Former Terrorist, Former Nazi Speak at Columbia Univ.

This is a partial transcript from "Hannity & Colmes," October 12, 2006, that has been edited for clarity.

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SEAN HANNITY, CO-HOST: And that was the scene at Columbia University last week when student protestors disrupted a speech by the co-founder of the Minuteman Project during an event sponsored by the College Republicans.

Last night the College Republicans sponsored another event, this one featuring a reformed former terrorist and fascist, and Columbia security only allowed a few dozen people into the auditorium after promising to allow a much larger audience.

Joining us now is the reformed terrorist, Zachariah Anani is with us. And a former member of Hitler's Nazi — Nazi Youth, Hilmar Von Campe is with us.

All right. Let me start if I can here with Zachariah. You, as I look at your background and the things that you stood for, you were a teenage militia fighter. So you describe yourself as a terrorist.

ZACHARIAH ANANI, REFORMED TERRORIST: True. That's true.

HANNITY: What specifically was your goal? Your motivation? What was your thinking at the time and what did you do?

ANANI: Well, at the very beginning I was brought up in a dedicated Muslim family, and that's how I started my indoctrination since I was 3 years old.

And then I joined militant fragments, and by that time I was indoctrinated and trained and equipped to fight the Israeli army and hating the Jews and the Christians and the Americans.

HANNITY: Yes. You admit, you say you were trained to fight, kill Jews, to hate Christians and hate Americans. You say every time I killed someone and two or three fighters witnessed it, they would give me a point on my chart. You killed 223 people.

ANANI: That's what my chart says, yes.

HANNITY: Is that what you think, you killed 223 people? You believe you did?

ANANI: Yes. That's equivalent of fights I went on in 40 years of my life on the streets of Beirut.

HANNITY: So now you've changed your mindset. You feel like you were indoctrinated into this ideology of hate. We keep using the term Islamic fascist, and people don't like that term, but there is the use of religion to justify killing and hatred. You're saying you were a part of that.

ANANI: Yes, it's true. Because what you have brought up on teachings is exactly what is obstructed from the Koran itself, where it teaches you to hate and kill the others who are not Muslims.

HANNITY: Hilmar Von Campe, let's talk about your background, your life. You were brought up in the Hitler Youth area.

HILMAR VON CAMPE, FORMER MEMBER OF HITLER YOUTH: Yes, I was seven years when Hitler took over.

HANNITY: Tell us about you. For example, you thought that as a soldier you were fighting for your country. You, in essence, feel you were brain washed.

VON CAMPE: Well, I was, but the reason why I was brainwashed, and I let myself be make a tool of Hitler's policy, was I was a bystander of what was my own lack of morality, that I couldn't see through what these people really were.

And my parents, especially my father, that had great difficulties because children could give away their parents. And my parents were anxious that we didn't get in the position to be talking about something which they were talking about that they were talking about. They didn't like the Nazis. So that therefore my father could not talk with me about many things.

ALAN COLMES, CO-HOST: We want to ask you about what happened last night at Columbia. Were you at all prevented from speaking? I mean, we saw some of the videotape here, but you were able to get your message out, right?

VON CAMPE: I thought that it would be all a thousand people in the beginning.

COLMES: Right. So maybe they were concerned about incidents, so they maybe tamped down the audience, but were you stopped in any way from giving your message?

VON CAMPE: No.

COLMES: And Mr. Anani, were you in any way stopped from giving your message last night?

ANANI: No, but as my friend said, unfortunately, they did not allow people who already were going to come in from coming in. So it's almost they didn't stop the speaker, but they stopped people from hearing.

COLMES: I understand that. But hopefully, if you want your message out there at least you did get a chance. And perhaps there was some concern because of what happened at Columbia last week. And you may have heard about that. We had the Minutemen on.

And there's some dispute as to actually who started the physicality last week, whether it was those who were pro-Minutemen or anti-Minutemen.

Mr. Von Campe, you did get a chance to get the message out.

VON CAMPE: But I did see before — I did see the video about that event before. That is no surprise for me. We had the — we call them Storm Troopers. Hitler had Storm Troopers who should shut up the opposition. And therefore, these people tried to do the same thing.

COLMES: They rushed the stage with banners last week, and that was wrong. But it seems like the first punch was thrown by those defending the Minutemen. That's where the violence came from. And that's wrong, too, isn't it?

VON CAMPE: I haven't seen that. I don't know. I know that the Minutemen did not go out to fight with these invaders, so to speak.

HANNITY: It's amazing. I guess the lesson is that there really is evil. An entire countries and populations can be brainwashed into doing these evil deeds for these evil dictators. Isn't that the story?

VON CAMPE: It's the story. We said in Germany, everyone has a small Hitler inside. So in other words, the evil you see, you may not have 100 percent, maybe you have only 1 percent, but there is evil in all of us.

HANNITY: We're seeing some evil in our time. We see it a lot with innocent people killed, and kids strap bombs on themselves, thinking they're going to heaven. That's evil in our time. Nine-eleven, that's evil.

Anyway, thank you both for being with us.

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