This is a rush transcript from "The Five," December 6, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Dana Perino along with Kimberly Guilfoyle, Julie Roginsky, Eric Bolling, Tom Shillue. Its 5:00 in New York City and this is "The Five."
We are just two hours away from president-elect Donald Trump's second stop of his post election thank you tour, this time in Fayetteville, North Carolina. You'll never know what he might say so stay tuned. Remember the big news he revealed in Cincinnati last week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT-ELECT DONALD TRUMP: I don't want to tell you this because I want to save the suspense. We are going to appoint "Mad Dog" Mattis as our Secretary of Defense. Keep it inside the room, but that's what we have and he's our best. They say he's the closest thing to General George Patton that we have and it's about time. It's about time.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: Retired Marine general James Mattis will be joining the president- elect tonight and will formally be announced as Mr. Trump's pick for secretary of defense, that's according to the transition team. And Kimberly, earlier today I spoke to some senate staffers who said they believe that waiver that is necessary for him to be able to get the confirmation because it's not been seven years since his retirement, that they think that's going to be able to sail through, no problem.
KUMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Well I hope so because we need it to sail through. I think he's an excellent choice. I'm really looking forward to it. This is a name that was kind of banded (ph) about before as a potential vice presidential pick as well.
A lot of people in the military have tremendous respect for him. He's got a cool nickname, "Mad Dog." We share that in common. I'm "Mad Dog" and my boy is "Row Dog." Ain't that funny? That's how my brother calls me. He doesn't call me Kim or whatever. He calls me "Mad Dog."
PERINO: Is there a reason you got the name?
GUILFOYLE: More like tough cool. I like that.
PERIONO: Julie, do you agree that --
TOM SHILLUE, GUEST CO-HOST: Does it have to do with fighting?
GUILFOYLE: Undefeated in sports.
PERIONO: You think the Democrats will go ahead and support the waiver?
JULIE ROGINSKY, GUEST CO-HOST: I think some will. I think some already said they won't. I hope they do. This is not a fight that I think they should pick. I think he's a reasonable choice. Typically the president does get his choice of nominees except for extreme cases and I can think of a few extreme cases that where I would not support the nominee.
But this is not one that I think they should oppose. I u understand you have the senator here from New York, Kirsten Gillibrand, saying she's not going to do that and a few others in the house but the reality is --
PERINO: Not that many.
ROGINSKY: -- not that many and I think they should.
PERINO: Do you think they will announce any other nominations tonight?
BOLLING: I'm hoping -- I'm hoping Jon Huntsman gets named as secretary of state. He's obviously not going to do it.
GUILFOYLE: I think you got a man problem (ph).
BOLLING: Oh my, didn't I just tell you.
GUILFOYLE: I think you're going crazy.
BOLLING: Look, like I had this brainstorm a couple of weeks ago and then it turns out Huntsman talked to him the other day about possibly becoming the secretary of state and the more I think about it, the more -- and I've looked into Huntsman's past. I've known him -- his family has been in business, has been in the oil business, has been in the natural gas business, in the chemicals business for years, for decades. They have a massive cancer center out in Utah, but Jon Huntsman is a two-time governor, elected twice to probably one of the redder states in the country.
PERINO: And ambassador to China.
BOLLING: Ambassador to China. Speaks Mandarin. The guy knows business. The guy knows the world. I absolutely love this choice and --
ROGINSKY: Are you getting (ph) credit for (inaudible)
BOLLING: No, no, because I didn't tell anyone. I told some friends a dinner but I just think -- I'm just so happy when those things -- how's this, I know the campaign, the transition team watches this show. I'm just putting my two cents that this would be an absolutely great pick. He's the -- he brings everything that Romney would have brought but without the never Trump part of the Romney --
PERINO: Do you have a comment of general Mattis and the Department Of Defense before we move on?
TIM SHILLUE, CO-HOST: Obviously he should get the waiver, but forget about the waiver. They should change this law. It's from, I guess 1947. It was ten years and they changed it to seven years because they realized -- I think they realized there was something wrong with the law. I think that the military is different now. The idea that you have to be out of uniform for seven years, it seems like a crazy law. I mean, what is the reason for it? The idea that you want to be off the battlefield?
PERINO: I mean civilian control of the military has long been, I mean that's --
SHILLUE: Seven years. It seems a little long to me. I think they should change the law.
PERINO: All right, let's move on to something else because we had President Obama today who was speaking about national security and he's repeatedly claimed that Al Qaeda's leadership has been destroyed but ISIS is waving victory flags in some places of the world. He did so again during his counter-terrorism address at MacDill Air Force Base in Tampa just moments ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: For Al Qaeda, the organization that hit us on 9/11 is a shadow of its former self. Its leadership has been decimated. The terrorist threat was never restricted to South Asia or to Afghanistan or Pakistan. Even as Al Qaeda has been decimated in Afghanistan and Pakistan, the threat from terrorist metastasized in other parts of the Middle East and most dangerously, we saw the emergence of Isil, the successor of Al Qaeda to in Iraq.
To say that we've made progress is not to say that the job is done. We know that a deadly threat persists.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: The president also warns against aggressive interrogation techniques, including waterboarding.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: Staying true to our traditions as a nation of laws advances our security as well as our values.
We prohibited torture everywhere at all times and that includes tactics like waterboarding and at no time has anybody who has worked with me told me that doing so has cost us good intelligence.
Despite all of the political rhetoric about the need to strip terrorists of their rights, our interrogation teams have obtained valuable information without resorting to torture.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINP: Kimberly, this is probably one of his last addresses that he'll give on national security and he's just going over some of that well (inaudible) ground on waterboarding and trying to make -- actually I think he was trying to say obviously we didn't contain the terror threat because now you have ISIS to contend with.
GUILFOYLE: Right. Okay. So President Obama was really not a big fan of the killer capture. He kind of loves the killing, to be honest with you, because he's the one that has ordered all of these predator drone strikes. No, he's not in favor of waterboarding, not in keeping them alive. But the problem is when you don't utilize effective intelligence gathering techniques, you are then wasting an opportunity to be able to get intel and collect it to prevent future attacks.
If you're just killing an information rich source target like that, it dies with them. So you're not able then to continue forward to get other associates, other people that are working with them. Other, you know, predictors about future terrorist attacks and that's a problem so we've actually lost.
And if you talk to any of the intelligence officers, a lot of opportunities to be able to get that information so, I think they really need to take a focus back on that and you'll see that with General Flynn and General Mattis. I believe in terms of advising him about that to get back into the intelligence game.
PERINO: Because Eric, that is interesting because in 2013, President Obama gave speeches saying Al Qaeda is decimated, we're moving on and that because of that vacuum left in Iraq dealing with ISIS, which has then metastasized in around the region.
BOLLING: And what he failed to mention that what happens is, these killers, these Islamic extremists, which he won't say, went from the Taliban to Al Qaeda, from Al Qaeda now to ISIS and if you start to make some way into ISIS, they'll metastasize into something else in another region where you take your eye off the ball. It's very interesting to me though that, you know, President Obama is against waterboarding, we know that.
Although he'll take the victory lap on killing Bin Laden even though the intelligence came from a waterboarding session that led to the courier that eventually got Bin Laden. But he's more concerned of releasing this Gitmo (ph) terrorist than getting information out of them.
It just blows my mind and he wonders why they go from Taliban to Al Qaeda to ISIS. You have to get the intel. You have to do what it takes to get the intel and then kill them, call them what they are. A very interesting side note, General Mattis, against waterboarding.
PERINO: Well, I think what's interesting, Julie, is not of the things that Donald Trump has said, and I think Michael Flynn as well, but why do we keep announcing what we would do or not do? Just say we are a nation of laws. I do believe that everything that was done in the Bush administration was lawful.
But do you think that maybe there'll be a different way to address terrorism and given what Kimberly was saying, it's not just kill but maybe killing -- capture so that we can get the intel?
ROGINSKY: Maybe, but first and foremost, yes, General Mattis is now against or has always been against waterboarding. Apparently Donald Trump, after a conversation with him -- a brief conversation with him, is now also against waterboarding. He announced at Bedminster a couple of weeks ago when he met with him. But what I think is fascinating, you know, Kimberly has a point about capturing these people and getting information from them whether through waterboarding --
PERINO: But there is other intelligence gathering --
ROGINSKY: -- or hopefully other means. What's interesting to me though is you have to put boots on the ground in order to do that. It's a lot easier to kill them from drone and not put our soldiers in harm's way and on the ground. So, we have to have an honest discussion.
I've said this from day one, if we want to do that, we have to have an honest discussion with the American people this will involve having many more troops on the ground in order to capture these people because a drone can't capture them, and that's a discussion that I think President Obama frankly has been loath to have and I think to some extent president-elect Trump is also been loathed to have.
It's an honest discussion that we need to have about the appetite that people in this country may or may not have for putting more boots on the ground all over Southeast Asia, the Middle East and now more and more potentially in places like Europe.
GUILFOYLE: That's not the intelligence gathering (inaudible). What you're going to do is you're going to have CIA officers, you're going to have Special Forces, special operators, S.E.A.L.S -- they are there already. They're all there. They're all there. They're there right now.
PERINO: But I'm not sure --
BOLLING: So we think (inaudible) going to capture these killers on the battlefield, bring them back to Gitmo and then do what?
GUILFOYLE: You interrogate them.
BOLLING: But they don't want to do. So, maybe Mattis has a different idea. Maybe Mattis will come in and say, all right, so, we'll capture them. We'll bring them back to -- we won't close Gitmo, and we will enhance interrogate them. OK, you don't waterboard them but there are many other methods of enhance interrogation.
ROGINSKY: Listen, (inaudible) torture them, I'm fine with that, but if there are other ways to do and apparently Mattis doesn't believe that you need to torture somebody to get information out of them. Trump said --
PERINO: Really you could define torture in many ways, right.
PERINO: One thing we didn't talk about today were any of the attacks such as Fort Hood, Chattanooga, San Bernardino, and Orlando.
SHILLUE: Yes. And the reason that we talk about waterboarding so much is because it's right on the line because you talk about defining torture. We don't torture but right on the line was waterboarding. It's the most talked about thing. And how often did we do it? A couple of times and we will not shut up about waterboarding. No one is going to do it. It's off the table, basically.
SHILLUE: Now it's become a way --
GUILFOYLE: We do it to our own troops. There's been more U.S. soldiers and Special Forces guys and operators waterboarded than any of the enemy, get that, because in order to even be in those groups, it's part of the training.
SHILLUE: I'm with you, Kimberly. That's why it's either do it or not. But we've talked about it so much --
PERINO: Then why talk about it?
SHILLUE: It's a way to signal, you know, we're against torture, against waterboarding. I mean President Obama has never waterboarded but he's never stopped talking about how he won't waterboard.
GUILFOYLE: Which is torturing us in a whole other way, and there's other enhanced interrogation techniques that are so frightening like caterpillars on shoulders if they are afraid of bugs.
BOLLING: Loud music.
GUILFOYLE: Loud music
BOLLING: Speech defamation (ph)
GUILFOYLE: Yes, I mean it's a thing --
BOLLING: God forbid the open hand slap. I mean that is just awful. These people are blowing up and killing Americans everywhere they can find one or westerners.
PERINO: OK, we're going to keep going. Coming up, president-elect Trump announcing another jobs deal here in the United States, what this means for the American worker, up next.
BOLLING: Well, some big news on the business front. President-elect Trump securing more jobs for the American economy. A Japanese investment group company pledged $50 billion -- let me say that again -- $50 billion and 50,000 jobs to America.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: He's just agreed to invest $50 billion in the United States and 50,000 jobs. And he's one of the great men of industry so I just want to thank you very much.
MASAYOSHI SON, CEO, SOFTBANK: Thank you.
TRUMP: Thank you.
SON: Because he would -- a lot of deregulation. I said this is great. The United States -- U.S. will become great again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What exactly are you committing to?
SON: Invest into a new company, a startup company in the United States.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And how many jobs do you believe you can create?
SON: Fifty thousand new jobs. We will invest $50 billion.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: Mr. Son went on to say he's investing in America because Trump won the election. First Ford then Carrier now a $50 billion investment that will put 50,000 Americans back to work. You can get upset with me for saying this but it's exactly what I've been saying for 18 months.
The businessman who knows how to negotiate deals is just what America has needed for a very long time. Now, let's sit back and watch the liberal posse twist itself into knots over this and we'll start with you, Julia.
ROGINSKY: Is the liberal posse here to twist?
BOLLING: But you have to be happy when you see a Japanese firm pledging $50 billion that they didn't have to do. They're just --
ROGINSKY: I was super happy about that in October when they announced this deal, right. So they announced this in October, which was before the election. I'm very happy that they're now upping this commitment to --
BOLLING: From 25 to 50.
ROGINSKY: From 25 to 50.
ROGINSKY: They said in October they could do potentially as much as 100, so they are doing half of that, but here's what --
BOLLING: Let's be honest. They said with Saudi Arabia maybe $45 billion --
ROGINSKY: Arabia was going for 45 and they were doing 25.
BOLLING: And so now it's up to possibly $95 billion.
ROGINSKY: No, no, but not from them. Combine Saudi in them.
BOLLING: OK, right.
ROGINSKY: So, the reason I say --
BOLLING: That's the knot you're twisting.
ROGINSKY: It's not the knot. Listen, I hope you're right. It's like you're sitting here thinking I'm rooting against this. I hope you're right. I hope what this gentleman said is accurate. That they do regulate and this creates tons of new jobs. I truly hope that's true. I just happen to believe that we have to look at the statistics here. Carrier may have saved 800 jobs but they say --
BOLLING: That's 1,100.
ROGINSKY: Well, 1,100 -- 300 of those were actually never going to leave, but OK. But there are also sending 1,800 down to China -- sorry, to Mexico. So the reality is, look, you can do -- you can pick and choose these different corporations. You have to create our environment which is I think what this gentleman is saying, there's a regulatory environment that he's going to create to bring more jobs in. When and if that happens, I will be the first to stand up here and applaud and I think all the --
BOLLING: But KG, he's not even president yet. He's still president-elect.
GUILFOYLE: Correct. That is accurate. But you know, look, the point is he's made a promise. There's a movement across the country. I believe he's trying to honor that promise. Guess what, everybody should be happy. Liberals, Republicans, Greeners, health food addicts, whatever, it doesn't matter. All of them, vegans, everybody just join in. You want jobs. You want the economy to do well. You want this country to prosper and for families to be able to provide to get us back on the right track.
These are all very positive developments and I do believe and I hope that he's going to continue with this direction and this focus because this is one of the things we thought all the exit polls and with the focus groups, that they really did favor him with respect to the economy and putting back infrastructure, jobs, not exporting jobs and manufacturing out of this country but making sure that we are bringing goods and riches from this country and sending them to other countries so why not make it here.
BOLLING: Dana, you know what today is? One month. One month since the election and we have three companies who said they are either leaving jobs here or another group --
PERINO: OK, I do think there's a little bit of truth to what Julia is saying in terms of when you look at the fine print but overall, yes. And I've been on that book tour. I've been to California, Texas, Wyoming, Colorado, Florida, and Alabama and just across the board, businessmen and women are feeling a lot more optimistic about the future of the economy.
Even in the agribusiness, I was talking to Eric about it earlier, there are regulations like the Waters of the United States, the whole road (ph) is (inaudible) that was such, like, basically asking farmers to run a marathon with 20-pound weights on their ankles, I think that will probably be done and so that's a good thing.
But overall feeling of optimism and some regulatory relief, but (inaudible) the United States is a great place to invest. So, I wasn't exactly surprised by this but I was reminded of a West Wing episode, the actual TV show. Remember the staff comes in and they say, "President Bartlett, McCallum (ph) wanted to come in and just say hi to you." And he says, "No, they don't." They want to come say hi and shake your hand. He's like, "No, they want something."
What this company wants is favorable treatment and a blessing of the Trump -- I'm sorry. The T-Mobile/Sprint merger and they might deserve it. They might get it. But under President Obama, it was like, that's not going to happen. So, I think that there are other reasons for business men to go visit Donald Trump at this point as he starts to set up his government so that there's signals sent about what sort of regulatory relief they specifically are looking for.
GUILFOYLE: And maybe they also think he's one of us. You see the magazine that he's going to understand a business dynamic and help.
BOLLING: Tom, would like this one or would you like the Boeing deal that I'm about to read right now?
SHILLUE: Yes. Let's talk Boeing. This is very exciting.
BOLLING: So the president-elect rattled some cages today as well. Early this morning, he took a shot across the bowl (ph) of every company selling their stuff to America. We're not an easy market anymore. Mr. Trump warned Boeing he wasn't thrilled about spending $4 billion on a new set of Air Force One' and Two's.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Well the plane is totally out of control. It's going to be over $4 billion for Air Force One program and I think it's ridiculous. I think Boeing is doing a little bit of a number. We want Boeing to make a lot of money but not that much money.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BOLLING: In essence, he was saying, hey contractors, all of you, not just Boeing, we're looking at the bill before we pay from now on and guess what happens Tom when you look at the bill before you pay, sometimes you catch people trying to rip you off.
SHILLUE: Hey, I love the -- that's a great way of complimenting and attacking someone in the same statement. You know, he wants them to make money, just not that much money. I think this is very interesting because companies now, they have entire departments, compliance. You know, when there's federal regulations, you have an office of compliance because they have to figure out what this stuff is.
There's going to have to be offices about how to respond to Trump when he attacks your company. He's going after one company after another. They're going to have to know what to do because they can turn it to their advantage if they know how to deal with him. So, I kind of like what's going on. It's interesting.
ROGINSKY: Well, I got to tell you, if this were a Democrat doing this, people would be screaming about the president, you know you would about picking winners and losers and going after some companies and rewarding others.
BOLLING: All he's doing is saying --
GUILFOYLE: Don't overpay.
BOLLING: Let's figure out how much we're paying for airplanes. Let's make sure -- and from a guy who knows --
GUILFOYLE: He ought to know.
ROGINSKY: He already came up with a price tag by the way, which Boeing said they have no idea where he came up with that, I mean the number that he came up with is apparently false.
BOLLING: It's $4 billion, but Boeing said they have a $170 million contract. Do you really think we're going to get delivered two brand-new Air Force Ones for $170 million?
ROGINSKY: He came up with a number that apparently doesn't exist.
BOLLING: I think the actual number is $3.2 or $3.3 billion.
ROGINSKY: Again Eric, he's picking winners and losers and again, much like he said with the Carrier deal, I can only imagine if a Democrat did this, how much you would be up in arms about it.
BOLLONG: I would be thrilled if a Democrat once said this costs too much - -
ROGINSKY: Right. Democrats try to cut -- Democrats try to cut the budget - -
GUILFOYLE: By the way, oh, I'm so sorry, but overpaying is not sexy. Why should we overpay for something? Why not cut a good deal?
BOLLING: Pay for sale (ph) for once, right.
GUILFOYLE: Come on.
BOLLING: Stop with the retail jets.
GUILFOYLE: Just get a discount.
BOLLING: Can I ask you something?
PERINO: But what Boeing has said --
BOLLING: Right. Julie brings up a very good point. Today we found out or someone released a study that there's somewhere around $125 billion of overpayment in the Pentagon. Now, is this something that the Pentagon should worry about maybe getting some of that budget pulled back or maybe diverted somewhere else?
PERINO: Well, this is something that there is a lot of complaints about overspending at the Defense Department and it was $25 billion over five years or something like that, how they got to the $125 million mark. I think there are some problems with the "Washington Post" story, but yes, sure. You can find some ways to cut and I think the military is the first to say that and there's been -- presidents try and I actually think that President Trump, like from that moment from the first day with General Mattis, if he's able to become the secretary, then, yeah, he'll probably know where to do that.
On the Boeing thing, if I could say a couple of things. One is that the contract is there for them to do the same design. The reason that it is expensive -- Boeing said they don't even make money on the plane. It's for prestige that they actually make the Air Force One. It's that the technology -- when President Bush on 9/11 had to fly around the country had lost all communication, could not communicate with people, Air Force One needs to be able to withstand a nuclear attack. And he is the most important person in the world or she will be whenever there is a woman president.
It has to be able to withstand that and you have to be able to have the communications back to the ground and that's one of the reasons it's so expensive and also why it's secretive because we don't want other countries to know the technology that is there so you can protect the president of the United State because he's the most important person. I would just wait, maybe wait a couple of minutes, get a briefing and then you can trash a company.
BOLLING: All right. We'll leave it right there. When we come right back, is the west finally ready to crack down radical Islam? Two major developments today in the fight against terror coming up.
GUILFOYLE: Is the west finally ready to crack down on the culture of radical Islamic extremism? It appears there are signs of change. German Chancellor Angela Merkel who last year opened the door to nearly 1 million mostly Muslim migrant is calling for a ban on full-face veils worn mainly by Muslim women.
Germany's proposal follows similar Burqa bans in France, Belgium and Switzerland. And web giants including Facebook, Twitter, Microsoft and YouTube are teaming up to identify and remove violent terror content from their websites creating a shared database. So this is quite fascinating, Dana, from you know, a communications and technology perspective. They're actually working in concert together to combat terror, at least what it seems on its face.
PERINO: That's what they say, right? So it's no time like the present, guys. We've been waiting. Because we know that the attacks that have happened here in the United States, that they were communicating with each other, and they post things like the OSU guy just last week.
GUILFOYLE: Social media.
PERINO: We know that he was doing that. So yes, like, we would love that.
And in fact, the Counter Extremism Project, which is a group that has been advocating for this kind of cooperation for a long time, thinks that, OK, this sounds like a good thing, but the proof will be in the pudding; and let's see if they actually do something about it.
Can I say one thing on the burka ban?
PERINO: I think that, given Germany's history and their -- socialist nature of its politics, I can understand why Angela Merkel was so permissive initially, but she's seen the writing on the wall. She wants to run for re-election. She knows she will not win if she doesn't do something strong.
And also, you have this problem that we know that Islamophobia has actually increased by this problem, and women who are living in western countries that are made or decide to wear a full burka are not being able to take advantage of all the freedoms that we have in the west. And if one of us were to go to Saudi Arabia right now, they force -- they would force us to wear a long robe in public. And I don't think that it is unreasonable to ask for the Muslim community to comply with these requests and, if they don't like it, they can return and live in the Middle East.
GUILFOYLE: OK, so Eric, you know, back in the day, Angela Merkel was a big proponent of the idea of multiculturalism and letting everyone live within their culture and their own values and customs and ideas. Now, this seems to be a departure from that.
Also, because of the recent assaults, criminal activity, problems, rapes of children -- there's a large number of horrible stories coming out of Germany and what's happened there with a -- violent terror and the Muslim migrant community committing these kind of atrocities. So she's getting a lot of backlash. And do you think this is going to help?
BOLLING: I think it will help her get re-elected, because I think that's the only reason why she's doing this. She's had this policy -- she's had this -- she's pushed back on the burka ban for years. Now all of a sudden, she wants to embrace it, because she's seeing the people of Germany, the people throughout Europe who have taken all these refugees and who are seeing spikes in crimes -- spikes in crime against women. They're feeling the backlash. People are saying, "No, no, what are we doing here? Why do we do this?"
A little too much like the genie out of the bottle, though. You've got more than a million that are welcomed in Germany alone, millions throughout Europe, and the free pass, being able to travel freely between...
GUILFOYLE: E.U., yes.
BOLLING: ... the different countries. They really -- I think Dana is right. Yes, it has a lot to do with the election, but they need to stop now, like right now.
BOLLING: It's something we've been warning about over here for years, saying whatever they're doing over there, let's not become Europe. We had the -- we had slid towards Europe with President Obama economically, but with socially and culturally, if we're going to start looking to Europe for our future, let's use that as our experiment and say, "Hey, don't be thinking about doing that here."
GUILFOYLE: And you also see the U.K. with the Brexit passing there, too, so there's a lot going on here, because there was a sort of terror express, like terror HOV lane between the E.U. countries, where they were able to move freely. And we saw that with the attacks in Paris, Julie, and they were able to get into Belgium, move really quickly to leave the scene of the crime and planning and these other countries and slipping in very easily.
ROGINSKY: It's called the Schengen Zone, I think, an EZ Pass around Europe.
But look, I can't speak to Germany's laws. You're absolutely right, Dana and Eric, that this was because she's up for election next year, and it's a tough election for her. She's facing a challenge that she hasn't faced in a long time.
Boy, I'm not going to talk about Germany, but I am personally and I understand the concern and the horror that people have associated with the burka. I think it's a repressive, repressive thing to force women to wear. Having said that, I am very uncomfortable with governments telling people what they can and cannot do with respect to their...
SHILLUE: It's the full face thing, though.
ROGINSKY: I get it.
SHILLUE: It's not a head scarf. People mix them up.
ROGINSKY: I know, I get it. Listen, I understand.
ROGINSKY: But what I'm saying fundamentally is it's a slippery slope to me. And I completely sympathize with everything that everybody here said about the burka. I just think that's a slippery slope. You start telling people how to worship or how not to worship in their own way, you had to live and let live...
PERINO: But then Muslim men who want to -- who want to commit acts of terror shouldn't dress up in burkas.
ROGINSKY: I get it. I get it.
PERINO: And that's what they're doing.
SHILLUE: And there's no slope. You can't cover your face. That's all. There's no slope. I don't mind a burkini. It's -- I almost wear a -- on the beach, I'm so sun sensitive, my swim wear is...
BOLLING: Thank God for that.
ROGINSKY: This is an image that will forever be seared in my head.
GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God. This is too much. This is too much for me to take right now. Let's get out.
Ahead, a stunning reversal after the public editor of the "New York Times" slams her paper's anti-Trump's liberal bias. What she's saying today after facing a lot of backlash. Stay with us, next.
ROGINSKY: New developments on a story we've been following. New York Times public editor Liz Spayd appeared on Tucker Carlson's show Friday night and called out her own paper's liberal bias, suggesting some tweets by her fellow news reporters at the Times that were critical of President- elect Trump were out of line.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LIZ SPAYD, PUBLIC EDITOR, THE NEW YORK TIMES: I think it's outrageous. I think that that should not be -- they shouldn't be tweeted, and they shouldn't -- and it -- and it does concern me that that would be -- that that would be -- I mean, everybody is going to have their personal and political views. We all do. But they ought to be personal, and if you sign up to be a journalist, then that's what you ought to be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROGINSKY: Now Spayd is walking back her remarks after facing some backlash, telling Politico, quote, "In retrospect, I should have held back more, not knowing what the context was for the tweets. I think that's a fair criticism. But I stand by my view, that journalists should be careful, sometimes more careful than they are with what they say on social media."
Dana, I will come to you because you worked with a lot of journalists in the White House. Do you think this is overblown, or do you think this is legit criticism?
PERINO: One, I admire her for going on Tucker's show. I mean, that's not a show that's for the faint of heart. And he is tough. It's a great new program. I love it.
I do think that Twitter gets a lot of people into trouble for a lot of different reasons. We've seen people have to resign. Remember the P.R. executive who tweeted something that she thought was funny. She ends up -- she lands...
ROGINSKY: Thirteen hours later.
PERINO: ... she'd been fired.
One thing that happened going back maybe ten years or so is that all of a sudden in newspapers, you would have actual journalists that sat in a White House briefing room or elsewhere, but the ones that I dealt with there, and then all of a sudden on a Saturday or Sunday, they would have a longer piece on the front page of the paper, and it would be labeled "analysis." And so I would ask them when they called the next time, "OK, so am I talking to you, John Doe the reporter, or the John Doe analyst? I need to know so that we can understand what we're dealing with here."
And Twitter has just basically blown the doors off of that. And I think she's right, that if you want to be a journalist, there are ways that you can participate on Twitter by tweeting facts and keeping your opinion to yourself.
ROGINSKY: Well, it's interesting, K.G., because I'm going to read a tweet from one New York Times reporter who said, "Pardon me for asking but what qualifies Jared Kushner to have a seat at the presidential table?"
Now, I happen to agree with him, but also, I'm not a journalist. To everybody that tweets me on a daily basis that I'm a bad journalist because I give my opinion, I'm not really a journalist. I'm paid to give my opinion. So -- but this journalist is actually a journalist. And so to me I happen to agree with him, but I think it is somewhat out of line to say that about Jared.
GUILFOYLE: Do you know Jared? Have you spent any time with him?
ROGINSKY: I don't know Jared. I don't know his qualifications.
GUILFOYLE: You don't like him because of his father and...
ROGINSKY: No. It's not that I don't like him. I just don't think he's qualified to sit in the White House by virtue of the fact that he's never worked in government. But that's my opinion.
GUILFOYLE: Trump has also never worked in government, and he was elected president by...
ROGINSKY: That's true. He's also not qualified, but that's a separate story. But go ahead. But go ahead.
GUILFOYLE: Based on -- based on that, what I'll do is compliment Tucker Carlson. I think it was fantastic, somebody having the courage to call them out like this and show them, here's the proof in the pudding; here's the evidence; here's what the tweets are. They are biased. They are not proper journalism.
What we do here, this is an opinion show where we discuss news of the day. So there are separate shows here, news division.
So she answered honestly. Now she's trying to walk it back, because it's problematic. But really, they need to take a good look at themselves and say, "Wait a second, we've got a problem here. Look what we were doing." There was a concerted effort there to try to undermine his candidacy and focus a large, you know, number of resources and reporters to try to tear him down.
But the thing is, people were thinking for themselves and relying on a variety of different sources to be able to get their information. So I think this was great television.
ROGINSKY: Well, what's interesting, Eric, is that she did walk it back. Because Margaret Sullivan, her predecessor, who I think was hailed by everybody as a very good...
BOLLING: Public editor.
ROGINSKY: ... public editor, she probably would not have walked it back. Listen, I'm surprised -- to me...
BOLLING: You just read one tweet. There were -- Tucker read a bunch of tweets that I think she was -- the public editor, Ms. Spayd -- is that what it is?
ROGINSKY: Yes, right.
BOLLING: Was correct in pushing back. We have reporters. We have journalists, and we have opinion people. There is a line. FOX has them, too. And there is a line.
But the problem is that she walked her own criticism back, which is kind of...
ROGINSKY: That's what I don't get.
BOLLING: It just blew that line apart.
SHILLUE: How many articles...
BOLLING: Can I do one thing?
ROGINSKY: That's her job.
BOLLING: You're pro-Israel, right?
ROGINSKY: I'm what?
ROGINSKY: I am pro-Israel.
BOLLING: You listened to Donald Trump's AIPAC speech?
ROGINSKY: I did.
BOLLING: Fantastic, right?
BOLLING: You know who advised him on the AIPAC speech?
ROGINSKY: I know just who wrote it, and I'm not sure it was Jared Kushner. But...
BOLLING: I'm saying who advised him on the AIPAC speech, Jared Kushner. He was very involved in that AIPAC speech.
ROGINSKY: You're telling me that Jared Kushner is now capable of creating...
BOLLING: I'm saying...
ROGINSKY: ... peace between Palestinians and Israelis, based on that?
BOLLING: ... if you want to talk about qualifications to be in the Oval Office or to be in the West Wing, at times I think Jared Kushner certainly rings that bell.
ROGINSKY: OK. Tom, Liz Spayd, should she walk this back or not?
SHILLUE: She shouldn't have walked it back. The tweets were outrageous, but it's not the tweets. The tweets aren't the problem. They should be able to tweet if they want. Just take the word "objective" off the front of their title. They're not objective journalists, and we should know it. It's fine. Tucker said that, and he was right.
ROGINSKY: OK. For more on the story, check out Tucker's show, weeknights at 7 p.m. Eastern here on FOX News. And the "Vanity Fair" profile of Jared Kushner, which I think is very illuminating. That's a separate issue.
BOLLING: Where was that? You just ad-libbed that.
Some A-list celebs are having a tough time dealing with President-elect Trump. Is it time for them to just get over it? The latest celeb diss from LeBron James and Madonna when "The Five" returns.
SHILLUE: Some really rich celebrities are having a tough time dealing with President-elect Trump winning the election. NBA superstar LeBron James and some of his Cavaliers teammates have decided they're not staying at a Trump-owned hotel here in New York City when they play against the Knicks tomorrow. You may recall, James endorsed Hillary Clinton during the campaign.
And another Clinton supporter named Madonna is also dissing the president- elect. She tells Billboard magazine she feels betrayed by women who voted for Trump; and when Trump won, quote, "It felt like someone died." Wow, that's an exaggeration, Kimberly.
SHILLUE: But she still looks like a virgin, right?
GUILFOYLE: You tell me. You tell me.
SHILLUE: I think so.
ROGINSKY: That was the first concert I ever went to. You leave her alone. I loved "Like a Virgin" tour.
GUILFOYLE: Let's look at it this way.
GUILFOYLE: A bit of a stretch. OK.
SHILLUE: But is it a betrayal of women?
GUILFOYLE: I don't know. I was invited to this in Miami Friday night. I did not attend, and I'm glad, because my ears might have been, like, bleeding.
But a lot of people that I know that even -- you know, liberal, Democrats, people I know that did attend said that they were really put off by it, that it was too much. It was just over the top and kind of defeating the purpose of what the event was supposed to be about, and it was more about her, like, whining therapy session and putting it upon everybody else.
GUILFOYLE: And then also her comments. Really, I think it's just very dismissive. It's upsetting to me to say that -- you know, what's wrong with women? Women don't like women? Women love women. Women love each other. We're very supportive to one another. So please don't try to speak for all the women out there, Madonna, because we got it covered. So maybe you need to grow up a little bit.
SHILLUE: How about for the guys, Eric? LeBron doesn't want to stay at Trump hotels.
BOLLING: First of all, I still have that first-class ticket to anyone who wants to leave the country since Donald Trump was elected for any celebrity, one-way on me.
So LeBron makes $44 million last year. Madge made $76 million last year. Trump's top marginal tax rate is 6.6 percent lower than the current marginal top rate, which means she will have were $5 million more to donate to the cause of her choice, and LeBron will have $3 million more. Beyonce, $54 million. Katy Perry, $41 million. They'll have a lot more money to donate to causes.
GUILFOYLE: Her event was for Malawi, but great to make it about her.
SHILLUE: Dana, are they going to get this out of their system by the time he takes office?
PERINO: I don't know. Actually, that was -- I didn't have the math, but I was going to say they're going to love Donald Trump's tax plans, and they're not going to complain about it.
I'm fine with them. Free-market exercise. You know, if they don't want to stay at a Trump-owned hotel, fine. Fine, do whatever you want to do.
The thing with Madonna is that it's more of the same of liberals trying to explain the election in a way that they're just trying to find anything that they can except for blaming themselves on a poorly-run campaign with a candidate that did not inspire people, regardless of gender.
GUILFOYLE: Yes. She's blaming it on other women. That's the problem.
SHILLUE: Don't blame women.
GUILFOYLE: Well, they voted. Women voted, a lot them. And a lot of them voted in support of President-elect Trump. So, you know, deal with it. This is a democracy, and people can make choices for themselves.
SHILLUE: Julie, you've stayed at a Trump hotel, right?
ROGINSKY: No, never.
ROGINSKY: No, and I never will. Like LeBron James, I will not. I will vote with my pocketbook. But that's my right. And that's LeBron James's right. So I don't see why anybody should have a problem with that.
SHILLUE: Wonderful. "One More Thing" is next.
PERINO: It's time now for "One More Thing."
I thought it would be appropriate to mark the anniversary of Pearl Harbor. That will be tomorrow, 75 years since the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor, and that basically led us right into World War II.
And this weekend, I had a chance to meet two amazing World War II veterans. Take a look here. This is Nick Nichols. He is celebrating his 100th Christmas. His daughter, Cheryl (ph), brought him to the Plano, Texas, signing of the "Jasper" book. And I asked him what's your secret to long life, sir? And he said pizza and cheeseburgers. Kimberly would be excited about that.
GUILFOYLE: Love it.
And then, last night in Montgomery, Alabama, I met Tom Ingraham of Opelika, Alabama. He was a member of the 90th Infantry Division. He stormed the beaches at Normandy, fought in the Battle of the Bulge. And he has farmed in Alabama his whole life. He goes back to Europe often and has reunions.
They're just amazing people, and we should all be thinking about them on this anniversary.
BOLLING: Absolutely. Great one.
So here, we'll bring out "The Right Board." I'm not sure if Julie has had the pleasure of seeing "The Right Board" recently.
ROGINSKY: Every day that I watch, Eric.
BOLLING: Judicial Watch came out today with the numbers for President Obama. Apparently, the president and his family love to travel. He spent over $85 million of your tax dollars on travel. And a couple of things, Hawaiian vacations. The last one in 2015, was $4.8 million. He's done eight of those. You know the Martha's Vineyards, 619,000 bucks on airline travel just alone for the Air Force One, or however they get there. And this New York City jaunt with his daughters and a couple of friends to go see "Hamilton," that cost us $309,000. Just a little note for all the American people.
GUILFOYLE: Those tickets, pricey.
BOLLING: Thanks, Obama.
PERINO: You forgot the hash tag.
BOLLING: You know, someone said should I do hashtags. No, I'm kind of over hashtags. But retweet these. I'll put these up on Twitter and Facebook after the show.
PERINO: OK. I got -- it's my responsibility here to call on Kimberly.
GUILFOYLE: Thanks you so much. And speaking of food -- whoops -- and delicious, how about it's time for...
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: Kimberly's Food Court...
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUILFOYLE: ... back by popular demand, sponsored by no one but loved by everyone. You know who you are.
So here we go. Feast your eyes on this. Chick-Fil-A. You're not going to even believe this, but Chick-Fil-A is going to have its first ever, like, food truck to go out from your office and go...
PERINO: Because the lines are so long.
GUILFOYLE: Right. But how cool is this? So this guy is one of the franchisee's [SIC] owners, Jesse Chaluh, is going to start operating this Texas truck. It's a limited menu. OK. So this is what you're going to be able to get: waffle fries -- excellent choice; sweet tea -- Ainsley loves that; lemonade; a couple of cold entrees; and the chain's original chicken sandwich and the spicy chicken sandwich.
So I'm going to re-enact a food truck situation here. Oh, some little...
PERINO: Waffle fries.
GUILFOYLE: Waffle fries here and a sandwich.
BOLLING: While you do that, can I make a suggestion?
BOLLING: This Chick-Fil-A truck, you know where he should park?
GUILFOYLE: Yes, go ahead.
ROGINSKY: Right here.
BOLLING: In front of the White House. Right in front. (AUDIO GAP)
GUILFOYLE: It will be well-received.
ROGINSKY: All right. I'm going to eat those fries in a second.
But first, yesterday in a very, very emotional session, a bipartisan session, the Senate voted to rename a bill for cancer funding after Beau Biden, Vice President Joe Biden's son. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY), MAJORITY LEADER: I think it's fitting to dedicate this bill's critical cancer initiative in honor of someone who'd be proud of the presiding officer today, and that's his son, Beau, who in the motion to reconsider, be laid upon the table with no intervening action or debate.
JOE BIDEN, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Without objection.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ROGINSKY: Very, very emotional moment.
ROGINSKY: And thank you to Joe Biden for everything he did on this very important issue.
PERINO: All right. Tom Shillue.
SHILLUE: OK. Santa's house is -- it's not for sale, but it's listed on Zillow if you want to see what it looks like. Look at that. Santa's house, fantastic. It features reindeer stables, river-rock fireplaces and a sleigh parking garage. This could all be yours for $656,000.
BOLLING: Is that where it is?
SHILLUE: Well, it's in the north mole.
ROGINSKY: Who's the bunk bed for?
SHILLUE: It's not for sale. But if he were to sell it, that's what it would cost you.
PERINO: Good thing they have that fireplace going.
That's it for us. "Special Report" is up next. Thanks for being here.
BOLLING: Twenty million in Manhattan.
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