Trump: Don't like drawing red lines, but I act if I have to
The president sits down with Eric Bolling to discuss North Korea, foreign policy challenges on 'The Fox News Specialists'
This is a rush transcript from "The Fox News Specialists," May 1, 2017. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I am Eric Bolling along with Eboni K. Williams and Kat Timpf. And this is "The Fox News Specialists." Thank you so much for joining us today on the inaugural episode of "The Fox News Specialists." Every day, Eboni, Kat and I will be discussing today's biggest stories, but here's the twist, we'll be joined by two specialists for unpredictable and unexpected commentary.
Let's meet today's specialist, he started his first company selling garbage bags door- to-door at age 12, since then he's developed businesses and invested wisely earning him billions with a B. He doesn't golf but he does love basketball, so he bought the Dallas Mavericks an NBA franchise. And he specializes in all things entrepreneurship. He's Mark Cuban, and he is here.
And he's the co-producer and co-host of "The Circus" on Showtime. He's worked on big league presidential campaigns, namely, George W. Bush and John McCain presidential bid. He has competed into two iron man competitions, and his specialty is Nashville songwriting, Mark McKinnon is here. So on day one you guys we have two specialist, Mark and Mark. Welcome, gentlemen. Thanks for joining us on the first show. Cuban, finally in studio sitting next to me.
MARK CUBAN, DALLAS MAVERICK OWNER: Here I am wearing and I'm wearing a suit.
BOLLING: And you look great. And Mr. McKinnon.
MARK MCKINNON, THE CIRCUS COHOST AND CO-PRODUCER: Congratulations on the show.
BOLLING: Thank you.
MCKINNON: Big guest this morning.
BOLLING: We've been working together, the three of us, for a long time but never together at the same time.
EBONI WILLIAMS, CO- HOST: Going to cashing in, baby.
(LAUGHTER)
KATHERINE TIMPF, CO- HOST: Oh yeah. I'm very excited. I'm very excited to party right now.
BOLLING: Guess what, 5:00 will never be the same.
WILLIAMS: Never, never.
BOLLING: All right, let's get today's stories. It's been one of the president's biggest promises since he hit the campaign trail, repeal and replace ObamaCare, but thanks to what's being called ObamaCare lite, Republicans were unable to seal the deal with Paul Ryan's plan. But reports swirling around today suggest they may finally be close to reaching a deal on health care. A senior White House official telling Fox a vote to repeal and replace ObamaCare could happen as early as Wednesday. Earlier today, I sat down with the president to discuss this among other issues. Here's what Mr. Trump had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: Health care. We're going to get that past?
PRESIDENTDONALD TRUMP: The one mistake I made with health care. You know we have one plan that's been going through. It's been getting better and better and better. And somebody saying, oh, the people who voted for Trump aren't getting good -- they're going to get the greatest. These are the greatest people. We're going to have a great planner. I'm not signing it. And I said from day one the best thing I can do is let ObamaCare die and then come in with a plan, but it's not fair to the people. So, then it's going to be very good. I don't want to set deadlines. I think it's going to be approved. It could be soon, but it could be not so soon. It's going to happen. But remember this, I've been really focused on this for like, seven weeks and seventeen months.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: All right, Eboni. So we may get a vote this week. And boy, let me tell you, it's a hard fought vote that he may be earning.
WILLIAMS: Yes, certainly. But you know what I'm more concerned with, Eric, is instead of getting a fast vote, something that's actually better. That's my thing. I've never been somebody fighting, necessarily making ObamaCare better. If you need to repeal in order to do that, I'm not really beefing with that. But these harsh deadlines, the best thing I think President Trump said there is, I'm not concerned with the deadline. I'd rather get it right, however long that may take. Than something fast and it's no better than what we currently have now.
BOLLING: Kat, he need this though. I mean, they decided that was the first thing they're going to do coming out of the box, health care. That's big issue that they gone first.
TIMPF: Right. They should not have done that, in my opinion. And I did not like the last plan. It had the same pitfall as ObamaCare. And I agree that they should wait to find something perfect. But at the same time, not doing anything is making a decision. It's like if you're with your friends and you're arguing where to go to dinner, you want to go to a really good place. But if you argue too long, the only thing that's going to be left is the diner with the waitresses that smelled like cigarettes and broken dreams, who don't have teeth, which would be like single-payer in this case. Which nobody wants and then nobody wins.
BOLLING: Let's talk a little bit about the politics of this.
MCKINNON: Here's the challenge. They were able to get the freedom caucus on board because they now have in the bill an option where it goes to the states, and the states can opt out of such things like pre-existing conditions. The president said yesterday that he says pre-existing conditions should be in it. They should be guaranteed. Well, if they're guaranteed then the freedom caucus is going to have a problem with it.
TIMPF: Because prices will go up if they guarantee.
MCKINNON: Sure.
TIMPF: Why have everything. It's an emotional thing. Of course he wants people to be -- of course.
CUBAN: Look, who's going to take less, the stakeholders or the health care providers, the insurance companies and the patients. Who get less?
WILLIAMS: And that's really the thing that nobody wants to say though. You're exactly right, Mark Cuban. Because under what we currently have, there's no way for more people in America to have coverage, which is the goal of ObamaCare, probably the only thing it successfully did, 20 million more covered, but it so much more expensive. And you cannot do both at the same time.
BOLLING: Can I jump in and give you the conservative version of why I think everyone can do better. We can have lower premiums. We have lower costs for health care by providing competition, Mark. You know this is one of the most.
CUBAN: Yes, OK.
BOLLING: Let me finish this. So my biggest problem with the original bill was that it never allowed for health care across state lines. Competition drives down prices.
CUBAN: Let's look at this like a business, right? How much do you think premiums could go down?
BOLLING: Premiums or health care?
CUBAN: Premiums is for health care.
BOLLING: Well, how is this? How much can health care go down? I'll tell you how much premiums can go down.
CUBAN: Exactly, right. So have you seen any stock analyst downgrade any insurance company at all? Have you seen them say, look, they're going to sell more policies based off of this? No, because it doesn't play out. Just because they wanted to happen first, doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. And they better be careful what they ask for because it's not going to work the way they plan.
BOLLING: That's my biggest concern is that it doesn't happen at all. I mean, the promise, Mark, is that it will happen in phase two or phase three of health care.
MCKINNON: It's got to happen. And the worst thing that could happen will be the roll it out and have it go down again. So, as you've said it should wait. Make sure to get it right this time.
(CROSSTALK) CUBAN: What was the number one thing Obama had to do when it came to selling the ACA? He had to get as many healthy people on it as possible. When -- if and when this passive, what's the number one thing President Trump is going to have to do?
WILLIAMS: Give it as a mandate?
CUBAN: Well, no. Because -- the tax payment that you have to make. He's going to have to go out and sell to as many healthy people to sign up as possible.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: The irony is he and Obama have the exact same challenge.
BOLLING: You know why?
TIMPF: Demanded the exact same thing, just because you'll have to be penalized by the insurance company rather than be penalized by the government. You're still being penalized for not buying something.
WILLIAMS: Health care package that doesn't really make life better.
TIMPF: There's a reason why things that are covered by insurance have been rising in price. Things that aren't covered by insurance have been dramatically decreasing in price because there's competition in one area only.
BOLLING: Absolutely. And you hit the nail on the head. When you remove that mandate, Mark, and you are forced to get healthy people on it. If you don't have the mandate, healthy people say, look, I'm not going to do that it's too expensive.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: But, McKinnon, what about this? What about the freedom caucus who now all of a sudden is on board. Somehow they were fighting it and now they're on board. I defended those guys tooth and nail for a long time. And I'm going, wait a minute, this isn't that different but you're on board?
MCKINNON: Yeah. Well, I agree we've got to expand the staples like you're saying. I like the federalist approach to give it back to the states, if they want to take up pre-existing conditions, let those governors deal with the politics of it. That will work.
CUBAN: But what about the health care of it? You know, politics is one thing, but what about the people?
WILLIAMS: Do you know the quality of health care, Mark Cuban?
CUBAN: Yeah.
WILLIAMS: I think that's what is not being talked about. I was discussing this with a very good friend of mine who is a practicing physician and he said that's the thing. We're talking about health insurance and health care like as if.
TIMPF: They're very different things.
CUBAN: The best thing we do just get the health insurance companies out, right?
TIMPF: I agree with that.
CUBAN: The day has come where I think we can go.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: Worst of all, worlds in libertarian land which is single-payer.
CUBAN: Right. But -- we have de facto single payer because of all the risk pool money that both plans put up, right. We pay it through the back door right now because they're doing, what, $150 billion for risk pool and more under Obama. It's the fact those single payer. We all pay in to pay everybody -- no matter what.
TIMPF: With insurance company -- with that system, it's not really patient centered because the customer isn't the patient, the insurance company is.
MCKINNON: The key is to make the pool bigger.
(CROSSTALK) BOLLING: Right. And Rand Paul would say that. But that would bring insurance costs down. It doesn't bring the health care costs down.
MCKINNON: No, it's exactly right. You're exactly right.
BOLLING: But the way to do that is to provide competition, right. Let a hospital compete with another hospital. Get the insurance companies out of the way, period.
WILLIAMS: And how are these doctors going to feel though, Eric? I like your idea of competition. It will drive down premiums and prices. I'm worried about how it will affect health care itself because if people are getting less -- far less, right, for the coverage they're providing, I don't know how we continue to incentivize the quality, if it starts being that cheap, so to speak.
TIMPF: Make a patient center, make doctor's answered the patient not insurance companies.
MCKINNON: And a quarter of the states are almost a quarter, you now have this one insure. That won't work.
BOLLING: Do you know what the news is though? It's big news. Health care -- people care about health care.
MCKINNON: And this stuff is hard.
BOLLING: It is.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: It's fun talking about health care. What's the biggest threat to the country? Is it ISIS? Is it a crazy Korean dictator? Is it the Democrats? We'll hear what President Trump sees as our biggest threat when Fox News, "The Specialists," continue.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WILLIAMS: President Trump took some time out of his very busy schedule to talk with Eric Bolling today on the debut of "The Fox News Specialists." They discussed many hot topics as you could imagine including how he's handling North Korean dictator Kim Jong-un, as well as ISIS.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: Mr. President, thank you for joining us. Let's start with North Korea. I know a lot of people have been talking about it. You mentioned it over the weekend with CBS. Kim Jong-un, is there a redline for President Trump with North Korea?
TRUMP: Well, I'm not like President Obama where you draw a redline, as you said, a redline in the sand and then lots of bad things happen and he never goes over the redline. In fact, I actually covered his redline for him with Syria. But I will say that -- you see what's going on. It's very, very bad. It's very threatening to us and to many other allies, if you look at South Korea, if you look at Japan and others. It's a very horrible thing that's going on. And the statements are very inflammatory. They're horrible. So we'll have to see. I don't like drawing redlines, but I act if I have to act.
BOLLING: What would it take? Would it take a missile launch into South Korea, conventional or nuclear?
President Trump: You know I've been pretty well known for saying like nothing when it comes to the military. When they announced it was going to, they were going to Mosul in four months, and then they said in three months, in two months, we're going in next week. I said, why do they keep saying that? And that was supposed to be a pretty quick battle for Mosul. Guess what, it's still going on because the enemy knew they were coming. You just don't talk about it. You do what you have to do and you don't talk about it. So when people say, well, I was asked yesterday, well, I mean, exactly when would you go in, at what time would you go in? I mean, it's ridiculous. I don't want to talk about it. I can say this, he's very threatening. He's a big threat to the world.
BOLLING: How safe are our troops there along the demilitarized zone and our ally, South Korea. House safe are they with some of the defense systems that we've provided and what's the status?
President Trump: Nobody is safe. I mean, who's safe? The guy got nuclear weapons. I like to say they're very safe. These are great brave soldiers. These are great troops, and they know the situation. With 28,000 troops on the line, and they're right there. So nobody is safe. We're probably not safe over here. If he gets the long-range missiles, we're not safe either. So we have to do something about it, and we will see what happens.
BOLLING: Is he your biggest concern foreign policy wise?
President Trump: I think probably yes. Look, we have ISIS. We're doing very well on ISIS. We have made tremendous strides in our fight against ISIS. And we have no choice. Not that we want to do this, we have no choice. There is an evil there, and we have to solve that. We can't let -- you know, when I first saw the heads being chopped off, I said to myself, I've never seen that. Not since medieval times have we seen the things that are going on in the Middle East. So we have to solve the problem. We should have never been there. We should have never gone in. We should have never attacked Iraq. They didn't knock down the World Trade Center, by the way. But once we were there, we should have never gotten out the way President Obama got us out. The void was formed, and ISIS was formed, and now they are in 32 different countries. And I tell you what, I inherited a mess.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: All right, Eric. So here are -- see you speaking with the president. He is clearly gravely concerned on both of these fronts from a national security perspective and foreign threat perspective. Many times, I heard you, Eric, giving kind of an opportunity for a line to be established as to at what point the president is going to move forward in a particular way. He refused to do it. From your take, is that the way to go just to keep all options on the table?
BOLLING: It's very interesting because I kept trying to get him to get to a redline. I know they don't want to do that, but I think the American people want to know what it's going to take, other than they're going -- at the last minute, decide to maybe wipe out the North Korean missile system or they're going to wait for a preemptive strike on of our allies, South Korea. I don't think they have the capability of getting anywhere near here, but I think Japan could be at risk. And think about this for a second, I asked him about China. China has to step up. I mean, they provide energy to North Korea. They provide food to North Korea. If there is a war on North Koreans soil, there's going to be a massive refugee problem going right to China. They're not going to go south. They're going to go right north to China. So I've asked him are they playing -- he alluded the fact that they would, but it wasn't very specific.
WILLIAMS: No.
CUBAN: Look, part of the problem I see is he's scaring the hell out of everybody every single day.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: Well, no. Just in general.
WILLIAMS: That's a serious question because I do think.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: North Korea, Iran, ISIS. Who else? Syria, I mean, all of these catastrophic potential conflicts. Instead of just scaring us, I think he should really be talking about why he got voted in, his strengths, his confidence and what we can do. Tell us the good stuff, right. Tell us where this military is going and how -- you know what, these are threats but here's how we're going to deal with it. We don't need timeline we just need a sense that he can do it.
TIMPF: Absolutely, absolutely. And I really like when he was running, he was very much more into a situations that involve diplomacy. We can work it out. We're going to be involved in that. I mean, we need to do everything we can to make sure we don't have war with North Korea.
MCKINNON: But, Mark, I'm serious.
TIMPF: Massive bloodshed.
MCKINNON: . he went into Syria, acted on Syria, and people like Nancy Pelosi said props for that.
BOLLING: Any by the way, two-thirds of the American people approved of Syria.
(CROSSTALK)
MCKINNON: Biggest foreign policy mistake and Donald Trump kept his word on it.
TIMPF: But why was it a mistake? What success that we have getting involved in that area repeatedly, over and over again.
MCKINNON: Because Obama said he was going to do something and didn't do. You lose your credibility with other world leaders.
WILLIAMS: I think that's where America as a nation is not very consistent or clear maybe is a better word, around where we want to be doing. Do we want to intervene in this moment or don't wait? Because Donald Trump ran on, Mark, saying that he's a nationalist candidate and that America was first and Syria was serious problem. But then when he bombed it, you know, a lot of people from the left as well are celebrating. So, again, it's an inconsistent message. I think we're even giving the president on what we want him to do.
CUBAN: If you look at anyone of these individually, you can say he dealt with it right. When you look at them in aggregate, it's scary. Why? Because he went from being voted in.
BOLLING: Are we any less safe based on what he's done? Dropping bombs on both Syria and Afghanistan?
TIMPF: Are we any more safe though.
CUBAN: Not the point. He's got to instill confidence that we can deal with whatever enemy comes along.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: Instead he is saying they are at risk in Korea. We are at risk here.
MCKINNON: This is where the meetings with China have really helped and I think had been productive.
CUBAN: I agree.
MCKINNON: This is where -- China can choke them off with sanctions. As you've said, they've got electricity, they're a lot of other things they're offering to North Korea and we can choke that off completely.
CUBAN: Look, if he gets the right preparation, he's one of the world's greatest salespeople. That's why I think he wants to sit down and have these meetings and do face-to-face diplomacy. Hopefully he gets the substance he needs to do it.
(CROSSTALK)
TIMPF: People criticizing when he does that.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: You want your American president to sit down with Kim Jong-un, that crazy dictator?
TIMPF: Yeah, absolutely. I'm not saying like grab his little cheeks and say, oh, you nice little chubby boy, you're so wonderful. I'm saying you talk, and you do anything that you can to avoid war because.
MCKINNON: I don't want to call him honorable. It hasn't worked not to meet with him.
TIMPF: Exactly. What do you have to lose by meeting with him?
MCKINNON: Well, or you could just do this.
TIMPF: Ten million people live in the capital. There's 30,000 Americans. If there's a war, that's going to be huge bloodshed.
MCKINNON: Trump has been flattering. Remember McCain calls him a crazy little fat kid, and when pushed back he said, I'm sorry, he's not little.
(LAUGHTER)
TIMPF: I like that.
CUBAN: We don't know the exact issues, but every meeting he's had face-to- face with the head of government has turned out positively. He is a great salesperson. Hopefully they will give him the tools and information to go out and sell and offer diplomacy.
BOLLING: He should bring back President Xi of China back to Mar-a-Lago. Remember the last time he visited Mar-a-Lago, he bombed Syria. So bring him back.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: Other than chocolate cake. Let's back off a little bit.
WILLIAMS: Yeah, I love diplomacy as much as the next person, but I think you're right, Eric. It doesn't work all the time. You've got to be honest about it.
TIMPF: You should try it first.
WILLIAMS: But first, this May Day protests are normally focused on worker's rights, but this year as you might guess has taken on a brand-new meaning, thousands hitting the streets to rally against President Trump's immigration policies among other. You will hear from them when "The Fox News Specialists" returns. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TIMPF: May Day protests are underway across the globe today as demonstrators speak out against more than just worker's right. Here in the U.S., protesters and as many as 200 cities are taking aim at some of President Trump's policies, including immigration.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: We are here today in front of the immigration and customs enforcement building, which has really become a symbol of terror and hate.
UNINDENTIFIED FEMALE: We want to make sure that families are not being separated. We want to make sure that there's not corporation out there supporting the Trump agenda which is an agenda that breaks up the families.
UNINDENTIFIED MALE: There is fear and there is anxiety, but what gives me hope and gives me resilience moving forward is that the communities are resisting and saying this is not the way that we should operate in the United States, and we've got to stop. We're not going to go back in the shadows. We're actually going to fight because this is a country we love and we want to make it better.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
TIMPF: OK. So May Day is historically a socialism protest, and now it's apparently also an anti-Trump protest. I always thought the purpose of a protest is to show all the support you have for your cause. If everyone's got a different cause, it's a bigger -- people, bunch of different causes, what is the point then?
(LAUGHTER)
MCKINNON: We did a show focusing on the resistance, Democratic resistance, a week or two ago. And what we discovered is, A, they're galvanized but, B, they're not unified.
TIMPF: Nope.
MCKINNON: We went out and we did a Nancy -- Feinstein town hall. And she used to be a liberal lefty from San Francisco, right. And now they think - - Democrats thinks she is a sellout because she's not for socialized medicine.
TIMPF: So what's the point? Everyone is mad about something. There's a bunch of people like, oh, we're all mad. Yeah, everyone is mad. What's the point?
CUBAN: It's America. This is what you do. You protest, right. You get the word out, particularly in social media world because it's going to get covered. It's going to get tweeted, snapped, Instagram, website blogs, etcetera.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: Well, you start somewhere and you evolve.
WILLIAMS: So I love a good protest. I've been in several as a college student, law school student, I think, you know, first amendment rights are fantastic. It's one of the things I love about our country. I agree with you, Kat. You've got -- this started in New York City at least on Saturday. I saw signs that say they were immigration, LGBTY, police brutality, you know, six or seven issues. So, Mark, I want to ask you this because you're a strategy guy. When you have maybe four messages, can any of them be effective, or is it OK to kind of not put all your eggs in one basket?
MCKINNON: No, that's the challenge. I remember when Republicans were going through. When your party is out of power you spend a lot of time in the dessert and what you've got to do is find water, and that becomes a unifying cause.
TIMPF: But there are a lot of people who are antisocialist.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: Saturday was the climate change people. Today it's the May Day people. There is the common denominator. They are all anti-Trump. And they're aggressively anti-Trump.
CUBAN: Think about this for a second though. Trump is a unifier on that regard.
(CROSSTALK)
TIMPF: That he makes them all mad?
BOLLING: There were 200,000.
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: They are not all paid though, Eric Bolling.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: Let me just say you this, diplomacy starts at home, right? If you want to end conflict, go talk to them, don't just say, you know, I don't want to acknowledge them or ignore them. You have to talk and you have to learn.
BOLLING: You guys are saying the same thing about Donald Trump, the candidate, who could never become president.
CUBAN: He won.
BOLLING: . because he was to anti-illegal immigration. He hasn't changed his stance on immigration, and he won, and they're still protesting.
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: What, 76 percent.
TIMPF: He didn't win the popular vote. A lot of people are still going to be upset.
WILLIAMS: I would submit that he has changed a bit on immigration, Eric, though, in terms of the order in which people are being deported. I think this is my chief issue with it. He ran saying he's getting rid of rapists and murderers and whatnot; and instead we're seeing many people that do not fall into that criminal category still being deported. We know those stories.
But this is my question to you, Eric, because you've spent time with President Trump this morning. When he sees this type of resistance, this type of organized protest -- so far we think it's been nonviolent. Do you think, to Mark Cuban's point, it can be effective? It is something that he even thinks about or considers as he makes policy?
BOLLING: I honestly don't think the protests do, but I think his children do. And I think Ivanka and Jared Kushner are both very -- they have an ear to this, this stuff. Like, especially the climate change stuff. And I think that has softened Donald Trump, because Ivanka and Jared have been saying, "Look, there are a lot of people out there..."
WILLIAMS: So he can be...
BOLLING: "... literally millions of people who are..."
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: But not because of the protests, because whatever way -- reason they're making that issue, it's making its way to his top advisors.
CUBAN: He works so hard to talk to people overseas. He works so little to talk to people who didn't vote for him or who didn't vote at all. And that's a problem.
TIMPF: That's true, but it's kind of a two-way street, right? The signs aren't, like, "Please talk to me." They're, like, "Donald Trump is a hate crime." So it makes it a little difficult.
MCKINNON: Small crowd, sad.
TIMPF: Sad.
BOLLING: So this is a true story. The producer sent us out information on these May Day protests this morning, and I'm not kidding. It said, "Hundreds of thousands expected to protest." And then it went down to tens of thousands.
TIMPF: I didn't see anybody. I walked to work. No problem.
BOLLING: Now it's thousands. A few people.
TIMPF: Exactly. Right.
The president was renewing his feud with the media, issuing some harsh statements over the weekend. Up next, what President Trump told Eric about his rocky relationship with the press.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BOLLING: Welcome back to "The Fox News Specialists."
The president's love-hate relationship with the press was reignited this weekend. While media elites gathered together in D.C. for the White House Correspondents' Dinner, the president was in Pennsylvania giving a speech to his supporters and, of course, taking a few jabs at the press.
Earlier today, during my sit-down with the president, I asked him about this ongoing feud.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: I assume when you say fake news, you feel they don't cover you fairly. That's what you mean by fake news?
TRUMP: Not all of the media. You know, I'll tell you just -- that is unfair the way they cover me, because they say the media, I'm against the media. I'm not against the media. I'm against the fake media.
If you look at CNN, the way they cover me, no matter what you do, it's negative. Hits, hits.
So I love the media. I think the media is great, and if I do something bad, treat me badly. But they don't tell it like it is. And even on the 100 days, not to make a big deal out of it. You're going to see lots of great things happen for the next 100 days also, but we've done a lot.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: All right, Kat, your thoughts on that Saturday night with the White House Correspondents' Dinner with those elite -- media elites with their bowties and steaks. And then on the other side, you had President Trump hanging out, talking to his deplorable people.
TIMPF: Yes, I would have done that, too. Right? He can go somewhere where everyone's going to make fun of him, no matter what, or he can go somewhere where everyone is going to cheer for him no matter what. So it makes a lot of sense.
The fake news thing is always funny. There have been times it's unfair. But he does kind of treat any bad news like fake news.
WILLIAMS: No, you make -- that's my question. So this is my thing, Eric. I believe in fairness. And the CNN relationship is adversarial. Right? I mean, that's just where they are, and I get that. They're petty and mean with him. He's petty and mean right back. You give it as good as you take it. I'm fine with that; that's a wash.
But the president says here that he's OK with some media. But I would love to hear him say, "You know what? That's a fair critique. Let me take a look at that." If he said that, I think that this whole, it's not all media thing thing...
MCKINNON: It would make those targets more credible. But blowing off the Correspondents' Dinner was a brilliant strategic move.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
TIMPF: Absolutely. And can you imagine if any other -- any other relationship like that was treated, when someone says, "Hey, we have some issues." You start screaming, "Fake news. No, fake news. Fake news." You have to listen sometimes.
BOLLING: All right, Cuban, when you have an adversary who's wildly unpopular, isn't it smart to continue the fight with them?
CUBAN: Yes, the first 756 times, right? But at some point, you've got to do your job.
All -- look, you -- it was a great interview. You asked great questions, and he could have gone into substance or depth about anything. I'll give you an example.
They got the budget approved through October 1. That's his best move so far. He could have -- he could be up there bragging about, "Look, we finally went across the aisle. We finally got things done. I'm -- this is my example of me being able to bring people together and get something passed."
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: ... actually.
CUBAN: Didn't even mention it. His finest moment, and he didn't even mention it.
BOLLING: But if he feels he's being treated unfairly by a group, a media group, whether it's, you know, mainstream media or print media, why shouldn't he continue to fight?
CUBAN: Why doesn't he just carry around the world's smallest violin? I mean, it's crazy.
BOLLING: He can tweet to 100 million people. Press a button, 140 characters.
WILLIAMS: That's fine. But many of us are asking this question, Mark. Is his the issue with me (ph) media or is it with accountability? Because that's a separate issue. If your issue is only with people that were treating you unfairly and being mean to you, that's fine. If you have an issue with accountability, that's a problem.
TIMPF: I would rather have a press that does -- is tough on the president.
BOLLING: Yes.
TIMPF: Because that is how you have him be accountable. I'd rather have them be too tough than not tough at all.
BOLLING: OK, Kat, but then what about the last eight years under President Obama? We can't say the press was tough on President Obama.
TIMPF: I'm saying that was bad.
WILLIAMS: They liked Obama.
MCKINNON: It's going to be the golden era of journalism. I think this is an opportunity to be a truly great journalist.
Let me give you an example. We all have to do a better job with fake news, because there's a lot of it out there. Part of what's happening that's good is that, I think, is that consumers are becoming aware of that there's a lot of fake news.
But for example, on our show, we are shooting the Easter Egg Roll. There was a thing. We were shooting it live, and there was a thing where the president signed a kid's hat and threw it up in the air. We were shooting a thing on Twitter. And he throws -- he signs the kid's hat and throws it up in the air. So it looked like he threw the hat away from the kid. And Twitter went mad, and that's when we shot on the thing. And then it turns out the kid caught the hat. But that's...
TIMPF: Right. But it turns out that way, and he's able to say, "Look at all this fake stuff." The truth does come out. That's not what I'm talking about.
CUBAN: We're 20 years into the age of the Internet. Everybody has to be more careful now.
TIMPF: Sure.
CUBAN: But look, I'm going to answer that. We're 20 years. I started a blog in 2004, because someone wrote a story about me and the Mavericks that was complete nonsense. So I put in the blog exactly what the facts were.
This is the president, the leader of the free world. He has access to his website. He has access to Facebook. He has access to everything. He can do more than 40 characters. If someone is misleading, if CNN says something wrong, well, put out what's right; put out the facts.
MCKINNON: Your point is a good one, though. He just can't say that everything he doesn't like is fake news. There's got to be times when something he doesn't like...
CUBAN: But you have a platform. You have the world's biggest platform with the Internet to communicate around the world.
MCKINNON: But he'll be more credible if, on occasion, he'll say, "You know what? Fair shot."
CUBAN: Just give us facts.
WILLIAMS: There you go. I think a lot of -- a lot of people would appreciate that, I think.
BOLLING: But he will still -- you know, he takes on The New York Times. He takes on The Washington Post, but he'll still go to them when he needs something, when he wants something -- when he wants something else.
WILLIAMS: Isn't that interesting?
TIMPF: Don't you mean the failing New York Times? To have an arbiter to say you know how to spell "failing" in front of it.
BOLLING: Yes, but OK, you're failing, but here's a story that -- that, you know...
TIMPF: You are failing, but I will talk to you.
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: You have to have -- to your point...
MCKINNON: You're succeeding because of Donald Trump.
WILLIAMS: ... every president has to have a dialogue with certain parts of mainstream media. That's necessary.
BOLLING: But if he feels there's one group that just completely will never give at least a hat tip to his side of the story, why should he embrace that?
MCKINNON: But he does. I mean, he meets with the people that he thinks are his enemies. That's actually smart.
BOLLING: We're getting wrapped here.
Recently -- recently-retired former President Obama -- it sounds great -- has spent time rubbing elbows with one-percenters, and now he's taking heat for making huge bank off Wall Street speeches. And it's not just me who thinks so; it's folks from the left, like that guy over there, Cuban.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WILLIAMS: President Obama continues to be under fire for banking $400,000 in speaking fees. Let me say it again, that's a big number: $400,000 per speech.
And the criticism isn't just coming from those on the right. The New York Times issued a blistering takedown of the president, saying, quote, "It is disheartening that a man whose historic candidacy was premised on a moral examination of politics now joins almost every modern president in cashing in."
Van Jones also had some words for the president and perhaps some advice on how we can fix the problem.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VAN JONES, FORMER OBAMA ADVISER/CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: If he were to do a poverty tour first. Listen, he should not be the first president to have to be broke. Listen, every other president went out there and gave the big speeches. Don't hold him to a second standard. Don't give a double standard to him.
But I'll tell you what: From a moral point of view, it would be great for him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WILLIAMS: OK, Eric, this is my issue with that. I think everybody in America knows how you feel politically about President Obama. But this issue specifically, because I do know you are a capitalist. I think where Van Jones and many of the progressives, to me, are being the ones that are tone-deaf here is why are we demonizing and equating it as a moral failure to want to make money?
And here's where I'm coming from with that. I think many people in this country are maybe left of center or something like that, maybe can go that way. But we still work hard and want to do well in life and live a good life and a good lifestyle. And not be made to feel bad about it. So can you help me reconcile this?
BOLLING: May I? I think Van is 100 percent right.
WILLIAMS: But pass the torch (ph).
BOLLING: President Obama is going to make a billion dollars. He's going to be -- he's going to be like this guy over here.
WILLIAMS: What's wrong with that?
BOLLING: Nothing. So go ahead and to the poverty tour first. Go ahead and hit the people who -- who elected you. I mean, he was a grassroots organizer. He went door to door, to make sure people who felt that they were not part of the system...
WILLIAMS: And so he shouldn't do well now?
MCKINNON: Let's let the capitalist go. What was your advice to him?
CUBA: Well, I have a real problem with what he's doing.
WILLIAMS: Please tell me why. Because I for the life -- seriously, can't -- here's the other reason. These people -- Van Jones, Liz Warren, Bernie Sanders, everyone that's condemning Obama right now were with her. Right? And she also made a whole bunch of money speaking to Wall Street, as well. So why is it OK for Hillary and not OK for Obama?
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: I have a real problem.
BOLLING: He's going to tell you. He's going to tell you.
CUBAN: I have a real problem. He's not charging enough.
WILLIAMS: OK.
CUBAN: Are you kidding me? One, President Reagan got a million dollars a speech in Japan in 1989. Two, he's killing the market for the rest of the people who go out and do...
WILLIAMS: Also here.
CUBAN: Charge more. I said that to him in the past.
BOLLING: But he could give a few away first, right?
CUBAN: Well, he probably does.
BOLLING: Like when he went to Chicago, he didn't charge for that.
TIMPF: It does kind of fit, because he also said that the Wall Street fat cats have too much money, and now they have 400 grand less. Maybe that's what he's trying to do. Maybe it's a little sneaky...
MCKINNON: Trickle up. Trickle up.
TIMPF: Of course it's hypocritical, but kind of who cares? There's plenty of people that I've said, "Oh, this person is a problem. This is not a good person." But if they called me up and said, "Hey, Kat, come over and talk to me. I'll give you 400 grand..."
WILLIAMS: But Kat, you can't.
TIMPF: ... I'd say, "I'm on my way." And maybe even "I love you."
WILLIAMS: The only question, Kat, is...
TIMPF: You all would. I'm just saying.
WILLIAMS: ... can you not make money and still be passionate and compassionate for poor people in America?
TIMPF: Of course. You have to do that after you're done making your 400 grand.
MCKINNON: Drag the rake. Drag the rake. You had the hardest job in the world. Drag the rake.
CUBAN: Absolutely. Get paid.
WILLIAMS: Get paid and get back on that road.
(CROSSTALK)
BOLLING: He signed a $65 million book deal. He's going to be OK.
WILLIAMS: And there should be more, right?
BOLLING: But how are you going to be the president who says, "I'm of the people, for the people, by the people" and then, once you get out, you no longer -- charging 400 grand for a speech.
CUBAN: I am stupid rich. I am stupid, stupid rich, and I get to give money to anybody for anything anytime I want. And I try to help as many people I can. And so...
BOLLING: You never played like you were one of the people. You never said, "Vote for me. I'm going to make your life better."
(CROSSTALK)
MCKINNON: I've got a theory about this.
WILLIAMS: This is how rumors get started, Mark Cuban. I like that.
So what do NFL draft day and O.J. Simpson have in common? Well, they're both making headlines because of this T-shirt. Are you stumped? Well, wait until you see this. Stay with us.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
TIMPF: Newly-drafted wide receiver Zay Jones made the cut for the team on Friday night, but he made the headlines for different reason. During the draft, the 22-year-old was seen wearing a T-shirt inspired by O.J. Simpson's famous 1994 police chase but with a twist. Instead of showing police cars chasing the Simpsons' white Bronco, the shirt showed a bunch of white Broncos chasing a police car. Apparently some sort of statement.
You know, I do understand issues with criminal justice, particularly in the black community and police brutality. However, is O.J. Simpson really the example of the person that you want to have be the poster?
WILLIAMS: Let me stop -- Kat, let me stop you. I don't think we need to overstate it, because Eric and I were talking in the break. I don't know what we're to take from that T-shirt. Right? I don't know that he's holding up O.J. Simpson as...
TIMPF: He was just worried everybody else would be wearing a shirt with the police chasing O.J., and he wanted to be different?
WILLIAMS: I'm just saying, I don't want to be overly conclusive. That's all. Because I don't know what he's saying.
MCKINNON: People are going to read into it whatever they want to.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
MCKINNON: And I defend First Amendment. I went to jail on a First Amendment charge. But if you're going to do that, be smart about it, especially if you're a professional athlete. Just ask Colin Kaepernick.
TIMPF: I want to know why.
WILLIAMS: But you think Colin Kaepernick was being smart, Mark.
TIMPF: Mr. Cuban, you are a T-shirt interpretation expert.
MCKINNON: I don't think he's in the NFL any more.
TIMPF: Specialist, if you will. What do you think?
CUBAN: I think good for you, right? Whatever it is you want to convey, do it. If it's a conversation starter and you have a point you want to make, go for it.
TIMPF: The second part is what I don't get. What's the point?
CUBAN: The point is big. Right? We're talking about it. We've made progress.
MCKINNON: There you go.
WILLIAMS: Let me ask you this, Mark Cuban. As a franchise owner, though, when you see this player up for grabs, so to speak, at a draft, and you see him making a -- some type of political social justice statement. WE don't know what it is.But he's making a statement. Does it give you pause?
CUBAN: No.
WILLIAMS: No?
CUBAN: Can you play?
WILLIAMS: Right.
CUBAN: Anybody who works with me, they can say whatever they need to.
MCKINNON: But if a player is a distraction, does that create a distraction?
BOLLING: You can play, right. You can play. Technically, Kaepernick could play.
WILLIAMS: Well, that's arguable. That's my point. Yes, let's not over -- he ain't the best out there.
BOLLING: By the way, your buddy, Cam Newton?
WILLIAMS: Don't start. Don't start. We were having such a good show, such an nice time today.
MCKINNON: We're going to give a shout-out to Cam at the end of the show.
WILLIAMS: Yes, there's a special Cam surprise at the end.
MCKINNON: We've got a Cam moment.
BOLLING: Got to end with Cam.
TIMPF: So are you happy now with that?
CUBAN: I got my dab in? Yes. I'm sad we didn't bet on it, though, but yes.
TIMPF: Oh, bummer. Make a little bit more money.
BOLLING: Can we -- I hate to do this. Can we speculate on what it actually means? We have, like, a series of white Broncos chasing one squad car, right? I mean, I literally don't -- what's the message?
WILLIAMS: I don't know what it means. I know that right now there's a lot of nostalgia around what happened in Los Angeles, around the O.J. -- this past weekend, Tribeca Film Festival, 1992, L.A. Riots anniversary came up. So I think there's just a lot of unanswered question, Eric, around the Los Angeles P.D.; around black men in America...
MCKINNON: O.J. doc was on...
TIMPF: Right, but O.J. was treated more than fairly. They let him drive around a very long time with his little moustache bag.
WILLIAMS: And nobody's crying for O.J. Simpson in the black community that I'm aware of. So I don't know that that's -- that's why we're speculating around what the shirt meant.
TIMPF: Exactly.
BOLLING: You know what blew me away also? I realized it was 22 years ago. This kid is 22 years old, right? So he's wearing a T-shirt of something that happened the year he was born.
MCKINNON: And he's got everyone talking about it.
TIMPF: Another interview with Trump that's coming up tomorrow? You want to talk about that a little bit?
BOLLING: We have a little bit more with the Trump interview. We went -- I went deep on a lot of things, and we didn't have time to, obviously, get all of it.
But he was very engaging. He really wanted to talk, and he was very nice to give us this interview, because it was our first show. Right?
TIMPF: Yes.
BOLLING: He's like, "Got to do this for your first show," and he was fantastic. Sixty minutes, said, "I don't want to necessarily do it," but he said, "I'm going to."
It was really cool, too. I'm a political junkie. So while I'm waiting for the Trump interview, General McMaster walked by. I'm like, "Hey, General, how are you doing?" And then Reince Priebus walked by. And then Sean Spicer was over there. I yelled over to him, "Hey, Spicey!" And gave me kind of gave me a frown look, like don't.
CUBAN: I want to know what was on his desk. What was on the president's desk?
TIMPF: That's a great question.
BOLLING: It was clear. It was a telephone on the president's desk. It was completely clear. And the telephone. That was it.
WILLIAMS: What do we -- so what do we think of his next 100 days?
BOLLING: I have a picture, and I'll post it on Twitter after the show. But it was a clear, clean desk.
WILLIAMS: So Eric, we're done with the first 100. What do you anticipate from -- from this president for the next 100 days?
BOLLING: Well, I think oddly enough, he finishes 100 days, and the week he finishes, we might get health care, which will lead into tax reform. I asked him about time frame on those.
TIMPF: Maybe. Big "might."
BOLLING: But here's a big one. I said what about infrastructure? He's like, "I really need that, because I want the Democrats in."
WILLIAMS: I think that's really -- tax reform and infrastructure is where he should have started, in my opinion...
MCKINNON: I agree.
WILLIAMS: ... because...
TIMPF: He probably...
(CROSSTALK)
CUBAN: And I'm going to tell you here and now. You hear it from me first, right? Here's an attempt to add more jobs by creating these factories, it's going to lead to fewer jobs. And 18 months, 24 months from now, if you look at the total employment for any company he's bragged about, they will have fewer employees. He doesn't recognize that. He's not getting the...
BOLLING: How?
WILLIAMS: What do you think about the next 100 days? What do you -- what do you expect?
MCKINNON: I think what he's learned in the first 100 is going to help in the second, which is process matters. Process matters.
CUBAN: I agree with that.
MCKINNON: Got to get it done right.
BOLLING: Boy, did he get burned by that. Not necessarily because of himself. I mean, let me think about this. No, no.
TIMPF: Maybe a little.
BOLLING: Let's be honest. OK, so health care, right? Paul Ryan was the one who came up with a health care plan and said to President Trump...
WILLIAMS: Oh, Eric.
BOLLING: ... "I can sell this." And he -- and Trump, to -- you know, if he has a strike against them, he believed Paul Ryan.
MCKINNON: All right. So he learned that. That's why he's doing tax reform differently.
WILLIAMS: Trust and verify? Trust and verify.
CUBAN: He's got to learn some of the basics. You know, he doesn't know what the three "R's" are. Go with that.
BOLLING: Let me ask you something. You bought the Mavericks, right?
CUBAN: Uh-huh.
BOLLING: You weren't a perfect the first week, were you, in the first 100 days owning the Mavericks?
CUBAN: No, but it was money. I mean, they were the worst professional sports team in America. There was no place to go but up.
MCKINNON: Started with the worst Congress in America.
WILLIAMS: National title.
TIMPF: He inherited a mess, I've heard him say that.
MCKINNON: He started with the worst team in Congress ever. So he's got nowhere to go but up.
TIMPF: Yes, I...
CUBAN: Hey, Eric, let me say thank you for inviting me. This was amazing. Congrats on the first show.
MCKINNON: Five p.m. will never be the same.
BOLLING: That's the tagline. That's one of Kat's friends who came up with that. That is a great line. Thank you guys for joining us.
WILLIAMS: Thank you so much. It was a big honor. Thank you.
MCKINNON: And I got to dab.
TIMPF: You did.
CUBAN: We've got all dab. Ready, go.
WILLIAMS: We're done.
TIMPF: Thank you, everybody. Thank you to our "Fox News Specialists" today, Mark Cuban and Mark McKinnon. And make sure to tune in to "The Circus's" final episode, airing on May 7 on Showtime. Thank you all for watching today. Come back tomorrow, because Joe Namath will be joining us. Make sure to keep the conversation going on Twitter, using the hash tag #FoxNewsSpecialists. "Special Report" is next.
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