Rubio: We shouldn't focus on a ban that will never happen
Presidential hopeful talks protecting against terror threats, responds to his critics on 'The Kelly File'
This is a rush transcript from "The Kelly File," December 9, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
MEGYN KELLY, HOST: Breaking tonight, stunning new information on the killers who terrorized America. As the director of the NBI admits today that the U.S. failed to detect some major warning signs. That could have tipped us to the deadliest attack on U.S. soil since 9/11.
Welcome to "The Kelly File" everyone, I'm Megyn Kelly. Today marks exactly one week since the attacks in San Bernardino. And just hours ago, FBI Director James Comey told the Senate Judiciary Committee that the pair of murderers had been talking about terror for at least two years before going through with their bloody plan. That means that when Syed Farook and Tashfeen Malik cleared this immigration checkpoint, right here back in 2014, they were already bent on Jihad and were prepared to die for their cause.
So was this couple among the hundreds of Americans under FBI surveillance for possibly supporting ISIS? No. And did our immigration screeners raise any kind of alarms when this woman who had been attending a radical mosque, whose family had extremist ties, who falsified her immigration form with a fake address, did they raise any concerns? Not one. So when the FBI today had an answer to the Senate Judiciary, the director painted a troubling picture.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JAMES COMEY, FBI DIRECTOR: The FBI has a very broad array of responsibilities to address a staggering array of threats that face our country, in terrorism, in counterintelligence and criminal matters.
In San Bernardino, we saw last week a different dimension of the threat, which is the homegrown violent extremist, radicalizing in place in order to kill innocent people on behalf after foreign terrorist organization.
San Bernardino involved two killers who were radicalized for quite a long time before their attack, as early as the end of 2013, they were talking to each other about Jihad and martyrdom before they became engaged, and then married, and lived together in the United States. We are working very hard to understand exactly their association and the source of their inspiration. We're also working very hard to understand whether or there was anybody else involved with assisting them, with supporting them, with equipping them. You pay us to do counterterrorism. We are not perfect. We are good at this. We cannot allow ourselves to be paralyzed by what these people are hoping to achieve. That's what I hope the American people will take from the unsettling experience of watching what goes on in San Bernardino and Paris.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Our chief intelligence correspondent Catherine Herridge has more from Washington. Catherine?
CATHERINE HERRIDGE, FOX NEWS CHIEF INTELLIGENCE CORRESPONDENT: Megyn, this is a groundbreaking testimony. For the first time, a senior law enforcement officer has publicly confirmed that the couple were radicalized even before they met each other, leading a senior Republican to question whether ISIS or al Qaeda played matchmaker.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM, R-S.C., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Is there any evidence that this marriage was arranged by a terrorist organization or terrorist operative? Or was it just a meeting on the internet?
COMEY: I don't know the answer to that yet.
GRAHAM: Do you agree with me that if it was arranged bay terrorist operative of an organization, that is a game-changer?
COMEY: It would be a very, very important thing to know. That's why we are working so hard to understand it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HERRIDGE: An inscription Director Comey said, criminals and terrorists are using this technology in greater numbers and with the even more success. On the ISIS inspired plot in Garland, Texas last May, where two shooters tried to take out a Prophet Mohammed cartoon drawing contest. The FBI director said, the suspect went dark, sending 109 messages, that remain secret to this day.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COMEY: Our ability to monitor them has not kept pace. In fact, it is going in the wrong direction. So, our ability to find people hiding in the United States looking to do bad things to root out all kinds of organized criminal factors is steadily being impaired. That's the problem.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HERRIDGE: Also on Capitol Hill, new scrutiny of the K-1 fiancee visa used by Tashfeen Malik to enter the U.S. allegations that the address in Pakistan had been fake. And whether she somehow bypassed the required interview by a State Department officer. Director Comey's testimony leads no doubt today that the visa screening process including two rounds of criminal and national security background checks failed and that Farook had been in contact with terrorism suspect the FBI was tracking, it was not enough to open an independent FBI investigation of the 28-year-old -- Megyn.
KELLY: Catherine, thank you.
HERRIDGE: You're welcome.
KELLY: And while Director Comey seems to be concerned with the government's ability to keep Americans safe, Attorney General Loretta Lynch, who was his boss, seems focused on downplaying any larger threat to the country. Telling an audience in London today that quote, "At this point in time, we do be have an indication that these two people were part after larger cell."
James Kallstrom is a former FBI assistant director in charge and a former senior adviser to the New York governor for counterterrorism in the years following September 11th. Jim, good to see you, glad to have you back again.
JAMES KALLSTROM, FORMER COUNTERTERROR ADVISOR TO NEW YORK GOVERNOR: Nice to be here.
KELLY: Why would she say that?
KALLSTROM: I don't know. I don't know. I know she is a U.S. attorney. She's a great lady. And maybe between here and Washington, you know, part of your mind falls apart or something. I don't understand it. You know, what does it do for anybody? To even make that claim at this point. You know, we don't know what happened, but still, the results are what the results are.
KELLY: Right. And it would be nice to know. But do we really care whether ISIS called them up and told them to do it?
KALLSTROM: No. We don't care if they listened to it on the internet or someone talked to them about at this point. The FBI cares because there might be other people involved with this particular conspiracy.
KELLY: Uh-hm.
KALLSTROM: But you know, I don't know where we are all tangled up in the semantics. You know, it is like gymnastics, you know, I don't understand.
KELLY: Yes. So, it is like enforce it when they refused to acknowledge it as terrorism until recently --
KALLSTROM: Yes.
KELLY: Because they couldn't find a direct correspondents between the shooter there, and Awlaki, oh, wait, there was one. And even then they wouldn't call it terror.
KALLSTROM: Yes.
KELLY: The notion that Lindsey Graham raised whether this was an arranged situation, it always struck me as odd that some radicalized woman over, you know, from Pakistan living in Saudi Arabia goes on some Muslim internet dating site to find some American with whom she has no connection, she never dated men, didn't show her face, she wasn't getting photographed. It doesn't pass the smell test.
KALLSTROM: No, it doesn't. And I'm sure there's many things that are arranged. Vis-a-vis marriages. Or just transportation in here.
KELLY: And we missed it.
KALLSTROM: Yes. Yes. Well, you know, we have talked for months now, you and I, about the fact the FBI just doesn't have the resources to -- you know, there are a thousand investigations. Megyn, that could be 4,000, 5,000 people. I mean, that's just -- it is Herculean task -- what they have they're doing a great job.
KELLY: Right.
KALLSTROM: So maybe that was prioritize --
KELLY: But they aren't even the ones who are doing this investigation when somebody tries to come in --
KALLSTROM: No, that's right. And the State Department -- I'm sure they're under mend also but that is such a cursory thing they are doing. I mean, are you a terrorist? Yes or no. You know, I mean, it is just bs. It is ridiculous.
KELLY: Uh-hm.
KALLSTROM: You know, and that's why we said, you know, we've got to really look at these people that are coming in here. We owe that to the citizens of this country. To protect them. We don't know anything about these people. And this multilayered, you know, so-called program we have is nonsense.
KELLY: Now you hear the director of the FBI in the wake of the worst terrorist attack on U.S. soil we've seen since 9/11 say, he is on the record saying, Jim, our ability to monitor these people is going in the wrong direction. It is being steadily impaired.
KALLSTROM: Yes. I wish those, Erin -- you know, I wish the people in the government including Director Comey would have those hearings behind closed doors. I mean, why are we talking about the things that are impairing us? Why are we talking about the things that, you know, we want to direct more people in a certain areas? Why do we do this?
KELLY: But he is trying to pressure people presumably.
KALLSTROM: I know he is trying to pressure people, but he needs to --
KELLY: To get the President to do the right thing.
KALLSTROM: Well, all of these people need to come together. Stop all the bs. Stop all the politics. Come together and deal with the issue. Deal with these resource -- deal with these technology issues. These are big time issues. Get the National Security Agency back in here protecting the public.
KELLY: The NSA.
KALLSTROM: Please, you know, I mean, I'm very concerned about the fact that that's not there now. And regardless of what some of our good friends on this network say, you know, it is very, very important. And you know, the FBI director needs some support. Needs to have some hearings with the people that run the Congress and run the White House. And thank God for the task force. Because that's a little bit of a, you know, double resources, but still at that, I think they ought to bring back retired guys. I think they ought to do things like that right now.
KELLY: It's all hands on deck.
KALLSTROM: Yes, it's all hands on deck.
KELLY: As you hear warnings like that, about the radicalization in place and our abilities going in the wrong direction. Jim, thank you.
KALLSTROM: Yes ma'am.
KELLY: Well, "The Kelly File" has confirmed tonight that terrorist Syed Farook's job as a health inspector took him inside many schools in the area to conduct safety inspections. Think about that. This guy was going into the schools to make sure they were safe. In the months leading up to his terrorist attack. Wait until you hear what was done just now to make sure the kids are safe.
Plus, we'll ask former al Qaeda operative turned CIA double agent Morton Storm just how concerned people should be about Syed Farook's ability to fly under the radar and reports that this couple was communicating with like-minded individuals in the Los Angeles area.
And then, the top man in the U.S. Intelligence community revealed that the terrorists are trying to get into the United States by posing as Syrian refugees. Remember we were told that wasn't the case. President Obama said it is just widows and orphans trying to get in.
Republican presidential candidate Senator Marco Rubio is here on the Intel reports that he got to look at.
And then with events in California turning the nation's attention to security, will this hurt Hillary Clinton and the Democrats in 2016?
Dana Perino and Chris Stirewalt are here on that. Don't go away.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Breaking tonight, we are learning chilling new details about terrorist Syed Farook and his movements in the months leading up to this attack. It turns out he actually visited dozens of schools and restaurants in the area to conduct safety inspections. That was his job. "The Kelly File" obtaining this image courtesy of the San Bernardino Sun, actually showing Farook on the job in a local restaurant. The idea that this guy was so close to food supplies and children is raising serious concerns tonight. In fact, "The Kelly File" has confirmed one school district even brought in a bomb-sniffing dog after the attack it make sure everything at the school was okay.
Adam Housley reports tonight from San Bernardino, California. Adam?
ADAM HOUSLEY, FOX NEWS SENIOR CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Megyn, not only are a lot of schools reacting of course to the news that he may have been in their cafeterias or in their work stations where food was prepared. But also a lot of businesses, restaurants, as you might imagine, all reacting to that affect. One report we have -- to give you a look at three different reports from just some of the many schools that Syed visited. We have been told that at least several schools have taken posted notes believe it or not and put it over his signature. Because when you post one of these reports in a cafeteria, for example, it has to be seen by others and his signature would normally be seen by others if not covered by some of the these post-it notes.
It comes on a day that Fox News is also learning a lot of new information about Syed and his wife. We're reported yesterday he was radicalized. Now we are hearing more and more why they feel they're both radicalized well before they ever knew each other. Fox News is now learning exclusively that authorities do believe that the dating website that they supposedly met on was very likely a cover. This investigation not only expanding here locally, Megyn, but also around the globe. Specifically in Pakistan. Looking very closely at her family there, looking very closely at the communications.
They are even going through a lot of the electronic changes in potentially their bank accounts and if that has anything to do, anything suspicious. So, as you can tell, Megyn, a lot of information coming out tonight and probably the big headline for us is that people here locally are looking at him and in fact he inspected their food but also the fact that the whole idea that they met on a dating website may be another potential cover and the family may not be telling the total truth here -- Megyn.
KELLY: Uh-hm. There is much more to the story. Adam, thank you.
Joining me now, Morten Storm, a former CIA double-agent who infiltrated al Qaeda. He is now a terrorism consultant for the International Spy Museum and co-author of "Agent Storm: My Life Inside Al Qaeda and the CIA." Morten, thank you very much for being here. So, now we know this terrorist got hired by the county government and became health inspector who was going into our schools, our restaurants, as his wife was studying pharmacology so she could be up close and personal with our medications. Does this surprise you?
MORTEN STORM, FORMER CIA DOUBLE AGENT INSIDE AL QAEDA: No. It's just confirmed that these terrorist doesn't necessarily have to come from a very, you know, criminal background or very low levels of society. And it confirms that they actually are from all over societies, rich and poor. Educated and uneducated. And so, and I know that many of those who have joined ISIS, you know from the U.S. are very well educated people. People in IT and some are doctors and some are very good skilled, you know, mechanics, and so on. So it does not surprise me.
KELLY: Do you believe, as our reporter Adam Housley just suggested, this dating website may have just been a sham, that it may have been a cover. And that as Lindsey Graham suggested, Senator Lindsey Graham suggested today, this whole thing may have been orchestrated by a terrorist group.
STORM: Well, I think that they are inspired by a terrorist organization and maybe in Yemen or maybe ISIS. But I think that the reason themselves for doing what they did in America and, what can I say, as for those websites, you know, where they have dating websites, and there are loads of them in the Muslim, you know, I found my first Moroccan wife in a Muslim website for dating, for marriage. And you know, there is a lot of groupies, like Jihadi girls, who are like groupies and would be searching out for these, you know, Jihadi wannabes, the men.
KELLY: It's not hard to do. Do you believe, because the FBI is now confirming, that they believe that these guys were in touch with other extremists, although it didn't rise to the level that the FBI paid attention to it? I mean, do you, you know, you've been in these neighborhoods. What's your experience of it?
STORM: Well, as I've told you before in our interviews, of course, they have a network. And I was a hundred percent sure there were other people involved. And I think that we now can find more people, I have been told and I have read that he was in -- he was a convert and I think his name was Enrique Marquez or something like that, I'm not good at Spanish.
KELLY: Yes. We are looking at him tonight.
STORM: Yes. The one who actually handed him over -- and so I think, you know, by time we will discover that there is probably more people involved in this.
KELLY: We learn more every day. And Morten, thank you.
We're going to have a report on that in a moment. This accomplice now. Maybe accomplice. We're not sure. He certainly gave them the guns.
In the weeks in San Bernardino, there has been a big push for more gun control. But wait until we show you what we found at some gun stores.
Plus, the top man in U.S. Intelligence today revealing that these terrorists are trying to get into the United States by posing as Syrian refugees. A far cry from President Obama's claims that we were just dealing with widows and orphans coming from Syria. Republican presidential candidate Senator Marco Rubio has new details on that, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Breaking tonight, sobering new intelligence from the highest levels of the U.S. government indicating that terrorists are indeed actively trying to enter the United States by posing as Syrian refugees. Just hours ago, Mike McCall, the chairman of the House Homeland Security Committee revealing that the director of National Intelligence James Clapper, is saying that terrorists are specifically looking for opportunities to hide in the crowds trying to escape from Syria.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHAEL MCCAUL, R-TEXAS, HOUSE HOMELAND SECURITY COMMITTEE CHAIRMAN: The DNI sent me a letter the other day saying that there are individuals tied to terrorism in Syria who have actively tried to use the refugee program to get in the United States.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: A far cry from the way our president characterized the refugee situation just a couple of weeks ago.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: But apparently, they're scared of widows and orphans coming into the United States of America as part of our tradition of compassion.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: Joining me now, Republican presidential candidate Senator Marco Rubio. Senator, thank you for being here.
SEN. MARCO RUBIO, R-FLA., PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you.
KELLY: So it is not just widows and orphans trying to get into the country as it turns out.
RUBIO: Well that statement you just played is baffling to me. I'm on the U.S. Senate Intelligence Committee. We have the same -- see the same intelligence the President does. And for him to say something like that really runs counter to information we know that he has. First of all, there is evidence that they've tried to use some of the trafficking networks in Mexico to send a lower cartel and others to traffic people that are coming with the profile of Syrian refugees. But it goes beyond that. They are also actively recruiting people that could fit the profile. Whether it's a doctor, student visa to enter the United States. Obviously, we saw them exploit a little provision in the visa to enter that killer that came in and a fiancee visa. And then on top of that, you have the threat there of homegrown violent extremist. So, they have grown increasingly sophisticated in their knowledge and ability to use the U.S. immigration system to put insert potential terrorism into this country or terrorists into this country.
KELLY: So, given that, why do you oppose Donald Trump's suggestion that we should ban all Muslim immigration?
RUBIO: Well, first of all, I don't believe it is constitutional to have a religious test on who we allow into the country. And so, if you take it to sort of extreme, the king of Jordan, who was an important ally on the war on terror, his son attends Georgetown University. He is Muslim. They would not be allowed to enter the country. Second, it's not going to happen. You know, we have sent the better part after week now reacting to this horrible tragedy and terrorist attack that occurred and suddenly all of the attention is focused on an idea that isn't going to happen. Let's focus on things we can actually achieve that would be effective.
KELLY: Let's talk about that.
RUBIO: Things like reforming our --
KELLY: Let's talk about that. Last night on Hannity --
RUBIO: Yes.
KELLY: You were saying, one of the things -- one of the many things, we have to worry about is homegrown extremists, like we saw in the mail terrorist out in California. That's a toughy. I mean, how -- how do we get the NSA program didn't pick up on this guy. He was radicalized on- line, from the look of it. How? How do we get guys like that?
RUBIO: Well, we need to get our authorities that we used to have backs so you can play in a more complete picture of individuals and who else they're talking to and coordinating with. We know that they were radicalized as far back as 2013. So, we need that full information. We're going to have to deal with. And then we haven't yet kind of reconciled how to do this, but encrypted communication, is now a way the terrorists are communicating. In fact, it is available to all-Americans. And on the one hand, it protects you from identity theft and things of this nature but on the other hand is allowing terrorists to communicate in a way we never have access to.
So, we're going to deal with that as well. I actually believe that across this country there are Muslim communities that are not radicalized that are moderate and we're going to need their help and support as well in identifying people that are potentially being radicalized. They need to become bigger participants in this effort to root out what is happening on across this country. I mean, it is a multi-faceted problem, it's a threat unlike anything we have ever faced. And it will require a comprehensive approach. And that's why I hope we focus the next few weeks on as learning as much as we can about this attack and reacting base on what we learned from it.
KELLY: The last time you were on, you suggested that we will have to look at cafes, diners, any facilities you've said which we must close if they are inspiring radicals. That of course raises questions about First Amendment free speech and so on and even Debbie Wasserman Schultz tonight hit you for that comment. Your response?
RUBIO: Well, the bottom-line is, this is not -- my point was, that all of the talk at that time was about mosques. And my answer was, it is not just because of their mosques, it is not just mosques, it's any facility where radicalization is occurring. And that could be anywhere.
KELLY: But how could you shut down a restaurant where two radicals are sitting there talking about, you know, Mohammed and Jihad?
RUBIO: Yes. It is not about shutting them down, it is about surveilling them. It's about being able to have access to these facilities whether it is a mosque or a restaurant or people are being radicalized and being able to surveil them and identify into the -- within them. And learn about what is occurring. You know, the markers are pretty clear. You go to a mosque and if a mosque is handing out radicalized literature, if the preaching on Fridays after prayer is radicalized, that gives a pretty strong indicator that there are people attending that place.
KELLY: Senator, thank you.
RUBIO: Thank you.
KELLY: And breaking tonight. FBI Director Comey says his ability to keep us safe is quote, "Going in the wrong direction." Which may even have some of George W. Bush's critics missing him a little bit. Later, W's brother Jeb Bush joins us with more on how his brother kept us safe and what he will do if elected.
Plus, the country has suffered its worst terrorist attack since 9/11. Our intelligence community and our State Department missed it and failed to see the warning signs.
Up next, Dana Perino and Chris Stirewalt on what this means for Hillary Clinton who wants to continue President Obama's strategy.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: We cannot turn against one another by letting this fight be defined as a war between America and Islam. That, too, is what groups like ISIL want.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ROBERT GRAY, FOX NEWS CORRESPONDENT: This is a Fox News alert, I'm Robert Gray. Protesters taking it to the streets of Chicago tonight, they've been marching for several hours, clogging streets and blocking traffic. They're calling for the mayor's resignation. The march continues to protest and started with a court-ordered release of video last month. The video from October 2014, showing a white city cop shooting a black teenager, 16 times. The death of 17-year-old Laquan McDonald has four several investigations and the resignation of the city's police chief. And now there's is a pending civil rights investigation by the U.S. Justice Department. Mayor Rahm Emanuel delivered an emotional address, earlier today, stressing the need for better community policing. But that the city must confront what he calls the underlying challenges of family poverty, joblessness and hopelessness. I'm Robert Gray. Now back to The Kelly File.
ANNOUNCER: From the world headquarters of Fox News, it's The Kelly File with Megyn Kelly.
KELLY: If you are just joining us tonight, we're tracking a number of new developments on the San Bernardino terror attacks, including confirmation that this couple was plotting jihad well before the wife came to the United States. And new reports that this - - that the Islamic state terror group is specifically trying to sneak people into the United States by having them pose as Syrian refugees, contrary to President Obama's claims that the refugees are basically just widows and orphans. With stories like that, you would think republicans would have a good issue in their run for the White House in 2016. But instead, the GOP field seems to be spending most of its time defending against remarks made by Donald Trump. Chris Stirewalt is our Fox News digital politics editor and Dana Perino is a former White House press secretary for President George W. Bush and co-host of The Five. Thank you both for being here. Let me start with you Dana. So that's all we seen? That is always seen for 48 hours now is Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, and almost nothing about what we've seen is a massive intelligence failure here in the United States.
DANA PERINO, FORMER WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: Not holding the administration's feet to the fire and holding them accountable, or actually trying to get to the bottom of it to say, what did we miss, how does with we miss it, have the terrorist evolved and adapted to our sources and methods, so that we don't know where they are and what they are doing. But it does works, right. The only person that could Trump, Trump at this point was President Obama and a third of its kind Oval Office address on Sunday night at 43 million people to watch, and it was terrible. He had -- did not have confidence. He did not assure the American people that he had their best interest in mind, when it comes to terror. He might think that, but that's not how people felt. In addition, nobody knows what Hillary Clinton said about that speech because it was buried in the Trump coverage. She actually said, she agreed with it and wouldn't change a thing.
KELLY: She loved it.
PERINO: That would be worth noting.
KELLY: Chris, the republicans aren't talking about it. Even the republicans aren't talking about that because they are talking about Donald Trump.
CHRIS STIREWALT, FOX NEWS DIGITAL POLITICS EDITOR: As you rightly said councilor, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump.
KELLY: Loud and complete.
(CROSSTALK)
STIREWALT: Exactly. And so as Marco Rubio pointed out to you, when it -- so here is a guy who is on the -- this should be his moment, he and Ted Cruz are having their magic moment in their republican field. They're gaining points, they're catching up with Trump, there's still 10 points behind, but they are moving, and they're both focused on these issues. These are the things that the two of them are having substantive disagreement about on policy. This is their sweet spot. But guess what every interview ends up being about in some point or another. Are you trumping the Trump or does it Trump, Trump you and how do you fee, about all these stuff and on it goes. And so they are - they're hermetically sealed in a Trump-shaped box.
(LAUGHTER)
KELLY: It is true, Dana, and you watched these republicans trying to get out from under this. They can't do it. So the question is whether this is -- whether this is as we asked yesterday, based on that federalist piece, potentially doing generational harm to the Republican Party. I understand there are some within the republican base who like Trump's message, but there is a whole generation coming up right now, that hears his message a very different way.
PERINO: Well, if you look at, it is already going to be hard for a republican to win in 2016. At this point, Hillary Clinton is probably amassed 218, 240 of the 270 electoral votes that she needs, just if you look at the map. So you are Donald Trump, I don't see why he wouldn't try to have used this moment, rather to get attention for himself to get attention for the field, right? Because I think when you're.
KELLY: By going after the exaggeration.
PERINO: When you're that far ahead and you're that much in the lead, why not say, yeah, then tell us Obama and Hillary Clinton, what you would do differently and show people the rest of the Republican Party that you can follow, but I do think generationally, I guess, you know, we'll have see it. Anecdotally, I would suggest that yes, tolerance for young people is important. But they are a different sort when it comes to gun control than the baby boomers. They are actually more tolerant of people that want to own guns.
KELLY: Well that.
PERINO: We don't know exactly.
KELLY: But what experts are saying, Chris, is what the republican nominee, whoever it is, is going to have to do to win this election is they're gonna have to peel off a couple points from Hillary, if it is Hillary, with women.
STIREWALT: Oh, it is.
KELLY: Hispanics, with African-Americans, with young people. And I don't know if that is helping. I don't know if it is -- I don't know. I'm not an expert on this. But there is a question about whether Trump's comments are really gonna help him or whoever becomes the nominee in that regard. Moreover, these republicans continue to look completely senseless when it comes to how deal with it.
(LAUGHTER)
STIREWALT: But other than that, they are doing a totally great job.
(LAUGHTER)
STIREWALT: The reality is the democrats have lived down to the bad expectations that the electorate had about their handling of national security and foreign policy. A very accurate (ph) is distrustful of republicans on a several key issues, there is a weariness there. But on national security, that's a key element of the republican brand. George W. Bush didn't leave in great odor on the subject, but the republican brand through his presidency and before strong national defense, rigorous national security, kill the bad guys. That's big thing for republicans. Democrats have lived down to the bad expectations with those street terror attacks, it still room to the exploit, but only if they get out of the hermetically-shaped or the Trump-shaped hermetically box.
KELLY: There has no (inaudible) of commentary magazine coming out and saying, is he trying to help democrats? Every time the news cycle turns bad for them, Trump says something that distracts the attention from that, back to himself. And this week has been a great example of that -- great to see you both.
STIREWALT: You bet.
KELLY: We are learning a lot more tonight about the man who bought the weapons used in this bloody -- look at this picture, in this bloody terror attack and the tangled family ties that link him to this terror couple. This guy is in a whole lot of trouble tonight. We'll tell you about it.
Plus, in a week in San Bernardino, there has been a big push for more gun control, but wait until we show you what we found at some gun stores.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSH DEASER, CALIF. GUN STORE OWNER: We get a lot of new people. It is not like everybody that comes in has been a gun owner their whole life. I mean, we do a lot of first-time buyers and things like that. And I think people, you know, people are kind of like, OK, you know, I'm a little worried.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Breaking tonight, in the hours and days following the terrorists attack in San Bernardino, the question on many minds was did this terror couple, Syed Farook and Tashfeen Malik, act alone? New details emerging from California suggest the answer may be, no. Enrique Marquez, the man who purchased the assault rifles used to carry out this terror assault was a neighbor to this pair, and also tied to Syed Farook's family by marriage. And there are reports tonight that authorities may soon bring weapons charges against him. Moreover, we are learning tonight that Marquez, shortly after converting to Islam, might have been involved in a previous terror plot with Syed Farook in 2012. That he reportedly claims the pair abandoned, after becoming spooked by other terror investigations in the area. Marquez, according to reports, claims he knew nothing about the San Bernardino plot, but his relationship with Syed Farook has become a focal point of this investigation.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JEB BUSH, R-PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: In our fight against Islamic terrorism, we have to maintain our values and what he proposed -- if that's a proposition, is not a serious proposition at all. I've just laid out comprehensive plans to destroy ISIS, which would solve this problem, and deal with the refugee challenges. He's playing you guys like a fine Stradivarius violin. This is what he does. He is an expert at this, garnering attention.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KELLY: That was Governor Jeb Bush, slamming his competitor Donald Trump, after the republican frontrunner recently suggested banning all Muslims from entering the U.S. as a way it keep us safe from would-be terrorists. So what exactly is Governor Jeb Bush's plan to keep terrorism at bay? The former governor of Florida and republican candidate for president, Jeb Bush, joins me now. Governor, thank you so much for being here.
BUSH: Great to be with you, Megyn.
KELLY: So let me just start on the comment that you made there, "he's playing all you guys like a violin." It's basically what you said. I mean this -- do you believe this isn't an orchestrated campaign to get himself back into the headlines?
BUSH: Oh, of course. He wants to -- his tactic is to dominate the news, so that other people's voice can't be heard. And it's very effective, I mean, he's a master at it. No one has ever come close to mastering that art form like he has.
KELLY: Do you think he keeps things? What was the most outlandish thing I could say?
BUSH: Yeah, exactly.
KELLY: And not a serious proposal?
BUSH: Look, it's not a serious -- it's not a proposal, it is a sentiment to say it is way to fulfill people's deep anxiety and fear. People are legitimately scared. The president of the United States gives a speech on Sunday that was beyond uninspiring. The only animated part was gun control when we're under attack. We're at war, at least by our enemy, they think we are at war. We're trying to, you know, enforce a law enforcement operation on top of them, and they declared war on us. And so Trump is a master at this. But the simple fact is he doesn't have a plan. He's not serious. And he is jeopardizing our ability to create a strategy to take out ISIS. The way to deal with this problem isn't to ban Muslims coming into our country, it's to destroy ISIS. Plain and simple.
KELLY: So what about the immigration issue when it comes to some Muslims then, because now, we know that this female terrorist got in. She was already radicalized. She gets in on a marriage visa. And now we find out that there's been admission that some ISIS operatives are trying to use Syrian refugee crisis to get into the United States.
BUSH: Absolutely.
KELLY: That's why Americans are saying, wait, whoa. Maybe we do need to pause.
BUSH: Exactly. And I think we should pause. I don't think we should be.
KELLY: On Syrian refugees.
BUSH: Exactly. And we should pause and make sure, like our visa waiver program. We have European countries, citizens, who could be radicalized. They could have easy access to our country. We have to adapt to our policies to the fact that we are at war. There is nothing wrong with that. But then they have a blanket indictment for a billion people. Is that really a serious plan? All Indonesians are not allowed in our country? Canadians that happened to be Muslim aren't allowed into our country? Then it's ridiculous. And it sends such a killing signal to our allies that we are no longer serious. How do you expect an ally, which we need, we need to build an alliance. We can't do this our ourselves, to take out ISIS. How are they going to do it if they believe Donald Trump can be president? I don't think he will be, but it sends a pretty powerful signal. I mean, Prime Minister Netanyahu, today said that it's not a serious idea. There hasn't been a single leader in the world that suggests that's the right approach.
KELLY: Well it's amazing to see foreign leaders speaking out about the proposal of one presidential candidate. He's not even the president, he's a candidate. I want to move on from that because I want to ask you about your plan today. And you tell me whether I'm wrong. To me, it looks a lot like former George W Bush's plan when it comes to intelligence and surveillance to keep the country safe.
BUSH: Yeah, absolutely. After 9/11, I think he built an infrastructure to protect us. And this president has reversed those things. Not just the Patriot Act.
KELLY: What percentages of it do you -- would say has been dismantled by this president?
BUSH: Well, it's the tactics of intelligence gathering that has been restricted.
KELLY: CIA black sides and the interrogations there.
BUSH: That has definitely, that's definitely changed. And that might not be necessarily a bad thing. The times have changed, but.
KELLY: The NSA surveillance.
BUSH: That changed. And then -- and then thirdly, that people have civil liberties outside or terrorists effectively diversion -- aversion of civil liberties. That they -- you have to have compelling proof to be able to surveil outside the country. These are memorandums that have been designed by the White House on top of our intelligence community, and top of our military community that puts hands tied behind their back.
KELLY: But what about those who say, if the NSA program had been in place -- it was in place, out in California.
BUSH: Yeah.
KELLY: For years, while these two were up there harboring, you know, their plans. And it didn't protect them.
BUSH: Well, this is not the -- this is, that misunderstands what the metadata program is. It is a data base from which you can identify the possibilities of attack. If you eliminate that, then you're never going to be able to get to the needle in the haystack. By eliminating the haystack, how are you going to find those cases? I think we need to use every tool. There is not any evidence that there's been a violation of civil liberties. Look, we're at war. These people want it destroy our way of life. We look out behind you and you see New York. Even -- in spite of the great law enforcement efforts and intelligence efforts that take place in this city. It is vulnerable to attack and everybody knows it now. And this president hasn't led. Hillary Clinton hasn't offered anything different. And Donald Trump is mirroring what they believe.
KELLY: Governor Jeb Bush, thank you.
BUSH: You bet.
KELLY: Up next, startling gun sale statistics in the United States, in the wake of the San Bernardino terror attack. Dana Loesch and Robert Zimmerman are here on that.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: Within minutes of the San Bernardino attack, we saw lawmakers and journalists pushing gun control. Yet, local gun shops in the blue state of California are actually reporting very long lines. There has also been a significant uptick in the number of requests for gun background checks across the nation and how -- wait till you hear the numbers. Joining us now with more Dana Loesch, host of Dana on TheBlaze TV and talk radio host, and Robert Zimmerman, a democratic national committee member from New York, Clinton donor and co-founder of Zimmerman-Edelson public relations. Good to see you both.
ROBERT ZIMMERMAN, DNC COMMITTEE MEMBER FROM NEW YORK: Good to be with you.
DANA LOESCH, HOST OF DANA ON THE: Thank you, Megyn.
KELLY: So the numbers are pretty staggering. Black Friday, the FBI said it processed 185,000 plus gun background checks, most recorded on a single day. This is not the right graphic. In November, the FBI had one of the highest months on record for background checks. And on it goes, including, as I said, Robert, in California. Why?
ZIMMERMAN: Well, Megyn, that doesn't concern me at all, the fact is.
KELLY: I didn't ask if it concerns you. Why do you think it is?
ZIMMERMAN: Well, obviously Megyn, when you have a situation we were facing, the first primarily concerns throughout the world. People want to protect themselves and that's fine. The issue is not whether people buy guns. The issue is watching a republican congress and right-wing allowed terror suspects to buy and collect firearms. The issue is watching a republican congress weaken the background checks. That's the concern that should galvanize all of us. And in fact, according to Mike Luntz, a republican poster, 80 percent of all people, of all citizens and 74 percent of gun owners want to see stronger background checks, contrary what the NRA is trying to do.
KELLY: They may say that, but those same seems Americans seem to be rushing to the gun stores right now, Dana.
DANA LOESCH, Yeah, well, I have to wonder if Robert has ever even purchased a firearm. Look, Megyn, the president told everyone, Josh Earnest told everyone, go home for thanksgiving and talk about gun control. And look what happened, sales went through the roof that Friday. And now it's not republicans that are trying to keep terrorists into guns. Look, when you purchase a firearm, you already checked the terror watch list. It pings that watchlist, it pings everything. If some is a terrorist, they are going to be denied, plain and simple.
ZIMMERMAN: Not true. If you're a terrorist's suspect, that's not the case Dana.
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: Hold on. I give you the floor in a second. Go ahead Dana, sorry, finish.
LOESCH: You have to bring federal charges against someone. If they are, if you want to render a suspected terrorist to be prohibited possessor, you have to bring charges, the evidence ahs to either convict them or exonerate them. Just merely suspicion.
ZIMMERMAN: You're ducking the issue, Dana.
KELLY: OK, Go ahead, Robert.
ZIMMERMAN: Here's the deal, if you are on a terrorists -- if you want a terror watch list or if you're on a no-fly list, you are allowed because of the republican congress to buy and collect firearms. And I wish the.
(CROSSTALK)
ZIMMERMAN: Republicans would show the courage they show in standing up to Syrian children, trying to come here for safety. I wish they'd show that same courage in standing up to ISIS.
KELLY: Don't say that because we just spent an hour talking about how DNI Clapper is confirming that ISIS is in fact trying to infiltrates the refugees to get.
(CROSSTALK)
ZIMMERMAN: And the points that we used Megyn, and the points that we're making, where is that courage when standing up to the NRA?
KELLY: OK, that's fine. You can make that point. But Dana, what's about that? Because that's something the president made a big issue out of.
LOESCH: Yes.
KELLY: This sounds bad, that you got a terrorist on a no-fly list that can get guns. You're -- speak to that.
LOESCH: Yeah. Well, my question is well then, if they are, if they think that they're terrorists that are so dangerous out there that they can't purchase firearms, why aren't they charging them? Keep in mind, Megyn, there is thousands of innocent.
KELLY: Well, you know, and sometimes it's just suspicion, but you can't actually charge.
(CROSSTALK)
LOESCH: But innocent-Americans. We have innocent-Americans on this list. There have been 2-year-olds, 8-year-olds. My uncle was on this list.
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: Why shouldn't they have to wait to get a gun, just so we can make the terrorists don't get one.
(CROSSTALK)
LOESCH: They already ping the list. Whenever you.
ZIMMERMAN: You know, Dana, you aren't worried about the civil liberty of terror suspects.
(CROSSTALK)
KELLY: Last question. Look at now it's time for the chart that we put up too early. Look, Robert, look at the gun sales during the Obama era.
ZIMMERMAN: Right, right.
KELLY: Beginning 2010, look at surge. Whatever he's doing and saying isn't working.
ZIMMERMAN: It's not about that, Megyn. And very frankly, everyone has the right to get a gun legally. That's not even the question. The question simply is what are we gonna see? The republican show, the courage to stand up, to make sure that.
(CROSSTALK)
ZIMMERMAN: Americans have done safely, and we can put aggressive background checks in place.
LOESCH: Bring charges.
KELLY: We've accomplished nothing. But it was nice to see you both.
(LAUGHTER)
LOESCH: Thank you, Megyn.
KELLY: Thank you.
ZIMMERMAN: Good to be with you, Merry Christmas.
KELLY: We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
KELLY: So will anything be done about Director Comey's testimony today, that his ability to detect these terrorists has been impaired? Facebook.com/thekellyfile, on Twitter @megynkelly, with your thoughts, thanks for watching everyone. I'm Megyn Kelly. This is "The Kelly File."
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