Donald Trump defends his tone

Vs. Rubio, Hillary, National Review


This is a rush transcript from "MediaBuzz," March 13, 2016. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

HOWARD KURTZ, HOST: On the Buzz Meter this Sunday, Donald Trump sits down with me to talk about his nasty fight with Marco Rubio, his use of personal insult, his past phrase of Hillary Clinton, whether he's flexible on immigration, and the harshest attacks by his media detractors.


DONALD TRUMP, REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: These are bigoted people, as I've read...

KURTZ: Bigoted, in what...

TRUMP: ...well, they're against me -- these are people who have such hatred for me. I don't know why. I don't know them. I do think it's unfair. You know, they don't call me. I've never spoken to any of them to the best of my knowledge, so you would think that if they're going to write something about me, they'd call and they'd talk to me.


KURTZ: He also talked about whether he'll stop showing up for televised debates.


TRUMP: Oh, I think the debates are out of control. I think it's ridiculous. I think the debates are absolutely -- how many times can you ask the same question?


KURTZ: Donald Trump's victory is now being overshadowed by the coverage of violent clashes at his rallies which forced him to cancel a major Chicago event and what about, Breitbart reporter disputed charge at a top aide reporter (ph) which is questioned by her bosses? And with two days until the Florida Primary, have the media tried to push Marco Rubio out of the race? Hillary Clinton hits a pothole as Bernie Sanders beats her in Michigan and she gets tougher questions in debates.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: If you get indicted, would you move out (ph)?

HILLARY CLINTON, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Oh, for goodness that is not going to happen. I'm not even answering that question.


KURTZ: Is the press still portraying Bernie as a hopeless long shot? Plus, a jury awards Erin Andrews a huge sum over that nude hotel video, did she deserve $55 million?

I'm Howard Kurtz, and this is "MediaBuzz."

And I sat down with Donald Trump the other day at Mar-a-Largo, the famous estate he owns in Palm Beach. I had a long list of media and political questions, but we started when the subject has generated plenty of chatter and criticism his tone.


KURTZ: Donald Trump, welcome.

TRUMP: Thank you.

KURTZ: After you won Michigan and Mississippi, you said, "I can be more presidential than anyone, except Abe Lincoln," but you're constantly under attack. That is true. I hear people say, "can't he tone down the insults a little bit and start acting a little more president?"

TRUMP: The problem is I started off how it was 17, way up 17 people. It's a little smart, a little tough, you know, governors, senators...

KURTZ: You've got three opponents.

TRUMP: I'm down to three, all right. And I was being attacked from every angle imaginable. I mean, it was really amazing and I had to be tough and I had to be sharp and I had to be nasty in some cases because they were nasty. And now, we're down to a few, and you know, I want to finish the game. And look, I went to the best school, I was a good student. I'm a very smart person...

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: ...I can be the most politically correct person that you have ever interviewed and I do joke. I can be the best other than Abe, honest Abe with a hat, he'd be tough. He's the ultimate, right? But I would say this, I can be very presidential. But it just hasn't been -- this is a highly competitive thing with all these people...

KURTZ: On that point, you have really gotten into with Marco Rubio, a lot of personal attacks back-and-forth. You're running an ad now that says little Marco, as you call him, is corrupt, he is dishonest. You talk about cheating on his Republican Party credit cards and you were asked on "Morning Joe," would you consider him beeping (ph) you said, "Sure, he's got lots talent."

TRUMP: I didn't say that, I said it's too early to say. I didn't say that...

KURTZ: ...but you said, he got talent. You were...

TRUMP: ...I said sure he's got talent, he's got talent but he hurt himself badly...

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: ...when he tried to be down reckless (ph) that was not a good thing. He shouldn't have done that because it didn't work for him. And he was actually doing nicely. He's talking policy, he could be very sharp on occasion, got hurt by Chris Christie...

KURTZ: But you're calling him corrupt, are you now thinking, okay, I may need to mend fences with this guy if I'm going to -- I win this thing?

TRUMP: I don't want to really discuss it. Honestly...


TRUMP: The reason I don't is because we'll see what happens. But I will say this -- he was better off before he attacked. And I don't do the attacking. I mean I'm a counterpuncher. I don't do the attacking if you look at every one of the 17...

KURTZ: But you always say they started it.

TRUMP: They started it, and then they go packing. And there's something awfully nice about that. Wouldn't it be nice to have that working for our country?

KURTZ: In the Detroit debate when you talked about the size of your hands and the size of something else...

TRUMP: I didn't talk about it. Marco talked about it.

KURTZ: Well, I was going to say, he started it, you were responding...

TRUMP: Sure.

KURTZ: was a joke. I didn't have any great problem with it. But it led to a tsunami of coverage including this front-page headline in The New York Times, the descent in the Donald Trump's pants, how does that help you?

TRUMP: Look, he made a statement that I had small hands. He made it up. He's a politician. Politicians lie. I don't have small hands. I have good hands. Look, my hands are good...

KURTZ: What the record show.


KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: I have good hands...

KURTZ: Did Melania think that was a good place for you to go?

TRUMP: She didn't like my mentioning it, but I did. Look, I was shaking hands two days later and people were saying, oh, you have large hands. You look wonderful and they were shocked. The world thought, why should I -- why shouldn't I say it? He lied. And I called him out. Now, should I have done it? Yes, I should have done it. Because now at least they know it was a lie. Look, he became very nasty, Marco and I became therefore probably nastier and it turned out to be a very bad thing for him. But I do believe when you get hit, you got to hit back.

KURTZ: Let's talk about flexibility. That's came up because word leaked of an off-the-record meeting you had with "The New York Times" editorial board about immigration...


KURTZ: ...and you say that was off the record and I take off the record very seriously...

TRUMP: ...very important.

KURTZ: So, I don't want to ask you about that.

TRUMP: Sure.

KURTZ: I want to ask you about the larger issue which some of your opponents think that when you make these sweeping declarations and then you talk about flexibility maybe you are not good to carry out all the things you say you would do.

TRUMP: Flexibility is very important. You can't say this is the way it is and...

KURTZ: To be stuck in cement.

TRUMP: ...I will not talk to you. I will not -- and you know, I use the example, so the wall is going to be 40 feet, so it's going to be 38 feet.

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: I mean flexibility is very important. Sometimes you have to give something to the other side. It may be meaningless, but it's a bone, you call it a bone, and they take it. It's in the art of the deal.

I mean look, Cruz is a very inflexible person, I think -- I think. Who knows -- who knows if he is or not? But when he stands on filibuster for two days on the Senate floor, what did they get out of that? Nothing except they wasted two days.

You have to be -- you have to have a certain -- now, ask for more than you want, come back to what you want, make the great deal...

KURTZ: Negotiating.

TRUMP: ...but -- it's called negotiating.

KURTZ: In the Fox debate you talked about -- you said you were changing and softening your position on more visas for highly skilled immigrants. The next day, you put out a statement kind of backing off so critics are saying well, where does he really stand?

TRUMP: Well, you know, what I was talking about and what I really refer to and I think it's very important we educate people in this country and then from other countries, OK? Whether we like that or not, they pay, et cetera, et cetera but we educate a lot of people, very smart people.

We need those people in the country. They cannot come into the country. You know, they go to Harvard, they are first in their class and they're from India they go back to India and they setup companies and they make a fortune and they employ lots of people and all of that.

Many people want to stay in this country and then want to do that. I think somebody that goes through years of college in this country we shouldn't kick them out the day they graduate, which we do.

KURTZ: You said you're a common sense conservative?


KURTZ: When do you position that some on the right don't like is that you say don't touch Social Security and Medicare people paid into it, they're entitled to get the benefits. But those are, as you know, two monster entitlement programs...

TRUMP: Sure.

KURTZ: ...that are, along with Medicaid, driving the federal that 45% of the budget when you include Medicaid, do you say, I wouldn't even look at raising the retirement age, no changes what so ever...

TRUMP: I don't want to change -- I tell you what, I don't want to change. And, by the way, the Democrats aren't going to change. I watched them the other night they're talking about increasing it...

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: ...and I'm saying...

KURTZ: ...more of the democratic position...

TRUMP: ...oh, good -- no, no...


TRUMP: let them -- let it -- be their (ph) position.

KURTZ: Why should billionaire...

TRUMP: You know then you wonder...

KURTZ: Why should you and your billionaire friends be...

TRUMP: Oh, I would like to do a system where people voluntarily -- I would give it up in two seconds and so would a lot of people that I know. And somebody said they don't want to do that I would give it up in two seconds, make it a voluntary basis. I would say this...

KURTZ: Why not set -- why not set an income control (ph) above wage you don't get it?

TRUMP: Let me tell you this, look -- people -- there are people that it doesn't even come into, you know, they don't even know they have it. There are other people, they needed it so desperately. I don't want to change it, and I don't want to change it for a number of reasons. But one is because they've committed, they've paid in for years. We can make so much money in this country if we stop the waste, fraud, and abuse. If we negotiate it, if we had other people helping us...

KURTZ: Speaking of your detractors on the ride, national reviews did come out very forcibly against you, at your press conference the other night you said, these are idiots who don't have any common sense...

TRUMP: I didn't use the word idiot. No, I didn't use the word idiot.

KURTZ: I thought I heard you use the word...

TRUMP: Whatever.

KURTZ: ...but...

TRUMP: ...but, you know, you could use that word, it could be acceptable.

KURTZ: ...why are they with these people who are fighting for their vision of conservative principles in which in many cases doesn't...

TRUMP: Because, they shouldn't be attacking me. Look, we have something that's very unique. Millions of people are going to the polls right now, and they're going -- and they're voting for Donald Trump, millions and millions -- more than has ever happened for the Republican Party...

KURTZ: Is it...


TRUMP: ...they're going for me and maybe in some cases they'll vote against me I mean...


TRUMP: ...regardless, but more than have ever gone to the polls. The Democrats are down 30% -- 35%...

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: ...the Republicans are up...

KURTZ: But people say, you are ruining the Republican Party, they say you're expanding the Republican Party.

TRUMP: I'm expanding it, and you know who I'm -- I'm expanding with Democrats, with Independents -- I'm expanding with people that never voted before. So many people Howie are coming up to me are saying, Mr. Trump, I've never voted before but you are the first one I'm voting, millions of people. And they should embrace me, and I should embrace them and I will embrace them at the right time. What the Republican, you know, they call them the elites I don't know why they are more elite than...



KURTZ: We're at Mar-a-Largo.

TRUMP: OK, but they call them -- or they call them the establishment, OK? So, let's say the establishment -- the establishment should embrace what we're doing.

KURTZ: I know you once gave money to Hillary Clinton and then you invited her to your wedding because you were New York businessman and it was your job to get along with politics...

TRUMP: Yes...

KURTZ: ...especially you're in Democratic now...

TRUMP: Absolutely.

KURTZ: ...isn't it a little odd if you personally announcing these things (ph) -- these harsh things about someone who you were friendly with?

TRUMP: Well, not so friendly. I mean I was at a point where as a businessman, one of the magazines said, "Donald Trump was a world-class businessman," it's true. Look at the company I built. I filed all my...

KURTZ: Look at my salary (ph).

TRUMP: No, but as a world-class businessman, I have to get along with secretaries of state, with senators, with this and that and I would support people and I get along. I never knew I was going to be doing this. I never knew I was going to be running for office.

No, it doesn't bother me at all. I mean I look at job performance and you look at what's happening with Syria, you look at what's happening with so many different -- but look at Libya, what a disaster, look at Benghazi, what a disaster...

KURTZ: In 2012, as the four-year secretary of state, you told Fox she was a terrific woman...


KURTZ: ...did a very good job at the state department, so was that BS?

TRUMP: I'm a businessman. So, why should I say...

KURTZ: So, was that BS?

TRUMP: I don't say BS, I don't say anything. I say, why would I say bad? I have to go to the state department to get approval on some project that I'm building in some foreign country and they have to give me a letter of recommendation. Why would I say that?

KURTZ: Because it makes you sound like a little bit of a politician if you're not changing your view of Hillary Clinton.

TRUMP: No. I'm not a politician. But why would I say bad things about people when, you know, I never knew I was going to be doing this. I never knew -- I just got fed up when I looked at the incompetence in government, when I looked at the incompetence of our country...


KURTZ: We'll have more of the Trump interview a bit later with a candid discussion about his view of the media. But, when we come back, much of the media asking whether Donald Trump could be encouraging violence at his rally after the cancellation in Chicago is that fair?


KURTZ: The issue of violence at Donald Trump's rally surfaced with a Jake Tapper question at the CNNN debate the other night and when chaos erupted at his Chicago rally on Friday night, cable news went wall- to-wall as protesters clashed with supporters prompting Trump to cancel the event and then to call in to the anchors covering it. And the tone was strikingly different on different channels.


GRETA VAN SUSTEREN, FOX NEWS: This is not a demonstration against war or economic conditions. This is a protest as I understand it against your free speech. They're using free speech. They have a right to peaceful protest to try to shut you down from your free speech.

TRUMP: No. I think this is a demonstration against economic conditions on both sides.

RACHEL MADDOW, MSNBC, I'm close to the contention here that he wants -- he wanted a conflagration this big because it's a classic strongman political technique...


KURTZ: Joining us now to talk about the campaign coverage, Heidi Przybyla, senior political correspondent for USA Today; Kristen Soltis Anderson, a Republican pollster and contributor to The Washington Examiner; and Michael Tomasky, columnist for The Daily Beast. Heidi, I was watching the saturation coverage on Friday night. As you just saw, the tone -- the focus seemed to be somewhat different on Fox and MSNBC. What's your take?

HEIDI PRZYBYLA, USA TODAY: One day, Howie that was a great montage and somebody is going to do a big expose showing a lot of montages of how the media has really helped to drive people into their ideological corners in this country. That was a great example.

It's absurd to not acknowledge that Donald Trump hasn't played a role in setting the tone here. We've all seen the footage of him urging people to, you know, punch that guy and I'll pay your legal fees, and even like promulgating racial stereotypes by picking out a black man and saying, "go get a job."

At the same time, it's malpractice not to acknowledge in the press that these protests have gone over the line. They've gone from what were peaceful, silent protesters standing there with signs to people who are rushing the stage who are making 9-year-olds cry on their way outside the event, and pushing women up against their cages.

KURTZ: The New York Times headline this morning, "Donald Trump's heated words were destined to stir violence, opponents say." And look, Trump's rhetoric is obviously a fair game, Kristen but what about the thugs who show up, who organized then punch people or try to shut down rallies?

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, THE WASHINGTON EXAMINER: This is what's sort of inexplicable to me about the strategy of a kind of stuff Trump threw protest that do go over the line, is that -- in art of the deal Donald Trump says the media loves conflict.

This has been part of Trump's press strategy for decade. And so from his perspective, when people turn on the news and they see images of these protesters fighting against Trump's supporters, what do you think most people will walk away from that footage saying?

They'll walk away saying, hey, even if I don't like Donald Trump, I don't know that I think people should be hopping over barricades to come after him. It's going to make Donald Trump look sympathetic. I don't understand the strategy of the protesters who crossed the line.

KURTZ: Trump got hammered today on several live Sunday interviews that he didn't give an inch -- he didn't say that he feels that he bears any responsibility for the violence that has broken out. Does this feed a larger media narrative about Trump and his supporters?

MICHAEL TOMASKY, THE DAILY BEAST: It certainly does. And I think reasonably so, you know, Maddow -- you had that Maddow clip the other night. She had on a reporter from Chicago who said a very interesting thing. She said even holding the event at University of Illinois and Chicago, in the first place is probably provocative. She said, I've covered tons of events, he or she is a Chicago reporter, I've covered tons of events in the city, I've never seen a Republican hold an event there. It's usually...


ANDERSON: ...speaking out and going to places where Republicans don't always go. If they only speak at, you know, big churches or they're only speaking at country clubs then they're filling a narrative.


PRZYBYLA: You don't see this at Cruz event, you don't see this at Bernie events, and you don't see the kind of rhetoric that set it up...

KURTZ: Right.

PRZYBYLA: ...cheated it all off that we've all been expecting something like this to happen.

KURTZ: So, Heidi when we have hours and hours of live coverage on all the cable news channels, at one point Trump in his respond with Greta Van Susteren said, "Well, you keep playing the same footage of people punching each other over and over, I mean I think the other channels too because we pick the most...


KURTZ: ...violent episodes to, so is there a point there that the media might be feeding this a little bit?

PRZYBYLA: Yes, well they're going to play the best footage of the day. And by virtue of the 24-hour news cycle, depending on when you turn on their figuring oh, you're not going to see it, you know, not all of their viewers will see it so -- but yes does that -- for people who are sitting there glued in front of their TV start to feed some of that anger absolutely.

KURTZ: Let me turn to the controversy involving Breitbar reporter, Michelle Fields, who has alleged that Trump's Campaign Manager, Corey Lewandowski and we're looking at the footage here right before the incident, grabbed her forcefully.

She later showed bruises on her arm in an effort to pull her away from asking the question or that what she alleges at least. Lewandowski says this never happened. He's tweeted that she's delusional, that she's an attention seeker.

And here is what Michelle Fields told Megyn Kelly the other night?


MICHELLE FIELDS, BREITBARD REPORTER: Well, it feels awful. This has to be aside from my father's death the worst experience I've gone through. The hate that I have received, the email messages...


KURTZ: Michelle Fields is a former Fox contributor obviously was hurt. But initially she said she never saw apparently that (ph) -- she doesn't know who did this to her, so how do we cover this when it appears to be a kind of mob?

ANDERSON: Well, there was audio that was released of her talking with "The Washington Post" reporter in the immediate ten seconds after words after math where they're discussing, you know, what happened and who did it.

And I think at this point, it what's become pretty clear that it seems like the Trump's campaign has kind of realized if their strategy is to just deny, deny, deny even if there is evidence that they'll sort of get a pass for it. I mean the interview that you did with Donald Trump earlier with the show you came to him with quotes of things that he has said.

And he said, "Oh, no, no I didn't say that." But his campaign knows that if he just simply denies, denies, denies and now the strategy is being deployed in the Michelle Fields' situation they can sometimes get away with it.

KURTZ: On the other hand Michael, Breitbart, which is a blatantly pro-Trump site, hasn't exactly backed up Michelle Fields. In fact, that statement saying is "The Washington Post" reporter was the only apparent eye witness appeared to confuse apparently when asked (ph) with someone else then this video since they came up, Breitbart modified it quite a bit, so she's in a position where even her own bosses are not taking her side on this.

TOMASKY: I've never heard I don't think in the 25 years I've been doing this, I don't think I've ever heard a news organization not stand by its reporter in a situation like this...


TOMASKY:'s just an unbelievable thing to me, and you know, it makes them not a news organization. It makes them a Trump organization at least in this room with respect to the incident, it's unbelievable.

KURTZ: All right, let me get a break. We have more to say about this of course. Still ahead, Donald Trump in that interview says why libel laws in his views should be loosened to make it easier for people like him to sue media outlets. But up next, has the press been trying to shove Marco Rubio out of the race?


KURTZ: There's been a media drumbeat that whether Marco Rubio should quit the race before Tuesday's Florida Primary including one hotly contested report on CNN.


JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: There is a division in his campaign we are being told and some very senior advisers are suggesting to him that he's not going do well in Florida and that he should get out sooner...

ALEX CONANT, RUBIO'S CAMPAIGN COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Well, Jamie's report was utter nonsense. She did not contact the campaign prior to coming on the show last hour reporting that. It is 100% absolutely false. I mean CNN is doing a disservice to voters by airing that sort of reporting without even checking with the campaign...


KURTZ: That was quite a moment. Kristen, how damaging is it to Senator Rubio when every story asks is he getting out and every interview includes versions of that question?

ANDERSON: I'm sure that his campaign would prefer for it not to be the case. And I understand why the media covers it this way. Because it's much more exciting to sort of have underdogs and winners and losers than to say, well, here's what the delegate picture stands and we had a couple of contests this past week. And a few people racked up delegates here and there. That's not as exciting.

That's why we've had a number of different channels call, you know, it's going to be Super Tuesday number two and then Super Tuesday number three all this hyped excitement. It means you need an underdog if you need somebody who's fading. Rubio is unfortunately that guy for this week.

KURTZ: I understand why we report on somebody telling us X number of delegates and they probably don't have a path to nomination, but it does seem like there becomes this almost nudge to like why are you still in the race, and how is that our role?

TOMASKY: It's not and you're right this has been nudged a little bit in the past week. But I think Rubio overall got a really nice ride for a longer time than he actually deserved to have. He finished third in Iowa. He got up there, he gave a speech like he won and the press basically played along with that spin. And then, you know, his people remember had been saying this three, two, one strategy...


TOMASKY: ...we're going be third in Iowa, we're going to be second in New Hampshire, we're going to win South Carolina. He got drilled in South Carolina and nobody said when are you getting out? The people should have been saying it then maybe, so...


TOMASKY:, you know, I mean he -- yes, in the last week, has been rough, but he got a nice ride.

KURTZ: In that same story where Rubio's guy asked went racing across town here in Washington to dispute it, CNN stood by the story. They said they relied on multiple unnamed advisers, OK. But the network never called the Rubio campaign for comment for airing that, which of course started a lot of copycat stories, is that a problem?

PRZYBYLA: Yes, yes it is a problem. Because those advisers I mean anonymously -- you said an anonymous source in Washington is such a huge issue and there's so there's so much variance among different news organizations in terms of what's acceptable. But, in this case, there was one source, anonymous quoted and we didn't even know if there was a campaign official. But the bigger problem and the grievance that the Rubio campaign has is that they were never contacted. That is just not acceptable. You need to contact someone when they're the subject of your story to provide a response.

KURTZ: OK. In the half minute we have left just to go back to the Trump rallies, is there too much media focus on the things that Trump says at these rallies, you know, get him out of here, and wish I could punch that guy in the face, and not enough on the people who go there deliberately to try to shut down a rally which is suppressing free speech?

TOMASKY: It is, but you know, Trump is the story and Trump's the guy who'd really started all this and made all this happen and it's the energy around him and it's the way he talks that that got this ball rolling.

KURTZ: All right, well panel stick around. Let me get a break. Ahead on "MediaBuzz," Jorge Ramos demands pledges about deportation at the Hillary- Bernie debate. But first, it was a hardship assignment to be sure than I am when I went down to Mar-a-Largo in Florida, Donald Trump on how he feels when the commentators trash him.


KURTZ: More now of my Palm Beach sit down with Donald Trump starting with his outlook on the heavy schedule of debates.


KURTZ: If you do well in this Tuesday's Primary's, and you have a bigger lead than you have now and there will have a point have been 12 debates, will you be to the point where you say we don't need any more debates?

TRUMP: Oh, I think the debates are out of control I think it's ridiculous and I think the debates are absolutely -- I think how many times can you ask the same question and it's ridiculous.

KURTZ: So, are you prepared...

TRUMP: Oh, I mean they're very good. They get great ratings.

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: Why do they get great ratings?

KURTZ: From your point of view, do you know why...

TRUMP: Do you know why they get great ratings? Do you think it's because of Marco Rubio?

KURTZ: I think I know what you're saying.

TRUMP: ...or is it because of Senator Cruz, I don't think so? But look, they're making a fortune. The networks Fox and CNN and all of them, they're making an absolute fortune. You know, these debates used to be throwaways, you know that. They used to be television...

KURTZ: ...people watched, nothing like now.

TRUMP: ...they used to be television dead land they called it. They were forced to...

KURTZ: So, are you considering -- but you mention in the debate in terms of your participation...

TRUMP: I'll do what I have to do I mean...


TRUMP: ...but I just -- I will tell you, I think we've had enough debates. I like the debates. I've actually enjoyed the debates and think I've been good at it because I've won every poll about the debates. But yes, I think we've had enough debates.

KURTZ: You've talked about being unhappy with "The New York Times" and "Washington Post" reporting on you, you say we should open the libel laws to make it easier...

TRUMP: Absolutely.

KURTZ:, let's go down this. You can sue right now, but you would have to prove as a public figure that journalists published something they knew was false or acted with reckless disregard for whether it was false or not, how would you change that?

TRUMP: "The New York Times" and the "Washington Post" -- "The New York Times" has written stories about me that are so false and I think they know they're false. But they're so false and so defamatory and everything is so libellous. The problem is the libel laws are essentially nonexistent. I mean you could say...


TRUMP: ...I could say that you are XXX for public figure and it's unfair. If somebody writes falsely about a person, you should be able to sell...


TRUMP:, no but you can't win.

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: OK. Look, I can sue, but I can't -- you can't win...

KURTZ: Right.

TRUMP: ...the laws are setup so you can't win. They're set up that way for the papers.

But now, if I get in, I'm going to make the laws fair. If somebody writes a terrible, defamatory -- knowingly, defamatory story about me or horrible story about me and knowing the facts and putting in the wrong facts, I should be able to sue and I should be able to get damages. And I'm going to have those laws changed.

And when I say that, I make it harder on myself because people are going to say, oh, let's go after him even more. They can't do anymore. But the laws are very unfair. And actually in a certain way it makes the newspapers and makes the media dishonest the way they are now.

KURTZ: Let me read it one of your many tweets about the media. This one said, I am watching two clown announcers on Fox News as they try to build up failed presidential candidate little Marco. Fox news is in the back. My first question is, is there any possibility that you watched too much cable news and get...

TRUMP: No, I think Fox is very prone toward Marco Rubio.


TRUMP: It's an amazing thing. I have great respect for Roger Ailes. I like Roger Ailes. I think I get treated poorly on Fox. I think that Megyn's people treat me poorly, less Megyn and the people she has on, she has Stirewalt and some other people that just I mean -- no matter -- I could be 100% perfect on something and then say wrong. I think...


KURTZ: still have a lot of times reacting to the pundits...

TRUMP: Yes, yes because I think it's false stuff. I think Krauthammer has just absolutely a disgrace when it comes to me. Don't forget he was a big war hawk, going to Iraq -- going to Iraq. I mean he was wrong on so many subjects. I think he is. Steven Hayes treats me terribly. It wouldn't matter what I do, Steven Hayes -- I don't know Steven Hayes.

KURTZ: Do you hate (ph) the people who disagree with you...

TRUMP: No, not disagrees -- George Will, let me just tell you -- George Will are terrible. So -- no, I think Fox treats me terribly. I will say CNN treats me much better than Fox does.

KURTZ: OK. I wrote a column the other day about the way in which some of the columnists and commentators are really ranching up the language against you. And I want to read this and very harsh stuff...


KURTZ: get your response. Ruth Marcus, "Washington Post," "Trump is Nixon with all the megalomaniacal willingness to abuse power"; Solon, "is Donald Trump just David Duke in a better suit?" David Brooks, "New York Times," "his inability to think for an extended time but anybody himself." Nick Kristoff, The New York Times, "is there anything scarier or nightmare than president Donald J. Trump in a tense crisis with his sweaty finger on the nuclear trigger? Why do you think it is gone so thermal nuclear (ph) for those who don't like you in the press?

TRUMP: These are bigoted people. I've read...

KURTZ: Bigoted in what...

TRUMP: ...bigoted, they're up and against -- these are people that have such hatred for me, I don't know why. I don't know them. I see them. They don't know me at all, talking about my sweaty hands that I have sweaty hands. But -- and so that's what I mean.

You have to -- people should be held accountable. Ruth Marcus, I mean, I don't know who she has -- treats me horribly. She doesn't know me. She knows nothing about me.

Brooks, I read an article the other day it was just -- the hatred. This isn't -- this has nothing to do with government. This has nothing to do governing. This has to do with a personal hatred that is unbelievable. Now maybe...

KURTZ: Is there a level on which these media attacks help you?

TRUMP: I don't think they help me. A lot of people do. A lot of people said, "Oh, that's the greatest thing that could happen." I said, "No, I don't think it's great." They may have been right because my, you know, my victories have been so incredible, but the numbers are bigger than I thought.

No, I don't think it. People ask me that question when guys like Brooks and Marcus -- Ruth Marcus and others attack, Kristof I just find it -- I don't know if it's good or bad. I think it's probably, to me it's bad, I don't like it. But I will tell you I think it's unfair.

I do think it's unfair. You know, they don't call me. I've never spoken to any of them to the best of my knowledge. So, you would think that if they're going to write something about me, they'd call, they'd talk to me.

Maureen Dowd knows me a little bit and she writes and I really respect her. She's an amazing writer.

KURTZ: And she's critical of you too at times.

TRUMP: She's critical, but she would appear with persona (ph) an amazing piece and it wasn't a puff piece at all there are negative things in there. But she sort of got me. These people don't know me. And they write so -- and they write very personal.

You know, I say something about somebody personally I end up with a front- page story. And yet they can say things about me personally at the worst possible things you can say. No, I think it's very unfair. I think they're very unfair as writers, journalist, and critics.

KURTZ: Donald Trump thanks very much for sitting down with us in Palm Beach.

TRUMP: Thank you very much.


KURTZ: Coming up, Hillary Clinton gets asked about a possible indictment when Jorge Ramos pushes the Democratic candidates to promise through this deportation, first (ph) of all the journalist up next.


KURTZ: The headlines turned negative for Hillary Clinton because Bernie Sanders shocked the pundits and everyone else by beating her in, it wasn't Florida why did I say Florida, by beating her in Michigan. And at Univision debate, anchor Jorge Ramos insisted that she and Sanders take a pledge on a legal immigrants.


JORGE RAMOS, UNIVISION DEBATE MODERATOR: If you really don't want to be the next deporter-in-chief, can you promise tonight that you won't deport children and that you won't deport immigrants who don't have a criminal record but again yes or no? Can you promise tonight that you won't deport children -- children who are already here?

CLINTON: I will not deport children. I would not deport children. I do not want to deport family members either, Jorge.


KURTZ: We're back with the panel, Heidi Przybyla, what do you think the way Jorge Ramos pressed the candidates essentially to agree not to deport anybody except those with criminal records, is that the role of a journalist or an advocate?

PRZYBYLA: What we found was a journalist crossing over from being a journalist who is trying to get an answer to his question to someone who is advocating to try and get a commitment from the candidate, and you know, he was so caught up in that fervor that he actually missed the fact that she parsed her answer quite well. Even though in the end, she said I will not deport children, she's almost bludgeoned into saying that...


PRZYBYLA: ...she got that clear distinction between children who are coming to the border...

KURTZ: Right.

PRZYBYLA: ...and those who are already here.

KURTZ: And Sanders was in the same position. There was never mention in this debate, this Univision debate, that a lot of people are breaking the law by coming here or that there are people or lots of people in this country who opposed to illegal immigration, so was this, you know, an attempt to pond it to the Latino audience?

ANDERSON: Well, certainly, I mean we're in the middle of a democratic Primary so you want to speak to Democratic Primary voters. And when you take a look at exit poll after exit poll after exit poll, Hillary Clinton tends to do particularly well among Democratic voters who are not white.

So, I think it is very important for her to make sure that she's got her base shored up because Bernie Sanders continues to pose a threat to her in race after race after race. I still think ultimately she's going to be the nominee but she certainly feels that heat coming from her left.

KURTZ: Now Jorge Ramos, who had that confrontation with Trump where he got thrown out and he came back, he did ask Hillary Clinton a tough question about her email, was it fair to say will you dropout if you're indicted?



TOMASKY: I think it's probably fair. I mean, yes, there is this investigation, we don't actually know that it's an investigation of her, we don't know exactly what the investigation is of because they won't say but, you know, that's not an unfair question. That's just something that people are talking about.

PRZYBYLA: That will be drastic -- that will be drastic, I think he gets points for that.

KURTZ: OK. I mention Michigan and no one in our business thought that Bernie Sanders is going to beat Hillary in such a big state. The polls were off by an average of about 20 points. You are a polling expert, what happened and are the media too dependent on these polls?

ANDERSON: The media is incredibly dependent on polls because it shapes our expectations in so many cases, this is about do you exceed expectations or fail compared to expectations.

When you are talk about Marco Rubio sort of getting a little bit of a pass, you know, in those cases well he is exceeding expectations, that counts as a win. In this case, what happened on the Democratic side, we still don't know.

Is it that they got their sample wrong, is it that they did their waiting wrong? Is it that Democratic voters tend to be harder to poll because they're less likely to have landlines that could be a piece of it, lots of different reasons why those polls get up?

KURTZ: Just recently Michael you wrote a column, "eating crow," or saying there was no way Bernie Sanders is going to win Michigan.

TOMASKY: I did and you know I was wrong. I've got it wrong. I thought, you know, there's no evidence that he can win one of this big diverse state and I was wrong so I said I was wrong.

KURTZ: I didn't think so either.


KURTZ: So, just to come back to the Trump interviewing, you heard him at the end there talk about what he sees as personal hatred by his commentators for him, they don't know me and this was on the right and the left. What do you think of that answer?

PRZYBYLA: I think it's a dissect to media industry because there is no doubt that in terms of the columnists who are on either side of the ideological spectrum, there is a lot of anti-Trump. They don't like Trump, they write a lot of negative columns.

But that is completely over washed and balanced out by the fact that he gets so much network coverage. And look at the numbers, 69 interviews in the past 69 days, Howie, and you know, we had -- so the perfect example was this week, we had an epic upset (ph) going on in Michigan.

And none of the networks could find it within themselves to cut away from what essentially was a Trump infomercial, in extended 45-minute news conference, or he's like promoting his stake. And here Hillary Clinton is on...

KURTZ: Right.

PRZYBYLA: these other candidates.

KURTZ: OK. But just briefly, when he does interviews, he's taking questions from journalists. It's not the same as just covering his rallies and I like when candidates take questions from journalists. I think that's not necessarily a free pass, your thought?

ANDERSON: Yes. I think to the extent that he is a candidate who want to be accessible, that's going to lead to a lot more coverage for sure and there are certainly more -- other candidates who want to be more closed off. But in the case of his rally, when he was sort of hawking his stakes, that's not an interview.


KURTZ: All right, I won't put down as Trump stakes customers, Michael Tomasky, Kristen Soltis Anderson, Heidi Przybyla thanks very much for joining us this Sunday.

After the break, how Facebook and Twitter played key roles in channeling the animosity that led to the disruption of Donald Trump's Chicago rally. And later, why that Erin Andrews nude video never goes away.


KURTZ: When Donald Trump's Chicago rally turned dangerous on Friday night, social media played a key role in organizing and then channeling the anger of that moment. Joining us now Shana Glenzer, Technology Executive and commentator here in Washington, so what role did Facebook play in sort of galvanizing this protest?

SHANA GLENZER, TECHNOLOGY ANALYST: Right, so Facebook has become a really powerful tool for organizing political campaigns and events and, you know, it's easy to use and it has the potential to go viral very quickly, what we saw with the strap -- Stop Trump Chicago page created...

KURTZ: There it is.

GLENZER: ...created a page called Trump Rally Protest and that was the organizing force behind the events that happened on Friday and it was created just a week prior.

KURTZ: Just a week ago, post it up on Facebook and about 11,000 people responded...

GLENZER: ...11,000 people and they came out in force on Friday which we saw covered broadly.

KURTZ: As I was watching the coverage on Friday night, Twitter just exploded with all kind of anger on both sides. You've been looking on some tweets, what did you got?

GLENZER: Yes, I saw some tweets on Friday and so -- one is from Rachel, "so protesters are called dangerous but the racist xenophobic misogynistic man they're protesting against isn't?" And then Isaac on the other side said, "It's sad when a bunch of liberals protest our frontrunner because they know theirs is going to prison."

KURTZ: And I saw a couple Eric, "the neofascist left calls Trump a racist and then sends organized thugs to stop political speech. And Jorge, the media is responsible for this crap, they've been promoting the fascist clown for too long now." So, what do you make of this level of betrayal (ph)?

GLENZER: Yes, it certainly, there is a lot of hatred that's being spotted on Twitter and we saw it, you know, organized on Friday night around these protests and a lot of words like thugs.


GLENZER: know it does. Do I like it? No. Does it make me angry at times? Yes. But I think that they're -- I've seen how important Twitter is, many Americans, to allow them to voice opinions if they don't feel that they can voice on the other platform.

KURTZ: I love Twitter. It's democracy in action. You no longer need a printing press to be heard, that's all great. But this kind of also serving as an echo chamber for anger and accusations and charges of racism and I find that kind of depressing.

GLENZER: Again, I don't disagree with you...

KURTZ: Right.

GLENZER: ...but I do think that, as you know, the fact that that there is a place where people can become a part of a conversation, can share their views whether they're happy -- very happy about the candidate...

KURTZ: Right.

GLENZER: ...or really angry about something they can share that with others.

KURTZ: Even if they're shouting really loud...

GLENZER: Even if they're shouting really, really loudly they can share it and it has a place and it makes them feel part of a conversation.

KURTZ: Do you think maybe there is a constructive side to this because I mean, you know, everybody knows not just in the context of Donald Trump on the presidential campaign that's really can be an ugly neighborhood also a beautiful neighborhood, but is there a way in which it's a kind of a safety valve for people who have these strong emotions whether it pro-Trump or anti-Trump both demonstrators anti-thugs as some call rather than venting it into some socially acceptable way?

GLENZER: Yes, I mean I think that we can all probably be a little bit grateful to Twitter that we are not having to hear of many things in person than when we're out and about or, you know, at a bar people are sharing it on Twitter instead.

KURTZ: Is there an anonymous aspect to this because a lot of people don't use, they use these screen names so that they can say whatever...

GLENZER:'s certainly a lot more anonymous unlike on Facebook where your friends and your family members are there and so they have the anonymity to say what they want to on Twitter.

KURTZ: Right, thanks Shana, stick around. Still to come, Erin Andrews has relived a horrifying ordeal during a trial over that nude hotel video but does that justify a $55 million jury verdict?


KURTZ: It was during our program last Sunday that we got the tragic news.

It's the Fox News Live, we have some sad news to report, Nancy Reagan has died. The former first lady was 94 years old.

Tom Brokaw and Diane Sawyer delivered tributes at Nancy Reagan's funeral on Friday with other prominent media figures there to pay their respects.


DIANE SAWYER, AMERICAN TELEVISION JOURNALIST: Make no mistake, she would bop journalists, and I mean bop any journalist in this room, and we know this if she didn't like a report you had done.


KURTZ: Nancy Reagan got some rough coverage when her husband was president but in the end she won the respect of journalists and in some cases their friendship.


KURTZ: The Erin Andrews ordeals very much back in the news, the sports caster now with Fox News filed fired suit against the National Marriott over a creep who later went to jail providing him access to adjacent hotel room where he shot a video of her undressing. The jury this week awarding Andrews $55 million in the lawsuit after testimony that just was heart wrenching.

ERIN ANDREWS, AMERICAN SPORTSCASTER AND TELEVISION PERSONALITY: Screaming, that I was naked all over the internet and I didn't know what it was. And my dad was like he thought I had been in a car accident. He said, why are you screaming? I was like, Dad I'm naked all over the internet and I don't know what it is and I don't know where I am.

KURTZ: And then there was all the media coverage.

ANDREWS: I saw it in the "New York Post" the scandal, the Fox News and CBS everybody put up that I was doing it for publicity and attention and that ripped me apart.

KURTZ: Now you might think this is ancient history but not to Andrews.

ANDREWS: This happens every day of my life, either I get a tweet or somebody makes a comment in the paper or somebody sends me a still of the video to my Twitter, someone created that that means I'm right back to this. I feel so embarrassed and I'm so ashamed.


KURTZ: Marriott's defence was that the nude video didn't hurt her career, implying perhaps that it even helped her. Now, $55 million sounds wildly excessive and she'll never see half of it, that's supposed to come from our stalker but the verdict say an unmistakable message about invasion of privacy even if you're a celebrity. Shana?

GLENZER: Yes, I have been watching, this was infuriating and scary at times, and you know, by having the guts to pursue this in court Erin Andrews' naked video was once again a top Google search last week, so this will live on forever on the web.

KURTZ: So, this happened seven years ago that it surfaced and she brought it back in the news. And when she went -- filed the suit, she knew that everybody would then be searching for it again.

GLENZER: She knew and they did last week top Google search.

KURTZ: Yes, so it's -- the taking (ph) just simply don't go away...



GLENZER: ...they will live on from the web like she said every day it's coming out on the net and she's getting still shots sent through twitter, it's horrible.

KURTZ: Shana Glenzer thanks.

Well, that's it for this edition of "MediaBuzz." I'm Howard Kurtz. We hope you like our Facebook page. We post a lot of original content there, we'll respond to your questions,

Stick to the media, to be part of our Your Buzz segment, DVRs if you missed the show and we're back here next Sunday as always, 11 and 5 o'clock Eastern. So, see you then with the latest Buzz.

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