NFL national anthem debate continues to gain momentum

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NFL national anthem debate continues to gain momentum

Rhetoric heats up on both sides of issue; reaction and analysis on 'The Five'

This is a rush transcript from "The Five," September 26, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, and Brian Kilmeade. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNINDENTIFIED MALE: As they take a knee collectively, boos can be heard from this sellout crowd in Arizona.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: Well, NFL players and owners continue their anthem protest. President Trump is not backing down. He had a lot more to say on the subject at a White House news conference earlier.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I was ashamed of what was taking place because to me that was a very important moment. I don't think you can disrespect our country, our flag, our national anthem. I was at Walter Reed Hospital recently, and I saw so many great young people and their missing legs and missing arms and they've been so badly injured. And they were fighting for our country. They were fighting for our flag. They were fighting for our national anthem. And for people to disrespect that by kneeling during the playing of our national anthem I think is disgraceful.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PERINO: The president and the NFL has been fueling debate on the issue since Friday, when the president suggested any player protesting the anthem should be fired. And so now, Brian, we are five days into this story. It is not left the front pages or the top of any of these news shows. So where do you see it going after last night Monday night football game?

BRIAN KILMEADE, GUEST CO-HOST: NFL -- it's in the NFL's courts. They have 48 hours to get it done or else we're going to see more antics on this, Thursday. And Roger Goodell, I think, has just given unfortunate set of circumstances and challenges that previous commissioners did not have to tackle. I'm being totally honest. A lot of this is thanks for the hand grenade --. Everything is going to blow up on my watch. So I know it's not easy, but he should have handled this a year ago, just the way he handled the red, white, and blue cleats and the pink cleats all year long. But the NFL has to meet with the union right now, and I hope they're doing it. Don't tell the press. Just get it done. In a way that the players are going to feel comfortable and that nobody walks out feeling like they lost, because right now the only people losing are the fans. They're getting angry. There forced to say to themselves, am I giving up on my patriotism if I spend 500 bucks at a game with my kid?

PERINO: Jesse, that is an interesting thing about -- can this end by either Thursday night football or Sunday? Has the point been made by both sides? Or is there -- basically, do both sides benefit in their opinion by keeping this fire going?

JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: I don't think the kneelers benefit at all. The fans are sick of it, and the owners are going to probably get the point very, very soon. Trump is on the side of the country. He said it before. He's associated himself with the flags, with the anthem, with the country, and everybody kneeling is against that. So, I think he's clean on that. Trump just not president. He's a crusader, especially on this issue. And that's what drives the left so crazy. So in an effort to destroyed Trump, they're actually destroying the football season. And it's unfortunate because I think now a lot of people, like a Ben Roethlisberger said, wait a minute, I don't really like the way we handled that by not coming out into the field. Jerry Jones -- exactly, I mean, it's kind of the coaches' deal, so he was trying to do the team thing.

Jerry Jones tried to have it both ways. They knelt before the anthem and then stood during the anthem, but still got booed. You have Von Miller, the linebacker for the Broncos lost an endorsement deal because he knelt. Yet, the guy, Villanueva, from the Steelers, best-selling jersey right now in the league. So, freedom isn't always free, there's consequences. The market usually determines what's right and wrong, and they pulled the issue. Thirty eight percent don't support kneeling. Seventy two percent find the protest to be unpatriotic. So the left is losing the culture war, and they don't even realize it tearing down monuments to the founding fathers, by supporting kneeling during the anthem, by supporting sanctuary cities, by siding with Kim Jong-un over Donald Trump. This is going to be a blowout in 2020 if they keep this up.

PERINO: It's interesting, Kimberly, ever since Friday when the president really drove this home at that rally, there was a huge amount of riding. People either tweeting or commenting on television, but then the writing. I've actually been really interested to see -- in fact, I read somebody, Met Begly, today, he's a former marine officer who wrote in The Weekly Standard, saying I fought for their right to kneel. And I feel like there might be getting toward some way for people to find -- not common ground. Standing for the anthem is an absolute in my mind, but some understanding of like, you have problems, you have concerns, let's talk about them and try to work them out, and not have to use it as a way to sort of protest and ruin the football season.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Right. I mean, this was, you know, the issue of Colin Kaepernick, right? This is one man's idea to do this, and then all of a sudden when you really ask these NFL players, you know, what is your grievance? What are they protesting? What is it that's so wrong? I couldn't agree with you more. I think this is really an issue straight up with Roger Goodell, because I think this could have been avoided. In my opinion, it's bad management. He's essentially -- absolutely, and now it festers. It's half the size. And now we have this where everybody feels uncomfortable.

And the viewers, the fans -- what price are they going to continue to do this and alienate their customers? You see what I'm saying? When you look at the numbers and what's Jesse is saying it's just approaching it from, sort of, you know, a business perspective, but yet balancing the interest - - yeah, sure. You want to have a team meeting? Let's talk about how everyone is feeling. They want to bring in counselors in the locker room, I don't know. What's happening these days with football? All right. It's a little refer with my son playing flag football.

KILMEADE: The whole country is going to be playing flag football soon with the CTE, which is a bigger story, the head injuries.

PERINO: Let's get Juan's take on this, because -- I don't know if you saw similar -- you have the editorial commentary legs a few days behind these big events. And I wonder what's your take away has been?

JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Well, I think -- one, on the polling, I think most people say they're still watching the NFL and the ratings are not down. President Trump, oh, ratings so far -- no, the ratings aren't down.

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: They are down.

WILLIAMS: They are not down. They were not down this past weekend, Monday night football.

WATTERS: Yes, they were. All the other Sunday games were down.

WILLIAMS: This is a big, you know, fake news type situation.

PERINO: Oh, Juan.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: The second thing to say is that when you hear President Trump talk about the, oh, the flag, oh, the national anthem. Did he fight? Did he go to war? Oh, no. But secondly, that's not what the flag is about. America, as represented by the flag is about our values, our freedoms, our right to protest, to raise our voices, to come together as an American people when we think that there is something wrong. And today, Dana mentioned this in the Weekly Standard, you know, it was written, anybody who doesn't know that black people have a different experience than white people with cops id living in a bubble. They are intentionally blinding themselves to reality.

And when you get 70 percent of the NFL players who are black saying there's something wrong here, and all we're trying to do is call it out. Guess what? You get people like Bill Russell, the famous NBA star, taking a knee. You get someone like this. Look at this picture. This is an army veteran, 95 years old, taking a knee in support of the NFL players, 97 years old, World War II vet in Missouri. You also get people -- you ask Dana. Is this thing going to continue, is it going to grow? Look at what happened in baseball? Look at the Oakland A's player taking a knee yesterday. OK. Now it seems to me these are white people taking a knee. They understand there's something bigger at stake here than the way the president all of a sudden wants to wrap himself in the flag, like anybody who would say this, oh, what happens when we fly the flag at half-staff, Mr. President? Isn't that a symbol?

GUILFOYLE: But he's right, Juan, that these are private teams. These are private teams.

(CROSSTALK)

GUILFOYLE: You're absolutely right. So they can say, you know, are we taking a knee here at the table? No, we're sitting on our chairs. We're doing our show. There's a time and place and manner, you know, for everything. So the point -- this isn't just -- OK, do whatever you want. They're playing for a team. They're signing a contract. They're getting a paycheck. They're bargaining for a consideration.

WILLIAMS: Their team and the league said we understand that you have a legitimate grievance and you are seeking to use your platform to make sure the country is aware.

(CROSSTALK)

PERINO: Their platform would exist outside of the football field. I mean, in their communities and their states, a lot of professional athletes do great work and a lot of charity work. And they have platforms beyond the sideline.

KILMEADE: I'm going to do a Dana Perino, big picture. I'm realizing there's two issues that we're continuing to debate at each other and say to each other. The president sees it as patriotism. I don't think you have to join the army or navy or marines to be a patriot and salute the flag. I think you'd agree with that. So the president thinks is patriotism. And the fans who are upset, let's say like me, see it's about patriotism. And the people taking a knee, the athletes taking a knee say it's about race. So what we're trying to say is, I can't even get to the race issue because you're disrespecting the flag. If you found a way to get me to that race issue, I'll meet you there. But fundamentally, we're in the same family. We live in the same house. Don't comment on the house. Fix the house. But let's live in it together. And someone is saying, hey, this country isn't even good enough for me to stand and salute the national anthem. So it's race against patriotism. They're not mixing.

WILLIAMS: No, I think you're framing the conversation and a way that benefits your side.

KILMEADE: What side? I've just said there's two side.

WILLIAMS: No, no, no. Because, Brian, if it's all about, do I love America, there's no question I love America. This is the land of opportunity.

KILMEADE: But your symbolism says you don't.

WILLIAMS: No, no. OK, now we're talking about symbolism. I'm glad you granted that point. All the flag is a symbol. The reality, the substance of that flag is this is a great country where I'm allowed to express my opinion freely and I'm not to be punished by the commander in chief, the president, by telling my employers, get him out of here.

(CROSSTALK) PERINO: Because I do think there is commentary that is interesting about, should the president of the United States, whether it be President Obama, Bush, President Trump, be telling a private organization who they should keep on or fire. I mean, did that cross a line?

WATTERS: I think Trump was more defending the flag, defending the honor of what the flag represents, and avenging the assault on the national anthem. I agree that fighting police brutality is noble. There's a lot of people when they kneel, they're saying, I am rejecting police disrespect of black men. But when they do it during the anthem, they're disrespecting servicemen. That is the problem. People died for the flag. People were shot and paralyzed, Juan, and can't kneel for the anthem because they were shot by a sniper in Iraq or Afghanistan. This Iraq war veteran said this, real men don't take a knee for what they believe in. They stand up and fight for it.

WILLIAMS: Right.

WATTERS: There's a lot of veterans out there that feel very disrespected when they see players kneel during the anthem.

KILMEADE: They've got to remove the argument from the anthem, and then we'd have a totally different conversation.

WILLIAMS: Oh, so in other words, before this happened, everybody was properly focused, or did I, in fact, people on the right diminish and demonize black lives matter as a bunch of thugs who were copying us?

KILMEADE: This is black lives matter?

WILLIAMS: Oh, it's certainly is. That's what this is about.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: This is about a protest against unfair, brutal tactics used by cops against black.

PERINO: Listen, Kimberly, the last word, because that was the original protest. At this point, when you have so many different players, if you asked 25 of them, why are you protesting? You might get 25 different answers.

GUILFOYLE: You might. That's what I'm saying. It's so desperate in terms of what this specific individual reasons might be, you know. We were all on the same team, and everybody went around and asked each one of us what are you kneeling far, what does it mean? But you're right. It's now become attached in a way that I think it's kind of productive to the anthem, so now even more people feel alienated and upset. And it's in no way to diminish or disqualified or demeans people's feelings about what's going on in this country, or the need to shine a light on any kind of brutality, or -- by the way, crime in neighborhoods, or black on black crime, I mean, there's a lot of things that are upsetting that we should do something about.

(CROSSTALK)

KILMEADE: I was just with law enforcement that has a major event. They have a pushback on the feeling that they have -- two separate laws or enforcement as it relates to color of skin. So law enforcement wants to say in this. That's going to be the talk. I do remember this, after hosting a show with Jim Brown, he talked about in the 60's, going to meet then -- I think Cassius Clay. You would know as well as me. And he said, we wanted to find out why he was not going into the draft? But before he made a comment, they went and met behind closed doors with Bill Russel, it might have been Wilt Chamberlain, and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, and they met and they came out and go, he saw me, this is really something that I respect. I'm going to go in, you know. I'm going to do what I'm going to do. But Muhammad Ali told me that this is his pure thoughts that I will not fight this it's against my religion. How many people sat down with Colin Kaepernick around the league? They have 6,000 players. Twelve were five said Colin Kaepernick is on the right path. Twelve up until the president spoke. That is not Muhammad Ali, I will not go to Vietnam moment. But now it's getting that type of attention

WILLIAMS: It certainly is. And it's going to be on the cover of Sports Illustrated this week. And guess what? You see -- they say the sports world united in a nation divided, so it's not as if this is going to stop, Dana.

PERINO: It's interesting and a lot deeper, I think, than we all realized on Friday night. So we're going to move on. A lot of eyes are on the special senate runoff in Alabama today. Will the president be able to pull off a win for incumbent senator, Luther Strange? Stay right there. We'll tell you.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WATTERS: It's been a busy day in Alabama. The senate primary runoff between Luther Strange and Roy Moore is underway. While President Trump backed his guy, big Luther, his former top aide, Steve Bannon, is stumping for the other candidate, Roy Moore. Here's why.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) STEVE BANNON, BREITBART NEWS: I think Roy Moore is the guy that's going to represent Donald Trump and fight the establishment. I mean, it's very simple. This election is $30 million being spent by Mitch McConnell and that crew of corrupt and incompetent politicians and consultants. The hard-core Trump people, we're not here to defy President Trump. We were here to praise and honor him. And we think the best way to do that is to send somebody to Washington, D.C., out of Alabama, the good folks of Alabama, to send somebody who's going to have Donald Trump's back.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WATTERS: So this is very unorthodox, Kimberly, for the former White House senior advisor to leave the White House, campaign for the guy who's running against the president's handpicked guy. That he's spinning it as I'm doing this because I support the president.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. He's saying that he's out there doing this because he supports, and he's the most hard-core Trump supporter.

WATTERS: Right.

GUILFOYLE: Therefore, in order to put forward the president's agenda and proposals and ideology, this is the person that he has to go with in order to effectuate that outcome. But then, it really does suggest undermining the president's choice and the president's decision because the president went with a different candidate. So if you put this man in office, Donald Trump, because you believed that he would be the best person to make the decisions, to make the choices, and the calls, and put forth the agenda, you would perhaps think, OK, well, maybe we should honor his choice and his selection. That's not what's happening. So I find it fascinating. And we're going to see if anybody is living on Regret Island. We're going to find that out, tomorrow.

WATTERS: Juan, yesterday you use the phrase, little offensive, called Roy Moore, I think, ayatollah.

WILLIAMS: Of Alabama.

WATTERS: . of Alabama.

WILLIAMS: Yes.

WATTERS: Why did you say that?

WILLIAMS: Well, remember, he got in trouble because he refused to take down the ten commandments monument outside a judicial building and.

WATTERS: People love that in Alabama.

WILLIAMS: You asked me why.

(CROSSTALK)

WILLIAMS: If you believe in religious rule as opposed to living our country under constitutional law. That's more like an ayatollah than a judge. That's why I said that, Jesse.

WATTERS: OK. A little offensive, but carry on.

WILLIAMS: No, no, no. I wouldn't want to offend anyone, but I'm just saying. The second part is, then he says -- I'm not trying to offend you. But the second part is, then he says, oh, a Supreme Court ruling on gay marriage. I don't think we should enforce that here in Alabama. So I guess he doesn't like the idea of living in a country of laws.

WATTERS: So, that brings us to if Roy Moore is nominated and does wins, so Roy Moore now is Senator Moore. Is that going to be problematic if a guy like this, who's a little bit of a live wire according to Juan, gets in the capitol building and has to start answering questions that could be very controversial.

PERINO: Well, I guess, that's a possibility for all of them. I do think that the reason that the incumbent, Luther Strange, who was -- now, remember, he was appointed after Jeff Sessions was nominated by President Trump to be his attorney general. That left an opening in the senate. Luther Strange is the appointed person. That's why we're having this runoff between the two Republicans. If you ask Lindsey Graham, who was a senator of South Carolina, really attacked during his primary by five or six different opponents, and that really spread it all out and he was able to scoot by and he was fine.

WATTERS: A horse, I guess.

PERINO: And then, if you consider now you've just have Strange and Moore, there was Mo Brooks as well. So there weren't that many people to spread it all out. Roy Moore is super popular in Alabama. I wouldn't be surprised if he is able to win tonight. But the reason incumbents are supported like Luther Strange is because that's how you build majorities if you support the incumbent person. The interesting thing for me on this and I asked Sean Hannity about it yesterday, is I can understand supporting Roy Moore for a lot of reasons, but saying that he would be more supportive of Trump's agenda than Strange would be seems strange to me because Roy Moore up until recently was against the wall, he's also against the Graham- Cassidy, and Luther Strange has been for those things from the beginning. And yet, they think that somehow President Trump have the wool pulled over his eyes by the establishment. And therefore, they'll be able to -- by getting in with the real guy that he wants in there. It's very strange in Alabama.

GUILFOYLE: Strange and stranger.

KILMEADE: First, I would like to apologize to Dana for not preparing for your segment, Jesse.

(LAUGHTER)

KILMEADE: Number two, it's going to be who gets the Mo Brooks votes. I get that. Number two, I talked to somebody that's used to be involved intimately with President Trump, and he believes if Moore goes through, he will be as problematic to President Trump as Rand Paul. And that he will be going against.

WATTERS: He's a maverick type of guy.

KILMEADE: And for President Trump to call to Rick and Bubba, who's the blowtorch in Alabama, and I'm being serious. They're awesome. And he called in -- he said basically I don't even know Roy Moore. He called him Ray. And he said that Luther, he says, he'll be there, he's a good guy and he's tall. So I think he would be the guy. I'm just fascinating to see because Luther Strange has not been leading in any poll up to date right now. He would probably go without any Democratic opponent, substantial Democratic opponent. They say if Moore wins, look for Democrats to put $30 million into taking him out.

WATTERS: Thirty million dollars into an Alabama senate seat, I say liberals pour that money in. Coming up, the parents of Otto Warmbier lash out at North Korea in their first TV interview since their son's death. They spoke exclusively with Fox News. See that, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FRED WARMBIER: We see North Korea claiming to be a victim and that the world is picking on them. And we're here to tell you, North Korea is not a victim. They're terrorists.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: Well, that was the father of late-U.S. hostage, Otto Warmbier, with his wife, Cindy, lashing out at North Korea in their first TV interview since their son's death, more in a moment. But first, President Trump delivered a tough message to the rogue regime at a news conference earlier.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: It is time for all responsible nations to join forces to isolate the North Korean menace. We are totally prepared for the second option, not a preferred option. But if we take that option, it will be devastating. I can tell you that. Devastating for North Korea. That's called the military option. If we have to take it, we will.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

GUILFOYLE: OK. Dana, so the president, again, addressing this issue, not shying away from it, taking it head on today. Again, talk to me about the, kind of, progression of the messaging here, has it been consistent? Do you see some escalation?

PERINO: Absolutely. I think it has. I think for him, and he knows that America is on edge about it. And he also, I think, has to keep talking about it because he knows that Kim Jong-un is listening to everything that he says. So are our allies, which is important, so is our military. But the most important audience, I think, for him right now, is he's got to be talking to little rocket man as often as he can to make sure that he understands, like -- no, I'm not distracted. I'm on top of this. And don't you worry because we have a military option and we aren't afraid to use it.

I know that makes some people uncomfortable. They think the rhetoric is getting too high. But the truth is that rocket man is on a path to getting a nuclear weapon if he doesn't already have that. Marrying that technology is a concern. What I'm very interested in is how in the next -- two weeks, President Trump figures out how to deal with the Iran issue because by October 15th he has to decide to certify or not that agreement under the congressional law. And whatever that decision is that makes a big difference to what happens in North Korea and in Iran going forward.

GUILFOYLE: Any educated guesses?

PERINO: I think that everybody, if you're really interested in this, you should look at the speech that Nikki Haley gave. She's the U.N. ambassador. She gave a speech at the American Enterprise institute laying out how President Trump could actually certify but tell Congress, "You have to decide on the sanctions piece" and put it back in Congress's court.

GUILFOYLE: I think you should post every day for, you know, your recommended reading. One little, like, concise article.

PERINO: And he can roll his eyes at me.

GUILFOYLE: Exactly.

KILMEADE: Knowing Dana, she would charge for it, so it's all going to cost us, eventually.

I don't know whose pen this is, but it feels right in my hand. So the Warmbiers sat right behind you today. I talked to Ainsley, and I talked to them after, and they just told in a very calculated way, trying to hold back their emotions, what it was like to see your kid not in a coma but blind, deaf, with the bottom of his teeth were pulled out and put back in different places. With his foot cut open, clearly tortured. So that's how much this kid was beaten.

And I think it's so important for people to understand what we're up against. And that's an American. Can you imagine what he's doing to his own people?

GUILFOYLE: Well, we know.

KILMEADE: And for those people who want to say the president of the United States -- for one thing, that gets to the president more than anything else. Syria, when the kids, when he saw the kids. When he found out the details of this from Tillerson and company. That gets to him more than anything else.

And I'd like to add One More Thing. If you look at the fact that the president puts out a list with North Korea on it, and people say, "North Korea and terror? What, are you kidding?" That's why Mr. Warmbier came out and said, "Of course. They terrorized my son. They're terrorizing their own people, and they're getting away with it." And that's the message of today. That's what we're up against. It's easy to turn away and say, "Those crazy --- that crazy hermit kingdom." But we're going to be embarrassed for our generation when we take the cover off that country and we see the torture that was happening. And we let it happen.

GUILFOYLE: Well, that's the problem. And you know what? You don't want to forget about things like this. It's real every day when the Warmbiers wake up in the morning, when they go to bed every night.

KILMEADE: He took a poster down.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. They actually know the savagery of this nation, of North Korea, and what they -- what they're capable of. What they're doing to their own people and what they're threatening to do to us.

So at a certain point, you know, you've got to deal with it, Jesse, and the president is actually, to his credit, saying, "I will deal with it. I'm not going to pass the buck to the next administration. It's too serious."

WATTERS: And that was just heartbreaking the things you just described.

KILMEADE: Torture.

WATTERS: It's crimes against humanity, I believe. And it's not just the Otto situation. I just read something about he goes and picks out school girls in school...

GUILFOYLE: Yes, yes.

WATTERS: ... that are beautiful and then brings them back. He's a serial rapist, this guy.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, turns them into sex slaves.

WATTERS: He poisons dissidents, starves his own people. He fed his uncle to dogs. So I think right now, the president is trying to rally the country not just around the fact that they're a security threat. They're a threat to all humanity.

When the left -- and they've been doing this pretty effectively -- they almost put Kim and Donald on the same plane, and that serves to diminish and trivialize the threat and turns Little Kim from a bully into a victim. And Chelsea Handler said, "Oh, I wish we could trade leaders."

PERINO: Yes, right.

WATTERS: And then Toure the other day was saying, "Oh, I think that Little Kim was right in saying that President Trump's rhetoric was over the line."

GUILFOYLE: So nuts.

WATTERS: ABC, Terry Moran, we heard him say that President Trump's threats constituted crimes against humanity. Whoopee says both people are very unstable.

That has to stop right now, because I think that does a lot of damage to the United States' credibility.

WILLIAMS: Well, I think -- I'm interested in this conversation, because it sounds like you guys are just saying, "Oh, it's OK for President Trump, given the horrors perpetrated by Kim Jong-un, to do anything." Like we need to just rally and support the president, no matter what.

And I just have to stop and say wait a second. I mean, don't forget, I mean, we've heard from Steve Bannon when he was at the White House. We've heard from McMaster, and we've heard from Mattis at the -- at the Pentagon that any kind of military effort is going to have tremendous loss of life connected to it because of the proximity of South Korea, Japan. This is going to -- and our own troops are there. So you have to stop and think about this.

And don't doubt for a second, President Trump's rhetoric suggests that he says "if required" -- and I don't know if this means peremptory action -- he's willing to totally destroy North Korea. This has not engendered support for us.

Jesse, do your point, its made people around the world start to think, "Wait a second. What is Trump doing? Why is he talking like that?"

WATTERS: It's the opposite, Juan. After he said that, the Chinese banks slapped major sanctions on North Korea and financial institutions.

WILLIAMS: Listen. You heard from the Chinese...

WATTERS: South Koreans and the Japanese leaders said, both...

WILLIAMS: He's raised sympathy for this bad crazy guy. Restraint is necessary.

WATTERS: ... of the speeches this week have very strong and very effective.

WILLIAMS: What the Chinese said is restraint is necessary. What the Russians said, this is spiraling out of control. We need diplomacy not...

GUILFOYLE: But we're doing that.

(CROSSTALK)

WATTERS: We had diplomacy in the last couple decades, and now they're on the cusp of nuclearizing.

KILMEADE: The Russians did great diplomacy with Georgia and Ukraine. They are great.

GUILFOYLE: We don't need to, like, listen -- listen to them.

KILMEADE: We're going to get it back soon.

GUILFOYLE: OK, well, thoughtful deliberation and diplomacy, and then military strength if needed. That's what's happening.

President Trump addresses the growing humanitarian crisis in Puerto Rico. Next on "The Five."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WILLIAMS: Welcome back to "The Five." The devastation across Puerto Rico from Hurricane Maria, it's just heartbreaking. The Trump administration working to ease the humanitarian crisis. The president explained how, and he announced an upcoming visit to the island.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: I'd like to take a moment to send America's hearts and prayers to the people of Puerto Rico and the U.S. Virgin Islands.

I have directed all relevant departments and agencies to assist in the response and recovery effort.

I will be going to Puerto Rico on Tuesday. Our nation has been tested by the destructive force of Mother Nature. But we will respond to it with an even mightier force: the resolve of the American spirit.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WILLIAMS: Kimberly...

GUILFOYLE: Yes.

WILLIAMS: ... this is an interesting story, because the island is devastated. They're looking to the U.S. to help. And of course, they keep reminding people that the citizens of Puerto Rico are U.S. citizens.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, they're Americans.

WILLIAMS: And then the comparison comes in, "Oh, are we getting less than the kind of support and aid that went to Texas and Florida?"

GUILFOYLE: Well, OK, maybe that's a fair question, right? We never -- we're not going to be damaged by a healthy discussion and evaluation to say, OK, where are we spending the funds? We want to make sure that it's equitable. I think that's fair.

And this is a place that's suffering tremendously in terms of the devastation at the ports. Roads need to be repaired, ports rebuilt so they can actually get in the right amount of help, and supplies and resources that are necessary.

I talked about it on the show the other night. Dr. Manny is down there now, doing a tremendous job and working with the hospitals and the doctors and nurses. So many of those talented professionals had moved elsewhere during the economic time -- crises with Puerto Rico.

So they were already in a financial state of instability. Then hit by a brutal blow by Mother Nature. It couldn't be, you know, more of a disaster for them.

So I'm really happy the president is paying attention and that he is letting the world know that he's going to, you know, focus eyes and attention and resources on Puerto Rico and by actually, you know, going there to help these people. And Geraldo is there, as well.

WILLIAMS: You know, Jesse, this morning, though, the president was tweeting. "You know, wait a second." Puerto Rico has a broken infrastructure, massive debt. In fact, they've got $73 billion in debt and saying, "Hey, you know, maybe they are responsible for some of the level of devastation."

WATTERS: I don't think that was the message. I think he was just telling the truth and framing the issue to say that, yes, they have a lot to recover, because this is where they started from.

The new line of attack with the left now is that President Trump is so obsessed with the NFL controversy he's not paying enough attention to Puerto Rico. That just means the left was losing the NFL snafu and now are retreating and circling back to attack him on Puerto Rico.

From what I heard, the governor of Puerto Rico said that the president has been very supportive. Although I saw Geraldo down there earlier. And you've got to trust Geraldo when he's on the ground.

GUILFOYLE: Yes.

WATTERS: And he's, you know, from the island. They need a lot of help, and they need it fast.

GUILFOYLE: They sure do.

WATTERS: Like Kimberly said, the infrastructure is not in place to deliver it. So I'm glad "The Five" is doing this story to show the spotlight on this island, because it's incredibly tragic.

But the most important thing, once you get the relief and the recovery, and I've been there. El San Juan Hotel, Conquistador hotel. Beautiful places. Everybody, if they want to, book a trip when this place gets back up on their feet. Book a trip to Puerto Rico, go spend some money there, because that's really what the island needs, is our support.

WILLIAMS: You know, a moment ago, Dana, Kimberly and I were talking about the fact that Puerto Ricans are Americans. One of the realities, though, is that the mayor was crying and saying, "You have to understand we are devastated."

PERINO: That's right.

WILLIAMS: And I think you were pointing out, the crops are gone.

PERINO: Yes, so this is a story that 80 percent of the crops and agriculture in Puerto Rico, it's gone. Also, they have no power. And you have an immediate crisis with the dam that is about to break. Hopefully, it will not. But you have 700,000 people in the wake of that dam that could actually be in grave danger.

So the need is overwhelming. And so we've got to get all sorts of things down there. But to rebuild agriculture, that means -- if there's no agriculture, that means there's no fruit; there's no vegetables; there's no food and sustenance. So we have a big job to do in Puerto Rico.

WILLIAMS: You know what's interesting to me, Brian, is that Mitt Romney -- of course, he ran for president, former governor of Massachusetts -- said that he has been in touch with Puerto Rico, and he is calling on his fellow Republicans to get involved and points out that the Puerto Rican representative to Congress is a woman, Jennifer Gonzalez-Colon. She's a Republican.

KILMEADE: Right. I think he's 100 percent right. I think it's so easy to focus on Houston, the Virgin Islands, to Florida, to all the other challenges, North Korea. It's not like we don't have a lot going on.

GUILFOYLE: Mexico.

KILMEADE: However -- yes. People want to quickly say, "Well, the president's not taking -- putting enough attention to Hispanic people." That's quickly, "There he goes again." Because I guess Texas is more, has enough Hispanic people but I guess not enough for a lot of his critics.

Someone pointed out here that they are not a state, and they don't pay federal taxes. It should not matter.

GUILFOYLE: How sad is that.

KILMEADE: I would still send the Navy over there. I would still send everything you can to rebuild it.

But Dana, not only don't they have power. They don't even have a grid. They need a brand-new grid. This is going to be like rebuilding a mini- Iraq when we took over. So that's what's going to need. And we're writing checks on overdraft right now. So that's going to all play into this tax discussion and where we're heading.

PERINO: Yes, tax reform for economic growth.

WILLIAMS: Yes, I think this is -- it's complicated.

Anyway, much more to come on "The Five," including a very big announcement about Madame Dana Perino.

GUILFOYLE: Dana!

WILLIAMS: Stay right here for the big news.

KILMEADE: Madame.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KILMEADE: It's here; it's happened. A major step forward for women in Saudi Arabia. Today, it was announced that the kingdom will allow women to drive for the very first time ever.

Saudi Arabia was the only country to have a ban on women driving. The change will take effect in June of next year. So those who were arrested, paying the price, possibly in prison for driving, I hope will be free.

Do you think this is a good move, Kimberly, or should we go back to the old system of not letting women drive?

GUILFOYLE: Since I think women are very good drivers, myself included. Right, Dana?

PERINO: She's a great driver.

KILMEADE: Exactly.

GUILFOYLE: We have to do our driving segment, drive Dana around. It's going to be great.

Look, this is, like, unbelievable that this is the news story today. Right? You say to yourself, "Wait a second. Is this, like, some kind of joke?" How is it that women were not allowed to drive in Saudi Arabia? Wow.

KILMEADE: Right.

GUILFOYLE: When you think about that, something that we, you know, say OK, everyone should be able to drive. They finally got this well-deserved right. You can't even believe this is the modern day. God bless. I'm glad.

KILMEADE: Juan, Saudi Arabia in many ways, really -- not only women's rights are an issue. But at least they can drive around to now have a little bit of freedom. They were given almost no freedom.

WILLIAMS: I mean, I just think it's not a -- I don't understand it. I understand that they have a much closer adherence to their religious laws. But I think this was so much -- you know, it's antiquated and crazy and, I think, discriminatory, just wrong.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. Amen, Juan.

KILMEADE: One of the statements along -- Jesse, along with this release, was police will now have to be trained to interact with women in a way they rarely do in Saudi Arabia, since Saudi men and women have very little contact.

WATTERS: Ooh, wow. Interacting with women. That's a -- I guess this is a real problem for the Saudis. Who's going to train the police to interact with women? It's so ridiculous.

PERINO: Should we send you?

WATTERS: I can't even believe it. No, please don't send me.

GUILFOYLE: Jesse's busy.

WATTERS: Because we get so much oil from this country, you know, we don't always exert the full leverage that we could. This is finally something that's happening that's been progress. And I applaud them, even though it took a couple hundred years.

KILMEADE: Women will be taking less cabs. It could hurt the economy.

PERINO: Actually, I'm going to argue the other way around. And that is remember Condi Rice...

WATTERS: You're against women driving?

PERINO: No, about the economic impact. I actually think that what Condi said a few years ago right before we left the White House, in a speech there, she said you cannot expect your economies to grow if you withhold 50 percent of your population from participating.

GUILFOYLE: So true.

PERINO: And so this actually makes a lot of sense. The new leader of Saudi Arabia is trying to do some modernization. This actually doesn't take effect...

KILMEADE: Right.

PERINO: ... until June of 2018.

KILMEADE: Right.

PERINO: But it's certainly a big step forward. And I do think that Dana Powell at the National Security Council, and I don't know for sure, but I imagine that Ivanka Trump weighed in behind the scenes to try to make this happen.

KILMEADE: And the relations of this administration with Saudi Arabia are extremely good. I just said this. In all seriousness, there's women in jail right now because they tried to drive.

PERINO: Yes, let them out.

KILMEADE: They protested about it. You have to let them out. "One More Thing" is next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PERINO: It's time now for "One More Thing."

Our own Greg Gutfeld, you might have noticed, isn't here tonight, and it's because he's getting a very special award. Greg is receiving the Barbara Olson Award from the American Spectator tonight at their gala in Washington, D.C.

Barbara Olson was an American commentator. She passed away on September 11. She was a passenger on American Airlines Flight 77, which flew into the Pentagon. She was a real hero, because she called her husband to tell him. That's how we have a lot of the information that we have. She was a hero.

And Greg is much deserving of this award. The American Spectator itself turns 50 years old this month. So that means that Greg is older than the American Spectator.

WILLIAMS: Low blow.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Well, we have a very special announcement today on "The Five." Incredibly proud of one of our own, who represents us so well every day, and now she's going to continue to represent the channel in a phenomenal way with a very special show. Because Dana is going to daytime with "The Daily Briefing." That's weekdays every day at 2 p.m. Eastern.

But don't cry, "Five" fans, because she's also going to be here at this table every night.

And Dana, we just want to say you've done such an incredible job here and...

PERINO: Thank you.

GUILFOYLE: Unbelievable. We're so proud of you. God bless you.

PERINO: Thank you.

GUILFOYLE: You've been on that show at 2 p.m. before, and you were fabulous at it.

PERINO: I'm really excited for it, but I also recognize that without "The Five," there would be no 2 p.m. show.

WATTERS: You're welcome.

PERINO: Thank you, Jesse. Can't wait to have you on.

GUILFOYLE: Harris Faulkner is going to anchor a new program at 1 p.m., "Outnumbered Overtime." And Sandra Smith is going to be with our very own Bill Hemmer at 9. So what a great announcement. And, you know, just showing you the future of the FOX News Channel.

PERINO: Thank you, K.G.

GUILFOYLE: So enjoy it on Monday.

PERINO: Thank you. I don't like to talk about myself. But Juan is next.

WILLIAMS: So you know, I don't usually support the Trump administration, but I'm a fair-minded person. So I like to give credit where credit's due.

Ivanka Trump, you know, senior advisor to her dad in the White House, is spearheading an effort that's very close to my heart. It's a move to expand STEM programs -- That's you know, science, technology, engineering, and math -- in American schools. The president directed the Department of Education to invest $200 million in grant money to the program. The private sector kicking in another 300 million.

And today Ivanka Trump was promoting the effort in the Detroit public schools. So you know what? Hats off. That was good work, Trump administration.

PERINO: And she's taking a coding class herself.

WILLIAMS: Is that right?

PERINO: With her daughter. I could never do that. I could do the 2 p.m. No, I can't code.

Jesse, you're next.

WATTERS: I'd like to welcome my parents back from Africa. They just returned from a safari. They were in East Africa, in Tanzania. And in the north and western Serengeti.

PERINO: Your mom's beautiful.

WATTERS: They were there, visited a Maasai family. They were in the Rift Valley Children's Village and saw a lot of great people and a lot of great animals. So they got back, and they're home today. So welcome back, Mom and Dad.

WILLIAMS: You know what, Jesse?

PERINO: ... about that trip.

WILLIAMS: I lived there once.

WATTERS: You did?

WILLIAMS: Yes, and hung out with the Maasai young men. Boy, did they know I was an American.

GUILFOYLE: What an incredible trip. So happy for your parents.

WATTERS: Yes, they had a great time.

WILLIAMS: That's a great trip.

PERINO: We'll be asking them about it.

Brian thinks he has the best "One More Thing," so...

KILMEADE: I did until your announcement. And of course, the vacation. It's been great.

All right. So there is one new sitcom, traditional sitcom that's captured the world's attention and certainly mine. My body double, Kevin James, is soaring in "Kevin Can Wait." He brought it back to Long Island. He brought me behind the scenes, and I saw the magic of his comedy. And you know, he's one of the funniest people, most successful in the business.

But they have a problem. They wanted to bring Leah Remini back, and they had to get rid of his wife. So in a sitcom, how do you get rid of the woman and keep people laughing? That is Erin Hayes. Last night, we found out in season one. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEVIN JAMES, COMEDIAN: You've got to be kidding me. Not again.

ERIN HAYES, ACTRESS: What is it?

JAMES: It's from your Mom's gym. It's a postcard. "I haven't seen you. We miss you." You know what? So do I.

HAYES: You know what? Give me that. I will call them right now. It's been over a year since she died.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KILMEADE: You can't kill off somebody like that in a comedy. That is not the way you kill off somebody in a comedy. Kevin James is a genius...

PERINO: How would you do it?

KILMEADE: Here's what you do. You don't acknowledge it. Just put the new person in. Like for example on "Bewitched." We never asked who the new Darren was. We accepted the new Darren.

You remember "The Fresh Prince Of Bel Air."

GUILFOYLE: Yes.

KILMEADE: There were two Aunt Vivians. We accepted the two Aunt Vivians.

PERINO: And Brian thought that was the best "One More Thing." I don't know.

Set your DVRs. Never miss an episode of "The Five." I'll see you at 10 p.m. tonight. "Special Report" is up next.

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