• With: Barney Frank

    FRANK: Ok Mr. Miller was being critical of the President. That was his right. And as far as dividing the country, the country is divided as it should be in a democracy. Referring to existing divisions is not polarizing. I didn't know you were opposed to polarizing. I couldn't tell that from watching your show much of the time. But I think that's legitimate.

    As I said yes it was appropriate to talk about these -- the sympathy we felt and the horror but when I was asked for further reaction that was the reaction. And I do think that is a legitimate debate in America.

    O'REILLY: Ok.

    FRANK: And the other thing I would ask you, is what you said not the day after two days after or three days after? When did it become appropriate? Because I heard many people from all parts of the spectrum being appropriately -- not political in the sense you're trying to win elections but saying what they thought public policy ought to be much of that week.

    O'REILLY: All right, look. We have two positions, my position and what I called for on the night of the bombing was all Americans come together. And your position 24 hours after that you divided America on a policy basis and people can decide what's worthy and what isn't.

    FRANK: I reject that. No Bill I didn't divide America. I didn't divide America.

    O'REILLY: Sure you did.

    FRANK: America is appropriately divided.

    (CROSSTALK)

    O'REILLY: You cast aspersions on those people who want smaller government and lower taxes.

    FRANK: Not on that people -- not on that people.

    O'REILLY: In a time where we all should have been united.

    FRANK: Oh I did not cast aspersion on them.

    O'REILLY: Of course you did.

    (CROSSTALK)

    FRANK: May I finish? Again let's -- can I have, I listen to you.

    O'REILLY: Come on you've had twice as much time as I've had so far? Go make your point.

    FRANK: May I speak. Mr. Miller was in fact being critical of the President. I didn't mention the individuals. I wasn't casting aspersion on people. I was expressing differences with their viewpoint. And I do not think that it is appropriate to say gee, bad people who hate democracy did things. Let's not have a discussion of issues. It was not casting aspersions, it was not dividing people. It was referring to an existing debate in this country. And I have to ask you when was it appropriate to talk politics? Wednesday, not Tuesday?

    (CROSSTALK)

    O'REILLY: I think maybe aired it out by the end of the week. And then we had of course the crackdown --

    (CROSSTALK)

    FRANK: Well, Mr. Miller, doing it on Wednesday. Mr. Miller was being critical on Wednesday.

    O'REILLY: All right, it's not even close to the same ballpark.

    FRANK: Mr. Miller --

    O'REILLY: It's not even close.

    FRANK: Mr. Miller has been very is critical of the President.

    O'REILLY: All right.

    FRANK: No, it's right at home plate. Mr. Miller was attacking the President for not saying terrorism on Wednesday.

    O'REILLY: What do you think about that by the way? What do you think about that?

    FRANK: Oh I think it was clearly terrorism. It was clearly terrorism.

    O'REILLY: Ok what do you think about the Commander-in-Chief not saying that it was the Islamic jihad that was motivating force behind the terror attack? He won't say it. What do you think about that?

    FRANK: Well I'd say two things. First of all, I think you were trying to, you know, refer to a division of the country that's a good thing to do. That's legitimate. On the Monday, when Mr. Miller was -- was being critical of his comments on the Wednesday, nobody knew that it was Islamic terrorists. We knew it was terrorism. But nobody knew on the Monday, we didn't know what did it. So I don't say --

    O'REILLY: But he has -- and still the President still hasn't defined it as jihadist action. Still.

    FRANK: Well I don't know about jihad, I would say yes these were Islamist, these were people inspired by Islamic terrorism. I think people yes ought to be very clear about that. And I think that's a legitimate public policy debate --

    (CROSSTALK)

    O'REILLY: Why do you think the President is -- why do you think the President is not clear about it.

    FRANK: I don't know. Bill I'm not in charge of -- I'm not in charge of explaining the President.

    O'REILLY: Well you're a thinker, you know him very well, he is the leader of your party. You must have an opinion on him. You have an opinion on everything else.

    FRANK: No, no, A, I don't have an opinion on everything else. I only have an opinion on things I know and the fact on the Monday I said, I had no idea when people asked me to speculate, one of the things I thought was unfortunate where a lot of people who used to be in the line of work I used to be in speculating about things they didn't know anything. I thought we should just defer to law enforcement.

    O'REILLY: We didn't like that at all. Speculation is never good. So you just don't know why Barack Obama won't say this was generated by Islamist jihad?