Gutfeld on North Korea threatening to pull out of summit
North Korea threatens to cancel Trump-Kim summit over U.S. demands.
This is a rush transcript from "The Five," May 16, 2018. This copy may not be in its final form and may be updated.
GREG GUTFELD, CO-HOST: Hi, I'm Greg Gutfeld with Jedediah Bila, Juan Williams, Jesse Watters, and her iPhone is her full-length mirror, Dana Perino -- "The Five."
Well, someone in North Korea read "The Art of the Deal."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS: North Korea is threatening to cancel next month's summit between Kim Jong-un and President Trump over military drills going on right now involving the U.S. and South Korea.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: That is so Donald.
Now, this shocks the media, but if you just read one sentence from Trump's book, you'd know that negotiations don't proceed without such antics and more will come. And it's not like Trump didn't prepare you for it. Let's see what happens:
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: We're moving along very nicely with North Korea. We'll see what happens.
It's taken a long time, many, many decades to get here. Let's see what happens.
We're doing very well, as you know, North Korea. We'll see what happens.
So, we will see what happens.
We haven't seen anything. We haven't heard anything. We will see what happens.
We'll see what happens. We'll see. Time will tell.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: We'll see what happens. That montage was for those who think Trump is being played or hopes that he's being played. Better he looks a fool than brings world peace -- right, media?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIPS)
ANDREA MITCHELL, NBC NEWS: This was utterly predictable, once the president was so eager to accept the terms before the terns were even spelled out.
CHUCK TODD, NBC NEWS: Is it possible Kim Jong-un realizes he's got everything he's already wanted, which is recognition on the world stage.
WOLF BLITZER, CNN: Did President Trump, do you believe, make a mistake and all of his optimism about his upcoming summit with Kim Jong-un?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: Wet blankets.
Point is we all come at this with heavy skepticism. With Trump, we trust he's not full of rosy optimism driven by selfish legacy. This is a guy who wields a real stick, not just a yummy carrot, which is why there's real reason to be optimistic, even with the North Korean threats. I'd be more uncertain without such threats. It's a sign of engagement.
Granted, for this deal to happen, you have to think big and believe you can actually pull it off. Take a way smaller achievement: Wollman Rink, a Manhattan attraction that languished for years because the city couldn't get it running. Trump got involved and in months turned it into a wildly popular tourist attraction. So, why does that happen? Because some guy thought he could do it. Do not underestimate the power of positive thinking, especially when it's coming from someone who knows the good guy from the bad and how to speak both their languages.
And, look, haven't we seen results already? Today, North Korea threatened to cancel a meeting. Months ago they were threatening to nuke us. I call that progress.
Dana, Dana, Dana. Isn't this how this works?
DANA PERINO, CO-HOST: Well, when you're dealing with the North Koreans, I think so.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
PERINO: Certainly -- we don't know a lot about Kim Jong-un because it's called the hermit kingdom for a reason. And I do think there's going to be some curveballs along the way. I do think that the president has been pretty cautious. He's been optimistic and throwing some cold water on it at the same time. Almost everything that he says, not every time, so if there's criticism about that I think that if you look at the totality of the statements over a period of time, he has been, well, we'll see. We'll see what happens.
GUTFELD: See what happens.
JESSE WATTERS, CO-HOST: We had a lot on the cutting room floor, I think. Lot of more of that came from.
PERINO: And I don't think that the president is going to overreact, because the North Koreans need the summit a lot more than President Trump does. So, he can sit back and wait. And I think that President Trump was critical of President Obama's approach to negotiating with Iran, because President Obama made it looked like he was more desperate for the deal than the Iranians.
GUTFELD: Right.
PERINO: So, it looked like -- even if -- I'm sure the Obama team is going to disagree with the outcome, but if it looked like we were more interested in getting this done and rushing it through in the end. That's not actually happening here. Especially it's just the second year -- at the beginning of the second year for President Trump.
The other key factor here is the South Koreans. I know that the Chinese are really important, but the South Koreans want this more than anything. And President Moon is going to be coming to the White House on Tuesday, so the president will have a chance to meet with him face-to-face. I do think it was a good thing that President Moon said we are not going to stop these drills with the United States, because that says to Kim Jong-un that he's going to have to come to the table, and I bet he will.
GUTFELD: Jesse, do you have any theories behind this?
WATTERS: I do. They don't involve Dennis Rodman. I think what's happening he's flexing, posturing to make it look like maximum pressure didn't bring him to the negotiating table, but, in fact, it did bring him there because we had unilateral sanctions we've just slapped on. He brought the U.N. Make sure they had the blockade over certain vessels. The fuel was drying up. They did have limited access to capital. So, that was all good. So that was the truth of why this has happened.
Yes, he did say some good things. He said we're going to give the hostages back. We're going to destroy this nuclear testing site. And satellite imagery proves that it is being decommissioned right now. Although, there could been an accident that already decommissioned it that we have heard. And, you know, so good things were happening. I don't like the media coming in now and almost in glee that there was a hick up towards peace--
GUTFELD: Right.
WATTERS: -- just to hurt the president. And to act like that president has been punked here, when I think the last couple of presidents have actually been punked. Trump gave up nothing. And like he said, and you've showed in the montage, anything could happen. He says something interesting about John Bolton. He said John Bolton was repugnant.
PERINO: Kim Jong-un said that --
WATTERS: Yes.
PERINO: -- not the president.
WATTERS: And, this is a guy that I think burned his uncle in acid. So, to call Bolton repugnant was hilarious. I think --
JEDEDIAH BILA, CO-HOST: I said before, I would wear that like a badge of honor.
WATTERS: I know.
BILA: If Kim Jong-un called me repugnant, I would put it on a shirt and be prancing around.
WATTERS: That's true. That's true. And I think what he was referring to was Bolton who come in and said we should deal with North Korea like we dealt with Libya. What happened with Libya? They gave up all of their nuclear stuff to us, and then, a couple of years later, we invaded and killed them. So, that's why he was a little upset about that. Well, we've lead from behind.
GUTFELD: Jedediah, I trust you enjoyed this view much better.
BILA: Well played.
GUTFELD: Thank you. I'll be leaving now. Hey, what's your take on all this.
BILA: You know, I don't think the summit is the be-all and end-all. I think everyone, you know, expected, oh, this summit is a good photo op. You see them shaking hands, they're sitting down at the table. But the ultimate goal is for disarmament. And I think Kim Jong-un ultimately thought he was holding all the cards.
He could say, well, I don't like Bolton and I'm not going to do this if you expect me to disarm. And, he's not holding all the cards anymore because now he's dealing with someone who has a pretty strong history of being a tough negotiator. I just want to remind the media, though, when you're president is going up against Kim Jong-un you should be rooting for your president. Not so pretty across the board type of thing. Not surprising their behavior.
But, I think Donald Trump should stay tough. I think he's doing exactly what he should be doing. He should just completely unfettered by this whole thing and say, look, my end goal is the same. I'm going to be tough on you. I'm not going to stop talking about human rights violations just because you think that's something we shouldn't be talking about.
And I'm going to stay true to American values and American principle and be strong to this whole thing. And that's the best he can do. I mean, what if the summit doesn't happen, we're not going to change our philosophy or the way we handle this because we're the United States of America and that's how we roll.
GUTFELD: Juan, you were telling me in the green room that Donald Trump, in a sense, already won.
JUAN WILLIAMS, CO-HOST: Oh, yeah. I'm that was me.
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: I think that was the repugnant Juan Williams.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: You know what, I'm struck by here is that you guys say, oh, it's that liberal press that seems to be the lighting in the moment or suggestion that this might not come off. And, to my mind, it's the conservative media that was so quick to say, you know what, this guy is going to get a Nobel Peace Prize. This will be his signature foreign affairs accomplishment. And it seems to me like that was a little bit premature. Because I think he's had a tough week. I know it's not going to be agreed upon at this table, but you think about what happened this week in terms of pulling out of the Iran deal which is not popular with the American people--
BILA: But it was fantastic move.
WILLIAMS: Say what you want to say. Not popular with the American people. Number two, the effort to move the embassy to Jerusalem, again, lots of death. And I know, again, you guys have a different point of view --
BILA: By Hamas.
WILLIAMS: Whatever you want to say. I'm just saying, very controversial - -
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: Because I acknowledge that you guys are smart. And then the third point is the thing about, you know, ZTE, this Chinese company where he's off on his own and he's like, what's going on? So, here comes this motion at this moment, and I agree with you, Jedediah, and Greg, and Jesse, and Dana, Americans should be rooting for President Trump to do something here because North Korea is a threat to world peace. You do not want those people to have a nuclear weapon. But the thing about it is, and this is my concern, is that I think world leaders now think they can play Donald Trump. They can give him a big parade. They can flatter him. Tell him they love--
GUTFELD: This is just examples about Israel and Iran. It's a contradiction.
WILLIAMS: How's that?
GUTFELD: Because those show that you can't play.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Look at the Paris treaty.
WILLIAMS: No, but -- wait -- if you want to say something.
PERINO: I was going to say that one example would be that you had Macron, and Merkel, and Boris Johnson came to the United States and said -- asked the president, please don't pull out of the Iran deal and he did it anyway. The same cast of characters and more on the Paris Climate Accord is kind of the same deal. So, I think that -- flattering might get you good press with the president, but it doesn't necessarily get you the results that you want.
WILLIAMS: No, but I think in this case the idea is the he -- and, again, the conservative media are so hungry for the Nobel Prize that I think someone like Kim Jong-un is saying, oh, if that's the case, boy, he really doesn't want to miss this meeting. He needs it more than I do. And therefore, if I say cancel your joint military exercises, President Trump will be under pressure to do it. We'll see what happens.
WATTERS: No, we're not hungry for the peace prize, Juan. We're hungry for peace. And the Nobel is just like a nice trophy to shove in the left's face, because Obama didn't deserve this. Obama peace prize was a participation trophy.
(CROSSTALK)
BILA: You could argue that getting played was signing onto a deal like the Iran deal, which, actually, end up helping them and, you know, it was a minor band aid temporarily and didn't ultimately fix the problem.
PERINO: Can I just add one last thing that we didn't mention which is that the issue of denuclearization and what that means is the key issue.
BILA: Yeah.
PERINO: And -- that's why I'm skeptical on what -- if there will actually be in agreement--
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: Because he's just buying time. They say, oh, denuclearization in 15 years. Meanwhile, he hides all of his sites, and then, all of a sudden, in ten years he has nuclear capabilities to hit the --
PERINO: And also, like, if we're going to give economic aid, I want to know, well, who's going to get that economic aid? Is it the people or is it his, you know, regime and the cronies?
BILA: You bring up that great point, though, about the inspections, because even if they agree to the denuclearization, let's say we're all in the same page, everybody shakes hands and leave the table, then how do you guarantee that the international inspectors --
WATTERS: Yeah, not to self-inspections like the Iranians has.
GUTFELD: We've got to move on. We've got to move on. But this is the point, we are all skeptical, and we have a president who is skeptical, and we'll see what happens. Massive document dump regarding the Russia investigation. Will new revelations finally put the issue to rest? Probably not. That's next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WATTERS: A major document dump today that is sure to have liberals disappointed. Sorry, Juan. The senate judiciary committee releasing almost 2,000 pages of transcripts from interviews with key players at the June 2016 Trump Tower meeting. This is the sit-down where Russian lawyer promised dirt on Hillary Clinton, but didn't deliver. Here are the key takeaways. Donald Trump Jr. said he never told his father about the meeting. He never spoke to President Trump about the Air Force One statement. And the whole thing turned out to be a nothing burger. So, Juan, how does a nothing burger taste?
WILLIAMS: Oh, like chocolate, like chocolate. You know, I mean, just delicious. Anyway, so my thought on this is twofold. First and foremost, it's pretty clear from what we learned now that Trump, Jr. went into the meeting seeking dirt on Hillary Clinton.
WATTERS: OK, not a crime.
WILLIAMS: Well, I think that is a problem because, guess what, that woman was a Russian lawyer with ties directly to people in control of Russia.
WATTERS: Can I just say one thing. He says that when he was talking about the meeting, he asked who is going to be coming to the meeting, and was never given any of the names of people that were coming to the meeting. He didn't know he was actually meeting with Russians. He knew that the meeting was about dirt that the Russians may have had, but he didn't go into the meeting knowing there were Russians there. He said this under oath.
BILA: It's still coming from Russia, though. I feel like that should bother us, because it's not like he went and sat with a Democratic operative in the United States who had opposition research. And my problem with this is why would he go to that meeting, why would he trust any information coming from Russia, honestly, because I certainly wouldn't. And why wouldn't you know that even if it was tempting to get dirt on an opponent, as many people in that position may have felt that way, wouldn't you be afraid that this would ultimately hurt your dad if it came out?
So, I feel like, for me, this has to bother Republicans and Democrats alike, because you wouldn't want any politician -- I don't care if it was, you know, Don Jr., or Chelsea Clinton, or whoever it is, I don't want anyone allying themselves with Russia in an effort to undermine another politician in the United States. And believe me, I didn't want Hillary Clinton to get elected. I'm glad Donald Trump won that election over her, but that doesn't mean that this doesn't bother me.
WILLIAMS: Don't go that far.
WATTERS: I hate to do the water baptism, but Hillary Clinton paid for dirt that she actually obtained from Russia--
WILLIAMS: This is ridiculous.
WATTERS: -- Donald Trump Jr. never got the dirt.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: What makes Hillary's actions worse is that the Trump people were neophytes. They didn't know the rules and they didn't expect it would matter. They didn't expect to win. They didn't know -- everybody meets with somebody offering dirt, even when they're not in politics. I tried to get dirt on you all the time, Jesse. Do you know what collusion is?
And I may use this metaphor. Many of us go to like Safeway on Sundays, and we buy rotisserie chicken. That's what collusion is, because by Wednesday you're desperately trying to pick at the insides of the chicken because you're running out of meat. And so, right now, they're on Wednesday of Sunday's rotisserie chicken. And I was watching CNN, there was -- that typical six-screen panel about this, and they were all gnawing on the bones of a strip carcass.
PERINO: They're going to have to make a soup.
GUTFELD: They're going to have to make a soup, but there's only bones now. Soap for bones. Collusion soup out of bones.
WILLIAMS: By the way, because we have to make a lot of soup around here because it's rainy weather. Let me ask, what do you make of the fact that Don Jr. said, oh, I made this call to this blocked phone number. I don't remember speaking to my dad about anything, and I don't know whose phone this was--
GUTFELD: I have a blocked phone number. He might have been calling me.
BILA: It sounds strange.
WATTERS: Sound strange.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: At least she didn't destroy her phone --
WILLIAMS: Oh, here we go. No, no, that was Obama or Clinton, somebody.
WATTERS: I remind you every week. Dana, what jumps out in you from these --
PERINO: Well, something that is not Don Jr. related, OK? So, in the senate judiciary documents there was a list from Paul Manafort -- from his notes from the meeting that apparently he took on his phone. I don't think we have a picture of it. But, I did it on the 2 o'clock show, because said things like Cyprus, $133 million. Then it has the word elicit, but missing the T.
WATTERS: He said he can't spell.
PERINO: And then it has the -- yeah, but why are you writing elicit in the meeting with the Russians?
WATTERS: That's like crime.
PERINO: Underneath that it says something like actively supportive of RNC, OK? So, I think that those notes are a little bit more interesting--
WATTERS: Can I just say, I just got an alert on my phone a few hours ago. Paul Manafort is now following me on twitter.
GUTFELD: We should have led with that.
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: I did a survey at the gym today about this. I asked, you know, does anybody care about this? A hundred percent said no. Granted I only asked one --
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Oh, you killed my joke.
(LAUGHTER)
WATTERS: It was a good joke. All right, Bret Baier is out with a new book, and he's saying there are a lot of similarities between Presidents Reagan and Trump. Bret is going to be here next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
WILLIAMS: President Trump facing big foreign policy challenges including North Korea, Russia, the Middle East. And just in time for all these development, our friend, anchor of Special Report, Bret Baier, has a new book out that parallels today's headlines. It's called, Three Days in Moscow, Ronald Reagan and the fall of the Soviet Empire. Lucky for us, Bret is right here in New York with us. Bret, welcome.
BRET BAIER, FOX NEWS: Thank you. Thanks for having me.
WILLIAMS: Tell us about the parallels.
BAIER: Well, there's a lot of parallels in the moments, the challenges. They're obviously very different personalities. But, Reagan used a lot of bold language that Washington foreign policy establishment kind of really had a problem with back in the day. Thought it was too aggressive. And, in that case, you know, Donald Trump's tweets are similar in that way. We'll see if Donald Trump follows the guidelines of the summits and how he'd get up from the table if it didn't work. I do want to bring in the book, you know, the book is here. It came out this week. And I saw you all talking about the book, and how Jesse is so prolific in his reading.
(LAUGHTER)
BAIER: So, I brought the young readers edition, which also comes out at the same time. This is for you.
WATTERS: Thank you very much. Oh, and there's pictures in the middle. WILLIAMS: You know what, you can color in the back.
WATTERS: It's much better than the Gutfeld Monologues.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
GUTFELD: Hey. Endorsed by Bret Baier, the Gutfeld Monologues.
BAIER: That is creepy.
GUTFELD: Is this a creepiest thing? It's uncanny valley. It almost looks like you, because it's not like you, it's just freaky. I take this everywhere.
BAIER: That's really sad.
GUTFELD: I travel in the subway with it.
BAIER: I've had three companies say they really want to do this.
GUTFELD: Yeah.
PERINO: But I think you should do it for the children's hospital charity. Isn't it their logo anyway?
BAIER: It is. It is.
GUTFELD: You know what you should do, is do a promotion with your book on twitter that -- if somebody shows a receipt of buying your book, they are part of the auction for the bear.
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: Serious question though, what is going through your mind when you get "The Five" tossing to at 5:59:59.
BAIER: It is one of the most scary part--
(LAUGHTER)
BAIER: -- parts of the day, especially when it's Greg.
WATTERS: Yes.
BAIER: You really don't know what it's like.
GUTFELD: Just assume it's going to rhyme.
BAIER: Dana punch, she just says I don't have anything funny.
WILLIAMS: Dana, I need to ask a serious question.
(LAUGHTER)
PERINO: Was their instances -- and not just with this summit that Ronald Reagan had, the one that you write about here.
BAIER: Yeah.
PERINO: But were there instances where one of the parties threatened to call it off?
BAIER: Yes, Reykjavik, they got up and left. So, it goes Geneva, Reykjavik, and then, Washington, D.C. and Moscow. And the reason for this one is important in Moscow is the final one, and he speaks to Moscow State University students about freedom and democracy, and not, like, hitting them over the head that we're better than you, but sort of like a pied piper. Like come and see why the west is the way to go.
WILLIAMS: And interesting on that point, I mean, obviously, I think back - - I was covering the Reagan White House. This is --. And he makes tremendous inroads with Gorbachev, but now we're dealing with Putin. And Putin has rejected the west and all of our offers and help in terms of coming in to the western world in capitalism.
BAIER: Yeah. It's a totally different -- he's trying to recreate the Soviet Union expansionism. And, Mikael Gorbachev was a different leader, and Reagan saw that, and that's why he negotiated with him. A little fact in here, Reagan and Gorbachev in Red Square when they're walking around, Marlin Fitzwater whispers in his ear and says all these people around you, they're not civilians. They're KGB officers. And one of them was believed to be Vladimir Putin.
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: Is the facts in here? I'm not reading this.
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: Come on. You'll like. This is better than that New York Times.
GUTFELD: If you put killing three days in Moscow--
(CROSSTALK)
WATTERS: If I saw the title Three Days in Moscow, I thought it was about Trump's visit for the pageant.
(CROSSTALK)
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: Keep it clean, man.
BAIER: The publishers are really thrilled with this interview.
(LAUGHTER)
(CROSSTALK)
BILA: Some news of the day. We just did a block on the Trump Tower meeting with Don Jr. and the transcripts that came out. I'm just curious if, you know, some people are saying, oh, there's ton of stuff in here that could really change the tide. Others saying it was a big nothing burger. I think that was Jesse. What do you think? Is there anything new here?
BAIER: I just think what Dana pointed out with the Manafort notes is actually really interesting, the notes in the meeting. I also think that Don Jr., there's a lot of calls for him to come back and testify because there's some hazy memory there. At the same time, you look at this New York Times piece about operation -- what is it? -- Crossfire Hurricane, and in -- deep in there, it says, a year later, there's still no evidence of, you know, any -- the Trump officials colluding with Russia.
And I think both sides of this investigation, we have a lot to learn, and we're probably months away from the end of this thing.
GUTFELD: This thing's never -- this thing's never going to end. Can I just speak on behalf of America and say no one cares? No one cares. The bear doesn't even care.
WATTERS: Greg speaks for America.
BAIER: Creepy, level ten.
WILLIAMS: A quick follow-up. So Senate Intel comes out and says, much differently than House Intel, "Oh, yes, Russia interfered and they favored Trump." Does that matter?
BAIER: Well, it matters that they put it out, and they were backing up the intelligence community in what they report.
WILLIAMS: In a bipartisan report.
BAIER: In a bipartisan report. And we're going to have Senator Langford on "Special Report" tonight to talk about all that.
PERINO: That's a good guest.
BAIER: Yes.
WILLIAMS: Jesse, you know, I realize that you love books. So I want you to ask your toughest question, now that we have Bret Baier right here.
WATTERS: How will you handle the fact that Gutfeld might outsell you with the monologues?
GUTFELD: I like that he plugs my book.
WATTERS: Come back when I write mine. You've got the Kilmeade book out there. You've got the Gutfeld thing coming up.
BAIER: Yes.
WATTERS: Ainsley's got a book out
BAIER: We just have a lot of books. We've got five books.
WATTERS: How will you feel if you don't outsell all of them?
BAIER: I'll feel like that bear.
GUTFELD: Aww. Well, no, this bear is feeling pretty good right now. Has the best seat in the house, my lap. Right there. Wave.
WILLIAMS: Before we go, just on a personal note, what do you hear from Charles Krauthammer, our friend?
BAIER: So I had this e-mail the other day. He's doing better. His doctors say he's turned a corner.
PERINO: Amazing.
BAIER: And he hopes to be back in -- you know, in the panel and on the panel soon.
PERINO: Great.
WILLIAMS: Well, here is wishing you all the best, Charles. I know you watch.
GUTFELD: Does he watch? Does he watch "The Five"?
WILLIAMS: He watches "The Five."
PERINO: I hope we don't embarrass ourselves, Charles.
GUTFELD: It's a little late --
WATTERS: You're holding a bear in your lap.
GUTFELD: It's a little late for that. I'm holding a bear with a human face.
BAIER: It's true.
GUTFELD: This is where I am.
WILLIAMS: Do you get aggravated?
BAIER: No, I think it's good. You know, and I can always hear you laughing.
WILLIAMS: I just feel for you, man. I feel for you. Because I think you're trying to do a serious show.
Anyway, thanks, Bret.
BAIER: Thank you.
WILLIAMS: Ethan Hawke is pointing out Hollywood's hypocrisy on guns in movies. That's next on "The Five."
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PERINO: We always hear about celebrities calling for gun control, but then they star in movies that prominently feature them. We've called them out for their hypocrisy at this table over the years, but actor Ethan Hawke is offering some refreshing honesty on the issue. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ETHAN HAWKE, ACTOR: People have been talking so much about gun control in this country. And I noticed recently, like, if you put in a column every movie I ever did where I carry a gun and every movie where I don't and my salary, like, if I asked my father to do the math on this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
HAWKE: I really think it would be about 92 percent to 8 percent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PERINO: Sorry, I thought I was going to be Ethan Hawke. But it was Mike Baker. It was Mike Baker from Idaho. Just kidding. Obviously, that was Ethan Hawke. This is true about cigarettes, too.
GUTFELD: Yes. Are you talking to me?
PERINO: Yes, I'm talking to you.
GUTFELD: All right. We -- if Hollywood actually believed in their causes, there would be no guns at all. If you could imagine in "Die Hard," like, Bruce McLean fighting those terrorists with peace signs. That's what they would want.
So I have an idea. I have an idea. They should apply gun control to movie guns. And the only way you could do this is tax movies by amount of guns and by the amount of bullets they use per movies. Now this way -- so I'm going to -- I'm going to wonder. Hollywood's gun-control activists, and there are lots of them, like Alyssa Milano, Judd Apatow, whatnot. Will they be OK for a gun-control tax on movies with guns? Tax the bullets. Ten thousand dollars every time there's a bullet. A hundred thousand dollars for a gun. Would they do it? Somebody should introduce that bill tomorrow.
PERINO: OK.
GUTFELD: I'm full of ideas.
PERINO: That's a good idea.
Jesse, what Ethan Hawke is saying is that movies where there's guns, he gets paid 92 percent more than if he didn't have a gun in a movie. He would get paid about 8 percent of his usual.
WATTERS: Yes, Hollywood has made billions off of guns. All the big action movies from the '80s and '90s. Whether it was the "Die Hard" films or Schwarzenegger, Chuck Norris, all these guys. "Rambo." Everybody has a gun, and they're all just mowing down --
GUTFELD: Quentin Tarantino killed Hitler.
WATTERS: "Natural Born Killers." All that stuff made a fortune for these studios. And then to come around and say that you want to take away guns from law-abiding Americans. It's a little hypocritical.
I wanted to bring something to your attention here. This happened yesterday. There was a school shooting. A 19-year-old brought a gun.
GUTFELD: Right.
WATTERS: Started opening fire into a school in Illinois, and an armed resource officer shot him, neutralized them, didn't kill him. And saved --
GUTFELD: Defended lives.
WATTERS: -- countless lives. That story was not covered anywhere in the mainstream media.
GUTFELD: I was going to do it tomorrow as a monologue.
WATTERS: You should.
PERINO: Greg's monologue.
WILLIAMS: As an exception to the rule.
GUTFELD: So it is the rule.
WILLIAMS: No, it's not.
GUTFELD: It's the system, not the bug.
WILLIAMS: All right. All right. But here's the thing about this. When people complained about smoking in movies, it had an impact. When people complained, like, at the Oscars --
PERINO: But they still do it, though.
WILLIAMS: No, but they do it much less. It did have an impact. And the same thing, like, you think about how gays were demonized in movies. Now it's not an issue. More black actors, especially up for competition for leads in big movies. It does make a difference.
And then to say that, yes, guns have made movies -- have made money for Hollywood, but in the way, it seems to me, it's encouraged their culture. I go to -- you know, I'm an old guy, so I go back to things like "Gunsmoke," John Wayne and all that. Independent, self-sufficient American male.
But I wonder if, at some point, it wouldn't be just -- and I say, we can have a discussion about it. Just because it's guns doesn't mean you can't discuss it.
PERINO: What do you think, Jedediah?
JEDEDIAH BILA, CO-HOST: When you say guns encourage the culture, though, what do you mean?
WILLIAMS: No, no, no. They reflect.
BILA: Oh, reflect the culture.
WILLIAMS: They help to shape the culture. In other words, if you're a guy and you say, "You know what? Hey, I'm going to have a gun. I'm a real man." And by the way, I saw here that now more parents say, as long as the violence is justified and like self-defense, they don't mind seeing the guns in movies.
BILA: Sometimes when people, when they look at television and movies, they just want to be entertained. And when I think about this effort, that could sanitize these things, and, "Oh, let's remove the violence and let's only have it" -- that's not what film and television should be. I mean, some of my favorite movies. I love Liam Neeson. I love him in all the "Taken" movies. Some of these -- these movies and television shows rely on that story line. How are you going to have a chase or, you know, you're hunting down a killer, and you're going to have no gun. It's integral to that.
And I -- I don't think, I mean, it's like the same argument that people make, "Oh, if you grow up playing violent video games. You're going to be violent." It just doesn't work that way.
WATTERS: So you're against Greg's tax plan, to tax the bullets.
GUTFELD: I want -- I want to see the gun-control activists in California who are in Hollywood accept that plan. I think it would be amazing to see that happen.
PERINO: But it is true, Jesse, that if you read as a youngster, you do become a --
WATTERS: I don't like this narrative that's now sprung up about me not --
GUTFELD: Wait, wait, wait. Can we work Russia into this segment? Let's work Russia.
PERINO: I don't want you to have a heart attack, so we are not going to do that.
All right, it's the hottest debate burning at the Internet today. Is it "Yanny" or "Laurel"? I haven't listened to it yet, so it will be my first time hearing it. Next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BILA: Do you remember the blue and black versus white and gold dress controversy from a few years ago? Well, a huge Internet debate has erupted yet again. Is it the word "Yanny" or "Laurel"? What do you think? Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBOTIC VOICE: Yanny. Yanny. Yanny. Yanny.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BILA: All right. We're going to do that one more time. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBOTIC VOICE: Yanny. Yanny. Yanny. Yanny.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: Are you kidding me?
BILA: All I hear is "Laurel."
GUTFELD: I hear "Laurel."
WATTERS: What?
BILA: My side of the table --
GUTFELD: You do hear "Yanny."
WATTERS: "Yanny."
GUTFELD: "Laurel."
WATTERS: It's "Yanny."
WILLIAMS: I heard "Laurel."
GUTFELD: We win!
WATTERS: Is this, like, a prank? Is everybody in on this? Are you messing with me? It is so obviously "Yanny," it's not even funny.
GUTFELD: OK, but this is --
WATTERS: Play it again. Play it again. Play it again.
WILLIAMS: Wow, you're upset.
WATTERS: I am. It's so obvious. Play it again.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBOTIC VOICE: Yanny. Yanny. Yanny. Yanny.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: Yanny. Is your brain broken?
GUTFELD: No, but this is what -- the lesson here is that humans have 100 percent certainty. And this is what -- you just explained every single war. Every single battle is about one person hearing "Yanny" and the other person hearing "Laurel."
WATTERS: This is why we're in -- we got into Vietnam? This?
PERINO: And if you said "denuclearize," "denuclearize," "denuclearize," what you think Kim Jong-un hears?
WATTERS: "Cheese." "Cheese."
GUTFELD: This is like when we hear -- when we hear communism, we think, "100 million dead," but like, a left-wing academic goes, "Ooh, utopia."
WATTERS: Yes, that's true.
BILA: This is interesting, though, because they were saying that it could be that you were hearing it initially on different devices. And we're listening to it --
GUTFELD: So it's ear shape?
BILA: Well, they're saying the frequencies. Your ear can hear things at different frequencies.
WATTERS: Studies say more intelligent people hear "Yanny." This is a scientific study.
BILA: Actually, I did some research. And it said there was an investigator, a professor of speech, language, and hearing at the University of Arizona said -- and I quote, Jesse -- "Most likely, the original recording was Laurel."
PERINO: What?
BILA: Some people --
WATTERS: Left-wing professor.
BILA: -- are more sensitive to high frequencies or low frequencies. And as a result --
PERINO: I can hear everything. OK?
BILA: -- you actually can hear it differently.
GUTFELD: But do you hear both?
PERINO: No, I just hear "Yanny." I do hear it clearly.
WATTERS: I was trying to hear "Laurel," but I couldn't.
PERINO: I tried -- I actually -- I want to hear "Laurel."
GUTFELD: But you liked Yani as the musician? So maybe that was --
PERINO: Absolutely.
GUTFELD: Yes.
BILA: That's another philosophy that came out. Is that they say that what you're expecting to hear, your brain actually plays a role. And if you look at something, like for example, if the teaser clip said "Laurel" before you hit play, you would be expecting to hear "Laurel."
PERINO: I had no expectations. I had no idea.
BILA: I wouldn't have any expectation.
GUTFELD: Everybody here is married or was married. This explains every fight. Doesn't this explain every fight?
BILA: Oh, it's true.
GUTFELD: Spouses -- spouse hears one thing. Spouse hears another. And you can't change -- it's unbending minds.
WATTERS: Let's hear it again. Let's hear it again. I want to hear it again.
WILLIAMS: Oh, my God.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
COMPUTERIZED VOICE: Yanny. Yanny. Yanny. Yanny.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: Yanny.
PERINO: It is, you're exactly right. I hear it exactly like you did.
BILA: I can see this fight playing out in every house across America.
GUTFELD: Yes.
BILA: It's like -- it's really true. Now, of course, this is a little bit more specific. It's actually a sound bite. And it's funny, because this sound bite, they said, appeared on Vocabulary.com. And then the reason it got so much momentum was because a bunch of high school students were differing, doing what we're doing right now and saying, "Wait a second. This is what it's saying." And they posted it on social media, and it just went on and on. And now, as you see, it's like all over the nation.
By the way, the dress was white and gold, while we're on that.
PERINO: I think -- I think that's where I was on that, too.
BILA: Which is weird.
WATTERS: Whoa, whoa, whoa. So here's the dress. So what's the deal? One's blue on the left --
PERINO: You weren't going to see both.
BILA: You wouldn't see both.
PERINO: You saw one, and some people saw blue and black.
GUTFELD: So yes, this is an incorrect --
BILA: But doesn't it make you feel like nothing is real, then?
WILLIAMS: Well, that's what worries me, because I tend to be such a pragmatist and realist. You know, that's the way my brain is.
BILA: Must be hard.
WILLIAMS: How can people see one thing and interpret it differently? Now you're saying, though --
GUTFELD: Confirmation bias.
WATTERS: That's how I think when we talk about the Trump Tower meeting.
WILLIAMS: Oh, is that right?
WATTERS: I see nothing burger and you see collusion.
PERINO: You see a Big Mac.
WILLIAMS: Big Mac.
GUTFELD: But Juan, what you're talking about is, like, the -- Scott Adams. I know nobody --
WATTERS: Greg. Here we go.
PERINO: Scott.
GUTFELD: It's the two movies. Americans see -- you show one truth, but they see two different movies.
WILLIAMS: No, but that's the team sport thing you tell me about. Right, OK. But this is not team sport. This is actual perception.
GUTFELD: Yes.
BILA: An actually sound bite, too.
WATTERS: Decibels. People hear decibels differently.
BILA: Sometimes older people will be less sensitive to high-frequency, and certain letters have a certain frequency. It depends on how --
WATTERS: So the younger people at the table hear "Yanny."
BILA: "Laurel." It's so obvious.
WILLIAMS: Yes. I think you would hear a completely different.
GUTFELD: I heard -- I heard --
WATTERS: I'm surprised you could hear anything.
GUTFELD: I heard "collusion." I just hear "collusion." That's all I kept hearing. "Collusion."
WILLIAMS: You know what happened to me the other day?
GUTFELD: What?
WILLIAMS: My wife says -- my wife says to me, "You know, you're getting old, and you can't hear a blanking thing."
GUTFELD: Yes.
WILLIAMS: I go -- so I go to the audiologist. And you know what he says to me?
GUTFELD: What?
WILLIAMS: He says, "Who told you you couldn't hear anything?"
I said, "My wife."
He said, "Don't worry. I get ten guys a day who tell me that their wife -- "
PERINO: That same exact thing happened to Peter. But he went there, and they said, "Who told you that you have problems?" And his wife. He said, "It's always the wife."
WATTERS: That happened to me when I was in second grade. They sent me to the doctor to get my ears tested. And it turns out I could hear fine. I just wasn't listening.
BILA: I believe that. All right, guys. "One More Thing" is coming up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
GUTFELD: Time for "One More Thing." Let's go to --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRAPHIC: Greg's Plugs
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GUTFELD: "Greg's Plugs." Why is it pointing at my hair? This is real stuff. This is real stuff. I'm not like Kilmeade.
All right. My podcast is up right now. Go to FoxNewsPodcasts.com. Interview with Keith Levine, original guitarist for The Clash, later in PIL, one of the classic legendary musicians in the punk movement. Listen to it. We talk about block change (ph) and Bitcoin.
And if you haven't forgotten, go to Amazon and pre-order my book. Pre- order my book. Show proof to me that you pre-ordered it, and I will draw you -- I will draw a portrait of you. No, this is a contest. Only one of you. That would be -- that would be very -- that would be a big disaster.
PERINO: And everybody looks the same.
GUTFELD: And everybody looks the same. All right, Jesse.
GUTFELD: All right, I'll see your two, and I'll go three. Here's the first one. This video kind of reminds me of Juan when he tries to make a point and just doesn't quite get there.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(BOY COMES UP SHORT TRYING TO SLIDE INTO THIRD BASE)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WATTERS: So close, but yet so far.
PERINO: Give up.
WATTERS: There you go. Also, I would like to thank Donna Hine and Bob Hine for sending Greg and Juan and myself some cookies today. They were delicious.
WILLIAMS: I hope you know what that means, as to who ate the cookies?
WATTERS: I never shared them.
GUTFELD: Yes.
WATTERS: Also, I'm also on "The Story" tonight with Martha MacCallum.
PERINO: What's "The Story"?
WATTERS: You'll have to tune in and find out.
GUTFELD: There's a tease. Dana.
PERINO: OK. So check out what happened last night in Cumberland, Wisconsin. Cumberland, Wisconsin. Check this out. OK, guess what? It's a prank.
The high school seniors got together and pulled this prank. And they created this illusion of the car crashing in, and it was a pretty good prank, enough that the Cumberland Police posted images of it and sent this message. "Hats off to the Cumberland High School Class of 2018 on your senior prank. Congratulations, Class of 2018 on one of the best senior pranks that we have ever seen."
GUTFELD: They should all be expelled.
PERINO: Why?
GUTFELD: What a waste of time. What a waste of time for the cops.
BILA: Get off my lawn!
GUTFELD: Thank you. Where's my rake?
PERINO: Thank you for --
WATTERS: You were fine in high school, I bet.
GUTFELD: All right, Juan.
WILLIAMS: Rain, rain, go away. We have had crazy weather events here in New York City yesterday. In fact, all along the East Coast as severe thunderstorm slammed the area.
Better to show than to tell. So here's some stunning imagery that we have collected. Let's begin with this remarkable time lapse video as the storm rolled over Manhattan. The weather also caused lots of travel delays at airports and train stations.
Take a look at the chaos in Grand Central Station yesterday as the MTA closed train lines that headed north out of the city. They had to close the doors.
GUTFELD: I don't see anybody in there.
PERINO: Someone said, "It's like Grand Central Station in there."
WILLIAMS: Yes, really.
GUTFELD: Oh.
WILLIAMS: And then there's this shockingly awesome moment from Mother Nature as she takes aim at New York City's One World Trade Center.
BILA: Oh, wow.
GUTFELD: I bet liberals were hoping it would hit the Trump Tower.
WILLIAMS: Oh, yes. I'm sure.
WATTERS: Did you bring your Weatherman umbrella today, guys?
GUTFELD: I did.
WATTERS: So did I.
GUTFELD: The Rick Reichmuth.
WILLIAMS: Yes. But you have three, and you won't give me one.
WATTERS: That's true.
WILLIAMS: Cookies, and now umbrella.
GUTFELD: All right. Jedediah.
BILA: I am going to tell the story of Smokey and Remus. And they are two puppies. They were playing -- we have some video. They were playing in a pool in Arizona. This is security cam photos.
And all of a sudden, Smokey falls in, was struggling to get out, and Remus jumps into the pool, pushes him out. This is why, A, dogs are better than people. And 2, Gregory --
GUTFELD: Yes.
BILA: -- this is why you pay homage to the service animal.
GUTFELD: You're still mad at that?
BILA: I'm still upset.
PERINO: But Jedediah --
BILA: What if you were on the plane and you start drowning in the toilet? He would come and get you out.
GUTFELD: That has never happened.
PERINO: He is kind of small.
WATTERS: -- up on the airplane.
PERINO: Jedediah, I had seen -- people were tweeting that around and sending it to me. I couldn't even watch it, because it was like too much anticipation. I was too nervous. Even though I knew it had a happy ending.
BILA: Do you think Jasper would have jumped into the water?
PERINO: No. No, I don't think that he would have.
GUTFELD: He probably just got waxed. You know?
BILA: Animal videos make me happy. You, though, you're a menace.
GUTFELD: I am a menace.
BILA: Everyone should know.
WATTERS: Because he hears "Laurel," that's why. He hears "Laurel."
GUTFELD: All right. Set your DVRs. Never mess an episode of "The Five." Fake news beware. We have Bret Baier. Bret, are you there?
BAIER: So much better. So much better.
GUTFELD: I prepared.
BAIER: It's Laurel. Thanks, Greg.
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