This is a RUSH transcript from "The O'Reilly Factor," November 11, 2009. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
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BILL O'REILLY, HOST: In the "Unresolved problem" segment tonight: There was an intense debate over whether public money should pay for abortions in the Obamacare legislation. The issue is still not defined, but there is no question abortion remains very controversial in this country.
Enter Abby Johnson, the former director of Planned Parenthood in Bryan, Texas. Ms. Johnson had a conversion and now believes abortion is wrong, so she's speaking out against Planned Parenthood, which is trying to stop her. And yesterday, a judge lifted a temporary gag order on Ms. Johnson, who joins us now from Houston, along with Shawn Carney, national campaign director for 40 Days for Life, an anti-abortion group.
Ms. Johnson, what — what does Planned Parenthood not want you to say and what do they fear?
ABBY JOHNSON, FORMER DIRECTOR, PLANNED PARENTHOOD, BRYAN, TEXAS: I think that they're nervous that I am going to continue to speak out and tell people that their business model has changed, and that, you know, this prevention that they preach about maybe is not really what Planned Parenthood is all about, and that, with the downward economy, they are really trying to increase their abortion numbers, because that is the most lucrative part of their business.
O'REILLY: Now, do you believe that, based upon what you saw in Bryan, Texas, do you believe that Planned Parenthood is an abortion mill trying to profit off that?
JOHNSON: Yes. I mean, I absolutely believe that. I mean, I saw them trying to increase their abortion numbers. I saw them increase their abortion numbers.
O'REILLY: Well, how do they do that? How do you increase an abortion number?
JOHNSON: Well, they increase their accessibility to abortion for women. So, for instance, the clinic that I worked at, usually we only did abortions every other Saturday. And they said, "You know what? That's not really enough. We really need to be able to open this up to allowing women to have abortions almost every day during the week.”
O'REILLY: OK. Now, your conversion from pro-abortion person to pro- life person, how did that happen?
JOHNSON: Well, I actually saw an ultrasound-guided abortion procedure, which is not very common in large abortion facilities like Planned Parenthood. They're a more lengthy procedure. But I did actually get to see an ultrasound-guided procedure, and what I saw on the screen was a 13-week baby fighting for its life.
O'REILLY: And instantly, you said, "This is wrong. I shouldn't be at Planned Parenthood. I should be pro-life"? Did that happen instantly?
JOHNSON: Well, what I saw was this baby fighting, and I had flashes in my head of my own daughter. I remembered having an ultrasound at 12 weeks with my own daughter. And I just was thinking, "What am I doing?" I was thinking, "I've never seen this before." And Planned Parenthood really tries to instill in their employees and the women that are coming in for abortions that this is not a baby, that this is just a mass of cells. You know, don't say "baby" in the clinic. Don't say "baby" to the women coming in for an abortion. And so you begin to believe that. You begin to believe that it's not a life.
O'REILLY: Mr. Carney, the court case that temporarily prevented Ms. Johnson from speaking about Planned Parenthood was pretty intense. They went after Abby pretty hard, did they not?
SHAWN CARNEY, NATIONAL CAMPAIGN DIRECTOR, 40 DAYS FOR LIFE: They did, Bill. And it shows that this organization refuses to accept, particularly from one of their own, that somebody can have a change of heart on this issue. And the judge threw it out because they presented no evidence that she had a breach of contract. She simply saw a baby fight for its life, only to obviously lose that fight before her eyes, and she changed her position. And she came to 40 Days for Life and knew that we would be accepting of her. We hold vigils across the country for people, obviously, having abortions, but also the people who work in this industry. And she trusted that. She was confident in it. And Planned Parenthood refuses to accept that.
O'REILLY: Well, obviously, it's a very emotional issue. Now, in your experience, do you demonize women who have abortions, Mr. Carney? Do you guys do that kind of stuff? Because that really makes Americans uncomfortable.
CARNEY: Right. And this is a peaceful effort. This is why we're there, obviously, for the women who are going into the clinics for abortions. And we're also there for women who work in this industry. Abby is actually the 26th abortion clinic worker who has approached us after her clinic was the site of one of our vigils. They left that industry. Abby is the only Planned Parenthood director who had a conversion and left her job. But we are there for these workers…
O'REILLY: But it's a soft persuasion?
CARNEY: ...can't leave, and the pro-lifers have to be there to support them and not judge them and not be radical.
O'REILLY: It's a soft persuasion.
CARNEY: Absolutely. This is a peaceful effort. It's not violent. It's approachable. And Abby's case proves that because she felt the warmth of the people out there, and that's why she left that industry and had somewhere to go.
O'REILLY: All right. Very interesting story. Ms. Johnson, Mr. Carney, we appreciate you coming on "The Factor" this evening.
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