takes an oath that was taken by President George Washington, the patriarch of our country, in front of whose picture we stand here. It's so sad, so tragic for our country that the actions taken the president to undermine our national security, to violate his oath of office, and to jeopardize the security of our elections, the integrity of our elections has taken us to this place. So today, we will make history. When we walk down -- when the managers walk down the hall -- across the threshold in history, delivering articles of impeachment against the president of the United States for abuse of power and obstruction of the House. Making that history we are making progress for the American people, progress in support of our Constitution, progress in honor of the sacrifice and divisions of our founders. Progress and honor of the sacrifice of our men and women in uniform, and progress for the future of our children, make it be very clear that this president will be held accountable. That no one is above the law, and that no future president should ever entertain the idea that Article One -- Article 2 says that he can do whatever he wants. And so with that, I will sign the resolution transmitting the articles of impeachment to the Senate, which will be delivered by our managers, of whom I'm very proud. When they bring this over, it will set in motion a process on the Senate side. Probably tomorrow, I don't know their schedule. But it may be as soon as tomorrow. The senators will take an oath of office. They will take a special oath of office to do impartial judges and to impartial justice according to the Constitution and the laws. Let's hope that they uphold that oath that they take tomorrow. And so now, I'm very honored to be here with our 6th chairman who worked so hard to help us uphold the Constitution with their legislating, their investigating, their litigating. You know the Chairman of the Judiciary Committee is part of the managers, Jerry Nadler, Mr. Schiff, the distinguished Chairman of the Intelligence -- House Select committee on Intelligence. Congresswoman Maxine Waters, the chair of National Services Committee, congresswoman -- madam chair of the Oversight Committee. Congressman -- Mr. Chairman Eliot Engel of the Foreign Affairs Committee and -- Chairman of the Ways and Means Committee, we thank them for all of their difficult work. And we honor our darling, Elijah Cummings, who said one day when we are dancing with the angels, what we will say about what we did at this difficult time in our country's history? And then I am very proud that Mr. Nadler and Mr. Schiff are part of our managers. But I want to acknowledge other managers who are with us. A freshman member but I shouldn't say freshman. They have been here one year, accomplished great things. Congressman Jason Crow from Colorado, Congresswoman Val Demings of the state of Florida. Congresswoman Garcia of Texas -- are we all here? Where is Hakim Jeffries of New York? Is that everybody? And -- this is who served the impeachment. She was -- the Nixon impeachment, she was a staffer for the Judiciary Committee member Don Edwards of California. She was member of the Judiciary Committee in the Clinton impeachment, and her own right a member of the Judiciary Committee and now member of the Judiciary Chair -- House administration which oversees elections and a manager. And with that, I thank them all for their leadership and their service. And I am now going to proceed to sign the articles.
BAIER: Speaker Nancy Pelosi surrounded by seven House impeachment managers that will make the case in the U.S. Senate in the trial and six committee chairs who dealt with the committee's hearings that led to the articles of impeachment, abuse of power of President Trump, and obstruction of the House, Speaker Pelosi now signing these articles of impeachment as they will make their way over formally. Bring back Dana Perino and Juan Williams. Dana, the House Speaker today said this is not political. This is not partisan. This is about patriotism. But frankly, it is political and it is partisan. And it's just the process that we have witnessed over the past weeks.
PERINO: I think one of the most partisan comments that she had was -- happened over the weekend when she was on the Sunday show on ABC, in which she said that regardless of what happens in the Senate and being faced with the fact that we already read the end of the book, we know that the president will be acquitted. And so now, we are being forced to go back and read single every word for our punishment, for having skipped ahead and read the end of the book. But she said the president has already impeached, and he will have that for the rest of history, as if that was the goal. And I think right now what you're seeing is this ceremony. And it seems very sombre, but that's very different from the House process which was quite chaotic. And I think when it goes over to the Senate, people will see that Mitchell McConnell will run a process, a trial that will be very senatorial. It will be calmer and more sterile. And it will be more slow than anybody wants. And we will have to go through this because this got going back in September, or if you look at what president has said they have talked about impeaching him from the very beginning. The other thing I would say is that Senators Collins and Murkowski, the two Republican women who Senator Schumer basically is doing is polling in their states to see if they are vulnerable in 2020. I do not think that those two women will be bullied into voting for witnesses unless they really think it's meritorious. But you'll start to see a lot more 2020 activity, including you'll see three of the senators who are on the debate stage last night for the Democrats. They will be in the Senate having to be jurors in this trial and they're not allowed to say anything during that time. So it will be interesting. But I do think it will be a much calmer process than what you saw in the House.
BAIER: Juan, what about that prospect? There is also Democrats up for re- election like Doug Jones in deep red Alabama -- will have to make a decision as well.
WILLIAMS: I do. I think that this is a political process. I mean, I don't think there is any getting away from that, Bret. And the difference is the way that we frame it as Republicans and Democrats. Republicans clearly are intent on saying this is a partisan act. The president has said as much.
BAIER: Let me break in here for a second, Juan. Sorry. OK, passing out the pens, getting it ready to walk over to the Senate side. Sorry to interrupt. Go ahead.
WILLIAMS: Not at all. I think while Republicans have sought to frame this as a partisan act, I think from -- what you just saw from Nancy Pelosi is her on emphasis on the idea that there are people of conviction and principle standing up as patriots. I think that's why she spoke about the idea that this doesn't happen everyday, that you have the Constitution, the founding fathers, the people serving in our military, and our children all looking over our shoulder. That's a very different way to look at this. And I think that what she is saying is -- and again, this comes back to what Dana was saying that -- to both sides we both know that this does not happen to every president. This is a real mark against a president, even if he or she is to be acquitted, and acquittal is likely. And finally, when she spoke of the Senate, she spoke of them taking an oath to do impartial justice. And she said she hoped they would uphold that oath. I think that's very strong language. And again, framing it in the sense of putting the pressure, the onus on Republicans, to look at the evidence, to hear from witnesses -- even the new evidence as we've been discussing here on Fox that's came out in the last 24 hours.
BAIER: All right. Juan and Dana, thank you. We will head your way after this ceremony is completed. We will toss it over to THE FIVE. Thank you. Andy McCarthy, both sides, Republicans and Democrats, pointing to the founders and what they said about the impeachment today, House Speaker Pelosi saying that the founders did not want a ruler, a king, and noted that -- Republicans pointing to federalist 65 and Hamilton what he wrote about partisanship and concern that this could be a process that happens again and again and again if it is just on a partisan basis. Thoughts on that as we watch this walkover from the House to the Senate.
MCCARTHY: I think what's to be very concerned about with that, Bret, is that impeachment is a vital part of the Constitution. Madison thought it was indispensable, as he said during the debates over the Constitution, because it was necessary as kind of a final measure to wrestle or grapple on the -- on the congressional side with potential presidential excess or misconduct. And the problem with impeachment becoming politicized is not just the spectacle that we're seeing but also the fact that it cheapens the impeachment remedy. So we may be heading into an era where we see impeachment much more regularly because it's now going to be used as a political weapon, but that also degrades it because no one will take it as seriously anymore as it's really meant to be taken. It's supposed to be really the nuclear option in our Constitution.
BAIER: All right, Andy, standby. You're looking live right here from the Capitol rotunda looking towards the House chamber, those the doors to the House chamber. And what you're going to see this engrossment ceremony, it's not the best name for this. We'll bring in Chad Pergram. But it is the ceremony to take the actual articles of impeachment and walk them physically which is part of the deal over to the U.S. Senate. And Chad Pergram, we are going to see this pomp and circumstance from chamber to chamber here.
PERGRAM: That's right. We're going to see it twice in the next couple of days. So what's going on right now behind the scenes by the Democratic cloakroom, which is kind of the dugout for the House floor, between the Rayburn Room where they were actually conducting this ceremony, is Cheryl Johnson who is the clerk of House. She is actually putting pen to paper here. You might have seen how Speaker Nancy Pelosi signing her name, signing this message to the Senate with a series of pens that so all the committee chairs and also all the impeachment managers kind of have a souvenir that they would take with them. They do that when they enroll a bill and send it to the President, all the main sponsors get a pen. Well, the same case here. And you're looking toward the House doors. This is what we call the Will Rogers era. You often see us doing live shots or live interviews on our network and others with members of Congress. They will then walk that into Statuary Hall. Statuary Hall is the Old House chamber. Then they will go past the Speaker's office, Paul Irving, the House Sergeant at Arms. He's in charge of security at the Capitol. He will escort Cheryl Johnson, the clerk of the House, with those -- that message in blue folders through the Capitol rotunda, that's the middle of the building, actually then passed the old Senate chamber and then pass the Office of Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. On the Senate side of the Capitol, they'll be met by Mike Stenger. He is the Senate Sergeant at Arms and they will actually take the Articles of Impeachment -- or excuse me, take this message alerting the Senate what the House is done into the chamber. And I'm looking right now at the Senate floor, they are kind of in a posture, a holding pattern right now waiting for the House to bring those over. Chuck Grassley is the President Pro Tem, the most senior member of the majority party and he is presiding, waiting for this message to be received in the Senate. And then again, tomorrow is when we do this all again and the actual articles of impeachment plus the manager show up in the Senate in a very similar fashion, Brett.
BAIER: OK, getting ready to see this movement. People at home may say why is this important? Well, it's only happened three times in the history of our country. Let's listen in, not that there's much to hear, but let's listen in. That's Clerk of the House Cheryl Johnson and House Sergeant at Arms, Paul Irving leading the way. Martha McCallum, your thoughts?
MACCALLUM: Well, you know, I'm just watching them walk through the rotunda here, Bret, and thinking about the fact that, you know, regardless of the fact that this is a really purely partisan exercise here, just based on the votes that we saw. In fact, it's bipartisan only in the fact that you had a couple of Republicans vote against what we're seeing play out here. But the rotunda is a place where, you know, you see so many important ceremonies over the course of history take place. It's Statuary Hall, it's where all of the statues of the founding fathers and other prominent Americans are. It's where we see funerals at times as we see people lie in state. So you know, there is a lot of ceremony here and a lot of weight to what we're seeing -- what we're witnessing. And I was also struck by the fact that Nancy Pelosi said, we will make history and progress for the American people, which I think is an interesting choice of words in terms of progress. I think that Democrats look at this period and wonder if in the election process, you know, people wonder what they accomplished in their time as a majority in the House. And she's characterizing this as progress and we'll see if the American people agree as we enter this really, you know, sort of busy period heading into the primaries here of how the American public will really receive all of this.
BAIER: Speaking of the American public, you can come up to Capitol Hill and make the same walk from the House to the Senate. There's places you can't go but for the walk, they're making with the sergeant at arms you can do, and also the impeachment managers falling behind Adam Schiff and Jerry Nadler leading the way of the impeachment managers. Let's bring in Harold Ford again, former Tennessee Congressman. Politically, Harold, how do you think this falls as some of these polls are kind of upside down in swing states about how impeachment is going, how it's -- how it's working for Democrats?
HAROLD FORD JR., FORMER CONGRESSMAN OF TENNESSEE: It doesn't look on the surface as you look at some of the battleground state polling, that anything move during the hearings before the committee, before the Schiff committee and then before the Nadler Committee. So, it will be interesting to see that now that this has moved as Dana and Juan commented to a different process, probably more sterile and predictable and stale process when you consider how chaotic things were in the House. But I would remind everyone, there's no doubt this is a political exercise because impeachment is, but the facts here are ones that are very serious ones. The allegations are very, very serious. The accusations that the President of the United States called a foreign leader and ask that foreign leader for help in a political contest by investigating someone that he might -- that might be running against him this year.
BAIER: Let me interrupt you here, Harold. Hold on one second.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CHERYL JOHNSON, CLERK, UNITED STATES HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES: -- of Donald Trump, President of the United States.
SEN. CHUCK GRASSLEY (R-IA): The message will be received.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BAIER: Sorry. Chuck Grassley is presiding. He is the President Pro Tem, the longest-serving member in the Senate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRASSLEY: The Majority Leader.
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): As unanimous consent that pursuant to rule one of the rules and procedure and practice when sitting on impeachment trials, the Secretary of the Senate informed the House of Representatives that the Senate is ready to receive the managers appointed by the House for the purpose of exhibiting articles of impeachment against Donald John Trump, President of United States, agreeably to the notice communicated to the Senate. Further that at the hour of 12:00 noon on Thursday, January 16, 2020, the Senate will receive the managers on the part of the House of Representatives in order that they may present an exhibit the Articles of Impeachment against Donald John Trump, President of the United States.
GRASSLEY: Is there any objection? If not, so ordered.
MCCONNELL: As unanimous consent, pursuant to rule three and four of the rules of procedure and practice when sitting on impeachment trials, that at the hour 2:00 p.m. on Thursday, January 16, 2020, the Senate proceed to the consideration of the articles of impeachment, and that the presiding officer through the secretary of the senate notify the Chief Justice of the United States of the time and place fixed for consideration of the articles and request is attendance as presiding officer pursuant to Article 1, Section 3, Clause 6 of the U.S. Constitution.
GRASSLEY: Is there any objection? So ordered.
MCCONNELL: As unanimous consent, that the Presiding Officer be authorized to appoint a committee of senators to upon the recommendation of the majority leader and to upon the recommendation of the Democratic leader to escort the Chief Justice into the Senate chamber. Further, as consent, that the Secretary of the Senate may directly to notify the House of Representatives of the time and place fixed for the Senate to proceed upon the impeachment of Donald John Trump in the Senate chamber.
GRASSLEY: Is there any objection? If not, so ordered.
MCCONNELL: As unanimous consent, that access to the Senate when the Senate floor and the Senate chamber galleries during all of the proceedings involving the exhibition of consideration of the Articles of Impeachment against Donald John Trump, President of the United States and all times that the Senate is sitting in trial with the Chief Justice of the United States presiding be in accordance with the allocations and provisions are now sent to the desk and asked that it be printed and the record.
GRASSLEY: Is there objection? If not, so ordered.
MCCONNELL: As unanimous consent, the Senate proceed to the consideration of asterisk 471 submitted earlier today.
GRASSLEY: The clerk will report.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Senate resolution for 71 authorizing the taking of a photograph in the chamber of the United States Senate.
GRASSLEY: Is their objection to proceeding to the consideration? Without objection, then the Senate will proceed.
MCCONNELL: As unanimous consent, the resolution be agreed to, and the motion to reconsider be considered made and laid upon the table with no intervening action over debate.
GRASSLEY: Without objections, so ordered.
MCCONNELL: Now, Mr. President, for the information all Senators, a few minutes ago, the Senate was notified that the House of Representatives is finally ready to proceed with their articles of impeachment. So by unanimous consent, we have just laid some of the groundwork that will structure the next several days. We've officially invited the House managers to come to the Senate tomorrow at noon to exhibit their Articles of Impeachment. Then later tomorrow afternoon at 2:00 p.m., the Chief Justice of the United States will arrive here in the Senate. He will be sworn in by the President Pro Tem, Senator Grassley, then the Chief Justice will swear on all of us senators, will pledge to rise above the petty factionalism and do justice for our institutions, for our state, and for the nation. And then we will formally notify the White House of our pending trial and summon the president to answer the articles and send his counsel. So the trial will commence in earnest on Tuesday. But first, Mr. President, some important good news for the country. We anticipate the Senate will finish the USMCA tomorrow and send this landmark trade deal to President Trump for his signature, a major victory for the administration, but more importantly, for American families. So let me close with this. This is a difficult time for our country, but this is precisely the kind of time for which the Framers created the Senate. I'm confident this body can rise above short-termism and factional favor and serve the long-term best interest of our nation. We can do this and we must.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BAIER: Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell formally accepting The Articles of Impeachment. The Senate now will start this process a trial and rules of the trial that will be set starting tomorrow at noon. The Justice -- the Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, John Roberts will be sworn in to preside over this trial. And the House managers will begin to make their case as of next week on Tuesday, when this trial officially gets underway. The logistics, the pomp, and circumstance of the articles being moved from the House to the Senate has been finished. No matter your ideology, no matter your political party, where you stand on any of this, this is history. It's only happened three times in our country and we have you covered. Please stay tuned to Fox News Channel and this Fox station for continuing coverage of this story. In Washington, I'm Bret Baier. Now here on, Fox News Channel will continue.
JESSE WATERS, FOX NEWS CHANNEL ANCHOR: Let's toss it over to THE FIVE for their analysis.
DANA PERINO, FOX NEWS CHANNEL ANCHOR: We're going to take it from here, Fox News Alert. Thank you so much, Bret. Welcome to THE FIVE. Breaking news on Capitol Hill. Moments ago, Speaker Nancy Pelosi signing the Articles of Impeachment against President Trump. That move clearing the way for a trial that could start next Tuesday. We're also learning who the house impeachment managers will be. Pelosi breaking House Intelligence Chairman Adam Schiff, and House Judiciary Chairman Jerry Nadler to lead the team prosecuting the president. We know you want to hear from THE FIVE so I'm just going to turn it over to Greg. He's got a few things on his mind.
GREG GUTFELD, FOX NEWS CHANNEL HOST: Yes. I'm trying to control myself from swearing. That was a fricking ceremony. You have ceremonies to award medals. You have ceremonies at weddings and funerals. This was like a baptism at The Addams Family. Did you notice they had a silver platter for the pens? Everybody got a special party favorite, a little pen to take home. We are paying for those fricking pens and for that platter. And then you see the media taking pictures of the pens. Oh look how special the pens are. That -- what that -- what you saw with that ceremony, they were spackling a turd with gold paint, right? And we're all suckers. We're all suckers for believing this is serious. We know it's a sham. It's -- they say it's historical or it's historic. That's B.S. all right. We know this was an emotional tantrum directed a daddy who won the election and they're mad at daddy. So we have to go through this phony procession. Oh, let's show pictures of the cloakroom. Oh, let's watch them walk down the halls. Oh, this is breaking news. Let's repeat it 25 times over and over again until I want to blow my brains out. Look --
PERINO: You're going to have a great time in the next two weeks.
GUTFELD: If you're a viewer, OK, and you're watching this coverage, here's four things you got to remember. The media controls the narrative OK. Look what happened to THE FIVE, right? You know, we -- they put the money in the jukebox, we got to dance. Number two, the Dems have been -- in the media been working on this for three years. So this isn't a moral cause. This was a political vocation meant to unseat an election. Number three, they don't hate Trump, they hate you. He's a proxy for you because you voted for him. They think you're a bunch of rubs because you didn't listen to the media. This is their revenge. And last but not least, you got to store all that anger. And when this is over, and when they lose, because they will, you got to rub their noses in their loss to the day they retire. Thank you.
PERINO: We have 14 minutes left. Jesse?
WATTERS: Greg, here's a pen for you.
GUTFELD: Thank you. You don't know where I'm going to put this.
PERINO: You can keep it.
GUTFELD: I'm going to D.C.
JUAN WILLIAMS, FOX NEWS CHANNEL CONTRIBUTOR: All right.
WATTERS: This is all payback by Hillary Rodham Clinton. She was supposed to win the election and Donald Trump ruined it. So this is revenge. It started with the insurance policy, Trump sniffed it out, fires Comey, Mueller knows the whole time there's no collusion but he lets it hang over the Midterms so the democrats win so they can sort up the impeachment. Bill Barr challenges Mueller to show his cards. He's got nothing so the Democrats panicked. They fired up this fake whistleblower deal, rig a very unfair trial against the president, but they rushed it. If they had gone to court and gotten the testimony they needed and gotten the evidence they needed, that would have been one thing. But they had to get it under the wire before Christmas so Nancy gets this half-baked impeachment, only two articles, no criminal violations. And then she runs into a brick wall in the Senate. And McConnell is like, you know, the teacher where it's like, time's up, everybody. Pencils down. Nancy is still scribbling. She ran out of time.
PERINO: Look at all those pens.
WATTERS: Put the pencils -- put the pen down, Nancy. She's got nothing. This is all designed to discredit Donald Trump for political revenge and because he was a businessman and came in and did a better job than a regular politician, and because the Trump doctrine of America first poses a mortal threat to the Democratic Party. It busted down the blue wall, he outflanks them on trade, on everything else. And at this point, it looks like he's going to restrict immigration. So you have someone who comes in former Democrat, a dealmaker, lives in Manhattan his whole life, ready to make a deal. He agrees with them on infrastructure, on drug prices, on everything. You could have a golden age of bipartisanship, signing ceremonies instead of engrossment ceremonies, pens for everybody, but they don't do that. They spit in the President's face. So you know what he does instead? He goes, I'll do it myself. USMCA papers China deal phase one, kills ISIS Baghdadi. He starts running the table. He's like a guy at the casino. He's got a hot hand and everybody else is winning, because they're all at the roulette table, having drinks having a party, everyone's getting rich, but the Democrats --
GUTFELD: They're playing (INAUDIBLE). They're in the (INAUDIBLE) room and they're losing.
WATTERS: They want to arrest of the guy with a hot hand instead of joining the party, and having everybody get rich and happy. And that's why they're so pathetic.
PERINO: Emily, I don't know how you're going to follow that, but I'll let you do it.
EMILY COMPAGNO, FOX NEWS CHANNEL CONTRIBUTOR: I will not try to follow it - - no, I just want to -- I want to point out that it seems that when it suits the Democrats, this is a trial. And when it doesn't, then oh, no, no, this isn't like anything that we have in the court of law. It's totally separate. It's just politics. And to take this out for a second, and just to illustrate perspective. If we did, in fact, have a trial in normal court of law, and an ongoing, simultaneous trial at the same time was a grand jury proceeding, and there were still evidence been gathered, and you could still add it into the trial, it would be preposterous. That would never happen. And I bring that up to say that as we speak, Nadler says with complete finality and confidence that oh, of course, the Senate will accept this new evidence, this bombshell testimony, everything that has to do with Lev Parnas and more as if it will change the game. And yet with all of the fact-finding mission that the House went through, the urgency, the import, the matter of national security, apparently it wasn't enough for them to get it in a timely fashion, nor was it enough for the four weeks that Nancy Pelosi hung on to these articles for her to have it and tidy it up. So, at any point, this defendant, which is also the President of the United States, might be slammed with an additional article of impeachment, apparently, or more evidence that the Senate is just supposed to take. I find that patently against the Constitution because what we usually stand for and constitutionally is one of due process and a fair procedure that we can depend on. And to me, that's the largest mockery, that's it that's in place right now. And one more quick thing. You know, everyone acts that -- just a reminder that it's Chief Justice Roberts who's in charge moving forward, and that this is his show moving forward.
PERINO: It's supposed to be ceremonial though for him.
COMPAGNO: But he still has -- he has final say over the rules. And the Senate has a short amount of time to get their act together, but it's he who can make game-changing decisions. So it looks -- I mean, we'll see whether he optimizes that role.
PERINO: What do you think about -- you know, so here's the thing. As much as it might annoy everybody, it is happening. So given that it is happening, what do you think about what I was saying with Bret Baier that Mitch McConnell, he's just a creature of the Senate. He loves the Senate. So he's going to make this boring, calm, sterile, and I think about -- what about that tactic rather than making it firing?
GUTFELD: I think -- well, I think it's a great tactic, but I always go back to I'm like a viewer. I'm sitting here just like going -- if it's boring, I'm going to go crazy, if it's exciting, I don't want to watch this. Why is this happening? The answer was last night when you saw the debates. The Democrats and the media realized they can't win with that selection that they had from last night. This is their election replacement supplement. It's their testosterone patch. And the worst part about it is we are paying these people. They're on the clock. And they're indulging this emotional revenge on our dime. Shouldn't that mean that we have a right to save super awful things about them? Aren't we allowed because we're paying them to get something out of it by making fun of them every day and ridiculing them and mocking them, because they deserve it, because they're taking our money and they're spending on this undermining our country?
COMPAGNO: Can we talk about --
WILLIAMS: When people say these nasty things about Republicans, you guys go through the roof?
GUTFELD: I'm OK with it.
WILLIAMS: But I'm just going to say this. I think that it's important that we have just witnessed here on THE FIVE the rage from the right over this impeachment process. But what about the reality that the President tried to use his office to get political dirt on an opponent, and we continue to see evidence coming in that this was taking place in terms of even surveillance of the U.S. Ambassador that potentially was threatening to her life.
GUTFELD: It's part of the job.
WILLIAMS: So to me -- part of the job, that's right. The President of the United States is involved in threatening an American ambassador.
GUTFELD: He wasn't threatening anybody.
WILLIAMS: So you can't say -- you can't say the evidence is weak especially with the track record of Trump obstruction, one of the articles of impeachment.
GUTFELD: Oh, now obstruction.
WILLIAMS: And the fact that he was saying people don't testify -- don't testify, don't send the documents over. If he's so innocent, aren't you curious? Why not just have people testify? Why not put it on the table?
GUTFELD: If he's guilty, why is he acting like an innocent person?
WILLIAMS: Innocent person? An innocent person says let everyone testify. Here's the proof.
GUTFELD: That certainly helped in this process.
WATTERS: Juan, if you're accused of a crime, you're not taking the stand. You know what I mean?
WILLIAMS: Oh, no.
WATTERS: You put up a good defense. And in this country, you're innocent until proven guilty.
WILLIAMS: I think Bill Clinton --
WATTERS: Even the President of the United States.
WILLIAMS: Did Bill Clinton take the stand? Bill Clinton testified.
GUTFELD: Not this guy.
WATTERS: Bill Clinton was actually convicted of felonies, felonies.
PERINO: Including perjury.
WATTERS: Not Donald Trump, not Donald.
GUTFELD: There's no crimes.
WATTERS: Those were agreed upon crime.
WILLIAMS: Bill Clinton --
WATTERS: Felonies. He was actually disbarred practicing law, Juan.
WILLIAMS: Excuse me. You must missed the history. Bill Clinton was not convicted by the Senate.
WATTERS: Bill Clinton was convicted and accused felonies by the special counsel.
WILLIAMS: You know, this is the --
WATTERS: And that was the truth of what happened in the 1990.
WILLIAMS: This is how people start marching in Trump lockstep.
WATTERS: This president hasn't even been accused of a felony.
WILLIAMS: Oh stop. Obstruction -- abuse of power in terms of bribery --
WATTERS: It's not a criminal charge, Juan. And they didn't even float the bribery article --
WILLIAMS: It is.
WATTERS: The guys couldn't hack it.
WILLIAMS: It's in --
WATTERS: They couldn't hack it. They didn't have the goods and they failed. And that's why you've been sitting around this desk for the last couple weeks, pouting and moaning. Because if you are in a good mood, because you know what justice would be done.
WILLIAMS: No, it's because you are here. I couldn't listen. I could listen to all this flack.
WATTERS: But our viewers is smiling because they know the end to the story. We know he's acquitted and we know he's reelected.
WILLIAMS: Here's why I was pounding. It's January and I was waiting for your snow job. I was waiting for you to come in with this nonsense.
WATTERS: Well, there's global warming, Williams, and were not getting any snow.
WILLIAMS: Well, I just think if he's so innocent, why don't you say bring it on, bring all the evidence. Instead, you're up here, stonewall.
WATTERS: You do the investigation in the House and then you try it in the Senate. You had your shot in the House. You failed. Let the senate adjudicate.
WILLIAMS: Because we have a president who's acting like a monarch --
WATTERS: You can change the rules, Juan.
WILLIAMS: -- and obstructing justice.
GUTFELD: That is an opinion, it is not fact.
WILLIAMS: It is. It's an opinion that he obstructed justice?
GUTFELD: All of this is based on opinion. Every problem that you have with Trump is based on I don't like his personality. He's mean, he's obnoxious.
WILLIAMS: He's told people don't testify, don't present --
WATTERS: That's not obstruction, Juan.
PERINO: Can I play a sound bite just for a moment.
PERINO: So, this is Jerry Nadler, this is the C block intro soundbite number one. Control Room, if you can find that for me. So this is -- this whole issue like should there be witnesses or should there not. This is Chairman Nadler's position on Hunter Biden.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. JERRY NADLER (D-NY): Any witness who has information about whether that is true or not true is irrelevant witness. Anybody like Hunter Biden who was no information about any of that, is not a relevant witness.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: So there you go. And they keep -- the position on the Democrats will be that they don't -- they might want certain witnesses but they don't want Hunter Biden.
WILLIAMS: But there's a difference between material and imitate.
PERINO: I know. I'm asking the lawyer.
WILLIAMS: All right.
COMPAGNO: Right. And that's partly why -- first of all, this hasn't changed. This position hasn't changed this entire time. The Democrats wanted to neuter the GOP's presentation in defense of calling witnesses. And to this entire time, they argue it's immaterial and the GOP argues it is material. So ultimately, it seems to me that their strategy would be yes, let's get - - let's get everyone in here. Let's get everyone in here. Everyone should be committed to the highest level of transparency because both sides are arguing the information and the facts should be construed in their favor. But we're going to see. I mean, the whole bottom line is --
PERINO: I don't think -- I don't think that Collins and Murkowski will be bullied into saying that there should be witnesses because Collins already signaled today that the House did an incomplete job. I do want to ask you about this, Greg.
PERINO: You had this great monologue set up for the debate last night.
GUTFELD: Yes, but we're going to use it tomorrow because I never throw anything away.
PERINO: So in the meantime, Klobuchar --
PERINO: -- Sanders, and Warren, all three senators are like they're going to have to come off the campaign trail right 10 days before Iowa, sit there in the Senate, not being able to say anything. Is that a good idea?
GUTFELD: Well, it doesn't help them but it might help -- it might help Biden. That's what --
WILLIAMS: Big time. Big time.
GUTFELD: Look, the good news here is you've never seen a wider disconnect between reality and media. In reality, you have probably the most prosperous peaceful time in recent history. In decades, you have 29,000 stock market that's going to go higher. Meanwhile, the media is pushing impeachment as though the apocalypse is coming. And I think that America is smart enough that they're seeing this chasm. It can't be covered up anymore. It's too wide. And that's what you see in the -- in the list of things that are being trusted, Hollywood is the least trusted, slightly above that is the media. And I would actually think I trust Hollywood over the media at this point.
PERINO: What do you think about the debate last night? Did you have a chance to watch?
WATTERS: I did. I missed the (INAUDIBLE). I want to go back. I was completely bored by it. I thought it was flat. I guess Bernie had a good night. He's the only one with a little charisma. But I mean, he makes absolutely no sense when he talks about anything to do with money. Biden, for someone that's been in politics for 30 or 40 years, he seems befuddled by the basic elements of policy like health care, which should be his signature deal, Obamacare. He could just drop the hammer on these socialists on the stage and say, let's just expand Obamacare. Medicare for all is crazy. Let's move on, but he doesn't, because he doesn't have the skills and he's not sharp enough. And then the Liz Warren thing, man, she was so weak she had to play the gender card. I don't think it came off well. It's all she's got. She's fallen in the polls so she had to throw that out there.
PERINO: What do you think about Bernie Sanders?
WATTERS: It made her look small. And the moderators --
WILLIAMS: No, I think --
WATTERS: The moderators, in a he said she said, the moderators just side with she without even knowing what happens.
WILLIAMS: Well, this is interesting because this place to what Greg talks about in terms of media because I think CNN in terms of its reporting said, we know that Bernie said this to Elizabeth Warren, even though Bernie said I didn't say it. And in terms of me as the audience, wants to hear her have to argue with Bernie about his flat denial. I think that was unfair to Bernie. But it's telling -- it's telling that you are able to see at this table that Republicans have taken Bernie side in this argument.
GUTFELD: Oh, yes, because I think --
WATTERS: You know when someone is getting (INAUDIBLE) by the press, Juan.
WILLIAMS: No, because you know, like President Trump knows, he thinks anyway, not knows. But he thinks Bernie is more easily defeated than Joe Biden. And even Elizabeth Warren who said, can a woman win, and she says, yes, look at the women on this stage. They are the ones who beat a Republican.
GUTFELD: Liz is not trustworthy.
PERINO: It was just a matter of fairness. And I think that you even saw Liberals say that Bernie was treated unfairly.
WILLIAMS: That's what I just said. I just think you got to treat the guy at his word. Give him --
PERINO: Well, it was pretty obvious, like the senator was saying. All right, so, that was a lot of fun.
GUTFELD: Was it?
PERINO: And it's -- it really was. That's it for us. You're going to set your DVRs because you're never going to miss an episode of THE FIVE. Special --
GUTFELD: Are you? Unless they cut in again.
PERINO: Always set your DVRs.
WILLIAMS: Hey, you don't hold a grudge, do you?
PERINO: OK, "SPECIAL REPORT" is up next.
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