This is a rush transcript from "Sunday Morning Futures," October 30, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MARIA BARTIROMO, HOST: Good Sunday morning. Thanks for joining us. The FBI reopening its investigation into Hillary Clinton's e-mails, triggering a political earthquake in the race for the White House.
Thanks so much for joining us, everybody. I'm Maria Bartiromo. This is "Sunday Morning Futures." The Clinton campaign on defense this morning as the bureau reviews newly discovered e-mails related to its investigation of former Congressman Anthony Weiner.
We will talk to former Attorney General Michael Mukasey coming up on where this could be headed now. Talk Donald Trump's plans to kickstart the recovery, an exclusive interview with his economic advisers on how he plans to create new jobs and move the needle on economic growth.
We will get that economy panel on track. And then the Trump team pulling out all the stops in the critical battleground of North Carolina. Will the Tar Heel State turn red on election day?
We will talk to Governor Pat McCrory coming up as we look ahead this morning on "Sunday Morning Futures." Well, the reopening of the Clinton e- mail investigation is causing friction between the Justice Department and the FBI this morning.
Attorney General Loretta Lynch warning Director Comey not to send a letter of intent to Congress because it goes against the long-standing policy of the DOJ to avoid public disclosure of any investigation that could potentially impact elections, Hillary Clinton making mention of that in a rally yesterday in Florida.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HILLARY CLINTON, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: It is pretty strange -- it's pretty strange to put something like that out with such little information right before an election.
(APPLAUSE)
In fact -- in fact, it's not just strange, it's unprecedented. And it is deeply troubling because voters deserve to get full and complete facts.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BARTIROMO: But we now Loretta Lynch already inserted herself months ago when she had a private meeting with Bill Clinton right before Hillary Clinton was to be interviewed by the FBI. Judge Michael Mukasey is the former attorney general under President George W. Bush.
He joins me right now.
Judge, good to see you.
MICHAEL MUKASEY, FORMER ATTORNEY GENERAL: Good to see you.
BARTIROMO: Thank you so much for joining us. Your reaction to this first off?
MUKASEY: Well, the rule that she cites about not mentioning something on the eve of an election relates to ordinary corruption investigations, where you're talking about a mayor or even a senator, where you can continue the investigation after the election because you don't know what the outcome of it is going to be, and bring a prosecution if necessary after someone takes office. This is not that kind of case, number one.
Number two, this was preceded by a determination by, of all people, the -- the FBI director, whose -- it's not his job to determine whether charges are going to be brought or not. So right away, you're dealing with an unusual situation.
And according to the reports that I saw, he felt he was between a rock and a hard place, because if these e-mails came out after the election, he would be accused of suppressing them. So really, they're for his own purpose and to preserve the -- the good name of his agency, he decided to disclose this now.
BARTIROMO: And in the letter to the congressional and committee heads, as well as in a letter to the FBI staff, by the way, Jim Comey writes, he felt he needed to go to Congress because he has been saying for so long recently that he's closed the investigation. And obviously, these new e-mails changes.
He has also testified to Congress saying, he was asked a question, "If you find any new information, will you reopen the investigation?" So he felt compelled.
MUKASEY: Right. All of that said, I don't think anything is going to happen. By anything, I mean any criminal charges under this Justice Department as a result of this, regardless of what's there.
BARTIROMO: Tell me about that, though, because when you look at the past -
- I don't know, just a few years, when you see the number of people who have actually been penalized for doing just what Hillary Clinton has done, let's look at General Petraeus. Let's look at Mr. Cartwright -- Cartwright (ph). He's going to jail.
MUKASEY: Well, he may go to jail. And there are military people in jail now who did far less, who were dishonorably discharged for doing a lot less than she did.
BARTIROMO: What do we know at this point of what could be found? I mean, we -- you know, the -- the Dems are saying, look, we want that information by Monday. Is there any way we're going to get a look at what specifically triggered this turnabout?
MUKASEY: The report is that it's somewhere in the vicinity of 10,000 possibly -- in any event, it's in the thousands of e-mails. There's no way that you can review all of those and disclose.
And if you disclose only part, and it turns out that something you haven't read yet bears on what you did disclose, that could make it even worse. So the likelihood that we're going to see it by election day, I think, is remote, number one.
And number two, even if we did, it's the Justice Department, headed by the attorney general, who serves at the pleasure of the president, who determines whether any charge gets brought, whether anything gets put before a grand jury even in the limited time that we have. And she's already made it clear that that's not happening.
BARTIROMO: Catherine Herridge (ph) reporting earlier this morning on Fox News basically saying that this came from the Manhattan FBI investigators, who were investigating Anthony Weiner, the husband of Huma Abedin for sexting an underaged child. And within that investigation, they found these e-mails.
So 10,000 e-mails -- incredible, by the way, that number. This could be anything from, you know, going against what Hillary Clinton may have said to Congress and to the FBI, and then to actual national security secrets.
I mean, we -- we have no idea what these e-mails could reveal.
MUKASEY: None. And well, speculating about it is just that. It's speculation.
BARTIROMO: Is there any chance that Anthony Weiner is trying to, you know, cop a plea, I mean, do a deal -- some kind of a deal with -- with lawmakers saying, look, I'll tell you what I know as Huma Abedin's husband in terms of national security information that was shared with me if you give me a deal with the sexting underage children?
MUKASEY: I seriously doubt it. The FBI has the computer. And once they have the computer, they do the looking.
It's not a question of Anthony Weiner saying I'll tell you. What's going to tell them is what's on the computer, and that they have.
BARTIROMO: You know, I wonder where the pressure for Jim Comey came from because we know that once the -- the New York agents were looking at the Anthony Weiner case, and they tripped over these e-mails, I guess the story got deeper within the FBI and the government agencies. There was nowhere to hide, is what I'm trying to say, for Jim Comey.
What -- what was it, do you think, that made him say I've got to do the right thing here. And even though Loretta Lynch, my boss, is telling me to not get involved, I need to send this letter to Congress.
MUKASEY: I can't get inside his head. And I'm not going to try. But once more than one person knows a fact, it's no longer a secret.
BARTIROMO: Right. So that after, let's say she wins the election. She becomes president. Where does this investigation go?
I mean, we all know that this is going to take months to -- to take place?
But what does that mean if, in fact, she's the commander-in-chief?
MUKASEY: I think the investigation, if we're talking about the -- the inquiry in its broadest sense, goes to Congress, because the Justice Department isn't going to pursue it. That's -- that much is clear.
And the only people who can pursue it are the -- are the congressional committees. And the only way they will pursue it is if Congress stays in the hands of the Republicans.
Of course, it's in the hands of the Republicans until -- until there's a new Congress, i.e. until January. But if -- if the election continues that, either in the House or in the Senate or both, well, then you can figure that Congress will investigate.
If congress turns over, then the likelihood is they won't.
BARTIROMO: You know, this -- this could have been also discussed on that plane. I mean, you -- you're a former attorney general.
Loretta Lynch is in that role right now. She's got this private meeting with Bill Clinton. And then days later, we find out that Hillary said, oh, I'm going to keep Loretta Lynch as attorney general, should I become president.
It's a little too close for comfort.
MUKASEY: I -- look, I don't know what was discussed on the plane. But the one thing you can say is that there should have been a member of the A.G.
staff.
The meeting should never have taken place for starters. But if it did take place, there should have been a member of the A.G. staff present.
That's why you have staff people to make sure you have somebody who is witnessing what is being said to you and what you're saying to someone else.
BARTIROMO: I mean, have you ever seen a situation where you don't have staff present taking notes with two such high powered people on a -- during such an investigation?
MUKASEY: No -- no, I just (ph) -- look, I was -- I was asked by a foreign official, whether I would meet with him. He came to the Justice Department. I met with him.
He asked if we could meet privately. The answer was no. And when we sat down with staff present, I was very glad that I said no.
BARTIROMO: Your Honor, good to see you.
MUKASEY: Good to see you, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Thank you so much, Judge Michael Mukasey, joining us there. So where does this investigation go from here with just 10 days before the -- the election?
We will talk with two members of Congress, one of them actually received a letter from James Comey. That's Senator Ron Johnson. He's up next.
Stay with us on that. Let us know what you'd like to hear from him. Send me a tweet on Twitter @mariabartiromo at "Sunday Futures." Stay with us.
We're looking ahead right now on "Sunday Morning Futures."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Welcome back. Republicans are praising the move by the FBI to further their investigation into the Clinton e-mails. But Democrats are not.
Top Senate Democrats are demanding more information about the newly discovered e-mails mentioned in Director Comey's letter. And they want to know what they are, what those details are by tomorrow.
They are arguing that the wording is too vague. In part, Comey says this, "I agreed that the FBI should take appropriate investigative steps designed to allow investigators to review these e-mails, to determine whether they contain classified information as well as to assess their importance to our investigation."
Joining me right now is California Congressman Darrell Issa. He's a member of the House Judiciary Committee. Also with me is Wisconsin Senator Ron Johnson.
He's the chairman of the Senate Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee. He was among those who received a letter from James Comey.
Gentlemen, good to see you. Thank you so much for joining us.
REP. DARRELL ISSA, R-CALIF.: Thank you, Maria.
SEN. RON JOHNSON, R-WIS.: Morning, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Senator Johnson, let me kick this up with you. You received the letter. Give us your reaction to the letter and -- and what Jim Comey was trying to tell you in that letter.
JOHNSON: Well, first of all, I'm not -- I'm not praising Jim Comey. I think this investigation has been bungled from the start. To me, it's pretty simple, Maria.
There is -- there is two statutes to really govern here. And I'm -- I'm going to leave out a lot of the detail.
But you have (ph) 18 U.S. Code 2071 (ph) says anyone who willfully conceals, destroys any record of the United States shall be fined under or imprisoned not more than three years and be disqualified from holding any office in the United States. This investigation, you take a look at the immunity agreements, we've been stonewalled every step of the way in terms of trying to find out exactly what is -- you know, how those things came about.
But this investigation seemed more designed not to uncover and prosecute but, if anything, to -- to cover up and exonerate. So I'm -- I'm not one praising Jim Comey whatsoever.
And my guess is there are people inside the FBI that's pretty unhappy with him.
BARTIROMO: So what do you think was the trigger, then, Senator, for him to change course and send this letter to Congress, because we know that Loretta Lynch tried to stop him from doing so? And -- and then I want to ask you about this Yahoo! Account because you know, I mean, you are the -- you are the chairman of the Senate Homeland Security and Government Affairs Committee.
And you have to have an opinion about the fact that Catherine Herridge just reported that Huma Abedin was basically sending her security e-mails to her Yahoo! account because she said it was easier to print them from her Yahoo!
account. Who knows what she sent to that Yahoo! account.
So let me get your take first on that. What do you think changed course here for Jim Comey?
JOHNSON: Again, I -- I can only speculate, maybe pressure inside the FBI.
But now, you're talking about the mishandling of highly sensitive national security information.
And that's exactly what Secretary Clinton did as well. So I mean, the fact of the matter is is we are not really engaged in a -- in a serious investigation here.
And when you take a look, one -- one of the things I've asked the State Department is who else is on those e-mail chains because Maria, we all know when you send an e-mail, you know, is that going to the -- the state.gov classification e-mail system or is it going to clintonemail.com.
President Obama was e-mailing Secretary Clinton at clintonemail.com. He had to know. This is -- shows and reveals corruption at the highest levels of government in the White House, in the State Department, in the Department of Justice and the FBI.
But that -- that's just the fact. This is such a simple case. It's getting so complex with all these e-mails. It's actually pretty darn simple.
Information was concealed. It was destroyed. It was mishandled. And there are some pretty simple statutes street (ph).
I'm -- I'm not a lawyer. I'm not a prosecutor. I look at this. It's pretty cut-and-dried case.
BARTIROMO: Well, I think you make a really good point, Senator, because we now know that the president did lie to the American people. He was in an interview, specifically asked, when did you learn that Secretary Clinton was using a private e-mail and a private server, which nobody else had done.
Never have you seen anybody use a private server. And he said I learned when everybody else learned and that we know now, it was a lie.
JOHNSON: He was -- he was e-mailing. So were all kinds of people -- high
-- high-level officials inside these departments were using that e-mail
account. We know it.
If you're -- if you're e-mailing a Gmail account, you know it. If you're e-mailing state.gov, you know it.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
JOHNSON: So no, there -- I think this is a cover-up. I think this is corruption at the highest levels of government.
It needs -- it needs proper congressional oversight. The problem is we're being stonewalled every step of the way.
Just look at the -- look at the -- the immunity agreements. They were granted to Cheryl Mills and Heather Samuelson. They're outrageous.
BARTIROMO: All right. Well, I want to ask you what your committee is planning to do about it in a second.
But Congressman Issa, let me turn to you because you have built your career on trying to fight corruption. You wrote a book about it.
You've been trying to do this for years. What's your reaction to what we've learned this weekend?
ISSA: Well, I think if the American people understand that when I sent a letter years ago when Hillary Clinton was still secretary, specifically because we had discovered that others were using private e-mails, so every cabinet officer received a request for are you using a private e-mail server and how are you accounting under the Federal Records Act, at that point, that letter pretty well put Hillary Clinton, if she wasn't already on notice, on notice that those records belong to the American people. And they needed to be retained.
If she had left a full copy, even if she had the private server, if she'd left a full and complete copy when she left the State Department, she wouldn't be in this situation today. But very clearly, she sought to avoid public scrutiny of her correspondence, both good and bad.
And that's why she's in this position. So when she's complaining that it's only a few days before an election, it's her own fault, including her most close confidant, Huma Abedin, who could have turned that information over and clearly didn't meet that obligation, even though they were both under subpoenas.
BARTIROMO: But Congressman, can anybody do anything about it? I mean, in the face of all of this, you've got commander-in-chief basically giving out messages to people, basically saying, she didn't do anything wrong. Keep moving forward.
I mean, that -- it starts at the top, right? And he just called you out -- the president did, just the other day on the campaign trail.
He said, and here is what he said about you, Congressman Issa. We have it onscreen. "Issa's primary contribution to the United States Congress has been to obstruct and to waste taxpayer dollars on trumped-up investigations that have led nowhere.
And this is now a guy who, because poll numbers are bad, has sent out brochures with my picture on them touting his cooperation on issues with me. Now, that is the definition of chutzpah." That's what President Obama said about you late last week, sir.
ISSA: Well, he also said there hadn't been a single major scandal during his administration. So there is a little bit of inconsistency with the truth there.
But we know that without Congress, and Ron was my partner during my time as chairman of Oversight, without -- without the kind of scrutiny that we've had, we wouldn't know about the gun-running deal.
BARTIROMO: Right.
ISSA: .the fast and furious. We wouldn't have known the truth about Benghazi. We certainly -- we'd still have the IRS targeting groups for their -- their beliefs.
BARTIROMO: That's true.
ISSA: So there is a role for Congress. And we have succeeded in shedding light on it. No question at all.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
ISSA: .if Ron and I are returned to Congress, we're going to have to make sure that laws are put into place that hold the next president more accountable, no matter.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
ISSA: .which party he's in. And that's Congress's role. It's the one that I'm proud we've tried to do. But there's more to be done.
BARTIROMO: Real quick, Senator Johnson. Are you going to do anything about this in terms of the letter that you received?
What can you do?
JOHNSON: We'll continue to follow up. You know, Donald Trump said it's time to drain the swamp. Hillary Clinton, Senator Feingold -- I ran against (ph) Senator Feingold, they've been swamp creatures for over 30 years.
They ought to be flushed down the drain with the rest of the swamp.
BARTIROMO: Wow. Gentlemen, thank you very much. We will be watching the developments. We appreciate your time today.
We've got brand new Fox News polls from battleground state of North Carolina. We'll talk to the governor next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Welcome back. Well, now, there are nine days left to go until America votes on a new president. New polling out of North Carolina to share this morning.
It shows Hillary Clinton is leading Donald Trump by six points in the key battleground state of North Carolina. I want to point out that this poll was taken before the new revelations about the FBI reopening its investigation into Hillary Clinton's e-mails.
Joining me right now is the Governor of North Carolina, Pat McCrory.
And Governor, it is good to see you. Thank you so much for joining us this morning.
GOV. PAT MCCRORY, R-N.C.: Thanks for having me again, Maria.
Thank you very much.
BARTIROMO: First off, we just showed these polls. Give us a sense of what the people of North Carolina are looking for in their next commander-in- chief.
Obviously, Hillary Clinton is in the lead here, 47 percent to 41 percent for North Carolina. What sense do you get from the people in terms of their priorities?
MCCRORY: Well, the latest priority before this controversy erupted on Friday was Obamacare increase in premiums. It's going to hit North Carolina extremely hard -- 30 to 40 percent average increases in Obamacare accounts.
And that's been taking over the news for the past four or five days. And many of us, including this governor, predicted that.
I wanted to challenge Obamacare and I challenged it, joined those states that challenged Obamacare, which lost in a 4-4-1 (ph) decision. The attorney general that I'm running against, Roy Cooper, refused to join in that lawsuit against Obamacare, and was bragging about it up until two or three weeks ago.
But now, with this latest Clinton revelation, it's like we're going back to the `90s now. Clinton fatigue is back.
And it's going to be very interesting to see what the impact of the polls will be.
BARTIROMO: Yes, I was interested in talking with you because I know that you've really been focused on the economy quite a bit there in North Carolina. Things are a lot better under your -- on your watch.
And -- and we know that you signed tax reform into law, which put more money in the paychecks of hardworking families. That's one of the issues that we're talking about in this campaign -- tax reform and economic growth that has been very hard to come by.
What do you think is needed to actually move the needle on economic growth and jobs for the country overall?
MCCRORY: Well, I'll tell you what we did in North Carolina. When I came into office three and a half years ago, we had the fifth highest unemployment rate in the country.
We had 9.4 percent unemployment. North Carolina, which is a booming state, was really hurting three and a half years ago.
And what I did was lower the corporate tax from 6.6 percent to three percent, lowered the income tax from the high sevens to low fives. And I also paid off $2.6 billion debt we owed for unemployment to the federal government.
And we just started seeing a sharp reduction in unemployment. We're now the fourth fastest growing economy in the United States in North Carolina.
Our unemployment is 4.7 percent. The cranes are back, especially in Charlotte where I'm at today. So things are going real well.
But I also have to remind your viewers, in the eastern part of our state, we're still feeling the effects of hurricane Matthew. You know, that got off the news two weeks ago.
But literally, some of our small towns in Eastern North Carolina, the water is just now clearing out. And I've got towns of a thousand to 2,000 people that are literally wiped out. And so.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
MCCRORY: .we're wondering what the impact of that will be on the economy, and plus the human lives. We've lost 28 people due to that hurricane.
BARTIROMO: Well, my condolences to you and the entire state, sir. You mentioned Obamacare earlier and the 30 to 40 percent increase that we're going to see next year in premiums.
What do you want to see in terms of Obamacare from our next president? Of course, we know that this has been one of the issues that has held back the economy because businesses are reluctant to create new positions because it's too expensive with Obamacare and -- and the requirement to add benefits.
MCCRORY: Well, the two biggest concerns that I've been expressing since I've been governor and even when I was mayor of Charlotte when this started was that I'm afraid -- you know, the old way of getting insurance was through your companies. And I'm afraid you're going to have a lot more companies just drop their insurance, pay the penalty, and get out of the insurance business, which is make us more dependent on government brought in (ph) insurance.
And that is a big concern of mine. The other thing is there is no provider competition anymore.
Now, in the state of North Carolina, we only have one provider. And that's Blue Cross Blue Shield.
BARTIROMO: Right.
MCCRORY: And they almost pulled out four weeks ago. So this is why the premiums are going up.
And who knows what Blue Cross Blue Shield might do next year because their stockholders, their -- their board's going to look at the numbers and that
-- well, they share (ph) a responsibility and go, we can't -- we can't do this anymore.
BARTIROMO: Right. I mean, and we know that was the reason that United Health pulled out and Aetna pulled out of a number of states in terms of the exchanges. Do you think this reopening by the FBI, reopening of the Clinton e-mail scandal, the reopening of the investigation will have an impact on North Carolinians voter -- voting?
MCCRORY: Yes, I do. I think more than anything, it might impact the turnout. I think -- I -- I personally think the turnout will be impacted.
We're already seeing the Clinton voters not coming out in numbers that the Obama voters were coming out four years ago at this point in time.
I think the turnout will be impacted by this because people are just disgusted with the whole thing. And I think there is Clinton fatigue.
And frankly, there was some concern about Mr. Trump, too. It's kind of ironic. In the last three weeks, the media keeps going to me.
Well, are you going to still support Trump due to the controversy from two weeks ago? It's going to be interesting if the media turns around and ask my opponent, are you going to still support Hillary Clinton and put the same pressure that they put on the Republican candidates for the last three to nine months. So that's going to be an interesting media dynamic and political dynamic.
Will the Democrats start running away down ticket from Hillary Clinton at this point in time?
BARTIROMO: And are you supporting Trump?
MCCRORY: I am. I am. In fact, I was with Mike Pence yesterday.
He was a fellow -- he and I were elected governors at the same time. And Mike and I were working at the N.C. state football game parking lot yesterday.
I'm (ph) going to work at Carolina Panther parking lot today. But Mike and I are very close friends.
And I -- I consider Mike Pence to just be an excellent vice presidential candidate -- very solid, solid individual.
BARTIROMO: We will leave it there. Governor, good to see you. Thank you so much for joining us this morning.
MCCRORY: Thank you very much.
BARTIROMO: And in another key battleground, new polling shows the candidates neck-and-neck. It is the one state that could make all the difference in this race.
Take a look at those numbers when we come right back with Larry Sabato as we navigate this race, nine days left. Back in a minute.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: Well, welcome back. We've got some brand-new poll numbers this morning showing a dead heat in the all-important battleground state of Florida, with 29 electoral votes up for grabs in Florida. Hillary Clinton has 45 percent of the vote to Donald trump's 44 percent.
That is well within the margin of error. And I should point out that this, too, was taken before the FBI reopened its criminal investigation into Hillary Clinton and the e-mail scandal. Larry Sabato is with us.
He is the director of the Center for Politics at the University in Virginia.
Good to see you, Larry. Thanks so much for joining us. Your take on the race so far?
LARRY SABATO, DIRECTOR, UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA CENTER FOR POLITICS: Well, it's the craziest race I've seen since the 1960s. So I -- I always try and prepare for these contests by taking extra vitamins and eating healthy the last couple of weeks.
And I think we all need to do that because there are still some twists and turns to come. There will be other October and November surprises before November 8.
BARTIROMO: Well, what about this surprise that we just got? Do you think it's going to alter the race, the fact that the FBI is reopening its investigation into Hillary Clinton's e-mails?
SABATO: Well, I'm calling it the Comey effect. The Comey effect will be real in the presidential contest.
And it will be real in the Senate and House contest. I think what Director Comey has done and the actions that he's taken will benefit Donald Trump.
I don't know how much, maybe a point or two. We won't know until Wednesday. We need to have a series of good polls come out that are taken over the period when people will have learned about this.
And we don't have that yet. And it's going to have an impact in some of the really close Senate and House races. And it will help Republicans rather than Democrats.
BARTIROMO: So let -- let me ask you about this investigation and why you think it will be helpful. I mean, there's -- there's the one idea that there are e-mails that were on Anthony Weiner's P.C. that basically go against what Hillary Clinton may have said to Congress and to the FBI.
But then there's also this worry about national security in general.
Catherine Herridge from Fox News reporting earlier that during Abedin's -- Huma Abedin's April FBI interview, she said that she routinely sent State Department Hillary Clinton e-mails to her personal Yahoo! account to print, saying that the State Department system was too clumsy.
So she wanted to send them to her Yahoo! account. Now, fast forward a few months after that, we know that Yahoo! was hacked.
SABATO: Well, these are interesting facts. And I'm going to let the partisans argue about them, Maria.
I simply look at the polling effects of what has happened. And this has been a major event in the campaign that occurred 11 days before the election.
I think it will have the general effect of energizing Trump supporters, as though they needed to be energized more. And it will have the effect of depressing some Clinton voters.
Let's remember that 20 million have already votes -- voted. They're -- they're in the bank.
And it's infuriated some Democrats. They were very angry at the FBI director for having undertaken what they say is an unprecedented action just before the election.
So I'm going to look at what actually happens in the polling places and let the partisans argue about whether there's any there there. And as you know, Maria, there are a lot of different stories circulating, most of them will prove to be false.
BARTIROMO: Do you think that in -- in 11 days, independents' viewpoint can be changed by something like this?
SABATO: Well, the funny thing about this race, and it fits in with everything we know, is that there really aren't many swing voters. No matter what people tell pollsters, often, they don't want the pollster to know anything about their politics.
They consider it an invasion of privacy. But in most cases, the undecideds at this late state, half of them aren't going to vote, Maria.
That's -- that's been the tradition for many, many years. Half of them don't show up. And the half that do break in about the proportions that the electorate does as a whole.
Maybe -- maybe.
BARTIROMO: What is the.
SABATO: .this controversy.
BARTIROMO: .yes?
SABATO: .this controversy may add a point or two to Trump. We'll have to see. I want to let it play out until Wednesday.
BARTIROMO: So you think it's more impactful that people will not come out to vote, that they will basically lose interest because they're angry about this as opposed to saying, I'm going to come out and I'm going to help Hillary Clinton?
SABATO: Yes. I think essentially, at this point, you're not going to have more than a handful of people switching from Clinton to Trump or Trump to Clinton. Really, how could you?
It's such a stark choice. Maybe there are some who will vote for a third party candidate instead. I tend to think they will either not vote or skip the presidential contest, though I'll bet you, the numbers even in that case.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
SABATO: .are quite small.
BARTIROMO: Real quick, you know, for a long time, this economy was about national security -- this election was about national security and the economy. People were voting about who they thought could create more jobs, who they thought could keep them safer.
Has this election become more about people want an end to corruption?
SABATO: Certainly on the Republican side, it has become that. I think we can all agree that while corruption is an important issue, the economy and fighting terrorism are more important than -- than that.
But this is typical of American campaigns, Maria. We -- we rarely see the truly big issues float to the top at the end.
Usually, charges, counter-charges, allegations of corruption -- they tend to take over at the end. And that's exactly what we're seeing this year.
BARTIROMO: Larry, good to see you. Thank you so much. Larry Sabato, getting (ph) us there.
SABATO: Thank you, Maria.
BARTIROMO: Up next, Donald Trump is calling for major reforms on taxes and trade. He says he can move the needle on the economic growth story.
How does his plan move forward? And can he implement what he's looking to do? We will ask members of his economic policy team in an exclusive panel interview on Trump economics next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: A Trump administration will stop Trans-Pacific Partnership, a horror issue (ph).
(APPLAUSE)
Really bad deal. We are going to stand up to China on its massive currency manipulation, because they are beating our companies because of currency manipulation. We're going to lower taxes on American business from 35 percent to 15 percent.
(APPLAUSE)
We're going to cut taxes for middle-class families by hundreds of billions of dollars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BARTIROMO: That was Donald Trump hammering home his positions on the economy and how to get growth back. Will they resonate with voters on November 8?
Want to bring in our exclusive panel this morning from Trump's economic policy team: Wilbur Ross of W.L. Ross and Company is a Trump economic adviser; Peter Navarro of U.C. Irvine business professor and a Trump economic policy adviser; Andy Puzder is the former CEO of CKE Restaurants, Hardee's Carl's Jr. and a Trump victory committee member, and Steven Mnuchin is the Trump campaign finance chairman.
Gentlemen, good to see you all. Thank you so much for joining us.
WILBUR ROSS, FOUNDER, W.L. ROSS AND COMPANY: Great to be here.
BARTIROMO: Let -- let met kick it off with what Donald Trump just started with, and that was the TPP and the trade deals.
Wilbur, you are an international business guy.
ROSS: Right.
BARTIROMO: You have seen dealings with lots of countries, whether it's
(ph) from -- with steel.
ROSS: Right.
BARTIROMO: .with commodities. Talk to us about Trump's plans for trade because I think they scare some people. He wants to redo all the trade deals.
ROSS: Well, they're (ph) -- they should not be scared because Trump is not anti-trade. He's anti-dumb trade.
And dumb trade is why we used to a favorable balance of payments with Mexico of $4 to $5 billion a year. But do you know how much the cumulative trade deficits since NAFTA is with Mexico?
One trillion dollars -- $1 trillion. That's ridiculous. It doesn't have to be that we have such huge deficits just to have trade.
BARTIROMO: I -- I guess the -- the point is, Peter, is if we're redoing NAFTA, and we're going to try to do something different on Trans-Pacific Partnership and we're going to redo all these trade deals at once, isn't that going to be a disruption for the economy rather than actually focusing on revving up economic growth?
PETER NAVARRO, BUSINESS PROFESSOR, UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA, IRVINE: It's going to be a tremendous stimulus. If you look at the drag we have now on our economy, it's a $766 billion a year trade deficit in goods.
That's factories and jobs going offshore. To reinforce Wilbur's point, let's take South Korea 2012 deal.
This, to me, is the -- the poster child of everything that's wrong with Hillary Clinton or bad trade deals. As secretary of state, she negotiated that.
She called it cutting edge. She promised us 70,000 new jobs. What do we have four years later?
We've lost 95,000 jobs. We doubled our trade deficit with South Korea.
And you know who's been hit the hardest?
It's been the auto and auto parts industry, which has the highest multiplier in terms of jobs. It's places like Ohio, Wisconsin's, Indiana.
And this is what the problem is. North Carolina -- so you're talking to Pat McCrory earlier. It's like North Carolina has been hit since 1993 in NAFTA with all of these bad trade deals.
So the idea is Donald Trump is a smart negotiator. The art of the trade deal is to go in and have good deals for the American people, use our position as the biggest market in the world.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
NAVARRO: .the most powerful economy and do what's right for the American worker, American manufacturer.
BARTIROMO: Yes, if that's going to include tariffs on goods coming in.
NAVARRO: Tariffs are only at the -- tariffs are only.
(CROSSTALK)
BARTIROMO: That's a threat (ph) -- it's (ph) not just a threat (ph).
NAVARRO: .that is not the end game. They're only a negotiating tool to bring each country to the table to give a good deal for the American people. Hillary Clinton's -- look.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
NAVARRO: .South Korea -- a hundred thousand jobs gone because she didn't negotiate a good deal. We've got to stop doing that.
BARTIROMO: All right. Good point.
ROSS: Right. And not all of it should be tariffs. A lot could be just increasing our exports to those countries.
China, for example, buys a lot of soybeans from us.
BARTIROMO: Yes.
ROSS: But they also buy them from other people. If in turn, they would just buy more from us, it would help, same with natural gas, same with a lot of industrial equipment.
BARTIROMO: One -- one of the issues is communicating these stories. But does he have the ground game and the money to actually explain the way you both have in terms of what these policies will mean for people's lives?
Steven Mnuchin, that's your area. What can you tell us in terms of Trump's ground game and what you're seeing out there from individuals, from businesses?
You can't find many CEOs that have given Trump money, right?
STEVEN MNUCHIN, FINANCE CHAIRMAN, TRUMP CAMPAIGN: Well, first of all, Maria, we -- we have had a lot of people across the board who have contributed, extremely generous. And as you know, we've had the largest online fundraising for any Republican ever.
So we -- we couldn't be more comfortable. The ground game is -- is fully paid for. We worked very closely with Reince at the RNC.
We have a terrific ground game, better than they've ever had before. And we just had a massive amount of advertising purchased.
So we'll be competing with Hillary head-for-head with advertising this week.
BARTIROMO: All right (ph).
MNUCHIN: We couldn't be more comfortable with where we are on that.
BARTIROMO: OK, so now, you feel that you're going to be competing effectively with Hillary in terms of advertising because she's been throwing out lots of negative ad against Donald Trump?
And then there's Obamacare, Andy Puzder. And I want to talk about this as well in (ph) our next segment because this is a lot.
There's a lot here. Pick -- pick a state. Arizona is going to see premiums up a hundred and 16 percent.
PUZDER: Right.
BARTIROMO: This -- we just got this news a week and a half ago. Has that impacted Trump's chances?
PUZDER: Oh, I think it's real (ph) -- people are really angry about this.
And if you're one of the millions of people in states like North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Arizona, as you mentioned, that have got these huge policy increases, and you were considering voting for Hillary Clinton, I mean, what the hell are you thinking about?
I mean, this -- she's just going to make this worse. So Trump's got a plan
-- increase competition, increase incentive, so that people want to buy insurance, not that they're mandatorily required to buy it, a system that will really lower cost, increase quality and get everybody covered.
That's the kind of system we need. It's not the kind of system Hillary Clinton wants.
As a businessman yourself, having seen firsthand the impact of regulation and whether the pendulum goes too far, what has been the impact of Obamacare in terms of small business and -- and mid-sized business as well?
PUZDER: Well, it's interesting you ask. There is -- this last year with the seven percent increase in Obamacare premiums, in the restaurant industry, a report by Civic Science came out that said 47 percent of people who had their -- their health care premiums increase are going to restaurants less, and are 30 percent more likely to -- to significantly reduce restaurant visits than people whose health care premiums didn't go up.
We're kind of -- we're kind of the canary in the coal mine in that respect because that was the seven -- that was the impact of a seven percent premium increase. Next year, it's 25 percent.
BARTIROMO: Right.
PUZDER: So it could have a real impact on the entire economy. This -- Obamacare is a disaster.
It needs to be repealed and replaced.
BARTIROMO: I want to talk about the other parts of Trump's economic plan.
We've talked trade. Next, let's get into tax cuts.
Let's get into rolling back legislation and tapping into energy. That's
his plan. More with our exclusive panel on Trump economics, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BARTIROMO: We are back with members of Donald Trump's economic policy team
-- Wilbur Ross, Peter Navarro, Andy Puzder and Steven Mnuchin with me this morning. Let's go through the plan.
Number one, cut taxes.
ROSS: Right.
BARTIROMO: Most -- most important there is the corporate tax rate of 15 percent, which he thinks is going to enable and push businesses to hire more workers and invest. Number two, rolling back regulations.
ROSS: Right.
BARTIROMO: .in particular, Obamacare. Number three, tapping into energy and number four, redo trade deals that have not worked for America.
Taxes -- it's going to be expensive, Wilbur Ross, cutting taxes that much.
ROSS: Well, it'll be not as expensive as anybody models because they are failing to take into account the tax revenues that will be generated by ending the trade deficit. That's $220 million more wages that will be taxed.
BARTIROMO: OK.
ROSS: It's more corporate profits that'll be taxed. Unleashing energy -- same thing -- more wages that'll be taxed, more corporate taxes.
We believe it's revenue-neutral when you take the entire plan into account.
As opposed to Hillary's plan, she actually is planning to raise corporate taxes.
BARTIROMO: Right.
ROSS: She said $275 billion. To put that in proportion, that's seven and a half percent of all business earnings in the country. And it's one and a half percent of the economy.
That's going to kill jobs.
BARTIROMO: I don't know how you get businesses to raise money and -- and jobs if they're paying more wages and paying more taxes, Peter.
NAVARRO: Yes, look, the big picture here is from 1947 to 2001, we grew three and a half percent year in, year out. Life was good. Since then, we've grown less than two percent.
What's the problem? It's taxes are too high, regulations too high. It's a
$2 trillion tax on our economy from overregulation, Hillary shutting down our oil, natural gas and coal industries in all these bad trade deals, which we've already discussed.
What we need to do is go from this -- this new dismal, what they call the new normal, get to three and a half percent or four percent with Donald Trump's plan, that generates an enormous amount of tax revenues so we can pay for everything we need plus create 25 million jobs. That's the vision.
If you take something.
BARTIROMO: Right.
NAVARRO: .like corporate tax and you cut that, we produce in Michigan rather than Mexico -- simple as that.
BARTIROMO: Yes. Twenty-five million jobs seems like a big number, Andy
(ph).
NAVARRO: Over 10 years.
BARTIROMO: Over 10 years. You think that's doable. And you think four percent economic growth is doable based on what we're hearing here?
PUZDER: I think it's absolutely doable. And I think it'll better than four percent growth, with the right energy tax, regulatory and trade policies.
You know, you can't -- looking at Clinton, you can't grow the economy if your -- if your tax plan is to redistrict income. You can't grow the economy if your energy plan is to address climate change instead of making America energy-independent.
And you can't grow the economy if your regulatory plan is to grow the government rather than the economy.
BARTIROMO: Right.
PUZDER: I mean, it's impossible.
BARTIROMO: Steven Mnuchin, we're going to see you soon. We appreciate you joining us this morning.
Gentlemen, thank you very much. I'll see you tomorrow, "Mornings with Maria" at Fox Business Network. See you tomorrow.
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