More signals that Biden is edging toward White House run?

Buzz building for Biden bid


This is a rush transcript from "The Five," August 25, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Kimberly Guilfoyle along with Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, Dana Perino and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

This spring, President Obama had some nice words to say about Hillary Clinton.


PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: She was an outstanding secretary of state. She is my friend. I think she would be an excellent president.


GUILFOYLE: But during a lunch yesterday with Joe Biden, the president reportedly gave the vice president his blessing to run against her. At the same time, his spokesman heaped a slew of praise on Biden at the briefing.


JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: There is probably no one in American politics today who has a better understanding of exactly what is required to mount a successful national presidential campaign.


GUILFOYLE: Charles Krauthammer thinks it's evident which one Obama would likely endorse out of the two.


CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER, FOX NEWS CONTRIBUTOR: That was a pretty broad hint from Josh Earnest that the president is tilting towards Biden. He says, I can't think of anyone else in the country, anyone else like Hillary, who could run a better campaign. Since 1988, Reagan handing over the torch to vice president Bush which is exactly what this scenario would be. Who would be the best person he would like to entrust with his legacy. The liberals have a vision of a 12-year rule. It would work perfectly for them.


GUILFOYLE: And here is a visionary, Charles Krauthammer. Dana, you and I are always agreeing with him.


GUILFOYLE: Absolutely.

PERINO: And we're going to run away with him at some point.

GUILFOYLE: At the same time.

PERINO: Well, of course. This is one of the best and most fun developments of the election cycle for sure. I was also a little taken aback yesterday when Josh Earnest from the White House podium, basically said, "I wouldn't rule out an endorsement from the president of the united states in the primary." And also that the information coming out of a private lunch between the president and the vice president, actually so explicitly makes its way into a news report out of CNN says to me that the president definitely gave his blessing. Now, could it have been an encouragement like I would like you to run? I doubt it. I think that Biden probably came to him and said give us a lot of thought. I thought it through. I see a path. I'm concerned about her. I want to make sure that we solidify this legacy for the great eight years that you've had so far as president. And so I'm asking you for your blessing to move forward. And I don't see how President Obama could have denied him that. Unless, he really thought that Joe Biden couldn't win. And I also do think that if you look at Bill McGurn's column in The Wall Street Journal that he hits on something very important. Joe Biden really doesn't have anything to lose. He has been vice president. He has been in the wings what -- ready to take over if he was called upon to do so as president of the United States. He doesn't long for money. He's already been made fun of by everybody in the world. He's like at a saturation point. And somebody asked me, "Does he have the stomach to run against what Hillary Clinton might be able to throw at her for all the things she might know about him?" And I said, "What about the things he might know about her?"


PERINO: What might they think is happening, not just on the e-mail scandal, but other things? Or do they think the campaign won't work? And think about this. President Obama knows better than anybody else what her weaknesses are because he beat her in 2008 in the primary. So I think it's a very exciting development.

GUILFOYLE: It really is. And then you couple that with the fact that he had the meeting with Elizabeth Warren. I mean, if you're in the Clinton camp right now you're shaking in your pant suit and your boots.


GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Well, Hillary's campaign is like a 02 breaking ball, down and out. A little baseball joke there. It's got to kill her. It's happening all over again. She's being pushed aside by a more appealing candidate. She's like the Susan Lucci of candidates, you see -- in the room, near the end, passed over. At least Biden that we know has a purpose. He will be the official curator of the Obama presidency. He's like -- to make sure the legacy is intact.


GUTFELD: Nobody destroys the herb garden. They don't put fattening foods back on the menu. He might actually do the tours. He just says, "This is where President Obama used to think." But it really doesn't feel like a presidency. It feels like a four-year hosting gig. Like he's like Sammy Hagar between David Lee Roth. He sits there until they get the next person. And he's fine with that because he spent all his life running for -- not all, like he's he ran twice for president. Now, he's not really running, and it's running towards him.


GUTFELD: And that teaches you a lesson. Sometimes in order to get what you want you shouldn't chase it, Juan.


JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Thank you. Thank you because I oftentimes chase.



GUTFELD: And what happened to, end that would be? Side and out.

WILLIAMS: Yeah, you know and it's a big car, too. I don't know what to do with it.


GUILFOYLE: Now Juan, what do you have for us? Any inside information of things that you promised to never reveal or discuss with anyone else? Now is your time to blab.


WILLIAMS: But I will say this, that when you see people -- talking this is kind inside baseball, but I just be brief, but when you see people like Anita Dunn and Bob Bauer meeting with the vice president. Now Anita Dunn was the communications director -- Dana shaking her head, but she is.

PERINO: I'm nodding.


PERINO: You know I'm nodding.

WILLIAMS: Yeah. She's a hardball political player. I think kind of nasty in my opinion. Bob Bauer, who worked with Clinton -- with Obama early on, knows the rules of how you set up a campaign, what are the deadlines for filing.

GUILFOYLE: What does it take?

WILLIAMS: Right. And now, what I'm hearing is that the vice president has major donors coming over to his house after Labor Day.


WILLIAMS: And this is a big issue because he's getting it late. And so will he have the money? He needs about $30 million. So let me stop with the inside baseball, but all of that would indicate that he's leaning towards this decision. But let me say there are a lot of democrats who think that all he's doing is playing to republican desire to scuttle Hillary because what's he going to do? He can't get to the left of Hillary. So what he's gonna say?

PERINO: I would not think that.

WILLIAMS: "Oh, Hillary's corrupt. The Republicans are right. The e-mail scandal is a big deal and that's I'm running." Well, what kind of a deal is that?

JESSE WATTERS, GUEST CO-HOST: You know I think everybody needs to slow down on this Biden stuff. Obviously, Obama wants a 3rd term to some (ph) his legacy, and if Hillary implodes, Biden is the insurance policy. Think about it. Biden is the insurance policy. Biden's about as disciplined as a puppy, OK? Let's listen to what Biden said.

GUILFOYLE: But everybody loves puppies.

WATTERS: True, I mean, that's true. He might be cute.


WATTERS: But it kind like run his face into the curb. Now Biden like told a guy in a wheelchair to get up and stand up. He mocks Indian accents. He goes skinny dipping. He drops the F-Bomb on a hot mic.

GUILFOYLE: What's wrong with that?

WATTERS: I mean this guy is going to be like treating the rope line.

PERINO: All of that can factor in.

WATTERS: This guy is gonna be like treating the rope line like a personal petting zoo. I think -- he needs an insurance policy. You know what that insurance policy is?

GUILFOYLE: What is it?

WATTERS: Elizabeth Warren. So you have the Biden-Warren ticket. And they're not going to have an e-mail problem because Biden doesn't know how to use e-mail, and Elizabeth warren uses smoke signals. So I don't think it's going to be a problem.

GUTFELD: I saw that one coming from a mile away.



WILLIAMS: Hanging curveball.

WATTERS: That's right. I don't think Biden is gonna be that big of a threat.


WATTERS: I think he's just as much of a case to implode as Hillary.


PERINO: I mean I cannot take responsibility for anything Jesse Watters says.

GUILFOYLE: Clean up on aisle five.

PERINO: When I said that people have made fun of Joe Biden for years, what I mean is that all of those things are true. He said that he mocked the Indian accent, but I do think that all of that has been factored in. There will be plenty of time for criticism about Joe Biden if he decides to run, but today is a day to celebrate possible, entering some excitement in the race. Could I quibble with something that you said?

WILLIAMS: Yeah, of course.

PERINO: Why in the world would Joe Biden want to appease republicans who want, like.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, that's make sense.

PERINO: Oh, Hillary's got out of the race?


PERINO: What does he have to gain by doing that?

WILLIAMS: No, he is. Well, let me tell you. This is I mean.

PERINO: Why would he appease me?

WILLIAMS: There's a psychological angle that's really interesting to me.

GUILFOYLE: And you're about to dump a conspiracy theory on us?

WILLIAMS: Well, it's a little bit of conspiracy. I'm just -- you know kind of inside gossip which is look. His son dies. The son -- reportedly told him run for president please, dad. Please run for president. He was, OK. He's 77-years-old, right? And he sees this is his moment to be remembered as more than a senator from Delaware or Obama's vice president. He could be President Biden. So is he reacting psychologically that moment? Is that why he's doing this? Way after the point? He should have announced if he was going to do this in the spring. Would have had a totally.

PERINO: But I don't think that they know. I actually -- I think that he has been very thoughtful about it. And he has been watching Hillary Clinton's campaign, slowly start to unravel.


PERINO: And there are also had -- what do they have -- else happens since this spring? Bernie Sanders got in the race. He's got a lot of interest. Elizabeth Warren said she wasn't going to run or basically, he's got no indication that she would. So now you've got a split in the Democratic Party. Who could unite the party? Arguably, I think that Joe Biden is the most capable of uniting the party.

WILLIAMS: Wait, wait, but there's no.

GUTFELD: There's no combination of both of them. Like if you took Sanders and Hillary and put them in a blender, you would get Joe Biden.

PERINO: Right.

GUTFELD: Because he has kind of the stature and a little bit of the crazy old-fashioned.

GUILFOYLE: But you know what?

GUTFELD: But wait, can I -- the other thing that we're missing here is, we're watching the party turn on Hillary.


GUTFELD: If that is a big story, I think they realize this is not, this -- I was going to say this dog isn't in the hunt, but I'm not because it's a clich,' that I banned. It's like the kid at -- nobody wants to sit next to that kid at the high school cafeteria because of the accident in the gym. That was she becoming.


GUTFELD: Yeah, there's nobody that wants to get near her because they sense doom.

GUILFOYLE: Because of the e-mail scandal, Jesse. She's got cooties right now.

WATTERS: That's true, she had cooties. I'm gonna say.

GUTFELD: That's' sexist.

WATTERS: That's true. That is sexist.

GUILFOYLE: Anybody can get cooties.


WATTERS: Everybody has cooties.

GUILFOYLE: Cooties are unisex.

WATERS: She probably got them from Bill. Now, but here is the thing.



PERINO: Doubt it.

WATTERS: Hillary could.

GUILFOYLE: I doubt it.

WATTERS: Be helped by Biden's entry, and let me tell you why. Hillary could play the gender card on Biden.


WATTERS: Can do the whole Lazio thing. Remember he invaded her space, got elected and he was tossed. She could play the victim. You know Hillary is great at playing the victim. She could play the underdog.

PERINO: She can also say she's not the older person in the race.

WATTERS: That's right. He's older. He's whiter. You know, there's a lot.

WILLIAMS: He's what?

WATTERS: There are a lot of things.


WATTERS: Yeah, much whiter. Have you ever seen him dance? You see Hillary dance on the vineyard? She's got some moves.

GUILFOYLE: Oh my, gosh.

WATTERS: No, but she.

GUILFOYLE: Dance off like Brittany and Justin.

WATTERS: Could Biden -- Biden could -- Hillary could critique Obama and distance herself from Obama when she goes after him.

WILLIAMS: I think you're on to something here.

WATTERS: There's ways to make this work for her.

WILLIAMS: But you know, I think you're on to something in terms. What's going on among democrats who I think are very upset about all this is that -- look, Hillary -- a lot of people think it's her turn. You know Obama, the black guy came.

PERINO: But that what they said in 2008.

WILLIAMS: No, no, no. And then Obama came and took the turn.

GUILFOYLE: But that's like an entitlement theory. It's just that.

WILLIAMS: It's not entitlement, but it seem like you're.

GUILFOYLE: Wrong. You shouldn't be entitled to a presidency of the United States.


GUILFOYLE: Gender selection.

WILLIAMS: How come every time the republican that finished second gets the nomination next time?

PERINO: Well, look how well that's done the last time that can work so well.

WILLIAMS: Well, I'm just saying.

PERINO: That can I throw a little cold water on the Vice President Biden thing?

GUILFOYLE: Go ahead.

PERINO: Because I do think it's worth noting that any vice president that served for two terms has a very hard time.


PERINO: Getting the nominations, only happened once since World War II. That was George H.W. Bush. He did not then win re-election. And I think you -- you just look at Al Gore. The thing for.

GUTFELD: Do we have to?

PERINO: The thing that's interesting is for years we've said that the great thing for Obama has been like what, Bush had with Cheney. Is that Cheney wasn't running for president. Biden has been very comfortable being the vice president. That's why I think it is totally on the merits that he has decided that she might not be able to got distance. They know they can't win with Bernie Sanders. And so who's the one person who could pull this together? They need insurance policy.

GUTFELD: Jerry Brown.

PERINO: And Biden is the good one.

GUTFELD: Jerry Brown.

GUILFOYLE: There are those rumors.

PERINO: And I think he can raise $30 million. I don't think he -- he doesn't have to declare until the end of September.

WATTERS: And I tell you what.

PERINO: I have $30 million. I think they can raise it.

GUILFOYLE: I think so.

WATTERS: The media loves a horse race and they are gonna root, root, root, for Joe Biden.

WILLIAMS: And that's a good point because I think the media is a little bored on the democratic side.

WATTERS: They are.

GUILFOYLE: The thing is I think he was probably measured and waiting the time that he has. He's not hurt by it because the more that you know Hillary is.

PERINO: Last one in.

GUILFOYLE: And it is like limping along, he's going to come in a little bit more fresh, people aren't going to be right away that's the guy with the gaffes because she's the one with the crimes.



WATTERS: What's worse, gaffes or crimes?

WILLIAMS: Wait until Jesse.

PERINO: I'll take gaffes for $200.

WILLIAMS: Got an opportunity to attack Vice President Biden.

WATTERS: Yeah. We're just getting started.


PERINO: There's plenty of time for that.

GUILFOYLE: Plenty of time

PERINO: Today, let's just have fun.

GUILFOYLE: And plenty of time for that.

GUTFELD: And he just has to be there. This is the thing about Biden. He's not going to be a transformative leader. He's going to be -- he's seat filler until the democrat.

PERINO: Although, he does know how to get a deal done.


PERINO: If you think what he did with Obamacare, helped seal that and he helped -- government would shut down.

WATTERS: He sealed Obamacare?

PERINO: He is not -- from a democrat's perspective.


PERINO: Yes, he did. And then also, what he pushed President Obama on gay marriage.


PERINO: He actually could energize the race better than anybody.

WILLIAMS: Race deal.

GUTFELD: By accident.

WATTERS: Well, he pushed him?

GUTFELD: He pushed him like didn't he?

PERINO: It wasn't accident. I don't think it was an accident.

GUTFELD: Really?

PERINO: I actually -- no, no. She's pushed.

GUILFOYLE: She's making a solid point.

PERINO: Thank you.

GUILFOYLE: He's very good at bipartisan politics. He enjoys support and friendships to people on both sides of the aisle. I would like a little bit of that.

WATTERS: I think she's just talking.

GUILFOYLE: It got class in that way. And I really object to your disparaging comment about his penchant for skinny dipping.


GUILFOYLE: Coming up.


GUILFOYLE: You got it. You got it, baby.

A day in court for the suspect taken down by Americans on a train in France, what we can do to prevent a threat like that, here at home, next.


GUTFELD: The heroism seen on that French train is a wonderful horror story.

It's wonderful in that we saw a fearlessness that we all wish we might possess in times of danger. What those Americans and that Brit and Frenchman did was wonderful.

The horror is what the government didn't do. The government didn't stop that creep, so hundreds of passengers had to bank on a Yank. This Islamist was on three terror watch lists, yet there he was on a train bent on murder. If those brave men hadn't been there, it would have been pure carnage.

Anyone taking a train these days makes a chilling observation: so many entrances so few securities. Cheap umbrellas offer more protection. And if it's not guns it will be homemade bombs or Bio-med attacks, anything is possible. The fact is the world has changed. States no longer hold a patent on violence. Anyone can do it and has. This forces us to grow up and admit that, aside from heroes, increased surveillance is all we've got these days. Given that terrorists are innocent of crimes until they commit them, that means our only good offense is a great defense. It's time we shake the Snowden hangover and recommit to national security. Whistle blowing is great in films, but in the real world you don't blow the whistle on your only chance for survival. Snowden's easy sabotage stands in stark contrast to those valiant men on that train. But as long as we allow our security to be dictated by rats, then we'll need to rely on the kindness of strangers on a train.

I got to point out because I've been raging on professors for four years that Professor Mark Mugalian, I think it's how you say was the first passenger to tackle the guy. No, there was a French kid, French 28-year-old that won't be mentioned out of whatever reason, but tackled the guy and got shot. So I take back everything I've ever said about professors.



GUTFELD: Until the deep lock when I go after professors again. But this is -- I mean, this guy, we talked about the other three fellows, but there I think -- there might be six or seven people loosely involved here. Every one of these people is an incredible hero.

GUILFOYLE: Absolutely and rose to the occasion. It's something we can all learn from to be involved. Don't be a passerby in life especially when we all have something at stake here. The fight against terror should be something that united us globally. This should be a geopolitical fight on all fronts that we can engage in together and do things that are smart. What bothers me, is, when I hear people in this country and administration say things like, you know that's just not who we are when they do the apology tour and they are constantly worried about these PC politics when it comes to the fight against terror. Hundred percent, this is what we're talking about with the NSA, with the metadata gathering to make sure that they have all of this data points to. People that are out there, operators in the field, people that are putting it on the line every day, they need every advantage and tool that they can. They have no interest, really, in listening to Jesse's calls. They really don't.


GUILFOYLE: They want.

GUTFELD: I tried it.

GUILFOYLE: And this is the point, right.

GUTFELD: All he does is talk about hair gel.


GUILFOYLE: It's -- it's a snooze alert.


GUILFOYLE: So it's really uninteresting.


GUILFOYLE: This is what we want to do. Why do you want to hamstring our people that are working in national security and trying to maintain, you know, maintain our security every day to make sure that this country is safe. And in Europe, they need our help too.

GUTFELD: This is what scares me, Juan is that we are relying on the heroism of strangers, when we should be really thinking about there's -- we can't wait until that happens.

WILLIAMS: No, you can't. And but the thing is.

GUTFELD: And it trains here.

WILLIAMS: I was about to say, I mean, I ride the Amtrak, the Acela and there is very little security that is visible.


WILLIAMS: And normally they tell you, you know if you see something, say something. But in that situation, I mean, I guess that they had sort of the equivalent of Air Marshalls on the Amtrak train.


WILLIAMS: And they have an Amtrak security force, but you don't go through a magnetometer to come into Penn station here in New York or Union station D.C. You just don't.

WATTERS: Let's not tell the terrorists that one.


WILLIAMS: But I think they know.

GUILFOYLE: Juan, take it easy.

WILLIAMS: The question in my mind is what do people do? Because actually the experts say, you shouldn't just be running at the bad guy because that gives him hostages or you can hurt you. The question is how do you deal with this? And I think the government to come back to your -- actually, point. The government has some responsibility here.

GUTFELD: I think the government has to be hand in hand with private businesses because there are actually terrorism is now using private enterprises and private pathways to come after us.


GUTFELD: They are going to use, you know the day that self-driving cars are a reality, they are going to use those. Google has to think about it. Every private company has a responsibility, I think. I don't know.

WATTERS: That's true. And I think everybody forgets what it was like here after 9/11. Remember everybody was looking up in the sky when the plane was flying low. We didn't want to go into the subway because we thought there's gonna be some gas attack. You know the guy's dad on the train said the other day, cut the PC crap.


WATTERS: Cut it out because we're dealing with a bunch of savages. To one of the reasons why Trump is resonating because he's like, this is like medieval times. People are getting their head shut off. There's rape room. This is disgusting. We don't like when the president goes out after Americans beheaded and plays golf and fist bumps. We don't like it when the president doesn't even say Islamic terror. It's very disturbing. And I remember.


WILLIAMS: Went off to the right. Oh my, God.

GUTFELD: Just got thrown out of the.


WATTERS: In World War II, if you look at the history books, they were gassing Jews in Germany and we didn't get involved until Pearl Harbor was attacked.


WATTERS: I'm not saying we have to go and invade Syria. I'm just saying we have to be more.

WILLIAMS: No, no, no.

WATTERS: Tenacious going after these savages in the sand than we are right now.

WILLIAMS: I'm all with you. I'm with you.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, who are crucifying children, who have cooked children, there's so much horrifying information out there, factual information. We have to listen to the people that are in the theater, that are on the ground, that know what's going on.

WILLIAMS: I agree.

GUILFOYLE: Use the tools, God.

GUTFELD: Could back to the -- my central point here is that it's not war. War isn't enough when the war is here. When the war is -- when the borders don't matter and they're in France or they're in the United States, we need as what Kimberly says we need every single thing at our disposal.


PERINO: I like the way you describe it as a Snowden hangover because now, hopefully, we can work our way through it, but there's two problems. Number one, what Snowden did was not just reveal that we actually had the capabilities, he revealed the capability.


PERINO: Capability is ruined. So all of that work, all of that money on a taxpayer dollars that went into building the capability to keep us safe, in that regard in terms of metadata, that's gone.


PERINO: It has to be rebuilt. So whoever is the next president of the United States, they're going to have to figure out a way to get Congress to put more money into that. Then number two is that, yes, I think private companies have a responsibility. There's a problem, Greg. Who has the highest approval rating of anybody in the world in Silicon Valley right now?


PERINO: Ed Snowden.


PERINO: No. They love him. They think he's a major hero.


PERINO: So they actually -- you have private companies that have the capabilities to help and then probably might be willing to, but from a public relations standpoint, they're afraid to.

GUTFELD: Oh, that's sad.


GUILFOYLE: We will just make them do it.

PERINO: We'll compel them to do it.

GUTFELD: All right, ahead. Ben Carson calls on Black Lives Matters activists who change the targets of their movement. Who he thinks -- who he thinks they should protest, next. Who wrote that?


WILLIAMS: We're friends. We've gone to games together, but we don't share the same politics, that's republican presidential candidate Ben Carson. But he and I do agree when it comes to the misdirected anger of the Black Lives Matter movement. In an op-ed for USA Today, Carson acknowledges the right of protesters to be upset about issues facing the black community. But then he says they should concentrate on the real source of the problems, like the public school system in America failing black children.


BEN CARSON, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: It doesn't matter what your ethnic background or your socioeconomic background is. If you get a good education, you write your own ticket. End of story. No ifs, ands and buts about it. One of the things I tell people all the time is during slavery, it was illegal to teach a slave to read. Now, why do you think that was? Because even those evil masters knew that an educated man is a free man.


WILLIAMS: Dr. Carson also calls out the entertainment industry that glamorizes black men as thugs and women as -- I'm just going to be polite here, trash, along with Washington government for failing to win the war on poverty. Carson says he is not the only black person who feels this way.


CARSON: There are a lot of people in the black community who actually think the way that I do. But it's very risky to actually say it. Because then you'll be called a name, you'll be scorned, and that is what the established progressive party wants.


WILLIAMS: Kimberly, why is it that we don't see Black Lives Matter saying, "Hey, I can't believe these drug dealers. We're going to go after the drug dealers. We're going to protest about black-on-black murder and crime, extraordinarily high, higher than any other racial group or community." Why don't we see that?

GUILFOYLE: Because black lives only matter some of the time, according to their movement.

They should be the first people rising up in arms to say enough. No more black-on-black crimes. No more murder in our communities. We want places where our children can get an education, can play in the playground.


GUILFOYLE: And not be slaughtered by a drive-by shooting or be collateral damage in these feuds and war that's going on in urban neighborhoods across America.

WILLIAMS: You make an excellent point. I think they're locked in by the unions. I think they're locked in by their own -- and of course, they love to blame you, white man.

WATTERS: That's true. They love -- they love to blame the white man. And you cannot criticize the black community in America, because the Democrats consider that attack and the Democrats are always on offense, and they strike back.

If you're a black conservative and you criticize the black community, you're an Uncle Tom. If you're a white conservative and you criticize the black community, you're somehow a racist.

But the Democrats have not been that great for black America. They keep the black people uneducated, because they don't support vouchers. They've surrendered the war on drugs. Open borders drives wages down for the black community. And, you know, with the easy welfare and the Food Stamps, it keeps these mothers single. It should be...

WILLIAMS: Here we go.

WATTERS: Well, it should be Black Wives Matter instead of Black Lives Matter. Because the family structure is the most important thing.

WILLIAMS: See, I happen to agree with you 100 percent on that point. But I think once you start going into, you know, kind of demonizing poor people, you know...

WATTERS: How did I demonize poor people, Juan?

WILLIAMS: Because I think that's where Republicans fall off the cart.

WATTERS: How did we do that?

WILLIAMS: They get defensive. They say you're attacking people who are vulnerable.

WATTERS: I don't see how I attacked poor people, but I'll let you believe so.

WILLIAMS: So Dana, I want to show you something, because I think this woman works for Jesse. But her name is Peggy Hubbard.

GUILFOYLE: She's amazing.

WILLIAMS: She has a video that's gone viral. Here it is.

GUILFOYLE: What do you mean she works for Jesse?


PEGGY HUBBARD, MOTHER OF MURDERED GIRL: Police brutality? How about black brutality? A little girl is dead. You say Black Lives Matter? Her life matters. Her dreams matter. Her future matters. Her promises matter. It mattered.

You're tearing up communities over thugs and criminals. You think the police are out here for fun? You think they're out here for games? You shoot at them, they're going to shoot at you. That's just the realism of it. If you try to kill them, their job is to serve and protect, not serve and die.


WILLIAMS: Let me tell you something, Dana, I got emotional. I think God bless her. You are speaking truth. What do you think, Dana?

PERINO: Well, I think she's courageous. And I was wondering if I could ask you a question. When you say it's gone viral, did it go viral amongst people like us here in the media, or is that more in the community? And could somebody like a Peggy Hubbard or a Dr. Ben Carson actually get the attention and possibly the support of more people in the black community?

WILLIAMS: Well, you know, I don't know the answer to that. I don't know exactly who, but I know the numbers are incredible in terms of people who watched that video.

But I'll tell you this: it makes an impact on me. Because it got to me. And then I -- and I think she's speaking truth. But I think it also gets to people who then want to put her down and say, "Oh, she's just serving the white man or she's a conservative."

This is what ben Carson's talking about. Somebody comes out, takes a risky position, a stand, and Greg, she gets hammered by the black left.

GUTFELD: Because -- well, the scariest thing to a white liberal is a black conservative. And when you see anything that steers away from those -- that ideology, it freaks people out.

When you look at these activist groups, whether it is Black Lives Matter or occupy Wall Street or PETA, you're always going to get the idiotic fringe people in there, because there's no quality control. There's no standards in being an activist. It's not like going to med school where you need standards in order to actually save somebody's life. All you're doing is shouting. So there are some good people in these groups, but then there's some nuts.

There's -- the old joke about a New York Times headline, no matter what it is, they always say "minorities hit hardest." So the earthquake strikes, minorities hit hardest. Hurricane, minorities hit hardest. Joblessness, minorities hit hardest.

With radical politics, it's true. When there -- where there's radical politics, it is minorities and black communities that are hit hardest, because they're the most vulnerable. They can't leave their communities. They can't run from these activists. They're stuck there.

And that's what's so painful, is that the gulf between their leadership and these people is so vast. Black communities are far more conservative than the activists who represent them.

WILLIAMS: That's true.

GUTFELD: But that's because all activists are radical. Not just black or white but all.

WILLIAMS: And honest, let me just make one quick point and ask you, Kimberly, or Jesse, to respond. "Straight Out of Compton," I think, is the No. 1 movie in America right now. And there are a lot of people who say all you're doing is celebrating thuggish, violent behavior.

GUILFOYLE: Perpetuating that lifestyle.

WILLIAMS: Even misogynistic behavior.

GUILFOYLE: Perpetuating that lifestyle. But that's why -- I mean, it's a free market. OK? So they have every right to make that movie. But there should be a lot of discussion about the benefits and the -- you know, the bad outcomes of this, where people try and emulate this kind of thug life and thug behavior, which just fosters more violence.

WILLIAMS: And I think it plays to white people who think, oh, that's the way they are.

GUTFELD: But that's -- that's what the problem with that movie. The problem with that movie is that it's dishonest. It wasn't a political -- NWA wasn't a political group. They were capitalists. They were out to make money. And if the movie focused on that -- and also, it looked some of the more unsavory aspects of Dr. Dre's life, it would have been a better, honest film.

WILLIAMS: It didn't include them?

GUTFELD: It didn't. It didn't include them is my point.

WILLIAMS: All right. Because we now have to be commercial and make some money. So next, suggestive signs targeting freshmen women at -- just got one fraternity suspended at a Virginia university, I'm trying to say. That's what's going on. So anyway, we're going to just come to that coming up.

GUILFOYLE: That wasn't your fault. That was weird. Yes.


PERINO: All right. There's a lot of debate about whether college is a waste of time and money. Could this help settle it?

The Daily Caller has put together a list of what it calls the dumbest college courses for 2015 at some of America's elite schools. Among them, "Wasting Time on the Internet" at U. Penn. According to the course manual, students will be required to stare at the screen for three hours. Aimless drifting is mandatory.

And at Georgia State you can learn all about Kim Kardashian's husband if you take "Kanye Versus Everybody."

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my God.

PERINO: Or at Occidental College there's a Stupidity Class, where you'll be studying "Beavis and Butthead" among others.

So I've got to imagine, Kimberly, that if you're a mom and dad and you're saving for your child's college education, this isn't exactly the kind of course work you'd expect.

GUILFOYLE: Isn't it sad? I mean, this is like open enrollment applauding for technical schools. If this is what you're going to get, is like going to college, "Beavis and Butthead," basket weaving -- that was another one - - I mean, what a waste of time and money. I mean, you're just, like, turning your brain into sludge. I don't understand why they think it's good.

PERINO: Aimless surfing of the Internet, Greg, is free.


PERINO: You don't really need to take a course for that.

GUTFELD: You don't have to pay for that.

GUILFOYLE: Terrible.

GUTFELD: What -- what do these courses prepare you for? Only one thing, and that is to teach those courses.


GUTFELD: Teach these courses, because you have no other skills.

Cornell teaches tree climbing. Because once you realize none of the skills you learn will get you a job to pay rent, you're going have to live in a tree.

GUILFOYLE: Right. Like the Robinson family or something.

GUTFELD: But these aren't even the worst ones. The worst ones are the other pseudointellectual courses that fetishize gender and race, and deconstructionism. And they weave it all together, so it has nonsense masquerading as intelligence.

Then when they shove these people out into the real world and go to a job interview, they have absolutely no common sense. Nothing they've learned will help them when they're trying to ask for a raise or trying to figure out a problem. But, you know, they deconstruct "Moby Dick."

WILLIAMS: Really? You can help me figure out how to ask for a raise around here?

WATTERS: Juan, you're very well-paid.

GUILFOYLE: We all know.


PERINO: Juan, did you take a look at your -- your children's courses that they chose? Like when they were going to college, did you look and check? Or no?

WILLIAMS: Let me assure you. Let me assure you, they did not take any of this.

But I will say this. Because we have a number of friends who are so critical, especially the black studies type thing. I think, you know, if you want to get an education, get an education. If it's rigorous, OK.

But a lot of this seems to me to be frivolous and just kind of accentuating identity and racial politics...


WILLIAMS: ... in place of education.

I will say this in defense, that my mom -- bless her soul -- used to say to me, "So what kind of job does a philosophy major get? What are you doing?"


WILLIAMS: She couldn't understand that.

GUTFELD: But a philosophy major is great. It's a great major.

WATTERS: I was a philosophy major for a few years, and then I dropped out.

WILLIAMS: There you go.

GUTFELD: You dropped out of college?

WATTERS: No. Just dropped that major. But listen.

GUILFOYLE: Can't you tell?

WATTERS: These people that take these courses, these are the people that show up in "Watters' World." I mean, that's what you get.

PERINO: That's a good point.

WATTERS: This is -- you'll end up in "Watters' World" if you major in tree climbing.

GUILFOYLE: So they serve their purpose. You need them.

WATTERS: Right. That's right. So keep taking the Kardashian class, and you're all set.

But, you know, it's not brave to teach these courses. You're supposed to be a professor and try to, like, you know, bang kids' heads together. I came up with courses that I think they should take on campus. It kind of would rock the world.

Economics. "Why FOX News and Capitalism Save Lives." I think that would be good. International relations. "The World's Muslim Problem," taught by Greg Gutfeld. And women's studies, "The Case for Male Dominance." Taught by Keith Ablow. I think those courses right there, those would really provoke discussion on campus.

GUILFOYLE: Crowd pleasers. Yes.

PERINO: All right. Well, Jesse, when your daughters go to college, are you going to check their courses that they're taking?

WATTERS: My parents signed me up for my freshman year of courses. And it was, like, the hardest courses. It was, like, English Lit, Greek. I got all "F's" first semester.

GUILFOYLE: Are you serious?

WATTERS: Yes. So I had to ease back after that.

GUTFELD: There was an interesting -- I just thought of this when you were talking about the idea of how we -- how on campuses you propagate division. What the real solution is for courses is the opposite of division, which would be to teach or empathy or teach persuasion to your point of view. Because sooner or later, robots are going to be doing anything that doesn't require persuasion or empathy. That's the only skills that we will need.

PERINO: You know what you should do?


PERINO: You join the speech team.


WILLIAMS: Yes. And that's, in fact, what I did.


WILLIAMS: But I think you're right. I wish I'd had you around to speak to my mother. Because I think that's what philosophy teaches you. Analytical, critical thinking.

GUTFELD: That's right.

PERINO: All right. We've got to go, because we've got one more thing to talk about. Things were finally looking up on Wall Street today until minutes before closing bell. And that's next on "The Five."


WATTERS: After yesterday's freefall on Wall Street, U.S. stock market rebounded and tumbled in the final minutes of trading today after China cut interest rates to boost its economy. The Dow closed down 205 points. The NASDAQ dropped 20, and the S&P fell 26.

If you grabbed a coffee today at Starbucks and notice the staff being extra nice to you, that's because its CEO, Howard Schultz, asked them to be mindful of any stressed-out investors. In a note to employees, he wrote, quote, "Our customers are likely to experience an increased level of anxiety and concern. Let's be very sensitive to the pressures our customers may be feeling and do everything we can do individually and collectively to exceed their expectations."

So I mean, first the CEO is telling everybody to initiate a race conversation. Now I guess this is better, probably. Wouldn't you want them to be nice to customers?

GUTFELD: I find this hilarious. Because Howard -- so Howard Schultz is concerned about increased levels of anxiety of its customers, and he sells coffee! Coffee is the No. 1 causing...

GUILFOYLE: It's a stimulant.

GUTFELD: ... anxiety-driven beverage on the planet.

GUILFOYLE: Heart palpitations.

GUTFELD: There's nothing that gets you crazier than a cup of Starbucks coffee. In the stock market, it's really just a monetary version of caffeine. People watch it. They go up, or they go down. They go up or go down. It's hilarious. You should probably say don't drink coffee. Don't drink coffee today.

WATTERS: If he really wanted to help investors, he would have maybe given a little discount on the coffee after everybody lost their -- everything in the kitchen sink yesterday and today.

PERINO: Apparently, now Schultz is admitting that capitalists buy really overpriced coffee. And we need to be nice to them so that they keep buying overpriced coffee.

WATTERS: That's true. Isn't this guy running for president? They floated his name when Hillary's server took a dive? And, you know, what's this guy? He's, like, trying to make headlines.

GUILFOYLE: Anybody goes. I mean, I guess that's what it is. I mean, they do make delicious coffee. But -- and Greg is on the "no coffee" rule now.

GUTFELD: No, I drink a lot of coffee.

GUILFOYLE: No, but you're not supposed to drink coffee from 4 p.m. on before the show, because you have that problem.

GUTFELD: Been there, done that.

WILLIAMS: Yes, you talked about floating. Yes. See, a lot of floating when you drink coffee.

WATTERS: That's true. Are you even a Starbucks guy? You don't look like you go into Starbucks. You look like a Dunkin' Donuts type of guy.

WILLIAMS: I love Starbucks.

GUTFELD: Is that a racial thing?

GUILFOYLE: Yes. What was that?

PERINO: What was that, Jesse?

WATTERS: I think. Listen, Black Monday I thought was racist. I don't think they should call it Black Monday. I think it should be called White Monday.

WILLIAMS: I must say, I'm interested that he's so concerned about the capitalists and the rich having a bad day. I wonder if he does this, like, you know, at the end of the month before the welfare checks come out. Does he do that?

PERINO: Oh, Juan.

WATTERS: Come on. Everyone's beating up on Starbucks. They have great coffee. I don't know what the problem is.

PERINO: Actually, I think Juan was beating up on you.

WATTERS: That's right. Well, I didn't feel it. He doesn't throw that hard of a punch.

WILLIAMS: There you go.

GUTFELD: They have great restaurant -- they have great restrooms.

PERINO: Sometimes.

WATTERS: That's true. That's true. All right. "One More Thing" is up next.


GUILFOYLE: All right. It's time now for "One More Thing" -- Juan.

WILLIAMS: Here's a great quote to take to heart. Quote, "Donald Trump rarely apologizes, although in this case he should. We have never been deterred by politicians or anyone else attacking us for doing our job," end quote. Those words from part of a statement our boss, FOX News chairman and CEO Roger Ailes, issued earlier today in response to Trump's repeated assaults on our colleague, Megyn Kelly.

Trump has certainly been successful to this point in the GOP primaries. But if he hopes for that momentum to continue, he may want to focus on more serious issues facing this country.

As for Megyn, her journalistic credentials speak for themselves. And all of us at this table and throughout FOX News are honored to call her a teammate and a friend.

GUTFELD: Well done.

GUILFOYLE: Indeed. Thank you, Juan. Dana.

PERINO: All right. Constitution Day is September 17, and Constituting America is this great organization. It was founded by Janine Turner, and the cofounder is Cathy Gillespie. And they have a great contest. It's called We the Future. Anyone from kindergarten through college can submit a PSA, a public service announcement, or like a best song or short film, anything with a theme to do with the U.S. Constitution.

Here's last year's winner. She did a PSA, Laura Lee Hicks. Just a piece of it. Take a look.


LAURA LEE HICKS, WINNER OF CONTEST: If you have something, something that others wanted so badly but were denied it, something that you used and relied on every single day. If someone had given you a document that protected that something, wouldn't you take the time to read it?


PERINO: So this is a great chance for you to talk about the Constitution, learn about the Constitution. Also last year the winners got to meet with Bret Baier. I mean, that's pretty cool. This year -- and Megyn -- I'm sorry, Monica Crowley and Sean Hannity are two of the supporters.

Entries are due September 17. So for details, you just go to Parents or teachers, if you're watching, this is a great organization. I encourage you to try to get involved.

GUILFOYLE: Thank you, Dana.

PERINO: You're welcome, Kimberly.


GUTFELD: Yes, let's go to this.


GUTFELD: Greg's Fashion Tips.



GUTFELD: Now, when you are, like, at any kind of a museum or exhibition, try to dress the part. Here's a young man, a 12-year-old boy, actually, not a man. He's in Taiwan. He's walking down to look at a painting. Why don't you roll the tape?

And he walks -- and he trips. And his fist goes into a $1.5 million painting of flowers. The kid's fine, by the way.

I only say fashion tips, because I think he should have been wearing slacks and maybe some sneakers. He probably wouldn't have tripped if he was wearing maybe some loafers or something. And he wouldn't have fell.

But anyway, he didn't get in trouble. He only spent four weeks in jail. No, he's good. He's good.

PERINO: There's a big hole in the painting.

GUTFELD: No, they fixed it.

PERINO: I know. But still that's a big deal.

GUILFOYLE: Oh, my gosh. That was terrible. OK, Jesse.

WATTERS: OK. Jon Stewart sill unemployed, can't get out of the limelight. Here he is seeking more attention.

GUILFOYLE: What are you doing?


JOHN CENA, PROFESSIONAL WRESTLER: You're going to understand this. Because right now I'm just going to do what I got to do.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, no. Oh, no. That's Jon Stewart.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Put him down, John.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: With an -- of Jon Stewart.


WATTERS: So the funny man body slammed. You can call that a body. Just begging for attention. Can't just ride off into the sunset. Next season he will be on "The Bachelorette."

PERINO: You're lucky that he doesn't have a show anymore.

GUILFOYLE: I have one so super special. And these are K.G.'s fashion trips for Greg. He should try some of these outfits.

Now look at this, a guy, 23-year-old writer from, was tasked with recreating Prince George's outfits for an entire week. These might even fit Greg. And that is in order to dissect what it was like to be a royal and, more specifically, a royal baby.

Look at his little outfits. They are adorable. We could wear one every day on "The Five." It would be fantastic.

GUTFELD: Got to have good legs.

GUILFOYLE: All right. Set your DVRs so you never miss another episode of "The Five." That's it for us. "Special Report" is next.

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