This is a partial transcript from The O'Reilly Factor, November 19, 2001.

JOHN GIBSON, GUEST HOST:  In the Personal Story segment tonight, controversy surrounding the Pledge of Allegiance in Madison, Wisconsin.  Last month radio talk show host Chris Krok spoke out at a school board meeting against their decision to ban the pledge.  The remarks he made to one school board member whom he thought was Vietnamese got him labeled a racist.

Joining us now from Madison, Wisconsin, is the man at the center of the controversy, WTDY-AM radio talk show host Chris Krok.

So Chris, you were trying to support the notion that kids ought to be compelled to do the -- say the Pledge of Allegiance.  How did you manage to get caught up in the racism charge?

CHRIS KROK, RADIO TALK SHOW HOST:  Well, John, first of all, if I may, let me apologize on behalf of these five school board members of the Madison Metropolitan School District and apologize to the nation on Fox News, on The O'Reilly Factor...

GIBSON:  Well, tell them what happened first.

KROK:  ... for these five people.

GIBSON:  Tell them what happened first.

KROK:  (UNINTELLIGIBLE) -- sure.  What happened is, first of all, this man is a Vietnamese refugee.  He's Laotian.  He's Hmong, which means from the mountainous regions of countries such as Laos, and...

GIBSON:  So what did you do to him?

KROK:  ... and -- well, I didn't do anything to the gentleman.  I spoke my mind, and, and, and, and, and in, in a society, in a city that's supposed to be tolerant, they will be tolerant if it supports their views, not ours...

GIBSON:  All right, let me, let me put it this way...

KROK:  ... a more conservative view.

GIBSON:  ... he said, he was quoted before the meeting, and his name is Shwa Vang (ph), right?

KROK:  Yes, See-saw Shwa, he votes yea and nay on the same thing twice like he did on this pledge.

GIBSON:  OK.  He said before the meeting, "Doing the Pledge of Allegiance builds support for war."  Then you addressed the meeting, and you said what?

KROK:  I addressed the meeting, I said, "I respect you as a person from Vietnam."  Immediately the 10 percent out of 1,200 people at this meeting, 10 percent of them were against the pledge, the rest of them were for it...

GIBSON:  Now, wait a minute...

KROK:  ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

GIBSON:  ... the quote here is, "Maybe in Vietnam saying the pledge builds support for war, but in America, it supports our country."

KROK:  Well, yes, he's a Vietnamese refugee, and, and they attacked me, they called me racist in the middle of my speech because I said that.  But the fact of the matter is, if you look, this man is a Vietnamese refugee and he's from Laos.  And in the Vietnamese national anthem, it says, "Soldiers, we go forward."  And in "The New Yorker" today, I'm attacked as well in "The New Yorker" today, John, I'll have you know, and in that, they try to brand me a racist as well.

The deal is this.  He said saying the pledge builds support for war.  I said, Maybe in Vietnam it does.  And you know what?  He even indicates that in "The New Yorker" today.  It does there, but not here.

So I said, "This is America.  I'm an intelligent American.  I graduated summa cum laude, the fact of the matter is... "

GIBSON:  But you were trying to make the point...

KROK:  "... there's no reasonable explanation."

GIBSON:  ... Chris, you were trying to make the point...

KROK:  Yes.

GIBSON:  ... that the Pledge of Allegiance is not a bad thing for the nation's little kiddies.

KROK:  No.

GIBSON:  Correct?

KROK:  Where, where in "One nation, under God, with liberty and justice for all," is there a saying, Get your gun and shoot somebody?  Now, in the Vietnamese national anthem...

GIBSON:  But why did...

KROK:  ... it does say that.

GIBSON:  But why did you bring...

KROK:  And (UNINTELLIGIBLE).

GIBSON:  ... the Vietnamese stuff into it at all?

KROK:  Because I couldn't think -- as an intelligent American, I could think, John, what other reasonable explanation?  This man makes a big point of being from another country.  At -- what other reasonable -- John, can you come up with a reason explanation?

GIBSON:  Yes, I can, Chris.

KROK:  OK, how does (UNINTELLIGIBLE) of the U.S....

GIBSON:  He's from Madison, Wisconsin.

KROK:  ... build...

GIBSON:  That's wiss (ph) the problem is.  You might as well say he's from Berkeley.

KROK:  No.  The problem is, a few people, a handful of people with a lot of free time...

GIBSON:  It's not (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

KROK:  ... and some letterhead collared this man.

GIBSON:  ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE), he's from Madison.

KROK:  Excuse me?

GIBSON:  He's from Madison.

KROK:  No, we were not...

GIBSON:  Madison is going to oppose...

KROK:  ... (UNINTELLIGIBLE), that's one thing...

GIBSON:  ... the pledge no matter what.

KROK:  John, I will defend this.  We are not a Berkeley.  I will defend this city to the death.  I will tell you this, there is a small percentage of people with a free time and some letterhead, and those clowns get in the press and get more coverage.

And when I stepped up in this allegedly diverse city, there's a handful of media people and a handful of pundits attacked me, and I will not, I will not be taken down by those people.

GIBSON:  All right, Chris Krok, thanks very much, apologize the people of Madison.

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