Obama calls terror attack on Paris kosher deli a random act

President describes victims 'folks,' 'randomly' shot


This is a rush transcript from "The Five," February 10, 2015. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.

KIMBERLY GUILFOYLE, CO-HOST: Hello, everyone. I'm Kimberly Guilfoyle, along with Bob Beckel, Eric Bolling, Dana Perino and Greg Gutfeld. It's 5 o'clock in New York City and this is "The Five."

Not only won't President Obama you utter the words Islamic terrorism. He now refuses to acknowledge that the victims of last month's attack at a Jewish deli in Paris were targeted for their faith.


PRESIDENT BARACK OBAMA: It is entirely legitimate for the American people to be deeply concerned when you've got a bunch of violent, vicious zealots who behead people or randomly shoot a bunch of folks in a deli in Paris.


GUILFOYLE: And that comment wasn't randomly made by the president. Today, the White House backed it up.


JOSH EARNEST, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: The adverb that the president chose was used to indicate that the individuals who were killed in that terrible tragic incident were killed not because of who they were but because of where they randomly happened to be.

JONATHAN KARL, POLITICAL JOURNALIST: They weren't killed because they were in a Jewish deli, a kosher deli?

EARNEST: These individuals were not targeted by name. This is the point.

KARL: Not by name but by religion, were they not?

EARNEST: Well John, there were people other than just Jews who were in that -- that deli.

KARL: Do you think that deli was attacked because it was a kosher deli...


KARL: Any random deli, it was a kosher deli.

EARNEST: I answered the question once, no. Ed?

ED NHENRY, BROADCAST JOURNALIST: Then why didn't the president acknowledge that? If he knows that and it's obvious, why didn't he say that? He got long --

EARNEST: The president, he acknowledged it on many occasions when he has the opportunity to speak about this incident.


GUILFOYLE: Somebody call doctor because I'm in pain. All four, the victims killed in the Parisian kosher supermarket were Jewish. Their funerals held in Jerusalem. But even the State Department stunningly won't acknowledge their religion.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Does the administration really believe that these people -- that the victims of this attack were -- not singled out because they were of a particular faith?

JEN PSAKI, US STATE DEPARTMENT SPOKESPERSON: Well, as you know, I believe if I remember this victim specifically, there were -- there were not all victims of one background or one nationality.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Does the administration believe this was an anti-Jewish -- an attack on Jewish community in Paris?

PSAKI: I don't think we're gonna speak on behalf of French authorities.


GUILFOYLE: It just keeps getting worse at an alarming rate. Dana, get your take on these comments and the communications coming out of the White House, the State Department.

DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: I've been nearly unable to breathe since I saw that, and I would tell -- you've got to go back and watch the entire State Department and White House briefing. Because, you cannot believe that they're actually saying what they're saying, they're arguing about the president's adverbs. Then after they leave the podium, after those performances they both go back to their desk and they tweet something that says, "We have been perfectly clear all along that it was an act of anti-Semitism." OK. So is tweeting better than speaking? In this world now are we just supposed to say, OK, just go to Twitter and not believe that what you said at the podium five minutes ago is what the president...


PERINO: Has asked you to say? The other thing that bothers me, and I don't know how this happen. So that interview that the president gave was on January 23rd, Vox then does a whole bunch of hocus-pocus editing, makes it look real slick, look at me, couldn't look better. Then they don't release it until February 8th or 9th. If you are a staffer for the president of the United States, you are in the room when the president gives an interview like that, and it doesn't occur to you that you might have a problem.

GUILFOYLE: A big problem.

PERINO: When this happen?


PERINO: Do you don't try to fix it beforehand and then all of a sudden I think this is a partisan attack on the president. I actually think that the president owes the Jews of Europe an apology. They deserve better from the president of the United States. Anti-Semitism is on the rise and somebody must stick up for them.

GUILFOYLE: How about the Jews of the world deserve an apology? Take it -- take it a step further, Eric, your reaction to this -- to this fault. You think that we have a chance to like figure it out and fix it, instead, semantics gymnastics.

ERIC BOLLING, CO-HOST: Very important point, because that Vox interview was a couple of weeks ago and...

PERINO: January 25th.

BOLLING: Yeah, January 25th. It just came out recently. So there was a time where they could have pulled that interview down but they choose to go with it. President Obama literally says a bunch of folks, won't say terrorists, killing people, a bunch of folks killed some people in a deli in Paris. Then Josh Earnest backs and fills and says, yeah, we -- here's why it wasn't anti-Semitism, because they weren't mentioned by name. Now think about every single hate crime that's prosecuted in this country. Are they -- are you going to -- is that gonna be the standard for hate crimes? If they're mentioned by the victim is mentioned by name before they're killed or beat up or done whatever to? So that's ridiculous. Here's my problem. Josh earnest up until this round has been pretty darn good, I think. He's been respectable. This Josh Earnest right there that we just saw today reminded me of Jay Carney and -- for the first time, for the first time since he has taken over, what are we about a year now into this? Josh, what's going on? Josh, you had us...

GUILFOYLE: Save yourself. Get a head hunter. Get a job.

BOLLING: And now -- yeah, now I'm done.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, terrible. Greg.

GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Well, let's -- this is a very easy way to look at this. They are terror denialists. (ph) They deny terror at every -- at every place. So when Islamists kill Jews, it's -- they blame the butterfly effect. You know, it's like 9/11 was due to fog. This is not a White House, this is an outhouse they're so full of crap. If a cop, an American cop shoots someone who just committed a strong-armed robbery they indict the entire justice system. They call it a systematic condemnation of a corrupt system, but when an Islamist goes to a kosher market and kills a group of Jews, that's random. They could see root causes in everything except the truth. What are they scared of? What are they frightened of? Why won't they say what's happening there? Obsessed with Language, yet they -- they can't articulate a single truth and I finally realized what it is. All these years that they have been talking about Islamophobia, they are truly the Islamophobic ones. They have such a profound fear. President Obama and his White House, have such a profound fear of Islam that it forbids them from identifying actual terror, attacks on Jews. They can't bring themselves to do it because they're terrified of Islam. They are the Islamophobes.

GUILFOYLE: If only we could get a vaccination to prevent this widespread epidemic at the White House. Bob, what do you think about these comments and how do you even reconcile the fact that they are not even responding or tuning in to the horrifying nature of these statements they're making?

BOB BECKEL, CO-HOST: Well, a couple of things. One, I think that Greg says, it's the fear of -- I happen to think from Obama's standpoint probably the like of. You know, in other words, I think he's -- he as I say yesterday grew up in this climate, but how -- how can you stand there and say, this is a Jewish kosher -- kosher deli. And -- yes, can you not name the people that are gonna be shot? But what are the chances that the people in that delicatessens are Jewish, probably pretty high would they?


PERINO: Well, they -- don't forget also that the -- the shooter calls a reporter, French reporter afterwards and they say, why did you do it? And he said, I wanted to kill some Jews.

BECKEL: Right.

GUILFOYLE: I mean, how much more clearly do you need to be than that? That's about transparent as you can be.

BOLLING: No question that it was targeted. Here's the problem. Dana, points it out that today, Josh Earnest -- these are his words, talking about the people who were killed, were killed not because who they were but because they were random -- were they randomly happened to be and then the tweet, this is Josh Earnest's tweet, his words. "Our view has not changed. Terror attack at Paris kosher market, it was motivated by anti-Semitism, Paris (ph) didn't intends, it's just otherwise.

GUILFOYLE: Then why didn't you say that?

BOLLING: No, but -- are we so stupid that we're not gonna hold them accountable for within, you know, hours that they completely refute the words -- the very words that they spoke to the world, really? It's not just America, it's to the world. They're at their podium. Everyone across every state, every State Department across the globe is watching what Josh Ernest is saying.

BECKEL: Would you imagine if you had to go into the department store and do this or did you have to stop and look at stars of David on everybody's neck. I mean, to figure out who's -- and of course you're gonna go with the largest concentration of people who are Jewish happen to be. So it's -- from the beginning it doesn't make much sense and I'm going to refuse to say anymore than that.

GUILFOYLE: Well let's see who else is left to offend. The Christians, they had it the other day. Now the Jews -- I mean honestly, don't offend the Muslims though. Let's turn now to the president's prayer breakfast, swipe at Christian.


OBAMA: Remember that during the crusade and inquisition, people committed terrible deeds in the name of Christ.


GUILFOYLE: Well last night, Bill O'Reilly asked Obama's former aide David Axelrod why he would choose to make such a remark that would rile up Christians. Axelrod's answer, the president knew exactly what he was doing.


DAVID AXELROD, FORMER OBAMA ADVISOR: I think he knew what he was saying and he knew that it was provocative, absolutely, I think he knew that.

BILL O'REILY, THE O'REILLY FACTOR HOST: Then why would he do it?

AXELROD: Because, his point is that we have a quarter of the -- the world's population -- Islamic and the vast majority, the vast majority of them have nothing to do with extremism. Let's isolate the extremists just as we wouldn't blame -- that we wouldn't blame -- every Christian for the acts of some Christians, every Jew for the acts of some Jews.


GUILFOYLE: David (ph) says sufficient explanation.

GUTFELD: Well, in a way, I mean, President Obama treated the prayer breakfast the way Kanye West treated the Grammys. It was an opportunity to say, hey, you're not all that. But he reminds of the cliched freshman college students, comes home -- comes home for thanksgiving at a dinner wants to freak everybody out by dropping some knowledge on them that he got from his new radical professor. And -- it's always --

GUILFOYLE: In his women's studies class.

GUTFELD: Yes. And it's always about the power -- the powerful versus the powerless. To him a killer bee is just a bee that's fought imperialism from other bees.

BECKEL: Do you notice how many kids leave for college as capitalists and come back at thanksgiving as communists.

GUTFELD: How does that happen?

BECKEL: I have no idea.


BECKEL: But -- you know Axelrod's answer, he was not there. Why Obama doesn't give somewhere near the same answer, I think -- I don't get some (inaudible) It was an understandable statement of Axelrod.

GUILFOYLE: Eric is it as simple as people are saying that President Obama is not doing a very good job this week, explaining himself and (inaudible) is in rhetoric. I mean, what's the explanation?

BOLLING: I'm trying to figure out why, and Axelrod points this out, he knew what he was doing. If he knew what he was doing, why did he -- why did he ain't do it. And number two, why did they -- decide to write this speech for him. This is a prayer breakfast. Are you supposed to be provocative about people dying at a prayer breakfast or are you supposed to be praying, uniting? You're laughing, but I'm trying to be --

BECKEL: No. I just that --

BOLLING: I would guarantee you if they had that speech to do over again, that wouldn't be in the speech, the next time.


GUILFOYLE: What he did essentially, yeah, Dana, he was poking the cage with the Christians inside.


PERINO: I think we've established that it probably wasn't the best -- if you wanted to have this teachable moment, maybe you could have found another place to do it than at the national prayer breakfast. But, he -- I guess he had the intended effect. What they should have done though, you have an obligation when you're in the White House to make sure what the president is going to say is true. And you can call a couple of historians and just check it out. If you look at the New York Times story that run Saturday morning on February 26th about this speech, they quote several historians who say that actually, very few historians have the view that President Obama had. Everybody has moved past that and now the consensus view by the historians, not Republicans. The historians, is that, how he described it is not how it happened. And so --


PERINO: That would -- I mean, they could have done a little bit more fact checking. If the president wanted to include that in his speech just -- they have an obligation to him to help him get it right.

GUTFELD: It was an adolescent comment. It's like a YouTube comment on a cat video. I mean, there wasn't -- but there was no intellect in that.

BOLLING: Unless -- one other alternate theory would be that he got so burned when Ben Carson stood up and took him --

GUTFELD: On current (ph) event.

BOLLING: Took Obamacare apart that this was his moment to make good on it. His moment to get back in the spotlight saying, I've got this now. Don't do it to me again, and it made it worse.

GUTFELD: What they --

PERINO: What I mean, they said the president wanted it to be provocative but he didn't expect a full throated day long debate.

BECKEL: What would the historians -- I mean, I must be missing something here. They weren't denying there were crusades, right?

PERINO: No. But the reasons for the crusades were not about...

GUILFOYLE: No. Justification --

PERINO: Going after Muslims but about sacred territory.


BECKEL: I got you. I got you, I got you.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, OK. It's important to get your facts right.

PERINO: I gave you --

GUILFOYLE: The White House confirms the death of a fourth American ISIS hostage as a former CIA official casts, doubt on the administration strategy to defeat the terror network, next.


PERINO: Today, White House confirmed a fourth American hostage of ISIS is dead, 26-year-old Kaya -- excuse me, Kayla.


EARNEST: Over the weekend. Kayla's parents received the private message from her ISIL captors, with additional information about her death. That information was shared with the intelligence community. They conducted a review and an analysis and after that analysis was completed they concluded that Kayla has, in fact, died.


PERINO: The terror network claimed Mueller was killed by a Jordanian airstrike in Syria last week, but U.S. Intelligence has not found evidence of that. The White House also reported at least one other American is being held in the Middle East. The news comes as concerns grow over the administration's strategy to defeat ISIS, here's CIA Deputy Director Mike Morell -- former.


MICHAEL MORELL, FORMER DEPUTY DIRECTOR OF THE CIA: One of the things that has happened over the last six months, as we have conducted airstrikes against ISIS in Iraq and Syria, is that their brand is spreading. And this is happening at a speed much greater than al-Qaeda's brand ever spread. The only thing we can do is take the fight to these guys in Iraq and Syria because, as long as there's a perception that they are winning, as long as they are doing well there, their brand is going to continue to spread.


PERINO: And in order to address that spreading, Kimberly...


PERINO: The United States is about to embark on another debate about the use of military force. The White House is now -- finally, has put forward language to the Senate, asking for the authorization to use military force -- that's called an AUMF...


PERINO: That they -- now say that they need. And I think that that's good turnabout, that -- we're gonna have this debate, we should at least have the White House's input.

GUILFOYLE: Yeah, about time and four hostage deaths too late. That's the problem here. You know, just like we had the information, direct Intel to be able to go and rescue these hostages. The Obama administration waited seven weeks. They were moved, they were -- and Catherine Herridge, reporting for Fox News and there were three specific sites and they were being rotated amongst those sites and when you hesitate, you lose. Time kills all deals and rescue operations. You have to have that element of surprise. So when I see things like this and it's a failure to act, I would hope that we would learn, because we shouldn't tolerate anymore of this. There has to be some specific leadership. There were people put in office that we wanted a change in America. Let's see them bring about that change and put the pressure on the administration and feet to the fire.

PERINO: Bob, I actually don't think that the administration needs a new authorization to use military force. I think the one from 2001 suffices is -- but the problem for the White House is in July, they said they didn't no longer needed that. Now ISIS on the scene and they say they want a different one. Something they've done that -- troubling to some Democrats apparently, and I wonder if you could talk about their concern. Is -- it used to be before they sent this language that they were going to limit the geographical area for which you could target people. That actually has been taken out. So now I guess that we are back to a global war on terror.

BECKEL: Well, yeah. I mean, that's -- I thought that was the most interesting part. And also, the existing troops that are there now and I'm curious how many -- this is gonna add up to. But -- you know, frankly, I find it hard to believe that they didn't act -- if they thought they could save hostages and they had Intel and told them where they were, why would they stop doing it? I mean, that I don't understand. Not because they chose among dead --

GUILFOYLE: It's in the history of hesitation and failure to act in a timely fashion. That has been well-documented. We have six years of this. Doesn't mean that eventually they're going to try to come around to do the right thing, but the element of surprise and of timeliness is crucial, especially to clandestine operations like this Bob...

BECKEL: Right.

GUILFOYLE: And anyone involved in that will tell you that.

PERINO: Can I get Eric -- I wanted to ask. It probably a good thing for the president that these Republicans took over the Senate, because they're more likely to give him what he wants.

BOLLING: Yeah, he'll probably get what he wants. There's so much news that came out in the last 24 hours that the Jordanians have now put thousands of troops on the Jordan border to -- kind of thwart any further ISIS. The UAE -- what?

BECKEL: The Iraqi border.

BOLLING: On their own side of the border...

BECKEL: Yeah --

BOLLING: Right. But -- more so to show of force to the -- to the ISIS fighters. Also the UAE has now started -- has resumed the airstrikes. I'm thinking that a lot of this has to do with Jordan being so successful with their airstrikes. A quick thought. Look, the Iraqi army has hundreds of thousands of -- personnel, 250,000 Kurd Peshmerga in the area. The airstrikes seem to be softening them up a little bit. There -- is it, am I crazy to say, draw a line. Make it -- draw a line saying -- I don't know, March 1st, April 1st, whatever the date is. If you're friendly and in the area of ISIS, your life is at risk and that day, just unleash hell on them, drop bombs, carpet bombs and if people -- there's collateral damage, they've been warned. I don't know, it just seems like rather than putting our own --

PERINO: You should --you should write that up and we'll send it over to Pentagon.

BECKEL: You know, who's -- who's --

PERINO: Let me get Greg in here before we have a minute left. I want to get your thoughts. Because, there are generals like General John Allen and then you have Secretary of State Kerry, yesterday saying, everything is going very smoothly. Then you hear from Former CIA Deputy Director Mike Morell saying, no, we're not in good shape here...


PERINO: What do you think the truth is?

GUTFELD: Do you ever like --

PERINO: Morell?

GUTFELD: You go to those weird bars, would you ever see those drunk guys fighting and there's always a strategy that you wait for the drunk guy to pass out from exhaustion, from throwing punches until they fall over. That's their strategy. They keep thinking that somehow ISIS is gonna be to be exhausted, but they forget the problem is there's no exhaustion when you keep getting an influx of new fighters. They're never gonna get tired...

GUILFOYLE: But don't get it.

GUTFELD: Especially, if they're winning. I have --

GUILFOYLE: Every good fighter knows the first punch wins the fight.

GUTFELD: Exactly, especially in the right spot. My solution is, you know police have these stings where they send out letters saying you've won a new boat, Bob, you probably gotten this...

BECKEL: I have.

GUTFELD: And you go, you show up at the convention to get a boat and you get arrested because you have an outstanding warrant. I think -- I think our government needs to create attractions, like a bug lamp to get the roaches to coming to them. Whether it is creating a fake outpost or a fake magazine like Charlie Hebdo, that -- that entices terror to create places for ISIS to flock to, so you can then bomb them. Whether it's a place that you believe there are aide workers, or where there are troops. But just something -- I think we need to be every bit as evil and as devious as they are, because the difference between Jordan and the United States is ISIS didn't know what Jordan would do. With Jordan, they kicked a hornet's nest and with the United States they've been knocking on a hollow log. It's time to change.

BECEKL: Now let me -- Eric, mentioned they're acting. They've got hundreds of thousands that we trained to the extent of hundreds of millions of dollars and they were the first ones to cut and run in the face of ISIS.

PERINO: OK. I don't want to get into that debate again...

GUILFOYLE: I don't have (inaudible). They're our allies.

PEIRNO: But I could, no kidding.


PERINO: Especially, leading them without the training that they needed. Alright, how does someone that owes our country millions of dollars in taxes get so much access to the president? Not to mention his respect -- that's their word. White House insider David Axelrod, on the relationship between President Obama and Al Sharpton, next.


BOLLING: A new report out shows just how close President Obama is to the divisive civil rights leader and known tax evader Al Sharpton. According to the Wall Street Journal, the MSNBC host couldn't attend Nelson Mandela's funeral on 2013, so President Obama brought him back a momentum, (ph) assigned program with the note, praising Sharpton for being a fellow warrior of justice. Sharpton has visited the White House more than 70 times despite his inflammatory rhetoric on race and owing millions of dollars in taxes. Listen to David Axelrod try to explain the relationship.


AXELROD: Al Sharpton is widely regarded as a leader within the African- American community...

O'REILLY: You think the president respects him? Do you think the president respects Al Sharpton?

AXELROD: Well, I think he respects his -- leadership on some of these issues -- on these civil rights issues, yes, I do.

O'REILLY: He owes millions of dollars to the IRS, his organization, millions of dollars. Is there any other American in the White House who owes millions of dollars to the IRS?

AXELROD: I don't know, I haven't gone through the tax returns of people coming to the White House.

O'REILLY: But isn't that strange? Isn't that strange?

AXELROD: No, I don't think it's strange.


BOLLING: Man, that was a -- that was a wide ranging interview last night, Greg.

GUTFELD: You know when -- when faced with Islamic terror, the president compels us to remember the crusades, which happened 800 or some odd years ago. So I would just humbly ask him to remember 28 years ago, not too far, Tawana Brawley and Al Sharpton ended in lives ruined. Freddie's Fashion Mart and Al Sharpton lend lead -- ended in death. The Crown Heights riots, ended in looting and injury, that was with Al Sharpton. Yankel Rosenbaum stabbed to death murdered after Al Sharpton protests. Anthony Garcia was -- was also murdered during that period. Then you have Wenjian Liu and Rafael Ramos, the two police officers killed. Only two months ago after there were protest, some of them lead by Al Sharpton.

I would ask President Obama to remember that in the context of his -- of whatever beliefs he has if he can. Because maybe that should inform his decisions about who he has in the White House.

BOLLING: Can I bring this to Bob? Bob, if I evade my taxes, I get an invite to Rikers. Al Sharpton debates taxes, he gets an invite to the White House 70 something times.

BECKEL: You get an invite to Rikers? To Rikers Island?

BOLLING: If I evade taxes I do.

BECKEL: The one thing I will say, and I want to come to Axelrod's defense on this. I think it's right. We don't have -- whether we like Sharpton or not, it is the black community that makes the decision on who their leaders are. And they just happen to believe Sharpton is one of their leaders.

Now, we can think what a dumb thing that is, what's wrong about it, but it is what it is. And so, among the black community, Al Sharpton is seen as a leader. And so that can't be taken away from him.

BOLLING: Nobody is trying to take that away, Dana. We're trying to figure out why he gets invited to the White House a lot.

PERINO: Well, I think that what Bob is saying is probably true from their perspective, and also I guess the owing of the taxes doesn't really bother them. The only thing that bothers them is that there was legitimate nonprofit Tea Party groups that wanted to get their due designation, and they were all targeted as a result of it.

I would have asked that. That would have been my follow-up question.

GUTFELD: Can I just respond to what Bob -- answer this question. Why Al Sharpton and not Allen West or Mia Love or Thomas Sowell or Ben Carson? It's because they aren't liberal. And they aren't accepted by the media.

GUILFOYLE: They're not cool. They're not in the bag for the president and with the mainstream media.

BOLLING: Do we not have a problem with Al Sharpton literally saying that he was going to be involved in picking the next attorney general, and the attorney general prosecutes tax evaders.

GUILFOYLE: Yes, well, I mean, Loretta Lynch.

PERINO: She should go after him.

BOLLING: Wouldn't that be good?

GUILFOYLE: That would be amazing. She should. You have to uphold the law. I don't understand why this guy is given a pass. I mean, this is the ultimate, "Hey, we're BFFs. Don't worry. You don't have to pay Uncle Sam. It's all good. I'll make up the difference from the Tea Party folks.

I think the president actually likes this guy. Look at his face and his smile. I don't even think he's faking it.

PERINO: It's genuine.

GUILFOYLE: It's genuine. I'm telling you, it's not just about, oh, you know, African-American groups like him, or liberal groups like him, or community groups. It's not. He likes this guy, I'm telling you.

GUTFELD: Every community, however, has its own fraud to embrace. You've got to remember the crooked evangelists from the '70s and '80s. Sharpton may just be the latest in a long line of them.

BECKEL: But I wonder what you just said about West, is that he, Sharpton, is liberal. The black community is overwhelmingly liberal. And that's probably why.

GUTFELD: However, they're also very conservative. They are pro-life; they were against gay marriage.

BECKEL: Back to my point: Why are they not campaigning? Why are Republicans campaigning?

GUTFELD: They have. But they -- when Romney went to Philadelphia...

GUILFOYLE: They're making inroads.

BECKEL: Romney didn't. And...

GUTFELD: Did great.

GUILFOYLE: They're making inroads.

BECKEL: What's the name of -- who's your senator again? I'm sorry.


BECKEL: Rand Paul went to Detroit.

BOLLING: He's not my senator. He's the Kentucky senator.

BECKEL: Well, I think he's your senator at heart.

GUILFOYLE: Like Ted Cruz is yours?

BOLLING: They want us to go. The American sniper murder trial coming up next, and then lots of speculation on the Brian Williams situation. We're going to tell you what we know and don't know.

GUILFOYLE: We know a lot?


GUTFELD: The mother of Chris Kyle's alleged killer warned the world that her son was in danger, frantically calling the police about his behavior. He was placed in psych care but released days later. We know what happened next.

Chris Kyle's murder was shocking, given the victim, but not so surprising when you hear this from the "Journal of the American Medical Association."

"Today's state-run psych units hold 45,000 patients, less than 1/10 that were housed in 1995. That's a 95 percent drop, factoring in the U.S. population doubling since then." Which may be why, as crime drops, we still hear of grisly acts committed by people who shouldn't be on the streets.

The problem is, we have nowhere to put them. It's the fake logic of closing Gitmo. We shut something down with no thought of a replacement. And, so, the sick wander and bring anguish to their families.

There are many examples: unbalanced men pushing women in front of subway trains, overmedicated teens shooting up schools, loners flashing pedestrians. Why is there no place to put them?

There's enough blame to go around. Decades ago mental-health asylums were truly scary. But we let that image kill any potential for improvement. We closed them down, making the streets their home.

As the researchers point out, it's time to move beyond stigmas and rebuild these institutions. Asylum should be a good thing, and it might have saved Chris Kyle, had it been a real thing.

K.G., you are the legal mind, and you lived in California. We -- that state shut a lot of places down. And there was an expectation that communities could have handled them, but it wasn't. There was no plan. And so there are -- we have people on the streets who are dangerous to themselves and others.

GUILFOYLE: Yes. The problem is people ran from it, right? And instead of trying to fix it or make it better, make it a place where people could go and get actual treatment, we didn't do it. So you have seen a tremendous amount of people that suffer from mental illness being housed, essentially, in the criminal justice system.


GUILFOYLE: And studies have shown that they're woefully inadequate to provide the treatment they need. These are people who engage in a number of conducts, misbehavior problems, and they end up getting put into solitary confinement, which also just proves to exacerbate the problem, worsens the condition, and it's a spiral that they're unable to get out of. When they are released, they are even more incapable of coping, and they re-offend.

GUTFELD: Absolutely.

GUILFOYLE: Hence the recidivism.

GUTFELD: Yes. The guy that punched that guy to death in Union Square in and out of prison. The guy that killed the police officers had been in and out of prisons. All of these people.

Bob, both political parties in my view are guilty for this. You have the left who fought for patient rights and conservatives who saw it as an argument to cut government spending. What should be done?

BECKEL: Well, two things happen here almost simultaneously. A number of court cases that got brought forward to try to release these people. And they won. And so they were released.

There also were a string of nasty stories. Geraldo Rivera did one.


BECKEL: On Staten Island. And these places were, when you look at them, like my God. (UNINTELLIGIBLE)


BECKEL: The problem is you put them out, and they're out on the street. I know a number of them are friends are mine. And they have -- a lot of these people are -- have no more reason to be out there than a serial killer. They are ticking time bombs ready to go off. And nobody has dealt with it.

GUILFOYLE: Affecting society and public safety.

BOLLING: So you're right. The sick wander, and they wander into the E.R.s. E.R. doctors are slammed. They don't have beds, so they're medicated and sent back out on the streets until they wander back in and -- or a bed opens up.

Help me out, Dana. The congressman or he ran for Congress in Maryland or Virginia. His son...

PERINO: Creigh Deeds. Virginia.

BOLLING: There was a great documentary that Creigh Deeds was a part of, talking about how his son kept having to look for a bed. There were no beds available. Maybe four or five days later there would be a bed available for a day or two to go in and come back out. It turns out what happened was Creigh Deeds' son went back to the house, tried to kill Craig Deeds, and he was subsequently killed and Creigh was shot. I mean, it's a problem. What is the answer?


BOLLING: In this documentary, it points out, unless you're willing to really step up and spend a lot of money, there is no answer.

GUTFELD: Also, we romanticize the idea of, like, your individual rights. No matter how mentally ill you are, you are allowed the right to be on the streets. And that in a way the homeless man becomes symbolic of this.

GUILFOYLE: Like Virginia Tech, you're right. Everyone was afraid to offend him or to turn him in. But they knew that they had this problem. That it costs lives. And you're turning your back on people with serious mental illness. And they're vulnerable, too. We deserve -- they deserve a right to be helped. And we should do more about it.

PERINO: I would say there's three things. The compassionate side of us should say we should do something.

I also think that there is a public safety cost/benefit. So if you want to get technical about the budget, you might be able to do that.

But the -- I think this would be the right thing to do for the working and the middle class. That's because Creigh Deeds was a person of some means and ability and connections...


PERINO: ... to be able to figure out the system, try to figure out how to get his son somewhere. People that are in the middle class or the working class, that are needing help, they call people and say, "I think my son is in danger."

GUTFELD: Danger.

PERINO: They have no support. They're lost and need some help.

GUTFELD: That's the worst.

PERINO: And the compassionate thing to do would be to help those families and also, in the name of public safety, help everybody else.

GUTFELD: It's such a good point.

BECKEL: These states that house people who sell marijuana in small amounts or get arrested for smoking marijuana, they should clean out those people and get some beds available for these people.

BOLLING: That is a great...

GUILFOYLE: County jail, not state prison, unfortunately.

BECKEL: Well, whatever. I mean, there is some bed space if you get those -- some of those lower end marijuana users out.

GUTFELD: And they could just devote the funds to taking care of...

BECKEL: Yes, that's right.

GUTFELD: Yes. All right. We've got to go.

Next, if Brian Williams doesn't make it through his war story scandal, Matt Drudge, the one in the hat, thinks he knows his replacement. The name ahead.



BECKEL: That's White Stripes, by the way.

A big drop in the trust factor for Brian Williams. Before the Iraqi chopper story scandal, he was 23rd most trusted person in America, according to an influential research firm. Now he's down to 835.


BECKEL: I wonder -- you know. No decision yet on his fate, but the Drudge Report is suspecting that Savannah Guthrie could be first in line to replace him.

All right, Kimberly, what do you think?

GUILFOYLE: I like Savannah. She's a friend of mine. I worked with her at Court TV, and I think perhaps they're looking at her because of her White House contacts and her time, you know, reporting on the Hill. So she's got some great elements, you know, in that aspect, but I don't know. Isn't she on "The Today Show"? Who's going to replace her there?

BECKEL: I don't know. Some people say "The Today Show" is more important to NBC in terms of money than the "Nightly News" is.

What do you think?

BOLLING: A couple thoughts. NBC says they're going to make an announcement fairly soon on what they're going to do. Hopefully, they do.

Lester Holt, love that. I hear he's at the top of the list, as well. That would be my pick if I were NBC management.

But my problem, we're burying the lead here, that Brian Williams is now 835th on the list of trustworthy -- trust factor, whatever. And that ties him with Willie Robertson. That is just so unfair to Willie. Willie should be so much higher than Brian Williams right now.

BECKEL: How long is that list?

GUTFELD: I'm not even 835 in this building.

GUILFOYLE: You're behind the unicorn with the fanny pack.

GUTFELD: I know I'm in front of Doocy, though. I don't trust that guy.

GUILFOYLE: Wait. You're in front of -- wait.

BECKEL: What would you like to see? What would you like to see?

GUTFELD: Well, I think it's a no brainer. You've got Rosie O'Donnell leaving "The View." And...

PERINO: Because of stress.

GUTFELD: Because of stress. Because doing an hour show is tough. Forty-two minutes is...

GUILFOYLE: Maybe 30 will be better.

GUTFELD: Put her in, and then Brian Williams can do "The View." And he can regale them with his stories, because he desperately wants to be liked; and "The View" is the place to do it.

BECKEL: All right, Dana, you've got a favorite.

GUILFOYLE: What a swap.


BECKEL: I thought you did.

PERINO: No. In who should replace Brian Williams? I don't even know if Brian Williams is going to leave. I think that we have to wait and see that.

I am curious about one thing. So he keeps saying that he made mistakes. So mistakes -- it's like you can make a mistake once, twice or - - but I don't see embellishing a story and lying about it as a mistake. I don't understand how all of a sudden we've turned it into a mistake. It's just weird language.

GUTFELD: He keeps saying he saw all these dead people. He's like that kid in "The Sixth Sense."

BECKEL: Well, you know, the thing about it is whether he is, he stays on or he's the former, does it really matter anymore? I mean, the network anchors are just not nearly as important as they used to be.

GUILFOYLE: You said that yesterday.

BECKEL: I know. That's because...

PERINO: I guess they're not, but I love the news.

BECKEL: ... if I had a psychiatric problem. No, seriously, I just don't think it's that big a deal.

PERINO: Well, I think it's -- I have always loved the news. I love the network news, love cable news, love all sorts of news.

GUTFELD: Huey Lewis.

PERINO: And the News?

GUTFELD: No, Huey Lewis should replace him, and they should call it "Huey Lewis and the News." And he gets on there, he just does the news. That's the solution, America.

PERINO: Better than rapping the news.

GUTFELD: Rap the news.

BOLLING: One of the other problems is that he was -- he was managing editor of the editorial voice that is NBC News, too, and when you have the guy who is managing editor who's also been found to be fraudulent in the past, admitted to be fraudulent in the past, they've lost a lot of credibility. Credibility is all they have at 6 -- 6 p.m., 6:30.

BECKEL: Well, it's also got his name on it. Right? It's "NBC Nightly News with Brian Williams."

GUILFOYLE: And Savannah just did the interview with the president.

BECKEL: She did.

GUTFELD: How about Matthew McConaughey?

BECKEL: Since...

GUILFOYLE: He's good in every role he plays.

BECKEL: I got blamed with a right hook by Kimberly, saying, I said -- "You said that yesterday." OK, I'll say it tomorrow.

All right. "One More Thing," up next.

GUILFOYLE: Right hook? Deal with it.


GUILFOYLE: Time now for "One More Thing." How you doing? Dana.

PERINO: OK, I get to go first, because if you missed it last night, you want to see this. And if you -- you're going to want to go to our Facebook page and watch the entire thing, because "Red Eye" had an all-star cast last night. You've got to see it.


GUTFELD: Joining me now to discuss, we have former CIA operative and current president at Diligence, Mike Baker; John Bolton; Shepard Smith, Geraldo Rivera; Phil Keating; Craig Jarrett; Charles Payne; Arthur Aidala; Oliver North. We have the legendary actor, Nicolas Cage. John McCain is joining us, as well. Real big ups to Mitt Romney.

Rounding out the panel, we've got actor, writer and political commentator, Ben Stein. Rosie O'Donnell; Brian Kilmeade; and finally, we have Kentucky Senator Rand Paul.

We're now being told in my ear that we've run out of time.


PERINO: Not that that ever happens on cable news.

GUTFELD: No, not at all.

PERINO: Watch the whole thing on "The Five" Facebook page.

BOLLING: That was a good one.

GUILFOYLE: That was a good one.

PERINO: How do you get on that show?

GUILFOYLE: She's going to be busy with "NBC Nightly News," though.


GUILFOYLE: So save that one for the reel.

Greg, you're up.

GUTFELD: When we were talking about Super Bowl commercials, I said that I think my favorite one was Loctite, which is this weird little glue. Apparently, they're fans. Fans enough to know that my unicorn horn is broken and they sent me some glue, but sent me a fanny pack for my unicorn, which is very nice. Which is great. Because what he carries in there is his ChapStick...


GUTFELD: He has a small handgun and he has a neck massager that he ordered from the back of "Parade" magazine. It's only for his neck, though.

BOLLING: Not his horn.

GUILFOYLE: I just don't understand how poor "Special Report" follows us.

PERINO: What are you supposed to do with this thing. Like, a real person?

GUILFOYLE: All right.

BOLLING: With the rhino, though, are the horns made of hair or is it...

PERINO: Ivory, I think.

BOLLING: It's ivory?

Do you know?

GUTFELD: I don't know.

GUILFOYLE: I just wanted to know what flavor ChapStick. That's the thing.

GUTFELD: Made of candy. Candy and love.

PERINO: Strawberry.

GUILFOYLE: Strawberry?

BECKEL: Are we going to spend any more time on the unicorn?

GUILFOYLE: We are unicorn (UNINTELLIGIBLE). Bolling.

BOLLING: OK, so, as you know, we've been updating you every Tuesday on the -- Geraldo's participation on "Celebrity Apprentice." Last night, right off the bat, Vivica Fox was fired, leaving just two. That's Geraldo and Leeza Gibbons.

GUILFOYLE: We called it.

BOLLING: We did. Take a listen to Geraldo last night.



GERALDO RIVERA, FOX NEWS: This task is the do or die for me. From now on, I'm going to -- I'm in charge of every shot, I'm sorry. This is (EXPLETIVE DELETED).


BOLLING: All right, so it's down to two, Geraldo and Leeza, and next week's going to be the finale. And I don't know. I think our man pulls it out.

GUTFELD: I hope he doesn't pull it out.

GUILFOYLE: It's a live finale. Very exciting.

GUTFELD: You know. It's a family show.

GUILFOYLE: You've ruined it.

BOLLING: I walked into that.

GUILFOYLE: Go, Geraldo. We're rooting for you! Yes, bring on the victory to FOX News.

Bob, do your best to restore some credibility to this show.

BECKEL: I want to go right to executions. In the state of Oklahoma, the home state of our producer, which makes some sense when you hear the story, Oklahoma has a case in front of the Supreme Court, because they botched an execution using injections. And the -- so there was a case taken against them.

Well, an Oklahoma woman, not wanting to be outdone, want to be sure they get their execution right, guess this -- guess what they're going to do? They're going to introduce two -- bill in the Oklahoma state legislature to bring back the gas chamber. Now, that is forward thinking on the part of Oklahomans. Okies.

PERINO: Well, maybe they have good reason to consider that, Bob.

BECKEL: Well, that was...

PERINO: And you're talking a gas chamber from 19, you know, 20.

GUTFELD: Your luck's running out, Dana.

BECKEL: Yes. Gas is gas, baby.

PERINO: What did the guy do?


PERINO: What did the guy do?

BECKEL: He stepped on a unicorn.

GUTFELD: I'm sure he did something far worse.

BECKEL: I don't know.

BOLLING: You should have looked that up.

GUILFOYLE: Listen, I'm...

BECKEL: Are we out of time here?

GUILFOYLE: No. I'm going to try and save this show. I don't know if I can do it or not. I mean...

PERINO: Good luck.

GUILFOYLE: I may need some "Lock It" or "Tight It." Whatever you call it.

But I've got a happy story for those of you that want to smile.

GUTFELD: Yes, I do.

GUILFOYLE: All right, so a young man was going for a job interview at Chick-Fil-A, tasty place, and he needed to tie. So he went to his local Target store to be able to pick up one of those clip-on ties that are very handy, but they were out. Yes. So he had to buy a regular tie. But the problem is, he didn't really know how to tie it.

That's where Dennis Roberts, an employee at the store in Raleigh, North Carolina, helps him -- you see the picture -- put on the tie. The whole deal. And this young man then returned back to this Target store to be able to thank everybody for this. And I sure hope he gets a job at Chick-Fil-A.

PERINO: Yes, hire him.


YASIR MOORE, TEEN IN VIRAL TARGET PICTURE: One of the best days that ever happened to me. When he told me his advice, it got my confidence back. You usually only see friends help you. Or even your family help you do that kind of stuff. Not just strangers that you never met before.


GUILFOYLE: Chick-Fil-A, hire Yasir Moore. Do it now.

"Special Report"...

PERINO: You know, the president should invite all of those folks to the White House.

GUILFOYLE: ... is next.

PERINO: Don't you think?

Content and Programming Copyright 2015 Fox News Network, LLC. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Copyright 2015 Roll Call, Inc. All materials herein are protected by United States copyright law and may not be reproduced, distributed, transmitted, displayed, published or broadcast without the prior written permission of Roll Call. You may not alter or remove any trademark, copyright or other notice from copies of the content.